Lauren and Chan dive into everything we know so far from Karen Read’s retrial — prosecution and defense strategy, courtroom drama, and key witness moments. It’s all on the table.00:00 – 08:00 Wedding Week Catch-Up08:01 – 10:59 Case Background & Legal Overview11:00 – 12:59 Media Impact & Public Perception13:00 – 15:59 Jury Insights & Legal Strategy16:00 – 18:59 Key Players & Investigation Focus19:00 – 22:59 Scene Details & Timeline Questions23:00 – 24:59 Financial Fallout & Defense Structure25:00 – 27:59 New Evidence Introduced28:00 – 32:59 Behavior, Phones & Property Changes33:00 – 34:59 Search History Controversy35:00 – 38:59 Opening Statements & Legal Framing39:00 – 41:59 Witness Testimony & Trial Atmosphere42:00 – 47:00 Expert Evidence & Courtroom Debates47:01 – 48:59 Trial Momentum & What's Ahead49:00 – 51:59 Pop Culture Pulse Check (Travis Kelce, Meghan Markle)52:00 – 55:00 Podcast Reactions & CommentaryCheck out our amazing sponsors:MasterClass: Our listeners always get great discounts on MasterClass, of at least 15% off any annual membership at masterclass.com/popapologists . Progressive: Visit Progressive.com to see if you could save on car insurance.Please note this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.For more Pop Apologists, follow along at:@popapologists on InstagramPop Apologists on YouTubeTo support the show, consider subscribing on Patreon or anywhere you listen to podcasts, where you can get bonus episodes of Pop Apologists every Monday and Friday!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
Chapter 1: What is the wedding week update and how are Lauren and Chandler preparing?
All right, everyone, welcome to part two of our deep dive on Karen Reid. So in this episode, Chandler and I chatted at the beginning about her upcoming wedding. So if you're here just for the Karen Reid of it all, refer to the timestamps on where to go to to begin the next part of our deep dive on Karen Reid.
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well well well we are here on the official wedding week for chandler wedding week is here we're in full swing we're both in white we're both in white i got in the elevator today and a very cute girl complimented my fit and she was like i love it so spring and i don't know why but i really wanted to be like well i'm getting married this week i'm so glad you did and i i held back the urge
It's kind of like when you see someone on your birthday who you don't know. You have the urge to be like, it's actually my birthday to the lady at CBS. She's like, bitch, I don't care. I don't care. But anyway, it's here. You look very stately, very regal, very bridal. Thank you. Very beautiful. I'm so sorry I'm wearing a white top. Truly, it was an oversight, and I didn't think about it.
Lauren's wearing a plunging white top, for those of you not watching. Plunging. Mm-hmm. Tits are out. For the girls and boys. The highest Olympic-sized, whatever, pool diving board plunging top. Yeah. I just can't stand when any attention is not on me, as you know. It's true. No, just kidding. I'm so happy for you. I'm so excited. I know. I am too. I'm feeling really good. Yeah.
The weather is a little bit all over the place, but it's looking warm. It's looking warm. We're not sure about precipitation, but at least the day itself is looking warm, which is maybe my biggest wish. Really? My wish is like really for warmth over. I think warmth is more important than even wet. Your Ray J one wish. Yeah. Is for warmth.
Just because you don't want people kind of frigid and uncomfortable. I think the worst possible weather. Not kind of wet. I think the worst possible weather would be cold and windy. Oh, yeah. And right now we're looking like warm, potentially afternoon shower. But we'll see. We'll see. And honestly, it'll be wonderful no matter what. I mean, can you imagine if it's a beautiful day? I know.
Will you be so happy? And if it rains in the morning, it'll be great because it'll be super green. It'll clear out allergens, et cetera. Love it. But yeah, what else about me and my wedding? I'm so excited. I was thinking, I was like, did I get the same lead up chatter? And I don't think I did. I feel like I was, my wedding content was so demure in comparison. It was worse. No.
It was gravely worse. Wait, our discussion of my wedding was, you think over, like the coverage was more intensive. Yeah. No, I don't think, well, I think it was more fraught. Well, I was more of a bitch. You're actually surprisingly chill. Like I am basically instilling fear in you and anxiety into this process.
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Chapter 2: What happened during Karen Reed's first trial and why was there a mistrial?
And I think that the hard part is, is like memory over the course of several years can be kind of difficult, right? You could misremember things. You could start to think that something that someone else said was something you heard yourself. You know, it's just, it's so easy, I think, to, with a case with so many details, it's just easy for caring to potentially forget.
really cause harm to herself by doing all these interviews. Yeah, and to that point, all of these witnesses are going to have to come back and testify again. Their memory is going to be even cloudier than before. And I think a lot of these witnesses that really were in favor of Karen Reid's case and that really looked bad, we just don't know if they're going to look bad again.
We don't know if this prosecutor is going to be able to do a better job at cross than Alan Jackson. It's just really crazy. I think that... Karen has very impressive lawyers on her side. It's the same legal team as before. In fact, they've added a new member to the team who was an alternate juror from the last case who's actually a lawyer herself, I believe. I believe she's a woman.
