President Zelensky left the White House without planned peace negotiations, after President Trump shouted at him and accused him of 'gambling with world War Three'. Also the latest on Pope Francis' health.
Chapter 1: What happened during the meeting between Zelensky and Trump at the White House?
We begin this podcast with the clash in the White House heard around the world. What began as a much anticipated meeting to discuss a route to a peace deal to end the war in Ukraine ended with President Trump and his Vice President J.D. Vance berating President Zelensky and accusing him of gambling with World War III. Here's some of it.
You're gambling with World War III, and what you're doing is very disrespectful to the country, this country.
In this entire meeting, have you said thank you? You went to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October. Offer some words of appreciation for the United States of America and the president who's trying to save your country. Please, you think that...
If you will speak very loudly about the war, you can... He's not speaking loudly. We are staying in our country, staying strong. From the very beginning of the war, we've been alone. And we are thankful. I said thanks in this cabinet. You haven't been alone.
We gave you, through this stupid president... $350 billion, we gave you military equipment, and you men are brave, but they had to use our military equipment. If you didn't have our military equipment, if you didn't have our military equipment, this war would have been over in two weeks.
In three days. I heard it from Putin. In three days. This is something you... Maybe less. In two weeks. Of course, yes. You don't have the cards. I'm thankful.
You're buried there. Your people are dying.
You're running low on soldiers.
Listen, you're running low on soldiers. And your people are very brave. But you're either going to make a deal or we're out. And if we're out, you'll fight it out. I don't think it's going to be pretty. But you don't have the cards. But once we sign that deal, you're in a much better position. But you're not acting at all thankful. And that's not a nice thing. I'll be honest.
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Chapter 2: What was the Kremlin's response to the White House meeting fallout?
Subsequently, President Zelensky left the White House, reportedly told to leave on Mr Trump's instructions. Our Russia editor Steve Rosenberg spoke to Helena Humphrey in Washington about the Kremlin's response.
So far there's been no comment from Vladimir Putin about what happened in the White House. Then again, President Putin doesn't need to say anything, really, about what happened in the White House. Not right now. He can afford to allow events to play out. You remember Donald Trump a little bit earlier, he said that this is going to be great television.
Well, you can just imagine the Kremlin leader sitting in front of the television set and enjoying the spectacle, the spectacle of his fiercest enemy. The leader of the country that Vladimir Putin invaded three years ago being so publicly rebuked by the President of the United States and the Vice President of the United States in front of the world's media. Quite astonishing.
So no comment from Vladimir Putin, but we have heard comments from Dmitry Medvedev. He is the former Russian president who is now the deputy head of the Russian Security Council. And he wrote on social media that after what happened, he's calling on America to stop military assistance to Ukraine. Wouldn't the Russians just love that?
And Steve, what do you think this tells us about relations between the United States and Russia right now? Are we witnessing a shift?
A seismic shift, absolutely. I mean, just look at what's happened in the last two weeks or so, right? It began with that phone call between Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump, I think on the 12th of February. America bringing the Kremlin leader back in from the cold. We've seen U.S.-Russian talks beginning at a high level.
We saw the extraordinary events at the Munich Security Conference with that open schism between America and Europe. And now, after these dramatic events in the Oval Office, we see a breakdown in relations between the United States and Ukraine. All of this is good news for Vladimir Putin. The Russians are very confident now.
that they are going to build a new relationship with America, a stronger relationship with the Trump administration, and that they are going to get everything that they want in this war against Ukraine.
That was Steve Rosenberg in Russia. Well, following that meeting in Washington, President Trump published a statement on his Truth Social network, which we've voiced over.
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Chapter 3: How did Trump explain his actions in the aftermath of the White House clash?
Instead, President Trump was posting on Truth Social to say that Mr. Zelensky had disrespected the cherished Oval Office, that he said he wasn't ready for peace and that he should come back when he was ready.
Extraordinary turn of events on a day in which Mr. Zelensky came here, I think, at a critical juncture, politically, diplomatically, everything weighing on this moment, that he was going to come here, yes, to sign the minerals deal, which now appears to be dead in the water, has not been signed here, but more crucially, he needed to try to leave with some sort of assurance from the United States president that there would be a security guarantee.
for Ukraine in the event of Russia breaching any future ceasefire. Now, clearly, he doesn't have that. And instead, what we have is an extraordinary historic moment where the rupture between the United States and not just Ukraine, but the entirety of Europe is now at an extraordinary level and has been played out in this unprecedented moment in front of the world's media and the Oval Office.
The US, though, still wants Ukraine's rare earth metals, so it's not just going to shrug it off, is it? I mean, what happens next?
In terms of the critical minerals that Donald Trump wants American hands on, that deal is, of course, dependent on the wider issue of whether or not Mr Zelensky is prepared to do this ceasefire deal with Donald Trump. Now, that is the card that he does actually hold. That's what Donald Trump was... effectively saying is that he doesn't hold cards, but he does hold that over the US president.
