Matt Walsh
Appearances
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I think that's true, what he said about— I'm sure that when there's a black president, we know there are real races out there. There are anti-black races, there are anti-white races, but they're out there. Social media was also really coming online around that time, so people had a forum to express this kind of stuff. And anonymously. Anonymously.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And so, yeah, those people come out of the woodwork. I'm sure that did happen. I don't deny that. The difference, though, is that that kind of racism is personal and individual. It's not systemic. It's not in the system. Right. And also... It's absolutely rejected by society. It's absolutely rejected by polite society.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So there's a reason why they had to go to 4chan or whatever to express those views, because you can't come out in public and say it with. And if you do, it'll be like the end of your whatever your career is. It's probably the end of it. And that's kind of that's the most you're going to when it comes. As you said, there's never going to be a time when there's no racists in the world.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So the most you can do is, okay, we're not going to have this stuff systemically. The system's going to treat everybody equally. Great. We've crossed that off the list. We've already done that. Actually, we've gone too far because we've got affirmative action where now you're discriminating against white and Asian people. So anti-black racism is out of the system. Fantastic. That's good.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's not accepted by mainstream society. Great. And then... So that's kind of it. I mean, what else can we do with this? You can't get inside people's hearts and make them not feel things. Those people are going to be out there. They know that it's not accepted in mainstream society. And I kind of think you could sort of move on from it culturally to other issues. It's not a major issue anymore.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
but they won't allow it. And you're right that then it's got this pendulum thing where, okay, well, if you go after white people and you demonize them relentlessly, and you do it practically from birth now through the school system, some of those white people are going to end up being stricken by guilt, and they're going to walk around feeling like they're guilty for something.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That's the white guilt liberal thing. But then you're going to have others who... kind of become exactly what you accuse them of being because they're like, oh, you know what? If you're going to call me racist anyway, then, you know what? Fine. And there's going to resentment that builds up and then you actually create more of it, which I think they're happy about.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That was kind of... When we had the idea for the film to talk about race, we knew we needed to get Robin D'Angelo. I didn't think we'd get her because I figured she'd be a lot more cautious. Yeah, savvy and cautious. But apparently she has no idea what's happening outside of her bubble at all. So she didn't know who I was. I mean, I gave her my name and she had no clue. Wow.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
If actual racism is increasing in society, I don't know if it is or not, but I think the people that call themselves anti-racist are quite happy about that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think it is like a – yeah, I think you're exactly right about that. That's why for me the more – So the grifters that are getting paid, that's not that complicated to figure out why they're doing it. They're getting paid. A lot of them. A lot of them are. And even when they're not, there's still power and influence. And they're being consulted as kind of these moral gurus, which strokes the ego.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That's rewarding. The more interesting thing is what about the people who go to those people? and consult them as moral gurus. I mean, in the movie we have this race to dinner where you got these white women who sit around a table and they invite these other two women, Cyber Rao and Regina Jackson, to come to dinner. They pay them to come to dinner and call them racist for two hours.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And it's like, why would you subject yourself to that? It seems like the most miserable experience to volunteer to be broken down and insulted and degraded, which is what happened to these women. I mean, I saw it. It's like two hours of them just getting... You're racist. You're racist. You're racist. They go around the table, confess their racist sins.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And then they all each go and they say what their racist sin, like, what's a racist thing you've done recently? They all confess. And I'm listening to it. It's like none of you have actually done anything racist. I listen to all your stories. None of that is racist. There's a woman who said that she's married to a black guy and she. Yeah. He's loud and she tells him to quiet down sometimes.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Right. I think my wife is racist. She could be. She could be. She's racist against me.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But we kind of went into that knowing what the end was supposed to be, if we could get her. We came up with that idea. We went to a bar the night before the interview and we came up with this idea. Could we get her to actually pay reparations to Ben, our black producer? And we had to kind of talk him into it. And, you know, it was really just like,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They bend the knee. And with kids, it's so insidious because... Yeah. Kids don't care about race. They notice it, though, which is fine. But then you give them like this complex from such a young age, which is so unnecessary. And that's why I mean, I remember when my oldest daughter was five, we were at the mall or something and a black family walked by and she pointed at them and said, what?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Why are people black? Why is their skin like that? She wanted to know, why does skin color exist? How do some people have different skin color than other people? And of course, I told her, to be polite, we don't point at people in public, so I told her that. But then we talked about it. It's okay to wonder that. It's okay to notice that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think with these anti-racist people, if I was listening to them, I should have... This would have been an opportunity for me to give her a whole lecture about racism and make her feel really bad for noticing that and asking about it. Yeah. And then you create this complex. And yeah, fast forward 20 years and she's one of these women at a race to dinner. Exactly. Yeah. It's awful.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But it's a very potent thing. I mean, white guilt, the fear of being called racist. It's hard for me to understand because... I get called racist all the time, 50,000 times a day. And it just rolls off my back. I don't care because it's just... It doesn't mean anything anymore. It doesn't mean anything. But for you and I, it doesn't mean anything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But for a lot of normal people, especially... It's a death sentence. Right. To be called that is the worst thing in the world.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They're terrified of it. They'd literally rather be called anything than racist. Yeah. And then... So for them, once you... Those kinds of people... When that's the threat, when being called racist is a threat, you can get them to do anything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Spoilers or whatever, but the last thing in the movie when I do my own anti-racist workshop with these people, and they're all real people, and we get them to join in on some things that are really morally repugnant. Because they're terrified of being called racist publicly. They can't stand that thought.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
In real time, I was there for about two hours, and it was an hour and a half of the most mind-numbing conversation where I'm just – none of that's in the movie because it's just me, like, fluff questions. And I'm repeating back to her own ideas so she knows that I'm a safe person. Right.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
really mean shitty people to have a virtuous way of expressing that yeah i think that's that's right and also the internet i mean the whole idea that the internet isn't real we hear it all the time that's why i hate when people say uh well twitter isn't real life but and i understand what's meant by that when people say that but it actually is real life because
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
