If the police don't rewatch movies, maybe we ought to do it ourselves. The Ringer’s Bill Simmons and Chris Ryan revisit the original ‘Death Wish’ from 1974, starring Charles Bronson and Vincent Gardenia. Podcast Manager: Craig Horlbeck Video Producers: Ronak Nair and Jack Sanders Try Loom today, visit loom.com to get started Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Chapter 1: What is the premise of the 'Death Wish' rewatch podcast?
The Rewatchables, brought to you by The Ringer Podcast Network. We're in a new studio for our video podcast. Look at this. Got Swayze. We brought Stallone. We brought CR. We decided to make this big-ass 70s month. Big 70s movies. I have no plan other than we did Star Wars, and we bought a lot of Goodwill. There's a lot of lobbying going on behind the scenes. For a big-ass 70s month?
And for which movies we do, yeah.
i feel like we're in one for us like century now who did star wars so much leeway so let's do death wish with charles bronson that's next was it worth it call him a mad vigilante call him a hero either way he's always on target we want you to get out of new york permanently never make a death wish Because a death wish always comes true. And you get to love it.
All right, CR. This is a podcast about Death Wish with Charles Bronson and vigilante movies and Charles Bronson himself. And I think all of them tie together. I think this is such an interesting movie. I don't know if it's aged that well. It has... A really awful scene in it, but this movie's also 51 years old. Do you want to start Bronson or Vigilantes?
Chapter 2: How did 1970s vigilante movies reflect societal anxieties?
I want to start Vigilantes, I think. And the idea of these normal, everyday businessmen becoming Batman in New York City, usually, and going out and handing out justice on their own terms, which then you have to read into the audience reaction to the movies at that time. Like, why were these movies popular? Yeah.
Well, and that's why we're doing the pod. So you have this cop vigilante era. Dirty Harry, 1971. Walking Tall, you big Buford Pusser guy. For sure. Three of those. And that was, Dirty Harry was, he's a San Francisco cop. Trying to find a serial killer. He's making his own rules. Yeah. That was, I think, the first. He's making his own rules. Watch out.
Not a lot of movies about cops who follow the rules. No, this one has really set the mark, though, for don't follow the rules. Yeah. Walking tall, sheriff trying to save his town, and he decides to bend some rules. And then Magnum Force was another one with Clint. Same type of thing. But nobody had really put all of it together with normal people until Death Wish. Yeah.
Where it's like, what happens? This guy's an architect. His wife and daughter are brutally assaulted. His wife dies. And he just kind of loses it. Yeah. And this leads to, they're still making these. I mean, I made a list. The Exterminator with Robert Ginty in 1980. Yeah. Remember that one? Yeah. Because I didn't, because I was- I remember the name. I don't know if I've ever seen it.
Never saw it.
Fighting Back with Tom Skerritt, 1982.
Yes.
I saw it in the theater. Yeah, I remember that. And then he went on to Top Gun. Death Wish 2, 1982, he moves to LA. Vigilante, Robert Forster and Fred Williamson, your guy. I don't know if I've ever seen that. Yeah, I didn't even know it existed. Death Wish 345, Falling Down, Michael Douglas, 93. The Substitute, our guy Tom Berger, 96. Yeah. The Brave One. Jodie Foster said, let me get in on this.
Yeah, that's basically a variation on this. Gran Torino, 2008. And now it just keeps going and going and going. Why do we like these? And then they remade it with Bruce Willis.
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Chapter 3: What is Charles Bronson's role and legacy in 'Death Wish'?
Chapter 4: How is New York City portrayed in 'Death Wish' and 1970s cinema?
It's just like all of Paul's more conservative friends are like, we should throw all these people in jail or whatever. And Paul's like, well, that's not what, you know, proper society does. Yeah. And he gets pushed and pushed and pushed. But I think a lot of it is almost like a midlife crisis movie as much as it's like a revenge movie.
Well, you hit this point when you get older with New York City where the fact that it seems like there's no ceiling and it's fucking crazy is like the best thing in the world. Yeah. But usually in New York, either... Late teens or mid-20s where you're like, this place is awesome.
I don't know what the fuck's going to happen.
I can get in so much fucking trouble here.
Oh, my God.
It doesn't shut down. I don't know what's going to happen at 3 in the morning. And then as you get older, you're right. You're like, man, New York's falling apart. I just feel like New York's basically been the same probably the entire time I've been alive. Yeah. Just it's how you portray it. Bronson, the Liam Neeson of the 70s.
Kind of unintentionally. Like, that's the thing. I mean, he's obviously always been this iconic action Western military character, and is just one of the most unique faces, voices, and vibes in movie history. But the craziest thing about him is to read interviews with him, and they're like, so you made Death Wish? And he's like, yeah, I actually don't think violence solves anything. Right.
He was like this very different kind of guy than the people he played.
He starts out, he's in Magnificent Seven, Great Escape, Dirty Dozen, Once Upon a Time in the West in the 60s. But he's like one of those guys. He's never the star of those movies.
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Chapter 5: What are the most notable and controversial scenes in 'Death Wish'?
Damn it, Ben Bradley. I don't know if that would have worked. Bronson, as Ben Bradley, would have been sick, though. Instead of Robards, if he was doing the speech at the end.
You better be right.
Nothing's riding on this other than the future of the country. And then he guns them both down. I'm literally going to kill you. He turned down the shootest that became a John Wayne movie, one of the last ones. He turned down City Slickers in 91 because he didn't want to die in the movie. He had this... I mean, the Bronson research, I'd defy anyone to find kind of a quirkier, weirder A-list star.
