Dr. Gordon Flett
Appearances
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Emily Falk on How to Rewire Your Brain for Better Choices | EP 596
I'd say just as a quick snapshot, if you feel like you're not just a non-essential worker, you're a non-essential person. Everybody's essential. Everybody matters. And you have the potential to make a difference in people's lives. But if you're walking around feeling like that, you've probably got this sense of anti-mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Emily Falk on How to Rewire Your Brain for Better Choices | EP 596
And the other thing that we've been studying lately as an extension of that is the fear of not mattering so that you feel like you matter now, but you anticipate maybe you won't matter down the road.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Self-esteem is more about feeling liked and feeling competent and feeling competent. But mattering is that sense of feeling valued and being important. And he showed in his original work that once you took into account self-esteem, that mattering was very much more predictive over and above.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And there's been multiple papers because that's the challenge for researchers when they have something that they think is fairly new is they have to show that it predicts above and beyond other measures like, like self-esteem or sense of belonging. And of course they're all correlated.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So somebody who feels like they matter tends to have higher levels of self-esteem and higher levels of belonging, but they're different. And when somebody has a lack of mattering as their core things, there's no way around it by boosting self-esteem where you might add to some narcissistic tendencies or the sense of belonging. And I found this one time, by the way, with a boy who had
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
been given one of our questionnaires and he wrote on it when it weren't supposed to write on it. He'd circled, I don't matter to anyone. And then he says, and this I know for sure he wrote.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I was telling the school board, I said, look, with this boy, if he's coming for counseling, unless you address that core sense of not mattering, educational initiatives, self-esteem initiatives aren't going to get to what he needs because he's got that core sense of just not being important to anyone when he overgeneralized.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And that's the thing about mattering is that you can say, I don't matter to anyone. That's why it's important for someone to show somebody they matter because then they can no longer say, I don't matter to anyone. And then overreact as a result of that.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yeah. I just wanted to add that in our original work with the school board, about two thirds of the kids said they felt they mattered, but the other third said they either didn't matter or they weren't sure. And a really important element and the thing to realize about mattering is we can measure it generally as we typically do.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But you can measure mattering at school mattering in the Community mattering at work, so it cuts across these domains. and research that's been done with kids mostly in the US on the mattering in the Community indicates that 45 to 50% of them say they don't matter in the Community. And to me, I said, well, we don't address that as a core thing.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
What chance is there in terms of raising well-being and helping them develop the way they could in terms of their potential? So it's shocking when you think about the sheer volume of people at different ages who feel like they don't matter.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Right, right. Well, their theory focuses on three primary needs that everyone needs to have satisfied. The need for autonomy, the need for competence, and the need for relatedness. So it links mostly with the need for relatedness. But I actually did find a quote from them. that I'm cherishing that I found where they talked about belonging and mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It's tucked away, but I cite it now quite frequently and realize that they had been thinking about this without going and drilling down. People who are feeling like they matter feel like they have a sense of agency. They have a sense of self-determination. But they also have unfulfilled needs in terms of that sense of competence and autonomy.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And we've shown with our work on the anti-mattering, which is that feeling invisible, that when people say they feel a strong sense of not mattering with that scale, it's very robustly correlated with all of those needs in terms of deficits across those three core needs. But it predicts above and beyond in terms of other outcomes. Let me put it to you this way.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
One of my students also has a class that he's teaching. I gave an exercise to the students and said, here's what competence is. Here's what relatedness is. Here's what this is. Here's a bunch of other needs, including this one we call mattering. Please rank them in terms of which is the most important to you and the people you know And mattering came out over and above those other ones.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And another illustration with the school board project is we had principles at a table where we had all these concepts on cutouts. And we said, we got like 15 psychological concepts here, like jargon city in terms of, we've got self compassion and optimism and. grit and all of these cons growth mindset.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And they said, well, all of these are important, but we said, which one would you pick and just go through them in order. And the principals unanimously agreed that mattering was the top thing out of the 14 or 15 that they picked. And when asked why, they said it's because it applies to everyone. It applies to our students. It applies to our teachers.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It applies to our staff and the custodial staff, the parents in the community. And then they immediately made the tie into the The kid was the one caring adult who changes the life of that kid. When I see those sorts of things, that's how I know that we can look at research findings, but it's something that has incredible resonance with people once they understand what the concept is.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And usually they then tie that to somebody that they've known in their past has made them feel that way.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