These are human beings who are communicating with each other. Now, there are bots, too. But if you're a human being on Twitter saying something, that's real life. It's not fake. This isn't happening in some kind of dream world. Right. But then people think that, well, okay, if I just say this on Twitter, I put it in a YouTube comment section, and it's this heinous, awful thing. It doesn't count.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It doesn't mean I'm a bad person because it's not real life. Which is like, that's like... Writing on a loose-leaf paper, calling someone a piece of shit and handing it to them, and then they get mad at you, and you say, hey, man, it's the paper. It's not real life. It just happened on the paper. It's a method for communicating. And so I think people have been...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Condition that in this world it's like a moral exception so you can do and say whatever you want and you don't have to feel bad about it. Right. And it turns people into sociopaths after a while I think.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's a safe space, and then you've got to build to it and build to it and build to it, and then finally you get to a point where you can do something a little weird, and she'll probably go along with it. Yeah. And she did. I mean, you saw, we go through a whole, we have a whole series of exercises we want to do with her. And she went, she did it. She was game.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I'm one of them. You seem fine. But, I mean, I am guilty of some of this. I do. I'm on it way too much, first of all. But then I have my excuse, which is it's part of my job. It's part of your job. I do often think if I didn't do this for a living at all, I don't think I'd be on any of this stuff. I think I'd be off everything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Because I don't know if you have a problem. If I go on vacation or something and I'm taking time, I have no issue putting it down. I have no compulsion to look at it. In fact, I have to, when I come off vacation, it's effort to get back. It's like, okay, I got to get back into this again. It takes me a couple days. Then after a couple days, now it's a compulsion again.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But I have to reignite this weird compulsion to constantly look at my phone.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But if you didn't do any of this for a living, if you just worked at Lowe's or something, do you think you'd still be – The problem is I'd still be me, and I still have this –
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So that was, and that was one of the first things we filmed. So after we got that, we knew that, okay, we have a movie here.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I think I think I would be the same, but I don't think I'd feel the need to. I would like to absorb all that interesting information, but I wouldn't feel the need to say, hey, world, here's what I think about this.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And not only that, but their engagement with you is cheap.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
they don't care that much so even if someone gives you positive feedback and they say oh that was a great tweet they've forgotten about it two seconds later right you're just they're just scrolling you're just the latest thing they saw and they're scrolling and they've already forgotten about it they don't care if they cuss you out because they're mad at you same deal they forgot about it two seconds later so yeah i guess it could be kind of intoxicating intoxicating to get the engagement but then it doesn't matter and that's one of the
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That's one of the things that makes it so toxic is how sort of like nihilistic it all is. That's why... This never was an issue before, but now I feel like when I go on social media, I'm constantly seeing these horrific videos of people dying, like snuff films are all over social media now. It feels like a relatively recent development. And... That's really horrible what it does.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I don't even think we quite understand what it's doing to our minds. I actually think we are all traumatized from it. I don't use the word trauma loosely. But what's traumatizing is not only are you seeing somebody die, but it's a context. It's like you see this horrible video. Someone just got shot. And then you keep scrolling. And a second later, you're.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
reading something about whatever, you know, a celebrity news or you're watching a cat video.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So it's like this, it's this horrific human thing that happened. But for you, it's just content. You absorb it that way. Um, And I don't know, after a while of just absorbing human suffering in this way, it's got to mess with your mind. Of course it does.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
50 grand you barely got anything out of her yeah that was well part of the point of the movie is that's why we put the price tags on the screen we want people to see how absurd it is so in a certain way it was like The higher they quoted the price, we said, great, we'll pay that because we want this in the movie. Right.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. But it's a thing. It kind of should haunt you for the rest of your life.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Do you pay attention to what people say about you online? No. You never search for Joe Rogan? Nope. Never? Nope. Shouldn't do it. Yeah. It's not good for you. I'll admit that I've done it on occasion. It's just... It's nothing but... If you want to just destroy your self-image, you can do it pretty quickly.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Because if all these people had said, oh, yeah, I'll do it for free or I'll do it for 200 bucks, just pay my travel, doesn't really make the point.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I don't care I'm used to it. It's the lies like when I see something about myself That's just a straight up lie. Totally made up. And then it picks up traction and people are, sometimes it could be, you know, even someone photoshopping a tweet that I never said or whatever, anything. That stuff still, still like bothers me. And it, and then I try to tell myself, well, it shouldn't bother me.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But at the same time it should, it's like, it's normal for a person to be bothered by when you're being lied about and other people are believing a lie, I think it's a normal human reaction that I'm like, I don't want, that's not fair. It's not true. You know, you can attack me for things that I really have said and done, but that's, you can't do that. That's not true.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But then at a certain point, you just have to sort of give into it and realize this is the way the internet works, I guess.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And then she basically said almost nothing. Right. But it was okay.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Well, it almost certainly was. It almost certainly was because if it was a white guy. They would have thrown him under the bus. Yeah, they would have. So the fact that they didn't. It's probably some like Hispanic kid or something.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
The thing that gets me about the Flat Earth thing is – because I didn't realize that it was a real thing until, I don't know, a few years ago. I did – I wrote – I posted something about it. And all these comments from real people that – what gets me is – well, you have the people that say, yeah, I think the Earth's flat. And that's – you're just really stupid.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But I was more fascinated by the, like, 80 percent of people who – 80 percent of the flat Earth crowd. 80 percent of them, their take was, well, I'm not saying the Earth is flat. but I'm open to it. So I'm open to the possibility. I get it if you're just completely stupid and you got sucked into this cult thing, but what I don't get is how can you be on the fence about the shape of the earth?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. And the moon landing, you're not a – you believe in the moon landing, right?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Because it's exactly what you just said about – well, there's a lot of reasons, but – The main thing is what you just said about the earth, the the the vastness of the conspiracy that would be required to fake that. It's so vast that it's just it's it's a lot more incredible to believe that we faked it than to believe that we just went and go into the moon. Don't get it's a massive achievement.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I haven't, but I can tell that there's little eye slits. You can't even see what's below you. Exactly.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But I think the greatest human achievement of all time. But even so, to fake it would be even more massive because not only would you need all of these space agencies and all the different whatever people in American institutions to be colluding, but you'd also need foreign governments, including adversarial foreign governments, who at this point certainly would know we faked it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
