Tiffany Reese
Appearances
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
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Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Sarah, a former client of Amy Tate, who you'll hear from this episode, delivered with Origins Birth & Wellness Dallas in 2019. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Did Amy Tate or anyone from Origins reach out to you while he was in NICU? What was your contact like with them post delivery?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Bringing him home must have been such a big deal. Oh my gosh, yes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
I waited to reach out to her all the same day, back to back, call Gina, call Caitlin, call Jennifer Crawford, et cetera. None of them returned for comment. And then I email Amy and she right away calls me and leaves me this voicemail where she's just kind of like instantly spiraling. And then she sends me an email and it's pretending like I did not reach out to her at all.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
She instead is like, I'm writing you because your podcast says something about me and I got a negative review on my Google reviews. My name has been in the podcast because Kristen mentioned that she was her midwife before transferring care to Jennifer. And so it wasn't until we had allegations that we're going to reach out to her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
She was just mad that her name was mentioned and she was like, which is concerning because you're connecting me to origins. Literal facts that are in public court documents because of all the lawsuits. She was in emotion and anger at the moment and in shock maybe. She called again and then I texted her. I was like, I have availability later. I'll give you a call. So then we end up connecting.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
The reason I hadn't reached out to you before was because, quite frankly, there was no, like, allegations against you. It was more like the passive mentioning of your name as just kind of like a fact, and we were able to confirm that through, like, the court documents and stuff.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
So there have been a few people that have come forward alleging that they were under your care at Origins before you left and they're reporting negligence.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
I can't speak to anything without knowing what it is. Right. I can shed a little bit more insight on that on that piece. But that's when like the shift happened. And that's why I wanted to connect with you, because obviously that's a very different situation. I don't know if you recall Sarah and her son Tuff.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Yeah, I know it's tricky with HIPAA violations and all that kind of stuff to like speak to it. So I was going to ask you more like general questions, more of like your processes in terms of how long would you consider too long that someone is pushing before you transfer them?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
And then what, there was another claim like records being changed after the fact or things being in... Okay.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Because it sounds like they had you working the floor by yourself, essentially doing everything before you left, is what I gathered.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Like, business stuff. Yeah. More of the, like, running of it. One of the claims was that she wasn't aware that shoulder dysplasia was, like, an... Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Yeah, she did tell me that, which is why I want to make sure I reach out. And we discussed it.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Yeah, they said that you would say that, actually. They said that that's what Origins has claimed this whole time.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Yeah. My perspective from the people that I've spoken to is that they feel that they had really... I talked to Kristen initially and was helpful to her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Right, right. She said that you left and then Jennifer, who was a student, became her, quote, midwife, who had no business practicing. Did you know that they were going to handle the clients that way, that they were going to be passed off to a student?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Yeah. Did you ever feel like when you were leaving, like, the need to alert the authorities? Did you worry that what Gina and Caitlin were doing were criminal?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
And they're basically, their claim against you was essentially that you had breached your contract. But your claim, no?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Gotcha. The subsequent lawsuit, right. That's the second lawsuit. Right. Sorry. Yes. Yes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Amy, I've been doing this a long time. I'm very well aware of how everything works, but I appreciate your time. Thank you very much. Bye bye. Bye bye.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
I'm sorry she's trying to rewrite history. How would she know that when they weren't even monitoring him all the time?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Amy Tate was Jennifer Crawford's preceptor. Yes. And then Amy left because Gina and Caitlin were allegedly overseeing Jennifer Crawford. She might have switched because Amy left.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
And at this time, Amy Tate, Gina Thompson and Caitlin Wages owned the birth center together.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
What do you hope that listeners will remember when they're hearing these stories this season?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Sarah and Tuff, thank you so, so much for sharing your story with us. I appreciate all of your energy and time. I know it's not easy to revisit and I genuinely appreciate it so much.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Monday, April 21st, 2025, our team reached back out to Amy Tate with a full document with quotes of allegations that would be included in episodes 12 and 13 this season. The following day, she sent her final statement in regards to these allegations. Hi, thank you for your message and for the opportunity to respond.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
I understand that I am being named in an upcoming episode of Something Was Wrong in connection to care I provided as a midwife. While I cannot discuss the details of any specific client experience due to confidentiality, I want to express my heartfelt empathy to any family who has experienced pain, fear, or lasting harm in their birthing journey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Birth is one of the most sacred, vulnerable moments in a person's life. As a provider, I've always held that responsibility with deep care. If a client remembers their experience differently than I intended, or if my presence contributed to harm in ways I did not realize at the time, I carry that seriously.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Since 2021, I stepped away from origins and built a new practice continuing my work, which is rooted in reflection, integrity, and transparency. My license remains in good standing, and I continue to serve families with the same commitment I've held throughout my career, to walk beside them with care, clarity, and humility.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Thank you again for the opportunity to respond and for amplifying voices that often go unheard. With respect, Amy F. Tate, LMCPM, Clinical Director, Swiss Avenue Birth and Wellness Collaborative. Next time on Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you. each and every listener for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins birth and wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Was there any discussion at this point about going to the hospital?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Additionally, midwives Jennifer Crawford and Elizabeth Fuel have also not returned our request for comment. Amy Tate's responses to the allegations against her are included within this episode. This season is dedicated with love to Malik.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
That's very scary though. Yeah, yeah. That video was so chilling. I was able to like zoom in with my video. So I was only looking at her. When I got to the part where she was talking, you can see her panicked, in my opinion.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
Were they directing him to do this or his instincts were just kicking in?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
How long had it been between when your water broke and when he was born?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E12: Tuff
The last two survivors you will hear from this season, Sarah and Barbie, were clients of Origins Birth & Wellness a few years before the other survivors you've heard from this season. They were clients of Origins during the years when Origins had three owners, Caitlin Wages, Gina Thompson, and Amy Tate.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
They became closer friends when Tom moved to Indiana during the COVID-19 pandemic through Teach for America.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Their friendship drifted apart a bit when Tom moved again, and he didn't keep up with her as much online or otherwise.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
It's important to note that even though Tom had seen the Twitter page about Stoner's alleged crimes, he was still questioning whether or not these people had legitimate claims. But having not been paid back by Stoner, Tom began to feel at minimum like he was being lied to.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
But after Stoner had been arrested and released on bond for both the OWI and the rental scams, Stoner resurfaced in Tom's life and began spinning her lies and manipulation all over again, trying to get money out of Tom for her Teslas and Yonis. To be clear, Tom had no idea at this point that Megan had gone to jail twice already.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
He had no idea she was a scam artist and Stoner had never given him personally any reason to doubt her credibility. Then, in May of 2023, Stoner began reaching out to Tom asking for money.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
A member of the Megan Stoner Awareness Group, Mike Neal, contacted Tom at the beginning of August 2023 to inform him about Stoner's known crimes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
I remember in the pre-interview, you told me that you actually originally sort of met Megan in a buy nothing Facebook group. What can you tell us about that?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Tom was hesitant to loan Stoner any money to begin with because, as he had shared with us, he's been taken advantage of in the past by friends when it comes to money. But being the kind and empathetic person Tom is, he eventually agreed to help Stoner out by trying to pay a bail bondsman on her behalf.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Stoner, and later someone claiming to be Stoner's mom, Gail, kept claiming the card wouldn't go through, and eventually Tom learned that his card kept getting canceled due to strange charges.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app. In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
Tom trusted Stoner, and he wanted to be a good friend to her. He shared personal card info with her, which he now regrets. But when you live your life with integrity, you assume others do as well, especially those you call friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
You've given her $1,000 via Venmo, and she was trying to get you to run this card or different cards over and over again to allegedly pay this bail bondsman on top of the other money, right?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
When Megan has created this fake alibi for herself that she's in some sort of hospital.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E6: A Weak Bridge Collapses
In the second half of episode five, we met Tom. Tom met Stoner through a disability advocacy group that he founded.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
In December of 2021, three of Stoner's rental scam victims contacted the Fishers Police Department and told police that they were victims of fraud involving a rental home that was advertised on Facebook. Each person had signed an individual lease and paid at least $600 to secure the home after Stoner gave them a tour of it.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
From December 12th, 2021 to March 28th, 2022, Stoner and her co-host Isaiah created the Sinking Ark podcast, which was about the alleged scandals of Ark Churches, specifically the Itown Church, which has several campuses around Indianapolis. We're told that Stoner mainly attended the campus in Fishers, Indiana.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
On her podcast, Stoner shared hers and other people's experiences with Itown Church and with Ark. On January 7th, 2022, Stoner called Fisher's PD about a disturbance stating that a person was beating on her car window and told her that she caused a seven-car pileup due to her dangerous driving.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
But I wanted to say thank you so much to the community members, both in Indiana and beyond, who have been instrumental in this effort, helping to catalog evidence, collect and document her crimes and the harm caused over the past years and decades for some that they've been following Megan Stoner's crimes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I've been told by many who drove with Megan in the car or have heard about her driving that she is a quote, scary driver and many have suggested that she has no place driving at all. You will see on her record several speeding tickets and obviously the OWI that we've spoken about previously on the season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
In fact, she was charged with speeding infractions on January 16th, February 10th, and February 12th of 2022 alone. And then on February 28th, 2022, Stoner was arrested and charged with operating a vehicle while intoxicated.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
As we heard in Episode 3, according to investigative reporter Julie Roys, on March 3, 2022, Pastor Jeff Thompson contacted her to inform her that Megan Stoner said there was a murder-for-hire plot against the three of them.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
It was later determined by Pastor Jeff Thompson that Megan was lying, and he contacted Julie Royce to let her know that the murder-for-hire plot was in fact a hoax created by Megan Stoner. Pastor Jeff Thompson made a statement to his congregation regarding Stoner's credibility.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
In the statement, he shared that he communicated with Stoner for a few weeks after meeting her on the All About Cough subreddit. Quickly, the conversations with Stoner seemed bizarre, including her attempt to impersonate pastors from ARC and the governor of Indiana, Eric Holcomb, through fake phone numbers and fabricated screenshots.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
In March of 2022, during Stoner's controversy with iTown and her father's alleged approaching death, online, Stoner claimed that a member of iTown Church shot her mom, Gayle. It has later been confirmed that her mom had not been shot and that Stoner made up the whole story, which she admitted in a recording with Chloe, which we heard in episode four, that was made up for attention.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
We're told by several sources that Stoner lied about her parents being dead before they actually were. Her dad did die on April 3rd, 2022. And after his death, it's alleged that Stoner had used her dad's likeness to drive for Lyft. On April 4th, 2022, Stoner is charged with disregarding a stop sign. On April 14th, 2022, Stoner was charged with improper headlights and a speeding infraction.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
On July 1st, 2022, according to a Fishers Police Department incident report, Stoner called the Fishers PD about a road rage incident between her and a, quote, white male in a silver pickup. Stoner alleged that she honked her car horn at the man who got out of his truck, walked towards her car, grabbed her phone, and dropped it on the ground. Stoner allegedly recorded this exchange on her phone.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Summer of 2022, Stoner was allegedly a teacher at a school for only a few days. However, many reported that she posted an Amazon wish list with around 200 items to social media and sent through DMs and wrote a Substack article urging people to donate.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
When I asked Megan about why she only worked at the school for two days, she told me that she had been bullied by the students, that one of the students had made a TikTok about her, and that she decided not to go back. However, I have not been able to confirm this information.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Something that really stands out to me when I look at the bird's eye view of Megan's behavior is that she really impacted her community in many ways. If you pull up her name on the mycaseindiana.gov website, there's many small civil cases against Megan. for hiring people to do work and then not paying them, or writing people bad checks, many different ways that she impacted her local community.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
At the time of recording this, Megan Stoner is set to be released from the Hamilton County Jail this Friday, November 15th, 2024. And we haven't even gotten through all of the crimes and harm that Megan Stoner has perpetuated. Since the season 22 trailer dropped, I have learned of many other victims of stoners, all across the United States and Canada.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
We will hear from some of those members of the community who were scammed by Megan or taken advantage of or promised funds for work that they were never paid. And many of those victims that had experienced Megan heard about the Megan Stoner Scams Awareness Group and started sharing their stories online.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
So then people really started to get a better idea of how much of a parasite Megan had been to their community. And I think it really fueled the fire between the community members and made people want to follow her more. and make sure that justice could be found not only for the people in the group but for what's suspected to be many others that we don't even know about yet
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
someone that you're gonna hear from, his name is Edward Ma. In 2022, he was a victim of stoners. He first met stoner through the Twitter mental health space and the two became friends. And he even had come to Indiana and hung out with her before, although he noted her very poor driving skills when they rode in the car together.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
He had expressed to Megan through their friendship he was unhappy with his living situation. And Stoner allegedly put him in contact with governor of Indiana, Eric Holcomb. And Edward began texting back and forth with whom he was told was governor Eric Holcomb, who had reached out to Edward saying that because Edward was a friend of Megan's essentially like, I'm happy to help you.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Stoner pretended to be many political figures while talking with Edward, and she also had a neighbor contact him. Edward eventually paid Stoner about $5,000 for a place to live.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Maybe elsewhere too, who knows what we'll discover by the end. I've spoken to many survivors and allies involved with this case, both on and off the record. I'm thankful to all of them. Not all feel comfortable being on the podcast, but still want to help with our investigation.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
On December 7th, 2022, Stoner was charged with a civil collections case from Bulldogs Moving Company, LLC. I spoke with Seth of Bulldogs Moving Company about his experience.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
But before we get into the next chapter of this story, how a group of citizens came together to help bring a second wave of justice for Megan Stoner's victims, I think now would be a really great time to recap what we know about Stoner's crimes leading up to the community stings of 2023. Here's what we know.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Megan Elizabeth Stoner was born February 28, 1998, to Gail Ann Updegraff and Dennis Lee Stoner. The two never married, though they were together for a long time. Stoner's aunt's name is Linda Sue Updegraff, and Stoner would later in 2017 steal over $20,000 from her aunt Linda on credit cards that she took out in her aunt's name without her consent.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
This matter went to civil court, and Megan and her aunt Linda didn't speak for several years. Because of this, I'm told. Megan has a half-sister named Elena J. Stoner. She's approximately 48 years old, and since Megan Stoner is only 26 years old, I'm told that they grew up very separately for the most part. I'm also told they don't get along.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I was told by a man who spoke with Stoner over Facebook in April of 2023, who produced screenshots of their conversations, that Stoner was also pretending to be a car sales representative. She had four to five phone calls with the man and his wife and had been urging them to send Stoner $2,000. Communication stopped when Stoner was arrested at the end of April.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
And then on April 25th, 2023, Stoner is charged with nine felony charges, corrupt business influence, fraud, theft, fraud, theft, fraud, theft, fraud, theft. On April 26, 2023, there was an order issuing a warrant for Stoner's arrest. And on April 28, 2023, Stoner turned herself in and then posted bail quickly and was released from Hamilton County Sheriff's custody.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
On May 1, 2023, Stoner attended her hearing virtually and agreed to hire counsel, Something we haven't talked about yet on the podcast is that at some point Stoner began posting on social media about yoni massages. Now, for those that are not familiar, let's break this down.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Now, a yoni massage by definition is a erotic or sensual massage and is a tantric practice that aims to create an intimate connection with one's body. A yoni massage primarily focuses on massaging the labia, clitoris, G-spot, breasts, and anus, and other erogenous zones, which is illegal in every state but Nevada.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
And Megan started posting about getting these yoni massages from this guy named Haribo. His real name is Harry Friedman. He lives in New Jersey. He's a younger guy, which was not what I was expecting. I don't know why I was expecting him to be like a 70-year-old hippie from Berkeley Hills, but he was not.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I don't know how Stoner and him got in contact, but Stoner basically began paying Haribo for these vagina massages. And it's alleged that he not only would cross state lines from New Jersey to come to Indiana to give her these, but that she would also travel there. She sometimes referred to him as her coach, etc.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
We know that Stoner started getting involved in politics, or at least posting and doing interviews about her involvement in politics in Indiana around 2014. She did some interviews on some smaller YouTube shows, like this one from Sam Whitfield on February 18th, 2014.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Later, we would find out that the money she was using, allegedly over $17,000 that she paid this guy for her happy endings, a lot of it came from her theft victims, some of them who believed they were Stoner's friend and had known her for years, and Stoner went on to con, manipulate, lie.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
and get that money from people whom trusted her and believed they were helping a friend, which we're going to hear about later, from Tom and people like Edward. So basically, through 21, 22, 23, Stoner was stealing and scamming as much money as she could get out of people to pay for her Yonis and her Teslas.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
She also had over the years started posting about herself as if she had some grandiose importance, talking about things like how flying private has ruined her. She definitely was trying to give people the impression of importance. And I think for some people who were either out of state or less aware of what was going on in Megan's life at this time,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
