Nick Pell
Appearances
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Nein, ich denke das überhaupt nicht. Zuerst einmal, das ist dumm, weil ich in einem der größten konservativen kongressiven Städte in Amerika lebe. Die Chancen, dass mein Kind nach Hause kommen wird, kritische Rassentheorien zu sprechen, oder die Werte des kommunistischen Kubas zu sehen, sind nicht existent.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Ich denke, die Frage, die Sie sehen, wenn Sie lesen, dass die Regierungsschulen meinen Kind als Non-Binary-Kommunist oder was auch immer, ich sehe das und denke, wie involviert sind Sie in Ihrem Kindesleben? Habten Sie die Regierungsschulen erwartet, um Ihr Babysitter und der einzige Unterrichtsführer Ihres Kindes zu sein? Wenn so, ja, große Schock.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Sie haben gewonnen, weil Sie den Kampf verabschiedet haben. I think the most dangerous thing my kid is going to learn at government schools is an unhealthy deference to authority, conformity and unquestioning obedience. I also worry about the socialization that he's going to learn there. Speaking of having a five-minute attention span, we'll be right back.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Do these people remember school? School was awful. It was an awful place to learn to socialize. You had friends, but as an adult, no one is coming up to you at work and going, hey, meet me by the water tower after work so I can beat the snot out of you because you looked at my girlfriend the wrong way. Like this doesn't happen as an adult.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
For the most part, no. Grown-ups do not resolve their disputes through weird bullying rituals and physical violence. In my opinion, it's not a great place for socializing. Ich habe keine Ahnung, ob das wahr oder nicht ist. Es würde aussehen, als wäre es eine sehr schwierige Sache, das in irgendeinem Sinne zu quantifizieren.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Aber ich habe niemanden gesagt, dass sie mich nach der Arbeit als Adoption schlagen werden. Aber ich hatte das definitiv in meinen Augen.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Ich würde sagen, die einzige Stelle, wo Menschen wirklich physische Gewalt als Ältere erleben, sind Bars.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Oh yeah, no you wouldn't. I don't think you would. Yeah. Das sagt, ich möchte hier wirklich klar sein, dass ich die Lehrer für das nicht verurteile.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Homeschooling really exploded post-COVID. In 2019, there were about 2.5 million kids getting homeschooled. And for the 21-22 school year, that climbed to 6 million. But of course, this was during COVID. Newer stats are hard to come by, but the Washington Post said some of these kids went back to government schools, but most of them didn't. Why do you think that is?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I think it boils down to people seeing what goes on in government schools when they're at home and not having... Ich glaube, das hat etwas mit den Werten, die in Regierungsschulen gelernt werden, zu tun. Most teachers are Democrats, most of them voted for Clinton, and some parents just aren't on board with that.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Now, to be clear, I don't think Hillary Clinton is Fidel Castro, but I can imagine that in a lot of parts of the country, like where I live, or in a lot of homes, even a pretty tepid liberal bias in the classroom could be very poorly received by the parents.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I think parents should be in control of their kids' education and if they want to yank their kid out of government school because their kid's teacher voted for Clinton or Trump or RFK Jr. or dyed their hair blue or listens to too much Milli Vanilli.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
The point is, I just think parents should be able to do whatever they want with their kids with regard to school, provided the kid's actually receiving an education. And I'm just not going to sit here and Monday morning quarterback other parents' decisions about their kid's education.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Wow, there's no regulations? Which states are those? There's effectively no regulations. I'm sure there's some, but you can kind of do anything. Gonna be shocked to hear that Connecticut and New Jersey are states where you don't have to give any kind of notice. Get out of school. Whole bunch of these states are in the Midwest. There's Texas, Oklahoma, Alaska, Idaho.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
But weirdly and also kind of surprisingly, the two nutso, you know, we don't have laws for anything states, Florida and Arizona, they both require notice. At the opposite end of the spectrum are the states with tons of regulations where you more or less just have to be doing government school at home. You have to follow a state mandated curriculum. Those states are about what you would expect.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New York, Pennsylvania. Everywhere else is somewhere in between.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
My kid isn't state property. My kid's education is my choice. It's not the government.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Honestly, that sounds awesome. I'm way less of an advocate for homeschooling per se than I am a cheerleader for non-traditional education.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I'm totally not. No, again, I want to super stress this point. I have zero opinions on how other people should raise their kids other than love them, feed them and don't hit them. My kid goes to government school now. Not everyone is capable of homeschooling their kids. Some people aren't smart enough. Some people aren't patient enough. Some people just don't have the time.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, I think it probably is. It depends on specifically what you're talking about, because there's so many different kinds of private schools. But I think the beauty of private schools is that you could pick something that's a good fit for your kid. I think I would have really excelled at a Montessori school as a child, but a lot of kids wouldn't.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Montessori Method is from Maria Montessori and it's all about child directed learning, collaborative play. It's meeting kids where they are and having them captain the ship, albeit with a lot of adult guidance. And guidance is a good word for it because the teachers are usually not called teachers, they're called guides. Anyone who's spent a lot of time around kids knows they're super curious.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
It's always like kid asked me. How do I see things the other day? That's awesome. Adults don't ask questions like that. And people are laughing like, but do you know how I see things? I do now because I watched a YouTube video on it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, thank God for YouTube so that we can actually answer these questions. I think Holt was right, though. I think government school kind of just whips this out of kids by making learning really boring. I think I would have done really well at a Montessori school because I was a super self-directed kid.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
But my kid, that wouldn't have been the ideal environment for him because he's not really much like what I was like as a kid.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, a girlfriend of mine did that. They have some kind of unorthodox ideas about child development, like she didn't learn how to read until she was 8.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
