The Jordan Harbinger Show
1137: Jay Dobyns | Undercover with the Hells Angels Part Three
Tue, 08 Apr 2025
By popular demand, former ATF agent Jay Dobyns returns to take us deeper into the logistics of infiltrating the Hells Angels and living to tell the tale! [Pt. 3 of 3 — find 1 here and 2 here!]Full show notes and resources can be found here: jordanharbinger.com/1137What We Discuss with Jay Dobyns:ATF agent Jay Dobyns first infiltrated the Solo Angels gang in Tijuana simply to gain credibility with the Hells Angels in Arizona — an infiltration within an infiltration to establish presence in a culture notorious for extreme scrutiny.The psychological toll of living a double life while undercover was severe. Taking handfuls of Hydroxycut to keep pace, Jay would cry himself to sleep from exhaustion and once signed a check with his undercover name, showing how blurred the lines became.At the Mesa clubhouse, when his hand moved toward his concealed weapon, a Hells Angel asked, "Jaybird, let me ask you something. Can you outdraw my trigger squeeze?" — one of many moments where Jay's survival hung by a thread, with only his wits as a safety net.Despite evidence gathered over two years, prosecutors reduced charges and sought plea deals with criminals in the Hells Angels organization rather than pursuing full prosecution — a profoundly frustrating outcome for Jay after years of risking his life to put these predators behind bars for good.Despite having his home burned down and contract killers sent after him, Jay made a life-changing decision: "I live with concern. I choose not to live in fear because if I live in fear, they own me." This powerful mindset shows that even after facing extreme adversity, we all have the ability to reclaim our power by refusing to let fear dictate our choices.And much more...And if you're still game to support us, please leave a review here — even one sentence helps! Consider including your Twitter handle so we can thank you personally!This Episode Is Brought To You By Our Fine Sponsors: jordanharbinger.com/dealsSign up for Six-Minute Networking — our free networking and relationship development mini course — at jordanharbinger.com/course!Subscribe to our once-a-week Wee Bit Wiser newsletter today and start filling your Wednesdays with wisdom!Do you even Reddit, bro? Join us at r/JordanHarbinger!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
Chapter 1: What challenges did Jay Dobyns face while infiltrating the Hells Angels?
Coming up next on the Jordan Harbinger Show. I'm at the Mesa, Arizona clubhouse. Beautiful clubhouse, like a Hell's Angels museum. And there's dudes standing around with guns out and pointing guns, asking these questions. Why are these guys talking shit about you? So I had a shoulder holster that held a pistol on each side.
And this one member notices, like, my hand is starting to make its way towards the pistol. And he said, Jaybird, let me ask you something. Can you outdraw my trigger squeeze? And I was like...
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Today, Jay Dobbins back on the show. He joined the ATF, that's the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, and went undercover in the Hells Angels.
Last time we had him on, we talked about undercover operations, prepping for those in general, a few details here and there, but we didn't really get into the weeds on what it's like to go undercover in the Hells Angels, the most notorious biker gang in the world. In this episode, we're going to do a deep dive on that. I won't spoil it. Here we go with Jay Dobbins.
Hey, man, thanks for coming back on the show. I know we just had you on, but we had such a good audience response from it. We had a really good, long conversation about your work at the ATF and how you started the undercover operation, but we never actually got into the Hell's Angels stuff. We basically just dipped our toes in it and then bounced off of it.
If people haven't heard the first couple episodes I did with you, I recommend they do go back and listen to those just so they get a little bit of a basis for some of this, your work in the ATF, outlaw biker gangs. how some of them operate and your undercover work in general. How did you get started doing undercover work?
