Terry Glavin

I think other people have used the term cultural Marxism, which kind of, you know, it certainly borrows the language of Marxism and borrows the language of the left, but of course replaces the proletariat, the working class. is replaced by this kind of, you know, rainbow coalition, ethnic, racial, and gender subsets and subgroups.

I think other people have used the term cultural Marxism, which kind of, you know, it certainly borrows the language of Marxism and borrows the language of the left, but of course replaces the proletariat, the working class. is replaced by this kind of, you know, rainbow coalition, ethnic, racial, and gender subsets and subgroups.

But the other thing I think that's important to understand about antisemitism, it's not just like any other prejudice. It's not just another bigotry. It's a conspiracy theory. It's always been a conspiracy theory. And I think a lot of people who perhaps were once Marxists or are informed by the intellectual tradition in Marxism

But the other thing I think that's important to understand about antisemitism, it's not just like any other prejudice. It's not just another bigotry. It's a conspiracy theory. It's always been a conspiracy theory. And I think a lot of people who perhaps were once Marxists or are informed by the intellectual tradition in Marxism

can easily get that wrong, can easily imagine that, you know, the powerful hand of the international bourgeoisie has, you know, their names often end in Stein and Berg. And the next thing you know, you know, it's the Jews are being thrown down wells. And I think just to understand where we are in Canada particularly,

can easily get that wrong, can easily imagine that, you know, the powerful hand of the international bourgeoisie has, you know, their names often end in Stein and Berg. And the next thing you know, you know, it's the Jews are being thrown down wells. And I think just to understand where we are in Canada particularly,

I think it's really necessary to understand the trajectory of the left over the last 25, 30 years. Well, go back a little further.

I think it's really necessary to understand the trajectory of the left over the last 25, 30 years. Well, go back a little further.

With the collapse of the Soviet Union, right? Much of the Democratic left was perfectly content with this, was very happy about this.

With the collapse of the Soviet Union, right? Much of the Democratic left was perfectly content with this, was very happy about this.

Yes. Yes. Much of the democratic left was, or at least resigned to it and confused by it. And then during the 1990s, the primary iteration of left-wing activism and politics was anti-globalization, showing up with these massive demonstrations at the IMF and the World Bank and the World Economic Forum. And then came 9-1-1. And 9-1-1 was kind of like a blunt trauma wound to everybody's head.

Yes. Yes. Much of the democratic left was, or at least resigned to it and confused by it. And then during the 1990s, the primary iteration of left-wing activism and politics was anti-globalization, showing up with these massive demonstrations at the IMF and the World Bank and the World Economic Forum. And then came 9-1-1. And 9-1-1 was kind of like a blunt trauma wound to everybody's head.

Everybody went a little bit weird. It was such a shock. I mean, it was like out of a movie, some kind of a science fiction movie. And immediately what happened was, you know, the iteration of the international left and the activist milieu changed. was cloaked in anti-war activism, right? And it shouldn't have taken much effort on the part of the mass media.

Everybody went a little bit weird. It was such a shock. I mean, it was like out of a movie, some kind of a science fiction movie. And immediately what happened was, you know, the iteration of the international left and the activist milieu changed. was cloaked in anti-war activism, right? And it shouldn't have taken much effort on the part of the mass media.

Unfortunately, and I have to confess as a lifelong journalist, the media was not at all helpful in Failing to recognize that this phenomenon that was being presented on the nightly news and on the front pages of the paper as an anti-war movement, they were actually on the other side. They weren't against war. They were on the other side.

Unfortunately, and I have to confess as a lifelong journalist, the media was not at all helpful in Failing to recognize that this phenomenon that was being presented on the nightly news and on the front pages of the paper as an anti-war movement, they were actually on the other side. They weren't against war. They were on the other side.

And at the core of it, at the very, very core of it, whatever you happen to think about Afghanistan or Iraq, at the core of it was anti-Zionism, this thing called anti-Zionism. And that had sort of percolated from the 1970s. A lot of it was informed by Soviet propaganda, but from the United Nations, you know, the Durban Conference, the proposition that Zionism is racism.

And at the core of it, at the very, very core of it, whatever you happen to think about Afghanistan or Iraq, at the core of it was anti-Zionism, this thing called anti-Zionism. And that had sort of percolated from the 1970s. A lot of it was informed by Soviet propaganda, but from the United Nations, you know, the Durban Conference, the proposition that Zionism is racism.

Now in Canada, the way Irwin Kotler put it to me, I think very well, who, he's kind of my lodestar, I confess. Tell everybody who he is. Well, he's a former Canadian justice minister. He founded the Raoul Wallenberg Center for Human Rights, and I'm a senior fellow with the Raoul Wallenberg Center.

Now in Canada, the way Irwin Kotler put it to me, I think very well, who, he's kind of my lodestar, I confess. Tell everybody who he is. Well, he's a former Canadian justice minister. He founded the Raoul Wallenberg Center for Human Rights, and I'm a senior fellow with the Raoul Wallenberg Center.

And he's beloved of persecuted Democrats the world round, whether it's Hong Kong or Belarus or just about anywhere, Russia. Anyway, the way he put it to me was that in Canada, particularly, Canadians, the United Nations is kind of in our DNA. Right. You know, the way we understand our role in the world, our place in the world. I mean, we were there at the Foundation of Israel.

And he's beloved of persecuted Democrats the world round, whether it's Hong Kong or Belarus or just about anywhere, Russia. Anyway, the way he put it to me was that in Canada, particularly, Canadians, the United Nations is kind of in our DNA. Right. You know, the way we understand our role in the world, our place in the world. I mean, we were there at the Foundation of Israel.

