How About Tomorrow?
Dax Is Definitely Not Sponsored By Cloudflare and Adam is Definitely a Real Human Being
Mon, 30 Sep 2024
Hear how Dax got into some trouble this week, Adam wishes he could be less midwestern, being mad at people in your dreams, Cloudflare container like stuff, who gets to DDOS everyone, gaming on PC vs streaming, and how to kill drain flies.Want to carry on the conversation? Join us in Discord. Or send us an email at [email protected] Night by enkiaVisual Studio Code • Dracula ThemeDracula PROThoughts on FlashOpenNextIndex - OpenNextdax on X: “@rauchg @0xblacklight how many times do i have to say “it’s not evil it’s not malicious” this has been in our docs for years, there is literally no sponsorship from cloudflare for opennext this has nothing to do with edge runtime” / XBreaking up with VercelDax’s Sponsored PostConnect EverywhereOptimize server locationGeForce NOW | The Next Generation in Cloud Gaming | NVIDIADiscover Game PassNext-Gen Flight SimulatorReact MiamiTopics:(00:00) - Recording with Adam (00:30) - Why is Dax in so much trouble? (07:42) - Adam wishes he could be less midwest (10:51) - What did Dax do to Vercel? (19:09) - Being mad at people from your dreams (22:12) - Dax was a container boy, Adam said "see you later boy" (29:29) - Who is DDOS'ing? (32:27) - Gaming on PC vs streaming (42:44) - Drain flies and mosquitos update
Uh-oh. I don't hear you. Oh, it's probably me. Oh, my volume is down. Wait, what? You can hear me? Yeah. Okay. But why are you such a jerk? Huh?
I'm in a lot of trouble.
I've gotten in a lot of trouble this week. Are you actually in trouble? Can you actually get in trouble? Is it possible for Dax to be in trouble? And with whom? Is it possible for me to be in? I guess not. Like real trouble. You know what I mean? Not like internet trouble. Oh, no, you've been canceled. You don't care.
I'm just saying, Pete, someone could always just hire a hitman. There's always that possibility. Oh, like real trouble.
Like you're in imminent danger. That's something you actually have to think about. I don't think I have to worry about that. But that's something you could consider. There's a lot of money on the line, Dax. It's true. There is a lot of money on the line. Something like $300 million. Sorry.
yeah well i guess two things so i got in trouble after our episode last week oh right uh where i besmirched the name of a company uh
Yeah, I will say, like, during that rant last week, I do feel like, like, I don't know, I wouldn't put that out there publicly. Like, just the things you're saying, I'm kind of surprised.
Okay, so here's, I thought about this a lot. So anyway, to summarize very quick, I was very rude and very mean. And I hit in some very sensitive spots. Are you apologizing? No, I'm not apologizing. Of course I'm not. Come on. Okay. It's true. I did all of that. And then the clip went to the CEO. The CEO emailed Frank and Jay being like, you know, whatever.
The typical, I'm going to talk to your boss situation. You got fired. I got fired.
Now you're looking for a job.
Uh-huh.
Verso might be hiring. Yeah.
And then I quickly messed that one up too. That's what happened. But here's how we perceive it, right? Let's say Apple does like a keynote. They're doing a new launch to do a keynote. We're all on Twitter online being like, oh, look at that guy. He's so stupid. That guy's a dork. This feature is so dumb. It's literally just that. And that's all I was doing. I was just doing that same thing.
But there's this perception that I have some kind of business tie to it, which is why this person's not going to... The CEO of this company is not going to email some random person
being whatever but because there's like you know i have i have a company and i and it kind of does in the same space it feels like inappropriate and we uh so we got that email and we're like oh you know what would we do if we were on the other side of this like if someone was us like what would be our reaction we kind of thought about like what is like the actual conflict here and here's the problem
So as SST, the company, the product, we actually, especially with V3, we have no opinions. Like whatever you, the user, want to deploy wherever, our role is to help you out. We're not going to be there being like, hey, you should actually use this or like that thing sucks, you should use that. So it's a very neutral position. And that's like how the company is positioned.
But me as an individual, real human person, I have my preferences. I have my opinions. I think some things are great. I think some things are stupid. And I think people have a hard time, understandably have a hard time, like understanding that these can be
two things that are side by side and like they seem conflicting but it's fine i make fun of next.js and think it's the worst thing in the world all the time simultaneously if you come to us trying to play next.js we're gonna bend over backwards to help you right so like yeah it's in conflict but it's fine so i think that's
That creates confusion around interpreting this, but I personally see it as the same way that we'd make fun of any company way outside of our space.
Yeah. I guess you do say a lot of similar things, things in the same vein about lots of people, companies, whatever. And it doesn't really bother me. I think this one was hard for me because I have a connection to this person. Oh, I see. I hate conflict. Like, I hate... I'm a Midwesterner. I want everyone to be happy and glossy and everything is fine.
And the connection is literally I use Dracula and have for years. Like, if he didn't invent Dracula as a theme, I wouldn't have cared. But...
The reality is you're going to have to switch color themes now. I guess so. You're going to have to come over to Tokyo Night. Okay.
Tokyo Night's like the default, isn't it? On like NeoVim or something? I didn't know it was a default.