It's a whole thing with them. I don't think it's bad necessarily. In her case it worked out. She could not spell to save her life, but she did read more than any other human being I've ever known in my life. And she's a really good artist and they're really very arts focused. So those are the two that I know the most about.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Prenda Microschooling is another one which has taken off or must have because there's a ton of them around here and Wir sind die letzten Menschen auf der Erde, um etwas Neues zu bekommen. Aber sie haben vermischtes Alter und Klassenzahlen unter 12. Ich habe mich auf die, die hier vor mir sind, für mein Kind angeschaut.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Und ich weiß nicht, wie viel ich von ihnen kenne, ob es nur die lokalen oder wie sie alle runten. Aber wissend, was ich von Prenda kenne, kann ich mir vorstellen, dass es eine gute Variation gibt, wie eine Mikro-Schule funktioniert, als eine andere.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, they're in age groups. It's not like you have 5-year-olds with 17-year-olds. You have 6-year-olds with 8-year-olds. And I think you're right. Yeah, that's the idea behind it. And the thing that was attractive to me is that an 8-year-old can help a 5-year-old with math and they both kind of benefit from that. And the flip side of it is, hey, if your 8-year-old's not really that great at math,
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Was wir jetzt als Homeschooling nennen, ist im Grunde nur, wie viele Menschen ihre Kinder historisch gebildet haben, vor der Erklärung von compulsory education laws, die in den USA im 19.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
They can do math with six-year-olds and it's not like they have to go sit in a classroom that's two grades behind them to get a little help that they need. The great thing about private schools is there's a zillion different teaching styles. There's military schools, there's classical education, you name it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Generally speaking, not a big shock to you or anyone else who's paid attention to what I've been saying here, but I just think free markets create better solutions to problems in the state, and I don't think schools are an exception to that.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So this is one of those stats that varies widely from one state to another. Private religious schools tend to be a lot cheaper, I assume because they get subsidies from... Wow, that is a big difference.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, the local evangelical Christian school around here is about 5,000 a year. Wow. The average cost of homeschooling varies from state to state, but in Arizona, the range I got was between $500 and 2,500 bucks per kid. So another advantage of homeschooling is it's cheap. I did this as an unemployed single dad for a year. People in the 75 to $100,000 range
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
income bracket are the most likely to homeschool, with the very poor being a close second. That's people making below $25,000 a year. And I think there's just this sweet spot of affluence where it makes more sense to homeschool than to send your kids to a private school.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
And then there's just a whole bunch of families who take the hit on a second income, have moms stay home, and that's what accounts for the lower end of it. It's also probably a function of a fact that the biggest state for homeschooling is Alaska, which famously is not a very affluent state.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, that's good to bring up because I think it's worth talking about what we mean by educated and how much formal education people really need or needed. My maternal grandfather was a farmer. He was an 8th grade dropout and he had a gigantic library of everything from Plato to Mark Twain. And I would say he's a lot more educated than even
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I don't think there's much of this going on, but there's maybe other forms of abuse and neglect. In any event, it doesn't strike me as a compelling reason to have An invasive bureaucracy for policing homeschooling. I'm reminded of the Mark Twain quote about censorship is the philosophy that a grown man shouldn't be able to eat steak because a baby can't chew it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Are we just going to make all of our laws about the absolute worst people that exist? The rest of us responsible people have to like suck it up. I think no. We actually have statistics about the overlap of abuse, neglect and homeschooling. And there's a really disturbing study with a really disturbing title called Child Torture as a Form of Child Abuse that addresses this.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, it is awful. The things I'll do for money.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
There are some things I won't do even for money. The people who wrote this study got some pretty solid statistics on abuse and homeschooling. And people taking their kids out of government schools because teachers notice abuse that happens. It's pretty rare, but it does happen. There's a super sad case that you can read about if you have a strong stomach.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
A kid named Teddy Fultz Tedesco in Struthers, Ohio. Absolutely demonic levels of abuse. You can google it. I just wanted to say his name because I think that kid's life matters and I think people should know his story. And it's just Wow, 1717. Das ist so traurig. Yeah, so I hate CPS agencies with the white hot passion of a thousand burning suns and stuff like this is a big reason why.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
17 complaints, by the way, from like mandated reporters.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, not the rando down the street teachers. Any competent agency would have taken this kid out of that home long before his mom's boyfriend beat him to death in front of his little brothers.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Es ist. Ich habe das von der Koalition für verantwortliche Homeschooling. Sie tun wirklich gute Arbeit, in der Dokumentierung von Kindesabsturz in Homeschool-Häusern auf ihrer Webseite Homeschooling's Invisible Children. Sie studieren speziell diesen Phänomen. Oh mein Gott.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So these parents are saying they're homeschooling their children, but it's what, a cover to abuse their kids away from mandated reporters like teachers and other authorities? Is that what's going on?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I also hate that, and it gets worse. The median age of death for those 211 kids? 10 years old. Oh my god, those poor kids. Yeah, it's completely and utterly disgusting, but... Das sind 400 Kinder aus 6 Millionen oder was auch immer es ist. Lass uns das Nummer in die Hälfte schneiden. Lass uns es 3 Millionen machen, weil wir nicht wirklich sicher sind, was die Zahlen sind. Post-Covid.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Das ist ungefähr 0,01 Prozent aller Homeschool-Kinder. Das ist ein absoluter Outlier.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Ja, absolut. The question is, is government oversight of homeschooling gonna save those kids? Again, Teddy Fultz Tedesco, that's his name, google it. 17, 17 CPS-Complaints while he was still in school. And he's dead.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
