Chief Change Officer
#387 Todd Davis: Inside 30 Years at FranklinCovey—What Most Leaders Still Get Wrong — Part One
Sun, 25 May 2025
Todd Davis didn’t just teach The 7 Habits—he lived them for 30 years inside the leadership company that built its name on them.As the former Chief People Officer at FranklinCovey, Todd spent three decades coaching teams, executives, and entire organizations on what truly drives effectiveness—and what quietly kills it. In this episode, he unpacks why trust is more than a buzzword, how most leaders think they’re being clear (but aren’t), and what’s gone missing in today’s fast-changing workplace.Whether you’re leading a team or just trying to survive your next meeting, this is your crash course in timeless leadership with zero fluff.Key Highlights of Our Interview:From Recruiting to the C-Suite“I was just hiring people. Then suddenly, I was leading them.”How Todd built a 30-year career at FranklinCovey without ever planning for it.The Secret to Long-Term Career Growth“I didn’t hop around jobs. I stayed put and made an impact.”Why depth, consistency, and trust still beat flashy résumés.The 7 Habits Still Work—Here’s Why“They’re not business tactics. They’re human principles.”Why The 7 Habits remain relevant—even in an age of AI and burnout.What’s Wrong With Workplaces Today?“People don’t hate work. They hate how work is designed.”The real reasons employees disengage—and what better leadership could fix.The #1 Leadership Skill People Get Wrong“Most leaders think they’re clear. They’re not.”How miscommunication erodes trust—and how to stop it from happening.______________________Connect with us:Host: Vince Chan | Guests: Todd Davis --Chief Change Officer--Change Ambitiously. Outgrow Yourself.Open a World of Expansive Human Intelligencefor Transformation Gurus, Black Sheep,Unsung Visionaries & Bold Hearts.EdTech Leadership Awards 2025 Finalist.18 Million+ All-Time Downloads.80+ Countries Reached Daily.Global Top 1.5% Podcast.Top 10 US Business.Top 1 US Careers.>>>170,000+ are outgrowing. Act Today.<<<
Chapter 1: What is the focus of today's discussion?
Hi, everyone. Welcome to our show, Chief Change Officer. I'm Vince Chen, your ambitious human host. Our show is a modernist community for change progressives in organizational and human transformation from around the world. Today, we are talking about leadership, trust, and why AI still can do what humans do best.
My guest is Todd Davis, former chief people officer at Franklin Covey, a properly listed leadership training company. Todd is the expert behind the bestseller, The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. And I spent 30 years coaching leaders and managers on how to actually work well with people. In this two-part series, we get into the real stuff.
Why most leaders think they are clear in communicating and giving instructions, but they aren't. How trust is built like a bank account. and why human intelligence is still the biggest competitive advantage. Oh, there's a wild story about these seven habits changing someone's life in the prison. Let's dive right in. Todd, good afternoon. Welcome to our show. Welcome to Chief Change Officer.
Thank you, Vince. Really appreciate your invitation.
Todd Davis is from Franklin Covey, a name that's practically a household brand in the U.S. When it comes to leadership training, Franklin Covey is like Starbucks. Everyone knows it. At some point, almost everyone has either read one of the books or attended one of the trainings through the employers.
And of course, one of the best-selling books in history is The Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. Honestly, who doesn't want to be more effective? But let's be real. Workplaces today are facing big challenges. So I want Todd to join me and talk about how these habits can help solve or at least alleviate some of these issues.
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Chapter 2: What is Todd Davis's journey at FranklinCovey?
Now, Todd, before we get into the book, I always ask my guests about their own journey, the transitions they've made, the paths they've taken. But your story is different. You've been with Franklin Covey over 30 years. You are truly a loyalist. Tell us about your journey. What led you to Franklin Covey? What kept you there for three decades and how the role has evolved over the years?
Then we'll dive deeper into the book and its impact.