Like I know I say this about everything. You probably were using it 10 years ago. Yeah, exactly.
Before it was a default.
I know. I saw it. Where did I see it? Was it? That guy, Fatty. Oh. I'm probably butchering his name. Yeah, I think I know who you're talking about. Yeah. He like just built it all, like all the go tooling, tons of stuff. I think he had it like super long ago.
I'm teasing about it being the default, but Dracula is also like super basic, super common.
Everybody uses Dracula. I've seen Dracula for years, for years and years and years. And at some point I was like, I think I like read it wrong. And I was like, oh, it's Darkula. It's a pun.
So there is a Darkula variant, I think. I see. I want to say that is actually a thing, too. I use Dracula Pro now. I'm levels above the normal Dracula users.
I'm all in. There's a paid version.
Slightly different colors, which I'm sure you could just find on the internet and not have to pay for it.
This is crazy. No wonder Resend thinks that they can make money selling anything. That's the last one. That's the last one. Okay. It makes me feel better. I did message him and I was like, the last thing I said to him was, yeah, how are things? Prove me wrong.
I mean, the thing is, I didn't, I don't think I like messaged him in a way that he feels good about necessarily, but I did say, you know, okay, prove me wrong. Like, that's really all we can do.
You have like the opposite personality. I mean, maybe that's why I like talking with you because I just dream of being able to do the things you do. Like I saw the message you sent him and I'm like, wow, what's it feel like to just be like, now what, what do you want? I just can't, I can't imagine being like that.
You know, what's crazy, Adam, that's your perception of it. My perception of it is, man, I need to get to a place where I can like hold back even less and,
Yeah, because ever since the DHH episode, you're like, how can I be more myself?
In reality, if this was like the ideal version of this is Jay got that email and he would reply, WTF, why are you wasting my time with this? And then reply back. Because, and you know why I thought about this? I was like, Frank, send us a screenshot of a Steve Jobs email. Have I seen this? That Steve Jobs Adobe email.
and it was like way like more clever than what i just said but uh it's just clearly like it's so to the point and there's zero fakeness it's just his exact emotion yeah forward whereas you know the rest of us we qualify and say things in a certain way to make the other person not feel too upset even though it's not it's kind of fake to some yeah yeah uh
Yeah, I read the Jobs biography, and I'm probably every other tech bro that was like, yeah. I really appreciate that. I think it's more for me. It's less like, ah, he was a tech tycoon. I just want to emulate him. It's more just I'm from the Midwest, and it's like you... Steve Jobs, people who are just direct and just say what they think and feel. I just wish I could be that so badly.
And I feel like I can't scrub the Midwest off of me, like just 30 something years living here. I just, I can't help but be kind of fake, especially with people I don't know very well. I really wish I could not be. And I think that's the thing I admired like about Steve Jobs, about what I'm seeing in this interaction for you. It just like, It feels very refreshing.
It's so antithetical to how we interact with people in the Midwest. And maybe that's a blanket statement, but I think it's pretty true. I think it's pretty... East Coast, the whole thing you said about what is really kind, being direct and actually saying what you think and feel, that's kinder than pretending to be kind.
Yeah. And what's crazy is I...
still feel all of what you're describing like it's still very difficult for me to be in situations and feel like okay i was like true to myself uh so maybe i could push through maybe there's hope yeah i'm saying even for me it's really hard and i didn't grow up in like an environment that even had any like the midwestern thing you're talking about so yeah it's just it's just hard and there's still a lot done like we are social animals like we're just so you know
And there's some value to it, of course. I don't think Steve Jobs... I wouldn't literally want to be Steve Jobs in every interaction. The other thing that I'm understanding now is I feel like there's also different flavors of this. So... The Midwest one, I feel like it's avoidant. Like, yeah, it's more of a topic change or like not saying anything. Yes.
I think there's a California version of this, which to me is the Midwest one. I can just like, yeah, the Midwest one is just like, to me, it's like quirky and funny. You know, it's like a funny, funny thing. The California one, I find really weird because it, to me, it's extremely passive aggressive, but they think it's,
not transparent like it'll always be like I mean even in this email that we got there's like all these lines in it that are like so clearly like a jab or like making a point but it's like wrapped in this language that's supposed to like you know neutralize it or whatever and to me it's like extremely passive aggressive and very obvious what they're actually trying to say and so it seems like very shady to me but I think people that are from California are like this is us being polite and
Yeah. So I really don't like that one. That one is tough for me. Yeah. No, I'm with you. Receiving end.
I just, I wish, I wish I were born on the East coast and just had that like, F you attitude, but like coming over later. I don't know. So what'd you do to resell? Yeah. I I'm catching up now. There's, there's some, there's some tweets out there.
Yeah, so yesterday we posted about... So Cloudflare's... It's been Cloudflare's birthday week. They've been doing a bunch of releases. One of them was they are now very actively supporting Next.js on workers because the workers Node.js compatibility story has gotten much, much better. Okay. So they have got... They are like, okay, we can say we're actively supporting Next.js
they messaged us a few weeks ago being like, Hey, we have this adapter. It's working. We think it can make a lot of sense to like put it under the open next like bucket umbrella, which I thought was a good idea. The whole point of open next was instead of these fragmented efforts, let's put it all in one place so that there's some cross pollination, uh,
But in the short term, there is actually no cross-pollination. It's just they have their adapter. I did some reworking of our docs so they can put the Cloudflare specific docs in there. And then they publish their adapter to the GitHub repo.