You have to balance the rights of the 99.99% of homeschooling parents who are not beating their kids and then taking them out of school when somebody notices with the safety of those 400 kids who, like again, like... 17 Berichte. Und sie haben nichts gemacht.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I don't see a compelling argument for erecting this invasive apparatus around homeschooling because a tiny minority of people are beating their kids up and then using homeschool.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I don't see a compelling reason for erecting this invasive apparatus around homeschooling because some tiny minority of people are gaming the system to take their kids out of school so they can beat them without the prying eyes of mandated reporters. Und wiederum, verabschieden Kinder ist gegen die Regeln. Wir haben bereits Regeln gegen das.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Es ist nicht so, als wäre es plötzlich legal, weil man sie heimschulen würde.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, as of 2016, which, yeah, is almost 10 years ago. I know. Ouch. Another reminder of how time flies and I'm just old now. Right in the feels. Right in the feels. 80% of homeschooled parents don't trust the safety of the school environment, which I think is a valid concern. 61% don't like the level of educational rigor. I also think that's a valid concern. 67% do it for moral reasons.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
51% for religious reasons. I'm not really sure what the difference is there, but whatever. 39% want a non-traditional approach to schooling. That's probably where I would fall in. The environmental concern that I talked about at the beginning, where they don't trust the safety of the schools, that's way up from a 2007 poll, where only 21% of homeschooled parents were worried about
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
At the end of the day, I think parents should be in charge of their kids' education and that if it gets bad results, that sucks, but I still don't want the government stepping in and forcing kids to go to government school against their parents' wishes. But it would be a lot harder to defend if there were bad outcomes. But the outcomes for the most part are positive.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
We find that the homeschool kids do better on tests of academic skills. The research doesn't control for things like parental income and parental involvement. So, that could be doing some work there, because I think it's a pretty safe bet to say that on average, homeschoolers are from more engaged households.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
We talked earlier about how the most likely income bracket is $75,000 to $100,000, and it's a lot easier to be engaged in your kids' education when you're not worried about affording the last tin of beans at Walmart or digging change out of the couch. Yeah, you don't have three jobs. Yeah. Ja, genau.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, which is totally fair. We've encountered many people who don't believe in dinosaurs. The phenomenon of homeschooling as we know it kicked off in the 70s, and this was thanks to a guy named John Holt. Holts philosophy was pretty hippy-dippy, and mostly he was opposed to what he considered to be the oppressive environment of traditional government schools.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Also ist es schwer zu sagen, ob die Kinder besser machen, weil sie nach Hause geholt haben oder weil die nach Hause geholt haben Kinder mehr engagierte Eltern haben.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
They're taking on an additional parenting responsibility. They're not just doing what everybody else does. That doesn't require greater engagement as a parent, but it does suggest that many homeschooled families will likely be more engaged. The correlation between engaged parents and good educational outcomes, that makes sense to me,
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Auf der anderen Seite sehen wir sozial ein bisschen eine gemischte Tasche. Einige Studien sagen, dass Homeschooler sozial besser tun. Einige Studien sagen, dass sie das Gleiche tun. Einige Studien sagen, dass sie es schlimmer tun. Es ist nicht wirklich ein großer Schock, zu sagen, dass die mehr sozial involvierten Homeschooler-Studenten tendieren, sozial besser eingestellt zu werden.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Diese sind wie, ob du dein Kind in den Jugendliga-Soccer investierst. Boy Scouts und Kirchengruppen und Plätze, wo sie mit ihren Kindern sozialisieren können. Ich würde mir vorstellen, dass das auch für öffentliche Kinder geht. Kinder, die mehr sozialisieren, werden wahrscheinlich bessere soziale Fähigkeiten haben. Das ist nicht eine große Überraschung für mich.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
They are about 23% less likely to go to college homeschool kids, which I don't necessarily think that's a problem, especially when I hear that 74% of them Ja, genau.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Skilled teachers have a hard time teaching kids calculus or history or biology for that matter, let alone parents without any kind of formal training and education. I'd be curious to know about basic math skills versus math for engineering. Honestly, most people don't use anything beyond pre-algebra in their daily lives.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So, I think knowledge is good for its own sake, but I don't really see a kid trying to get a degree in history as being held back a lot by the fact that he got a C- in trig.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
A recent study from Harvard found some pretty strong and profound advantages to homeschooling in terms of the overall quality of life. You're more likely to volunteer, you tend to be way more forgiving, and you're way less likely to be a drug addict if you were homeschooled. Und Homeschool-Kinder verdienen ca.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I suspect a lot of them are entrepreneurs. That's what I think. I think a lot of them are starting like Jersey Mike's or whatever. I know Jersey Mike's was started by like some kid. And I think a lot of them are like just whatever. Maybe they start a car detailing business when they're 16. Und es ist nicht so, als ob sie einen Zillionen-Dollar-Detail in Karten machen.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
He didn't even call it homeschooling, he called it unschooling, which is a term that still gets used a lot by the people who have a more What specifically did this guy John Holt teach to would-be homeschoolers of his day?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Es ist einfach so, dass sie lernen, wie sie ein Geschäft runtern.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Another big thing that I think drives all this is you're just not exposed to the nonsense drama, which I'm sure helps with academics. It helps with social adjustments, quality of life in general, when you're not dealing with the blackboard jungle of government schools and kind of everything that goes along with it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I just think it's a lot easier for these kids to focus on learning and social adjustment.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I think you just do a lot of research and make the call. Nobody's going to be able to make this decision about your kids better than you. I know people who started homeschooling with teenagers and I know people whose kids have never seen a single day inside of a government school. So don't think, oh, it's too late because my kid's 13 or whatever. Nobody knows your kids better than you do.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