We were there in the crafting of the United Nations Declaration on Human Rights. We were there in all of the protocols and conventions that arose from the ashes of the Shoah. This was a very Canadian thing and something to be proud of. But what we haven't really noticed over the years is the way the United Nations has been taken over by the Organization of the Islamic Congress.

We were there in the crafting of the United Nations Declaration on Human Rights. We were there in all of the protocols and conventions that arose from the ashes of the Shoah. This was a very Canadian thing and something to be proud of. But what we haven't really noticed over the years is the way the United Nations has been taken over by the Organization of the Islamic Congress.

It's been taken over by the police state bloc. The last time I looked, I think Beijing was basically in control of seven of the 11 major United Nations agencies. And then you get the United Nations Relief Works Agency, which is this strange agency.

It's been taken over by the police state bloc. The last time I looked, I think Beijing was basically in control of seven of the 11 major United Nations agencies. And then you get the United Nations Relief Works Agency, which is this strange agency.

strange organization that keeps alive the prospect that Israel is just a temporary aberration and that somehow the massively growing Palestinian refugee population, it's not really a refugee population, will somehow be sorted by the restoration of a Palestinian or an Arab sovereignty. in all the places where Israel currently exists.

strange organization that keeps alive the prospect that Israel is just a temporary aberration and that somehow the massively growing Palestinian refugee population, it's not really a refugee population, will somehow be sorted by the restoration of a Palestinian or an Arab sovereignty. in all the places where Israel currently exists.

So it's really hard for Canadians to sort of think, hmm, maybe the United Nations, maybe these, are we the baddies, you know?

So it's really hard for Canadians to sort of think, hmm, maybe the United Nations, maybe these, are we the baddies, you know?

The way I see those tangling together, if we can think of it in terms of the Liberal Party or the Trudeau Liberals, right? not the same as a lot of what a lot of people imagine the liberals to be, is that this kind of intellectual slovenliness that the sort of blind adherence to United Nations declarations and so on

The way I see those tangling together, if we can think of it in terms of the Liberal Party or the Trudeau Liberals, right? not the same as a lot of what a lot of people imagine the liberals to be, is that this kind of intellectual slovenliness that the sort of blind adherence to United Nations declarations and so on

and the entire panoply of its colonial settler state politics, its diversity, equity, and inclusion politics.

and the entire panoply of its colonial settler state politics, its diversity, equity, and inclusion politics.

It's just there's no way that it can defend itself against a virulent, lurid, blood-curdling, anti-Semitic, anti-Zionist.

It's just there's no way that it can defend itself against a virulent, lurid, blood-curdling, anti-Semitic, anti-Zionist.

Okay, here's Trudeau. Here's Trudeau. Here's the thing about Trudeau. Yeah. There's really not much there. I hate to be uncharitable. I think it's time to be uncharitable. Okay. Well, there really isn't much there. I think you've been very interested in the phenomenon of narcissism. There you go. The world is a vanity mirror.

Okay, here's Trudeau. Here's Trudeau. Here's the thing about Trudeau. Yeah. There's really not much there. I hate to be uncharitable. I think it's time to be uncharitable. Okay. Well, there really isn't much there. I think you've been very interested in the phenomenon of narcissism. There you go. The world is a vanity mirror.

And you have to remember when he came along, it sort of parallels the rise of Trump in the United States, right? When he was first elected, just a few months from the election of Donald Trump. And Donald Trump, you know, said all these scary things about Muslims and then Justin Trudeau, you know, tweets, well, everybody's welcome to Canada. It doesn't matter. You can be a Muslim. We love you.

And you have to remember when he came along, it sort of parallels the rise of Trump in the United States, right? When he was first elected, just a few months from the election of Donald Trump. And Donald Trump, you know, said all these scary things about Muslims and then Justin Trudeau, you know, tweets, well, everybody's welcome to Canada. It doesn't matter. You can be a Muslim. We love you.

The next thing you know, he's on the front page of the Rolling Stone magazine. He's the toast of, you know, Vogue photo shoots. He's the leader of the free world.

The next thing you know, he's on the front page of the Rolling Stone magazine. He's the toast of, you know, Vogue photo shoots. He's the leader of the free world.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think a lot of people, you know, he's not my cup of tea. but a lot of people were really swept. He was sort of like this matinee idol. A lot of people got caught up in that.

I think a lot of people, you know, he's not my cup of tea. but a lot of people were really swept. He was sort of like this matinee idol. A lot of people got caught up in that.

But as far as the intellectual milieu, if there was such a thing, around his emergence... Well, I mean, everybody was willing to give him a chance. I was willing to give him a chance. I remember speaking to him back when he was running for office, running for, you know, in the election. that period. And I was definitely willing to give them a shot. Why? Well, we spoke a lot about Syria. Yeah.

But as far as the intellectual milieu, if there was such a thing, around his emergence... Well, I mean, everybody was willing to give him a chance. I was willing to give him a chance. I remember speaking to him back when he was running for office, running for, you know, in the election. that period. And I was definitely willing to give them a shot. Why? Well, we spoke a lot about Syria. Yeah.

And I have many friends and comrades who are associated with the Syrian revolutionary movement. And what the NATO countries, what was being asked of the NATO countries at the time was a no-fly zone over Syria. All we need is one NATO country to say, yes, we need to do this. Because the Americans couldn't really understand what was going on.

And I have many friends and comrades who are associated with the Syrian revolutionary movement. And what the NATO countries, what was being asked of the NATO countries at the time was a no-fly zone over Syria. All we need is one NATO country to say, yes, we need to do this. Because the Americans couldn't really understand what was going on.

