Founder's Story
The Coach Who Transformed Steve Jobs: Why Most Leaders Never Reach Their Potential - John Mattone | Ep. 198
Sat, 12 Apr 2025
John Mattone is more than just the world’s #1 executive coach—he’s a trailblazer in leadership transformation. Globalgurus.org recognized him six times in seven years (2019–2025). John is the creator of the revolutionary Intelligent Leadership® (IL) framework. His work has impacted nearly 1 million individuals and thousands of organizations across 55 countries, earning him the trust of world leaders, Fortune 500 CEOs, and high-growth entrepreneurs.In This Episode:John Mattone joins Founder's Story to unpack the journey that led him from corporate trainer to one of the most respected executive coaches in the world. He shares deeply personal stories—like his transformative five sessions with Steve Jobs—and offers practical, heartfelt wisdom for leaders looking to unlock their full potential.This episode is about more than just leadership. It’s about legacy, soul work, and the commitment to becoming the best version of yourself—at home, at work, and beyond.We cover:The pivotal moment Steve Jobs reflected on his growth as a leader and fatherWhy John’s first book failed—and how it led to everything that came nextThe Intelligent Leadership® framework: what it is, how it works, and why it’s changing livesWhat most executive coaches get wrong (and how John does it differently)The one question every great leader must ask themselvesWhy the best leaders operate from heart, mind, and soul—not just ambitionJohn’s personal evolution, mentors, setbacks, and the calling that reshaped his lifeHow to build trust with high-performing executives and hold them accountableThe importance of giving back—and John’s powerful story of creating scholarships to honor his family legacyKey Quote:“Most people die without creating their masterpiece. My job is to help them build it before it’s too late.”Connect with John: 🌐 www.johnmattone.comOur Sponsors:* Check out Indeed: https://indeed.com/FOUNDERSSTORY* Check out Northwest Registered Agent and use my code FOUNDERS for a great deal: https://northwestregisteredagent.com* Check out Plus500: https://plus500.com* Check out Rosetta Stone and use my code TODAY for a great deal: https://www.rosettastone.com
Chapter 1: Who is John Mattone and what is his coaching background?
Hey everyone, welcome back to Founder Story. Today we have John Matone. And John Matone is the founder of John Matone Global. And John, you have had the pleasure of being one of the world's number one executive coaches. I love the introductory video on your website. And it talks about you working with people like Steve Jobs and other incredibly well-known and famous individuals.
But you've really been a trailblazer in leadership transformation. And you've been doing this for many years. And I'm sure you are full of incredible insights today that we're going to dive into. But first, what made you become this number one transformative coach? And why did you get into this industry?
Daniel, first of all, great to be on the show here. It's been an evolution. I got out of graduate school many, many years ago. Started my first job at Conoco, the oil company, and discovered I was a pretty good trainer. And I got a lot of feedback from my executives at Conoco saying you should start a business. So for 10 years, I ran around the world.
My wife and I raised our family of four, but I was never home. wrote a couple books during those 10 years, was not doing any coaching, Daniel, at that time. It was just basically speaking and training and so on and so forth. and was, quite frankly, unsuccessful. One of the books that I had written, Success Yourself, emerged later, which I'll get to in a second, 2010.
Went back into the corporate world for 15 years and really, honestly, grew tremendously as a person, as a professional. Had an opportunity to do some coaching in a role that I was in going back a few years ago, a number of years ago. and really, really liked it. In fact, I applied the concepts that were written about in that book, Success Yourself, that failed.
And I had executives saying, boy, this is just absolutely incredible. So I knew I had something, but I wasn't sure how to bring it. I was just unclear about the vision for it, but I knew that I wanted to coach. I wasn't really sure what was going to happen next. Long story short, Steve Jobs picked up my book in 2010, about a year before he passed, was intrigued with the concepts in the book.
I had the opportunity to meet him and coach him. I had five coaching sessions with him that were transformative. And I will tell you that in a second coaching session that I had with him, He told me, he said, you know, what he was learning, I say this very humbly, with me, if he had applied in his 30s and 40s, he would have been a better father, better husband, better leader.
And let me tell you what, I wasn't even sure. I get chills sharing that with you and the listeners here. But... There was a transformation that day. I knew I had the coach and I still wasn't sure how to do it, though. And it was a number of months later I had a calling to do this work. I launched John Matone Global in 2011. I've written 11 books, five bestsellers.