If your gut says it's not the right fit, it's probably not. On the other hand, if you get a strong sense that this is really the type of environment that my kid will thrive in, you're probably also correct.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Hey man, I said no comment on the teachers.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Thanks for having me on as always. I'm definitely not here to tell everyone that homeschooling is the one solution to all your educational needs. It's definitely not, but it's one option. And I think people dismiss it too quickly as either too hard to do or this thing for total freaks. And it's not impossibly difficult and it's not for freaks, not exclusively anyway.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Like I said, we met our fair share of kids who really wanted to tell my son that dinosaurs weren't real.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Holt thought that government schools just didn't do a very good job of educating kids. And he thought this because he thought that the government schools crushed kids' spirits and curiosity and forced them to learn in this really rigid way that ignored their interest and curiosity. And he was very critical of the one-size-fits-all method of education in government schools.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I mean, I slept literally through most of my classes in high school and nobody cared. Holt war nicht unbedingt ein Proponent für das Homeschooling deiner Kinder für ihre gesamte Bildung. Er dachte, die Eltern seien bei etwa acht Jahren alt und dann ging der Kind zu einer normalen Schule.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Aber er war immer noch sehr viel ein Proponent für die radikale Reform der gouvernementlichen Bildung, weil der Gründe, die ich gerade erwähnt habe. Back in the early days of the modern homeschooling movement in the 60s and the 70s, it was very common for parents to work with the school boards. Six states required homeschooling parents to have a teaching license.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
80er-Jahre ist, als der evangelistische christliche Bewegung sehr interessiert wurde, in der Homeschooling. Vorher, wie ich gesagt habe, war es eine Art liberaler Hippie-Ding, wo die Leute über die Wohlfahrt ihres Kindes und wie sie von den Regierungsschulen und wie sie Kinder beitragen. Die Frage war immer, ist das in der besten Interesse meines Kindes?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Und sobald die Evangelikalen involviert wurden, wurde es viel mehr so, dass sie meine Kinder in satanische Kommunisten bewerben.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Nein, nicht überhaupt. Ich bin ein praktizierter Katholiker. I'm not trying to smear Christians of any kind here. I'm just trying to give a lay of the land in admittedly broad brush, slightly exaggerated terms. But it is very much a fact that when the evangelicals showed up to the homeschooling movement, it changed.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So the more hippie parents wanted to work with the school systems and the new evangelical leadership was much more oppositional towards Ich war auch ein Hochschulvater. Und obwohl ich religiöse Glauben und ein Mann der Glauben bin, glaube ich, dass man sagen könnte, dass ich definitiv viel mehr in das Hippie-Verein-Kampfen auf das falle.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
I'm generally in favor of more local control and less centralization, but I do also want absolutely zero regulations on homeschooling.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
For the record, I believe in evolution, but I think that you and a lot of parents would be very surprised at how well they would do with homeschooling. I did homeschool my son for his kindergarten year. My divorce would have stopped at that. And anecdotally, with regard to how well did it work, I didn't have
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Wenn du gesagt hast, dass du dein Kind nach Hause schulen würdest, war ich eigentlich ganz überrascht.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Ich werde auch meine Karten auf die Tafel legen und sagen, dass ich nicht ein Fan von Regierungsschulen bin, wie ich stöbern öffentliche Schulen bezeichne. Das gesagt, möchte ich zwei Dinge zu diesem Ausdruck hinzufügen, bevor wir dazu kommen. Ich habe keine Ahnung, was für jemanden am besten ist, aber ich und mein Kind.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Wenn Sie Regierungsschulen oder was für Ihren Kind am besten ist, ist das Ihr Geschäft. Es ist nicht mein. Ich habe keine Meinung darüber, wie Sie Ihre Kinder erwerben, außer dass Sie sie in irgendeiner Art und Weise nicht verletzen. Zweitens, ich denke, dass verschiedene Kinder am besten in verschiedenen Umgebungen lernen. Nicht jedes Kind ist das gleiche.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Das ist der große Kritik von Regierungsschulen, dass es ein Ein-in-ein-Fitz-All ist. Und ich präsentiere hier kein alternatives Ein-in-ein-Fitz-All. Ich akzeptiere vollständig, dass es Kinder gibt, die wahrscheinlich am besten lernen in...
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Okay, gib uns die I hate public schools rant early on, because you are a pretty reasonable guy for an unhinged anarchist, gun nut, desert dwelling conspiracy theorist. There's a few things going on with government school that I think deserve highlighting. One is you just have a completely unreasonable amount of kids in the room. You said you couldn't deal with two. Yeah.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
How are you going to deal with 25, 30 kids? That's how many kids there are on average in my kids' school. And I don't think that's
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Ja, das Nächste ist, und das ist meistens für jüngere Kinder, aber du hast es angesprochen, ich denke, es ist eine völlig unverantwortliche Erwartung, dass ein siebenjähriger Junge, ich habe einen siebenjährigen, fünfjährigen Jungen, was auch immer, einen jungen Jungen, besonders einen Jungen. sit still and pay attention for seven hours a day.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
When I homeschooled, we did Charlotte Mason method, and the Charlotte Mason method, one of its key features is that it expects total attention for age-appropriate times. So in his case, that was 10 to 15 minutes. And during that 10 to 15 minutes, he could fiddle around with Legos or fidget spinners or whatever, because if I'm making him sit still, all of his attention is going to go towards
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
sit still when he got sent home his first week of government school with a coloring project that was just about sitting still i was absolutely horrified
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, I'm not a fan of what's called the German industrial style of education, which is what government schools in America for the most part are based on. Sit in chair, listen to teacher. It's not designed to create intelligent, curious, thoughtful people. It's designed to create factory workers and it runs on farm time. Und das war Holtz' Kritik, der Kern davon.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
Und es ist die Kritik vieler von den Eltern der Hochschulen, die ich kenne. Es ist nicht so, oh, meine Kinder werden über Dinosaurier lernen. Es ist so, dass mein 7-Jähriger nicht in einem Sitz für 7 Stunden am Tag sitzen wird.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So there's also the way that No Child Left Behind has affected teaching. This is a Bush-era program where they tied educational funding to educational achievement, and the educational achievement was measured by standardized tests. So now they're just teaching to the standardized tests these kids have to take because that's where the funding comes from.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1119: Home Schooling | Skeptical Sunday
So as an example of how this plays out in the real world, I go to my first parent teacher meeting and they tell me that my son has trouble reading and that they're worried that he has dyslexia. And I'm like, Ja. Währenddessen habe ich ihn zu Hause mit den Narnia-Büchern und den letzten Kindern auf der Erde gelesen, das ist wie ein Zombie-Buch für Kinder, die 10 Jahre alt sind.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You know what you won't have to sexually extort a child in order to afford?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Ich meine, das klingt wie ein typischer Tag in 1995. Ja, du hast recht. Ja, es ist schrecklich. Also, das ist einer dieser Dinge, die Leute denken, dass ich verrückt bin, wenn ich sage, dass es niemals ein sicherer Zeitpunkt war, ein Kind zu sein. Vielleicht gibt es Leute da draußen, die sich erkennt, dass das wahr ist. Aber die meisten Leute...