And everyone hoped that it might be Trudeau who said, yeah, I'm in. And he did give me, and of course there was the whole Syrian refugee issue, and he did try to, he made a lot of capital, political capital out of that. We can come to that in a moment. But to understand who he represents and what he's all about, You have to wind the clock back further.

And everyone hoped that it might be Trudeau who said, yeah, I'm in. And he did give me, and of course there was the whole Syrian refugee issue, and he did try to, he made a lot of capital, political capital out of that. We can come to that in a moment. But to understand who he represents and what he's all about, You have to wind the clock back further.

You remember when Michael Ignatieff was briefly the leader of the Liberal Party?

You remember when Michael Ignatieff was briefly the leader of the Liberal Party?

Well, he's a very smart guy, Michael Ignatieff.

Well, he's a very smart guy, Michael Ignatieff.

He was an intellectual heavyweight. Yeah, he was actually. I like Michael. I mean, just as an intellectual.

He was an intellectual heavyweight. Yeah, he was actually. I like Michael. I mean, just as an intellectual.

You know, if you can imagine a kind of... Oh, I don't know. A TikTok account run by a 19-year-old college girl in charge of a G7 country. 14-year-old. Okay. But anyway, so he emerges. How does he present himself to the Liberal Party as a worthwhile leader of the party? Yeah. And for this, he turned to McKinsey & Associates. Consulting firm. Massive global consulting firm.

You know, if you can imagine a kind of... Oh, I don't know. A TikTok account run by a 19-year-old college girl in charge of a G7 country. 14-year-old. Okay. But anyway, so he emerges. How does he present himself to the Liberal Party as a worthwhile leader of the party? Yeah. And for this, he turned to McKinsey & Associates. Consulting firm. Massive global consulting firm.

The apologist for dictators everywhere. I think, I don't know how many billions of dollars they've had to pay out in lawsuits for boosting... oxycontin sales in the United States, a fellow by the name of Dominic Barton, who happened to be a Canadian who spent half his life in China as the head of McKinsey.

The apologist for dictators everywhere. I think, I don't know how many billions of dollars they've had to pay out in lawsuits for boosting... oxycontin sales in the United States, a fellow by the name of Dominic Barton, who happened to be a Canadian who spent half his life in China as the head of McKinsey.

Trudeau brought him in, and essentially to add gravitas to his candidacy for the Liberal Party,

Trudeau brought him in, and essentially to add gravitas to his candidacy for the Liberal Party,

It is a small town. Yes.

It is a small town. Yes.

Ottawa. He was essentially a function of the Canada-China Business Council. This is a really important thing for people to understand. His entire campaign was built around the proposition, and this is how he sort of lent gravitas to himself, that the key to the future is China. Canada's future is China. The middle class prosperity is all about China, China, China.

Ottawa. He was essentially a function of the Canada-China Business Council. This is a really important thing for people to understand. His entire campaign was built around the proposition, and this is how he sort of lent gravitas to himself, that the key to the future is China. Canada's future is China. The middle class prosperity is all about China, China, China.

And this immediately, you know, he immediately accrued to himself a lot of money and a lot of power and a lot of help. The Demare Corporation, the Power Corporation in Montreal, those whole circles. And of course, his father...

And this immediately, you know, he immediately accrued to himself a lot of money and a lot of power and a lot of help. The Demare Corporation, the Power Corporation in Montreal, those whole circles. And of course, his father...

And people don't like to talk about this when they talk about Pierre Trudeau, but he was probably the most important propaganda asset for the Chinese Communist Party during the Maoist period in the English-speaking world. That's nothing.

And people don't like to talk about this when they talk about Pierre Trudeau, but he was probably the most important propaganda asset for the Chinese Communist Party during the Maoist period in the English-speaking world. That's nothing.

So, you know, and Trudeau would trade in this and say, well, you know, they know me in China, you know, I can have a family name. And a lot of that was sort of glossed over. People didn't notice what was going on.

So, you know, and Trudeau would trade in this and say, well, you know, they know me in China, you know, I can have a family name. And a lot of that was sort of glossed over. People didn't notice what was going on.

Well, all I can tell you is that, you know, two things happened in 2001. What happened, the atrocities in New York and Washington, the Al-Qaeda atrocities, and the moment that the West put a knife to its own throat only three months later by admitting China into the World Trade Organization. This is a massive event.

Well, all I can tell you is that, you know, two things happened in 2001. What happened, the atrocities in New York and Washington, the Al-Qaeda atrocities, and the moment that the West put a knife to its own throat only three months later by admitting China into the World Trade Organization. This is a massive event.

And I mean, I think there were a lot of people of good faith who imagined that the more China modernized and became capitalist, they'd become more like us. People who understood China knew this was rubbish. It was not going to happen.

And I mean, I think there were a lot of people of good faith who imagined that the more China modernized and became capitalist, they'd become more like us. People who understood China knew this was rubbish. It was not going to happen.

Yeah, yeah. Okay? And, I mean, anybody who's followed Canadian politics at all

Yeah, yeah. Okay? And, I mean, anybody who's followed Canadian politics at all

In the last five years, we'll be aware of the scandals associated with the intimacies between the Trudeau liberals and the United Front Work Department of the Chinese Communist Party and the Organization Department of the Politburo of the Chinese Communist Party, the manipulation and monkey wrenching of elections in 2019 and 2021. Yeah, we still don't know the full extent of that.

In the last five years, we'll be aware of the scandals associated with the intimacies between the Trudeau liberals and the United Front Work Department of the Chinese Communist Party and the Organization Department of the Politburo of the Chinese Communist Party, the manipulation and monkey wrenching of elections in 2019 and 2021. Yeah, we still don't know the full extent of that.