What I would say is like people talk about, as we have talked about belonging, they talk about connection, but mattering is about those special connections that everybody wants to feel special to someone. They want somebody who truly understands them at a level that nobody else does. And so many people don't feel understood and they don't feel seen or heard.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And, but it's largely about those feelings and it's tied to memories that people have. that a time when they've had someone like that. And I remind myself of this when I go and I look at popular things that are out there. I go, why are some of these things so popular? So fictional wise, I always come to the movie, It's a Wonderful Life, where there's Jimmy Stewart's character shown.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
What would it be like if he didn't exist? Which, you know, you do not matter. You don't exist. The other fictional example I point to is Mr. Holland's opus with Richard Dreyfuss at the end when he thinks he's wasted his life and
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
he's not really going to do the great symphony and he retires and there's that room, that auditorium filled with his former students who he's impacted in ways he didn't understand.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And it just, it's the, it's the value of the rewardingness of people and the comfort that comes from knowing that there are people who really, you know, it's not just loving you, but they really care about you and they would miss you if you weren't around. And,
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It even goes through, I realized I was looking at, I gave a talk for a hospice organization and the Cicely Saunders, I believe is her name, who has the famous phrase, you matter to the end of your life, even when you're not here, no longer you matter and you'll never be forgotten. That sense of people want It's about their identity too. It's like they want a sense of unique identity.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I added this in my description of mattering, the need to feel like a unique individual who people are seeing as somebody with unique, positive properties, a sense of individualization. And people, that's the thing about belonging versus mattering is that you're, you've got a unique identity within that group.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yes. I haven't studied reciprocity per se, but in the new book that we just, you know, I just finished talk about mutual mattering. In terms of that reciprocity and when you're really locked in with somebody, you've got that sense of reciprocity where they understand you and you understand them, but they're looking out for you and you're looking out for them.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And the book I always go back to read to remind myself of this is Tuesdays with Maury. It should have been called Tuesdays with Maury and Mitch, Mitch Albom's book that was a gigantic bestseller. And I said, there's Mitch Albom going back to visit his professor who's in his final days, or he's heading in that direction.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And that sense of caring about each other and how much he seemed to miss that in terms of when they'd lost contact. And that's the key. And that's the best thing in terms of With parent-child relationships where, you know, there's that sense of connection where the child is showing concern for the parents' feelings as well.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And that whenever they get to that stage, some young people intuitively seem to have that component. Reciprocity is key. One-sided mattering is going to feel bad at some point in terms of, Hey, I'm doing all this stuff for them, but They're not doing it for me. Nancy Schlossberg, who was another big name in the field, looked at this in terms of caregivers.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And she said, it's the only time when you feel that mattering is not really good is that it's you're feeling too dependent on, and it's more one way so that you're not getting the recognition. So you have to perhaps remind yourself of times when, if it's an aging parent, maybe dealing with dementia, when they were able to engage that way.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Or there'll be moments where you get that glimmer, but when it's too one way, it can become a sort of a compulsive thing where it's all focusing on other people's needs. Especially glad your framework includes that focus on mattering to yourself, because ultimately I fear what happens with far too many people is they don't feel like they matter to others. And then they internalize it.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I talk about this in terms of the internalization so that I don't matter to anyone. I don't matter to myself anymore, which potentiates a lot of very bad, risky behaviors. with young people that could be internalizing in terms of self-harm, but it could also be acting out and doing things where you're not worrying about consequences because you don't see a future.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And mattering to yourself wraps around that concept of hope and optimism in terms of what you are yourself in terms of the future. And if you don't matter to yourself, then you just act whichever, which way, because you're not saying anything that you're going to lose down the road. A psychologist, I'm not a clinical psychologist.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
My closest colleague in the perfectionism work, Paul Hu, we've been working together for 30, 35 years now. And he talks about the relationship that the self has with the self. that you've got to be kind to yourself. You've got to care about yourself and not be so hard on yourself as perfectionists tend to be because they feel that they're pushing themselves by being so hard on themselves.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But ultimately it's a recipe for exhaustion and being totally drained. And you've got to learn to be accepting of oneself over here, set up for all those bad choices.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yeah, I have to say here that when you said to giving a gift, I immediately, my mind went to being at the bottom of our stairs here, waiting for our daughters to come down the stairs to see. Caught them sneaking down there early a couple of times along the way too, but just the looks on people's faces.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And how that makes you feel to realize that you've had that impact where people think, wow, that's somebody who's really thinking about me. And I did find that as a big shift for me as you get older. But you do get that sense of having a positive impact. So it reflects back on you in terms of you can make a difference in other people's lives and that special glow.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Which I learned back when I was the undergraduate director, because the person I inherited the role from said, unlike most things where you'll send a paper off to a journal and be waiting months and wondering, is anybody going to read this when I actually have it out there, if it goes out there. When you're the undergraduate director, you have students with real problems, real lives right there.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
