Unashamed with the Robertson Family
Ep 1019 | Jase Uncovers a Big Jesus Controversy & What to Do If Your Spouse Feels Like Your Enemy
Wed, 08 Jan 2025
Jase wins an argument by metaphorically becoming one with the wind and poses a question: “What is the most controversial thing Jesus ever did?” Jase, Zach, and Al illustrate how to work on yourself to make your life, marriage, and family look more like Jesus, even when things seem like they’re falling apart. Plus, what did Mary think about Jesus’ ministry and miracles? In this episode: Romans 8, verse 28; Galatians 3, verse 26; Galatians 4, verse 19 — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Chapter 1: What does it mean to know Jesus better?
I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. We've kind of been talking about the last podcast, this idea of a new year, the idea that for me, I've been using the term to know Jesus better. Jason's been talking about Jesus stuff. How do we make Jesus stuff applicable? When are we going to do the Jesus stuff?
Chapter 2: How can we make Jesus' teachings applicable in our lives?
That was my point. Right, right, right. As a church, as a family, as an individual. Because I'm just saying, when you read the Gospels and then look at your life, there should be a profound determination. Does my life look like Jesus? I have his spirit in me, right?
Right. And I like the idea. So you ended the last podcast by telling the story about you apologizing to Missy, which, by the way, we should never get too far along in life. We can't apologize to anybody. Right. Especially people we love the most. But I love the idea because I was thinking the exact same thing, Jace. When you first become a Christian, when you go all in, you believe you surrender.
There is a point in time where we just get to that point where it's unmanageable where we are and we give in. And for some people, that's very young. Some people, it's older. Some people have stuff in between. I call it the proclamation of intention. In other words... I'm proclaiming I want to be a follower of Jesus.
And according to Ephesians 1.13, when that happens, we receive the Spirit of Christ. We are included in Him. It says we're marked in Him with the deposit of our resurrection, the Holy Spirit. But then, and I brought up Ephesians 1.17.18. For me, it was just kind of my theme verse for this year, even though we're going to be studying John.
There's this idea that if we have a spirit of willingness, now that we've made our intention, I call that the process of integrity. In other words, it takes time to build integrity. You mentioned 34 years in marriage with Missy. For Lisa and I, it's been 40 years. It's been a process. And look, there's been some rough times and there's been some amazing times. But over the course of the time,
There's an integrity for both of us that's grown, and that's the process of growth in Christ. That's what should be happening. We shouldn't look at the end.
When we get down to the end of our lives, like mom and dad have been together 60 years now, and I'll watch them, and man, the integrity they have for each other and their relationship with God, that's the way we want it to be as we get closer to the end. The biblical word for that is sanctification.
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Chapter 3: What role does the Holy Spirit play in our lives?
Chapter 4: How can we build integrity in our relationships?
There's an integrity for both of us that's grown, and that's the process of growth in Christ. That's what should be happening. We shouldn't look at the end.
When we get down to the end of our lives, like mom and dad have been together 60 years now, and I'll watch them, and man, the integrity they have for each other and their relationship with God, that's the way we want it to be as we get closer to the end. The biblical word for that is sanctification.
There you go. It's being freed. progressively from the power of sin over the span of your life. And that's something that happens in measure as you walk and grow in maturity.
And I'm so glad you brought that word up, Zach, because I think it's in, is it 1 Thessalonians? It talks about the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit. So you can't have sanctification if you first don't have the Holy Spirit, because that's the source of the work that goes on over the course of your life. And some people get it quicker, some people it takes longer.
Well, it's John, John makes that, or Jesus makes that point in John's gospel too. I mean, you get to, when we get to John 14, 16, 15, 16, 17. Right. Um, he says the spirit of truth will guide you into all truth. And he links, Jesus links the Holy spirit with the agent of the Trinity who reveals truth to the believer. And he says in John 17, that that truth then sanctifies the believer. So it's a,
He prays that they'll be sanctified by the truth. Your word is truth. Well, how are you going to hear the word? The Holy Spirit reveals that to us. And he reveals to us who God is. And so the reason why that results in sanctification and being freed from the power or the grip of sin is that when God reveals abundant life to me, which is himself.
And as I participate in the abundant life, as I participate in him, then I stopped believing in the lies because I'm actually tasting in the goodness of God. And my faith increases as I give glory to him. Romans chapter four. That's what happened with Abraham. I think that's the progression of how that happens.
No, I like it. And so here's my little way of framing it, and this is a sermon I'm working on for Ephesians. There's a proclamation of intention, Ephesians 1, 13, 14. There's a process of integrity that takes place when we have a willingness and a heart that seeks wisdom.
And then the last thing is verse 18 when he says, "...we pray the eyes of our hearts may be enlightened to know the true hope of our inheritance." And that's what I call the promise of being an image bearer. In other words, Jesus came and said, if you've seen me, you've seen the Father. I'm the image bearer of God.
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Chapter 5: Why is it important to interact with people outside our faith?
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Well, that's when you got to have a realization that if you're only being conformed into Jesus's likeness two hours a week at a gathering, that's not very much. And that's why I'm saying you can't do Jesus stuff inside a building twice a week. That's true.
And look, the more you grow, the more you should always be able to help other people grow. I mean, that's just part of the natural process. Over the course of the holidays, there were two different occasions in our home, in our southern layer, Lisa and I, sharing a meal, having some of our friends over. different places of their own Christian walk. Some are new Christians.