They were seeing these pictures with this young girl who says she works in politics. She says she's connected to all of these local politicians. She has pictures with a lot of these people. And she did some of these interviews, etc. And so I think it especially digitally made Megan look like she was more important than she actually was. That was part of her grift.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
The Teslas were also part of her grift, I believe. Many people even noted it. She was driving a Tesla and Megan often talked about how online, how it made her feel good and it made her feel important to drive it. It's never okay to steal, but to be stealing for Tesla's and happy endings is, is ridiculous.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
It is so atrocious, especially when people were losing housing, not being able to buy their kids gifts during the holiday season, not to mention the psychological stress of just dealing with Stoner throughout these things many people reported. And if you review a lot of the text messages between Stoner and her victims, you'll see a pattern of skilled manipulation and a complete lack of boundaries.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
what appears to be complete unawareness of other people's feelings or considering of other people's feelings. She'll take her lies to the most unimaginable places to be emotionally manipulative to get what she wants, going as far as making up children and deaths of children just to manipulate people and further her grift.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
And here's another interview she gave March 4th, 2014, on The Jeff and Alan Show, talking about her experience in politics.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I've been told that when Stoner was around 14 or 15, her parents hired a man named Dustin Beth, who was essentially a political consultant for her. They would meet and he would help and coach Megan in the political sphere on everything from outfits to interviews.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Eventually, Stoner's parents stopped making payments to Dustin, and I'm told that Dustin Beth later learned that Stoner was being investigated because of the financial theft against her Aunt Linda. Eventually, he cut off contact from her, and I believe she still owed him money at the end of that relationship.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
We're told that when Stoner was 15 to 16 years old, she and her parents were spoken to by police for falsely accusing two of her church pastors. She had texted a member of their congregation saying that the pastors had texted Stoner and invited her to come over to their house and watch him and his wife engage in sexual activity.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
The pastors immediately went to police, and according to one of the pastors who gave an interview on a Facebook live show called Forensic Foreplay, Pastor Michael Anderson stated that the officer that interviewed Stoner said that she displayed behavior of a sociopath as she showed a lack of remorse and empathy.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app. In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
She tried to convince her longtime friend, Faith Burnside, whom we heard from in episode two, that she was a victim involved in an Indiana-based sex trafficking ring similar to the Pizzagate conspiracy. Stoner claimed that attorney generals, senators, and the governor of Indiana were all sexually assaulting her daily.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Stoner told Faith that she gave some of these men her phone number, and they began texting Megan violent and sexually explicit messages that she showed to Faith Burnside. Faith Burnside then herself began getting texts from these, quote, politicians, ranging from Donald Trump to Mike Pence to Brian Bosma. We're told that Stoner was a mentee of a local House representative, Kurt Knisley.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
He took her under his wing when she was in high school, trying to encourage her as she was a young person interested in politics, and sometimes that can feel like a rare thing. Within a few months of meeting with Knisley, Stoner allegedly began telling him about sexual assault allegations against then-Indiana House Speaker Brian Bosma.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Over the years, Megan Stoner made many claims about her political resume, though many now assume that these were false claims. And on the confession call that we heard on episode four with Chloe and Stoner, Stoner admits that she never had a paid position for any politician or political group and was only a volunteer.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
And quite frankly, she was fired quickly after volunteering because she was forging the data. We heard from women who were in the Facebook group called The Spice Girls how Stoner allegedly posted tragic personal information for attention in the Facebook group, which ultimately led to her being removed.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Stoner posted stories such as fake stalking stories perpetuated by medical professionals, local politicians, pastors, political figures, deaths of loved ones or loved ones being shot.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
sometimes from suicide, sexual assault, claiming to be run off the road by members of iTown Church, claiming that members of iTown are sending her sex toys and harassing her, claiming that journalists from the Indy Star were harassing her,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
claiming that doctors and therapists had sexually assaulted her and were stalking her, that she was tied up by another one of Brian Bosma's victims and held at gunpoint with Brian Bosma. And that allegedly took place in 2018. Many have alleged that Megan Stoner had a fake boyfriend named Jake.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
a local politico named mike neal who was also part of the megan stoner scam awareness facebook group tweeted i can add to the megan stoner boyfriend story on thursday november 9th 2017 i was staffing an event for then vice president mike pence at tko graphics in plainfield indiana I was outside speaking to a few friends who were in line to go through security and get in.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Megan had somehow gotten a ticket to the event. Pence would be joining the governor and other officials for a roundtable on business tax cuts. Because the parking lot was so close to the building, the U.S. Secret Service was searching every car that was parked. Megan Parks gets in line and shouts to me loudly, Hey Mike, my boyfriend is on his way and he has a gun in his car.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Can he still get in here? My jaw dropped. I assumed the Secret Service was about to take her down like a calf at a rodeo. But lucky for her, they didn't hear. I told her, don't say anything like that around here ever again. I should have told Service she said that, but I didn't. Of course, the boyfriend never materialized at the event. End quote.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I'm told by a woman who met Stoner through the Spice Girls Facebook group that had texted quite a bit with Stoner that she had been told by Stoner that Brian Bosma wanted Megan to sign an NDA for his alleged sexual assault. The woman reviewed the NDA and felt it had been fabricated. She then searched some of the text from the alleged NDA and found that it came from a Google resource website.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
On October 26, 2018, there was a judgment in civil court. According to my case, it was ruled that Stoner owed her Aunt Linda $25,152.94. And as of today, she still owes $20,592.94. On December 11, 2020, according to a Fishers police incident report, a local chiropractor called Fishers PD about his client, who was Megan Stoner, impersonating political figures over text.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
He alleged that these figures included Eric Holcomb, Mike Pence, Donald Trump, Donald Trump Jr., Eric Trump, Steve Munchen, Rudy Giuliani, Chad Wolf, Mark Meadows, and even a Secret Service agent.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Stoner went on to later file a HIPAA complaint against the chiropractor for reporting to the police about his concerns with Stoner and her claims that she knew all these politicians and that they had been texting him. That chiropractor ended up winning, and it was proven that Stoner's claim against him was not valid.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Please note, at the time of this episode's airing, I have been unable to reach Brian Bosma, Eric Holcomb, or Mike Pence for comment. February 15th, 2021, Stoner's then-roommate Abby Espy called Fisher's Police Department regarding Stoner allegedly biting her on the hand, causing her to bleed. Abby Espy has not responded to our request for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
It's alleged that in March of 2021, Stoner defrauded the Small Business Administration by obtaining a PPP loan while the program was in effect. In the Fishers Police reports from 2021, Stoner also called the Fishers PD several times saying that she smelled marijuana from her neighbors and that it was making her physically ill.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
During August of 2021, there were several Fishers Police Department incident reports between Megan Stoner's then-roommate Abby Espy and Stoner, making different allegations about physical disturbances or leaving the property, taking things that belonged to the other person. It looks like their relationship got very volatile towards the end.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
It's alleged that in 2021, after Abby had moved out and was subleasing her portion of the apartment, Stoner then began doing things that were not in alignment with their lease, such as renting out Abby's room as an Airbnb or the rental scam. September of 2021, the Fishers police were investigating Stoner for trying to sublease a unit in the District of Saxony apartment complex.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
A woman told police that she paid Stoner $1,700 but never received a key to the apartment. The woman was paid back a month later. Due to Stoner's alleged rental scheme, which she perpetuated to multiple victims in 2021, one of the victims was scammed out of $1,800, which led to her homelessness.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
I'm told that the last time Abby and Megan Stoner were in the same room and saw each other was during a civil court case between the two of them. We've heard from Sandy Rusk that from December 2021 to April 2022, Stoner was making a lot of claims about iTown Church. Stoner told Sandy many lies about her life and her relationship with iTown.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
The most impactful and painful lie that she told Sandy was that her daughter was in trouble. And when Sandy figured this out, she cut off contact with Megan after many months of assuming that Megan was lying.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E5: Self-Made Woman
Today is Saturday, November 9th, 2024. I just returned home last night from Indiana. Last week, I met with the Indiana State Police to present the evidence and testimony we've collected thus far this season. It all went really well. That's really all I can share for now.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Although cons, schemes, and fraud can make for intriguing storylines, the true impact of fraud has pervasive detrimental effects on its victims that are not often highlighted in society or media.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Younger adults were more likely to fall prey to online shopping scams, which often started with an ad on social media, far more often than any other fraud type. Younger adults also reported losing money on job scams at more than five times the rate of older adults. And with the invention of the internet, the accessibility and ease of committing fraud has increased immensely.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
The Federal Trade Commission reports that of all reported fraud from 21 to 23, victims who made initial contact with scammers through the internet were scammed out of a total of nearly $6 billion.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
One in four people who reported losing money to fraud from 21 to 23 said it started on social media, and those victims reported losses that reached a whopping $2.7 billion, which is significantly higher than victims that were frauded through other contact methods.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Social media is also being used to increasingly target younger victims, and is the method of communication in 47% of fraud reported by 18-19 year olds. Still, most fraud is actually not reported, which means that these numbers are actually just a fraction of the harm that common cons, schemes, and frauds cause in the internet and social media age.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
As Experian highlights, artificial intelligence-powered scams are increasingly important to keep an eye out for. These scams can produce highly convincing emails, phone calls, and texts. They can also create quality deepfakes featuring celebrities or otherwise influential people to trick victims into investing into a business or idea.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
AI-powered scams can even trick victims into believing a family member, loved one, or employer is on the other end of the con. Artificial intelligence can also offer the perpetrator the ability to fabricate images, videos, sounds, or other content in the likeness of the victim and potentially use it to extort other victims.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
you can report extortion to the police and to your local Federal Bureau of Investigation field office by calling 1-800-CALL-FBI or online at tips.fbi.gov. You can also report threats involving the internet, such as when a mobile payment app is involved, to the FBI's Internet Crime Complaint Center at www.ic3.gov.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Another common scam is the sale of non-existent goods or services, which includes online purchase scams. Scammers will often use mobile payment apps to trick people into sending money or merchandise without holding up their end of the deal. For example, a scammer may offer to sell you concert tickets. or lease you a home, but then never actually give or lease them to you.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Relatedly, the FBI website enlists 18 different common types of fraud and scams on their website. including but not limited to identity theft, business and investment fraud, charity and disaster fraud, property scams, mortgage fraud, extortion, sextortion, adoption fraud, cryptocurrency investment fraud, elder fraud, election crimes, healthcare fraud, mail fraud, holiday and romance scams.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
A scammer may also purchase an item from you, receive the item, appear to send a payment, and then cancel the payment before it reaches your bank account. These sorts of scams are criminally deemed business fraud. If you think you made a payment to a scammer, contact your bank or the company you used to send the money immediately and alert them that there may have been an unauthorized transaction.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
You can also file a complaint with the Federal Bureau of Investigation's Internet Crime Complaint Center at www.ic3.gov. Although there are many different types of scams, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau offers some things to consider in all cases of fraud.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
First, scammers may work to gain your trust, often pretending to be someone you trust or even pretend to be a company or government agency you already know. Scammers will also create a sense of urgency, intimidation, and fear. They want you to send the money before you have a chance to confirm or deny their claims or second guess their choices.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Don't let anyone rush you into giving them payment or sensitive business information. Scammers will also ask you to pay in specific ways. They often demand payment through alternative methods like wire transfers, cryptocurrency, or gift cards. But they can also use peer-to-peer mobile apps and other money transfer options.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Although fraud can be charged criminally and civilly, and each state does so differently, the Department of Justice shares, federal and state laws are not sufficient to deter consumer fraud effectively. Because of this, victims of fraud and consumer scams often report feeling dissatisfied with the way the crimes are addressed.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Victims are often compelled to seek both civil and criminal charges in order to receive more encompassing justice.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
However, fraud can be charged federally if and when the fraud committed violates federal law, involves a federal agency, crosses state lines, uses the United States Postal Service or interstate communication methods in their scheme, or if it involves fraud as a means to benefit from a federal program.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Despite the variability in fraud schemes and the way that they're addressed, the Better Business Bureau has some general steps that can potentially help all consumers avoid scams. One tip is to keep your personal information private and, if stored, making sure to do so in a highly secure way. Relatedly, it suggested that users establish passwords that are more complex and not easy to guess.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Also, know that your bank or financial institution will never contact you to ask for passwords or pins. The Better Business Bureau also suggests working with local businesses as frequently as possible. Although local businesses are also capable of fraud, fraud is more likely to occur when distance exists between the patron and business.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
The Better Business Bureau also highlights the importance of being careful what you share online. People who commit fraud often weaponize information about their targets that they can find on social media platforms. When seeking purchases online, you can request to see the property in person before submitting payment. When paying people, avoid using cash when you can.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Having a digital trail can help. And although scammers can use digital apps as part of their schemes, the apps themselves are not inherently fraudulent. Using discretion and the aforementioned tactics when sending money via any method can help prevent falling victim to fraud. Additionally, an interesting educational tool is the Better Business Bureau's Scam Risk Calculator.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
It offers targeted scam prevention education based on basic personal information. The calculator is linked in the episode notes. Another preventative measure is to report suspected scammers. If you were scammed or think you saw a scam, report it to the FTC at reportfraud.com. You can also report fraud to your state's Department of Consumer Affairs by searching online for their respective website.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
If your personal information has been compromised, the IRS Identity Protection Specialized Unit can be contacted to flag your tax files to ensure that your information is not used to falsify tax refunds. In the event that your identity has been stolen, the Identity Theft Resource Center is a national nonprofit organization.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
The ITRC website offers tools that help victims through the recovery process and provides links to resources. In addition to the website, you can call ITRC at 1-888-400-5530. The Financial Industry Regulatory Authority offers resources on their website for those working to combat financial fraud, and they also offer victim resources and training for first responders.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
In 2023, the Federal Trade Commission data showed adult consumers reported losing more than $10 billion to fraud, which was the first time that reported fraud-related losses had reached an amount that high. This number is a 14% increase over reported losses in 2022.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Cybercrime Support Network is a non-profit collaboration created to combat cybercrime that is working towards prevention and also offers resources for victims. For more information about the nonprofit organizations and websites mentioned, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
For a more comprehensive list of free and confidential organizations that are working to help victims, please visit somethingwaswrong.com slash resources. Many of the amazing groups listed on our website are only able to exist because of the community's help and support.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
If you would like to find out more information about volunteer opportunities, please feel free to visit the resource page and reach out directly to the organization of your choice. I'm Tiffany Reese. This episode was written in collaboration with our two associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you so much for listening and learning with us.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
Considering these alarming statistics and the increasing use of artificial intelligence to victimize many people at once, the Broken Cycle Media team believes it's essential to highlight the most common cons, schemes, and fraud.
Something Was Wrong
Data Points: Cons, Schemes, & Fraud
It's important to note that the FTC highlights that anyone can become a victim of fraud, although victims in different age ranges do largely fall victim to different types of fraud. The FTC points out that in 2021, people ages 18 to 59 were 34% more likely than older adults ages 60 and over to report losing money to fraud, with some types of fraud being more common than others.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong. Hi friends, today I am honored and excited to bring a special episode featuring Cilicia Stanton, host and creator of Truer Crime and host of The Vanishing Point, both on Tinderfoot.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Isaiah Leslie Goodman, who was 34 at the time, it was found that from 2017 through November 2020, he defrauded at least 23 of his investor clients out of approximately, in the end, it was totaled over $2,300,000. After the sentencing, did you feel like a sense of closure?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Cilicia and I connected over email and when she reached out and started telling me a bit about her own story, which ended up leading to her being a podcast creator herself, I I was like, this is perfect timing because we have been discussing scams, fraud and crime. And as you'll hear in a few moments, her story very much involves those themes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
I was very honored that she would trust me to discuss her story as well. And it's also a great opportunity for y'all to hear about the amazing shows that she creates. Celicia, thank you so much for joining us today. I think a lot of people will hopefully feel validated by hearing your experience and learn a lot because I know I did.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
When your episode went out and you shared your story with your audience, did you get a lot of feedback? How did it feel to share your story in that way?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Congratulations on your next season and the launch. That sounds incredibly compelling. And I did not know that either about the 1999 civil case. Another interesting case that you did an episode on in season one that leapt out to me was Jonestown because we covered the story of a family of survivors who escaped Jonestown on season four of Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
And that's a really complex case to cover. And you did it in one episode, which is tough to do.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Are there any other more infamous cases you are touching on in this new season that listeners might have heard of before that they might be interested in hearing more about?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Very exciting. I can't wait to hear all the new episodes. Will they be released at once or are you releasing them weekly? What's your cadence?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
As somebody who's been there going from like strictly independent, just have the passion and idea and inspiration and channeling your creativity. And now you get to release this content with like a team and the backing and the support. What has that been like for you?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Thank you so much for being willing to connect with me and share about your own experience. It takes a lot of energy to relive a lot of this stuff and revisit it. And I really appreciate you doing so.