You can do something about it. And he says, you'll get that glow of knowing that, Hey. I actually am making a difference around here, that this student's life is going to be better, this person got back on track. And it does develop a sense of what we, interpersonal efficacy, where you feel you can have a positive impact on others.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And the other thing that we've been studying lately as an extension of that is the fear of not mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And some people, I think, have taken what they've learned through mattering to others in terms of relationships, and then they've gone on to careers in terms of public service. And anybody who's in a public service will know about what it means in terms of wanting to make a difference in people's lives and how you feel like you do make a difference in people's lives.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And when they're prone to burnout is when they get to that point of saying, I don't matter. Nobody's paying attention to this. If I didn't show up for work, nobody would miss me. And that's one of the key elements that's not been studied extensively, but there's clear links between feelings of not mattering and psychological burnout and demoralization in the workplace.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
To the point that the US Surgeon General, Vivek Murthy, Dr. Murthy included that as one of his five pillars in terms of workplace mental health, the feeling of mattering in the workplace. So I think of that though, in terms of, I think back to the pandemic and here's those situations where we celebrated first line people, front line people. And celebrations at night, ringing bells and that.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And then later I've seen accounts of going, hey, where did all the appreciation go? Because suddenly it's not taking on that spotlight. But you get that sense of making a difference in people's lives. And the key part, which Nancy Schlossberg talked about, a key element of the mattering concept is the feeling of being appreciated.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Once you know that you're appreciated, it's like a sense of validation. That's not going to be creating narcissism or false feelings about the self that, Hey, I somebody sees that I made a difference. And this is when I am asked to give advice for perfectionistic kids and their parents. Parents say, what can we do? I said, how about you spend some time volunteering?
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I'd say just as a quick snapshot, if you feel like you're not just a non-essential worker, you're a non-essential person. Everybody's essential. Everybody matters. And you have the potential to make a difference in people's lives. But if you're walking around feeling like that, you've probably got this sense of anti-mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Where your child learns that it's not all about grades and competition, but you can actually feel really good about yourself in a lasting way by going out and doing something for other people. And you don't forget it. And but also when you're in a occupation where you feel you should be getting some acknowledgement and appreciation, instead, maybe you get criticism or no attention.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It can cut you both ways in terms of that as well.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yeah. I won't go into this in great detail. In terms of the scale, it talks about things like To what extent do you feel insignificant? To what extent do you feel invisible? But I think one of the things that's correlated with antimattering that probably might amplify feelings of it is when people feel really isolated and lonely. There's a very strong correlation.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I just have a recent chapter on loneliness and loneliness. feelings of not mattering. And the premise of the chapter is the loneliness epidemic actually an epidemic of feelings of not mattering because they're so highly correlated.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And even when I look at the items to measure loneliness per se, I see all these anti-mattering type items that are in there that sort of pull for those two to be related. So it's a sense though of really feeling like if you weren't around, nobody would miss you. And there's different levels of it so that
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
You know, you can have a moderate level, but if you have an extreme level, which sadly some people do, I've seen perfect scores on our measure that are so alarming. This is where you'd say, I don't matter to anyone. And people seem to be going out of the way to make me feel insignificant or they look through and past me.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
People in homelessness situations say you feel like people are just looking beyond them and they're not really there. But some people have lives, lives like that. And it's also possible to have a general feeling of mattering. because we've shown in profiles that people have a sense of positive mattering, but they also have a sense of antimatter because maybe
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
They have a background where they know they matter to people, but they're in a work context where they're made to feel irrelevant. And that famous thing about essential workers versus non-essential workers. I'd say, just as a quick snapshot, if you feel like you're not just a non-essential worker, you're a non-essential person. Everybody's essential. Everybody matters.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And you have the potential to make a difference in people's lives. But if you're walking around feeling like that, you've probably got this sense of anti-mattering. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
,,,,,, ,,,,,,, And people realize that people are very busy. So if you give them a little bit of time that they realize, Hey, I'm important enough. They gave me some of their valuable time. But so many leaders don't figure it out.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And I talk about human costs, but if somebody added up the financial costs, you know, people not being as productive as they could or being ill, it pays for itself, but I think it mostly pays in terms of. the people themselves in terms of how they feel as a result of their interactions. I feel sorry for that lady.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
She cut herself off from rewarding interactions and a more enjoyable workday by not getting talking to some of the people and probably also not learning some of the things that would then enable her to make important decisions down the road. I won't pick on her too much, though. I don't even know the...