Just to clarify for everyone who's not familiar with this world, Open Next does things with a Next build output. But then still, Next is so complicated to deploy, you still need an adapter On top of that, on top of the Open Next piece, to work on a given platform?
Yeah, so I think the way it's actually structured is the thing that we built was actually the AWS adapter. So it's now being rehoused as OpenXJS slash AWS. And now they have OpenXJS slash Cloudflare. So there's actually no overlap. There's no overlap.
There's one process to turn a Next.js build directory into... into the thing that works on a given platform. I got you. So it's more of like a branding and then like stewardship. You're taking over stewardship of this Cloudflare thing, I'm sure with their support, but putting it under the Open Next banner.
So it's like we manage the AWS one, they manage the Cloudflare one. We have another company that's also gonna be joining in a few weeks. Ooh, can I guess? Or is that like no good?
It's kind of obvious, but... I was going to say there's one thing I can think of and I just want to say it out loud, but I'm not going to.
I'm just going to say it. So we have another one coming. So we announced it yesterday. The response was crazy. Like my post has like 2,000 likes.
wow that's like lambo video like yeah counts it's wild like people were really excited because there is a lot of pent-up demand to like try out cloudflare and a lot of people use next year so everyone was really really excited unfortunately someone tagged guillermo in the replies being like what's your position on this i of course reply with a joke being like i'm assuming their position is we wish them the best of luck but unintelligible jargon like i just put that in there
I didn't see that one.
And then we got an essay from top G. Okay. Just saying a bunch of stuff and an intelligible dragon. Yeah. It was just like really defensive.
That's not, that's not common for a defensive top G reply to one of your tweets, right? Yeah.
normally ignoring usually smart enough to ignore yeah yeah in it he implied some things that I was like I like didn't really take too seriously because I don't know if it was just like in the heat of the moment but he implied like He says the phrase was something like Cloudflare wants to be in this large argument, but basically saying Cloudflare wants to be your host effectively.
And they're spending millions of dollars in marketing to do this, including sponsoring DAX or like partnering with DAX. And I was like, OK, he probably just means that like. they're spending money on marketing and separately, they're just partnering with us. And it was a bunch of back and forth in there. I like made my usual jabs.
And I made another post later that was definitely exceptionally annoying. Then today, the thing that I... The only thing that bothers me about his replies was when he describes this as like a made up problem. He said that we open next is like a made up thing for engagement. Like we work on this thing to get like we say that next year is hard to deploy for engagement and likes.
I don't like that because I know the people that work on the project and they like they work very hard and they really like next year. Yes. But that makes me feel bad. And that's the one thing I have an issue with. So this morning I posted a screenshot from our open next doc saying, just showing like, Oh, look at this thing that they documented.
You know, it's about this pretty complicated thing that can break when you try to self host next and how they like work through it and figure it out. And it's, you know, it's interesting to see that this is a tedious work that they do. I was like, it's not made up. It's like, this is like a real thing. Like this, these are real problems. Uh, we're not doing this for likes. These are,
The two people that work on it, we actually don't know who they are. They are GitHub, no profile picture, work super hard on this thing, amazing, that whole situation. Anyway, that point, and again, someone tagged him, Guillermo, being like, is this true? Which is a weird question. It's just like, what do you mean, is this true? Like, you think we like made up this post and we just wrote this?
And he replies being like, it's not true. this is probably just a problem with Cloudflare. I had to think of Cloudflare. He was like, it's probably just a problem with Cloudflare, like comma, Dax's new sponsors. I saw this, yeah. Yeah, and I'm just like, okay, so you are definitely suggesting that Cloudflare is paying me to now say bad things about you guys. And I was probably being like,
uh no there's they're not sponsoring open next this is like not a thing that's happening yeah so it's nothing to do with lambda this issue is like over a year old also the person that wrote these docs didn't even know about this partner this like partnership happening until like a week ago and i was like Are you really the person to be like throwing out sponsorship accusations right now?
Like, I know you just kicked the oats to the curb. So now you can say you don't have sponsors, but like we all remember. And guess what? There's a really great video on YouTube about how frustrating it is when someone says, oh, but you're sponsored as a criticism made by the person that you were formerly sponsoring. Yeah. I don't know.
I honestly was thinking about messaging being like, can we just do a truce? Like I, at the end of the day, the only conflict here is that I don't really think this stuff is a big deal. And you think next JS and front end is like the biggest thing ever. I, I honestly just want to like, I have this one more announcement I need to do because a new company is going to join up next as well.
I'll just never talk about you guys again. I'm happy to do that because it's just going to a stupid place.
That sounds nice, actually. I think about it on the podcast. Just how much... Yeah, I know. I mean, it's mostly making fun of... I think we're just kind of both like... We don't like a lot of things that that particular company stands for. It's just like... all the money raised, the front end being this big deal. There's just a lot about that space that's really annoying to me.
So I just, it's very easy to make fun of. But yeah, I would love if we talked about it less. It's just, it is hard. Like the nature of what you guys work on, it just comes up.