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Chapter 2: How did John Mattone become Steve Jobs' coach?
But the most exciting thing is that we're bringing, you know, my coaching philosophy and process and tools to the world. You know, 55 countries now and Dramatone Global is growing significantly. So that's a little bit. It's been an evolution, Daniel.
You know, it really has been. Sounds like an overnight success story. I love that. That took 20 years. 20 years. So let's go back to Steve Jobs because I'm very fascinated by the fact that it was towards the end of his life and he was reflecting about how he was as a leader and the changes he could have made, which I find very interesting.
How was that feeling of getting that call and then now coaching him? Because it sounds like even at that time, you were still 100% unsure as to coaching as a career. I don't know if it's... I think it was only until recently maybe that coaching has become a lot more popular and we find a lot more people want to be a coach. But much less at that time. So...
Going back to that time, how was that feeling and what was that first phone call like or first meeting?
Listen, I had chills and I struggled for a few years. Because I actually said to myself, I got lucky. And other than my wife and a couple of really close people, really didn't even know. I wasn't sure how to actually bring it to the world. And I had a lot of... It took me a few years to kind of open up, you know, and now... Now just about everybody knows I had this incredible opportunity.
So looking back on it, I don't think I was lucky, Daniel. You know what I'm saying? Because I don't think the incredible things that have happened to me, my family, and the business would have happened if it wasn't meant to be, honestly. I look back on it. It was not lucky. It was meant to be, and I'm very humbled that – I had this incredible opportunity.
I would say that, you know, one thing that is core, I think, in growth of a human being is making the decision to be vulnerable. If you don't make that decision, you're done. In this world today, things are moving so, so quickly. You're going to stagnate. You're going to die, you know. And when...
One element, you know, I'm sure parents listening in, we teach this to our children to be vulnerable, open, you know, open. Listen to your teachers. And you go to church, you listen, right? I would say that Steve Jobs, it took dying from pancreatic cancer to embrace being vulnerable, right?
And with him saying to me that he could have actually been vulnerable at a younger age and would have grown more and would have been a better human being was was to me an important tenet that I took with me. And that's what I bring to the world now that, listen, you want to become better. Yeah. Think differently. Think big.
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Chapter 3: What leadership lessons did John learn from coaching Steve Jobs?
but you've got to consciously make that decision to be vulnerable, to ignite growth in yourself, your team, your family, so on and so forth.
If I think back to the most famously known leaders especially if they were men, I don't really see them ever being vulnerable. Maybe I think it's only, you know, until recently that I know, you know, leaders that are more open to being vulnerable. What do you think is the change that is happening and what change needs to happen in order for people to embrace this?
Yeah, I would say that, you know, I think the association of greatness and leadership has been overly tied to drive, you know, achievement, the ambition, you know, be tough and so on and so forth. And I think with generational changes and this whole notion of recognizing, Daniel, that you can drive and be achievement-oriented and ambitious, but you can also have a heart.
You can have the courage, and that's what it takes, to show your heart and be compassionate and care for others. Those two worlds coexist beautifully, okay? And when they coexist beautifully, what ends up happening is you don't compromise either side of the equation. The equation gets stronger in terms of building culture, right? You know, we talk about culture ultimately. Right.
And same thing in our families, too. There are some family cultures that are not good and there are some family cultures that are really good. Where's that come from? Comes from leadership and it's instilling belief right in the children. that they can execute what needs to be executed, they can achieve their dreams, and so on and so forth.
So I think it's a global recognition that these two worlds can coexist beautifully. And in fact, if you look at the results of great businesses and great leaders, I'd say the last 25, 30 years, We're going to see people who can embrace and embody both sides of that equation.
So I know you've impacted over a million people and thousands of organizations. I would imagine if you ask most people in a leadership role, whether it's corporate or an entrepreneur or somebody that's in business, they want to reach their full potential. So how do you ensure or what advice or strategies do you give to people in order to do so?
Because I think, at least for me, I mean, that is what I always strive to do is I want to be the best version of myself, whether that's in a relationship with my wife or that's in business or that's showing up to my teams. But I also want to make the most money. I want to be the most successful. I want to impact the most. And I think all this ties down to
me reaching my full potential, but how do I get there?
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Chapter 4: Why is vulnerability important for leaders to grow?
It's a process. And so I believe in measurement. I think it's important to recognize that the inner core, otherwise known as the soul, Daniel, is very multifaceted, very complex. But ultimately what I've learned is that if your soul and your inner core is strong and mature and vibrant, what does that mean? Self-image balanced, right?