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yeah, and I always think of my favorite fictional detective, Bosh, with Michael Connelly. Everybody counts or nobody counts. And everybody in an organization is important. Because they're going to be an opportunity to do whatever for whoever. And as you say, sometimes the greatest ideas come from having many minds focused on the same thing and many voices talking about it.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I found there are schools and there are even some school boards here are now trying to put a focus on mattering, but it's the exception rather than the rule. And for those kids who don't feel like they matter at home and they don't matter in the community, if they matter at school, then they can no longer say I don't matter anywhere. And they can get out of that type of thinking.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And one of the concerns of course, with the generation that we're dealing with now is social media addiction. And if you feel like you don't have that sense of mattering in your day to day, whether it's at school, family relationships, And you can turn to the internet and social media to try and get that sense of mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And there is some initial research, including studies I've been involved with, linking the feeling of not mattering and the unmet need to matter with social media addiction. And that sets you up, I think, for maybe more contact with people, but not the kind of quality relationships that provide that key, unique sense of self-worth.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
My thing about schools is that it would be very easy for schools to implement something that would enhance the sense of mattering of everyone at the school if there's no focus on it. And it doesn't take a lot of time or energy. I did come across one school in our resilience project that was supposed to be in a comparison group.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And I looked at the scores and the students in the school had much better adjustment and much a bigger sense of mattering. So I asked the school board educators, I said, what's up with this school? Because this shouldn't even be a control school. Whatever they're doing, people need to do more of it. And they said that, well, on Mondays, the school-wide theme is Mental Health Mondays.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
and fridays it's physical fridays for the physical well-being so that sort of initiative where it's coming from the top of the school and then comes in various ways as part of how the week unfolds and sends the message right at the start that hey we realize that you need to matter and you matter to us to the point where we've structured this and made it a focus
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And try to show how you let your fellow students know that they matter so you can develop more peer relationships. But I do think that the mental health issues of young people today, whether it's anxiety, depression, loneliness, suicidality, mattering and that feeling of not mattering has a very strong role to play.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Thanks for having me, John. I am glad we finally got together, and we have done a lot of things, I believe.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It's not the only thing, of course, but for many, it's at the core element of this. And when they feel that they don't matter, then there's little reason to become engaged in learning. So this is what I was telling our educators is that the ultimate goal for them was to increase learning outcomes and to decrease problem behavior that was really problematic in several schools.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And I said, people need that sense of a future and a sense of worth, and that will carry over in terms of learning, and it will carry over in terms of behavior so that
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
people are going to benefit young people benefit in multiple ways and it can create a culture so if you can foster an environment where it's across where it's a workplace or a school or wherever where that is a very salient thing and people do big things or small things to promote the sense of mattering among the people they interact with it can have an enormous benefit and i've seen it so i actually found with the school behind us and the principal who we renewed acquaintances with on friday that
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I found the initial documents where they went and selected staff that had this kind of an orientation to kind of people who orientation so that it was a brand new school at the time. And it was something that was built in baked in in terms of picking people. You could carry this message and this way of interacting with people.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
don't have any research per se except to turn back to that work on doing for others in terms of volunteering or mentoring and how there's a literature on this now usually these papers on volunteering or mentoring don't mention mattering as key ingredients in terms of those interactions but they say well there's a benefit to this and benefit to that and what is it about that and it's in terms of that relational side of things where you can see somebody's face light up when they learn something that they weren't able to learn
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
That transformation because you were able to tutor them in a way that got them on the right track where they suddenly are not self-doubting anymore. But generally speaking, like I said, I do believe there's even examples in terms of that making a difference in other people's lives. There's case examples of people with severe forms of mental illness, and then they were given a role.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
within a setting or helping a fellow patient or that where they suddenly realized hey i can do something worthwhile for somebody else and i do have this positive and it transforms them and it's a key it's a key to their well-being just one example of this how people can lose sight of this though for years i don't go to church often but my wife did and the church where we were married and the minister who actually married us ended up suffering from severe depression a fabulous guy