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Kids can't play outside anymore because it's too dangerous or whatever else. There's literally never been a safer time to be a child. Fact. This is not a matter of opinion. This is a stone cold fact. There is mountains of data. There has never been a safer time to be a kid. Johnny Gosch, Adam Walsh, these kids' disappearances and deaths
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
completely changed the culture around child abduction in this country.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Seine ganze Karriere basiert auf dem Fakt, dass sein Sohn getötet wurde. Er war jung. Er war in meiner Kindheit. Ja, aber Adam Walsh und Johnny Gosch, und es gibt einen dritten, den ich nicht erinnere. Es gibt drei, die sich immer zusammengebracht haben. Sie haben komplett alles verändert, wie wir als Gesellschaft, zumindest in Amerika, respond to child abduction. The stats on this are wild.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Kids literally used to just get snatched out of the mall, out of the park. Hey, little girl, help me find my dog, that kind of stuff.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, and in the older child abduction cases from the battle days, most of those kids were murdered. I'm not trying to be gross or grim, but You can sell a baby, somebody will buy it, but a kid is a witness. A kid is not a commodity, it's a witness.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
And if you're abducting a kid, it's also so weird, because I just watched this thing last night about, there was always like, oh, I'm eight years old and apparently I was kidnapped. And I don't remember it. No one's kidnapping eight-year-olds for illegal trafficking. Not in the West, not in the first world.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
So if you're abducting a kid off the street from a playground, wherever, like you're abducting some strange kid, you're not doing that for wholesome purposes. You are absolutely getting rid of the only witness when you're done doing whatever it is that you're doing to them. It's why Adam Wohlstein, almost certainly. I don't know that they ever figured out who got him.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
That's what you do with a kid when you're done with some kid that you grab. Yeah, it's gross, but like, that's it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, and so the thing is too, this is so absurdly rare these days. Like almost all child abductions now are non-custodial parents. Almost all of them. Kids do not just get grabbed off playgrounds anymore. It is a man bites dog story when they do.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
And I don't even think most, well, good luck as somebody who is divorced and has a kid. Yeah, good luck being a single man taking a kid out of the country without a notarized paper saying that you're allowed to do it. And also there's things like the hate convention on child abduction. You just, you can't do that. You're not gonna grab a kid and take it to France and get away with it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Interpol's gonna grab you, they're gonna send the kid back. Zero evidence here, just a hunch. I think that in almost all of these dad took the kid across state lines or whatever, dad kidnapped the kid or mom kidnapped the kid or whatever it is, I think that
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Wahrscheinlich ist die überwältigende Mehrheit von diesen Mischungskommunikationen oder die Eltern hatten einen informellen Vertrag und eine Partei hat sich an die andere Partei gefreut und sie haben sich entschieden, die Polizisten gegen die andere Eltern zu weppen.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Okay, so coming back to the topic at hand. So it's never been safer to be a kid. What's with the child sextortion thing? So the giant screaming asterisk next to the statement, there's never been a safer time to be a child, is the caveat that you have to be extremely careful about what your kids are doing online. The data on this is also very one-sided and clear.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Children are safer than they have ever been, unless... You include the things that can happen to them on the Internet.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
But on the Internet, it's a whole other ballgame. And I'm aware that one factor in making the world safer is the helicopter parenting. If you're always hovering over your kid, no one's going to take them. There used to be ads on television at 10 o'clock reminding parents that they had children. Ha! Es ist 10 Uhr.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Das ist lustig. Between the hours of 2 p.m. and 8 p.m. Any given day. That's true. No idea where I was.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah. No, me and my friends walked three towns away sharing a single pack of cigarettes like we were passing around a joint like, you know, walking train tracks and dodging trains and whatever else. It was a magical time to be alive. A miracle that we're still here. It really is. We've been 30 since we were 12 years old. That's right.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
The cliche is that you had to be home when the streetlights were on or whatever. I just basically came and went as I pleased. I got into a lot of trouble and a lot of extremely inappropriate sex and drug shenanigans at a very young age. And like, why do kids not do that anymore? Because when younger boomers and Gen Xers had kids, they were like, my kid's not just going to roam the streets.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
wie ein Test-Guinny-Pig für ein neues Weid für ein Highschool-Kind. Ich werde wissen, wo sie sind. Also denke ich, dass wir vielleicht ein bisschen zu weit in die andere Richtung gegangen sind mit dem Helikopter-Parenting. Und ich bin wahrscheinlich schuldig dafür. Aber das Helikopter-Parenting ist einer der vielen Faktoren, warum Kinder sicherer sind. Du siehst sie, je sicherer sie sind.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
One of the biggest is just awareness, lack of tolerance for child danger. I always make the joke that the phrase, you know, a kid might get hurt, is like basically how you get any law passed in this country. We have completely bubble-wrapped the world, for better or for worse. I think probably both, upside and downside to both of it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