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S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Thank you again so, so much. I appreciate it. And everybody go check out Truer Crime season two. Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media. Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
jason and jennifer at ksco our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan and to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership special shout out to neon honey and gabanes for covering our theme song gladrag's original song you think you this season for more music from them check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
So you start meeting for these lessons. Everything's seemingly going well. When do you start to see the red flags?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E13: Truer Crime with Celisia Stanton
If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're going to love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high-quality items within reach, like 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50, washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-karat gold jewelry.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
It sounds like saying like I attended births I didn't even have to attend just to be supportive. Yeah.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Holy shit. I can't believe she put this on the internet. She said the quiet part out loud several times here.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
She was being told she was a quote graduate student and that that somehow absolved her of needing to have a license before practicing on her own. Right.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Within an hour away is wild when you're thinking about birth and how quickly things can happen.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
She's basically saying origins didn't even allow her to process that loss that she had to handle on her own as a student.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
And there is certainly a power imbalance between the owners and licensed midwives who have years of experience, who are owning these clinics, who are clearly looked at as the leaders of this community, and a student who's being told, oh, you're a graduate student, it's fine. Whatever they told her to make her feel like this was okay.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
And the fact that she's saying, I also saw five other people, if what she's alleging is true, acting under these same conditions. Thank you.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you. each and every listener for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
How great could her training be when the hours that she was allegedly being trained and overseen by other midwives, as we know, didn't happen? So how much was she actually being trained?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E7: How Did We Get Here?
And should students be editing those logs and making those changes? No. Which, just from a logistical standpoint, makes absolutely zero sense for any type of business and operation.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
What would you consider a good transfer rate for a birth center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Could you give us some general examples of what things can occur where these sorts of emergency transfers need to happen?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
I'm curious if your birth center allows VBAC, meaning a vaginal birth after cesarean, and what your experience is with that within the birth center setting.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Something that I heard from a few survivors I've spoken to for this season mentioned that at their birthing center, there wasn't enough supplies, things like not having enough towels or stools, very basic things from my understanding. Is there a duty of care in terms of providing those materials as a birth center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
I love that you mentioned staffing because this seems to be another major issue in some of these birth centers where I've interviewed clients who have had negative outcomes. What's being alleged is that students were seeing clients without their perceptor due to staffing issues. But that's not correct, right? The student should be overseen at all times. They should not be practicing solo.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
What are some of the challenges that you faced while opening the birth center? And was it difficult to find enough qualified staff to meet the need of the birth center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
You've owned a birth center for 15 plus years now. What are some implementations that you would like to see put in place from a state or national level? Things, in your opinion, that would just make other birth centers safer?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Thank you so much for your time, Amy.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Next time on Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist. Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends. If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
What's unique about practicing midwifery in Texas?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
So what makes your facility unique is that you have hospital privileges, whereas some birthing centers do not.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
How important is proximity to a hospital for a birth center and what do you feel is reasonable in terms of distance?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. This season is dedicated with love to Malik.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
What are some of the common reasons that your clients share with you that they're choosing midwifery?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
What are some of the common concerns you hear from clients regarding care that they've received at other birth centers in the area?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Excellent advice. Is there any other advice that you would share with listeners who are considering a birth center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E3: Standards of Midwifery Care with Dr. Amy Giles, DNP, CNM
Are there times when clients come in and you have to say, you know what, we think due to high risk that this just isn't the right fit for you?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Months after Alex connected with Stephen, in October 2023, he and his company Mason Motors filed a lawsuit against Stoner for breaking terms in their two signed agreements. One agreement that Stoner signed as herself, and the other where Stoner allegedly signed falsely using the alias of her former roommate and friend, Abby Espy.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Members of the Facebook group acquired the 128-page Tesla charging document, which details the lawsuit. The document reveals Stoner's failure to make proper payments for the Teslas, her submission of alleged fraudulent insurance documents, and texts exchanged between her and Stephen.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
In these messages, Stoner falsely claims that her child died in a train accident, using this heartbreaking fabricated story to delay fulfilling her payment obligations once again. The document lists seven causes of action against Stoner.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
breach of contract, stoner and SB lease agreements, breach of duty of good faith and fair dealing, fraud, fraudulent concealment, misrepresentation, conversion, and trespass. The documents prayer for relief wherefore plaintiffs pray for judgment against stoner are as follows.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
one for general special consequential and punitive damages in an amount to be proven at trial, but in no event less than $64,618." Two, for punitive damages pursuant to Utah State Code. Three, for prejudgment and post-judgment interest as allowed by law. Four, for attorney's fees and costs. And five, for such other relief as the court deems just and proper.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
On October 28th, 2023, Stoner called Alyssa from jail and they discussed the release of the case documents.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Last episode, we heard a series of jailhouse calls Stoner had with Alyssa and Justin, in which Stoner admitted to making false claims in attempts to get out of jail. From lying about money once again in an effort to convince Alyssa to bail her out, and then faking a death of a fake child, these conversations illustrated once again Stoner's manipulation, lies, and next-level audacity.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Shortly after Stoner admitted to lying about having a child, Alyssa, Justin, and the others from the Facebook group that would still answer Stoner's calls from time to time, ceased communication with her for about a month. Many anxiously awaited Stoner's plea hearing, which took place on November 22nd, 2023. Here's journalist, sting operator, and indie community member, Alyssa.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Today, consideration of criminal charges regarding the alleged identity theft related to the civil case regarding the Teslas is ongoing. On July 5th, 2024, an order was issued to domesticate foreign judgment for Mason Motors LLC to move the lawsuit from Utah to Indiana. meaning the Utah court's judgment where the lawsuit was initially filed will now be recognized in Indiana.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
The judgment in Indiana will be treated the same as any judgment issued by an Indiana court, meaning that the creditor, Mason Motors LLC and Steven Mason, can take steps to enforce the judgment, such as garnishing wages or seizing assets in Indiana, to collect the amount owed. The judgment amount is $68,002.10.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Jumping back a bit, amid Stoner's Tesla lawsuit, she was sitting in Hamilton County Jail from September 9th, 2023 to March 7th, 2024, when she was granted release into Hamilton County Community Corrections. Community Corrections programs oversee persons convicted of crime outside of jail or prison and are administered by agencies or courts with the legal authority to enforce these sanctions.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
After only 27 days of her community corrections program release, on March 29th, 2024, Stoner's mom, Gail, tragically passed away unexpectedly. Nearly a month later, on April 22nd, 2024, after two notices of noncompliance were filed and submitted against Stoner, her community corrections program was terminated, and she was then sent back to Hamilton County Jail the same day.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
The first information of violation of probation, aka the document that was submitted to the judge about Stoner's behavior while she was out, states that, quote, the defendant began a probationary period on December 18th, 2023. The sentence was suspended on the condition that the defendant obey all conditions of probation, but the defendant has violated certain of those conditions as follows.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Inappropriate conduct shall not be tolerated, which was discovered during a search of Ms. Stoner's cell phone. The second first information of noncompliance with community corrections placement was filed with the court. It alleges that the defendant on 4-13-24, Ms. Stoner had one or more hours of unaccounted-for release time.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
In the comments section of this document, it stated that, due to various noncompliance issues, such as late returns, continued unemployment, and unaccounted-for time, a cell phone search was conducted on Ms. Stoner's personal cell phone. The first concern that was discovered was a text conversation between Ms.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Stoner and another current male participant where she requested his personal information, including his social security number, to open an AT&T account for herself due to the fact that she has an outstanding balance in exchange for an incentive. Because of the nature of this case and the fact that Ms.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Stoner was soliciting information from and encouraging fraud and potential non-compliance issues with another participant in the program, this obviously generated great concern. The second issue was the discovery of more texts from Ms. Stoner to another current residential participant, a female, that included information about recent sales of her food stamps.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
The sale transaction was confirmed through her Cash App. An incident report with screenshots was immediately forwarded to the Hamilton County Sheriff's Office, who, in turn, sent the report to the Family Social Services Administration for further investigation. Again, due to the nature of this case and the fact that Ms. Stoner was engaging in inappropriate, potentially illegal behavior...
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
and encouraging participation and potential noncompliance with another participant in the program, this raised even more concern. Other information obtained by Ms. Stoner's cell phone included texts to potential landlords indicating that she was in need of housing and she was currently receiving disability for a diagnosis that was obtained in 2023.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
She has not provided any verification of any diagnosis or disability to HCCC. She has only provided paperwork that reports unsuccessful attempts to get into a particular bank account. It was verified that Ms. Stoner had applied to many jobs while under residential supervision.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
However, the indication, due to unopened emails from most of those businesses, is that the application process was the extent of most of her employment search effort. Ms. Stoner posted on social media almost daily about all of her personal issues while at HCCC and her specific business names, etc., job search efforts, and struggles. She always ended her posts with a plea for financial assistance.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
According to Ms. Stoner, she is fully aware of her negative social media and online following. Because of that, discussions were held with her that pointed out the fact that those types of postings were not in her best interest and likely impeded any potential employment progress. She agreed, but continued posting anyway, stating, "...asking for money is not illegal."
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Lastly, due to these same social media posts, Ms. Stoner's motives behind her multiple self-described crisis events at HCCC were questioned. It was found that during and after those quote, crisis events, she would immediately inform the public about the specific event and then follow it with a plea for money.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Her cell phone indicated that she sometimes sent these pleas to hundreds, if not thousands of individual social media accounts. Many times she would also add that she needed money for food as well, which appeared odd to HCCC as they provide three meals per day. While certainly not illegal, her social media actions caused questions as to the validity of the continuous crisis events.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
These events were often and the staff took an inordinate amount of time responding and tending to them. Ms. Stoner is not appropriate for return to supervision for all the above-mentioned reasons.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
It is the obligation of HCCC to hold participants accountable for their actions and to notify the court when inappropriate and or potentially illegal activities continue while a participant is serving an executed sentence. One of the goals of HCCC is to affect behavior and thinking style changes. In this case, it does not appear we are able to do so. Ms.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
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Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Stoner has an outstanding balance of $1,022, of which she has paid zero. Should the court disagree with this determination, we would respectfully request a minimum payment of $500 prior to any return so as to not begin her supervision with immediate noncompliance issues. On June 26, 2024, a fact-finding hearing was held to assess Stoner's noncompliance and violation of probation.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
During the hearing, Stoner admitted to the violations stated previously. Stoner's commitment to community corrections was revoked and her probation continued.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Her amended sentence was, "...defendant is ordered to serve 508 days in Hamilton County Jail, with credit for 222 sentencing days, 111 actual days already served as 111 actual days at Hamilton County Jail from March 7th to May 25th, 2024, plus 111 days of good time credit." Here's Alyssa.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app. In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
On November 22nd, 2023, after not speaking for nearly a month, Stoner called Alyssa to discuss her plea hearing, which took place that same day.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
No, you won't. Thank you for using Glow. After Stoner's plea hearing, she awaited her sentencing, which occurred on December 18th, 2023. On November 22nd, Stoner had pled guilty to counts two and five. Count two, fraud, but loss is between $750,000 and $50,000. And count five, theft, where value of property is between $750,000 and $50,000.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
For count two, Stoner was sentenced to 730 days in the Indiana Department of Corrections with 204 days of jail credit. Of the sentence, 365 days were suspended. Stoner also received credit for 102 actual days served from April 27th to April 28th, 2023, and again from September 9th to December 17th, 2023.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Restitution was ordered to her victims in the amounts of $1,300 for one and $600 for the two others, and additionally she was placed on probation for 365 days. For count five, Stoner was again sentenced to 730 days in the Indiana Department of Corrections for the false leasing of the same property to at least three different individuals.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're going to love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high-quality items within reach. like washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-karat gold jewelry.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
I ordered their Mongolian cashmere oversized boyfriend cardigan sweater, and it is so comfortable. The weight is perfect. The best part? All Quince items are priced 50-80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings to us.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices. All of their products are made of premium fabrics and finishes. I love that. Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quince. Go to quince.com slash SWW for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
I finally feel like I'm getting back into the swing of things after the new year, and I'm trying to focus on small attainable goals, and Thrive Market is helping me achieve one of them, which is to eat more often and healthier snacks. Thrive Market makes it so much easier to find better options without all the hassle.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
One of my favorite features is the healthy swap scanner in the Thrive Market app. Scan any item and it'll instantly suggest a cleaner, healthier alternative. So for me, this means even simple things like popcorn or crackers. I also love shopping their beauty section and I've found so many brands that I had never heard of before that have really affordable non-toxic formulas.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
And the best part is everything gets delivered safely right to my door every time and I get savings on every order. If you've been following the podcast for a long time, you know I have been a Thrive Market fan for quite some time. Whether you're looking for dye-free snacks, non-toxic cleaning products, Thrive Market has it and you can find it in just a matter of a few clicks.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Ready for a junk-free start to 2025? Head to thrivemarket.com slash SWW and get 30% off your first order plus a free $60 gift. That's T-H-R-I-V-E market.com slash SWW. thrivemarket.com slash SWW. One thread we've yet to untangle is Stoner's alleged crimes regarding Tesla rentals. Between June 1st, 2021 and July 28th, 2023, she drove many different Teslas.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
Stoner frequently boasted about them on social media, including that one was from a generous donor. Additionally, Stoner received many driving infractions during this time. Back in the summer of 2023, this sparked confusion and concern among community members, who were left wondering how was Stoner affording such luxurious cars like a Tesla?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
So prior to Megan's getting arrested in summer of 2023, as the operations to arrest Stoner for her rental scams were still forming, another investigation unfolded behind the scenes. One focused on unraveling the mystery behind Stoner's Teslas. Here's Spice Girl Alex.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E10: Indiana Delvey
This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Each of you suffered your own kind of trauma.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
I really admire so much your vulnerability and your bravery and your willingness to dig so deep and share so much because you are going to provide an enormous amount of validation for others who have been through similar experiences. And I hope that you found some for yourself. Coming up this season on Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
thank you to our extended team lauren barkman our social media marketing manager and sarah stewart our graphic artist thank you to marissa travis and our team at wme wondery jason and jennifer our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends. If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E11: The Moment That Everything Changed
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
Hi friends, this is Amy B. Chesler. As season 23 has progressed, and especially over the last couple weeks, many additional brave survivors have reached out to us to share their experiences. With that comes a lot of new evidence, and because we need to follow up on and fact-check every lead before airing the season finale, we need some extra time.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
In the meantime, today's special episode features a conversation between the Broken Cycle Media team and Dr. Ndidiya Maka Amuta Onukaga, founder and director of the Center for Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
For parents-to-be who are seeking perhaps a birth center or an alternative method of birthing out of the hospital, what are some things that they could look for that would be a sign that this is potentially a successful place to birth?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
This season, it was extremely important to have an honest conversation about the state of maternal health in America, especially for Black birthing people and other marginalized communities. We deeply appreciate Dr. Amuta Onukaga for sharing her time and expertise with us.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
What actions at the care level do you think physicians, midwives, any other providers could take to make maternal and postnatal health more equitable as well?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
Please don't forget to show your support for her and her organization by visiting the episode notes and finding out more about what they're doing to improve maternal and neonatal health in America.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
Can you highlight for the listener a little bit more about what the center is doing in order to promote more racial equity in the maternal health field and the neonatal health field?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
how and where can listeners support the center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
Thank you so much for your time and expertise today. Can you share with us what led you to this work?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: Black Maternal Health and Reproductive Justice with Dr. Ndidiamaka Amutah-Onukagha, PhD, Founder CBMHRJ
We will be sure to put all of the links for everything you've just listed in the episode notes. We are so grateful for all the work that you're doing and also all the time and energy that you gave us today.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Hey, friends. Firstly, I want to say thank you so much for your support of this season and of the survivors. We are so thankful to hear that many of you have been feeling validated by the survivors sharing their experiences.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Last week, we had the honor of traveling to the iHeart Podcast Awards at South by Southwest, where Something Was Wrong was nominated for Best Crime Podcast for the second year in a row. To celebrate the day before, we held a small private meetup party to test these kinds of events for the future, and it went incredible.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