Yeah, the whole commission has yet to report, you know, sort of report.

Yeah, the whole commission has yet to report, you know, sort of report.

Well, more than background rumors. One of the things that's difficult for people to grasp is that You know, a lot of people ask me, my goodness, the Chinese must have something on Justin Trudeau. Some compromise. He doesn't see anything wrong with it.

Well, more than background rumors. One of the things that's difficult for people to grasp is that You know, a lot of people ask me, my goodness, the Chinese must have something on Justin Trudeau. Some compromise. He doesn't see anything wrong with it.

If you take all the crazy things—well, I don't. Some of the things that the Democrats are saying about Trump and Russia were not crazy. But if you take all the extreme accusations that the Democrats were making about Trump's associations with the Kremlin in the 2015 election—

If you take all the crazy things—well, I don't. Some of the things that the Democrats are saying about Trump and Russia were not crazy. But if you take all the extreme accusations that the Democrats were making about Trump's associations with the Kremlin in the 2015 election—

Multiply that by 10, and you have in the real world Justin Trudeau's collusions and complicity with the Chinese Communist Party. In the open, by the way. And this is the thing. To understand Justin Trudeau, you have to understand he sees nothing wrong with this.

Multiply that by 10, and you have in the real world Justin Trudeau's collusions and complicity with the Chinese Communist Party. In the open, by the way. And this is the thing. To understand Justin Trudeau, you have to understand he sees nothing wrong with this.

When he got elected, immediately after he got elected, in the first election, he sat down with a reporter from the New York Times and said, this is what basically Canada is. He saw a post-national state.

When he got elected, immediately after he got elected, in the first election, he sat down with a reporter from the New York Times and said, this is what basically Canada is. He saw a post-national state.

No core identity, no mainstream. And immediately the question should have turned to, I remember talking to Jerry Butts about this, his sort of principal advisor, because we used to be quite chummy. And, you know, John Ralston Saul. Jerry doesn't take much of me. He doesn't like me either.

No core identity, no mainstream. And immediately the question should have turned to, I remember talking to Jerry Butts about this, his sort of principal advisor, because we used to be quite chummy. And, you know, John Ralston Saul. Jerry doesn't take much of me. He doesn't like me either.

You know, John Ralston Saul, the philosopher, he wrote this concept of Canada as a postmodern state. And it was kind of a nuanced, interesting philosophy, whatever. And I remember talking to Jerry. I said, Trudeau kind of got that wrong. I mean, wasn't he kind of channeling John Ralston's soul? He said, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. He meant it, post-national. And so here's the question.

You know, John Ralston Saul, the philosopher, he wrote this concept of Canada as a postmodern state. And it was kind of a nuanced, interesting philosophy, whatever. And I remember talking to Jerry. I said, Trudeau kind of got that wrong. I mean, wasn't he kind of channeling John Ralston's soul? He said, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. He meant it, post-national. And so here's the question.

Well, if you hang around with the Canada-China Business Council long enough— If you enthusiastically support, for instance, the largest overseas acquisition in the history of the People's Republic of China, the, you know, Sinox acquisition of Nexen. Flesh that out a little bit.

Well, if you hang around with the Canada-China Business Council long enough— If you enthusiastically support, for instance, the largest overseas acquisition in the history of the People's Republic of China, the, you know, Sinox acquisition of Nexen. Flesh that out a little bit.

Well, yeah, it was at a time when, just before Justin Trudeau was elected, when the Chinese Communist Party was buying up all the major, really key strategic sort of spigot points in the oil patch in Alberta. And the Harper government, the cabinet, was terribly divided about this.

Well, yeah, it was at a time when, just before Justin Trudeau was elected, when the Chinese Communist Party was buying up all the major, really key strategic sort of spigot points in the oil patch in Alberta. And the Harper government, the cabinet, was terribly divided about this.

and um eventually the good guys the good guys won the people i considered the good guys when harper said okay that's it you know sure it's a lot of money they're offering us twice the share value for every purchase they're making but no we do not want canada's energy sector to be owned by the organization department of the politburo probably better than that than stephen will bow

and um eventually the good guys the good guys won the people i considered the good guys when harper said okay that's it you know sure it's a lot of money they're offering us twice the share value for every purchase they're making but no we do not want canada's energy sector to be owned by the organization department of the politburo probably better than that than stephen will bow

Oh, yeah, the post-national stuff. This is really key. How do you do national security in a post-national state? What does it even mean? You see, I don't think they really thought this through. What are Canada's national interests if we're a post-national country?

Oh, yeah, the post-national stuff. This is really key. How do you do national security in a post-national state? What does it even mean? You see, I don't think they really thought this through. What are Canada's national interests if we're a post-national country?

And as I say, I don't know that I want to describe it as an ideology. It's kind of like an ideational package. This notion that Canada is this racist, colonial, settler state that has engaged in genocide after genocide against its indigenous peoples. And we're the liberals, and we're the nice ones. And so that's essentially what Trudeau was all about.

And as I say, I don't know that I want to describe it as an ideology. It's kind of like an ideational package. This notion that Canada is this racist, colonial, settler state that has engaged in genocide after genocide against its indigenous peoples. And we're the liberals, and we're the nice ones. And so that's essentially what Trudeau was all about.

And I think, you know, there's an adage that what starts with the Jews doesn't end with the Jews.

And I think, you know, there's an adage that what starts with the Jews doesn't end with the Jews.