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Chapter 2: How did Jay Dobyns manage the psychological toll of undercover work?
are asked to hang around which is an official title in the biker world a hang around is exactly that someone who's hanging around the club and they're deciding is club life really for me can i really do this and then they're being watched by members and those members are deciding is this someone that we want to keep around is this someone that is showing that they have the right stuff
From the hang around phase, then you become a prospective member, a prospect. And so with the Hells Angels, I don't know if this is universal, I was told as a prospect, you're a member without his patch. Like all our rules apply to you, all our bylaws and protocols and policies and all those things and all those standards that we live by, you have to live by them now.
as a prospect you're trying to prove yourself they're going to tell you where to be when to be there how to be there and it's non-negotiable as a prospect i was involved in some like outrageous crazy schemes on the high end up to a member ringing your phone at two o'clock in the morning and saying like i want a vanilla milkshake from mcdonald's everything in between and you better perform because everything you do is a test everything you say is a test
How you walk, how you talk, the motorcycle you ride, the condition it's in, what you know about it, your car, where do you live? Is there mail with your name at your house? Is there food in the refrigerator? Is there a half-eaten pizza in the refrigerator? Is there beer in there? Is there garbage in the waste? Is there toothpaste in the bathroom? Is there toilet paper and soap in there?
Like every single aspect and element of your life is being scrutinized. to confirm to them that you're a real person.
I don't suppose you can have them take their shoes off when they get into your house. That would be a deal breaker. My wife would never allow that.
Like, for example, you just set up an undercover house and you got some furniture in there. Like, me and you can walk in there and look around and say, no one fucking lives here. No one's spending any time here. When you live in a place, regardless of how, whatever your standard of cleanliness is or your maintenance is, there's going to be evidence and examples
of someone living there and so all those little things yeah that makes sense which came back like again i wasn't a biker investigator and i didn't know a whole lot about motorcycles i still don't to be quite honest with you even after spending two years with these guys but there was a time when i was having like a mechanical discussion about motorcycles with one of the members.
He was getting into the intricate mechanics of how a motor works and what I needed to do to make a tune-up and do those kinds of things. And I just stopped him. I said, dude, you're talking way above my pay grade. I roll this grip and it goes forward. I squeeze this handle and step on this pedal and it stops. When it doesn't do that anymore, I bring it to someone like you to fix it for me.
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Chapter 3: What was Jay Dobyns' cover story for the Hells Angels investigation?
I'll say this. I live with concern. I choose not to live in fear because if I live in fear, they own me. They control me. But I've seen firsthand what they're capable of. I know their history. These guys have their PhDs in violence and intimidation. They're very good at it. They're the masters of it. So I live with concern. I don't put myself in bad situations. I don't want a problem.
I do everything I can to try to avoid problems. But I don't hide. I'm doing an interview with you. But I also know any massive criminal organization, I don't care if it's the mafia, I don't care if it's street gangs, I don't care if it's Russian organized crime or the triad or whatever. If they want you, they can get you. You can't hide in today's world. You just can't.
I tried to run from those threats for a while and it was unsuccessful. And I was like, dude, you just have to live your life. I know there's people out there that hate me. I know there's people out there that would love to see me dead. But if I live my life in a fearful way, they continue to own me. I'll tell you something that good that came out of it.
The good thing that came from it is that like all these experiences elevated my faith. They elevated my spirituality. I realized that I got through this life. I got through this career and all these events that we talked about and hundreds more that are just like it because God had his hand on my shoulder and was controlling the things that happened to me. I'll say this.
I learned the hard way is that if the only time you're talking to God is when you're in trouble, you're in trouble. And my faith has grown. And my trust in God has grown. If that's what it took to get in my faith life to where I am now, then I think it was a good investment.
Thanks for coming back on the show, man. We had such a good response to the last one. I know everybody really appreciates it, especially me. You're a great storyteller and you tried to do the right thing. You're continuing to try to do the right thing. It's really admirable. It is a shame that you didn't have support when you needed it, though. I'll tell you that.
That's very disappointing to hear. Jay Dobbins, thank you very much, man. Right on. Thank you for having me. You're about to hear a preview of the Jordan Harbinger show with an undercover ATF agent that infiltrated the infamous Pagans biker gang.
Everyone was saying, hey, motorcycle enthusiasts, bikers are all bad. So they did this whole study and basically out of the study, he came back and said, hey, listen, 99% of them aren't. You know, 1% of these bikers might be problematic or gang members or what have you, but the rest aren't. Well, then the bikers, the real bikers, the outlaw bikers were like, hey, this is great. We are the 1%.
We're proud of being the 1%. I mean, you know, people think that these are just a bunch of morons running around partying. And they're not. They're very sophisticated in how they move their money. They're very sophisticated in their structure. And they're also very sophisticated in what they do. People are always like, oh, whatever made you decide to do a two-year undercover?
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