More than that, though, it's just the awareness that I talked about. Kids get told to avoid strangers, which is kind of stupid, because they're more likely to get abused by a teacher, a parent, a family friend, a priest, trust an adult, like my church had a whole thing about don't get molested by a priest and I wanted my kid to go to that because I wanted him to get it from like
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Die Kirche, nicht für moralische Gründe, weil ich es im Kontext des Priesterabsturzes wollte.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Ich glaube, ich sollte nicht sein. Ja, es ist ein Gerichtsmandat. Sie machen es nicht, weil sie gute Leute sind. Sie machen es, weil die Gerichtsmannschaft sie gemacht hat. Das ist Teil ihres riesigen Verhältnisses. Aber deine Kinder sind mehr möglich, von einem öffentlichen Lehrern verletzt zu werden, was ich sage, dass niemand glaubt, aber absolut wahr ist.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Dann gibt es andere Dinge wie Code Adam, ein Programm von Walmart und Old Navy, wo wenn ein Kind verloren ist, haben sie den ganzen Laden auf Lockdown gelegt, bis sie ihn finden.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Everybody knows it. And they're just like, stay away from him. No one calls the cops, nothing. They're just like, yeah, Mr. Johnson, he likes the Dutch kids. Stay away from him. Now he's on the registry, but back then, the registry was like, your parents told you, don't talk to this guy. Yeah, kids are usually safe at school or church in a way that they just weren't in the 1980s.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I think it's difficult to say, honestly. Do I think that there were 80,000 attempts to entice a child that stalled out because they picked the wrong kid? Yeah, I believe that. That sounds credible to me. Do I think that the people... Ja, genau.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Ja, und auch, Alter, so viele Mädchen, mit denen ich Freunde habe und Mädchen, mit denen ich verabredet habe, waren so, oh Mann, als ich 13 war auf AOL, hatte ich einen 50-jährigen Mann auf mich, und ich habe ihn einfach mitgebracht, weil ich dachte, es wäre lustig, aber es war wirklich schrecklich und verdammt.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Also ja, das passt für mich, aber das ist das Ding, 80.000, die einzige Grund, warum diese 80.000 sind, wer kümmert sich, ob die Kinder es aus der Proportion ausgelöst haben, ist, weil nichts passiert ist. Der Kind war satt genug, um zu wissen, ja, okay, I'm gonna mess around with Grandpa here for like 20 minutes and then I'm gonna get bored and I'm gonna go watch something on YouTube.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
But eventually they're gonna find a kid. Yeah, that's scary. One survey showed 40% of kids surveyed said that they thought someone had attempted to groom them online at some point. That's one where I feel like, yeah, we're maybe, kids maybe being a little dramatic there, but...
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
The only reason I'm able to say that is because the kid's smart enough to not get sucked in by their clumsy attempt at grooming them.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, but the thing is, from a parent's point of view, there's no downside to treating these kids' perceptions as real. Your kids do not need to be talking to or interacting with adults online.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Es gibt einen Fall, in dem Stranger Danger mit negativen Auswirkungen kommt. Aber in Bezug auf das Internet und Online, denke ich einfach nicht, dass es irgendein Szenario gibt, in dem deine Kinder zu vorsichtig sind.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
There was this lost 11-year-old boy scout who evaded his rescuers because he thought they were trying to kidnap him. Okay. It's an extreme example, but it's there. The bigger issue is safety in general, where parents are arrested because their 8-year-olds are at the park without supervision.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Oh yeah, I've gotten those. They're freaky.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
We can link to it in the show notes. And in fact, I texted you that story.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah. Parents have been arrested for letting their children play outside. Other parents have been investigated by Child Protective Services. I'm giving my finger to the microphone right now. Noted, okay. If we're letting children play in their yard, you know, again, like, read the show notes, if you don't believe me.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
America has gone insane when it comes to child safety, because child abduction, true child abduction, is extremely rare. Most missing kids are runaways, which isn't like, oh, well, yeah, let them go. It's just like, they ran away.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Maybe because they're involved in drugs, maybe because they're involved in other crimes, maybe because they have abusive homes, maybe because they're just tempestuous little shits. They weren't snatched by the Oakland County Child Killer. Exactly. People focus on all of this stuff like, oh yeah, it's 1974 and my kid's gonna get grabbed out of the playground by a man in a trench coat.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Und sie sind einfach verblüfft von den sehr echten Gefahren, dass sie ihren Kindern ein Gerät geben, das sie mit einem Algorithmus befindet, das sie wissenschaftlich ausgestattet hat, um ihre größten Geheimnisse und Angst zu verursachen. while simultaneously giving perverts access to their daily lives.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Correct. But the good news is that they're almost certainly not spying on you. And you can just absolutely ignore these emails and go on about your life.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I was super shocked to find out that kids as young as nine report flirting with total strangers on the internet. And I was curious about the opposite sex at the age of nine, but I did not have Internet access.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