That's very true. And I don't want to dispute that, and I don't want what I'm about to say as a contradiction of that. Mm-hmm.

That's very true. And I don't want to dispute that, and I don't want what I'm about to say as a contradiction of that. Mm-hmm.

uh my personal view is that if it did end with the jews it would still be evil yeah so big deal kind of a deal a lot of people was put it this way you know first they'll they come for the saturday people and then they'll come for the sunday people right right yeah canada happened the other way around it happened on the weekend of may 29th yeah may 29th 2021 when justin trudeau lowered the flag on parliament hill

uh my personal view is that if it did end with the jews it would still be evil yeah so big deal kind of a deal a lot of people was put it this way you know first they'll they come for the saturday people and then they'll come for the sunday people right right yeah canada happened the other way around it happened on the weekend of may 29th yeah may 29th 2021 when justin trudeau lowered the flag on parliament hill

And on the Monday ordered the flag lowered on all federal buildings across the country, owing to a report out of Kamloops about the discovery of a mass grave. And on the Tuesday, the chief of the Kamloops First Nation said, well, actually we didn't say mass grave. But the flag stayed down. The flags were at half mast. For how long? Like six months? Seven months, I think it was.

And on the Monday ordered the flag lowered on all federal buildings across the country, owing to a report out of Kamloops about the discovery of a mass grave. And on the Tuesday, the chief of the Kamloops First Nation said, well, actually we didn't say mass grave. But the flag stayed down. The flags were at half mast. For how long? Like six months? Seven months, I think it was.

And the people, God bless them, who managed to get them back up again were the Mohawks. Thank God for the Mohawks.

And the people, God bless them, who managed to get them back up again were the Mohawks. Thank God for the Mohawks.

Yeah. They said, look, you know, we have a lot of people who are veterans and we lower our flags on the 11th of November and also on Aboriginal Veterans Day. So how the hell are we going to lower the flags if they're already lowered? Do something about it.

Yeah. They said, look, you know, we have a lot of people who are veterans and we lower our flags on the 11th of November and also on Aboriginal Veterans Day. So how the hell are we going to lower the flags if they're already lowered? Do something about it.

You can wrap it up this way. This strange thing that we've just described, right? A lot of people talk about woke politics or whatever. It's not wicked because it's anti-Semitic. It's anti-Semitic because it's wicked.

You can wrap it up this way. This strange thing that we've just described, right? A lot of people talk about woke politics or whatever. It's not wicked because it's anti-Semitic. It's anti-Semitic because it's wicked.

It has nowhere else to go. This is what history... So why draw that distinction? Because this is what history tells us. about the agony of the Jews. And I really wish we had been able to kind of emerge from this. Everybody loves dead Jews. Everyone wants them to cry, isn't sad. But God forbid they should stand up on their own two feet and say, actually, no, we're restoring Jewish sovereignty.

It has nowhere else to go. This is what history... So why draw that distinction? Because this is what history tells us. about the agony of the Jews. And I really wish we had been able to kind of emerge from this. Everybody loves dead Jews. Everyone wants them to cry, isn't sad. But God forbid they should stand up on their own two feet and say, actually, no, we're restoring Jewish sovereignty.

in our ancient homeland, and you will not take that tone with us anymore, thank you very much. You know, everybody would prefer sort of be like, you know, sing Pete Seeger songs and pat Jews on the head. When Jews say, actually, no, we're, I mean, thanks for the help, but we're gonna stand up for ourselves.

in our ancient homeland, and you will not take that tone with us anymore, thank you very much. You know, everybody would prefer sort of be like, you know, sing Pete Seeger songs and pat Jews on the head. When Jews say, actually, no, we're, I mean, thanks for the help, but we're gonna stand up for ourselves.

This is what a lot of people on the left could not abide when the Jews began to get saucy in this way. And interestingly, this is very tied into the way the sort of Trudeau liberals understand indigenous people in Canada. And it's tied into the whole sort of from Turtle Island to Palestine that you keep hearing in the activist milieu.

This is what a lot of people on the left could not abide when the Jews began to get saucy in this way. And interestingly, this is very tied into the way the sort of Trudeau liberals understand indigenous people in Canada. And it's tied into the whole sort of from Turtle Island to Palestine that you keep hearing in the activist milieu.

Well, it was actually a white guy who came up with that.

Well, it was actually a white guy who came up with that.

Was it Gary Snyder? He was a poet in Chicago, I think. Anyway, I mean, there is some vague reference that can be drawn to, I think, an Anishinaabe creation, but whatever. I think it is a bowdlerization of the magnificent cultural diversity of indigenous peoples in this country, which we could talk about because you live in an interesting place, or we're filming this in a very interesting place.

Was it Gary Snyder? He was a poet in Chicago, I think. Anyway, I mean, there is some vague reference that can be drawn to, I think, an Anishinaabe creation, but whatever. I think it is a bowdlerization of the magnificent cultural diversity of indigenous peoples in this country, which we could talk about because you live in an interesting place, or we're filming this in a very interesting place.

But the idea

But the idea

that if indigenous people would stand up and say actually okay this whole territory as far as the eye can see you idiots you never signed a treaty with us we still own the land under british and canadian constitutional law uh aboriginal title is is enforceable and we're gonna start like we're gonna start acting like we own the place you better deal with us you're not gonna chop down all our trees and ship them off to china

that if indigenous people would stand up and say actually okay this whole territory as far as the eye can see you idiots you never signed a treaty with us we still own the land under british and canadian constitutional law uh aboriginal title is is enforceable and we're gonna start like we're gonna start acting like we own the place you better deal with us you're not gonna chop down all our trees and ship them off to china

Thank you very much. You're going to leave a lot of the wealth in the countryside with all our white neighbors. We're going to work in sawmills. We're going to produce wealth from this territory. People like Justin Trudeau's liberals do not want to hear this. They would rather come to you and say, oh, yes, would you like a wellness center? You know, stroke you on the back.

