The rules of romance have changed, and many young men feel they can't keep up. We get some tips from a Texas men's relationship coach. This episode was produced by Hady Mawajdeh and Carla Javier, edited by Miranda Kennedy, fact checked by Melissa Hirsch, mixed by Patrick Boyd, and hosted by Jonquilyn Hill. Shutterstock image by fstop Images. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Chapter 1: What challenges do men face in dating today?
Are women aware of the unique dynamics or challenges that men are facing that might actually affect their perception of desirability or datability?
Hey, y'all. I'm John Glenn Hill, and this is Explain It To Me, your hotline for the questions that matter most to you. We recently got a call from Rohan.
Hello.
He wants to know why people in their 20s and 30s are dating less.
Dating is obviously a challenging experience for everyone. And one of the challenges that I had sort of noticed is that men are kind of experiencing a harder time dating than women.
He's asking because he's been having his own trouble on the dating scene. The state of dating, particularly for men, has been everywhere.
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Chapter 2: Why are men struggling more with dating than women?
Why are men in such crisis? I mean, only 40% go to college. And women with degrees don't marry men who don't have degrees.
66% of young men between the ages of 18 and 29 are currently single, but only 34% of young women in the same age bracket are single.
Producer Hadi Mawagdi knows about them firsthand. Okay, Hadi, you were pretty excited about taking this question from Rohan. Why was that?
Well, I mean, JQ, there are a few things. For starters, I'm a single guy in his mid-30s and landing a date has been harder than ever. You swipe, you send roses, you sneak into the DMs. It's exhausting. You know, these dating apps really suck. And on top of all of that, I've heard so often that that women have decided to quit dating. They've given up on men. And I guess who can blame them?
Chapter 3: How do dating apps affect men's dating experiences?
But our guy on this call, Rohan, I honestly had no idea if he was one of those dudes who's like uber worried about birth rates or if he was simply struggling to get a date. And here's what he told me when I gave him a call.
One thing that I think is not really kind of discussed enough is that there are a lot of terminology that is being thrown around, like this kind of popular Rhetoric of like become a high value individual. And so it's interesting now that like now there are metrics of kind of like what it means to be a high value or low value in terms of datability.
If you're interested in someone, what is the way to pursue someone? And how do I at least, you know, demonstrate a bit of interest? in a way that is obviously consensual, but ideally reciprocal without having to feel like I'm either throwing a lot of money or I'm wasting my time. Yeah, I don't know. I was speaking with someone.
Someone said, well, you know, everybody's tired because nobody wants to get played.
So as you can tell, Rohan has spent a lot of time thinking about dating. And that's why I wanted you to give him a call, JQ, to help him on his journey.
Yeah. And you piqued my interest. I wanted to hear more about how it's going for Rohan.
Dating is obviously a challenging experience for everyone, but some of those challenges are maybe nuanced or they're asymmetrical.
Yeah, I'm curious. Do you and your friends ever talk about this? Like, what kind of conversations do you guys have with each other about this?
Yes, we've talked a lot about this. You know, I have some great male friends. I also have a younger brother. And I think one of the biggest things that we found is that kind of some of the means or mediums for meeting people are now very inaccessible. So monetization of dating apps is not just a nuisance, it actually can be financially exclusive.
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Chapter 4: What role does social media play in modern dating?
And I think black women tend to be unfortunately deemed as less desirable. Right.
Yeah, I definitely get what you mean. Like, you know, I've seen my fair share of colorism in dating, especially in my early 20s. It sounds like you use dating apps. Do you mind telling me which ones you're on?
Yes, I'm on Hinge and Bumble and Coffee Meets Bagel.
Ooh, okay. I am well-versed in all three of these apps. Okay, walk me through your approach. So, like, say you're on an app, you see a woman you want to match with. Like, what's the next step?
So I'm interested in a profile, and I'll review it, and I'll swipe, and then there's a match. And what I've realized is that it's very easy to actually ghost. I remember I was... chatting with someone, I really liked her profile, and I was trying to kind of flirt digitally, try to build a little bit of banter.
And so we had set a video date, and I had been very explicit about ensuring she was comfortable with it. And then I actually extended a Google Calendar invite, and she marked yes, she confirmed on the invite. So I was going in with a lot of confidence that this is going to happen. And then when I joined, she didn't show up. And so I had...
texted her saying, hey, look, just want to check if, you know, I'm in this lobby. And she said, I'll be there in a few minutes. And she didn't show up. And I waited, you know, basically about an hour. And then I realized that she was ghosting me.
I'm sorry, Rohan. That's all right. That sucks. That is like not OK. And that sucks.
I appreciate that. I think that's maybe kind of just a function of the way that dating is, that some of these dating mediums, when they're off screen, is that it's very easy to kind of escape accountability.
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Chapter 5: What can men learn from older generations about dating?
You know, I actually would not say it's so much guidance. If I could have one request, it would actually be, you know, people who can actually go through, like, roleplay exercises and really just showcase, like, this is what a positive expression of interest, one that is, say, you know, an IRL approach that is... comfortable and not creepy, not weird, not uncomfortable.