Thank you. Thank you so much. So yes, I have been with FranklinCovey for almost three decades. Prior to that, I worked in the medical industry for about 10 years and I was a recruiter. I recruited physicians and other medical personnel to staff hospitals and to staff clinics for a couple of organizations here in the Western United States where I live. and did that for about 10 years.
And then some friends of mine, they decided to form their own outsourcing company for human resource functions, for people functions. And so they had an attorney to handle employment law and they had a benefits person. And they asked me because I had been in recruiting for so long to join them and recruit for these various companies. And so organizations would contract with our group
provide these human resource services instead of hiring those kind of people inside their firm so we would contract with companies to provide those services and what was then called the Covey Leadership Center it was before Covey had merged with Franklin they were one of our clients and so they contracted with us and I was involved in finding their consultants to ironically to do what I do now finding their sales people and different things like that
And I had read The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People about a year before I started working, being a contractor for them. And I was blown away by the content and how it was helping me already change my life. And this is 30 years ago. And so I loved being a contractor for them. And then they said, that they wanted to bring recruitment in-house. They wanted to hire a recruiter.
So I threw my hat in the ring and interviewed and was selected. So I started my journey with FranklinCovey as their recruitment manager. And then, if I'm going too long, you tell me to speed it up. But I worked as a recruitment manager. And then I had, in a previous life, I had worked as a content developer, putting together training programs.
So after I recruited for Covey for a while, we merged with Franklin Quest. Franklin Quest in the U.S. here was the time management company. They had the Franklin Day Planner. And everybody over here in the U.S. had these day planners. They were very famous for that. And Covey Leadership Center, as you mentioned, was famous for the seven habits.
And so we merged those companies and I went to work for their innovations department where we developed our training, different training solutions. And I did that for several years. And then the CEO at that time came to me, this would be about 20 years ago now, came to me and said, we would like you to apply for the chief people officer role. The person that was in that role had left.
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Chapter 3: Why are The 7 Habits still relevant today?
That changes, we update that about every eight to 10 years because the application and how we put these practices or these principles to work change. And so that's what we have just launched. And what has changed in this most recent version? We just continually make them more practical, more applicable, more inclusive.
When I say simplify, anyone who's read The Seven Habits, it is a firehose of powerful information. And sometimes people just don't know where to start. They understand it all, but they don't know how to apply it.
And so this latest version, we've made it very, I don't want to say simplified, but very practical so that I can go through the course and I can start applying these principles tomorrow or tonight in my personal relationships and certainly in my professional relationships. Could you give us one example? You bet.
So I'm happy to walk through all the habits, but let me just tell you, habit one is very foundational. It's habit one for a reason. It's called be proactive. And it's based on the principle of choice. The principle being that while there is so much you and I cannot influence or change, we can choose our response to any situation.
In fact, when I have looked at your LinkedIn profile, Vince, and your background and history, And you've had some amazing experiences and some very challenging experiences. And I've thought about the choices that you have made, the way you have chosen to respond to those situations. You know, we can't always create or fix the situation, but we can choose our response.
So that's the principle in Habit 1. And with the mindset, we look at a paradigm for every habit. And the paradigm in Habit 1 is... I can't change how things are, so I just have to go with the flow. That's a common mindset. It's not very effective. The effective mindset is I make my own choices and I'm responsible for my own happiness that comes from those choices.
And that's what I mean you do in your, when I think about you. So with that mindset, Then I learn, okay, what are the behaviors I want to model? There are three behaviors or practices that we teach in habit one. The first is to pause before we respond, to separate stimulus from response. We have to think about that because reactive response just happens. We don't have to think about it.
But a proactive response, we have to separate stimulus from response and decide how we want to respond. What's the most effective way? That's the first practice. The second practice is to work within what we call our circle of influence versus our circle of concern. We can be concerned with everything going on in the world and problems at work and policies and things like that.
