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Blood Vines

Murder Was the Case: 4

Tue, 13 May 2025

Description

What had been a straightforward fraud investigation takes a bloody turn. The investigators’ most important witness has been shot in the head…just a few days before he was supposed to testify in the grape fraud case. The timing doesn’t seem like a coincidence—but who did it?Listen to Blood Vines on the Wondery app or wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can listen to all episodes ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Start your free trial today by visiting www.wondery.com/links/blood-vines.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Audio
Transcription

Chapter 1: What happened previously on Blood Vines?

0.149 - 1.832 Chris Walker

Previously on Blood Vines.

0

2.653 - 10.664 Investigator

So the word was out that we were investigating this fraud involving Corvette Company. And he basically said, come talk to me.

0

11.085 - 16.373 Robert Licciardi

He was really hurting because of what his one son did. He was cutting Michael out of the business.

0

17.105 - 31.762 Norma Licciardi

The paramedics were there when we walked in. His dad was laying on the couch. He looked like he was asleep. And then it's when I went into the kitchen, pulled Michael aside, and I told him that his dad had a bullet hole behind the ear.

0

33.812 - 57.022 Chris Walker

Upon examining her father-in-law's body, Norma Licciardi, Michael's wife, had just discovered a terrible truth. Jack had been shot, and she was standing in the middle of a crime scene. Suddenly, everything about the room seemed significant. And police officers, who'd recently arrived at the home, realized that too. They ushered the family members out of the living room to preserve evidence.

Chapter 2: Who discovered Jack Licciardi's body?

57.682 - 84.604 Chris Walker

But Norma's mind spun over what she'd seen. Suicide was an impossibility. Jack could barely hold a fork due to his muscular dystrophy. And no gun had been found at the scene, only an empty .22 caliber cartridge. Plus, there was a newspaper spread out on his chest and... Who sleeps like that, with a cigar in their hands? The body looked as though it had been staged.

0

85.164 - 104.975 Chris Walker

Not to mention the fact that the bullet hole had been cleverly concealed in Jack's hairline and there was suspiciously little blood. Had someone cleaned up the crime scene to make it look like Jack had died of natural causes? Norma was, understandably, spooked, and she wasn't the only one. When she broke the news of the murder to Annette, Robert's second wife,

0

105.894 - 111.078 Norma Licciardi

I don't know what she was thinking, but all I could see was fear on her face.

0

111.918 - 112.639 Chris Walker

As for Robert?

0

113.319 - 115.101 Robert Licciardi

I was at the time, I was paranoid.

Chapter 3: What evidence suggests Jack's death was a murder?

116.021 - 132.111 Chris Walker

he'd been the first to discover the body and possibly the last to see Jack alive. But when the Stockton police questioned him, Robert said he hadn't noticed anything unusual between the time he'd helped his father get ready for bed around midnight and when he'd found him dead around 10.30 a.m.

0

132.811 - 142.998 Chris Walker

And Jack's wife, Mary, wasn't of much help either since her Alzheimer's was so advanced that she was unable to even talk to the officers. So the question hung in the room.

0

143.018 - 145.119 Robert Licciardi

You know, who do you trust?

0

145.748 - 167.321 Chris Walker

And indeed, who could anyone trust? Because there was another aspect of the murder that no one could ignore, the timing. Jack had just agreed to testify in the grape fraud case and was in the process of scheduling his deposition. You may remember from episode one that when news of his death got out, the lead investigators on the case were shocked.

0

167.822 - 178.515 Investigator

I was sitting in my family room watching the evening news and a spot came on about a murder. I mean, obviously, we were all speculating what happened.

178.995 - 182.72 Chris Walker

Rumors swirled among the various criminal justice agencies.

183.441 - 195.775 Investigator

As you might recall, Steve Lapham saying, I don't know where we heard this, but he was murdered with a .22 caliber bullet to the head, which is a very mafia-type way of doing it.

196.095 - 211.84 Chris Walker

The idea seemed straight out of a Scorsese film. But the feds weren't the only ones to consider an organized crime angle. Mark Urban, the state prosecutor who was scheduling Jack's deposition, didn't want me to record my phone call with him. But he did email me this recollection.