It was so wild to meet friends in person and experience live discourse, feedback, and community. Thank you to everyone who attended. We hope to host similar events in the future to raise funds for local nonprofits that serve survivors in the cities we visit.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
If you're interested in attending an event like this in your city, please let us know in a new or updated review by adding a PS at the bottom and telling us the city you'd like us to visit.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Now, before we get into the more investigative portion of Season 23, the coming together of these incredible survivors and their ongoing efforts to help others, and the ongoing legal investigations of Origen's birth and wellness, we wanted to share a doula's perspective.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
A doula's perspective is unique and important because they typically work with birth clients and health practitioners in many settings. As a reminder, a doula is a birth worker, typically without formal obstetric training, who is employed to provide guidance and support to a pregnant person during labor.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
We are thankful to Doula Melissa from North Dallas Doulas, who previously worked directly with survivors who were clients of Origins Birth and Wellness Center. I'd like to also thank our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, for conducting this interview while I was unavailable.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Longtime listeners will recognize Amy's voice from season seven of Something Was Wrong, where she shared the harrowing story of her mother Hadassah's senseless murder at the hands of her now convicted brother. Amy, or ABC as we call her, is also the talented host and co-creator of our short-form docuseries show, What Came Next. ABC is an incredible interviewer, host, and human.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
The Broken Cycle Media team is thankful to have her important perspective. We'd also like to celebrate and give a shout out to ABC's newest podcast, Famillicide, which she co-created with Sam Mettler, the creator of A&E's hit docuseries, Intervention. Links to ABC's new show, Famillicide, and North Dallas Doulas can be found in the episode notes. Thank you so much.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Next time on Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E6: Dignified Maternal Care with Doula Melissa Espey-Mueller
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives, Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson, have not responded to our requests for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
And what did Dr. Fuller share with you about what was going on with Kristen at that point?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
And who was seeing you and looking over those results?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Elizabeth didn't note the suspected preeclampsia when they initially ran those labs? Nope, even though she had verbalized it.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
During the time in the hospital and during this recovery care, you're talking to a lot of the doctors and nurses and such. Did any of them speak to like their experience with origins or did they give any sort of indication that this was avoidable?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Sudden infant death syndrome, also known as SIDS, is the unexplained death of an infant or baby. The cause of SIDS is unknown, but it may be caused by problems in the area of an infant's brain that controls breathing and waking up from sleep. Both physical and sleep factors put an infant at risk of SIDS. These factors vary from child to child.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
You can be happy for her and upset for you at the same time, but then you get to feel guilt on top of the fact that you're feeling what you're feeling, right?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Do you feel like a lot of that was from the medical trauma in addition to the life transition?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
If you don't mind me asking, when did you guys start therapy?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Apgar is a quick test performed on a newborn at 1 and 5 minutes after birth. The 1-minute score determines how well the baby tolerated the birthing process. The 5-minute score tells the healthcare provider how well the baby is doing outside the mother's womb. It also helps measure how well the baby responds if resuscitation is needed right after birth.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
The healthcare provider examines the baby's breathing effort, heart rate, muscle tone, reflexes, and skin color. The APGAR score is based on a total score of 1 to 10. A score of a 7, 8, or 9 is typical and is a sign that the newborn is in good health. Any score lower than a 7 is a sign that the baby needs medical attention.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
The lower the score, the more help the newborn needs to adjust outside the mother's womb. Most of the time, a low APGAR score is caused by a difficult birth, C-section, or fluid in the baby's airway. A baby with a low APGAR score may need oxygen and clearing of the airway to help with breathing or physical stimulation to help get the heart beating at a healthy rate.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
A low APGAR score does not mean a child will have serious or long-term health problems.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there, every week, you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Jennifer's the midwife on call, even though Jennifer is a student. Yes. Which obviously, again, you did not know at the time.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E2: Life Threatening Emergency
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. At the time of this episode's release, midwives Jennifer Crawford, Gina Thompson, and Caitlin Wages have not responded to our request for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. The holidays just really mean survival mode. Luckily, you've got a secret holiday helper, DoorDash. Get gifts, groceries, dinner delivered right when you need it. And they've got big holiday deals from Best Buy, Ulta Beauty, Aldi, Wingstop, and more.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds. Because Progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations. This show is sponsored by BetterHelp.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
For some, wrapping up in a blanket with a mug of hot chocolate or watching a movie with family is the best way to spend the month of December. I'm enjoying staying cozy lately, chilling in holiday PJs, doing crafts, and watching football. Therapy is a great way to bring yourself another type of comfort that never goes away, even when the season changes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Therapy can also be a great tool to help you cope ahead if you're a little bit nervous about maybe having challenging conversations with people during holiday festivities. It's a great way to learn positive coping skills and how to set better boundaries. If you're thinking of starting therapy, give BetterHelp a try.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
It's entirely online and designed to be convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule. Just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist and switch therapists anytime for no additional charge. Find comfort this December with BetterHelp. Visit BetterHelp.com slash SWW today to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp, H-E-L-P dot com slash SWW.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Last episode, we heard about Justin and Amanda's elaborate Yoni sting operation, in which they invented a fake Yoni practitioner in an effort to find out where Stoner was allegedly hiding from police. Their efforts alongside Alyssa and local police helped lead to Stoner's third arrest. Stoner was booked at Hamilton County Jail on September 9th, 2023.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Shortly after being booked into Hamilton County Jail, Stoner began frequently calling Alyssa, despite the fact that Alyssa had previously represented herself as Vanessa, the fake journalist, and helped Amanda and Justin in the Yoni Sting incident as well. Here's Alyssa.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Hill House Home invented the viral nap dress, which has the most flattering and comfortable fit with their signature smocking. And my personal favorite part? Mine came with pockets. Celebs like Taylor Swift, Olivia Rodrigo, Anne Hathaway, and Mindy Kaling have been spotted in Hill House Home. One of my favorite things about Hill House dresses is how easy and versatile they are.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
You can wear the same dress you'd wear running errands during the day to a dinner party that night. Their commitment to comfort and style applies to all categories. They also sell amazing bedding, robes, and pajamas. The brand also has baby and kids if you want to have a matching moment this holiday season or you're in need of a baby gift.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
They have the cutest little tiny robes, onesies, and PJs that you can even monogram. Get 15% off your order of 100 or more at hillhousehome.com with code SWW15. Again, that's code SWW15 for 15% off your order at hillhousehome.com.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Alyssa's goal was ultimately to get Stoner to admit to more crimes, which she eventually did. Here is audio from Alyssa's first two jailhouse calls with Stoner on September 14th, 2023. Hello?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
DoorDash makes it so easy you may even feel guilty. But hey, no one needs to know. DoorDash. Your door to more. Use code SWWJOY24 for 50% off your first order of $15 plus max $10 off. Offer ends December 26th, 2024. One promo per order. Not valid for orders containing alcohol. Terms apply. Audible's best of 2024 picks are here.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
jason and jennifer at ksco our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan and to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership special shout out to neon honey and gabanes for covering our theme song gladrag's original song you think you this season for more music from them check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Discover the year's top audiobooks and originals in all your favorite genres. From memories and sci-fi to mysteries and thrillers, Audible's curated list in every category is the best way to hear 2024's best in audio entertainment.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E9: How Dare You
Like a stunning new full-cast production of George Orwell's 1984, heartfelt memoirs like Supreme Court Justice Jackson's Lovely One, or the year's best fiction like The Woman by Kristen Hanna. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Go to audible.com slash sww and discover all the year's best waiting for you.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Opinions expressed by my guests on the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself or broken cycle media. Resources and source material are linked in the episode notes. Thank you so much for listening. As shared in Part 1 and Part 2 of their story, J.E. Reich is a journalist, editor, survivor, and victim advocate.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
They shared their story on Something Was Wrong Season 6, Episodes 5 and 6, which aired on December 6th and December 13th of 2020. The episodes discuss the impact of the devastating 2018 shooting at the Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and the impact the hate crime had on J.E. 's community. The episodes also bring awareness to the related, horrific stalking J.E.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Tiffany said it perfectly. I just echo what she said. Thank you again. You really are an incredibly empathetic, powerful human. You've been through hell and I really appreciate you being willing to share some of that with the audience for awareness and for prevention and for healing. I know it's going to help people to hear it.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. Next week on What Came Next.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
What Came Next is a Broken Cycle Media production co-produced by Amy B. Chesler and Tiffany Reese. If you'd like to help support What Came Next, you can leave us a positive review, support our sponsors, or follow Broken Cycle Media on Instagram at Broken Cycle Media. Check out the episode notes for sources, resources, and to follow our guests. Thank you again for listening.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
and their family would be subjected to in the years following. However, at the time of the episode's release, J.E. and their family had received no justice for the unending harassment and death threats the caller executed over those years. The Broken Cycle Media team is extremely grateful J.E.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
was willing to return today to share more of their journey to seek justice and about the start of their consequent healing process.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Because Progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Of course, it's difficult to talk about these topics and to do it any service because it's so serious and so many people are being harmed. Just to be clear, I do not agree with anything that the Israeli government has done. But we're three Jewish people on this recording, and the anti-Semitism obviously plays such a piece in what we're going to discuss.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
These difficult nuances and layers to all of this, which is complex.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
We'd sort of see these headlines, unfortunately, constantly. They just pass through the news cycles now. And we don't always get a sense of how many people and how communities at large can be impacted by these events. It was a really brave time for you. I don't even know how long it was between when you submitted and when I contacted you. I think it was pretty quick.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
It hadn't even been that long since the shooting had taken place and the fact that you had spoken out already. Not everybody's able to do that, even in writing. By you doing so, it was very inspiring.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Really interesting timing that JE came into my life because the podcast had just went number one. That happened to have happened the week or two before their story was going to air. Insane time. But getting to interview JE was this major moment for me. I felt so incredibly honored to work with them and share their story. And it felt like, wow, this person is trusting me with this.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
And that was not lost on me. It was incredible to work together. And it was honestly, for me, the first major gun violence story that we had really gotten into on the podcast. It just felt like kismet in a lot of ways. And then I would go on to work with Amy. So we were recording all at the same time then.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're going to love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high-quality items within reach. like 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50, washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-carat gold jewelry.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
The best part? All Quince items are priced 50-80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings to us. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices. All of their products are made of premium fabrics and finishes. I love that.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quince. Go to quince.com slash SWW for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash SWW to get free shipping and 365 day returns. quince.com slash SWW. As much as I love the holiday season, it's also nice to get back into the swing of things in the new year. No matter what goals you have, Thrive Market can help.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
You know what's a startling statistic? Over 10,000 chemicals have entered our U.S. food supply, yet the EU limits this to just 300 additives. I personally don't have a ton of time to sift through ingredient labels to see what's in my food, which is why I love using Thrive Market. Thrive Market makes it so easy to find better options without the hassle.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
One of my favorite features is the healthy swap scanner in the Thrive Market app. You can scan any item and it'll instantly suggest a cleaner, healthier grocery alternative. The best part? Everything gets delivered right to your door and you get savings on every order. All of their products are 100% non-GMO and free from over a thousand harmful ingredients.
Something Was Wrong
(3/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
What Came Next is intended for mature audiences only. Episodes discuss topics that can be triggering, such as emotional, physical, and sexual violence, animal abuse, suicide, and murder. I am not a therapist, nor am I a doctor. If you're in need of support, please visit somethingwaswrong.com forward slash resources for a list of non-profit organizations that can help.
Something Was Wrong
(1/3) WCN Presents: [J.E.] S6 Updates
Whether you're looking for dye-free snacks, non-toxic cleaning supplies, or high-protein meals that fit your dietary needs, Thrive Market has you covered in a few clicks. Ready for a cleaner start in 2025? Head to thrivemarket.com slash SWW and get 30% off your first order, plus a free $60 gift. That's T-H-R-I-V-E market.com slash S-W-W. Thrivemarket.com slash S-W-W.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Markita, I am curious if you could share a little bit with us about Malik's Law and what we can do to support.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Hi friends. Over the course of this season, and especially over the past few weeks, we've had many survivors reach out to us with similar heartbreaking stories and new evidence. Because we need to fully follow up on these leads and fact check before airing our full findings in this season's finale, We need some extra time to make that happen.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Thank you, Dr. Clark. I see you want to share something.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
In the meantime, today's special bonus episode features Season 23 survivors Markita and Kristen, the Broken Cycle production team, and obstetric expert Dr. Shannon Clark. Together we discuss Season 23, the maternal health care crisis, and more. Thank you so much to all who participated in this special bonus episode. We are excited to hear from Dr. Clark and really gather her expert advice.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
And that's certainly one of the elements that drew me to work on this season. I tend to gravitate towards stories where areas of the law, there's these significant gaps because it really perplexes me how they still exist in so many situations.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
And what I continually see in all settings, in all seasons that we have worked on is that when there is a lack of oversight and accountability, this is where abuse flourishes. And this is where abusers flourish. And as much as it might not be the majority, unfortunately, those, quote, bad apples are in these sorts of parameters can really thrive.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
And so it's concerning because, again, these are life and death situations. When we looked at the data in certain states and areas of the U.S., it's certainly concerning. From your perspective, what are the elements causing this maternal health care crisis, if you agree that that's what's occurring?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Thank you so much for sharing that. What solutions would you offer that you feel like would help this crisis?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
She's been listening throughout the season and sharing her thoughts online. So we thought it would be great to welcome her onto the show and have a open dialogue as well as hear from the survivors what the season has been like for them thus far, what it's felt like hearing their stories back.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Thank you so much.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
what the response from their loved ones has been like, what questions have popped up for them as they've been listening back to other people's stories, etc. So I'm just really excited to host this roundtable. We also have on the call today two of our associate producers, Lily Rowe and Amy B. Chesler, who worked alongside me on this season.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
And I am eternally grateful for all of their hard work as well. Why don't we start with introductions? You guys already know Kristen and Markita from this season and you've met them before. So why don't we, Dr. Shannon, hear a little bit about you and your professional background and how you got into this work?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Amazing. I'm just in awe of you three and the things that you are working on. We have linked in the episode notes this season, the website and their Instagram and more information. And the same will be true for this episode. So please check out, support, contact your legislators. Also, Markita is a real estate agent in the DFW area. And I'm just going to plug that. We want to support her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
So if you're looking for a house in the DFW area.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
I'm curious, having known each other's stories, Markita, Kristen, and shout out to Amanda, who's not here. Was there anything that you heard back on the podcast that brought new understanding about
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
What an episode. I could not believe that interview with her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
the wide reach of the people that you are going to help, you'll actually never know how broad that is, which is what is so beautiful and wonderful about sharing in this forum.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Oh, my goodness. Do you get used to that?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
It seems like statistically from what we've gathered that there can also be really positive results of having midwifery care in hospitals. Do you have any insight there?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Comes with the territory, I suppose. Since we're on that topic, is 24 hours for you the longest you feel confident in working a shift? What is that cutoff point for you personally?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Yeah, it seems like to me, people a lot of times are trying to avoid intervention, and that's one of the motivators for out-of-hospital births. But those interventions are really essential when things go wrong. Kristen, I see you want to add.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Well, there's so much pressure and guilt put on us as women, right? To get pregnant and then to deliver a certain way, behave a certain way, and then fit into this box. And it's just like, we can't win. I'm just so glad you highlighted it because having three emergency C-sections myself that I didn't desire to have, I did feel like less of a woman.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
At that time, I was very young and I just felt like a failure. It's just a lot of pressure we put on ourselves and a lot of pressure that's put on us. And I'm so thankful that we are advocating for people to do what's right for them, what's safest for them and their child, because there's a lot that we need to destigmatize here.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Dr. Clark, is it common for medical professionals to add their clients on social media and communicate with them that way?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins birth and wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
I asked about the hours and like the cutoff of stamina, so to speak, because in some of these interviews that I've done, especially with ex-employees at the birth centers, they mentioned that midwives would sometimes be working 48-hour shifts per
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
I'm just so glad we're highlighting much of this. Thank you all so, so much once again for being here. I appreciate everybody's energy and thoughtfulness. We will certainly link to Dr. Shannon Clark's Instagram and her socials that we mentioned. We will link to Markita's real estate pages, so please go follow and support her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