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And he knew I studied perfectionism and he had in perfectionism inclinations. So he asked after two months off due to depression and the whole congregation knew that he was depressed. He asked if I could drop by the man's, the house where they live and just talk to him. And on my way there, I got the feeling this is before I was really studying mattering to the degree that I do now.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I said somewhere along the way, I think he's lost the sense of just how much he means to other people. So as part of our three hour conversation, I said, I need to remind you what you mean to people, you know, to us, to our kids, to the broader congregation. My wife, when she had a health incident that was almost potentially fatal, he came to the hospital. and made sure that she was doing okay.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I was just named the honorary president of the Canadian Psychological Association, which is quite an honor and has had former presidents like Albert Bandura and Kahneman of Kahneman and Tversky, but to me it's an opportunity to get people to find out more about mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So I don't know if that was it, but I suspect that it was because within 10 days he was back at work and doing much, much better. And I said, but it also taught me a lesson though. Like how can people who do so much for others lose sight of that? This is where people judge themselves according to some very difficult standards and lack of self accepting.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And I've actually been to a few things that are sad in a sense, but where somebody far too young has passed away. And you get there and there's three or 400 people and you're going, did this person realize just how much they meant to all of these people? I had a grad student who passed away tragically around the age of 40.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And when we got to the funeral, there was 500 people there because what I learned was, although he procrastinated on his own work, he was a master tutor in terms of statistics. And he literally went around the university helping out any grad student he could find or undergrad who was having problems with statistics. And it's too bad that people don't realize this.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It's like Jimmy Stewart in It's a Wonderful Life. He didn't realize his impact until he was shown what it would be like if he wasn't around anymore. And I think people need to get reminders. So this is what I tell parents is just don't assume that your kid knows that he or she matters.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Show them, remind them, talk about it, and realize that you matter as part of it as well, because parents also lose sight of how much they matter, especially when they feel like it's a thankless role at times. But parents, one piece of advice I give is for that situation where the teenager looks like they don't want any input from the parent, Give it a try anyway.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And then you can say, well, directly, you can say, hey, I just want you to know, even though you don't seem to want to talk to me, that I'm interested in finding out what's going on with you. Because they will remember that. They might not acknowledge it, but they'll know that somebody actually cared about them and their parents trying to show an interest.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Well, we can't forget as well the mattering to yourself part of it and to people remind themselves of what they have done if they don't feel that way in the current situation with what they've done in the past. But I think the outreach to other people can be through small ways, just checking in on somebody.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
is one way to get their sense of mattering up and then you will feel that you matter as well in terms of the reaction. The principal I referred to at the school was the master of the lost art of writing somebody a personal note.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I'll be giving a keynote address at our annual convention and we'll be focused on mattering and how it can make a difference in people's lives.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But you can also write a note to yourself in terms of reminding yourself about things that you've done that people seem to have appreciated and things that you could do if you're not having a chance at the current time. Really a key thing though is spending time with people.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
my my one brother said one time he never went beyond high school but he said to me one of the wisest things i've ever heard he says your time is limited so if you give your time to somebody that's the most precious gift of all so spending time with someone shows that you want to be with them that you're valuing them in a way and unfortunately in the busy world that we have too many situations where people are left to themselves and they don't get that interaction but
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Even just saying to somebody, I've been thinking of you, means that, hey, of all the things that are there to distract you and all the social media, that you were the person on their mind, not to the point of stalking or something like that.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But on the flip side of course is the anti matter you want to make sure that you're not doing the things that will make people feel less than to feel devalued or undervalued. So for instance, try not to spend time looking at your cell phone when you're interacting with somebody, try to have some eye to eye contact and put the phone away.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
That's called phubbing, P-H-U-B-B-I-N-G, in case people thought I said something differently. And don't add to that sense of, hey, they don't see me, they're not really paying attention, they're not listening to me, because that can be just as destructive as all of the positive things that I've said.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And the work by the Gottmans on marital interactions showed that if you had a very difficult something with a partner, like somebody harshly criticized you, it's going to take about seven years or so positive exchanges to make up for that one negative exchange.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So in addition to doing the positive things, make sure to try and limit the negative that will be destructive and give that sense of fears and feelings of not mattering. So it can go both ways.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