1 in 3 Minors sagen, dass sie einige ihrer fremdesten Freunde online kennengelernt haben und 1 in 7 sagen, dass sie etwas einem Online-Freund gesagt haben, das sie noch nie jemand anderes gesagt haben.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yes, absolutely. Which is a great way to start talking about the model of a predator and what they're going to do. So first they're going to set up a profile. It'll be a boy profile to target boys. Let's talk about... Ich weiß nicht, wie du das nennst, aber ich glaube dir. Ich habe das ständig in meinem Zuwanderer.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Also, du hast dieses Profil auf TikTok oder was auch immer es ist, das ein Kind benutzt. Und du fischst einfach an. Und es ist sehr normal, dass Tötungen eine Art haben. Aber sie können auch nicht nur Tötungen sein, in denen sie suchen, dass ein Kind persönlich verabschiedet wird. Sie könnten Gründer sein, die versuchen, Kinder für finanzielle Gewinn zu verabschieden.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Es gibt mehr dazu, aber der Hauptpunkt ist, dass nein, diese Person hat keine Fotos von dir, wenn du Sex hast, dein Haar schlägst, Screencaps von was auch immer du auf Pornhub siehst, um 3 Uhr, nach einer Nacht am Bar. Absolut das Beste, was du tun kannst, ist, die E-Mail komplett zu ignorieren.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You want to set up an account that's attractive to the kid. And you do a little social engineering and you look into what their interests are. And kids are so notoriously bad about blasting out where they go, things they like doing, interests. was für Mädchen sie lieben, was auch immer. Es gibt keinen Filter auf diese Kinder.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Sie haben all diese Details geblasen und das macht es sehr einfach für den Predator, nicht zu sagen, oh, Bobby kommt aus der Schule um 2 Uhr und er kommt hierher und ich werde ihn einfach holen. Oh, Bobby ist in The Legend of Zelda. Und wenn ich genug mit ihm über The Legend of Zelda spreche, werde ich seinen Vertrauen verdienen und ich werde relatable sein.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
How do you have a naked picture of a 14-year-old girl in this scenario? I don't maybe want to know the answer to that. So it could be a picture of a grown up. It could be some gross and illegal picture that they picked up somewhere else. B.A.I. could be a lot of different things. From there, it's basically the same old I'll show you mine if you show me yours kind of thing.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Teenagers and adolescent boys are pretty notoriously ruled by their hormones. And so getting them with a couple of nudie photos, probably not the hardest thing in the world to do.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I was fortunate in that I was like, I like girls, man, but I was just, I had zero confidence that any girl was ever going to be into me, which I look back and I like look at pictures of myself when I was 15. I was like, damn, kid, you were money. What were you thinking? But I was just like, eh, girls are never going to like me. I'm into like hardcore records and skateboards and being angry.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Oh, yeah. I don't know that I would have fallen for this because I would have just been like, eh, girls like boring.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, it's fishing a barrel with a boy. Everybody listening knows what we're talking about here. Boys are fishing a barrel with the new epics. And the girls is probably going to use foreign finesse, emotional attachment, manipulation. But with a boy, I can see, hey, here's some boobs. Now show me your wiener. Right. Okay. And then think about it from the kid's perspective.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Like a picture of you in your underwear could be mortifying to you as a teenager.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
The kid, he sends a picture of himself in his boxes or whatever. There's no turning back after that. Like everything is going to go back to what the predator wants. Maybe they want money. Maybe they want more incriminating pictures of the kid so that they can take the kid further down the road of sexual abuse and exploitation. Meet up with me and I'll delete these pictures or whatever.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Wenn du müde bist und so enttäuscht bist, hat die FBI einen Spot auf ihrem Website, wo du sie berichten kannst. Oh ja. Yeah, right. The FBI are about as useless as tits on a bull, unless you took an unsupervised tour of the Capitol Rotunda on January 6, 2021, or you're a 14-year-old being edgy in a Discord channel. They're not going to do anything.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
He's not going to do that. The point is, once they have something that the kid doesn't want people seeing, it's over.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I would wager that the chances are pretty small, though not entirely non-existent, but probably not too much more than non-existent. But perception is reality. If the kid thinks that the perp is going to send their shirtless or naked or... Whatever, picture out to the school.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
That's all the predator needs, because it's the fear of what might happen that's going to motivate the actions of the part of the victim. And that's true of adults as well as kids. The difference is that the adults are way more likely to be like, yo, go away, I'm not going to call the cops. The kids are terrified. They don't want to bring their parents into it. And that's the whole point.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You are freaking out all the parents listening to this show right now. Gut, sie sollten überrascht werden. Ich würde lieber, dass jeder Vater, der zu diesem Episode gehört, überrascht wird, als dass ein einziger ihrer Kinder zu einem dieser Art von Schäden verurteilt wird. Vor allem, weil, wie du weißt, das ist nicht so etwas wie zerstöre deinen Internet-Router und bürge deinen MacBook.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Das ist nicht die Lösung zu diesem Problem.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, I think the main thing is people need to be very clear with their kids about safety on the internet. And I'm sure that you're going to get a lot of eye rolls and, oh, God, Mom, whatever. I'm not going to get exploited online. I remember being a teenager very well. I have no idea. My kid is seven years old. I'm still in my...
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, this is a rabbit hole that if you get down it deep enough, they'll be blackmailing the kids to cut themselves on video. They'll be blackmailing the kids to starve themselves. There was one where they were blackmailing the kids to take estradiol. It's just gross.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I have a friend who runs a soup kitchen in Connecticut, and he gets a lot of people who have to do court-mandated public service, and he gets...