Yeah. And alternate...
reaction by Vercel this would have been my reaction right if I'm Vercel I am the best place to deploy Next.js there's really no threat of that that's how I really felt I would have saw this and been like this is awesome these idiots are building adapters for us for free we can now say Next.js has no vendor lock-in look there's like yeah all this support for it and we don't have to do any work and we can like completely dodge that criticism awesome
That's a good point.
Why not?
Yeah. People are still going to, by and large, choose Vercel. The people they're converting are trying to convert. Yeah.
And including me, I keep telling people, if you're going to use this next year, just use Vercel. Again, one of my personal opinions is that.
Well, now I've been perusing your Twitter and I just have so many questions because I'm not... I'm not seeing these live. One first, not a question, an observation. Liz, waking up and being mad at you. Casey gets mad at me about Dream Adam all the time. I do stuff in her dreams and I'm like, it wasn't me. You realize I didn't do that, right? Yeah. But what if you did? I didn't.
I literally didn't.
To be fair, I am no better. What do you mean? You have dreams. Sometimes I have a dream about dream ways and I wake up with the emotions and I know they're stupid and don't make sense. But I'm like, the reality is I feel mad at you right now. And that's just because I feel like this thing happened to me. It's going to take me a couple of minutes for it to dissipate.
yeah it's funny she she like it was funny i was on my phone again dealing with this stupid thing uh and i like look over and i see her open her eyes and she gives me like the nastiest look and she goes i'm mad at you and then she rolls over and she goes and so i was like because of a dream which is like yeah but i'm not ready to talk about it And then she goes back to sleep.
And then she wakes up again. And she's like, okay, I forgive you. And she wakes up again. And she's like, you did it again.
Stop waking up and going back to sleep.
And I was like, I still don't know what I did.
I've never had a negative dream about Casey. I'm like a puppy, I guess. I've never had a dream where Casey did something bad. I don't know. I'm just naive.
You've never had a negative dream, period? Or you've never had a negative dream?
I've never had a dream where I was mad at Casey because of something she did in my dream. She's never done anything in my dreams that was something I'd be mad about, I guess. That's funny. I don't have a lot of dreams. Do you ever think people are either like puppies or kittens? Like people are either cats or dogs. Like I'm more of a dog. I'm kind of like, like I'm just happy about everything.
Like play with me in case he's more of like a cat. She's a deep thinker. Like she can hold grudges. She can like, yeah, just, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I feel like you're all cats. It's hard for me to, I get what you're saying, but in my head, all dogs are boys and all cats are girls. Oh, interesting. Also, I have two cats that are literally girls and a dog that's a boy. So in my head, I'm just like, every single cat in the world is a girl and every single dog in the world is a boy. That's funny. It's hard for me to see past that. Okay.
That's fair.
Okay. More tweets. Cause we're not, we're going to run out of time. Uh, there's so many, so many questions. Uh, but this one's a quick one. What was your sponsor tweet today? Again? PP poopoo. What is this?
Oh, well, after, after that accusation that Cloudflare was sponsoring me, Sunil messaged me. I'll give you a dollar. If you tweet what I say, and he goes, PP poopoo. And I was like, all right, sold.
He said, he'll give me a dollar. That's too funny.
This would be the first sponsorship deal that I ever get.
So look at that. And then his tweet calling you a sellout. I love it. Okay. That was fun. I'm glad I asked. Let's see. What's going to disrupt the whole industry? You quote tweeted, Sunil.
Oh, yes.
I'm so excited that we can finally talk about this. You're so obsessed with containers lately. What happened to you? This container guy. Sorry, continue.
Just opened up a whole new world.
Do you just have Docker running on your Mac all the time now?
I don't use a Mac.
Like some kind of animal?
You do too. I use my Mac to connect to my Linux machine, which does have Docker running all the time.
All the time. I hear it's better on Linux. Sorry, I'm derailing.
There's no VM. Running all the time means nothing. It's like not doing anything.
Yeah, on Mac, it means something.
Yeah, I've heard.
I'm not smart enough to know what, but it means my machine is crippled, and so I don't run Docker. Continue, container boy.
So Cloudflare, they haven't launched it yet, but they have had an internal containers platform for a while. It's getting to the point where it can soon be a publicly available containers platform. And this is really exciting because the reality is the majority of the industry still uses stateful deployments. I love serverless, love all the cool things we can do with it. But it's an uphill battle.
When that's a thing you're showing people, only one in X number are going to be like, cool, I want to learn more about that. Whereas containers, you're just... selling into an existing habit. So they are launching a containers platform. Why this is really exciting for me is it's going to be one of those really modern container offerings where it's just like, Boots up really quickly.
Potentially it like scales to zero. You know, like literally I can spin up another one in 300 milliseconds. Like kind of like fly. Distribute it all around the world. Every single one of their, I think it's like 130. So I'm like over 100 data centers. So fly, but with Cloudflare's network. Yeah, Cloudflare's network and Cloudflare's
like they are at massive scale, which means pricing will be decent. Reliability will be decent. Uh, I think right now, if you want that kind of offering, you are looking at like newer companies, uh, or like middleman companies that are wrapping other clouds. So I think it's just going to be really disruptive and combining clouds plus workers, plus durable objects. Sorry. What is it?