Thank you very much. You're going to leave a lot of the wealth in the countryside with all our white neighbors. We're going to work in sawmills. We're going to produce wealth from this territory. People like Justin Trudeau's liberals do not want to hear this. They would rather come to you and say, oh, yes, would you like a wellness center? You know, stroke you on the back.

Oh, you know, victims, survivors. And by the way, here's $380 million to busy yourself rummaging around in graveyards for the next 10 years. This is, I think, really important to understand about this phenomenon. It is a kind of liberal racism, a liberal racism of low expectations. So there's all that. But there's also the fact that there's now 1.8 million Muslims in the country.

Oh, you know, victims, survivors. And by the way, here's $380 million to busy yourself rummaging around in graveyards for the next 10 years. This is, I think, really important to understand about this phenomenon. It is a kind of liberal racism, a liberal racism of low expectations. So there's all that. But there's also the fact that there's now 1.8 million Muslims in the country.

And I don't want to, you know, this is really fighting words for me because, you know, a lot of my friends are Muslims and Arabs and my compatriots and my circle. And we have to be very, very, very careful about the way we talk about this. But the reality of it is that when you have this notion of Canada, this, you know, This multicultural. Yeah, this multiplicity of diversities and so on.

And I don't want to, you know, this is really fighting words for me because, you know, a lot of my friends are Muslims and Arabs and my compatriots and my circle. And we have to be very, very, very careful about the way we talk about this. But the reality of it is that when you have this notion of Canada, this, you know, This multicultural. Yeah, this multiplicity of diversities and so on.

What you find is that there are certain organizations and institutions in this country that are very well financed and resourced by the federal government. and are intended to speak on behalf of, for instance, Canadian Muslims.

What you find is that there are certain organizations and institutions in this country that are very well financed and resourced by the federal government. and are intended to speak on behalf of, for instance, Canadian Muslims.

Well, it is essentially an investigation of the state of anti-Semitism in Canada. And I spent quite a bit of time and effort on this, 16 in-depth interviews, maybe another 16 interviews. not so in-depth interviews, a lot of research, a lot of time and trouble trying to get this sorted.

Well, it is essentially an investigation of the state of anti-Semitism in Canada. And I spent quite a bit of time and effort on this, 16 in-depth interviews, maybe another 16 interviews. not so in-depth interviews, a lot of research, a lot of time and trouble trying to get this sorted.

One of them is the Muslim Association of Canada, which is explicitly devoted to the theology of Hassan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, the fountainhead of Islamism, who was a collaborator with and a philosophical fellow traveler with Adolf Hitler. So this is a bit of a problem, you know? I mean, this is not gonna work out well in the long run.

One of them is the Muslim Association of Canada, which is explicitly devoted to the theology of Hassan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, the fountainhead of Islamism, who was a collaborator with and a philosophical fellow traveler with Adolf Hitler. So this is a bit of a problem, you know? I mean, this is not gonna work out well in the long run.

And there's only 350,000 Jews in Canada. Right, right, right. It's a small town.

And there's only 350,000 Jews in Canada. Right, right, right. It's a small town.

Yeah, like Thomas Mulcair, who's kind of an old-fashioned social democrat, you know, somebody who speaks the same language I speak, quite frankly.

Yeah, like Thomas Mulcair, who's kind of an old-fashioned social democrat, you know, somebody who speaks the same language I speak, quite frankly.

Yeah, yeah. And he said, you know, Canada's position on Israel is incomprehensible. You insist, because you need to, that Israel has a right to defend itself. And yet you will refuse to send any munitions to Israel or anything at all that might be used as a part of an airplane that might be in the Israeli Air Force. And she went so far as to, I think it was General Dynamics has a plant in Quebec.

Yeah, yeah. And he said, you know, Canada's position on Israel is incomprehensible. You insist, because you need to, that Israel has a right to defend itself. And yet you will refuse to send any munitions to Israel or anything at all that might be used as a part of an airplane that might be in the Israeli Air Force. And she went so far as to, I think it was General Dynamics has a plant in Quebec.

So it's actually American material going to Israel. And she said, no, we're not going to issue an export permit for that either. So Israel has a right to defend itself, but Israel is not allowed to have the means to defend itself. So Mulcair says, this is incomprehensible. It's just gobbledygook. It's mumbo jumbo. You know, talking to Melanie Jolie, the foreign affairs minister.

So it's actually American material going to Israel. And she said, no, we're not going to issue an export permit for that either. So Israel has a right to defend itself, but Israel is not allowed to have the means to defend itself. So Mulcair says, this is incomprehensible. It's just gobbledygook. It's mumbo jumbo. You know, talking to Melanie Jolie, the foreign affairs minister.

And her response was, Thomas, have you seen the demographics of my writing? Yeah, right.

And her response was, Thomas, have you seen the demographics of my writing? Yeah, right.

And if you look at the Democrats of her writing, or it's probably the demographics of her writing, Hansa Karsherville. The immigration into that writing has been off the charts. I mean, immigration into the country has been off the charts. Right, to add another dimension of complexity as well.

And if you look at the Democrats of her writing, or it's probably the demographics of her writing, Hansa Karsherville. The immigration into that writing has been off the charts. I mean, immigration into the country has been off the charts. Right, to add another dimension of complexity as well.