and for some reason haven't blown the lid on it. So they're letting us take this achievement that they know. Why haven't the Russians come out and said... All those things you're saying are true.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Well, I think that's because we lost the spirit and hunger for discovery.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You could develop the technology again. You can do all that. Sure you could.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But I think what you're describing to me, all that does is highlight how incredible the achievement was. If they did it. Right. If they did it. Well, here's the main point. There's no evidence. Because saying that it was a hoax... is an assertion of... You're not just denying an event. You're asserting a whole other event that you say happened instead.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And there is evidence that we went to the moon. Now, someone who's a skeptic might say it's not enough evidence or it's not good evidence. There's, like, evidence. There's eyewitness... There's people that went and came back and told us. There's footage. There's a lot. There is evidence. But there's no evidence of the hoax. Like, no one has come and said, here's my affirmative evidence
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
evidence that this hoax happened, it's never happened, as far as I'm aware. No one's ever provided that evidence.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So the idea that he missed those kids is like- The furries are doing a lot more than running around in those things too. They are. They are.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. I don't even want to know. Like a hatch. But it's actually a perfect example of what these people do, these race hustlers that-
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
All the images or a few of them? A few of them. But then other ones were found to be authentic.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
something happened it was a little bit unpleasant yes not a big deal there's a million ways to interpret that it's just a normal human thing that happens in the world like things happen that are a little bit unpleasant you're disappointed your kid didn't get a high five okay it happens uh but for them they have one lens for seeing the world and the lens is through this left-wing racial ideology so everything that happens is colored by that right uh and everything is understood through that lens so anything i mean you think about uh
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Well, but I think that's just that's the temperament it requires to do something like that. Could be. It's basically it's almost suicidal to go to the right. And so you have to be like not barely even a human being. psychologically to do it. So that to me is just like, and they just went through this whole experience, but who knows what that does to the human psyche.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
To even just be in the vastness of space, even on the space station, I feel like that would change me as a person.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So then what would you say, or someone who is a full-on believer.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Someone who is a full-on believer in the moon hoax. What would they say to my other point that there is evidence we went to the moon. You can try to nitpick the evidence. There is zero evidence of a hoax because that's a whole other event that would have had to have happened. There is no evidence at all, not one sliver of evidence ever of that hoax having ever happened.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But I mean, the JFK is an interesting example. Because yes, there are things that I'm skeptical of that are claimed. I don't really have evidence that the thing didn't happen or that it didn't happen the way they say, but I'm still skeptical. So I get that. But it feels different to me because the JFK assassination did happen. The question is, how did it happen?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But if we're going to assert that a major historical event, probably the greatest, the most significant historical event in history over one of them did not happen at all. No one did it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Michelle Obama, when she was first lady, she had multiple stories that she would tell about as first lady being discriminated against because of her race, allegedly. And one of them was she was in line for ice cream or something and someone cut in front of her. And she told this story in some interview, this very dramatic story about, well, they didn't see her because she's black.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Then, like I said, that's so what you're actually claiming is that some other thing this this they went somewhere and they pulled off this hoax and they planned it and they did like an event happened where they were faking it. Right. And so what I would want to see. Has anybody come out, any whistleblower ever, to say, hey, I was involved in the shoot or I'm in Hollywood.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Okay, so can I ask this, though? Do we have examples? We're saying, well, we don't know if a human can go through the... I would say, well, we do know because they did.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And meanwhile, it's like we've all been cut. Lady, people have cut in front of all of us. It's just that if it happens to me at Walmart, I don't think of it racially. I just think, oh, this person is an asshole. Exactly. But for her, it's all racial.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So my question is, have we tried to send humans through the radiation belt and not been able to? Has that happened?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I don't think the people... In the 1960s, the American people cared deeply about going to the moon.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But it probably takes a lot of time to get to a point where you can do that consistently.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I mean, weird makes it sound necessarily nefarious. I think it's... No, just weird.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I would say two things. Number one, I think that it does take... Yeah, we're kind of spoiled by the fact that there was this burst of incredible technological advancement. In everything. In everything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It doesn't necessarily... Not every facet of technology is going to continue at that pace forever into an infinity. So I think it does take... especially if you take a historical perspective, a longer-term historical perspective. It just takes a while to get from one thing to the next. It hasn't even been that long. I mean, 1969 was not that long ago from the historical perspective.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Right, exactly. It's an unpleasant thing that happens to all people. And if you're not in the kind of race hustler bubble, you don't see it that way. But it's interesting that nobody wants to call that out.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And especially if you want to do the next thing. I mean, what's the next thing? The next thing is to go to Mars. Most people agree. That's so much far exponentially farther away and harder to do. Sure. And so if that takes if it takes decades more to figure out how to do that, that doesn't seem that crazy to me.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And the second thing I'll say is that I do think I get your point about resources on the moon. There's a reason to go back. I agree. You know. practically speaking.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But it's just true that it requires a society that deeply values exploration for its own sake and is willing to make the sacrifices, is willing to send people off to do things just for the sake of exploration, knowing that they might die. I think we have almost no appetite for that now. Maybe the Challenger explosion was... You could point to that as the time when we sort of just...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
We have no appetite for people. We don't want people to die for this anymore. I see what you're saying.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It wasn't. But unfortunately, but politicians are the ones who decide it. People vote for those politicians. And unfortunately, there are a lot of Americans who are basically OK with sending money to Ukraine, which they shouldn't be. It's insane. I agree with you.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. And how do you know? So how do you know what's in that other person's mind? How can you ascribe motives to them? It drives me nuts that this is what we do now, where if someone does something or says something, someone else is offended by it. That person who's offended gets to decide.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But for the moon landing, you would need way more people involved. I don't know if you would. More institutions.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Does he have any evidence of that event occurring? Would he say, well, I know they only went so far and came back because of this?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
what the intent was behind the other person's action to the extent that if the other person says, no, no, no, this was my intention, I'll tell you what it was, they don't get to have a say in the intentions behind their own actions. They are suddenly not authorities in their own behavior.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. It's not as dumb as Flat Earth, but it does remind – to me it reminds me of – to me it's in the vein of like Sandy Hook was a hoax.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