Combining containers, plus durable objects, plus workers. Uh, it's, uh, It's going to be a really crazy combo. It makes it feel like a much more complete platform where you can be like, I can run literally anything on here. Uh, yeah. Like I imagine like an elixir distributed cluster.
That's like all around the world forming a single cluster, which you probably don't want to do because if there's other reasons you don't want to do that, but like, again, it, it, it,
It's just a tool that we haven't really had. All kinds of new possibilities. Yeah. Yeah. So you've been an investor in Cloudflare for a long time. Am I too late to invest in Cloudflare? Did I miss? No, dude. Are they still in the early, early, like in terms of the stock? Sorry.
It's just so hard to tell, right? Yeah. So here's what the stock did. It went way too high.
like way way way way too high during the pandemic like probably one of the stocks that was affected the most and it is now like a third of where nice okay but okay the problem is where it is now could be the correct value so i don't know if you necessarily have an edge in investing right it's not yeah but like there's still a lot of growth ahead of this company like this is a i think so company at the beginning stages of really disrupting
But you call them a hyperscaler. They're already considered... I don't know where they fit. If you take, let's say, Google, Azure, and AWS in one little bucket, I don't know if any other companies belong in that bucket, Oracle or something, I don't know. But if you take those big, big ones... And then you take the Flies and the Rinder and whatever, all those other littler companies.
Where does Cloudflare sit? If 10 is the AWS and then one is the little companies, is it closer to the big ones or closer to the little ones?
It's definitely closer to the big ones. The thing with AWS is they have so many customers, so they're running so many workloads beyond their own. Cloudflare's platform is newer. So most of their usage is their own, like their own usage of it. Okay. So like physically, like they have the infrastructure. Could you explain that? Cloudflare's, most of Cloudflare usage is Cloudflare?
Like, so they basically decided, okay, we're going to build a platform. We're not just like a DDoS company. We're going to build a cloud platform. Building a platform takes a long time. Like I think they're on like year eight or nine, I think. I would generally say it takes 10 years, right? Yeah. So they're close to saying, okay, we have a real platform.
And by building a platform, you mean like data centers, the whole... No, no, no.
Not that. You mean software platform. I'm talking about like a user-facing offering that you can go and spin up products on. But their core business already involved data centers, servers all around the world. They have done... A lot of things that AWS hasn't. But at the end of the day, in terms of public workloads, AWS has so many, so no one can really compare to them.
But they're definitely in the category of... Well, one, they're a public company. They're just on a different level compared to these other things in terms of resources. And they are at a crazy scale, which is why their offering can be so cheap. Whereas I would say these other options, like Fly... It's cool because they built their own stuff from day one. It just wraps GCP.
Railway also had wrapped GCP. They just announced they're offering their first bare metal stuff. It's in beta now. They announced that two weeks ago. Got it. So again, just like a different category.
I would say Cloudflare is way more on the... Well, yeah. I should have realized like public company. That's a tell. Like obviously they're... a large company in that case. Yeah. And they need to absorb DDoS traffic, you know? Yeah. And that's when you say their core business, that's where they started, right? Just the, like the security at the edge kind of thing. That was their main business.
And then they turned, they turned that into this whole cloud platform.
Yeah. So they for themselves had to build servers all around the world and make it super programmable so that their engineers can like make configure where the traffic goes and add custom logic. And that's where this whole serverless Cloudflare offering we see comes out of. That's what I mean by their usage is their own.
Yeah, and they're better at that stuff than AWS. There's not great options on the AWS side. I mean, there are options, and I guess the cost...
at large scale isn't that crazy but cloudflare if you're like a startup like their their options are just better it's wild how it's such an interesting business because they bet a long time ago that ddos is going to continue to be a problem And you fast forward, it's just like an infinitely growing problem because as time goes on, there's just more devices that are turned on in the world.
The older they get, the more vulnerabilities they have. And so there's more and more devices available to like do a DDoS. So it's just like this infinitely growing problem. It's like cheaper and cheaper and cheaper to do a DDoS. So they're just like, you like, it's getting to the point where like you have to put something like that in front of whatever you have exposed publicly.
That's why they see that and they see like 30% of that traffic or something crazy.
Yeah. Who are the people doing DDoS and like why? I don't know. Some of them seem so random. Like if I have a public endpoint up that's not affiliated with anything big and it starts getting DDoS, it's like, why?
Who and why? I was working on something the other day on my server, and it involved exposing a port externally. And very quickly, just a bunch of requests, just testing for random PHP vulnerabilities, right?
uh-huh like we have dev and staging environments that are not like publicly crawlable or like discoverable in any way and it's amazing if you just look at logs just for any internet property anything publicly facing just the amount of noise on the internet the amount of requests from like random i guess there's like wordpress exploits and all these weird things that all these bots are just peppering the internet with it reminds me of like
It makes me think of all the radiation just flying around in space. It just feels like this crazy amount of noise that if you tap in, you just say, I'm available on the internet. Boom, you just start getting peppered with all that stuff.