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
dass die konsistente Theme ist, dass das, was sie genossen hat, ein Kind schmerzt.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Terrible. So yes, it's so gross, it's so dangerous. Which doesn't mean you have to burn every digital bridge in your house, but like, treat it like parents treated a public park in 1987 after Johnny Goshen and Walsh. You gotta be mindful, you gotta be careful, you gotta communicate with your kids, you gotta tell your kids to have some stranger danger on the internet.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
What you need to communicate to them in the same conversation is that if they ever get into any kind of trouble online, that you are going to be there for them and that you are going to support them and that no, they're not going to be in trouble because some creepy weirdo coerced them or tricked them into sending dirty pictures of themselves.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You need to be very, very, very, very, very clear with them about that. If you think that this is happening to you, this is like you go to a party with your friends and the kid who drove you got drunk. Or you got drunk and you were driving. Call me. I'll come pick you up. That same type of conversation where it's like, think of it that way.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Your 16 year old drives his friends to a party and gets drunk. Ja. Ja. That's the thing that you need to communicate to them. I would also communicate to them, the creepy weirdo could be another kid. Because kids sexually abuse other kids. Kids manipulate, blackmail, sexually abuse other kids. And that's a thing that doesn't quite get enough attention.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I'm not really sure what you can do other than get out in front of it and communicate to them that the door is open, you don't blame them, you're there to help them, that sort of thing.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, and kids have a very poor sense of life's very real dangers. I would maybe also mention, if you don't want to talk to me about it, talk to a teacher, counselor, all that kind of stuff. I don't mean it as an afterthought, but the kids think probably correctly that you're going to get roped into it, even if they tell their pastor or their teacher or whatever.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
But whatever, they need to talk to somebody about it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I was pretty... report that the threats get worse with greater compliance. 82% are too scared to see Gelb. And that's, I think, where you can really make the difference, I think.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
said what is euphemistically called self-generated child sexual abuse material, but which, you know, is a 50 cent word for nude selfies.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Don't worry, it'll be back down to 20 grand by the time this podcast comes out. Good, I'm gonna buy more. Jim Cramer said it's going to the moon, everybody, it's over. Ultimately, though, these scammers, they're just playing a numbers game.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, it's only 6%, but yeah, I agree, that's nuts. 25% of the respondents of the survey viewed it as normal behavior. That includes kids age 9 to 17, so who knows what the bell curve on that is. But as you say, it's normalized. And I'm not going to tell parents that, oh, just throw your hands up, the world's going to hell and you can't do anything about it.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
It's going to send their nudie pictures to half the school and it's just what the kids are doing these days. I think that's just untrue. I think parents have tons of influence over their kids, but Gute Kinder machen Fehler. Und sogar, Quote, Quote, schlechte Kinder müssen nicht getargetet und verletzt werden von Älteren, weil sie einen Fehler gemacht haben oder 100 oder 10.000.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
But yeah, I completely agree. And if you're a grown up, the weird Russian hacker does not have any pictures of whatever it is you do when you're alone.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
If you send out an email saying, hey man, I have a video of you beating your meat, send me $10,000, or I'm sending it to everyone you work with, to 10 million people, and .01% of them respond, that's 1,000 people, and you just made a cool 10 million bucks.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I am a degenerate crypto gambler and if there's one thing that I know how to do, it's multiply by factors of 10.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Oh mein Gott, ich würde meine Kinder in die Slaverie für das Level der Konversion verkaufen. So, I really doubt these guys are converting even at .01% with their weird, malformed, broken English. But drop a couple zeros off the end of that 10 million, it's still a good paycheck for a day's work.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Untertitelung des ZDF für funk, 2017 It's not terribly sophisticated or even much of a problem, except for the rare people who send them money. Weirdly, no one is really concerned with this type of sextortion. No one really seems to care.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I think there's a couple pretty obvious reasons why, and that's the people who fall for this scam, this type of sextortion scam, they're not real eager to go report the crime because... They maybe figured out that they got scammed and as a guy who has been scammed. Wait, did you pay us extortionist? No, I sent Russian dudes like 10 grand for cryptocurrency miners.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, that must have stung a little bit. It does. And I think it's worth taking some time to talk a little bit about how I felt afterward. It is so not about the money. Losing the money sucks. Don't get me wrong. $10,000 is $10,000. But it's so humiliating. You feel like some idiot boomer. I was so mad at myself for being so stupid.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
And I was honestly more mad at myself that I wasn't the scammers.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I hate talking about this, so we can totally just move on now. But this was six months ago, and it still chaps my buns to think about it. Yeah, that makes sense. I get the idea of not bothering to report something because it seems so futile. What's the point? And the other thing is, if they get the victims once, there's a good chance they're going to get the victims again.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
I guess they don't generally ask for a ton of money. It's probably something negligible, say 100 bucks, 500 bucks. But the thing with blackmail is, though, you can just keep going back to that as many times as you want. Why is someone who's blackmailing you going to be honest with you about stopping blackmailing you once they have your 500 or your 100 bucks or whatever it is?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
So how can people be safe when it comes to sextortion scam emails? Don't send them money. Don't click links. This is like basic Internet hygiene. At the end of the day, this is just a phishing attack. They're just phishing. I'd wager that most of the people who get got by this are the ones who click links saying like, hey, I put your nude pictures here, come check it out.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
The scammers are absolutely counting on there being a non-trivial number of people who just cannot resist clicking links. die sagen, hey Mann, deine Nudes sind hier. Sie wissen, dass es einen bestimmten Art von Person gibt, der diesen Link klicken muss, der sich nicht helfen kann.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You should keep up to date on cyber security and scams in general because guess what? If you're in the age demographic for this show, you are growing into an old and out of touch person who has no idea how technology works and you are a prime target for a scam.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, Krebs is a good site. They tend to veer away from the total batshit insanity and paranoia, which that's not productive or helpful either.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
You have to be mindful. For example, there's a new addition to these phishing emails, extortion scams, where they send pictures of your house.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, it's the most generic low-res photo of the outside of your house that's on Zillow. Yes, exactly. How many times does the exterior of your house appear on the internet for anyone who has your address to find? Which is a really good segue into the question that I'm sure a lot of people who get these have, which is like, how do they know who I am? How do they know my name?
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
A lot of times they might have your address in it or like your phone number, your email, something like that. So... Wie haben sie das? Yeah, they're just buying data files off of, you know, dark, shadowy corners of the internet where people traffic in personal data. Your name and email, probably your address, maybe your social security number, your credit card numbers, they may be in there too.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
What's not in the file of data that they bought off the dark web about you? Yeah, anything remotely incriminating at all? Absolutely correct. This is not how blackmailers work. Blackmailers show you the proof they have something they're gonna blackmail you with.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
They don't say, hey man, I got naked pictures of you and here's the proof, it's your front door and the last four digits of your phone number.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Yeah, I got the Google Maps car to take a picture of your front door driving by and I got the last four digits of your phone number and, you know, your first pet's name, dude, and that means I have pictures of your wang. You've seen spy movies. There's a scene where the KGB agent hands over the Manila envelope mit der Beweise.
The Jordan Harbinger Show
1128: Sextortion | Skeptical Sunday
Okay, that's a good question. And I've got a really big reveal for you that you weren't aware of when you sent me out to research this for you. Lay it on us, Chief. People are freaking out about this because there's a variant of this extortion scheme that is not a glorified phishing scam. It's a means to sexually exploit children.