WEAPONIZED with Jeremy Corbell & George Knapp
PART 2 : Immaculate Constellation : A UFO Whistleblower's Journey - Matthew Brown
Tue, 06 May 2025
Why would anyone voluntarily endanger their career, reputation, freedom, and their life by stepping forward as a UFO whistleblower? For former Department off Defense and State Department analyst Matthew Brown, it was an excruciating decision. Brown tried to follow the rules and the law by reporting what he had learned about an unacknowledged special access program dubbed Immaculate Constellation. He says he repeatedly tried to bring it to the attention of superiors but found himself blocked at every step. In Part One of an exclusive interview with Jeremy and George, Brown said he was aware that by going public, he was risking everything. Now, in Part Two, he reveals more about the stunning documents he read, the depth and scope of the UFO coverup, and the methodical, by-the-book process he followed before making the fateful decision to go public and reveal his identity. The Department of Defense, its All-domain Anomaly Resolution Office (AARO), members of Congress, and the public interested in UFOs have all urged UFO whistleblowers and witnesses to step forward and share any information or evidence they may possess, and to not worry about possible consequences. Brown knows his career and security clearances are now toast because the system itself is designed to discourage truth and transparency. WATCH PART 1 HERE : https://youtu.be/ZAxI-LDrDqA WATCH PART 2 HERE : https://youtu.be/4n_bRtnIP14 WATCH PART 3 HERE : https://youtu.be/PtBVAxoHeaY GOT A TIP? Reach out to us at [email protected] ••• Watch Corbell's six-part UFO docuseries titled UFO REVOLUTION on TUBI here : https://tubitv.com/series/300002259/tmz-presents-ufo-revolution/season-2 Watch Knapp’s six-part UFO docuseries titled INVESTIGATION ALIEN on NETFLIX here : https://www.netflix.com/title/81674441 ••• For breaking news, follow Corbell & Knapp on all social media. Extras and bonuses from the episode can be found at WeaponizedPodcast.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Chapter 1: What is the significance of the Immaculate Constellation report?
So the idea that it could have been a war game, could it have been something, you know, some of these UFOs that have been seen over nuclear missile bases, silos and things of that sort, the implication has been, as with drones, that it's a readiness test of some sort.
If that would have been the only thing I had seen and none of the rest of this saga had happened, we wouldn't be talking. And I go and I have the meeting with Sissy, uh, give them the paper, including the various compartments and programs that they could themselves look into to access the same information that I saw, which is ridiculous that Congress has no access to.
When I was in USDI, I read the transcripts of Sean Patrick briefing Senator Rubio, Senator Warren, and Senator Gillibrand on the results of his investigation in his congressionally-tasked Arrow report. And those transcripts, which were supposed to be open kimono, here's the truth, Mr. Senator, Mr. Senator, Sean Kirkpatrick absolutely distorted. Saying what? What did he say that was a lie?
You know, I read these transcripts once and immediately knew that, uh, yeah veiled threat no i'm i knew that i was now something else i was in i had inside knowledge into the deception of our government by elements of our intelligence community people will be so curious so what comes on the fourth page talks through the pages just go ahead
Yeah, so I mean, like I said, the second series, second and third examples were less interesting to me. But, you know, they are images of orbs transiting from coastal facilities out to the ocean and sort of describing, you know, what those facilities were. uh, as I think the unspoken implication of why something like this would be out there. Um,
And yes, just a similar or just a bit not vague, but a general description of we observed this coming from this direction or from where this facility sensitive facility was left over the ocean. You know, this was our task asset and it happened on this date.
Anything really striking in the rest of that document that really highlighted to you anything else in that document is really striking.
Yeah. So the last example of the four was back to Russia again, this time, I believe, in the Atlantic Ocean. And it shows a another Russian intelligence vessel underway this time at night. The image is green infrared. And it shows above this Russian vessel another black triangle.