It's crazy. It's really wild. It comes from China. Almost all of it is coming from China. I don't think I can say who, but someone was telling me about how their company had a two terabyte per second DDoS system.
back in like 2019 or 2020 oh my word that's insane uh it was from the chinese government and it's just normal the chinese government literally just blasts companies and products that you know and use with two terabytes a second of uh of traffic that's crazy and it's like Are they just having fun? Because that one is just... Maybe they're testing capabilities for disrupting stuff.
Oh, yeah. It's like doing a missile launch. Yeah, exactly. It was like a test launch. Okay, we can do that. Now we know if we need to take down a government. Yeah. Two terabytes a second, no problem. We got it.
In that case, Akamai, I think, was the DDoS protection person and they handled it.
Yeah. I mean, if I just start thinking about some of this stuff very long, it just kind of blows my mind, like what we have accomplished as humans. You just start thinking about all the underwater cables, what the internet physically is, and then like... all the software layers upon layers upon layers that have gotten us this point and all the possibilities.
Like we start talking about these weird, obscure things people do that I would never do. It's just like, there's whole worlds that exist digitally and physically that I just don't know anything about. And I'm a technologist. Like I feel like I'm more plugged in than the average person by a lot. And it just kind of boggles the mind. Us humans, we're pretty clever.
Yeah, I had this experience recently because, I don't know if you, you probably didn't see, but I have been exploring video game streaming. Not like streaming video games I play, but like- Like Stadia? Like the Google thing they did? Yes, but like the NVIDIA equivalent.
Like Pixel, what is that called? Pixel streaming? I think that's what it's called.
Oh yeah, that's what it's called. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So again, the idea is, so NVIDIA obviously has their own GPUs. This is actually super cool because like obviously- Do they? They make GPUs?
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.
Well, it's cool because they can build this service where like it's running the GPU in the cloud and like sending you the video. They can do it for so cheap because the GPUs are a cost for them. Yeah. But I was like, I tried it out in the past and I was like, OK, but I saw a post being like, what the hell? This stuff is really good now. And I went and tried it.
it is incredible it literally feels like really i have a good gpu locally so i can compare plug-in like turn on my tv plug in like just the cheapest device right that like just streams video connect my controller for yeah it just looks amazing the gpu is better than the one i have here and it's like basically no latency very little just like occasionally you'll get some stutter
And I was like, this is wild that I remember using this before. And now we can literally stream like the craziest 4k detail thing here. It's probably related to like, I'm sure Netflix, just like that whole era of like making that all work. I'm sure like, yeah, that just further technology. Yeah. And the video compression and all of that.
So then I was like, okay, there's some games that, you know, that aren't in that library that I want to play. Let me try the open source version of this. So I installed something on my computer and again, it works flawlessly.
like i can be in any room on my macbook just like pop it open liz's like sitting next to me reading a book i can just play a game and then streaming from my computer and it's all over wi-fi my house is not wired i mean my desktop is wired yeah but my laptop is not wired my my tv device is not wired it's just all over this mesh yeah hero thing that i have
and it works perfectly so when you say you're looking at is it go beyond just like you're just playing games over it like you're looking into it from like an infrastructure sample or what were you saying at the beginning or you're just just using just personally yeah because i'm like i've always been someone because i like gaming i do less and less of it every year but i still like it uh so i've always had this custom built pc and i run linux yeah
yeah and i'm like this is such a hassle to like keep this gpu upgrade it's expensive it's annoying because like yeah gpu's upgrade with other parts of your computer upgrades this whole thing and i'm just past the point in my life where i'm doing it enough where that's worth it but i i love quality so i don't want to give the quality yeah you don't have to
I'm realizing I'm confused about how this works. It's not in the browser. There's like an app you run.
It can be in the browser.
It's like a generic shell. Oh, it can be in the browser.
Yeah.
But how do you, how do you use it? You run some kind of client app and then any game can be played through it.
Oh no. Yeah. So I don't know anything about electronics. That's bad. I'm saying it's just a browser. It's on the day. It's all browser tech. Oh, okay. I think the, the reason I use the app is because, uh, I think they limit Chrome to 1080p. There's some thing that's a little bit... They can't fully control a bitrate or something.
So there's a platform that you're using for this, I guess? It's an NVIDIA thing?
So the one I tried is NVIDIA GeForce Now. I think it's GeForce Now. It's $20 a month for the highest tier. It gets you the nicest GPU. $20 a month is... That's like nothing.
I mean, how many months before you'd buy that GPU at $20 a month? Four years. And there'll be crazier GPUs by then and crazier games, I'm sure.
And I'm sure if you're someone that buys at the right time, sells it at the right time, upgrades at the right time, you're going to beat this, of course. Of course, and if you don't have good internet or your internet's spotty, you're not going to be able to play, but all those trade-offs, whatever, it's such a good deal. That's crazy.
Yeah, that's the case where, like, a month's subscription is good. You still have to buy the game. There's lots of things. Oh, okay. So, like, a one-time fee for the game?
Yeah, but the thing is, so there's... So, GeForce Now is just a platform to do this, but then there's other game subscription services, like Microsoft has, like, a monthly $10 a month or whatever, and you get, like, a whole catalog. Mm-hmm. So I just like went and the other cool thing is no downloads. I was like, let me just sign this Microsoft thing.