As soon as you get out of the balanced self-image and you become an egomaniac and you go too far in the other direction, you've got a problem in the world of leadership today. Proper value system, thinking patterns that are strong, mature, and vibrant, belief system, character is an inner core thing. What I've learned is that the inner core drives the outer core.
So the work that I do as an executive coach Working with some of the top CEOs, government leaders in the world, very humbly said, we start with measurement. Let's calibrate how strong your inner core is. Let's calibrate how strong your outer core is. We use 360s. We do objective assessments. I watch them. I observe them. And then what we do is we co-create a strategy, just like a business.
It's literally parallel universe. If you want to become the best, just like you were talking about, how do I become the best that I can be? You got to execute a strategy. What are your gifts and strengths that we can make stronger? And what are the things that are getting in the way now or could get in the way? Let's put a strategy together that's very practical.
And we're going to work together to hold you accountable. And we're going to involve stakeholders, people around you to hold you accountable. And then we execute. And then what we do is we go back and we remeasure again. So executive coaching, the way I do it, very measurement-oriented, very process-oriented. And ultimately, here's the thing.
I really believe we're all put on the earth to create a masterpiece. I can tell you that when I work with top people, they've accomplished a lot. And but they recognize that, listen, a good portion of their masterpiece may have been built, but they're not there yet. And that is the key. And I think all of us is recognizing that it doesn't matter who you are and what you've accomplished.
You still got a long way to go. Okay. Most people die not having created the masterpiece. That's what drives me and my team to help You know, leaders all over the world in organizations ultimately create the masterpiece they were put on the earth to create. And, you know, that ultimately, that ultimate vision is the overarching thing where the strategy comes alive. You know what I'm saying?
Because a strategy only makes sense if it's connected to a higher order purpose. That makes sense?
Yeah. You know what I find? I'm glad you bring this up. The most successful people recognize that, you know, they need to get better and that are perfect.
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Chapter 5: How are modern leaders balancing ambition with heart and soul?
And they're, they're almost more, it's almost, they're more humble in many ways than people that are maybe just a one or two years in and think that, you know, they're at this level of success or a few years in, but when they've been many, many years in, they realize, uh, that they are not perfect and they can learn from other people. I'll give an example.
I used to I used to consult for organizations. The first phone call I had, the CEO tried to make me quit and it was the most uncomfortable thing. And I didn't want to do it anymore. But he said he was just testing me because it was just ways that he could build trust. How do you find when you coach these people, how do you build trust and rapport? Because they have to listen to you.
I'm sure you have to tell them things about themselves that they may not even want to hear. Many people don't like to hear feedback, right? Some do. But how do you build this rapport and trust? And do you find that these people, the more successful they are, the more humble they are to listen?
Well, yeah, a couple of things. You got to build rapport, trust, and credibility pretty quick. I'm going to be unfortunate in that I've got a little bit of a reputation out there, okay? Some of the younger coaches who are just starting out, they better work harder. They got to build a pedigree, you know?
You know, when you write books and you're out there and people kind of know who you are, it doesn't give you, you know, you don't have free reign. You still got to prove yourself. It's like an athlete. You got to show up. You got to execute. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter what your average is. You know, you could average 25 points a game. You still got to show up. So that's my attitude.
And I think the other thing, too, is people got to see you as human, Daniel. You know, they got to see that, boy, you know, here's this guy, Matone. He's accomplished a lot, but he's had a lot of setbacks, too. You know, a lot of failure. And I'm very open about that. You know, I share I share a lot about that. And in that often helps build the trust and rapport.
The other thing that gets everybody is this whole notion of, you know, the questions that I ask are big, you know, like, for example, what's the vision of the essence of the personal leader? that you must become. And people often spot me and they say, well, what do you mean must become? And I always say, listen, everybody walks around and they say, Hey, this is what I want to accomplish. You know,
The best of the best ask themselves the best questions, and the best questions are the ones that ignite change. What's the vision of the essence of the leader person that you must become? What is that masterpiece that you put on the earth to create? What does that look like? And how far along are you?
And let me tell you what, when I start to have those conversations, and I have them pretty early with my clients, They look at me and they say, this is interesting, you know, and I've never been asked these questions before. So I think I think those things are really, really important.
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Chapter 6: What strategies does John Mattone use to help leaders reach their full potential?
