A gloves-off trade war with the United States is uniting Canadians against their southern neighbor.Matina Stevis-Gridneff, the Canada bureau chief for The New York Times, explains how the dispute is shifting the country’s politics, culture and place on the global stage.Guest: Matina Stevis-Gridneff, the Canada bureau chief for The New York Times.Background reading: President Trump intensified statehood threats as he increased tariffs on Canada.For more information on today’s episode, visit nytimes.com/thedaily. Transcripts of each episode will be made available by the next workday. Photo: Amber Bracken/Reuters Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.
Chapter 1: How is Canada responding to Trump's trade war?
This is Daily producer Michael Simon-Johnson. I am in downtown Toronto because things are getting real here in Canada.
Okay, Anna Holy here, producer on The Daily. I have just touched down in Winnipeg in Manitoba, Canada.
It feels like the vibe is changing and I am here to do a vibe check.
How would you describe how you're feeling about what's going on between the U.S. and Canada right now? Canadians have always been known as nice people. We turn the other cheek.
We've been kind of backed into a corner now by your president. America, Donald Trump. How can American people back this man?
I don't buy any more USA products, just buy Canadian goods.
I will not buy anything from America. In fact, I've told anybody and everybody I possibly can, don't ever go down to America.
I served in our Canadian Navy, and nothing ever takes me more than when somebody looks down their nose at us.
I'm very, very proud to be Canadian.
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Chapter 2: What is the public sentiment in Canada regarding the trade dispute?
But it does sound like that's when Trump sort of started raising complaints about the U.S. relationship with Canada.
Fox News is reporting that Trudeau warned Trump that his tariff proposal would kill the Canadian economy, to which Trump replied that Canada could then become the 51st state and that Trudeau could be governor.
And made the supposed joke of Canada becoming the 51st state of the United States.
That meeting did not appear to go well.
The Canadian delegation brushed that off at the time, but it would come back to haunt them.
Right. I think a lot of us did. And no one knew if it was one of the many things that he says that you don't know whether to take seriously or not. For sure.
And I think that at first that was generally seen as like a troll. A lot of people thought it was quite personal to Trudeau because we knew Trump doesn't like Trudeau much from his first presidency. But I think that we started realizing it is probably something more ominous when Trump gave a press conference on January 7th.
So thank you all for coming. We'll take a couple of questions. Yeah.
And our own colleague David Sanger of the New York Times asked him about his claims on Greenland, which is an autonomous area of Denmark, and the Panama Canal, and Canada.
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Chapter 3: How did the Trump-Trudeau relationship impact trade negotiations?
And if that upsets foreign leaders, including the American president, I'm fine with that because I have one job to do is to fight for this country. We will never be the 51st state, and I will always stand up for our flag and our people.
So the opposition party, the conservatives, need to sort of reinvent themselves, frankly, more close to the center to have a fighting chance in the elections. So it's a kind of odd moment of political consensus in a country that was five minutes ago going through this incredibly polarizing political situation.
Are either of these candidates articulating what the future of Canada would look like? Are they talking about what would happen if the United States isn't at play anymore?
Absolutely, Kim. And I think that's just been something really interesting to observe. There's clearly an existential crisis happening with the Canadian economy, and this huge breakdown in the relationship with the United States is driving it home.
So both candidates and both parties are talking a lot about what a future of a successful Canada would look like, diversifying away from the United States' dependence. And part of the reason they want to be doing this urgently is that the situation with the tariffs from the United States is like shifting sands. The one day it's going to be 25 percent on everything.
The next day that's canceled, but it's going to be 50 percent on steel. And so this is a very destabilizing situation for the Canadian economy. And Canada doesn't have a lot of other customers. They sell most of their stuff to Americans. And that's why they're looking much more toward Europe. I mean, half of Canadians, according to a recent poll, want to even join the European Union.
That's amazing. I know that's how far this is going. But they're also looking to improve other relationships. Right now, they're in a really tough spot with China, which is another top trading partner. The Chinese have imposed tariffs on Canada, sort of trying to squeeze them not to cut a deal with the United States on tariffs and trade.
And so they're finding themselves in a really difficult position when they need to strategically rethink their global economic and trade links. And both the liberals and the conservatives are casting a wider net around the world for new best friends.
Mm hmm. Matina, in any good relationship, trust is essential. So in this relationship between the United States and Canada, let's say Trump goes back on the tariffs, decides that he wants things back to the way they were with Canada. Can the relationship be put back together again?
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