But whereas the first example in the Pacific was, you know, an equilateral, large, pretty stunning object that was of comparable size to the vessels below it. This was a more... Definitely smaller, smaller than the vessel. And it was more angular in shape and sort of swept back.
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Chapter 2: What challenges did Matthew Brown face as a UFO whistleblower?
And that's not the reaction I was expecting. I was expecting to at the very least sign the paper, right? Saying, you know, this incident happened.
Yeah.
Reported it. Signed it. Yeah, it's done. So. You know, I tried to ask him, like, are you sure? Like, do I need to sign anything? He's like, no, you can go. And so I left that room and never, ever had anything about that incident come up again.
Except immediately you went and checked again for the file.
Yeah, I went upstairs and I went to see what had happened and it was gone.
So the idea that it could have been a war game, could it have been something, you know, some of these UFOs that have been seen over nuclear missile bases, silos and things of that sort, the implication has been, as with drones, that it's a readiness test of some sort. We're going to put some secret operation, unexpected, and see how people and systems react to it.
Could that have been what was going on here?
I mean, it is something that on the surface level appears plausible. I do not believe that to be the case, given the circumstances of how it was located, the fact that hundreds of people had access to that system, the fact of its generic labeling. There's no red flags on that to draw any fish to the bait, as it were, to catch somebody. And then the process of reporting it,
You know, there's no outcome from that besides apparently making a lot of people pissed off and worried and kind of scared.
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Chapter 3: How did Matthew Brown attempt to report what he discovered?
But if you just needed to see the facility, but maybe not the plane, you know, those would be manually excised.
Now we have tools to do that for us. Could you describe then for us how you think this works, whatever the name for it is now, how it works? Did we have an AI system in 2018 that could do what we're describing now? Well, we know we did. Those documents have since become public.
Sentient. Sentient. Right. And the fact that sentient was operational at those dates of the documents mean it was operational for years before then. Years before 2018. Right.
You know, we've had our conversations, private and otherwise, about this kind of an operation. And it just seems like, gosh, there should be somebody who's collecting all this information and studying it and trying to figure it out. And the fact that it goes into the executive branch somewhere, if that's what happens to it. Good. I'm glad somebody is doing it.
Why is that, as you've learned about it, why is that not necessarily a good idea? Is it because it's not maybe really within the executive branch that it's? It's an entity unto itself.
Why it may not be a good idea to censor our intelligence products that are circulated within our cleared community to our service members that are on the front lines every day is because you are blinding them to their environment. You are opening them to threats. You're exposing them to risks. And you are essentially inhibiting the pursuit of national security objectives by doing so.
There's a reason you guys have talked to so many whistleblowers from the military who see these things. That's because partially because they're reporting it, they feel endangered by it, and nothing is being done and no answers are being given. And they are in some cases suffering legitimate injuries.
these images that would pop up here and there on some system, on some platform, this AI program that was once called Immaculate Constellation, it would grab them, take them away, and then they're gone from those platforms, those places. So like CIA or something.
I believe where it could, the data was ingested essentially in a stovepipe, right? It's locked off. It goes in. It goes into the black box, and then a product comes out for what you're cleared to see and what you have a need to know to see.
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Chapter 4: What were the reactions of his superiors to his findings?
So that's just more of a nature of SAPs, apparently, learning in how they're constructed and especially how the internal security for SAPs is run. I think you guys have reported on it that the budget for security is much higher than the budget for the actual research on this. And that is a very there's very real world effects, as I came to learn.
Describe those. For example, you're telling us that you realize the guys you're working for are lying. Do you start to feel marked because of your interest in this or do you make mistakes that put you in somebody's crosshairs?
So there was no indication that anything untoward was thought about me. As far as I knew, nobody even knew I was interested in this stuff.
You feel a sense of duty Congress needs to know. You know they've been lied to specifically. People tell you, yeah, this is an important piece to the puzzle. And you felt a sense of patriotic duty to do that. And so you took steps to that. You said, cool, they're going to give me whistleblower protections. I am a whistleblower. What happened? How did you do that? What were the steps?