We will have links to petition, more information about Mama and Malik's Law, all that good stuff in the episode notes. Thank you all so much for being here. And again, shout out Lily, Amy, everybody on our team who has worked on this season, our audio editor, Becca, and our social media manager, Lauren. Nobody does anything great alone, as they say. Thank you. Thank you all.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Yeah, it's a lot to ask of anyone, honestly. Kristen, are you fangirling hard over there? I know you're a huge Dr. Shannon Clark fan.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Dr. Clark, what was it like for you listening to the season thus far? I'm curious if you could give us some of your key takeaways.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Additionally, midwives Jennifer Crawford and Elizabeth Fuel have also not returned our request for comment. This season is dedicated with love to Malik.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
That's what's concerning with all of the survivors I interviewed on the record for the season and behind the scenes. For me, what felt like a lack of urgency, a lack of awareness that this is life or death, and just a lack of ability for the patient to consent to what was happening.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Dr. Clark, would you like to respond?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
One topic that kept coming up this season in many of the survivors' stories was meconium. I'm curious, Dr. Clark, what your opinion on this matter is. When is meconium serious? At what point when meconium enters the situation does a person need to be transferred and is that considered high risk?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Season 23 survivors Markita, Kristen, and Amanda have created a nonprofit called Moms Advocating for Moms in hopes to create a future where maternal well-being is prioritized, disparities are addressed, and every mother has the resources and support she needs to thrive.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
Mama has helped to create a Texas bill called Malik's Law or House Bill 4553, which is intended to improve data reporting requirements for midwives in Texas.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E14: S23 Roundtable with MAMA founders Kristen & Markeda and Dr. Shannon M. Clark, MD, FACOG
While some data is collected via birth certificate filing, the bill is intended to gather more data that could help improve both maternal and pediatric care, as well as aid consumers in more easily accessible data to make more informed decisions on their own care. To find out ways you can help support Malik's Law, please visit momsadvocatingformoms.org.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
According to Mayo Clinic, typically at the beginning of or during labor, membranes will rupture, also known as water breaking. It's not always easy to tell if water has broken. For example, it might be difficult to tell the difference between amniotic fluid and urine. Typically, after water breaks at term, labor soon follows, if it hasn't already begun. Sometimes, however, labor does not start.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
The longer it takes for labor to start after your water breaks, the greater the risk of infection.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
This disparity is driven by a variety of factors, including inequities in healthcare quality, underlying chronic health conditions, and social determinants of health that limit access to care, particularly for racial and ethnic minorities. the U.S. continues to have the highest maternal death rates among high-income nations.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Was it a cause for concern or was it more them saying, just try to rest while you can in between?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Within the U.S., Black women are disproportionately affected, often receiving lower-quality care than white women, with significant disparities in care processes, outcomes, and overall patient experiences. These inequities are deeply rooted in discrimination and clinician bias.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
In 2023, the CDC reported the maternal mortality rate for Black women was 50.3 deaths per 100,000 live births, far higher than the rates of white women at 14.5, Hispanic at 12.4, and Asian women at 10.7. While the rates for white, Hispanic, and Asian women decreased from 2022, the rate for Black women rose slightly from 49.5 per 100,000. Race also plays a component in infant loss.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Were people trying to not alert you to the feelings that they were having?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
According to the CDC, in 2022, the United States reported a total of 20,577 infant deaths, marking a 3% increase from 2021. The highest mortality rate was observed among infants of Black non-Hispanic women, at 10.90 per 1,000 live births.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
This was followed by infants of American Indian and Alaska Native women at 9.06%, Native Hawaiian or other Pacific Islander women at 8.5%, Hispanic women 4.89%, White women 4.52%, and Asian women 3.51%. Systemic racism in healthcare also plays a role in where patients and clients seek care, such as freestanding birth centers.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
There really are no words to describe. It's just sorrow that I feel for your loss, and I'm so sorry. What came next for you after those five days in the hospital?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
These are facilities that offer an alternative to hospital births that are gaining popularity for their potential to reduce adverse birth outcomes and aid maternity deserts. However, less than 5% are led by people of color, despite their effectiveness, especially in minority communities.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
I imagine it was hard to go back to work, given you work in a medical setting. Or do you feel like it was more a distraction?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Examples like Roots Community Birth Center in Minneapolis, which serves a predominantly black and indigenous population, show positive outcomes such as lower cesarean rates and higher breastfeeding rates. Challenges such as limited funding persist, especially for community-based organizations in minority populations.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
thank you to our extended team lauren barkman our social media marketing manager and sarah stewart our graphic artist thank you to marissa travis and our team at wme wondery jason and jennifer our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Efforts to establish birth centers in areas like New Mexico's Navajo Nation have struggled due to insufficient financial support. To add, between 2021 and 2023, an average of 63.7 of birthing mothers in Texas who are Hispanic were Medicaid users, and an average of 61.2 of birthing mothers in Texas who are Black were covered by Medicaid.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Speaking of episode notes, there, every week, you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends. If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
And as data from the March of Dimes illustrates, 48.8% of Texas births are covered by Medicaid. This limits options for those receiving pregnancy or labor care via Medicaid-approved facilities, as only a portion of licensed birthing centers are covered by Medicaid.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
These efforts highlight the need for greater support to improve maternal health outcomes and address disparities in minority communities through accessible, relationship-centered care. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Please note, this episode discusses the death of an infant and may be distressing for some. Please take extra care when listening.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. At the time of this episode's release, midwives Jennifer Crawford, Gina Thompson, and Caitlin Wages have not responded to our request for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Who was at your first initial appointment and what do you recall about that experience?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Although Jennifer Crawford was allegedly practicing as an unlicensed student midwife while caring for Kristen during her pregnancy, as we heard in episodes one and two, Jennifer did receive her certified professional midwife license, according to the Texas Department of Licensing and Regulation, on May 20th, 2022, prior to Markita's care at Origins.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
I can't obviously assume their intention, but it certainly makes it convenient if you're understaffed to be like, we're just free flowing staffing here.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
Yep. What sort of typical things were happening when you would go in for your checkups? Some people have sort of described like group doctor appointments. Was that also your experience?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
This season is dedicated with love to Malik. Every year in the United States, hundreds of women die during or after pregnancy, and many more face serious long-term health complications. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, over 80% of these deaths are preventable. Tragically, Black women are three times more likely to die from pregnancy-related causes than white women.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
According to the Cleveland Clinic, the mucus plug is a thick piece of mucus that blocks the opening of the cervix during pregnancy. It forms a seal to prevent bacteria and infection from getting into the uterus and reaching the fetus. You can think of it as a protective barrier between the vagina and the uterus. An increase in pregnancy hormones like progesterone form the mucus plug.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E5: Tragic and Horrific
And did they still charge you the full amount for services and everything?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Through their experiences, it becomes clear that the system-wide inequities and ethical injustices have contributed to their trauma. Their experiences also mirror the nationwide systemic gaps. Currently, America has one of the highest, most alarming rates of maternal deaths among high-income countries, especially those who have high rates of healthcare spending.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
In 2022, the average maternal mortality rate in the US was 22 deaths per 100,000 live births. Black and indigenous women in the U.S. have even higher maternal mortality rates than other racial groups. In fact, in that same year, 2022, the maternal mortality rate for Black women was 49.5 deaths per 100,000 live births, more than double.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
The steady increase in exponentially higher rates of maternal mortality in varied marginalized communities is a devastating sign of an inequitable medical landscape. And for pregnant persons, nearly two of three maternal deaths in the U.S. occur during the postpartum period, from delivery through the first 42 days that follow.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Many survivors you'll hear from this season were clients at the now-closed Origins Birth and Wellness Center, previously based in Dallas and Fort Worth, Texas. Their stories are sadly mirrored throughout the country by other survivors we've spoken to from various states that you'll hear from later in this season as well.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
You'll also hear from many medical experts and researchers who are working daily to improve what they describe as a maternal health care crisis in the United States. According to the data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, of the more than 400,000 out-of-hospital births attended by midwives in the last decade, nearly 60% involved direct-entry midwives.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
As you started going in for your visits and your checkups, who were you being seen by and what was that process like?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
A direct entry midwife is a midwife who becomes credentialed without first becoming a nurse, whereas certified nurse midwives, or CNMs, are registered nurses who have completed additional education and certification in midwifery.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Direct entry midwives tend to enter the field via midwifery schools or apprenticeships, and rarely collaborate with physicians or hospitals whose regulations fall under state guidelines. Meaning, the allowing of direct entry midwives to practice depends on the state.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Midwifery regulations are often established and overseen by state health departments, boards of nursing, or specific boards or agencies that are dedicated to regulating midwifery. In Texas, midwives are overseen by TDLR, or the Texas Department of Licensing and Regulation.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Some other things TDLR regulates, barbering and cosmetology, air conditioning and refrigeration, electrician licensing, driver education, massage therapy, boiler safety, elevator safety, auctioneering, and towing operators.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
The Mayo Clinic states that a placental abruption is an uncommon yet serious complication of pregnancy. The placenta develops in the uterus during pregnancy. It attaches to the wall of the uterus and supplies the baby with nutrients and oxygen. A placental abruption occurs when the placenta partly or completely separates from the inner wall of the uterus before delivery.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
This can decrease or block the baby's supply of oxygen and nutrients and cause heavy bleeding in the mother. Placental abruption often happens suddenly. If left untreated, it endangers both the mother and baby.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Because midwifery training standards and required education vary greatly state to state, there are deep inconsistencies in the birthing industry that leaves clients unaware of the potential risks involved. We are not here to demonize midwifery, birthing centers, hospitals, doctors, or home births.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
So scary. Were they able to tell if you had the placental abruption or not?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
We are, however, here to examine the places in which there is great concern for the safety of those states' citizens. We also aim to honor the experiences of the survivors that you'll hear bravely speak out this season. Pregnant persons, infants, and their families deserve to feel safe and secure no matter where or how they choose to give birth. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Obviously, now you've learned so much about this and you're coming to it from that hindsight perspective. But at the time when all this stuff is going on and you are in their care, was your anxiety increasing? Like, were you stressed or did you feel like at that time you were in good care?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
And this is one of the things that their website was boasting even when I looked at it. It was like, we have low transfer rates, etc. And so that's their way of convincing people this is as safe as a hospital.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
thank you to our extended team lauren barkman our social media marketing manager and sarah stewart our graphic artist thank you to marissa travis and our team at wme wondery jason and jennifer our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Speaking of episode notes, there, every week, you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends. If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. At the time of this episode's release, midwives Jennifer Crawford, Gina Thompson, and Caitlin Wages have not responded to our request for comment.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E1: Built to Birth
This season is dedicated with love to Malik. This season on Something Was Wrong, we're investigating the maternal health care crisis in the United States and its impact on pregnant persons, infants, and their families. Survivors will be sharing harrowing stories of pregnancy and birth trauma, loss, and grief.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Here's Alyssa, who posed as a journalist in the previous sting operation that we heard from last episode. Alyssa was brought into the Yoni sting as well to offer her perspective.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Vero called the cops while Alyssa kept Stoner busy, pretending to be waiting on Vero to bring her cash. The police arrived and the community members finally thought Stoner had been arrested on her pending warrant. But because at the time the warrant was a bench warrant and not an arrest warrant, and they were in a different county, the police let Megan Stoner go.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Then, after Stoner failed to attend multiple court hearings the following week, an additional arrest warrant was issued. Stoner continued laying low, renting Airbnbs with what was assumed to be the money of her alleged scam victims.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
As their frustration and the fear of what Stoner could be capable of next continued to grow, and they continued to learn of more vulnerable populations being impacted by Stoner's alleged crimes and cons, members of the Facebook scam awareness group continued to brainstorm how they could find out where Stoner was hiding to have her arrested.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
After the fake journalist sting, Justin and Amanda, who knew Megan through the young Republican's political scene, who you heard from last episode, began devising a plan of their own to catch Stoner. Justin and Amanda believed that Stoner would do just about anything to receive her beloved yoni massages.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
the following is audio from a twitter space live that justin and amanda hosted shortly after stoner was arrested ladies and gentlemen we got her we got her
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
As a reminder, a yoni massage is, by definition, an erotic or sensual massage that is a tantric practice. It aims to create an intimate connection with one's body. A yoni massage is primarily focused on massaging the clitoris, labia, G-spot, breasts, and anus, and many other erogenous zones.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
While there are many people who believe that yoni massages can have all sorts of health benefits, at the end of the day, there's no scientific research to support this. Also, from a legality standpoint, erotic massages given by another in exchange for money is illegal in every state but Nevada. Megan started posting about these yoni massages from a guy named Haribo, real name Harry Friedman.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
He lives in New Jersey. Later, it would be alleged by Megan herself that she had spent over $17,000 with Haribo for these yoni massages. I'm told that when Haribo started to learn more about the allegations against Megan online and was more focused on his upcoming wedding and honeymoon, Stoner started speaking to a new Yoni practitioner named Leo from California.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app. In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Stoner connected with Leo because Haribo is out of town for his honeymoon the summer of 2023. According to Stoner, she never actually met up in person with Leo.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Between Stoner's avid social media posts, spending allegedly thousands of dollars on her yoni massages, and seeking out multiple practitioners, it was clear to Amanda and Justin the lengths she was willing to go in order to receive these massages.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
So with Amanda's graphic design background and Justin's deep knowledge of all things Megan Stoner, they created a fake Yoni practice called True Renewal Bloomington and connected with Stoner on Instagram through its fake account. Stoner took the bait. She accepted and DMed the account asking for an appointment.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
From that point on, Justin took care of messaging Stoner pretending to be a Yoni practitioner named Xavier St. Clair. Here's Justin.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Here's Amanda, who you met last episode. She's a friend of Justin's who originally connected with Stoner through mutual friends online.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
That's Alex, whom we heard from in episode three. She met Stoner in the Facebook group called the Spice Girls back in 2017. After learning of Stoner's crimes years later, Alex joined the Scam Awareness Facebook group. She later became an admin to the group and got more involved with the efforts to hold Stoner accountable.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
Last episode, we heard from Indianapolis community member Alyssa, who acted as a journalist wanting to buy Stoner's life rights in hopes of gaining her trust to ultimately get her arrested. On August 12th, 2023, Stoner agreed to meet fake journalist Alyssa and her fake sister Vero, who is actually the founder of the Megan Stoner Scam Awareness Facebook group.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E8: We Got Her!
You'll hear Amanda, Justin, and Alex mentioning Mike, Kyle, Chloe, and Alyssa, some of whom you've already heard from this season. These local politicos and community members were involved in the efforts towards accountability as well.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Did Caitlin or Gina ever speak about why babies were lost with you or in front of you? No.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Speaking to the relationship that you had with Caitlin regarding being her surrogate, how did that conversation come about?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
There are allegations that Jennifer was practicing midwifery without her license. Were you aware of those sorts of staffing incidences where students were allowed to practice midwifery unsupervised?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
If they were graduate midwives, why didn't they just get their license? Because they hadn't passed their tests, basically.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
How many other midwives were working underneath Jennifer during this era of the birth center?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Well, it sounds like Jennifer was taking on a lot of it towards the end.
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
What was the process like becoming pregnant as a surrogate?
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Furthermore, Brittany reflected on how understaffed Origins felt then, which has been underscored since she left and began learning what proper staffing numbers were at other local birthing centers. Quote, Amy from Allen Midwifery talked about how they are now taking up to 20 clients a month with six nurse midwives blew my mind.
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
We were taking 20 plus clients per month with three midwives at each birth center. To clarify, each birth center was taking 20-plus births each on a good month, and each birth center was staffed with only three midwives, not including Gina or Caitlin."
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Relatedly, Brittany reports that throughout her time working for Origins Birth & Wellness, she tried to advocate for the midwives, but ultimately didn't feel any changes were made to rectify staffing issues, overtired midwives, and other logistical issues that could negatively impact midwives, their clients, and their families.
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Brittany shared that after the death of Malik, Origins never had a meeting to reflect as a team on what went wrong, only to refresh their partners on where to enter Baylor. Brittany shared that Origins owners did not seem to care when babies were lost, but instead fixated on negative reviews or transfer statistics.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
She alleged that after Marquita left her review, Origins hired a company and paid them $500 to try to remove their negative reviews, explicitly flagging Marquita's needing to be removed. Brittany says that she expressed her discomfort in this approach in the meeting with Gina and Caitlin, but her concerns were brushed off.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
It sounds like you felt like in the moment that the concern was for her son, but there wasn't that same level of concern for you.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
So you felt like she was kind of trying to take credit and hold that over your head a little bit?
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S23 E9: Bad Marriage
Some clients had reported that all of their notes and their chart were made under the same login and also several had changes made to them weeks and months after treatment. I'm wondering if you have any insight that you could offer us
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
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Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
The best part? Everything gets delivered right to your door and you get savings on every order. All of their products are 100% non-GMO and free from over a thousand harmful ingredients. Whether you're looking for dye-free snacks, non-toxic cleaning supplies, or high-protein meals that fit your dietary needs, Thrive Market has you covered in a few clicks. Ready for a cleaner start in 2025?