massive changes that the potential is there in terms of, especially we talk about the divisions that are amongst people right now. What I tell people is people have more in common than they don't. And something that ties someone together is that everybody has that shared need to matter.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And that's important to realize that even when people who have fallen by the wayside or done things that are horrible, even people think about it this way, if somebody is engaged in criminality at some level, they still have a need to matter too. And unfortunately, They didn't have people in their lives who positively exchanged with them in a way that satisfied that need.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So maybe I can matter by joining this gang who gives me the attention. So the search for significance through maladaptive, inappropriate ways. But if we dedicated ourselves to this in organizations and in communities, it could transform everything. And we've got a federal election just starting here in Canada. And the ad that's running with our short-term prime minister, Mark Carney,
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
talks about we care about people just that sense of people knowing that people generally do care and it's authentic can go a long way but when we have situations where maybe as every second young person says i don't matter in my community we can say what can we do in the community to make a difference and I'll just very quickly tell you a story.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I know we're going long here, but we once went to Maine to a town called, I think, Machias, and it has the most famous blueberry pie in the United States. And my wife said, hold off till you get across the border because you're going to get some of the blueberry pie.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And unbelievably, the night before we went to this inn where there's the restaurant with the award-winning pie that won the national award, the restaurant burned to the ground.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And I said, oh, my God, there goes the pie. But these young people who just took over the place, they've lost their place. Where does mattering in the community come in? They told us when we got there that their town was very now concerned about all the students who had summer jobs at that place. So the town was getting together the following Tuesday to say, what jobs can we come up with?
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
What opportunities can we come up with? We can help these young people who now have lost their employment as a result of this burning down. I said, I would want to live in that community.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Who wouldn't want to live in that community where people are looking out for each other and deciding that, hey, we'll look past what race, whatever sexual orientation and realize that everybody has this core sense of need to matter. And we can do a better job at making everyone realize that they do indeed matter.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
When you need it the most. And that's a key thing about reciprocity. I should have said is that it involves a responsiveness to someone's needs when they send out a signal or you can figure out that they need something, whether it's the help of neighbors or whatever.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Responding to that is a key time because then they say, hey, this person has tuned into me and what I need and was sensitive that I needed it. On the other hand, if the signal's there, that signal's up and you don't respond, that also then adds that sense of, hey, I'm alone here. I don't have that sense of connection. And that's the key is the responsiveness when somebody clearly needs it.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Great neighbors, you want to stay there as long as you can.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I think it's when people don't realize that they matter as we were talking about earlier, but also just how I like to change that around a little and say that people have told me like, Jennifer Wallace, for instance, have told me that knowing about this concept has changed how they interact with people.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
The research really hasn't picked up on that yet in terms of how people have had their lives changed as a result of being attuned now more to the relational side of things as opposed to the achievement.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
One thing that I learned, and this goes back in praise to my colleague Paul Hewitt in our work on perfectionism over the years, is that he said all along in therapy that perfectionists are driven by unmet interpersonal needs. And the achievements driving that's excessive that will end up maybe creating major health problems for them is driven by unmet needs.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So indeed, one of the unmet needs is the need to matter. And We need to get a better appreciation of how achievement and interpersonal are actually connected through the needs that are largely interpersonal. And there's now five or six studies showing that perfectionists of different age levels are ones that feel a net need to matter.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And it's like the striving is, okay, if I do something spectacular, if I'm famous, then people will give me the love, respect, attention, in the sense of being cared about that I've been lacking all this time.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yes. Yeah. The worst people off are the ones who actually attained perfection and find out that it didn't really matter to certain people that they really cared about.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