212.38 - 232.272 Chris Walker

Quote, there were some rumors floating around that Jack Licciardi and some of the people involved in the fraud had organized crime connections. Unquote. Maybe this was just stereotyping, all these Italian families and the wine business. But then again, Urban knew that a homicide of this nature would start as a local police matter.

Chapter 4: How did investigators link Jack's murder to the grape fraud case?

254.56 - 272.352 Chris Walker

And while no one knew exactly what Jack had planned to say, the question hung like a dark cloud. Perhaps someone, or someones, wanted to protect themselves from Jack's testimony. I'm Chris Walker, your guide in this series about the largest grape fraud in U.S.

0

272.372 - 308.989 Chris Walker

history, the powerful family at the center of it, and how a stunning sequence of betrayals triggered the fall of a California dynasty and forever changed the way we make wine in America. From Fox Office Inc., this is Blood Vines. When local newspapers and television stations first reported Jack Licciardi's murder, some noted that he'd been involved in the wine business. But only in passing.

0

309.45 - 333.211 Chris Walker

Given Jack's role as a behind-the-scenes dealmaker, the press didn't capture his importance to the wine industry. There was no broadsheet eulogy for California's godfather of grapes. But that also meant that reporters missed a more important concern— his proximity to the grape fraud, because that was getting plenty of press. The Washington Post was even calling it the Great Grape Scandal.

0

333.852 - 355.729 Chris Walker

By the time of Jack's death in 1991, it had become clear that the practice of grape mislabeling extended far beyond Michael and the Bavaros. Investigators had discovered new criminal rings, wineries and growers operating separately from the players in our story, but up to the same shenanigans. This included a medium-sized winery in the San Joaquin Valley run by Angelo Papagni.

0

356.269 - 368.139 Chris Walker

And prosecutors hinted at even more indictments coming down the pipeline, indictments naming big players and threatening stiff penalties. For instance, the Bavaros, they were facing up to 130 years in prison and a $6 million fine.

371.221 - 394.728 Chris Walker

Investigators found evidence that they'd scammed not just Delicato Vineyards, but Charles Krug, Robert Mondavi, and Sebastiani Vineyards, all with fraudulent grape deliveries. And then there was Michael. He also faced decades under lockup and a seven-figure fine. And that was just on the federal level. If the cases went its way, the state of California had designs to collect millions in penalties.

395.409 - 415.96 Chris Walker

The lawmen had thrown down the gauntlet. As the Washington Post quipped, We doubt even the French would go that far. So the question was, how far would people go to avoid that kind of punishment? You already know that Michael and the Bavaros initially tried to lie their way out of trouble. But would one of them have gone further? Like, say, killing a witness?

418.559 - 439.655 Chris Walker

Even though the press missed the significance of Jack's role within the wine world, industry insiders fretted. Who had the gall to take out the state's best-connected grape broker? Some business associates of Jack's ran scared because back then, California's wine industry was incredibly tight-knit, and it was possible someone within those close circles was responsible.

440.476 - 465.984 Chris Walker

Even today, some remain skittish on the topic. One grape broker I exchanged emails with seemed game to talk about the past. But as soon as I mentioned Jack Licciardi, I got this response, quote, I like my quiet life and I want to keep it that way, unquote. I couldn't get that person to write me again. In a similar aura of mistrust, so antithetical to what Jack stood for, tempered his funeral.

Chapter 5: What were the family dynamics at Jack's funeral?

591.334 - 610.194 Chris Walker

It seems a lot of the mourners scrutinized the Luchardi family's behavior. And it was hard not to, with all the unanswered questions about Jack's murder. The whole atmosphere reeked of suspicion. Even Robert's mother-in-law felt ill at ease, especially when, right after Jack's funeral, she started getting strange phone calls.

0

611.215 - 612.417 Robert's Mother-in-Law

Seven o'clock every night.

0

618.772 - 620.693 Chris Walker

Just heavy breathing on the other end of the line?

0

620.773 - 626.714 Robert's Mother-in-Law

Yeah, so you knew somebody was there. And I just hang up. But it was every night at 7 o'clock.

0

628.355 - 631.296 Chris Walker

She didn't know who was calling her, but she had some suspicions.

632.116 - 641.159 Robert's Mother-in-Law

We all felt that the family, being the mafia, were covering up something big.