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
Head to thrivemarket.com slash SWW and get 30% off your first order plus a free $60 gift. That's T-H-R-I-V-E market.com slash S-W-W thrivemarket.com slash S-W-W
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
So much about him hasn't changed from the earlier recordings. Even in the recording, when he first was sentenced, anytime the judge would try to point out to him your feelings or your family's feelings or how it was impacting other people, he basically would just be like, I haven't denied that I did that. There's no sense of empathy, compassion or anything for anyone but himself.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
You're so amazing. I just love that you're taking the power back in a lot of ways. And you're literally helping to make change to help be preventative to other people being harmed through these apps. This kind of legislation is what we hope for at a federal level. And we want to see in all 50 states and internationally, this is needed. It gets us one step closer. So it is a huge win for survivors.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
That's the tricky thing, especially with cyber stalking. If we look at season 20, Jessica Polley, her victims are in so many different states and she's constantly moving states.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
So it makes it really hard even for the FBI to figure out who has jurisdiction when somebody is constantly on the run and using the Internet and dating apps, especially the kind that will let you change your location and these various different things. Yes.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
That is also a part of advocacy that we don't talk about enough. Part of that is allowing yourself time when you need it. And then there's other times where you feel energized and you feel like you can accomplish a lot that day.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
And I believe you'll do that because everything you accomplish to set out to do, I feel like you conquer it where you're able. You're a very resilient person. You allow yourself time to grieve and to feel things, but you bounce back.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
I just can't thank you enough for even being willing to come back, speak to us and share more because you've already given us so much and shared so much and changed so many people's lives by sharing. We had so many stalking survivors submit their stories since season 19. It's been an honor to be a small part of supporting you through this. We continue to wish you the best. Thank you.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
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Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
When one of the other victims came forward, she had reached out to the podcast. She had shared with me that she's been a day one listener of Something Was Wrong and also a survivor of Morrison. As soon as she started hearing Amy speak on episode one of her season, that just continued to be confirmed for her through it.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
That's always our hope when we're putting these stories out there that we're going to find more victims. And especially was Amy's hope, her whole family's hope and prayer that this was going to happen. Then to see that actually come to fruition while the season is releasing was pretty incredible and very moving.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
Thankfully, you also had so many people in your corner that were willing to speak up for you and advocate alongside you. So we were really able to deliver to the listeners a really full picture of the situation.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
It helps from a victimology and a criminology standpoint, being able to have such a rich picture of you within the content and your loved ones, your support system and all the people who are ultimately impacted by Morrison's actions. Then also being able to really show people who Morrison was through the recordings and all the evidence that you provided.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
The monstrous person that you have unjustly had to deal with. Matching with this person on a dating app and having a few exchanges with this person. literally something that everybody that's dating nowadays has probably done at least once or twice in the modern dating app world. As a team, we were really honored to work on this story.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
Nor does your family or loved ones who are constantly worrying about you as well. Exactly. If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're going to love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high quality items within reach.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
like 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50, washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-carat gold jewelry. The best part? All Quince items are priced 50-80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings to us.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices. All of their products are made of premium fabrics and finishes. I love that. Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quince. Go to quince.com slash SWW for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash SWW to get free shipping and 365-day returns.
Something Was Wrong
WCN Presents: [Amy] S19 Updates
quince.com slash SWW As much as I love the holiday season, it's also nice to get back into the swing of things in the new year. No matter what goals you have, Thrive Market can help. You know what's a startling statistic? Over 10,000 chemicals have entered our U.S. food supply, yet the EU limits this to just 300 additives.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
At what point in your mind should you have been transferred care?
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
And that's what also strikes me within these stories is not only the negligence, but just the boundaries that are crossed in general and the nuances within the relationship. Certainly you want a personalized experience, but sometimes that personalization can be weaponized and it seems like it keeps people quiet. There are reasons for those parameters in the professional settings.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
According to the Cleveland Clinic, a prothrombin gene mutation is an inherited condition that increases predisposition to develop abnormal blood clots in veins and or lungs. This happens because the body makes more of the factor two prothrombin protein than is needed for normal clot formation.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
What has it been like hearing the other gal's stories so far?
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
What do you hope that listeners will take away from hearing the survivors' stories this season?
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Blood clots can cause serious problems in the body when they block blood flow, which keeps oxygen from getting to cells.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Monday, April 21st, 2025, our team reached back out to Amy Tate with a full document with quotes of allegations that would be included in episodes 12 and 13 this season. The following day, she sent her final statement in regards to these allegations. Hi, thank you for your message and for the opportunity to respond.
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
I understand that I am being named in an upcoming episode of Something Was Wrong in connection to care I provided as a midwife. While I cannot discuss the details of any specific client experience due to confidentiality, I want to express my heartfelt empathy to any family who has experienced pain, fear, or lasting harm in their birthing journey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Birth is one of the most sacred, vulnerable moments in a person's life. As a provider, I've always held that responsibility with deep care. If a client remembers their experience differently than I intended, or if my presence contributed to harm in ways I did not realize at the time, I carry that seriously.
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Since 2021, I stepped away from origins and built a new practice continuing my work, which is rooted in reflection, integrity, and transparency. My license remains in good standing, and I continue to serve families with the same commitment I've held throughout my career, to walk beside them with care, clarity, and humility.
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Thank you again for the opportunity to respond and for amplifying voices that often go unheard. With respect, Amy F. Tate, LMCPM, Clinical Director, Swiss Avenue Birth and Wellness Collaborative. Next time on Something Was Wrong.
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you. each and every listener for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
As a pediatric nurse, did you have awareness of the fact that a licensed midwife in Texas can become one with a high school diploma?
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
When you first started having your appointments at Origins, were you seeing Amy the whole time?
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
Origins birth and wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment. Additionally, midwives Jennifer Crawford and Elizabeth Fuel have also not returned our request for comment. This season is dedicated with love to Malik.
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S23 E13: Origins Shit Show
What was your impression of Amy? How did you feel about your care the first half of your pregnancy?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
I think we had close to like 100 entries and then we were able to invite 40 people and they were able to bring a plus one. I think we probably had almost everyone show up from a winner's standpoint. It felt like around 80 people. I don't know though.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
We'll go in alphabetical order because I'm a nerd. ABC, even though most of our listeners are probably very familiar with who you are, introduce yourself and a little bit about your background and how listeners may recognize your voice, Amy, and then a bit about what you do here at Broken Cycle Media. It's a whole lot.
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S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Yes. And Thomas, who was a longtime listener, which was cool. Yeah, it was so great to meet the survivors. It was crazy, like meeting Kristen in person. Amy's like, this is Kristen. It just like didn't click for me at first. First of all, she looks like a Disney princess in real life. It's really wild to feel so close to people emotionally, survivors that I get to work with.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And then like meeting them in person, I don't know, it's kind of like this out of body experience. It's like this realization that you feel so close to someone and this is the first time you're physically being in their presence and how strange that is, but like in the coolest way possible. This was also like the first time the four of us, our production team, were all in person together.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
So that's really special and definitely hope to do more things like that in the future. It was on a Sunday afternoon-ish and we had treats and espresso martinis. We got to interact with the listeners. It was incredible. I can get really overstimulated in those sorts of environments. I've talked about that before.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And I did at times, but it was in a good way, like a so happy overstimulated type of way. I definitely would do it a million times over. It was just so much more intimate getting to like speak to listeners face to face, hear their feedback, hear what landed for them, hear what it meant for them personally. It was really re-energizing, I think, but I really want to hear what you guys thought of it.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Everybody we met was amazing. I loved how many couples came. I loved how many friends came. There was like a grocery clerk who was a middle-aged guy who was there with like his young Gen Z coworker because they talk in the break room about something was wrong every week. So when one of them won the contest, they knew instantly who they had to bring with them. And that was really sweet.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Also, I was so focused on not messing this up. I love hosting. My husband and I, we love having people over like we're those people. And I love throwing a party and I love a fucking theme. But I was stressed. I was stressed. I was worried that things were going to go wrong. So I wasn't even thinking about how fucking cool it was until it started happening.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And thankfully, I was tapped in enough to like allow myself to enjoy it by the time things were like happening. But people kept coming up and being like, oh, my God, it Amy's here. Lauren's here. They've heard you guys before on the show. Sometimes we just don't realize how much people are following.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
It's just so refreshing to like talk to people that like you and like the show because I feel like a lot of the feedback I get, if it does filter down through to me, it's usually like not pleasant sometimes. stuff. Nobody's ever like, oh, I saw this really nice thing that someone said about you and sends that to me. Like, it's never that.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
No offense to anybody, but like, it's always like, oh, look at this horrible, untrue thing someone said about you. For me, that's what I found re-energizing about it. The people who get it, they get it and it means something different and they understand how it can be and that it's genuine.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Yeah. And it's so lovely not only getting to see like people show up for y'all, but then also like seeing the survivors and the people who are attending just having their own independent conversations and relating to each other. And that's when it clicked for me. These events aren't even just about us meeting the listeners. It's about the listeners meeting each other.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
What I kept hearing from people over and over was it just feels so nice to feel like I'm in a safe space. And everybody who was there just had a heart of gold. And I just thought it was beautiful. And so I definitely want to do more of them. Credible Threat is a brand new show that will be launching 7-7, 2025.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
We will be sure to link as soon as the feed is ready so that you can go follow and subscribe. Amy has been working alongside myself producing this first season of Credible Threat, and she has been there for all of the incredible interviews. So I'd love to hear from you, ABC, what it's been like to be a part of it.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Dr. Chris Mohandy is a forensic psychologist and Lenore Clare is not only a stalking survivor herself, she's also an advocate. You may have heard her on Something Was Wrong previously. She's been on What Came Next. They bring decades of experience and so do all of their guests, people who have worked on cases like the Night Stalker, O.J.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Simpson, a lot of cases that listeners are going to recognize. And the interviews really provide new insights into those cases as well as what goes on for the experts behind the scenes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And we are hosting an event, shameless plug, July 13th at the St. Felix in Hollywood. There's two locations, so be clear. The one in Hollywood, St. Felix, Hollywood. We are having a credible threat launch party. The vibe is Hollywood goth, which is very like Lenora and Dr. Chris. It's the perfect space. So if anybody wants to plan their outfits accordingly, that's the vibe.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
It is going to be invite only, but we will be opening up some tickets to listeners. So definitely follow us on Instagram at Something Was Wrong Podcast for those kinds of announcements. That will be where we're posting like the links to sign up or register and things like that. That's where Queen Lauren shines and does her social media goddess work.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And she makes sure that everybody has the information they need and also helps coordinate details when needed. We're really excited that venue is also much larger. It is free, but we are asking people if they would like to donate to two incredible nonprofit organizations that are both featured on the first season of Credible Threat with Lenora Clare and Dr. Chris Mohandy. More about that soon.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
But the event will be benefiting Tending the Garden as well as Transdo Task Force, both which are featured on Credible Threat season one. Amy, can you talk a little bit more about that since you have been producing Credible Threat episodes and were there for the interview?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
I think the work that you're doing is so important and so amazing. Our friendship really blossomed after working together on season seven. And then Amy ended up returning the favor and helping me tell my story for season 16. And Lily was definitely a part of that as well. Lauren, you're next in terms of alphabetical order. You're the newest on the team. We love having Lauren on the team.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Thank you so much. The actual artwork of the show you'll see is by Mona Edwards. She's a prolific courtroom illustrator who has sat in court and drawn these gorgeous pieces of art on some of the most devastating and infamous trials, especially when it comes to Los Angeles trials. I got her book as soon as Lenora told me about her. And I love the book.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
And I think her artwork is just so incredible. And so I was like, do you think she'd do like a drawing for the artwork for the show? And Lenora's like, it doesn't hurt to ask. So listeners, especially those who are interested in criminology, victimology, science, true crime, We'll be definitely big fans of this show.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
So again, that starts 7-7-2025 and you can join us and celebrate its launch on July 13th, 5 to 8 p.m. St. Felix, Hollywood. Moving forward, some other exciting updates that we had recently, Amy highlighted on the What Came Next episode we did with the survivor who we're calling Dara.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
At that point, the Senate bill, Senate Bill 151 in Indiana, that Dara has been working with various representatives on, it finally passed in the Senate. On 4-30-2025, Senate Bill 151 became public law. And this law specifies that a prosecution for rape as a level three felony that is barred by the statute of limitations may still be brought within 10 years from the discovery of DNA evidence.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Dara has been instrumental in working with the representatives to help author this bill, support this bill. It was a very exciting day for us here at Broken Cycle Media, and we just couldn't be happier for her.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
She has just been such an inspiration to me. Recently, we found out that Malik's law that we were discussing for season 23 in Texas, it did not get passed through in the House that session, which is not uncommon, even though obviously it can be very disappointing and discouraging for those who are working on these bills.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
If you're a newer listener, you might be more quick to recognize Lauren's voice.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
I was able to share with them because of Dara's perseverance in what she's accomplished. We've had other survivors who have been met with these obstacles in the past. They've stayed persistent. And sometimes it's a matter of changing some of the language, doing a little bit more research. There's different reasons. So again, just incredible work on her part, her family's part. And
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
It was just really fun getting to see that from a distance. I hope we see more of it. Another incredible legislative win for survivors was the Take It Down Act that just recently passed. This was a bipartisan law, meaning both sides of the aisle supported this law.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
It's now illegal to knowingly publish or threaten to publish intimate images without a person's consent, including AI-created deepfakes. It also requires websites and social media companies to remove such material within 48 hours of notice from a victim. The platforms must also take steps to delete duplicate content.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Many states have already banned the dissemination of sexually explicit deepfakes or quote, revenge porn or non-consensual pornography. But the Take It Down Act is a rare example of federal regulators imposing on internet companies, which is something we have been fighting for. This is just such a huge win for survivors.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E17: BTS with BCM - Case & Community Updates with The BCM Production Team
So many nonprofits that we work with and follow were ecstatic to see this passed. I hope we see more legislation like this that protects our citizens in the ways that tech companies need to be responsible for these products that they're packaging and they're selling to people, whether it be dating apps, social media, pornography sites, etc.
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They need to also be responsible for the harm that can be caused. And I think this is a great first step for many survivors. Switching gears to Something Was Wrong case updates, season seven featured Amy's story and her continued fight for justice has been spoken a lot about on both Something Was Wrong and What Came Next. Unfortunately, Amy's fight for justice truly doesn't end.
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And if you followed her story closely, You've witnessed that in real time over these last few years and what she's had to continue to fight for. Any updates you could share with us, Amy, about where things stand hearing wise? Are you having to go back to court anytime soon? Anything you feel comfortable sharing?
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Lauren, we started working together on season 20. And then I started following her page and seeing the things that she does on social media and learning more about her business. And I was like, after the season is over, can I low-key hire you? And it's been amazing. We love, here at Something Goes Wrong, hiring survivors. It's part of our mission.
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Is there anything that listeners can do to support at this juncture?
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Thank you so much for sharing. You never cease to amaze me, Amy. Hadassah is so lucky to have a daughter like you and who continues to fight for her. And it's just a tragic reminder of how survivors' fights, we'd never really get to rest and how these things really fracture and change us forever.
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That's a really sad, uncomfortable truth, but it is the truth and one we can help one another carry together. I just appreciate you and we'll certainly do whatever we can to support along the way. So if you haven't signed the petition, please do. We will link it in the episode notes.
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Switching gears, we also have a kind of non-update update for season 18, Caitlin Braun, for those who are following us. As a reminder, Caitlin Braun was originally sentenced for faking pregnancies and fraudulently receiving doula care. She was originally given house arrest. And then, as we predicted, she reoffended within months of being on house arrest. So...
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It's also just really great for me personally because I get to keep having these continual relationships with y'all and excuses to talk to you guys every week, which I love. Lily has actually been on our team the longest. Lily, do you want to talk a little bit about that? And we have to shout out Suze and Jeff.
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She was arrested and she pled guilty in January to two counts of obtaining by false pretense services under $5,000 and two harassment-related charges. This is a long-standing pattern for Ms. Braun, the assistant crown attorney Simon McNaughton told the court in January.
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According to the CDC, Braun previously pled guilty to 21 separate charges, including fraud, indecent acts, false pretenses, and mischief after pretending to have experienced pregnancies and stillbirths between June 2022 and February 2023. She was then sentenced to two years of house arrest, as requested by both the defense and the Crown, and despite a judge's concern that she would reoffend,
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She did. Her latest hearing was on May 15th, 2025. But essentially, the joint submission that was presented at this hearing suggests that the time left on Braun's two-year house arrest should be served in custody, followed by an additional three years due to her reoffense. They said they'll consider the submissions and they set a June 9th date where they will potentially sentence Braun.
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Again, a kind of a non-update update. But what I know is that the survivors deserved better and they should have done a better job sentencing the first time. I think it was really apparent to everyone that Caitlin was going to reoffend. And unfortunately, that proved to be true. So we will continue to bring updates as we can. But it sounds like Caitlin Braun will be doing some time in prison.