There's a lot of weirdness to it. Isn't it similar? Okay, because a lot of this comes from it's such an incredible feat that's so difficult to do that it's hard to believe anyone actually did it. Sure. Which I can understand that mentality. But the thing is, you can go back in history.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And you could look at, for the sake of discovery and exploration, you can look at what other men have done hundreds of years ago that arguably is more impressive than going to the moon. Like what? I mean, you name it. Take any famous explorer from the 1500s to the 1800s, and whether it's Magellan or James Cook or Christopher Columbus or any of them,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
What they were able to do, navigating this vast ocean, going to play, having no modern technology at all, being able to go from where their starting point, hit some little tiny island somewhere and then go around and navigating a world that they don't even know what it looks like. They have no maps. They have no GPS. They have nothing at all. I cannot conceive of...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
This other person who was the offended party gets to inform you what you meant by that thing, which is really what the, I mean, the move is called Am I Racist? But in reality, There's only one person who can answer whether you're a racist person and that's you. And if you don't think that you're racist, then you aren't because racism is a thought process.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
how they could have ever done that. I don't know how in the world, not knowing what the world looks like, having no map, having no GPS, having no modern navigation whatsoever, how in the world could you possibly get on a ship launching out of France or Portugal or wherever and make it anywhere across the ocean? I don't know how you could do it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But it also took centuries to get to the point where it could be easily recreated.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I would say 100 years from now. Perhaps. Maybe. Christopher Columbus was 300 years before James Cook, I think. The technology they were using was not that different. It was pretty similar. It didn't progress that fast.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I mean, it's interesting. Yeah. I'm at a slight disadvantage because I'm going to assume that people have addressed some of those issues before. and have given responses to it, I'm going to assume. Like if I went to YouTube right now and looked up that video debunked, people have probably done that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So I don't know what their response would be. So it's interesting. I just don't see it. So to me, I listen to that and I think, well, that's interesting. I look into that to figure out. The first thing I want to know is, okay, here's your claim, the claim they're making. I need to know what is the official narrative, let's say. How do they respond to that? Because I know they do. Right.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And if it's not in your head, then you're not racist. You might have stereotypical views about people of other races. Everybody does to some extent. You might think things that are even insulting about people of other races, but it's not racist because racist means you hate people of other races or you think they're inferior to you.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But you could be not a racist person and think that whatever Asians are bad drivers. You know, you could think that that stereotype is true. Whether it's true or not, you just happen to think that that's a true thing about this group. Doesn't mean you hate them. Doesn't mean that you think that they're inferior.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You could. I would just need some kind of solid evidence of that to believe that's true. Yeah, me too. This, to me... There are some things that we call conspiracy theories that I think are, you know, clearly true. There are some things that we call conspiracy theories that I think are maybe true.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But there are conspiracy theories that to me are just that they're just they're just they're not even theories, really. They're just kind of like fanciful, whatever projections. And the ones that I don't find convincing are where they usually start with. There's a so-called official narrative of a thing that happened. There's a couple of things about what actually happened that are kind of weird.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And we look at that and go, that's a little bit weird. And then the conspiracy theorists, in that case, they come in and they find these little tiny cracks, if you want to call it. And then inside the cracks, they shove this whole Hollywood cinematic narrative that they have created to explain what's actually a pretty tiny crack. You don't need this whole thing to explain that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So with the moon thing, I mean, one of the first... Weird aspects of the moon landing that I think started kind of the conspiracy theories about it was the flag, the fact that the flag's moving in the picture. And so, yeah, it's like when you look at that, you don't really understand. You look at what that is where, because there's no wind on the moon.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But then you understand that, okay, for example, when you put the flag down, it creates reverberations. It makes the flag move. It's going to move for longer because there's no gravity. So there's an explanation for that. But if you're the conspiracy theorist, then you take the flag moving, and you're like, nope, the whole thing is bunk.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And most of the time, these stereotypes, they didn't just fall out of the sky. They're grounded in something.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Right. And nobody would be offended. That's the thing. Nobody would be offended by a stereotype that really was not true at all. Right. You're only offended because it rings true at least a little bit. Because otherwise it would just be – it would be absurd.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It doesn't look like he hit it. It looks like a breeze. Yeah, but then the other part of this is that they... So what? The people that went through all this trouble to fake the moon landing... How would they miss these things?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I'll tell you what would convince me to, not that it's a fake, but at least would make me open to it. One thing that would shake my faith considerably in the moon landing, if Elon Musk were to come out and say, yeah, I don't know about this moon landing thing. Then, okay, fine.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And I'm not saying this is my whole reason for believing it happened, but Elon Musk, first of all, if the moon landing was fake, he knows it was. He knows it was fake. Sure. He's the richest man in the world. He's shown zero concern for propping up official narratives at all. Right. So he's a guy that would know if it's faked. There'd be no reason for him to continue that narrative if it was fake.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
In fact, he could even say, you know, they faked it. I'm going to do it for real. I'll be the first one to go to the moon because they faked it. And he hasn't said that. So I also find that to be pretty compelling. The fact that he, as someone who wouldn't know, let's say the problem is that you and I, most people that talk about this, we have no like direct access to knowledge about space.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Which is why when you get – I mean in the movie we go – there's a section where we go kind of outside this bubble and we go down and we talk to bikers at a biker bar in the south. We talk to the poor black community in New Orleans. And the only reason we did that was just – Well, let's find people who are not – they probably didn't go to college, so they didn't get brainwashed there.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
This is all being given to us by other people. So you got to go to people that have actually were working with this stuff. And so the fact that he has no time for this theory at all, I also find to be,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I will say, the moon landing hoax idea, it's barely even a kook take anymore. I think it is, but you're probably in the majority with your take on it. The last time I talked about this publicly, I got absolutely ripped to shreds. Of course. It felt like 99% against. And it's going to happen again in response to this conversation.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Maybe, but it seems like it's shifting drastically. And a lot of that is people just have lost all faith in our institutions, which I understand.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So people are – I mean, that was kind of the point of your bit, that people are – once you see that this is a lie, this is a lie, this is a lie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. That is happening. And I'm totally sympathetic to that part of it. But I just think that the moon landing, there's a lot of good evidence for it. And also, this is an emotional argument.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's one of our greatest achievements as Americans. Sure. You've got to pry that from my cold, dead hands. You've got to really show me something to make me willing to give that up.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That's also wearing off, though. You think so? I don't think so. They were able to make her into a sensation, a political sensation, for about a month. I don't think she has that anymore. I don't think people are... Because you can hype somebody up and you can turn them into the next political savior through really good branding. They did that with Obama. But you got to have something.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They're not getting the corporate DEI seminars. They're not reading Robin DiAngelo or any of these people. What do they think about this stuff? Are they worried about systemic racism? Do they see everything as racist all the time? And what we found is no. They're just not even – they don't even speak that language. When you say the term systemic racism to them –