So I had to find them. There was no way that I could find to get into contact with Congress. I tried. So then I started talking to other people who were at that time more vocal about their intent to be a whistleblower to Congress. Internally more vocal. Yes. On classified systems. Yes. Or in not so much on systems, but in classified facilities, verbal conversations. So.
met one person who did go forward. Kind of watched that person without letting them know what I knew to see, you know, what they were doing and how it went for them. At that time, it just seemed to be the report was, you know, I went in, talked with the staff. The staff then had a separate meeting to talk with the member. And there was no paperwork, no lawyers involved.
It's just you're in, you say what you have to say, and you're out.
That's the channel. No repercussion. That's what they said. We know all of those people as well. The assumption. There's not a SOP right now.
You know, this is what I'm learning and what I'm observing. And you told them what you know. Correct.
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Chapter 5: What evidence supports the existence of surveillance programs on UFOs?
Yeah. I don't know who to trust then either. Right. So what happens next is I'm told, okay, so we're going to set you up. To be clear, I spoke to a staff member from Sissy.
Mm-hmm.
I was told that next you'll speak to a staff member from SASC and then we will have a meeting with both SASC and CISI with the elected members of Congress there and the two people or sorry, and the staffers that is supposed to. That's what's what's supposed to happen. Right. So I feel a little better leaving this meeting.
Actually, the person I interact with seemed very genuine, took my concerns for safety very seriously. And perhaps oddly, but it was somewhat comforting, seemed to know more than me. Because at that point, I hadn't really met anyone who at least willingly was going to answer questions and seemed like they knew even a degree of what I knew at the time. So yeah, I felt like, okay, we're on track.
There's a process here. Congress actually is getting this under control. I'll have these meetings and it's, you know, I get a handshake, maybe a nice little thank you. And I feel like I did my duty and I can get back to my career.
They're asking you to come forward and you do it.
So none of those meetings ever happen. Weeks go by, I reach out. Hey, is this going on? Like, i told you i had more i want to give that more to you so i don't have it um when can we meet got the run around uh and then eventually the blunts reply like you either send me what you have in writing here on this uh non-official channel or uh You know, you don't and we don't need it.
So I sent that extra information. And then for many months, I thought, you know, I'm done.
It's disillusioning, isn't it? That the Congress has made a show of this. Hey, we want the information. We're going to pass this legislation, protect whistleblowers. Come on in, tell us this stuff. And then the channels really don't work.
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Chapter 6: How has the government responded to UFO whistleblowers?
No, I did not tell my bosses at this point in time I was at the Department of State when I was a whistleblower, to be very clear. I was a whistleblower when I – sorry, I was a Department of State employee when I reached out to Congress, and I was a Department of State employee when I spoke to Congress.
Mm-hmm.
So I get another job within FFRDC. I was going to work at DAHQ doing nuclear force planning. Pretty cool job.
Yeah.
And then last minute, a job posting goes up from the Department of State, and I'm told about it. I kind of knew some of the people at the State Department program. So that was a bit of a draw. If I feel like I need some protection, this could work out well in the long term.
So at the time, it was kind of self-interest there, where it was like, yeah, if I need to cover my ass and write something and have it not be redacted, this is a good place to do it.
It's pre-planning, right? And that comes from a sense of worry, a sense of fear in a way. You have to protect yourself. State Department's a good place. You're already thinking ahead. You're not doing pre-pub so you can write a book or be in a movie. You're doing pre-pub to protect your ass.
You got a new job at the State Department. You have in the back of your mind, look, if I decide to take it a step further, this is a good place to do that. Right. What's your job at State Department and did you like it?
Yeah, so my job was on paper sort of similar to what I had done at the Pentagon working in countering WMD. It's a cool job. Why was it cool? So the State Department one was mainly the draw, I mean, is to travel and is to travel to countries that I wanted to, in my case, in Europe. You're interacting with universities, industry groups, government sort of associations.