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Moving forward, a happy update related to season 20. After South by Southwest, Lauren and I both were able to fly to Iowa this past April to see Monica marry her sweetheart, Kenton. It was so beautiful. I was completely honored to be invited. It was just wonderful being together again with the survivors and for such a happy special occasion.
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Lauren, I'd love to hear from you what your thoughts were on the day and the weekend.
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It was a fantastic weekend. And also I have to say Des Moines downtown, I thought it was so cute and lovely and I would totally go back and spend more time there. We have had some non-update updates. We had a lot of people when we put up on social media asking what questions y'all had for the Q&A. A lot of questions about where things are at with Jessica and
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And if any charges have been brought, do you want to speak to that piece, Lauren, in terms of any further conversations you've had with police or any further action that's been taken?
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So there hasn't been any updates in terms of legal. And just so everybody's aware, we often report things to agencies like, let's say, Child Protective Services on cases. And we're not always going to go out and advertise that. We are prioritizing the safety of children. And so that's why we aren't going to get into a lot of details about that element of all of this. But it is a huge concern.
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And I think that's obvious just from what we've shared already about Jessica, that she's an unfit mother, in my opinion. As we shared in one of our previous update episodes, there was a tragic car accident that took place and there was a lot of speculation about what caused that car accident, etc. If you want to hear about that, you can go to our previous community update.
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We'll link it in the episode notes to make it easy to find. Since then, there hasn't been any traction with the police. I mean, there was some meetings that took place after the season had wrapped, but nothing went anywhere. I think part of it is like our laws are not necessarily caught up to technology and that maybe the police involved don't understand all of the working pieces at play here.
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But I also think part of it is that there was this person that worked at the courthouse that kind of did some shit they weren't supposed to do, which we also talked about on the season. I think he had good intentions, but I think they're Could have been some civil rights violations that happened, unfortunately, of the survivors.
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And so I think part of the reason, in my opinion, that some of this isn't being looked into is because they know they made errors on the case. That's my personal opinion, but really disappointing. And a trend I'm seeing when we're recording seasons and working on cases, it's like the police will be responsive somewhat. But as soon as it's convenient for them, they kind of ghost.
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And that's really disappointing. And it's something I hear from survivors in a lot of different cases. I feel like we shouldn't have to fight for like basic communication from the person who's allegedly working on our cases. To me, that seems like just common sense. There was two-year protective orders that were in place for a few of the survivors and those recently expired, August 2024.
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And I just think that's important to note because Jessica did attempt to make contact with Lauren in the last few months. But before that happened, there were some incidents. So essentially what happened is a woman who lives near Jessica started becoming friends with her Felt things were weird. Started going down a rabbit hole. Found the podcast. And then she went on TikTok and posted about it.
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It blew up really fast. I spent hours with her interviewing her about things. And what was concerning about it is what this person was alleging was that Jessica was still using... some of the, quote, characters, these fake people that she used with the survivors and was trying to introduce them to this woman. That was obviously very upsetting for all of us to consider.
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Then Jessica was like in the comments being generally awful as she usually is. And that woman's TikToks ended up going down. But before that went down, then another big TikToker picked it up. And so those podcasts essentially started circulating again. People started listening to it again. And I think
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Somehow on planet Jessica Pauly, she took all of that happening to think that she should then reach out to Lauren. I try to put myself in other people's shoes and I consider their perspective as part of like who I am as a person. And I have tried so hard to like wrap my head around the way her fucking brain works. And it is hard to understand.
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It is deeply hard for me to understand because if it's me and somebody has accused me of stalking them, they have sought a do not contact order through the courts. The courts have then said, yeah, don't contact this person for two years. And then you think, I'm just going to like casually text this person. I just don't get it in any capacity.
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Like for your own self-preservation, why you would continue to try to contact people who call themselves survivors of you or people they're connected with. If anybody has requested over and over for you to not contact them, don't contact them.
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Nothing about what you've shared ever was giving, please reach out and act like we can be friends or have a conversation about this. I think it's just important to highlight again, the survivors in season 20, your journey is not over. You have to continue to navigate this, including sometimes navigating communication from your abuser.
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And I was pissed because I was like, of course, Jessica is going to try and do this over the holidays because that's such a Jessica move to try and ruin everything. I think you, Lauren, pointed out that it seemed like it had been written by AI and it was determined to be like mostly AI. Am I wrong?
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The reason I'm bringing this up is because it has to do with the text that she sent one of Bree's friends, who was also a friend of Jessica's before all this came out. So Jessica has this close friend who we called on the podcast Bobby Sue. Bobby Sue claimed to be a victim of Jessica's, but it's unclear why. And they're still friends and very much involved.
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Unlike the other survivors who have supported the other survivors of Jessica Pauly, this particular survivor has instead taken up for Jessica Pauly, so to speak, and been quite nasty, to be honest, to the survivors. People have put this together because I don't think Jessica has a lot of friends that she's probably interacting with on TikTok.
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Essentially, some screenshots were sent to us of Bobby Sue posting something about catfishing and like, can a girl just have hobbies? And Jessica like responding in the comments, laughing it up like this is the funniest shit ever.
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And so it's just for the survivors, I think, felt like confirmation that she's not sorry, even though she's like trying to send Lauren these AI texts about how she's sorry and with great gratitude. Then why are you fighting people in the comments on TikTok?
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Then why are you laughing it up with Bobby Sue about this really, really painful thing that you did to a lot of fucking people and honestly ruined your own life with your own behavior? It doesn't add up. Christy Boschman, she goes by that documentary girl on Instagram and I believe TikTok.
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She shared about the season specifically and I felt very validated because she's like, all I do is watch true crime documentaries and this shit is the most insane catfishing shit I've ever heard. And so it was just great to have her support. She has a big platform and she also shared the petition. So we've been getting a little bit more traction on that.
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I think it's important to share that because then recently, May 9th, After getting no response from Lauren, Jessica Pauly reaches out to Bree's friend on May 9th. She says, Hi, I've been meaning to reach out for a while now, but I wasn't quite sure how to start. I know things ended on a really hard note, and I completely understand why you stepped back.
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I want to say upfront that I take full accountability for my actions in the situation with Bree. I've spent a lot of time reflecting and I carry deep regret for the part I played in how things unfolded. You played 37 parts, okay? Back to the text. That being said, I'm in a better place now, growing, healing, and trying every day to make better choices.
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While I know things can't go back to how they were, especially with Bree, I've been thinking about you a lot and what your friendship meant to me. You were such an important part of my life and my son's too. He still brings you up from time to time and it reminds me of how much you meant to both of us. If there's any space in your heart to reconnect, I'd love to talk and catch up.
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I completely understand if you're not in a place for that, but I wanted to at least open the door and let you know how much I miss having you in my life. Take care. Her name. No matter what, I wish you nothing but good things. So obviously this was really upsetting to Brie and Brie and her friend did give us permission to talk about this and read the text messages.
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But I think we all were, again, just like shocked at the audacity. Lauren, I don't know if you want to share any feelings you had about this similar text.
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She was the puppet master. It's upsetting. And now Brie has to deal with this. And then she's sharing it with the other survivors and they're having to, like, think about, is she going to try and reach out to me next? It felt like she was clearly trying to like use this friend to like deliver a message to Brie. I do want to read, if you're comfortable, Lauren, Brie's friend's response.
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It really is the best. I love having you on the team, Lily. And it's crazy thinking that Lily was like the first time I allowed somebody to help me in life and business. Just kidding. It was so hard for me at first to even contemplate handing anything off because I didn't want it to ever be disingenuous. I just put so much insane pressure on myself. Always. I had to slowly build my trust.
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Yes, please read that. Okay. So Brie's friend wrote, Dude, there is no place for you in my life. What you did is absolutely fucked up and you know none of those girls deserved any of that shit you put them through. Many of them bent over backwards for you as a friend and what did you do in return? You completely psychologically fucked them for life.
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You are fully capable of making friends without catfishing them as that's how we became friends. So stating that you did any of that to make friends is a full-blown lie. You have zero remorse per the things I've seen via social media. The things you said to them as, quote, Brody is fucked up. Brie and the other girls cried so many nights over, quote, him.
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over him being an asshole, him threatening suicide. And it was you the whole time. You were there being two-faced, rubbing their back over the heartbreak. It was you. You can't deny any of it as we all witnessed the true person you are.
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fake you have no remorse and you just move on to the next victim you caused all of the hurt and that is a fucked up thing to do as a quote friend you literally enjoyed manipulating people as you have done it for years mic drop it just makes me so happy that's a satisfying response oh it was satisfying the group chat was on fire we were like we are not worthy
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So then her ass comes back and she's like, I won't argue with how you feel or try to change your mind. I regret that. I won't bother you again. But basically trying to say like, it's so hard for me that I'm such a bitch. And then Brie's friend just sends the screenshots of her laughing it up on TikTok. about catfishing with Bobby Sue.
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And she writes, somebody who, quote, takes accountability and, quote, regrets deeply of the things you've done, don't make these kinds of comments. You called your friends pathetic when what's pathetic is the torture you put them through for your own amusement. Boom. I just have to say thank God for people like Bree's friend who actually are willing to go to bat for people and say something.
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Thank God for those types of people. Agreed. We need that. We have to stick together against bullshit. 100%.
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Next time on Something Was Wrong. What she claimed was that she found out Jessica was catfishing her because she had been sent some flowers. She called the florist and she demanded to know whose name was on the credit card. And they said it was Jessica Polly. And that's how she found out.
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Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production created and produced by executive producer Tiffany Reese, associate producers Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe, with audio editing and music design by Becca High. Thank you to our extended team, Lauren Barkman, our social media marketing manager, and Sarah Stewart, our graphic artist.
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And Lily was the best person to do this with because she is the type of person who goes above and beyond everything. I'd be like, oh, can you research this? She's like, say less, 65-page doc the next day. You made it as easy as possible on me, and I think that it just worked out so perfectly. We were able to slowly evolve that relationship.
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Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you, each and every listener, for making our show possible with your support and listenership.
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Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app. Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode-specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
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I have a lot of workplace trauma that I talked about in my memoir season. I had a lot of toxic female boss relationships in my own life. It was hard for me at first, to be honest, like be a, quote, employer, because I was so worried about... hurting of somebody who worked for me and making them feel that powerlessness.
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After a while, I had to be like, no, like I need you to assign me work basically in the sweetest way possible.
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Look at us now thriving. Our staff meetings, which is this quad here, our Monday kickoff meetings are one of the highlights of my work week because it's always like, what did you guys do for the weekend? But then it's always like, okay, what the fuck is happening in the world? Sometimes these can go longer than planned, but it's sort of like a world debrief.
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And I just love that about our staff meetings because it's part therapy. It's so valuable. I just love every single person that works for Broken Cycle Media and that we have on our team. And we're super, super lucky to have, not that I'm biased, the best people in the world on our team.
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Oh, yes, especially during White Lotus season.
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Yeah, I think doing this work, we get into so many deep topics with the people we meet with. I guess it makes sense that also like bonds our team and bonds us to the people that we work with. It's just good old fashioned human connection, which feels so rare sometimes. So I'm excited to kind of bring like a recorded version of our weekly Monday chaos meetings.
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This is we're actually recording this on a Monday when we normally are having our regular meeting time.
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Yeah, we take the work seriously, but not ourselves. And that's a really important distinction. The survivors and their privacy and the honor that we get and all the things that we work on, we uphold that with the most seriousness. I think all of our personalities, we have a very like, when it's time to get to work, let's get to work.
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But also we are fun people, humorous people, and we have had to learn to like use humor. to cope with some of the shit that you're just exposed to and life itself.
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That's really meaningful. It's a good group. And shout out to Becca, who will be editing this, our audio editor, who is also an essential part of our team. And Steven, who works on What Came Next, and he'll be working on our new show, Credible Threat. We're thrilled that he's going to be working with us on that show as well. We could not do it without our audio editors.
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We also have a lot of other partners. Since we're introducing the team, also shout out our business management team, Jason, Jennifer, and Samantha, who are our partners on more of the business, HR, financial, adulting side of things. My lawyer, Alan, our other legal team partners, Wondery, as well as my agents at WME, Marissa and Travis. All the artists we work with that contribute their music.
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Sarah Stewart, who does our graphic design and often designs our flyers and things like that for us. The listeners too. Everybody contributes to the communities and it's not lost on us. So just wanted to start by giving people a little bit of insight into what the team does. And then also just thanking everybody who like makes the dream work because it definitely takes a lot.
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Hoping that episodes like this will also help people get like a little bit of a peek behind the scenes and understand a little bit more about our process and things of that nature. Amy works alongside me closely with season 23. Everybody on the team works on every season. But Lily and Amy rotate seasons that they sort of take the lead on by my side. Amy was that person for season 23.
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I'd like to hear Amy as somebody who had worked on the scripting and a lot of the behind the scenes work, fact checking, research, what it was like for you to hear the finale and hear the season back and just kind of what your general thoughts were.
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Hello, friends. I am very excited to record this episode today because I get to do so with the Something Was Wrong team. We're going to chat about some community updates, some happy updates. We're going to talk case updates. We're going to do a little Q&A. We're going to talk about new shows, new content we have coming your way, all sorts of things. I figured we'd kick it off with introductions.
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So the whole team, we flew out top of March for South by Southwest. Something Was Wrong was nominated for the second year in a row for Best Crime Podcast at the iHeart Podcast Awards, which take place at South by Southwest.
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And so when I found out we were nominated again, we work our fucking asses off and we are constantly doing so much heavy shit all the time that I really wanted to do something that was fun and also like celebrate. We have to celebrate the wins. And that's something I'm working on in therapy. So this felt like the perfect opportunity. South by Southwest was fantastic.
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We didn't end up winning, but the award show was also great. Lauren sadly had to fly out that day, that morning, but Lily was able to attend the iHeart Awards with Amy and I. Amy, this was also your first iHeart Awards attending. What did you guys think of the award show?
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I love being able to include you guys in that stuff when I'm able to. We saw Payne Lindsey there. We saw Sabrina from Two Girls, One Ghost. Who else did we see? Andrea from Betrayal, who won the category. Congrats to her. She was lovely. We saw Andy from the office. We saw Ed Helms. I didn't know what to do. So I was just like, oh my God, hi. And acted like I knew him.
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You actually said, nice to see you.
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Lily like looked at me like, holy fuck. But it totally worked. So FYI, if you ever see a celebrity and you don't want to overwhelm them, but you know that they meet enough people that they just play like they know people, that's the way to go. I had so much fun the previous year at South by Southwest, and I had seen how different shows had hosted events similar to this.
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So I was like, I want to do something like that. So it was kind of our first attempt at doing something like this. Besides season one, we did a live show, but that was a bit different. The stickers that Sarah created and all the flyers and everything she designed, gorgeous. Lauren also designed a bunch of gorgeous graphics for the event itself.
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We found this really great place called Vinyl Beauty Bar in Austin, Texas. Shout out to them. They were fantastic. Their team was great. They were so helpful. The venue is awesome, but it's like this black, white and pink Dolly Parton themed space during the day, a salon. And then it has also like a stage. And so they also have evening events, concerts. You can host private events.