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
There has to be something. They at least have to have charisma. I mean, Obama had charisma. So you at least have to have that. If you have a politician who has charisma, then the media can come in and they can do the rest and they can turn you into.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, that's another. Or that it was shrapnel, which to me would make even less sense. Because, yeah, it's a very minor injury because she just got nicked. But if it's shrapnel, you would expect, you know, marks all over his face.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
The thing is, ears heal pretty quick. Yeah, and two centimeters. I mean, you can't see it from a distance.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Also, even if he didn't get hit with a bullet, which he did, But if he didn't, it doesn't make a difference. He still got shot at. It doesn't change what happened.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
The more bizarre thing about the shooting is that it's only been two months since it happened, right? Two months. Or not even two months. It's been like a month and a half. Mm-hmm. And we've moved on like it never happened. Like it never happened in two weeks.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's had no political impact whatsoever. Nuts. He got no polling boost from it. Reagan got like 12 points, briefly. Which just shows you the polls are full of shit. Probably. Yeah, full of shit. I mean, they are full of shit. But also, it would not shock me if, because we're so easily distracted, if people really did just forget and don't care a week later, two weeks later.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Why didn't he have a scope? This is one where I'm totally open to conspiracy theories, only because there's not even an official narrative. They basically told us nothing. So we're left to fill in the blanks.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I mean, and I just I can't. I think about when I do like a college speech, we'll have a little we'll have a few security guys there. Yeah. And there's no way, if someone showed up with a range finder, they would not get in the building. Anyone that looks vaguely suspicious with any kind of bag is getting flagged. I've got three or four guys, and I'm just a guy giving a speech at a college.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That never would have happened. It could not have happened. They would have flagged, especially three hours ahead of time. So how does that happen with a President of the United States or a former president? It's impossible to wrap your mind around. It's not like they've come up with...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's not like they've come up with some explanation where you could go, okay, well, now I can see how that might have happened. Everything we've heard since then just makes you even more confused.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think you're right that it was around 2012. BLM came into formation in 2013, I think. That was the Trayvon Martin thing. And so it's not a coincidence that it seemed like race relations in this country were improving decade after decade. They weren't perfect, but it seemed like they were pretty good. Much better than the 60s. Yeah, the 90s. I grew up in the 90s. It was not perfect, but...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That guy's a threat to democracy. Yeah. But I also think part of it, the fact that America seems to have moved on is nuts. Part of it, it's a political mistake. A lot of it's the media. Of course, they have no interest in talking about it. Some of it goes to the Republican Party. I mean, you had the Republican Convention, which was like two days later. So the timing is nuts. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Even at the Republican convention, I just felt like the fact that this guy was almost killed two days ago should be like the centerpiece of this thing. I mean, you've got all the cameras on you for four days. And so everything you were planning for the convention should change now because of this. And it should take on an extra seriousness and just the whole tone should change. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They've got Instagram influencers and they've got MAGA rappers from YouTube. It's just like you're not – you are not showing us how serious this thing is. And so I think that was a mistake.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They both are. I think they're equally as wild because Colbert apologizes to him apparently in that for being mean to him. In the clip we watched, he tells him, I'm so grateful that you're running for president.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And this was September of 2016 or 15. So this was, of course, after he'd already announced... A year plus before the elections. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I think it was that they were happy that he ran, and they wanted him to win the nomination because they thought that he easily beat him. So he was really... This really is a Frankenstein kind of story from their perspective. Yes. Because they look at him as a monster, this monstrous figure, and they... The media deliberately created this. They gave him all the attention.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They sucked all the oxygen out of the room for every other candidate because this is the guy they wanted. And they thought we were going to annihilate him. There's no way he's going to win a general election. And, of course, he won.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And I think that's one of the reasons why ever since then they haven't been able – the media, they just can't – they hate him with an extra passion that they have not had even for other Republican presidents. And I think a lot of it is – It's like they're projecting because they realize that they did this and they just can't get over it, I think.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I grew up in a diverse area. I went to public school. A lot of people of different ethnicities and races. We weren't talking about racism all the time. It was basically fine. And then something happened in the middle part of the first decade of the 2000s where it seemed like things started backsliding. And that's right at the time when Barack Obama was elected. And that's not a coincidence.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You also think that you are or you've told yourself that you are the vanguard candidate. protecting democracy in our way of life. Which is crazy. Which is insane. Of course, the idea that you have to prevent people from voting for a certain guy in order to protect democracy is nuts. It's so nuts. But that's what they actually believe.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And when you tell yourself that, you convince yourself that, well, this is for their own good. These people are silly. They don't know. They're dumb. They're bigoted. They don't understand what they're doing. And so for their own good, we have to prevent them. We have to do whatever we can to prevent this.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Like a lot of people have noticed that it's odd that we had a black president and then all of a sudden now we're having race riots again. And I think the reason is that when you elect a black president, I didn't like Obama. I didn't vote for him. I think his policies are terrible.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And not only can you get them to—obviously, they hate Trump, but to also demonize half of the country's population. I mean, there was just—I think it was MSNBC yesterday. One of these pundits was talking about Trump and said, well, he's despicable, he's terrible. But his supporters are, too. He said.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And they they went on about how terrible his supporters are, which is you're talking about tens of millions of Americans. A basket of deplorables. Right. But, you know, we take it for granted now. But 15 years ago, that would kind of be unthinkable. You just you wouldn't do that. You would you say whatever you want about a politician. You hate them. They're terrible.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But it was just generally understood that you don't you don't use that language to talk about all the people voting for these are American citizens.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And I don't mind – because you can go back farther in American history and you can find – like back to the beginning and they're in Congress like beating each other over the head with –