And she is now on the team. And I think she'll be really instrumental in kind of helping to shape the way they need to position their case for the jury. Did you hear that there were three jurors?
I think they were, I don't know if they were alternates, but there were, yeah, I think they were alternates, but there were three jurors essentially that were dismissed from the trial immediately after the trial was over. And those three jurors, Alan Jackson says in an interview, he says, We know they favored Karen Reid.
We just know from their body language, from how they... He says you can get a pretty good read on each of the jurors based on are they leaning in when our case is happening? Are they leaning back? What are their facial expressions? I guess you can get a pretty good sense. And three staunchly pro-Karen jurors were immediately dismissed. What do you mean by dismissed?
Like they only needed a certain amount. And I believe that... Like during jury selection? No, after when the... I think it could have been just the alternates. But once 12 went into... to deliberate all the, like, I wish I knew the specifics on this. So apologies. But basically it's like three, I guess just three jurors were selected to not need it anymore. And those three were very pro-Karen.
And he just says like, that is something that they look back on and really feel like was a miscarriage of justice for her. And there is some feeling right now that this judge is anti-Karen Reid. Have you seen that? And it's the same judge in this second trial, which I think is pretty insane.
I don't know if that's like what always happens, if it's always the same judge for the, you know, second trial.
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Chapter 3: What controversies and misconduct surrounded the investigation of John O'Keefe's death?
So a lot of people believe that this is very kind of like inside baseball or whatever, just kind of like, not inside baseball, but there's like an inside person said, hey, you're about to get this order, destroy your phone. Yeah. You don't destroy your phone if you have nothing to hide.
That's so strange.
Why have you destroyed a phone of yours ever? Well, here's another question I have. Chandler. Why would you ever remodel your basement floors? So this is another very confounding piece of this, but the house outside of which this happened, they sold three months after under market value. Brian Albert sold that house under market value. They also redid the basement floors.
I guess they wanted to do some remodeling before they sold it at a loss. And I believe that the basement floors had already been redone three years before that.
Yes.
Why are we redoing the basement floors when we just redid them three years ago? For what it's worth, that was also a home that had been in his family since childhood. They also, I mean, that point alone is just like, this is a family home. Okay, it makes no sense. They rehomed this dog that he has had for seven years. Yes.
They claim that the dog got in like a fight with another dog or there was just some incident. But it's just like all of this is really, really bizarre. Especially when John has markings on his arms that are consistent with bite marks. There's just too many weird factors outside of Karen exiting the driveway and driving home. There's too many other weird things that happen. Exactly.
Like the pieces of taillight that they find on the snow. Exactly. They don't find those until I believe the next is, it's a really long time. So they were like collecting evidence in the wee hours, you know, right after they found John. And then later on that day, they go back to do, you know, more evidence collection. After they've taken her car into custody.
After they have, you know, taken her car, seized her car, and they find all this other evidence. And which they then store and capture in red solo cups and stop and shop bags. Also, the evidence that they do find that morning is, are clear shards of a cocktail glass, right? Which is he brought home from the waterfall, that bar they were at.
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Chapter 4: Who are the key players involved in the Karen Reed trial and what are their roles?
There's just no part of it that's in any way like relatable or kind of chill or kind of... I mean, I think she tries to when she like has that moment where she breaks down and she's crying and she says like, this is why it's nice to not wear makeup or, you know, like she tries. But I think the friend is exactly like her. The friend is exactly like her.
So that's why I'm like, these people exist and they're happy and they're living their life, but they're not in our circles. I've never met. I've never met anyone like them, but they do exist. I mean, this is just my favorite part of the interview.
Especially women against each other when you're like... but you're my neighbor and everything's fine. Yeah. Like, I don't know. It's wild. So yeah, I had no idea. Like, and I think I know a lot. Yeah. And I had no idea. But just like the essence of, of, of a person, even one of my friends, you know, Marcus, but Marcus will see certain things and he goes, ah, there's my friend. Yes.
And gets so excited when you can see me reflected in a way that's the me that you know. Yes. And so what a gift that is. It's just so. Yeah. Letting me be. Hmm.
Thank you for letting me be. That's like the best thing a friend could ever say to me.
Oh, well, and you think even as I said it, I was going, wow, growing up, you would hear people going, just let, just let me be. Hmm. But with a completely different intention and intonation, I'm like, thank you for letting me be. You made me cry. Good thing I have no makeup on. You look so pretty. Oh my gosh.
I don't even... I mean, do I just have a black soul? Like, thank you for letting me be. I think that it's just... Thank you for letting me be, Chandler. I don't know. I think that like... No, your soul is in black. I just think that some people like eat that up. We don't. We don't. No, we just don't. And I just find it to be so silly. I don't know.
The problem is with Megan is that she's just really not our girly. And so we struggle to obsess over her because like we struggle to find where like the similarities lie and like the way that we talk and like the things that we like think about. Yeah. I just find that nothing really arrives at much substance, that it all kind of stays really in the realm of like platitudes and niceties.
And there just can be a lack of like disclosure and substance to what's being said. Totally. And like maybe real vulnerability. But you know what? That conversation might have filled her cup or whatever they say. Yeah.
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