Robert sits down with Amanda Montell to talk about Alfred Hugenberg, a German industrialist who made Hitler's rise to power possible for some very familiar reasons. Sources: The Pan German League by Barry Jackisch https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/02/hitler-oligarchs-hugenberg-nazi/681584/ The Fateful Alliance by Hermann Beck https://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/modern-world-history-1918-to-1980/weimar-germany/ https://corporatecitizen.in/issue3/corporate-history-mercedes-was-hitler%E2%80%99s-idea.html https://link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/978-3-642-75512-5_1 https://www.topfundsoehne.de/ts/en/site/history/index.html https://archive.org/details/alfredhugenbergr0000leop/page/11/mode/1up See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Chapter 1: Who is Alfred Hugenberg and why is he called the Elon Musk of Weimar Germany?
Holy shit. Oh, my God. I'm pumped. Okay, I said this at the beginning before we started recording, but, like, please don't apologize that we're not doing a co-leader. As you can imagine, I'm, like, kind of sick of it. But I'm on a World War II kick. I mean, actually, it's been an extended kick. It's been an extended kick.
So I'm... Is it appropriate to say, like, I'm pumped to talk about this Hugenberg fellow?
We love the big dub-dub-dubs. And this is... Hugenberg is, number one, one of the key guys in making the Nazi regime happen. Although, again, he's not a Nazi and he hates them. He hates them because most Nazis are kind of poor for most of the period of time. And he is a rich dude.
uh this is alfred hugenberg it would be fair to call him the elon musk of weimar germany that's the first thing that's the first thing that came to mind that is the first thing that came to fucking mind because like elon you know he's playing ball but he you know that he just disdains the shit no he thinks they're pitiful he thinks they're like small potatoes i i allegedly in my opinion
I don't know. I don't know what's going on in that noggin of his. Thank God. But that's the first thing that came to mind.
No one ever has. So I guess let's just get into this. Because it's one of those things... when it comes to his early life, not a super Elon early life, when it comes to his role in the Nazi regime, it's almost beat for beat exactly what Elon has done, right to the point where like Elon is now, it looks like getting edged out of Doge. There's a number of reports that Trump is kind of tired of him.
He said that he's stepping back. It's all like all of that. But it's going to be an interesting history of like a German piece of shit that like doesn't It doesn't sound all that much like Elon. And then he's going to get in power. And it's like, oh, wow, these guys. Was he was Elon just like creeping off this fucker's notes? It's the same story. It's so funny. Oh, my God.
I'm so excited. Again, I'm not sure if that's the right adjective, but like on the edge of my seat, on the tips of my toes.
I get I get giddy when I get a new Hitler book in the mail. So I get it, you know.
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Chapter 2: What were Alfred Hugenberg's early life and upbringing like?
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Alfred Ernst Christian Alexander Hugenberg was born on June 19th, 1865, in the city of Hanover, which five years or so later would become the city of Hanover, Germany. So, again, he predates Germany by about five years. These are still just a bunch of states with Austria being – or with Prussia being the dominant one.
Prussia, yeah. I was going to say Prussia, and I was like, if that's wrong, I'm going to sound so dumb, but it's all giving Prussian era.
It's the goddamn Prussians, and the goddamn Prussians, like, as a general rule, they just pants Austria, not far from the time that he's born, right? Which is why Austria is on, you know, anyway. So...
The fact that Germany becomes a thing is largely the work of a fellow named Otto von Bismarck, who orchestrated a series of wars, treaties, and alliances that culminated in the defeat of Napoleon III's France and the rise of the Prussian Kaiser as the emperor of all Germanic peoples. Or at least like, because like Austria-Hungary is still separate, most of the Germanic peoples.
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Chapter 3: How did pan-Germanism and imperial ambitions shape Hugenberg’s worldview?
And then looking at the British who own like fucking a third, like a shitload of Africa and like, what the fuck guys? And so this is what's all, this is all what's going on as Alfred Hugenberg has his childhood. Now, unlike Elon, because we've made that comparison, he is not born into wealth or into really much privilege at all. Some people will say his upbringing was comfortable.
That's not wildly untrue by the standards of the time, but we would not see this as a comfortable upbringing. And in fact, it's kind of close to Hitler's childhood. Alfred's dad is like a civil servant. He's a guy who works in the administrative state. And he dies when Hugenberg is very young. And Alfred is the only son in the family, which is also like Hitler.
And the Hitler comparisons keep right on Hitler-ing because both young men also spend their adolescent years aware of the fact that their mom, since their dad is gone, is incredibly financially strained, right? They have this pension problem. But none of the pensions are enough to take care of a family. And so they're like they're in there. It's a tremendously difficult time.
And he can't not have been aware of the fact that they were poor now.
Right.
So there are some other similarities between Hitler and Hugenberg. Both young men were moved to create art in their early years. Hitler becomes an obsessive devotee of the opera and has ambitions as a painter. Meanwhile, Hugenberg is a really talented creative writer with what biographer John Leopold described as, quote, a flair for literary expression.
And, you know, if you're a kid who's good at writing, that can be a great way to express yourself and to work through some of your trauma and stuff. Alfred does not do any of that. Sure. Which is actually a real difference because Hitler throws himself whole hog into being an artist. He kind of sucks at it. Like he's not any good, but like he tries.