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
fireplace pokers and that sort of thing and i don't you know there's an argument to be made for that kind of it certainly makes c-span a lot more interesting uh but that shows a certain passion for the issues i suppose but that's it's what we have now is different from that it's it's it's much more i mean there have been multiple cases recently of congressional hearings
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Marjorie Taylor Greene, AOC. And who's the other one? Jasmine Crockett, I think. And it's like a Waffle House. It's like, you know. No respect for each other, but also no dignity at all. No class. No respect for the position.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But you would think that at least one positive you could draw from that is that, well, at least that means that systemic racism is not a problem in this country anymore. I mean, if a black guy could rise to the top of the system and run it, then clearly the system is not racist against black people. And in fact, was overwhelmingly voted into that position by Americans.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
One of the things that's always interesting to me is that they are so desperate to stop Trump and that they act like it's, you know, the future of the planet hangs in the balance. Meanwhile... they still own everything when they own all the institutions, Google, you know, the federal government. So the truth is that Trump could get into office.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
This happened last time he was in office for four years. They act like it was into the world. Then he's out of office and they basically reverse everything he did in like two seconds, a couple of executive orders, whatever. And, and most of it never took hold anyway, because the bureaucracy is entirely aligned against Trump. So, uh,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So that's the problem, is that even when Trump gets in there, he's handicapped in his ability to do anything because the entire federal government, he might be at the top of it, but everybody underneath him despises him, and they're all leftist. And they can just reverse it the second that he leaves. And yet they still act like if he's in there that it's the end of the world. They still can't.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You'd think they'd almost have an attitude. They're like, yeah, whatever, fine. Let him have it for four years. It still won't matter because we're still going to be in charge of everything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
which is true, so that is evidence that America isn't systemically racist against black people, but the race hustlers don't want us to draw that conclusion. They're worried that we'll look at Obama as president and say, okay, well, racism isn't a big issue anymore. And that's a problem for them because there's a lot of power, money and influence to be found in the racist racism narrative.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Of course, the funny thing is that he definitely will not do that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, yeah, he ran on Lockerbocker, but he didn't. I mean, that's the thing. They always... Their criticisms of Trump, one of the reasons they don't really land is that they they're not hitting him in the places where like they don't even understand what his weaknesses actually are. They try to make him out to be some kind of dictator. That's that's the opposite. If anything, he has the opposite.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
If anything, he has the opposite flaw that he's actually hesitant to wield power, even in times when he should. So, you know, if anything, that should be the criticism that you should use your power more. But he's probably the least dictatorial, you know, presidential candidate we've ever had.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Right. But they don't know what he did. The people saying that they don't know what he did. They don't care.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And the funny thing is these are also people who otherwise would say that the court system is entirely corrupt, that just because you're a convicted felon, it really doesn't mean anything at all necessarily. Right. But in this case, they put a lot of stock in it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So they had to kind of like double up on their efforts to convince us that America is actually racist, which is why during Obama's term, that's when we started getting all these race hoaxes and the race riots and BLM. That's when things like people start talking about microaggressions and all this kind of nonsense because.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I kind of go back. That's the conventional wisdom, at least the people I talk to, that they say, well, if Trump doesn't win, he's going to jail. And so he's got a lot on the line here. I kind of think, are they really... Maybe it's naive of me to think, but would they do that?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Or would they rather just, he loses, Kamala wins, and then they'd want Trump to just fade into obscurity and never talk about him again? I don't know. I would tend to think that that would be, that they'd prefer that. But probably not. I mean, they...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
There's certainly a real thirst for vengeance. They want revenge on him. I think that's what it comes down to. Whether it helps them politically or not. Because I think that's the problem. If Kamala wins and then they really go after Trump and try to put him in jail, and if they actually do put him in jail, I don't see how it helps them politically.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think that's just going to radicalize people on the right even more than they already are.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And for good reason, by the way. I'm radicalized by it. So it doesn't help them politically, but I think he has to pay the price for defying them for so many years.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They needed to tell us that, yeah, you might think that this issue is kind of solved now, but it's not. Racism is actually worse than you ever imagined. It's lurking everywhere.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I'd be interested to hear his answer to that. It wouldn't surprise me if, in a weird way, when you become president, you... You feel very powerless once you're sitting there because you realize that you're overseeing this just gigantic mammoth thing that's just so unwieldy. There's no way to really control it. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And especially in his case, you've got so many people within his own administration plotting against him. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
is there a lot of people within his own administration now you think plotting against him or only then do you think it's just like backstabby politics that just what they do period i mean at the time there certainly was and i think but i think he also made some he made some bad choices in personnel he made a lot of really bad i mean bringing guys like john bolton in uh there's no chance that you're not going to be undermined by somebody like that um
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And now we're at a point, and then not long after that, they started tearing down Confederate Civil War monuments and stuff, stuff that's been there for like 100 years, which was always weird because 100 years ago, people could, whatever, walk by a Robert E. Lee monument and not care. It wasn't a big deal to them, black or white.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And especially, you know, in Trump's first campaign in 2016, drain the swamp was was one of the was build the wall and drain the swamp and lock her up. You know, the two three big things. And you don't we don't hear drain the swamp nearly as much anymore. In fact, I don't think I've heard it. It's never said anymore. Right.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Which is unfortunate because that is actually that is that is the first thing that needs to happen if he gets in there. And what I would love to see is that. Okay, he's in there now. He got back in. They tried to stop him. They tried to kill him. They tried to put him in jail. He still got in there. He's not getting reelected. This is it for him. Four more years.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