And I just tried out like 20 different games in like one day. That's crazy. That's like something you can't do, right?
Yeah. So this is the big like change. I remember as a kid, playing like Super Nintendo and my parents being like, this is crazy. How did they come up with this? Yeah. And like, it was just so beyond anything they could imagine. This is the kind of form of gaming that's coming along that's going to blow us away. Like the things our kids could do that we couldn't do.
We had to buy cartridges and we had to download games and we had to whatever, buy CD-ROMs. And now they can just stream from the cloud.
Stream it. You don't have to download. They don't have to have a powerful machine. Which already felt kind of crazy that you don't have to go to the store. You can just like...
download a game that's crazy download it it's uh it's wild have you seen the microsoft flight simulator 2024 no okay so microsoft flight simulator 2020 was already pretty incredible because it had the whole earth you can literally get in a plane and fly to the whole earth And it was a bunch of AI involved.
They just took a lot of data, automatically generated stuff, hand-tweaked more popular places. And it's all one-to-one. So if I took a plane from my local airport and flew it to New York, it would take three hours in the game for me to do. Really? And in 2024...
is like even crazier like the detail is upped and they do such cool stuff like you're gonna love this okay so they take in in just real time ship data on all the ships in the world you mean like planes are they called ships no no no ships in the ocean what and then they just put them in the game at the exact position they're in so if you're flying over the ocean you look down it's the exact same thing you see
And they're also ingesting animals.
In real time? In real time. The real ships are being tracked anyway, and they have all that data, and they put the real ships in the ocean at the real spots. That's insane. In the right kind of ship.
Yep. I think they're working on carriers, so you can land on aircraft carriers and stuff. Oh, my word. That's not it. Then they're also ingesting wildlife data of where animals are. And you can literally land a plane anywhere. Not individual animals. By population.
This is getting too far. What are they building over there?
Pigeon number 3043 is right here. But it's an earth simulation, right? But it's generally where they are. So you can land in the savanna and you can get out of the plane and walk around and you'll see... Like giraffes and stuff.
You can get out of the plane on Flight Simulator?
Yeah. They're taking it really far where it's like, yeah, it's a flight sim, but it's becoming an Earth sim.
This is wild. I feel like governments are going to use this to simulate diseases and I don't know, something.
And maybe it has a project called Earth 2. And they're doing like a digital Earth.
Huh. They should really collaborate like Open Next. Maybe this should be under the Open Next banner. I don't know.
It got posted on Hacker News and people were like, oh man, it would be cool if they just released this so we can all just build other cool stuff on it. And I've always had this feeling like some games make really, really cool environments, but it's just used for a single game. I would love to take this world and use it for a different thing.
Anyway, they have this career mode where you can play as... like a, like a medical rescue helicopter or like a fire, like firefighting helicopter, all this stuff. Um, and I'm like, this is really cool. And it can be rendered in the cloud and stream to you. Oh, and plate.
Oh, okay. Yeah. So that franchise has always been well regarded, right? It's very crazy accurate. Who is behind that? Was it just some former pilots that got hired by Microsoft and have this passion for this? It's the kind of thing where it feels like there's so much energy and something invested into something. There has to be reasons that they care so much about making this so good.
Or is it just that people like it and they buy it?
It's so technical too, right? It's just like a technical, to build like a simulator, it's very technical engineering oriented. Yeah.
Like all the different aircraft cockpits and stuff. Like I've seen the screenshots. It's like, they've really like, they've got all the planes and all the details about the plane. It's just crazy. Yeah.
And so you have to know how to build that simulation and you have to understand the physics of air and how the wind's affected so you can implement it in the game. Oh, sure. It's really, really talented, incredible people that work on it.
Can pilots use this to learn things? I mean, I feel like, do they, I guess? It feels like so much effort put into something for just like...
nerds to play on the weekend no i think it's more to it i think it's using like light training stuff yeah um you know my brother's a pilot have i talked about that yeah that's so crazy like it's just to me it's just that's so outside the range of a normal life yeah just fly around every day
Yeah, like, he's constantly in Atlanta. He's based out of Atlanta, but he lives here near me. Like, they just commute. They just hop on a plane in the morning and fly to the airport.
Their whole job is a commute. There's no, like, I commuted and arrived. The commute is a job.
But they have, like, they can just, like, get on a plane to go to the place where they're actually supposed to fly from. It's like... Oh, yeah.
it's a hour and a half flight to atlanta from here so he just has like an hour and a half commute but not a normal commute we're talking like eight hour drive commute i guess there's people that like commute to san francisco from la like rich people that have jobs in silicon valley it's like in our head it's a one and a half hour commute a lot of people have a one and a half hour commute
And it's technically the same thing. He probably perceives it in the same way. But for us, we're like, you are literally going to like another place. Like, how is this happening?
Yeah. And like twice a week. It's like, it's crazy. pilots, like truck drivers, but classier, much classier. Sorry, brother.
You're going to get an email from the truck driving CEO for this one.
I want to say something here that reminded me to our listeners. It's because sometimes I forget we have listeners and we're not just hanging out. I get a lot of emails or messages after every episode. It's funny, this last one, the number of people that reached out being like, oh yeah, React Native sucks for that. Here's the thing you should use. And I'm already forgetting.