Give one normal response to a movie. Yeah, he would turn down parts because... The Shootist, I think that was the one where the guy has some sort of cancer. He's like, I don't want to have cancer in a movie. That's it. He's out. City Slickers, which was a great part that won Jack Palance the Oscar. Bronson's like, I can't die in a movie. And just turns it down.
And it would have been like the crowning achievement of his career. That's one of those old once upon a time in Hollywood rules he's following. It's like, I'm not supposed to die. Charles Bronson. He didn't get Capricorn 1, a movie that I might be the only one that likes. And then he tested for Escape from New York and the studio pushed for it. And Carpenter. For him to do Snake.
John Carpenter said he's too old.
Yeah, he would have been in his 60s by then. Because he's like in his 50s for Death Wish, right? Yeah.
would I not own Charles Bronson and escape from New York on 4k Blu-ray? Yeah, of course. But if you, it's, I don't think he could pull off a half of what's Russell does. No, I think you need stunt doubles, all that stuff. He felt like in this movie, he said, he, he said, I was a really miscast person.
It was more a theme that would have been better for Dustin Hoffman or somebody who could play a weaker kind of man.
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Chapter 6: How does the movie depict the protagonist’s transformation and vigilante justice?
Did you wish there was a scene where Paul in Death Wish was walking by Annie and Alvy from Annie Hall? Yeah, he probably shoots... He probably shoots Alvy.
Yeah, Alvy, whatever his name was. This film became a big deal. Bronson became a huge star. um, It eventually copycatted. It had these copycat vigilante incidents, most famously in 1984, which I remember because I was living in Connecticut at the time. Bernard Goetz just wiped out four subway dudes and it became the Death Wish murder. It was the biggest story in the tri-state area for a year.
And it felt like something. And then it would turn into people going on talk shows, talking about pros and cons of just being able to shoot people.
Right. Wacky era, CR. I mean, they're doing that in the media drops in Death Wish itself. Yeah. And I think one of the reasons why this is such an interesting movie to talk about on this pod is this was such a divisive movie at the time. Yeah. The reviews were like, all right, nice job. Or this is a deplorable piece of shit that should be flushed down the toilet. And it's true.
There was such a spectrum of responses. We're feeling the same thing with the, with the ringer team. You mean the hush from over here? I don't know if the guys, the guys over there, Craig might just be like, I'm not even reviewing this at the end of it. Michael winner, the mechanics, Scorpio, Scorpio and the stone killer. Scorpio, great title for a movie. Burt Lancaster.
I feel like Scorpio I'm probably in good hands. I don't really need to know anything else. Yeah, it's like CIA assassins chasing each other. Yeah, I sure am. He... He kind of goes off the... They bring him back for Death Wish 2. Where he goes to LA.
Which if you think this movie has a pretty deplorable assault scene in it, Death Wish 2 is like hold my beer and has one of the worst scenes that I actually can't... I think there's been stories written about it. It's kind of like the peak of how... Why did you guys decide this was a good idea to do in a movie that's going to be in the theater? Yeah.
And there's a lot of stuff written about just how fucking weird he was. Michael Winter.
Okay.
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Chapter 7: What are the most rewatchable scenes and iconic moments in 'Death Wish'?
That's right. Same thing. Yeah. You'd like to get wet. What I tell my kids. Yeah. Be careful. Uh, this movie was made for 3.7 million. And it made $30 million. Roger Ebert gave it three stars. What an interesting man. Death Wish is a quasi-fascist advertisement for urban vigilantes done up in a slick and exciting action movie. We like it even when we're turned off by the message. That was Rog.
Yeah. Then he said... Michael Winter gives us a New York in the grip of a reign of terror. This does look like 1974, but like one of these bloody future cities and science fiction novels about anarchy in the 21st century. Literally every shadow holds a mugger. Every subway train harbors a killer. The park is a breeding ground for crime. Urban Paranoia is one thing, but Death Wish is another.
Raj is really... Raj is like... He's not even looking at it.
The actual New York Times called this film irresponsible. Yeah. I think a lot of... I mean, there were a lot of critics. Did your dad review this? I would think this was a little bit before his movie critic days. This is 74. I don't think he was doing movies until the later 70s. He would have hated it, though.
Think about the New York parks and all the shit that was going on from a movie standpoint. Oh, like with cruising? The Warriors? Yeah. If you've just ever, like, maybe AI, you just merged all these things together.
The New York cinematic universe of the 1970s? This is a billion-dollar idea. Actually, it's not a billion-dollar idea.
Can't AI do this?
Just put everybody together? Sam Altman, come on.
I want Al Pacino from Cruising hanging out with Roy Scheider in Marathon Man. One other thing about this movie is we talk about titles a lot. One of the best titles.
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Chapter 8: How has 'Death Wish' aged and what cultural impact did it have?
Yeah, I just wanted to point out... Does this happen? I... Like where they do like stage. That was an elaborate stage. Yeah.
I couldn't believe how good that was.
Yeah. I ever see like the Indiana Jones stunt spectacular at Disney. No. It's pretty cool. Is it as cool as that? Guys are falling off roofs. Yeah, they do the whole boulder chase in the Indiana Jones thing. The guy runs away from a boulder. Yeah, it's at Disney, I think, or Universal.
Anyway, the whole sequence, actually, it's a sneaky, almost best, most rewatchable scene for me, like the 10-minute Tucson sequence.
I do know something about guns, Ames. I grew up with them, all kinds of guns. You see, my father was a hunter. I guess out here you'd call up a gunman. My mother was the other side of the coin. When my father was killed in a hunting accident, some fool mistook him for a deer, you see. My mother won the toss. I never touched a gun since.
Just because it really lays the groundwork, not only for what Paul's going to become, get a little bit of like, oh, when I was a child, I used to handle guns all the time.
The Bronson's getting better.
Thank you.
He's really workshopping.
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