The gamble for him, of course, is the existential future of his country if he doesn't cede to that demand. So the stakes have been raised even further. But, you know, in this moment of complete breakdown of relations here, it's very hard to see how it gets built back up any time soon.
That was Tom Bateman. Reaction has been swift. The former Russian President Dmitry Medvedev posted on X that, and I quote, the insolent pig finally got a slap down in the Oval Office and Donald Trump is right. The Kiev regime is gambling with World War III. But European leaders have been expressing their support for Ukraine and Mr Zelensky.
The presidents of the EU Commission and Council, Ursula von der Leyen and Antonio Costa, issued a joint statement on social media telling the Ukrainian president, you are never alone. President Emmanuel Macron of France, who saw Mr Trump earlier this week, said Russia was clearly the aggressor and it was important to respect the people who've been fighting since the beginning.
The UK Trade Minister Douglas Alexander said he found the exchanges in the Oval Office deeply troubling and sobering, adding that the world was in uncharted waters. Our correspondent Rob Watson told us more.
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Chapter 4: What are the international reactions to the US-Ukraine diplomatic breakdown?
I mean, it may just be that big.
There's been a lot of diplomacy going on this week at the White House. What do you think the international reaction to this is going to be?
Well, some of it has been coming in already. Numerous European leaders have expressed horror. You will not, I think, you will struggle to find a European politician, apart from those who are pro-Putin, who are just not utterly aghast.
And I think what is going on in the foreign ministries and chancellories and government offices across Europe, literally, as we speak, Jackie, is to say, what on earth do we do about this? Because it seems to me that it utterly undermines, it almost ridicules those efforts by Sakhir Starmer and Emmanuel Macron earlier in the week to say, yeah, we think President Trump is listening to us.
He's going to stand by Ukraine after this. It looks as though it's right back to square one.
That was Rob Watson. And there has been a statement from Downing Street. A spokeswoman said that the British Prime Minister has tonight spoken to both President Trump and President Zelensky. He retains unwavering support for Ukraine and is doing all he can to find a path towards a lasting peace based on sovereignty and security for Ukraine.
The Prime Minister looks forward to hosting international leaders on Sunday, including President Zelensky. The Vatican says Pope Francis has suffered what they called an isolated breathing crisis and received medical assistance to help him breathe. The 88-year-old has been in hospital with pneumonia for two weeks. Claire Gengrave is the Vatican reporter for the Religion News Service.
She spoke to Julian Marshall.
Every evening we've been getting these updates from doctors and he had a bronchospasm, which means a strong respiratory attack. And that led to, obviously, a worsening of his overall condition. He had to be subjected to bronchial aspiration. This is to clear his airways and get rid of carbon dioxide in his lungs.
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Chapter 5: What is the current health condition of Pope Francis?
PHONE RINGS Michael, I'm speaking. Michael, it's Kath. Hello. Oh! Hello, Kath. How are you? I'm fine, dear. I'm a nervous wreck here. Isn't this incredible what you can do now with a computer?
Next came the money. The three founders sold it to eBay in 2005 for $2.6 billion. Later, it was sold to Microsoft for $8.5 billion. Now, after two decades, the famous ringtone is being retired. Other platforms have edged it out of the market, including Microsoft's own Team software, which flourished during the pandemic.
Skype fans took to X to express their sorrow, saying it was the end of an era, with one adding Skype's fumble during the pandemic will be studied for centuries. Microsoft says it will make the transition easy for users and that chats and contacts will automatically migrate to Teams. Adding in a statement, Skype has been an integral part of shaping modern communications.
We're honoured to have been part of the journey. Stephanie Prentice.
Still to come in this podcast... The Gen Z bell ringers, keeping an ancient tradition alive. The United Nations Secretary General, Antonio Guterres, has urged the US and other governments to review their decisions to cut funding for international aid. Mr Guterres said cuts to the main overseas aid agency, USAID, would harm the United States' own interests.
Going through with these cuts will make the world less healthy, less safe and less prosperous. the reduction of America's humanitarian role and influence will run counter to American interests globally.
I can only hope that these decisions can be reversed based on more careful reviews, and the same applies to other countries that have recently announced reductions in humanitarian and development aid.
The head of the Africa Centre for Disease Control, Jean Kaseya, has warned that pandemics originating from Africa would be harder to contain with less support from the West. HIV programmes funded by USAID are closing down following the termination of their grants by the new US administration. Our Africa correspondent Mayani Jones reports.
Dr Jean Kaseya, who heads the Africa Centre for Disease Control, was keen to sound the alarm and to remind the world of the devastating impact of the COVID-19 pandemic five years ago. He pointed out that with less money, recent outbreaks of the Marburg, Ebola and Mpox viruses in Africa would have spread further and posed a greater danger to the public.
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