But staying in that circle of influence actually shrinks, excuse me, staying within that circle of concern actually shrinks our circle of influence. Effective people, they recognize these things that we're concerned about, but then they go into the inner circle and say, what can I do about this? Where can I start to make an impact or live differently?
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Chapter 4: What is the significance of trust in leadership?
where we're listening through our own frame of reference, where we're filtering everything through my past experiences or the way that I see that. And we think it's helpful, and it is helpful at a certain time, but not when we need to understand each other. Dr. Covey said, the deepest need of the human heart is to feel understood. And I have seen that prove itself out over and over again.
And you think about it, whether it's two friends or whether it's two colleagues or two leaders or a leader and employee, when they truly take the time to understand each other, not agree or disagree, but really understand each other, they can solve problems that much quicker. You asked for a specific example that I'm remembering now.
A person who came to me, they didn't feel like their boss recognized their talent. And I said, tell me a little bit more about that. Why is it that you don't think that your boss, it was a man? And why do you not think that he recognizes your talent? I just never hear anything. I don't hear anything negative, but I never heard anything positive. I never hear anything, you know, about that.
And I said, have you talked to him about that? And they said, no. No, I haven't talked to him. I would think that they should realize that on their own. I said, I don't disagree with you. Let's think about what do you think would be important to him? And I did a little T chart and I said, okay, so here's what's important to you from what I'm understanding.
You'd like to be recognized a little bit more. You'd like to be given some more challenging work. We went through the list of the things and they said, yeah, that's it. What do you think would be important to him? And this person said, I don't know, I'm not him. And I said, I understand that, but put yourself in his place. What do you think would be important to him?
And this was a really seasoned, talented person, but they just, it didn't come natural to them like it might to you and me to think about empathy through the lens of the other person. So they said they probably want to make sure that they're recognized. And I said, okay, let's put that down. They probably want to make sure that the project we're working on is done on time.
Okay, let's put that down. They probably care that they're seen as a good leader. So we came up with this list and I coached this person and I said, what do you think about, what if you took this list to your manager, your leader, and you said, Hey, and I'll call him Joe.
Hey, Joe, I had some things I want to talk to you about, but I also, in my thinking, I wanted to make sure I'm thinking about what's important to you. And here's a list I've created. Can you tell me, am I off? Am I on? Are there things I'm missing? And that discussion opened up this wonderful relationship between this leader and this employee.
And in that discussion, the employee then said, I work really hard. And the leader said, oh, I know you do a great job. And they said, I never know that. You've never told me that. And so this person helped the leader develop. Anyway, long story short, this all stems from Habit 5 and really taking time to understand each other.
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Chapter 5: How can miscommunication erode trust?
It's doing a lot of things for us, but it cannot replace these interpersonal skills. This very basic, like you said, this very basic thing that I learned growing up from my parents as far as just respect and thank you. And would you have a few minutes and the way that we not just nice things, but things to really connect with other human beings.
And maybe I'll be wrong, but I don't see AI ever replacing that. Even now, I've used AI to put together, I had to do a keynote for a couple of hours with an organization on generational leadership. And I worked in that field and I've done that, but I still, I use ChatGPT and I said, hey, here's the elements I'd like to include. And it put a straw model together for me.
I had to apply my piece to that, but I think AI can be a very useful tool. But I think that human connection is, It's a principle. It's always going to be needed. Even if I ask ChatDBT to write me a letter or something, I'm going to want to go over it and make sure it has my tone and saying the things in the way that I want it to come across to the other person.
That's it for today. We've talked about what makes leaders actually effective. But next, we're diving into the real human side. Why trust works like a bank account. The biggest leadership blind spots. And why most people don't really listen. Oh, and wait till you hear Todd's present story. See you in part two.
Thank you so much for joining us today. If you like what you heard, don't forget, subscribe to our show, leave us top-rated reviews, check out our website, and follow me on social media. I'm Vince Chen, your ambitious human host. Until next time, take care.
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