642.159 - 645.36 Chris Walker

The family being the mafia? I asked her what she meant by that.

646.365 - 669.806 Robert's Mother-in-Law

I remember one time Robert told me, he says, well, I'm going to be okay because my dad always told me that the family in New York would take care of me. And in New York, they were Le Chardos with an O, where here they had changed it to an I, but they were all family and they were all mafia.

671.383 - 687.133 Chris Walker

Robert's mother-in-law didn't actually know if the story was true, but at least in her mind, it offered a possible explanation for Jack's murder. And I knew all about Michael. Meaning she knew about Michael's indictment in the federal grape fraud case and the rumored links to organized crime.

Chapter 6: What mysterious phone calls did Jack's family receive after his death?

860.94 - 883.126 Chris Walker

And it seems the police were most interested in clue number three, the fact that Jack usually kept a .22 caliber pistol under the seat cushions of his couch. And that gun now appeared to be missing. According to Jacqueline and Joanna, all of the family members knew about it. Their dad kept the pistol in a black pouch, sometimes alongside as much as $12,000 in cash.

0

883.747 - 899.434 Chris Walker

And to the detectives, the missing gun seemed like more than a coincidence. But where was it? They didn't have to wonder for too long. Two weeks into their investigation, the detectives caught a break through a most unexpected source, a pastor at a local Baptist church.

0

900.135 - 917.328 Chris Walker

He told the police that a member of his congregation had come to him with some disturbing information about a drinking buddy named Al, who had recently found a gun that may have been used in Jack's murder. The pastor refused to reveal the identity of the tipster, but it wasn't difficult to identify the owl in this story.

0

917.969 - 939.715 Chris Walker

The detectives remembered interviewing one of the Licciardi's neighbors, a 32-year-old named Albert Falmasilli, on the day Jack was found dead. At that time, Albert had said that he had no knowledge that a homicide had occurred next door. So now Sergeant Capron raced back to Albert's house to interview him again, but Albert wasn't home. Capron went back again the following day.

0

940.096 - 962.234 Chris Walker

Albert still wasn't home. So Stockton police set up a 24-hour surveillance to catch him when he finally returned. Little did they know that he was hiding and freaking out. Because what I'm about to tell you is an incredibly weird series of events. And to help me tell this story, I consulted two of Albert's friends at the time, Jeff Kroenke and Brad Rosario.

962.874 - 972.462 Chris Walker

They were all in their early 30s in 1991. And on the evening of Jack's murder, Kroenke was hanging out with Albert at a friend's house after they'd spent the day helping her move.

973.285 - 982.012 Jeff Kroenke

We were drinking beers, you know, this certain day. Albert was known to be a bit of a partier. We all did. You know, we were pretty raging partiers.

982.893 - 986.316 Chris Walker

And after they'd partied enough, Kroenke drove Albert home around 10.30 p.m.

988.11 - 994.355 Jeff Kroenke

And I remember it was dropping Albert off. The dude couldn't even hardly walk straight.

Chapter 7: What clues did police find at the murder scene?

1095.1 - 1116.778 Danny Rosario

what Albert did is he decided, well, I'm going to take this gun. I'm going to go over my, you know, my brother's house. Albert goes, Hey, check this out. My brother goes, get that fucking gun out of here. I don't want to fucking see it. I want to fucking hear about it. Get that fuck. Fuck you. Fuck. Get the fuck out of here. And his wife too. She's like, what the fuck?

0

1117.438 - 1131.87 Danny Rosario

So Albert leaves from, from what I was told from my brother is he went down to the Delta and, Which is very, we grew up right there on the port of Stockton. And Albert supposedly threw the gun into the fucking river.

0

1133.031 - 1154.061 Chris Walker

Except Albert lied about that. He didn't actually throw the gun into the river. And the truth was about to get squeezed out of him. Because remember how the Stockton police had set up 24-hour surveillance around Albert's home? Well, when they finally spotted Albert walking down Willow Street on February 8th, they immediately brought him into the station for questioning.