I think it was Capacitor was the consensus. It's just crazy. It's kind of fun to have a podcast where you can just publicly complain about something and then everyone's like, here's answers. Here you go, solutions. Thank you to all of you listeners that offer up information. I don't always reply, not like I'm snooty. It's just like... Uh, you can ask Dax. I don't always reply to stuff.
I should reply to work related, uh, terminal things. Uh, just sometimes I get busy and I just ignore DMs. That's the first thing to go for me. DMs. It's the first thing I just kind of like wholesale or just communications in general. Like when I'm busy, I got like programming stuff in my brain. I just, I stopped communicating. Sorry.
You know what the, is an example of this, like being able to get help. And so it's a weird superpower to have. I had, I don't know if you saw this, but I had like, this was a few months ago, I had these like flies in my sink. Like they kept, kept like killing them, but they just kept coming out of like our sink.
Out of your sink? Like out of the drain?
Yeah, out of the drain. And it's a very like common thing apparently, but I'd never had that before.
Really?
And I was like, what? They're really tiny. They're super, super small. And I was like, what the hell? Like, what should we do? We're looking up online, like pour water, hot water down, do this and that. We tried it all. It just, everything just kept coming back.
And then I posted about it and someone was like, oh yeah, before I was in, before I was a software engineer, I was like a food safety, like his job was to like design how kitchens like stayed clean. And he was like, here's a link to this thing. And it was like some weird phone that he linked me to.
and then I just took I got it I ordered it and I sprayed it down the down the sink and I was like I don't think I did this right because like some part of it was messed up Next day, completely gone. Really? I don't think I would have ever solved this problem. I think I would have moved out of my house. I think that's what would have happened otherwise. I just immediately fixed it.
And I don't think I would have found it otherwise.
I know you didn't intend probably to delve into the details of this, but I'm going to. Because I just have curiosities. They were coming up from the plumbing department. Out of the drain? Yeah, they're called drain flies. Yeah, yeah. So they're like... Next question is, isn't there like a bend in the pipes that like keeps water at all times? Like how did the flies get through the little bend?
No, the bend is what makes it possible, I think. Oh. Because the bend allows for... I forgot, it's like a name of... There's like a name of that...
piece of the pipe i forgot what it is but i think it leaves like a pocket of air or something so when you run water through there's like technically an area that uh that stays second yeah so i think you'll like get you'll get a bunch of them but eventually they'll like there'll be this area that's just not being hit with water okay interesting yeah but and this here's the craziest part i was looking this up online and i was like and people were saying that
yeah oftentimes if you like make it a problem for them they'll move to another drain in your house like through the pipes people are like yeah we got rid of them here but then they popped up over there yeah huh like whack-a-mole you're right that there is this bend and i don't really understand where i thought that kept like water in between i mean we have a garbage disposal it's possible they're like somewhere they were somewhere in the garbage disposal it's hard to hard to tell yeah
But yeah, drain flies. It's a thing. Drain flies. Just learned something new today. Yeah. How are the mosquitoes doing since Mosquito Joe did his thing there? If I want to come to Miami soon.
A lot better. They're a lot better. It's just not 100% effective. It's way better than it used to be. Yeah. And if... The good news is if I'm like in the morning, if I spend five minutes killing them with the, we got a new electric racket and this was way better. Oh, it's so good. Yeah. It's got multiple. The one that you use had a single layer of electricity.
This has like three layers of electricity. So basically impossible to go through. You can't miss. You can't miss. And it's this really nice pop, which, you know, you experienced. I love the pop. In the morning, if I spend five minutes just getting, there's like these usual locations where they are. If I can spend five minutes getting them, it's like pretty good for the day. They're gone. Yeah.
Yeah.
I did not experience that. We did not ever have a day where it was like, we're good today.
You just got to wear mosquito repellent the next time. We're so stupid for not thinking of that. I was so stupid for not thinking of that. All of us. I didn't even think about that either. Next time.
When is next time? I guess they're talking about React Miami already. Yeah. Are they selling tickets already? Is it that soon? Or do they do it that early?
Yes, there's some tickets and they're selling a lot, way more than they did previous year. Nice.
Did you just get distracted? I feel like I got distracted and you got distracted. A little bit, yeah. We both just got distracted. Maybe it's the same thing. What did you get distracted by?
No, I was looking at the clock.
Oh, just looking at the clock. That bored, huh?
No, I have to go in a minute for a meeting that might not even happen. Oh, yeah, yeah. We can get off here.
Next week, special guest. So exciting. We'll keep that as a teaser.
Yeah, we're going to have someone on next week.
This episode, as always, is brought to you by Terminal Coffee. You can buy your coffee from the terminal. SSH, terminal.shop. Let's take a break.
Also, it's not just sponsored by Terminal. According to Verso, it's also sponsored by Cloudflare.
Oh, yeah. We might as well give them credit since people think that they're sponsoring. They're not. Believe it. There's no money flowing from Cloudflare to any of us. Well, I think.
I don't actually know. Probably not. There is not. Okay.
Well, enjoy your meeting.
Okay.
This meeting can end a little early so you can get on your other meeting. Yeah. Okay. See ya.