Yeah, and we should talk about Polyev because when we're talking about Trudeau, we really are talking about a dead man walking. Yesterday, his government almost collapsed.

Yeah, and we should talk about Polyev because when we're talking about Trudeau, we really are talking about a dead man walking. Yesterday, his government almost collapsed.

And just for fun, her replacement, Dominic LeBlanc, used to be Trudeau's babysitter. Now, just imagine if Donald Trump appointed his babysitter as the Secretary of the Treasury.

And just for fun, her replacement, Dominic LeBlanc, used to be Trudeau's babysitter. Now, just imagine if Donald Trump appointed his babysitter as the Secretary of the Treasury.

And I think part of Barry's motivation was that she was sort of vaguely, dimly aware that something very, very unseemly was occurring in Canada. And she and I knew one another. We were kind of chummy. And I've covered, I've been sort of interested and concerned about anti-Semitism for about 20, 25 years now, actually, for reasons we might discuss.

And I think part of Barry's motivation was that she was sort of vaguely, dimly aware that something very, very unseemly was occurring in Canada. And she and I knew one another. We were kind of chummy. And I've covered, I've been sort of interested and concerned about anti-Semitism for about 20, 25 years now, actually, for reasons we might discuss.

Here's the thing. The other thing that Americans have to understand is that Canada is a bilingual country. constitutional monarchy, one of the most decentralized federal systems on earth that is thinly populated and spread out across the top of the most dynamic cultural phenomenon in the history of nation states. So the role of a Canadian prime minister has always been,

Here's the thing. The other thing that Americans have to understand is that Canada is a bilingual country. constitutional monarchy, one of the most decentralized federal systems on earth that is thinly populated and spread out across the top of the most dynamic cultural phenomenon in the history of nation states. So the role of a Canadian prime minister has always been,

to unite the country, to keep, you know, the role of federal policy has always been to allow Canadians to have a conversation amongst themselves. It's why we fund the CBC and the Canadian Council for the Arts and what have you. And it's a difficult thing to do because we are very, very culturally diverse. I mean, in every traditional sense of the word, the French speaking people of Quebec

to unite the country, to keep, you know, the role of federal policy has always been to allow Canadians to have a conversation amongst themselves. It's why we fund the CBC and the Canadian Council for the Arts and what have you. And it's a difficult thing to do because we are very, very culturally diverse. I mean, in every traditional sense of the word, the French speaking people of Quebec

the poor land Quebecers, are a nation in every conventional sense of the word. And Canada is, well, yeah, I guess we're kind of a nation, but it's complicated. I mean... It is vastly complicated, and it's a huge landscape. So the function of a prime minister has to be to unite the country.

the poor land Quebecers, are a nation in every conventional sense of the word. And Canada is, well, yeah, I guess we're kind of a nation, but it's complicated. I mean... It is vastly complicated, and it's a huge landscape. So the function of a prime minister has to be to unite the country.

Something core. Something that when push comes to shove, it's possible that we might be able to muster fire in the belly.

Something core. Something that when push comes to shove, it's possible that we might be able to muster fire in the belly.

Quite so.

Quite so.

The other thing about Trudeau is that it's a complete rejection of that, a complete reversal of that. It's just like, meh, we're a post-national country. And immigration, fine, you want to come in, yes. You know, Dominic Barton, who ended up being our ambassador to China, the guy who came from China's McKinsey and Associates and who crafted Trudeau's campaign campaign,

The other thing about Trudeau is that it's a complete rejection of that, a complete reversal of that. It's just like, meh, we're a post-national country. And immigration, fine, you want to come in, yes. You know, Dominic Barton, who ended up being our ambassador to China, the guy who came from China's McKinsey and Associates and who crafted Trudeau's campaign campaign,

at the very, very, very beginning of his rise to politics, says, yeah, we should actually have about a half a million people coming into Canada every year. We should aim for 100 million. We should at least double our population, you know, in the next generation or two.

at the very, very, very beginning of his rise to politics, says, yeah, we should actually have about a half a million people coming into Canada every year. We should aim for 100 million. We should at least double our population, you know, in the next generation or two.

Yes, we have.

Yes, we have.

We don't know how many people live in this country, Jordan. Yeah. We know from a recent census it's about 41 million. But on top of that, we have, well, for instance, over the next 12 months, 5 million people who live in Canada on various kinds of temporary permits and so on. So it's one-eighth of the population. Within the next 12 months, those permits expire.

We don't know how many people live in this country, Jordan. Yeah. We know from a recent census it's about 41 million. But on top of that, we have, well, for instance, over the next 12 months, 5 million people who live in Canada on various kinds of temporary permits and so on. So it's one-eighth of the population. Within the next 12 months, those permits expire.

Then there's another between 50 and 500,000, according to the official guess. of the Immigration and Refugees and Citizenship Department, who are what they call out-of-contract workers, which are undocumented workers. Now, for Americans to hear these numbers, you know, America's 10 times as many people, it's 10 times as populous. So, you know, just do the math, right?

Then there's another between 50 and 500,000, according to the official guess. of the Immigration and Refugees and Citizenship Department, who are what they call out-of-contract workers, which are undocumented workers. Now, for Americans to hear these numbers, you know, America's 10 times as many people, it's 10 times as populous. So, you know, just do the math, right?

If there's 5 million, if there are 50 million Americans or people living in the United States whose temporary permits expire within the next 12 months and who have all given every impression that they do not intend to leave. Yes, why would they leave? So Pierre Polyev's coming along, right? Yeah.

If there's 5 million, if there are 50 million Americans or people living in the United States whose temporary permits expire within the next 12 months and who have all given every impression that they do not intend to leave. Yes, why would they leave? So Pierre Polyev's coming along, right? Yeah.