Some have been there a while. But we got into stuff about one of the couples that was there, their children's son is going through a divorce. Well, that's created a huge amount of problems on the whole family. It's difficult because you've got this separation going on. So they're genuinely seeking, what can we do? How can we help? And they're asking Lisa and I these questions.
And even though we haven't gone through that specifically, because I understand what Jesus did, and can point back to some of the things he points out in the scripture, I'm able to give them good advice, good spiritual counsel to help them in that situation. That's part of the process of helping people see who Jesus is in the moment.
Because look, things get sideways in a marriage, in a relationship, and that's when you need Christ the most. There was another couple there, and this guy had had a strange relationship from his father as an adult. And basically just a cutoff. I don't want to have anything to do with it anymore. Well, I mean, you're talking about hurt at a deep level.
I mean, we're going through this stuff with dad. I can't imagine. If we didn't have this close relationship we've had of all the years of being together and him guiding us and teaching us for this moment. So those are things, if you're not prepared through your own walk with Christ, you can't offer anything to anybody else. And so one is you have to be willing. You have to be open.
You have to have those table moments that we're talking about. That's how you share Jesus. That's real life.
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Chapter 6: What does it mean to be formed into the image of Christ?
Well, just imagine how Jesus having a discussion with Jewish leaders, James brought up Nicodemus at the beginning of this, And they're saying, yeah, but we know. We've spent multi-generations of preparing for the moment of the Messiah. And yet they don't realize they're talking to the Messiah. He's like, I am the guy you've been talking about, the ultimate experience of God in flesh.
And they're like, yeah, but let us tell you what we know because we've been preparing. They knew so much about him, but they could not recognize him.
Well, my point is that most people are not doing Jesus stuff because they think, well, it may be the preacher's job. But, well, that's what we're paying you to do. That's right. Which Ephesians 4, which you're going to get in your series, says the exact opposite. The leaders are supposed to prepare God's people, the rank and file people.
For works of service, which is what Jesus' whole ministry was. He came here, you know, not to be served, but to serve and give his life ransom to many. And that was in the context of Zacchaeus, who was a tax collector, a wee little man, you know, up in a tree. And what did Jesus do? He invited himself, you know, to his house.
Which you make such a good point. If a pastor's doing his job, he works himself out of a job. Yeah. I mean, is that not true, Zach? I mean, you're always good. I'm always going to have pastoral DNA in me, and I'm going to be helping people and growing people. But at some point, I work myself out of a job because I'm training people to do exactly what they're supposed to do.
Well, exactly. That's why I brought up John Tyson. I said I like his story because he's focused on Jesus because you listen to a few of his sermons, and he has picked New York City. To go and say, look, he's trying to get those people to go out in the streets and in their apartments. And I was going to say homes, but they're upstate. Right. And share Jesus. Yeah. Well. Have you been to New York?
I've been there. Yeah. I actually did a little street preaching there when I was just late in my teenage years. It did not go well. It was met with resistance frequently and often. And so what I was going to say is that's one excuse. But the other excuse is, well, I don't know enough. Or I don't know the verses. I don't know what to say. Because these conversations... are intimidating.
And so I was going to use the illustration. So now Jay and I have that argument, and he finally relented because he knew. I was like, it'll work. I'm just telling you on a northwest wind, they're going to come over my left-hand shoulder, and they're going to come from behind us, which I'm not saying that's a bad thing.
It's just a lot harder to shoot them.
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Chapter 7: How does personal experience shape our understanding of faith?
Chapter 8: What is the significance of sharing meals with others?
Because if the argument became, where is West? Yeah. Where is North? And he didn't understand why I wasn't participating in the argument. And I was saying, I've hunted there on a Northwest wind. I don't care what that map says. Those ducks are going to come from behind us and they're, He just couldn't get it.
Your experience trumped all the academic knowledge is what you're saying.
Exactly. And that's what I'm saying. There's no substitute for experiences while the duck boys are struggling because they think they know what they know, but there's something. Duck hunting is unpredictable.
That is a great analogy to what we're saying because when you were initially talking about all this at the beginning, I was thinking about a song that that we used to sing back when I was running the college ministry at White Street Road. And the line was, I don't want to talk about you like you're not in the room.
And the idea was that we can get into these discussions about the Lord and we can sing these songs And we're doing it in a way as if he's not present. But to experience him in a real way, which Christ, I mean, he came in the flesh. That's the whole point. John 1, 1, the word became flesh. I mean, like, and dwelt among us. So that is the point. And to walk with Christ is,
To dwell with Christ is like, I'm actually going, and I've been duck hunting every day, every duck season for the last 40 years. I mean, you can't replicate that kind of experience. I mean, I can read about it all I want. You know intuitively, because you've been doing it a lot more, Jace, than anybody.
I mean, you're going to know intuitively stuff about duck hunting that nobody else is going to know if you only go three or four or ten times a year.
Well, just imagine how Jesus having a discussion with Jewish leaders, James brought up Nicodemus at the beginning of this, And they're saying, yeah, but we know. We've spent multi-generations of preparing for the moment of the Messiah. And yet they don't realize they're talking to the Messiah. He's like, I am the guy you've been talking about, the ultimate experience of God in flesh.
And they're like, yeah, but let us tell you what we know because we've been preparing. They knew so much about him, but they could not recognize him.
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