He's out of politics forever after that. And I'd love to see him just... I got nothing to lose now. They're going to put me in jail when I'm out of office. So I got nothing to lose. I don't care what these people say. And just ruthlessly push your agenda through no matter how much they complain about it. I'd love to see him do that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think that they're assuming he will, which is why they're so desperate to stop him. But I don't know. It didn't happen the first time. I hope it does.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Well, even if because even if it is most of the stuff they call misinformation isn't. But in the case when there's something that is misinformation, it's just not true. That's being plenty of that goes around the Internet. That's still free speech, too. You have the right to say things that are not as long as you're not slandering somebody.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You have the right to make claims about the world that don't happen to be true. So the idea that that doesn't qualify as free speech is, of course, absurd. But then that also requires some central authority to be the arbiter of what is true and what is not.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Now, all of a sudden, it's a bigger deal to us than it was to people whose parents fought. They had grandparents who fought in the Civil War or died in the Civil War. They were okay with it. And yet for us, what, the wounds of the Civil War are fresher or more raw for us than they were for people a century ago? It makes no sense. How are we less able to...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That's why I think the free speech thing is people act like it's a complicated thing. It's a complicated subject. Where do you draw the line? What is free speech? What qualifies and what doesn't? I don't think it is that complicated, really. I think it's just you should have the right to express whatever your opinion happens to be. Everyone should be able to say their opinion, their point of view.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Wrong or right, reprehensible or not, they should be able to say it. Yeah, you can't defame someone. You can't threaten to kill somebody. But those aren't really opinions. That's different. If it's just your opinion about what's happening in the world, it should be allowed. And it should be allowed legally. It should be allowed on every social media platform.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I think it's kind of simple, actually, to differentiate between that and the – because, yeah, there's certain kinds of speech that should not be allowed. We all understand that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And hate speech, too, is the other label they use. Tim Walls said this recently about free speech. He said, well, of course you can't. Hate speech and misinformation doesn't count. But what is hate speech? Hate speech is just you're expressing that you hate something. People hate things. It's legitimate. There are some things we should hate.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
So the idea that it's automatically illegitimate to express a view if it's communicating hatred is, of course, ridiculous.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Right. And it implies that all hatred is automatically bad, or at least it puts the people in power and position where they can decide what kind of things you're allowed to hate and what you're not.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
be objective and non-emotional about the Civil War than people who had family members. Ex-slaves were still living back then.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Different world, right? Yeah. I think Elon Musk is actually preserving free speech. One of the main people preserving free speech in America right now. And going into space. So it's always funny to me when people... When the left tries to nitpick and needle at him, it's like, this is one of the most significant human beings on the planet right now.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And he'll, you know, SpaceX will launch a rocket and it'll blow up or something. Stephen King was making fun of him. Right. Yeah. You'll have someone like Stephen King, like rocket blew up. It's like, dude, your rockets don't blow up because you don't build them.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And a lot of times when they say that the rocket malfunctioned or something, it's actually doing exactly what it was supposed to do. This is a test run or whatever. Yeah, they have to test tolerances and parameters.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. And you need and we just need people in the world. This is very much the it's like the Teddy Roosevelt man in the arena, you know, speech. You need people in the arena who are actually trying to do stuff, do important things. You need people like that. Yeah. And of course, social media gives a platform for people who are like not doing anything at all.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
To just sit and snicker at the few people in the world who are trying to achieve something?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. I mean, that's the catch-22 of social media because it could be – If you use it exactly the right way, it does give you access to all these human beings and the way that they're thinking about things, which can be quite enlightening. But most people don't use it the right way.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And this is also why, in my opinion, none of my kids have smartphones or social media. They're going to get bullied.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, I think once you... I mean, we haven't quite decided when we're going to introduce this stuff to the kids. But once you get into high... At a certain point, yeah, I don't want them to be 18 and it's their first time ever holding a cell phone. Right. Because then you're just... Then they have no idea. We haven't given them the tools to understand how to use this stuff. Right.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Like the emotional and intellectual tools. So you got to introduce it at some point. But... Most kids today, I don't know what the latest figure is, but millions of kids today have smartphones by the time they're like eight or nine years old.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
A lot of my kids, you know, with friends when they come over and they're eight, nine, ten years old and they've got phones, I just think it's like, it can only harm them. You understand, as a parent, you're giving them something. At this age, they cannot use it appropriately or correctly. They don't have the tools for it. They're not old enough. It cannot help them in their life.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. I mean, the average age of first exposure to pornography now is like... I think it's around 10 years old. I mean, it depends on, I guess, what study you look at, but it's young. And it's not just... Because, yeah, people sometimes will dismiss the harms of it because they'll say... They'll say, oh, yeah, I found a Playboy under my dad's mattress or whatever. Not the same.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's not at all the same. I mean, the kind of thing you're being exposed to, how often you're being exposed to it, how ubiquitous it is now, how readily available it is, it's not at all the same.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Well, that kind of goes to show there's something primal about... Even just the... Well, obviously with pornography, but the phone, the... Even like my two-year-old twins. They don't have phones, obviously, but... Just something about the phone itself. Even if it's off, they just like to have... It's a cool object. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And our kids, we will... They don't have tablets and all that stuff, but if we go on a long car trip, it's the one time we make an exception. If we're going on a 20-hour car trip, just for our own sanity, we'll let them have tablets in the car, just with games and books and stuff. But... Then we get wherever we're going, we take the tablets away, you don't get them anymore.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But there's like a detox period of like two or three days where they're jonesing for it. They're constantly, they can't, they're constantly asking for it. And once you get past that, they're fine again. But there's a real, it's like there's something, it creates this compulsion and kids take to it really quickly.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And it just becomes, it's like a, it becomes another limb for them, part of their, part of them somehow really quickly. Yeah.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. And it's yeah, we've gotten that with the movie. People ask, is it is all is that all real or did we stay? It's all totally real. We didn't script any of it. And that in particular is a yeah, it's like a support group for white people who are struggling with their white grief because they they have privilege and they're grieving their whiteness and their privilege.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And there's this woman, Bershia Wade, I think his name is. a black woman she'll do these sessions with white people where she'll kind of like talk them through their whiteness and people yeah people pay money to go and sit around and uh and talk to her and that was another one that was like an hour and a half two hours in the room in real time when did they start figuring out who you were uh
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
At some point, midway through, they started looking at me strange because I was intentionally making it really awkward just because it was funny. But then, as you can see in the movie, I get emotional because I'm on my own journey of self-discovery. And I had to leave because there's one rule that all these people have. We ran into this multiple times.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