0

1154.822 - 1168.392 Chris Walker

Over an intense series of interviews spanning 12 hours, Albert confessed to having stashed the gun at Danny Rosario's house and gave the detectives his account on what happened on the night of Jack's murder. According to Capron's written report,

0

1169.432 - 1188.361 Albert Falmasilli

Albert said at approximately 0200 hours, he began to hear a woman's voice arguing next door at the Luchardi house. About 10 minutes later, he heard what he thought was a loud bang. About 20 minutes later, someone opened the garage door and peeped in. Albert said the person had long hair. Moments later, the person had opened the door and shut the door.

1189.733 - 1202.101 Chris Walker

Sergeants Williams and Capron were understandably suspicious of this narrative. But when Albert took them to Danny Rosario's house, he did produce the gun, which he'd hidden behind a sofa in the living room without Rosario's knowledge.

1202.781 - 1223.03 Chris Walker

The weapon was a Colt .22-caliber semi-automatic handgun held inside a black zippered gun case, which matched the description that Jack's daughters had given the police. And while the thousands in cash that Jack normally kept in the case was missing, forensic tests would later confirm the gun as the murder weapon. But Albert wasn't off the hook.

1223.53 - 1245.575 Chris Walker

The detectives returned him to the police station, where they got him to consent to a polygraph examination. Here's part of the transcript, as read by a voice actor. Albert answered no, and the examiner noted he appeared to show no deception. Were you present when Jack Licciardi was shot? Again, Albert answered no, and appeared to show no deception.

1246.235 - 1256.759 Albert Falmasilli

But when asked, Do you know who shot Jack Licciardi? And, Did you have any prior knowledge or were involved in any planning of the homicide of Jack Licciardi?

Chapter 8: What insights did neighbors provide about Jack's murder?

1276.124 - 1294.437 Chris Walker

Police reports show that they spent weeks asking as many of Albert's friends as they could find, including Kroenke, what Albert had told them about finding the gun. And in the end, they found that Albert told a more or less consistent story, and he had no clear motive to kill Jack. But perhaps he knew who did.

0

1295.177 - 1314.332 Chris Walker

After all, he'd failed a lie detector test on the question, do you know who killed Jack Licciardi? And given the way he'd stashed the gun and gone into hiding, Albert seemed genuinely afraid for his life. But afraid of who? The police asked him this question in multiple interviews. The mafia, Albert kept saying.

0

1314.952 - 1334.081 Chris Walker

When pressed on this, Albert told the police that Robert Licciardi had always claimed or joked, Albert wasn't sure, that the Licciardis had ties to organized crime. And so here we are with the mafia rumors again. But whether or not the rumors were true, Albert's fear was palpable. He told friends that someone was trying to frame him.

0

1334.561 - 1355.871 Chris Walker

And as soon as the police let him go, he disappeared from Stockton, not to be seen for years. And that meant Capron and Williams were back to square one. They were also left wondering, who would try to frame Albert? What to make of his recollections of a woman screaming and a long-haired person coming into the garage? And was there any basis to his mafia mentions whatsoever?

0

1355.891 - 1377.349 Chris Walker

The detectives hadn't uncovered any shred of fact there. It seemed way more plausible that one of Jack's sons, like the one who told Albert the mafia tales, or the one who was on trial for grape fraud, was behind the murder. So what of the sons? Throughout the investigation, Robert had been cooperative but somewhat unreliable.

1377.95 - 1398.227 Chris Walker

He'd answered their questions about events surrounding the murder, but when asked to help identify the gun, Robert said he was busy and wouldn't come to the station. And Michael had been oddly quiet. In the nearly month and a half since Jack's murder, he'd barely said a word to detectives, which made them wonder. Was he simply distracted by his upcoming trial?

1398.528 - 1418.941 Chris Walker

Was he tired of dealing with law enforcement? Or was he hiding something? So in early March, almost two months after Jack's murder, Sergeant Capron decided it was time to revisit Michael as a suspect. The detective arranged to meet him at his home in La Mirada, and when he pulled up, Capron was surprised to see that Michael's home was built like a fortress.

1419.721 - 1423.323 Chris Walker

According to Michael's wife, Norma, We installed cameras.

1423.543 - 1438.992 Norma Licciardi

As soon as you rang the doorbell, the cameras would go on so we could see. We also had stuck a wall, a courtyard put up, and we, Michael, attacked, trained our Doberman,

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