And it's just like, if you follow the process, and I'm here to help you, heart, mind, and soul, you know? Guess what? We're going to measure, we're going to diagnose, we're going to co-create a strategy, and then we're going to execute together. And we are going to absolutely create that masterpiece together. I can't do it alone. You can't do it alone.
So that's sort of how I work, you know, and I teach that to coaches all over the world.
Can you explain more about that and why? I also want to thank you for your answer before, because I think a lot of people, maybe they want to coach. They have to realize that building up their personal brand in the industry that they're in, building up what they're known for, building up just the success in coaching is required to be an excellent coach.
I think it's one of those things where anyone, I guess, could just title themselves a coach, even with little experience. But I'm glad that you have laid down the framework in a sense that it requires a lot of work, a lot of building up yourself, a lot of things to achieve before you can really hit high levels of success, I think, as a coach.
But can you explain more about the Intelligent Leadership Framework?
Yeah, so intelligent leadership, the short definition is it's about heart, mind, and soul. We have no shortage of intellect in the world, Daniel. There's so many people with high IQs running around, yet we've got massive problems all over the world. And what it comes down to often in leadership, and this is a function of just how fast we're moving in the orientation around technology,
is that the heart and soul, in many respects, got lost. The pandemic was a magnifier on that, that those organizations that did not attend the heart and soul before the pandemic are out of business. Just go back to the Jim Collins book that was written, what, 24 years ago. Many of those companies do not exist anymore.
And actually, if you look at the research, right, how quickly you can evaporate, even these big companies, right? So I believe that we've got this great intellect, so we've got a skewed distribution on intellect in the world of business. But the skew is the other way in terms of leadership. And we must work extremely hard to close that gap. And I believe we've got to amp up heart and soul.
What does that mean? Compassion. Care for others. You know, the value of altruism. uh very very important and an orientation around just being more self-aware you know um when you put your head on the pillow at night what did i do well today to bring abundance to the world where did i fall short you know and just allowing those experiences to enter your soul allows you to wake up the next day
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Chapter 7: How does John build trust and rapport with high-performing executives?
See, that's humbling. I think everyone can learn from that. One is I feel the same way about my wife, that I am also very lucky and she is my number one advisor for sure. Like I follow the people. One of the best things I've ever done for my personal growth was picking up a new language, whether you're traveling, leveling up your career or just love learning.
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Chapter 8: What is the Intelligent Leadership® framework and coaching process?
You know, the amazing thing is you might help someone that I'm sure he never knew at 24. He was going to help John Matone, one of the world's greatest executive coaches. So you just never know, you know, what's going to become of someone.
So, listen, one of the things was I met my uncle. Joseph Matone passed away last year. Joseph and my dad were first cousins, Italy and then New York. I never met Joseph. Joseph ended up becoming a famous lawyer in New York and so on and so forth. And I couldn't, I remember my dad talking about, I never met Joseph. And it was a few years ago, he wrote to me, go, you're Dominic's son.
85, 85, 86.
And he looked just like my dad. It was incredible, you know? And he taught me about philanthropy. You know, he said, John, you're doing amazing in your career. Be very, very proud of what you've accomplished. You got to give back. You got to give back. And I got to tell you, I wasn't going to bring this up today, but now you're bringing this up. And it's not about the money or whatever.
Just being a mentor to somebody. But Joseph ended up giving millions of dollars to St. John's University. And the law library at St. John's named after Joseph Natal. And when I left the dinner with Joseph and the family, and now I'm close to that whole side of the family. Joseph passed away last year.
I got home to Orlando and I said to my wife, Gail, I said, you know something, we got to we got to create a couple of scholarships, you know, for the younger people. And that's what we've done. So Gail and I committed to, you know, creating a couple of endowed scholarships at Universe Central Florida, where I got my master's degree.
to do exactly what you're talking about, provide the opportunities for the younger people, the incredible young talent that we've got, so they can become the best that they can be. And you know, right? A lot of the resources out there for the younger people aren't there, you know?
So whatever we could do to help was something that I was really passionate about doing, both my wife and I, in our family.
It's so easy to criticize younger generations. instead of trying to uplift them and realize that we can help. We're always, as a species, we are very easy to say that they're lazy, they're this, they're that. They're always doing the wrong thing versus like, okay, how can I help somebody who's maybe in their 20s be the best leader that they can be? So I like your train of thought.
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