If you're white, you're not allowed to cry in front of black people because that's white tears. And you can't shed white tears around black people because white tears are manipulative. So in this place, she had a cry room. She said, if you get emotional, you have to cry. We have a room. Get away from us and go cry over there. So at one point, I left to the cry room because I was getting emotional.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's a very emotional experience to confront my whiteness. And... I guess while I was gone, they started talking to each other. Like, who is this guy? They looked it up, and they were Googling. And then I came back. The whole thing had changed. The tone had changed. They kicked me out.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
That guy, too, I can say. One of the people in that group was a professional cuddler, actually. It's not in the movie, but we just know that about them. They get paid to cuddle with people? Yeah, one of the people in the group. Jeez. A cuddlist is what they call it. Jeez. They're fringe people. We thought about somehow we could put up a lower third on the screen. But it seems fake.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's like people don't really professional cuddler. Come on. But this is too crazy. These people exist out there. This is a world that they live in. Yeah. They go to events like this and they're, they're very, they feel they have a lot of guilt for the fact that they're white. You know, uh, there were people crying in the circle. I mean, they were getting really emotional talking about it. Oh,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah. And that was always – it was always going to go that way because – George Washington, founding fathers owned slaves. Not only that, but they were rebels, you know, rebelling against a governmental authority. And if they had lost, then they all would have been hanged as traitors. And that's how they'd be remembered. Thankfully, they didn't.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
There's the part where she says, think about being white. What emotions come up when you think about being white? And then everyone goes around and they're like, oh, I have revulsion. I just feel, I cringe. I feel cringe. Really? This is you. You're talking about yourself. It's just, it's sick. It's a sickness.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
I didn't think, I mean, we had that planned as our last exercise when we bring the whips out. And we debated like, is anyone really going to take a whip? I didn't think anybody would. I thought that this would be, because we needed an end for the scene. And so I thought I'd bring the whips out and everybody would leave. Yeah. And so then that would be the end.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And then that would be, that's our, cause you know, it's a narrative we're trying to tell story. So that would be the thing that shows me I've gone too far, but then they started taking the whips. And I'm like, I don't think I can actually have you beat yourself right now for like liability. I don't know if I can do that. Um, so I was not expecting that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Yeah, there was really the, uh, right before that. I mean, you know, it's spoilers, I guess, but, uh,
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
when i'm berating my uh my racist uncle um and uh well i don't know you gotta watch it but you gotta watch it yeah that that was for me the the most shock making the movie the most shocking thing to me that happened that really took me back was in that moment and the way they responded to it uh which i was not expecting and it's kind of dark yeah they got aggressive with them yeah yeah
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
You don't enjoy it in the moment because it's really unpleasant in the moment. You're in this environment with these... Insane people. Yeah. It's exhausting listening to this. How did you develop that skill to do that, though? Because that's a skill. I don't know if I... I can't say I did anything to develop it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
It's more just... I just know what... We're making a movie, so I'm aware of that the whole time. Obviously, if the cameras weren't rolling, I wouldn't be reacting the same way. So I'm just kind of keeping that in the back of my mind. This is what we need for this scene. But the main thing is we want, with both movies, the whole point is to create an environment...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But so there's a it's actually there's a there's a it's not that far of a leap to go from from one to the other. And, of course, the issue is that. Everybody who lived on earth prior to about, certainly prior to 100 years ago is racist by our standards today, every single one. There was no one who lived on earth 100 years ago who we would not consider racist anywhere of any race.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
where the other person feels comfortable saying what they actually think and what they really believe and doing what they would really do. And that means not react because if you laugh at them, they clam up. If you argue with them, if you show any real skepticism, They clam up. They're not going to tell you what they really believe.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And then it's a boring movie because all you're getting are the talking points. And that's especially the case we found in this... That was the case with What Is Woman? We're talking to the trans activists. But in this, when you're talking to the race hustlers, they've been doing it for a lot longer. The race hustle has been around a lot longer than the trans hustle.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
And they're pretty good at what they do. And they're usually pretty sensitive to...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
detecting when someone's being skeptical and if they get that then they they're they kind of go into a different mode and they go into this kind of hr dei mode where everything's very sanitized very surface level they're not gonna they're not gonna tell you the stuff about how you know all white people are inherently racist and they're not gonna do they're not gonna get into the really brutal terrible racist stuff um so we just thought making this movie how can we
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Just create an environment where they'll really be themselves.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Which with What Is Woman, all that required was just kind of being a blank slate and asking questions. With this one, it required more of an affirmatively agreeing with them approach. and demonstrating that I'm fully on board with this.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
She did. But the thing is, she did kind of. And I think you can see it on camera. In the room, I could tell she was kind of like... What did you just do? She was trying to figure out in her head. I think she was trying to sort through it. Like, is he...
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
but I think she just couldn't, uh, she couldn't, the possibility that she was in the room with someone who doesn't already agree with her about everything. It's like unthinkable to her. She couldn't, she couldn't fathom it. She probably, that was probably the first time in like 20 years that she'd been in a room with someone who doesn't agree with her on everything.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Has she responded to the movie at all? Uh, No, she took down her Twitter page. So most of the people in the movie have taken down their Twitter pages, deleted them. So they're kind of going into a bubble somewhere. I mean, the truth is there's not a lot they can say because, listen, if we deceptively edited it, if we pulled any trick like that, they'd happily come out and say that.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
But they know that we didn't. Everything that's in there is what they said. We didn't change anything. Yeah. It's all real, and they know that, so what can they say? And especially in Robin DiAngelo's case, you know, it goes in a direction. She's willing to do some things that are quite embarrassing for her, and... But, you know, we didn't put a gun to her. We didn't force her.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Oh, it's in theaters. It's in theaters right now. Oh, nice. Nice. You can get tickets at mracist.com.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
Nice. We're trying to get it out to make it available to whoever wants to see it.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
If you go back 200 years or earlier than that, almost everybody either owned slaves or was okay with slavery as an institution. You go back 500 years, And there was nobody on the planet who considered slavery to be wrong fundamentally.
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
They might have had issues with how slaves are treated in some context, but it took like thousands of years for it to ever even occur to a single human on earth that slavery is actually fundamentally wrong, which is a crazy thing. And that's actually an interesting thing you could talk about and think about. Like, why is that?
The Joe Rogan Experience
#2204 - Matt Walsh
How could it be that it's so obvious to us, but some of the greatest minds of history, they never thought of it. But we can't talk about that because we have to talk about slavery and racism as if they're exclusively white Western phenomena.