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It's just awesome. And woman owned. Once I found the space too, I was like, oh, wait, this could really be something. We didn't know exactly what it was going to be, especially because this was our first one. I wanted to make sure that we kept expectations low. It was free and we opened it up on social media for people. If they wanted to register, they could enter to win a ticket.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Years later, Alyssa came across the Megan Stoner Scam Awareness Facebook group, which primarily consisted of alleged victims of Megan Stoner and concerned locals. After Stoner had been charged with the OWI and nine felony counts, she was released on bond.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
As a surprise to probably no one, Stoner continued to commit alleged crimes and target alleged new victims, like Tom, during the time she was running feral outside. Now, as we heard in the last few episodes from Tom, when he loaned Stoner money originally and shared his card info with her, he did not know about the rental scams.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Stoner had told him that she was in jail at times she wasn't in jail, and that her being in jail was due to a civil case against her by a moving company, which was also inaccurate. After months of Stoner giving Tom the runaround about paying him back, he began digging around more online and asking questions about Stoner's self-proclaimed haters.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Eventually, a member of the Megan Stoner scam awareness Facebook group, Mike Neal, connected with Tom and filled him in on what the group had gathered about Megan Stoner's alleged crimes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
After the failed sting to get Stoner arrested by Alyssa and Vero on August 12th, 2023, on August 17th, Stoner was called to appear for a pre-trial hearing and a motion to revoke Stoner's bail, meaning Stoner was likely heading back to jail due to her failure to comply with the court's instructions.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Because of this, her counsel then filed a motion to have her warrant vacated so she would not need to return to jail while awaiting her trials. The hearing for this took place August 23rd, and court documents show her attorney submitted the motion to vacate the warrant. The following day, August 24th, 2023, Stoner was again supposed to attend court hearings and failed to appear.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Tom was in shock when he learned this news, but even more than that, he was heartbroken to learn that he had been taken advantage of by someone whom he considered to be a friend and someone he admired in politics.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Because of this, the judge issued an additional warrant for Megan Stoner's arrest. So she now had two warrants and had failed to appear for several court hearings. And the longer Stoner failed to report to the court, the more locals in the scam awareness Facebook group became motivated to find out where Stoner was hiding out.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
When the Facebook scam awareness group learned about Tom and that Stoner had continued on her merry little scammy way, they were determined more than ever to bring Megan Stoner to justice. Fast forward to summer of 2023, and Stoner was due to return to court to face her pending charges. Here's Alyssa.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
jason and jennifer at ksco our cyber security team darkbox security and my lawyer alan and to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership special shout out to neon honey and gabanes for covering our theme song gladrag's original song you think you this season for more music from them check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
It's important to note when listening to most of the calls we're including this season with Megan, to keep in mind that the goal of the person speaking to Megan, I guess 90% of the time, was to gather more evidence by getting her to accidentally slip up and share important information.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
And this is certainly the approach Alyssa took to try and get info from Stoner by claiming to be a journalist and by offering a sympathetic ear in order to get more information. The goal was to scam the scammer into telling on themselves. And thankfully for all of us, she almost always takes the bait.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
The following call took place a few days before Stoner was due to report back to court for her pending charges.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E7: Scam the Scammer
Last episode, we heard from Indianapolis community member Alyssa, who first became aware of Stoner's shady behavior when Alyssa had posted some free items for people in need on Facebook. Alyssa reported Stoner to the Buy Nothing Facebook group admin after Stoner took items off Alyssa's porch that were intended for others in need.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
As the survivors investigated Origin's birth and wellness past further, one of the most eye-opening discoveries centered around owner Gina's first year as a licensed midwife. Gina Phillips became a licensed midwife on March 28th, 2013. By the end of that same year, the Texas Midwifery Board would receive at least one complaint about Gina's services and began the review process.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
So you submitted in writing, then you submitted on the website. You have spoken with them on the phone. You have emailed with them a few times and checked in on things. But as of right now, they're still, quote, investigating it.
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S23 E8: Life and Death
Then on October 9th, 2014, Gina was sent a notice of violation that stated Gina rendered services on or about December 13th, 2013 to April 6th, 2014 that allegedly violated several of their codes. End quote. End quote.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
She also received a violation for allegedly not referring clients to another clinician in the event of other conditions or symptoms assessed by a midwife exercising reasonable skill and knowledge that could adversely affect the mother or fetus. Two more of Gina's violations were related to guidelines surrounding labor and delivery that require a midwife, quote, end quote.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
According to the docket highlighting the Texas Midwifery Board's disciplinary actions, Gina was notified that her license was being suspended, and she was going to be put on professional probation in October of 2014. However, Gina signed a statement saying she did not accept the proposal by the Complaint Review Committee and requested an informal conference and formal hearing.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
,,,,,,,. P P P P P P P G實 , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , a en in in in in in a. A and. A. A. A. A. P. P. P. P. P. P. P.ר Thank you to Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Wondery, Jason, and Jennifer, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. Thank you endlessly to every survivor who has ever trusted us with their stories. And thank you.
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S23 E8: Life and Death
each and every listener for making our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Emily Wolfe for covering Gladrag's original song, You Think You, for us this season. For more music by Emily Wolfe, check out the episode notes or your favorite music streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Speaking of episode notes, there every week you'll find episode specific content, warnings, sources, and resources. Until next time, stay safe, friends. If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
On February 16, 2015, a meeting was held and disciplinary terms were agreed upon. Gina ultimately agreed that over the following year of her probated suspension that she would not supervise any apprentices or students and she would be supervised by a preceptor for 10 or more births.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Something Was Wrong is intended for mature audiences. This season contains discussions of medical negligence, birth trauma, and infant loss, which may be upsetting for some listeners. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
She also agreed to submit the charts of the first 10 births she attended in her probationary period and submit evidence of one year of supervised practice.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Lastly, Gina had to submit proof to the Texas Midwifery Board of taking three hours of continued education, including charting, hypertensive disorders in pregnancy, and vaginal births after cesarean, as well as additional education hours required for licensure renewal.
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S23 E8: Life and Death
What makes these findings even more interesting is that Caitlin Wages, eventual co-owner of Origins, became a licensed midwife on October 10, 2014, only one day exactly after Gina received her first notice of violation from the Texas Midwifery Board.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Considering the fact that Gina allegedly acted as Caitlin Wage's preceptor while Caitlin earned her licensure, that also implies that Gina's violations occurred while she acted as a preceptor. Relatedly, it's important to highlight that the North American Registry of Midwives
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specifically requires midwives that serve as registered preceptors to have at least three years of experience beyond entry-level certified professional midwives requirements or having served as a primary midwife for at least 50 births beyond the entry-level certified professional midwife requirements.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
It's an unfortunate foreshadowing to what we know now that you obviously all didn't know then.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, and Wondery. The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Origins Birth and Wellness owners and midwives Caitlin Wages and Gina Thompson have not responded to our requests for comment.
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S23 E8: Life and Death
How were you guys able to determine that Origins was doing this?
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S23 E8: Life and Death
Do you know if any of the other women have had run-ins with her, so to speak?
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
Although the survivors were being met with many obstacles in their pursuit of justice against Origins Birth and Wellness Center, they did not give up. They began learning more about the ways birth centers physical buildings are governed in the state of Texas.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
They learned that Texas Health and Human Services, which is often referred to as HHS, establishes the state licensing requirements and the operational standards for birthing centers. In their research, the women discovered that every building in Dallas is required to possess a certificate of occupancy, or a CO as it's often called.
Something Was Wrong
S23 E8: Life and Death
According to the city's government website, a certificate of occupancy is a document provided by the city that proves a structure is habitable, based on its legal use, type of property, and meets all housing and building codes.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong. Last episode, we discussed how Stoner and I made contact while she was in Hamilton County Jail.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
At the end of our fifth call, I played Stoner the season's trailer where she had little to no reaction. The trailer was available for early release on October 10th, 2024. Because of the trailer's release and the public attention on Stoner, I started to receive emails from former victims and others who had experiences with her.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
I spoke to Stoner again on October 14th, 2024 about my upcoming trip to meet with Indiana State Police and the allegations Hannah had shared with me.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
While on the airplane to Indiana, Stoner tried calling me nine times in five hours. The next day, she called me again.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Throughout my week in Indiana, I had productive conversations with Indiana law enforcement who are still considering further charges. I also had the pleasure of meeting up with some of the Indiana locals like Alyssa, Chloe, Justin, and Vero. During this week, I also spoke with Spice Girl Lainey, heard from earlier in this episode, and conducted other off-the-record interviews.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
November 8th, 2024, my final day in Indiana, Stoner called me for the 11th time.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
We'll continue to hear the remainder of my phone calls with Stoner, where she provides comment to her list of allegations. We also met Hannah last episode, a Facebook community member who was in conversation with Stoner's Yoni practitioner, Haribo, providing him information about Stoner's crimes. Here's Hannah.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
My last call with Stoner took place on November 13th, 2024, two days before her jail release and over a month into this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Bye-bye. On November 15th, 2024, Megan Stoner was released from Hamilton County Jail. Within hours, she was back to her old ways, messaging people on social media asking for money. Within hours, she was also texting me. Despite me telling Megan multiple times, we had nothing further to discuss if she wasn't going to comment further.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
There have also been multiple reports of Stoner and a few of her accomplices harassing victims and myself. Stoner even tried to propose that she start her own podcast to interview her victims to pay them back to a victim who has told Stoner repeatedly not to contact him since summer of 2023. Megan Elizabeth Stoner, are you absolutely delusional?
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Do you have no sense of the pain and the emotional turmoil that you have caused your victims and community? Have you no remorse about the resources you waste that could help real victims? Have you no respect for the death of children and your family, which you so recklessly use as a tool for your manipulation?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Your attempts to attack and discredit your victims and the truth are baseless and remorseless. You play the victim in the chaos that you create. Also, FYI, it isn't very smart to harass your victims while on probation, especially when some of these victims are still involved in the state's ongoing investigation of you. At a certain point, one could argue witness intimidation is the goal.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
My team and I have spent six plus months studying your bullshit, Megan. In my endless conversations with you, you never expressed genuine remorse or a sense of awareness of your impact on others. Your posts on social media since your release only confirm what your critics report. You're a parasite, a liar, a thief, and a joke.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
I'd like to say I hope you learn from your mistakes, but you never have before, and your attitudes and behavior since your release only underline everything I've thought to be true. You may think you're in the clear, but guess what, Megan? Through my investigation, I've found other victims. and they've connected with the state police.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
And you and I both know what's been covered on this season of the podcast is only scratching the surface of what you've done. And though this season may be wrapping up for now, just know we're still fighting for the victims and we won't stop. Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media. Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season. For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Because Progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're going to love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high quality items within reach. like 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50, washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-carat gold jewelry.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
The best part? All Quince items are priced 50-80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings to us. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices. All of their products are made of premium fabrics and finishes. I love that.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quince. Go to quince.com slash SWW for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E I finally feel like I'm getting back into the swing of things after the new year, and I'm trying to focus on small attainable goals, and Thrive Market is helping me achieve one of them, which is to eat more often and healthier snacks.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Thrive Market makes it so much easier to find better options without all the hassle. One of my favorite features is the healthy swap scanner in the Thrive Market app. Scan any item and it'll instantly suggest a cleaner, healthier alternative. So for me, this means even simple things like popcorn or crackers.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
I also love shopping their beauty section and I've found so many brands that I had never heard of before that have really affordable non-toxic formulas. And the best part is everything gets delivered safely right to my door every time and I get savings on every order. If you've been following the podcast for a long time, you know I have been a Thrive Market fan for quite some time.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
Whether you're looking for dye-free snacks, non-toxic cleaning products, Thrive Market has it and you can find it in just a matter of a few clicks. Ready for a junk-free start to 2025? Head to thrivemarket.com slash SWW and get 30% off your first order plus a free $60 gift. That's T-H-R-I-V-E market.com slash SWW thrivemarket.com slash SWW.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E12: Tip of the Iceberg (Finale Part 2)
During my investigation, I conducted interviews with Spice Girls' Alex and Lainey and a few other off-the-record interviews to gather more evidence of Stoner's many alleged crimes. I spoke to Stoner on October 2nd about these interviews and about speaking to Indiana State Police.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Wondery Plus subscribers can listen to Something Was Wrong early and ad free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Something Was Wrong is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Fiscally responsible, financial geniuses, monetary magicians. These are things people say about the drivers who switch their car insurance to Progressive and save hundreds.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
This podcast is intended for mature audiences and discusses topics that may be upsetting. For a full content warning, sources, and resources, please visit the episode notes. Opinions shared by the guests of the show are their own and do not necessarily represent the views of myself, Broken Cycle Media, or Wondery.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
The podcast and any linked materials should not be misconstrued as a substitution for legal or medical advice. Megan Stoner's responses to these allegations are addressed within this season. I'm Tiffany Reese, and this is Something Was Wrong. Last episode, we learned how Alex led the charge in uncovering the mysteries behind Stoner's Teslas.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Alex connected with Stephen of Mason Motors, who pursued a civil lawsuit against Stoner for inadequate pay and falsifying insurance documents. The case documents also revealed allegations that Stoner had stolen the identity of her ex-roommate. And although Stephen and his company Mason Motors won the civil case,
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Stoner has yet to pay the judgment of $68,002.10 and further criminal charges have not been pursued at this time. When my team and I first started working on this case, summer of 2024, I spoke with community member and former Politico Justin in one of my early interviews. I'm so thankful to Justin and all of the participants this season for their time.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
In one of our early interviews, Justin prepared me for my first conversation with Megan.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Because Progressive offers discounts for paying in full, owning a home, and more. Plus, you can count on their great customer service to help when you need it, so your dollar goes a long way. Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Potential savings will vary. Not available in all states or situations.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
That's next time on the season finale of Something Was Wrong. Thank you so much for listening. Something Was Wrong is a Broken Cycle Media production, created and produced by me, Tiffany Reese. Thank you so much to our associate producers, Amy B. Chesler and Lily Rowe. Thank you to our audio engineer, Becca High, and our social media marketing manager, Lauren Barkman of Luxury Media.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Additional thanks to our partners, Grant at Wondery, Marissa, Travis, and our team at WME, Jason and Jennifer at KSCO, our cybersecurity team, Darkbox Security, and my lawyer, Alan. And to all of you who make our show possible with your support and listenership. Special shout out to Neon Honey and Gabanes for covering our theme song, Gladrag's original song, You Think You, this season.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
For more music from them, check out the episode notes or your favorite streaming app. In the episode notes, you'll always find content warnings, sources, and resources, with links to our websites and social media as well. Thank you so much to every survivor and ally who has trusted us to help share their stories. We are forever grateful. Until next time, stay safe, friends.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
If you like Something Was Wrong, you can listen early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Before you go, tell us about yourself by filling out a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
When speaking with someone like Megan Stoner, I knew I had to play my cards correctly. This is why you'll often hear me playing dumb with Megan. I don't want to come across too strong, as I want to keep her talking, but I'm also trying to get her to give me information. At this point, the police had already visited Stoner in jail to try and get her to talk and she refused.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
But I also knew that Stoner loves attention more than anyone I've ever studied or encountered. She loves it so much that she often puts her own best interest to the side in order to get it.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
My second jailhouse call with Stoner was on September 27th, 2024, while she was creating plans for her looming release on November 15th.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
If you love the good things in life, if you love a little luxury, but you can't always afford it, I think you're gonna love Quince. Quince is my go-to for luxury essentials at affordable prices. Quince offers a range of high-quality items within reach. like 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters from $50, washable silk tops and dresses, organic cotton sweaters, and 14-carat gold jewelry. The best part?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
All Quince items are priced 50-80% less than similar brands. By partnering directly with top factories, Quince cuts out the cost of the middleman and passes the savings to us. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical, and responsible manufacturing practices. All of their products are made of premium fabrics and finishes. I love that.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
Give yourself the luxury you deserve with Quince. Go to quince.com slash SWW for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E You know that ding means you're going somewhere exciting. But do you know what this one means?
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
On December 19th, 2024, Stoner pled guilty to three criminal misdemeanor charges in Elwood, Indiana. One was for a criminal misdemeanor case opened on July 12th, 2023 for violation of driving conditions pursuant to distracted driving and driving while suspended.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
The other criminal misdemeanor she pled guilty to was opened on July 31, 2023, for possession-slash-display of fictitious-slash-suspended altered driver's license, operating a motor vehicle without financial responsibility, speeding, and driving while suspended. The third criminal misdemeanor case was for a case opened on August 2, 2023, for theft.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
On September 19th, Stoner's Anderson City Court case was closed and her, quote, probation was closed due to defendant's incarceration, end quote. This case was Stoner's criminal misdemeanor opened on March 1st, 2022, for operating a vehicle while intoxicated, endangering a person, operating a vehicle with a Schedule I or II controlled substance, and speeding.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
As of December 23rd, 2024, Stoner still has an outstanding balance of $682 for her fine, court costs, and filing fees for this case. In relation to the other cases she pled guilty to, she was ordered to pay a $250 fine. Back in September, my second call with Stoner abruptly ended because of bad cell service.
Something Was Wrong
S22 E11: Double Down (Finale Part 1)
My next call with her was three days later, on September 30th, 2024, where we jumped back into reviewing the timeline of her crimes once again.
Something Was Wrong
Listen Now: Scam Factory
Hey listeners, we've all gotten those suspicious messages and scam calls, right? Well, behind those suspicious messages flooding your inbox lies a nightmare that's all too real. Scam Factory, the gripping new true crime podcast from Wondery, exposes a multi-billion dollar crime empire operating in plain sight.
Something Was Wrong
Listen Now: Scam Factory
Every suspicious text you ignore masks a vast network of compounds where thousands are held captive and forced to scam others under the threat of death. Told through one family's harrowing account of sleepless nights, desperate phone calls, and dangerous rescue attempts, Scam Factory reveals a brutal truth. The only way out is to scam their way out.
Something Was Wrong
Listen Now: Scam Factory
Binge all episodes of Scam Factory early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.
Something Was Wrong
Listen Now: Scam Factory
I'm about to play a clip from Scam Factory, where one character, Jella, learns horrifying news while she's trapped inside the Scam Factory. While you're listening, follow Scam Factory on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.