feeling like an imposter, feeling unseen and not wanting to share anything about themselves. And a lot of the other thing that I've talked about in this new book on kids is that the front that people put on where they let on that everything's okay. And this is especially the case when people feel like they don't matter because there's a sense of shame about it.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Maybe it's something about me is the reason why I don't matter. That's the sort of time talk to oneself that people have to stop doing. No, it could just be you're in the wrong place at the wrong time with the wrong people or you haven't had a chance. You need an opportunity to show that you matter.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But I learned very early on with students and was a champion of student mental health that they may look like they're doing okay and they're exceptionally talented and all kinds of potential, but dealing with things. And that's where I came up with the idea of individualization that you talk about students, but students are different. Each has their own unique history, unique set of experiences.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And what might be how somebody got that way is totally different for someone else. And taking the time to hear somebody's story and to be responsive is one of that keys of building that sense of individual connection with somebody and realize that things are much more complicated than they seem on the surface at times.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I appreciate it. The Psychology of Mattering book was in 2018, and it was the first full-scale book on this particular topic. Actually, I think I have it behind me. This is it here. And you notice the hands that came up brilliant, I thought, within the book cover. And this talked about mattering in terms of introducing it, but also mattering in terms of its link with mental health.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
You can feel like you don't matter because you're not getting the services that you need when you're seeking help, but also mattering at school, mattering in the workplace, and so on. And the new book, this one here, just published by the American Psychological Association. This is the full scale look at what is it like to be a kid growing up in today's world without a sense of mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
There's a top 10 list, for instance, of 10 indicators of kids feeling like they don't matter. Also, I talk about links with depression, anxiety, social media, physical violence issues as well. So full-scale look. And one of the key points that I could say about both books is that 10 years ago, there wouldn't be enough to write these books.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I struggled at first with the first book published in 2018, just to pull everything together because the literature wasn't as luminous as it is now. Now there's plenty enough and books on the way. And I've been asked to write a follow-up volume to the first book, edition two, plus one on perhaps on the workplace.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But what I'm pleased to see is that it's something that is a topic that resonates with the public. So it's not something that sits on a shelf and doesn't get put into action. And there's big ways and little ways that it can be injected into settings and organizations to really make people's lives much better.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Well, thanks, John.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And maybe we can have a follow-up sometime as I know you're invested in mattering and I also would like more chance to learn from you because I'm sure some stories like the ones that you've shared that I find when like-minded people with passion, if you want to say passion struck, get together and one person will say something and create a light bulb going off in the other person and then even some shared initiatives.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So thank you. Absolutely.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Sure.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It was fortuitous in the sense that I was a member of a club, one of the publishers that had discount books for graduate students. And I saw this book on the self and I sent off for it at the low price that they were offering it for, along with the provision to don't share it with others. And I came across this chapter by Morris Rosenberg, who was the person who originated the concept of mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And in that chapter, there was five pages and He gave the impression that here's this totally neglected element of the self that's so relevant to people of all ages, so predictive. And I just filed that away thinking, well, why aren't people studying this? But then I left alone. I had to finish my work, my dissertation on depression. And then later we were doing a project on depression.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
the transition to college. And I'm actually just finishing a paper on transition and the role of mattering as a key resource. And I said, one of the postdoctoral students said, hey, I came across the scale on mattering. And immediately the light bulb went off. And I said, yeah, we need to be including this.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And at the same time, I was asked to be the researcher for a provincial program on developing a resilience prevention program and encouragement program for young people and we were kicking around concepts and I said, well, there's this concept of mattering and with educators, they knew exactly what I was talking about.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It's tied into the idea of the one caring adult who can change a kid's life like Oprah Winfrey did with her teacher who she had on her second last show. So we included it as well. And while we were looking at that's when I also came up with the idea that just as important it is to feel like you matter. The feeling of not mattering is also something that sticks with you at a very deep level.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So we started measuring it there. but aside from that i'd say that i look back and i said was i being prepared to realize that this was a concept i was very fortunate to be raised by loving parents and grandparents and we actually had the two grandparents and my aunt in the house growing up so i had surrounded by adults and my my paternal grandmother
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I was the first born, so I was treated like that spoiled special kid, but I got a lot of attention. And then later on, the school experiences, including when our daughters, we have two daughters now grown up and the local school is just a block away. And that school was all about mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And when you have environments where it's right at the top, the principal and the staff who ironically, I just met the principal again, a couple of days ago at an event.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