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Chapter 7: What role does AI play in the collection and analysis of UFO data?
Yeah, I it felt like at this point, again, I had not gone to Congress, but I had met the people who either were going to or had felt like, you know, OK, somebody's handled people seeing more senior than me who have connections and know what they're talking about or they got this. So I can rest easy. Let it go.
At what point did you read the transcripts of Sean Kirkpatrick speaking to the senators? Was that at the State Department? No, that was at USDI. I'm just trying to figure out at what point you decided, all right, you know, I tried to go to Congress. Obviously, you knew that Arrow wasn't the way to go. So you had to make a decision at some point. I'm going to take some action some way.
Yeah, so the NDAA language comes out. I recognize how serious that is. I'm talking with these people, even though now I'm at... States, I'm still tracking what's going on and start getting the the scuttlebutt that, you know, somebody big is going to come forward. And, you know, the implications of what they had to say are like, not good.
And they're making these people who are more senior than me feel or talk about like. You know, that there's corruption involved, that there is conspiracy, criminal conspiracy involved. Nothing is being whispered. But, you know, things start to feel like, oh, maybe this isn't so just a Cold War black program that was allowed to go on for too long.
And now it's just coming in from the cold, all nice and cute, like something much darker.
Right.
You see people like Dave Grush come forward and get slimed. You know that there are other whistleblowers who have come forward bits and pieces. You have to realize at some point there's a lot of risk in taking action.
Yeah, I mean, I went forward in such close proximity to Grush that I didn't have... At that time, I hadn't observed the blowback. It looked like from the outside that he had some... friction on his way there, but looked like he got to Congress, was saying the right things, and Congress was going to do something about it.
There was momentum.
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Chapter 8: Why is public awareness of UFO phenomena important?
some media personalities who could potentially be trusted. One of my next steps, which was, well, now I got to get something cleared, but then set back in a different way, which was, well, shit, we still have all these people apparently who are in danger. There's no help from the government. There's no help from Congress. There's no help from Arrow. Arrow.
There's no help from people who say they care about humanity, but their actions don't bear that out. So back to square one. And for me, square one is going back and reengaging with Congress. So I reach out in that. Yeah, I guess this would be winter of. Twenty four, twenty three, around there, back to my sissy connection.
And that person I learned had since moved on and he connected me to the current person, current staff member for sissy who's handled this. Arranged a meeting in a few months because I told them, hey, I'm going to just first of all, I asked, like, hey, did you get any of my testimony? The answer was no. At least that was the claimed answer. So I said, well, did you get any notes?
Like, I know he took notes. Did you get notes of what I said? No. So I said, okay, you know what? I'm going to write this all up for you guys. You have it and you can't lose it. And you're going to guarantee to me that this is not just going to stay with Sissy. It is going to go to Sask and it is going to go to Hask and it is going to go to Hipsy, like it was promised before, but never did.
Those acronyms meaning for the Senate committees and the House committees that would deal with these classified sensitive stuff.
You're like, fuck this. I'm writing it all down. Writing it down. I'm going to make it really your problem.
Right. and you gave me amnesty right you want this i'm giving it to you right so i spend uh some weeks uh laboriously typing this out um you know hidden drives on encrypted drives using open source software only able only opening it when i know i'm not connected to anything on a new device uh Not a very fun drafting process, and that's just the technical aspects of trying to be secure about it.
At this point, and I'm definitely under no illusions that the US government in some capacity knows about me, I'm mainly concerned about foreign intelligence and their possibility of collecting on me. I'm in DC, spy capital of the world. I was very concerned about that and wanted to do even the writing of this the correct way.
So during that time, draft this, I observe what's going on, continues to go on, the final death of UAP Disclosure Act 1 and the attempt to get the second one, which is totally watered down and not even worth our time to consider. And I go and I have the meeting with Sissy. I give them the paper.
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