Or this is a way to kind of express vulnerability in a setting without violating the norms.
Okay, so we're gonna get Rohan some dating help. And look, I'm no man expert. So Hadi, our producer who you met earlier. Hi. He paid a visit to a men's relationship group at a bar in Austin to figure out how we can be Rohan's proverbial wingman.
these guys are a bit older and they had some sage words of advice it's really easy to look at a group of people our age that are talking about the stuff we talk about and go these guys are so broken you got to get kicked in the teeth a bunch of times before you realize wasting here's what it is and so i would encourage the young guys find a men's group even if it's a group of older guys
And go learn from them because they've all made mistakes that you don't need to make. You can learn from them.
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Chapter 6: How do societal expectations impact dating dynamics?
That's coming up. We're going to figure out how to help guys get dates. Stay tuned.
Oh, man. What am I even doing?
It's Explain It To Me. I'm Jonquan Hill. Before the break, we heard from a caller who's struggling in the romance department. And when it comes to all matters of the heart, there's one go-to person here at Vox. Senior reporter Allie Volpe. Okay, Allie, is Rohan an outlier or do his struggles with dating sound familiar to you? I don't think he's an outlier at all.
Just anecdotally, so many of the single people I know personally are having a hard time with dating. It just seems like nobody is having a fun time.
It's hard to find the girl that you really want to be with the rest of your life. A lot of guys have very high standards for what they're looking for.
You're looking for something serious. You're looking for a person that can match your energy. And sometimes that means you're going to be single longer than you would like.
And like we're generally socializing less than like even 10, 20 years ago. So it makes it hard to just meet people.
Like playing on your phone when you should be listening to her, but everything she's saying is just going in one ear and out the other because you'd rather be on your phone.
We're also living in a way that doesn't necessarily promote connection. Like, we stare at our phones when we're on public transportation or while we're waiting in line for coffee. We use self-checkout. We order food via apps and touch screens. We wear AirPods in any interstitial moment.
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Chapter 7: What are the common pitfalls of online dating?
I'm doing a follow-up story about dating standards and expectations specifically. And, you know, like going back to the 70s, 80s, you know, if you would poll women about like what they were looking for in men, they're often looking for these like provider type qualities of they're high earner, they're going to protect, they're going to support.
And men just as consistently are like, I just want somebody hot. Yeah.
Well, there's a girl at school. She hot? She's super smart. Hot? Funny and cool. Hot? Yes, she's hot. Super hot.
Nice. And these expectations have persisted, like, from the 80s until, you know, recently. Like, these things have not really changed very much. A recent YouGov poll found that men prioritize sex, romance, and physical attraction more than women, while women emphasize empathy, monogamy, and independence more.
But it sounds like the standards have also changed. What's changed and why have they changed?
This is, I think, a good consequence of the Me Too movement, I think, is that there's been like a wider discussion about like what behavior women would consider predatory or inappropriate. So I think there's more of an understanding that like you shouldn't be creepy and harass women, which is great. Like that is wonderful.
And Richard Reeves, the expert I talked to, he's the president of the American Institute for Boys and Men, and he wrote a book also called Of Boys and Men, Why the Modern Male is Struggling, Why it Matters, and What to Do About It. He told me that the men that he works with, like, generally understand this. Like, don't be a creep. But that's getting in the way of them dating, you know?
Like, they're so in their heads about it. Like, they don't want to come off as, like, a quote-unquote bad guy, but they're just sort of opting out of it altogether. Yeah.
I think a lot of young women actually, one of the things they feel about a lot of young men is that they're a bit passive. It's almost like a lot of those men almost don't feel they have permission to be assertive.
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Chapter 8: How can men approach women in real life?
And so people are writing people off based on some of these red flags. But I think everybody is going to have something that might give you the quote unquote ick or, you know, might not be your dream standard. And we are more likely to write them off immediately because of that. You got to meet people in person. I think like, again, like apps are fine, but I think it's a tool.
You got to go to places where there are people and you're doing an activity that like you like. So like you shouldn't go to like run club if you hate running and expect to meet somebody, you know, like maybe you do like like a wine tasting club or like you go to you take some pottery classes or comedy classes, whatever.
go somewhere where there's going to be people that like you can see week after week. Like if you're seeing them week after week after week, like they kind of get a sense of who you are. And I think we just like, can't assume the worst of people. I feel like trust is really low right now. Again, another young male reader reached out to me. He's 20, 21, and he's just starting to date.
And he just feels like, how do I get people to trust me? How do I get how do I trust other people? And I get it. It's really, really hard. But I think we have to just like assume that people want what we want.
Like we just have to have a little bit of like humanity and flexibility for people and like to understand like, yes, if I'm an inherently like valued but imperfect person, so is this other person.
Explain It To Me will be back in a minute.
Okay, be cool, be yourself. It's just a date.
This is Explain It To Me. I'm Jonquan Hill. And this is producer Hadi Mawagdi.
Hi again.
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