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it's definitely giving like George W. Bush's painting endeavor. It's like, I don't know. Although the order of operations was flipped. W. entered painting after his political tenure. Maybe Hitler should have done that. I don't know.
I got to say, Hitler, better painter than George W. Bush.
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Chapter 4: What were Hugenberg’s political activities and contributions to German expansionism?
What does this guy look like?
1865?
Yeah, well, he's born in 60... This is... We're now in, like, the 1880s, something like that.
You're talking about Alfred? Yeah.
Oh, boy, Alfie. Yeah. You're going to it's like this is like the 1880s right now.
Yeah. But I mean, in fairness, it's the same. So I guess never mind. No, no, no, no, no. The picture is worth looking at it.
Oh, yeah. OK. Yeah. I just like forgive me. I just I need a visual here.
The picture is worth a thousand words and most of them are going to be. Wow. That is a German ass man.
The hair is fun. The mustache is fun.
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Chapter 5: How did Hugenberg’s views on agriculture and land reform reflect his political ideology?
No, this was super on purpose.
That does get us back to the Elon Musk comparisons because it's like, wow, neither of you motherfuckers know how to get a haircut. Jesus Christ. I say that looking the way I do today, but Jesus Christ.
You look great, Robert.
So although similar to Elon and Alfie, the hairline, the hairline is impressive.
I mean, he did not have the ability to have a Turkish man's hair transplanted onto his scalp. Yes, that is not a Turkish man's hair. That's all Hugenberg.
Totally, which is honestly amazing, especially considering that he was such a bad person. You would think that, like, that would have affected his hair.
Some terrible people are graced with an incredible head of hair, like Fabio. I don't know that Fabio was a bad person. I'm just insulting him for no reason.
Yeah, who knows?
Who knows? Given his humble beginnings, Hugenberg started his career as an entry-level civil servant. So he has no nepotism to benefit from, right? He's not getting like a head start. He's going to get ahead because he's good. He becomes a member.
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Chapter 6: How did Hugenberg’s entrepreneurial ventures influence his rise to power?
And so Hugenberg doesn't want things to work that way. He wants this land to be freed up if it's not being farmed for more farmers to buy it. Now, like all conservative Germans, and Alfred is very conservative – His interest is in autarky, right? He wants the state to be able to produce all of its own necessities. We just had the tariffs come down yesterday. It's kind of the same idea, right?
Conservatives never quite get over this. What if we didn't need anyone else? And it's like, I don't know, man, do you like kumquats? Because that's kind of critical that you trade.
Do you like computers? Yeah.
Yeah.
Fuck. Jesus.
It's a little more understandable in this period as a German because they're always aware of like, OK, well, we've got Russia on one side and they don't always like us. And we got France on the other and they don't always like us. And then the English control the sea. So we're really easy to starve here. You know, it would be great if we could grow enough food to not starve.
So, Hugenberg set to work applying his three principles to the problem of all these giant useless estates going unmanaged. Being a practical guy, he came up with what seemed like a simple solution, and he published a book about his work with the farming co-ops in Posen and how similar tactics could be used to encourage the rapid accumulation and deployment of capital to properly settle the East.
Alfred insisted that the state's role in all of this was not to stick with the traditional Juncker view of property, and instead to use its power to encourage competition. He wanted them to pass laws to confiscate large, unproductive estates and resettle them with small farmers who would form co-ops. I won't give Hugenberg credit for a lot, but this probably would have worked.
And I base this on the fact that basically 100% of the time, shit like this got tried and peasants were given access to large areas of raw land to split up and manage in common, productivity increased, and it especially increased over the old way of, quote, letting some rich guy use it as a private park, right? It's just more effective in a farm in terms of yield.
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Chapter 7: What role did Hugenberg play in the Weimar Republic and the Nazi regime’s rise?
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I got you, I got you, I got you, I got you.
Ah, and we're back. I don't know. I think Chumba Casino would be a good overlord. Seems ethical. Casinos are always nice. We could all smoke indoors, you know? That's how casinos work. That is a vibe. That is a vibe. So he bounces, gets out of government again. And his dream is to make East Prussia not a backwater, right? Like that's kind of what he wants in this period of time.
But he's been stymied. And Alfred, he's not an introspective soul, nor is he to kind of waste his energy being disappointed.
so he right away gets a job on the board of directors for a bank in frankfurt that serves several mining concerns and i not just mining but companies like generally in the metal business so suppliers and producers of raw materials and his job his role here is reorganizing and rearranging things to enhance the profitability of of everyone in this industry right basically all of the owners of these different minds and and sort of like mineral concerns and whatnot
are all putting a chunk of their money in a common pile to be used, and Hugenberg is managing it. He's an early hedge fund manager, right? Wait, I am so- It's not that back then, but that's what he's doing.
I am so dumbfounded by this guy's disposition. He wanted to be a creative writer. I'm still stuck on that. And then he suppressed it to become someone interested- A hedge fund guy. Yeah, in hedge funds. I'm just like- What how does that how does that make sense? Like, is he truly like a Renaissance man and so adaptable? Or was he never truly an artist to begin with?
And he just kind of like told himself he was suppressing his artistic tendencies. But really, he was meant for this.
He writes several books. I don't know if I'd say he was meant to be.
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