they're all about the importance of the child as a person not just the curriculum and really to the point where the principal in a school of 900 students knew every kid by name and something about them so that she could walk up to them and the playground during recess and then just start talking and really giving that sense of individual attention which is one of the ways you end up feeling like
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And then when I became a faculty member at York, I became the undergraduate director. And I had these students come in who had many of the things that you described in terms of loneliness, disconnection, demoralized, depression. And these were excellent students who had just not got off to a great start.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And what they needed was somebody like me in that position to be able to show some faith in them and to give them some strategies.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
and one of the things that goes along with mattering it's the secret power i say a secret sauce of mattering is that it's very strongly correlated with hope people who feel like they matter have a sense of hopefulness about them at a very high level and not just hope in terms of being able to do things and make things happen but hopefulness about other people and other people are going to be for them when they need it and so i saw it and i've seen it in other people in terms of just how it's changed their lives and
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
brought them from a position where they're really not doing all that well to a position where, hey, suddenly they realize their strengths and they're more likely to develop self-compassion and other positive things that go along with it.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And in my new work, a new book coming out, I talk about with kids how if they feel like they matter, it comes with a host of other strengths, usually including hope and positive orientation towards the future and a sense of resilience that they'll be able to overcome challenges and obstacles and adapt as new situations emerge. They said, I just recently retired, but I'm busier than ever.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And it's like the famous line from the Al Pacino and the Godfather, just when I think I'm out, they pull me back in. And that's what mattering is. There's much more to be learned about it and much more in terms of heightening awareness, which is another reason why I appreciate this opportunity today.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Well, mattering is... It's essentially defined as feeling important, feeling significant, feeling like people are paying attention to you. What I really come down to and something we've added much more focus on recently is the sense of that you feel cared about, that somebody cares about you and that somebody really is looking out for you and thinking of you.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And when you have that, you can be able to carry that from situation to situation, even when those people aren't there. And then of course the flip side is when you feel like you don't matter. So you're not heard, you're not seen, you're feeling invisible, you're feeling overlooked, maybe feeling forgotten, which we call anti-mattering.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And that feeling is something that some people have at a chronic level. But you can also have those kinds of experiences, even if you have a sense of mattering and you have to learn how to cope with that kind of treatment. But another element of it that's key.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Because it almost sounds like you're waiting for somebody to treat you the right way, but also you can generate feelings of mattering by going out and doing things for others. Isaac Prelatensky has talked about this in terms of adding value to other people's lives and This is what I tell someone who says, well, people just aren't treating me the way I need to be treated.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
I'm just going to have to deal with this. And I say, well, you can become more involved. You can find a cause. You can make a difference in somebody else's life. And you know that you matter to them at least. And then you can go from there. But really it's something that's described as a feeling in terms of that.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
How does it make you feel when you feel like you matter or don't, but also it's described as a need. So that everybody has a need to matter and it's believed to be universal. And this is the way that Rosenberg talked about it in terms of needing to be significant and needing to feel like you're making a difference or people would miss you.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
It's one of the things that he said is that if you're somebody who knows you matter, you know that people would miss you if you weren't around anymore.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
Yeah, it's a very important point. When I was just doing work on this, somebody, we get reviewers that said, well, I already studied this and it's called belongings. And I said, there's a difference. And the difference has to do with, I see Matt, I see belonging as you're fitting into a place somewhere where you're in the circle.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
But mattering comes into play as if you're in a group setting, for instance, when people recognize you and hear your voice. When I had this experience, sometimes at meetings where I'm at, where I say, well, I belong at this meeting that they let me into this meeting. but nobody seems to wanna hear what I'm saying.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
So it's not just fitting in, it's a sense of importance or connect of being valued within the belonging setting. And one key difference is that school boards have told me, educators have told me that they can identify kids and they have identified kids who have a sense of belonging when they're measured, but they don't have a sense of being valued.
Passion Struck with John R. Miles
Dr. Gordon Flett on the Urgent Need to Know You Matter | EP 597
And they said, for some reason, it seems that these are the kids that may be the worst off in the sense that they're wondering why don't I have a sense of value, even though I clearly belong here. As for self-esteem and the original work by Rosenberg, he made the key point that it's not just self-esteem, that it's a unique element.