And the interesting thing about Pierre Polyev, this goes back to what we were talking about earlier about language. Is this liberal or what the hell? Pierre Polyev, when he talks about housing, when he talks about employment, when he talks about access to health care, when he talks about wages, he's Bernie Sanders. Americans have to understand this. Try to imagine Bernie Sanders.

And the interesting thing about Pierre Polyev, this goes back to what we were talking about earlier about language. Is this liberal or what the hell? Pierre Polyev, when he talks about housing, when he talks about employment, when he talks about access to health care, when he talks about wages, he's Bernie Sanders. Americans have to understand this. Try to imagine Bernie Sanders.

I mean, and also the trade union vote has gone to conservatives. This has never happened before. The working class vote has gone to Pierre Polyev. I don't know. I mean, I'm not a partisan conservative. I don't know if I've ever written a conservative sentence in my life, by the way, although most of my friends seem to be conservatives. I don't know how that happens.

I mean, and also the trade union vote has gone to conservatives. This has never happened before. The working class vote has gone to Pierre Polyev. I don't know. I mean, I'm not a partisan conservative. I don't know if I've ever written a conservative sentence in my life, by the way, although most of my friends seem to be conservatives. I don't know how that happens.

And so she said, well, it looks like Glavin's the guy to do this story. So I did this story. And it's about 6,700 words long. It's a very deep investigation. And it has attracted a heck of a lot of attention. Unfortunately, it doesn't make Canada look very good. I wrote this primarily for an American audience.

And so she said, well, it looks like Glavin's the guy to do this story. So I did this story. And it's about 6,700 words long. It's a very deep investigation. And it has attracted a heck of a lot of attention. Unfortunately, it doesn't make Canada look very good. I wrote this primarily for an American audience.

So my great fear, and I'll close with this, and you can challenge me. Tell me I'm wrong, or if you like, whatever. You can argue. I think we've got about... year or two before everything starts to come unglued. And I'm very worried about this. I've always been an optimist. I've been an inveterate optimist.

So my great fear, and I'll close with this, and you can challenge me. Tell me I'm wrong, or if you like, whatever. You can argue. I think we've got about... year or two before everything starts to come unglued. And I'm very worried about this. I've always been an optimist. I've been an inveterate optimist.

But I actually haven't seen in Polyev a degree of sophistication in comprehending the nature and the scope of what he's going to be facing.

But I actually haven't seen in Polyev a degree of sophistication in comprehending the nature and the scope of what he's going to be facing.

I thought it was Alabama. Is it Mississippi? Same thing.

I thought it was Alabama. Is it Mississippi? Same thing.

No, that's never going to happen.

No, that's never going to happen.

Well, the Liberals might, but it might be some iteration of a Liberal Party that older Canadians are more familiar with.

Well, the Liberals might, but it might be some iteration of a Liberal Party that older Canadians are more familiar with.

Well, their history.

Well, their history.

I found Americans, God bless them, they haven't the faintest idea what's happening in Canada. They have an idea of Canada. embedded in their brains, and it's really hard to shake them from it. Canada is not the place that you will find in Michael Moore documentaries. Canada is not the place that you'll find in any aspect of American media, actually, particularly over the last 10 years.

I found Americans, God bless them, they haven't the faintest idea what's happening in Canada. They have an idea of Canada. embedded in their brains, and it's really hard to shake them from it. Canada is not the place that you will find in Michael Moore documentaries. Canada is not the place that you'll find in any aspect of American media, actually, particularly over the last 10 years.

Well, here's an interesting story. You find this a lot, this sort of speculation about, well, oh, this Trump thing, you know, could it happen in Canada? Right-wing populism, yada, yada, everyone wets their pants. Oh, my God, not here. Well, it actually did happen here, and it happened back then, and it was the reform part.

Well, here's an interesting story. You find this a lot, this sort of speculation about, well, oh, this Trump thing, you know, could it happen in Canada? Right-wing populism, yada, yada, everyone wets their pants. Oh, my God, not here. Well, it actually did happen here, and it happened back then, and it was the reform part.

Well, one of the things I think Conservatives should remember about the Reform Party is the result of the Reform Party was they reduced the Conservatives to three. And they ushered in a decade of liberal rule. So, good luck to you lads. Canadians, I think, are, you know, this is something I also want to stress. The overwhelming majority of Canadians are not anti-Semites.

Well, one of the things I think Conservatives should remember about the Reform Party is the result of the Reform Party was they reduced the Conservatives to three. And they ushered in a decade of liberal rule. So, good luck to you lads. Canadians, I think, are, you know, this is something I also want to stress. The overwhelming majority of Canadians are not anti-Semites.

I would say probably the overwhelming majority of Muslims are not anti-Semites, although that's hard to say. It also depends to some degree on how you phrased the question. That's right. In fact, I refer to a study... of Muslim public opinion.

I would say probably the overwhelming majority of Muslims are not anti-Semites, although that's hard to say. It also depends to some degree on how you phrased the question. That's right. In fact, I refer to a study... of Muslim public opinion.

And it was actually the proportion of Muslims who agreed to answer a particular question about suicide bombing and about whether or not the state of Israel should be allowed to exist. It was pretty high. There was, do you remember, there was a big debate about five years ago, six years ago, about Islamophobia.

And it was actually the proportion of Muslims who agreed to answer a particular question about suicide bombing and about whether or not the state of Israel should be allowed to exist. It was pretty high. There was, do you remember, there was a big debate about five years ago, six years ago, about Islamophobia.

In Canada. You know, there was going to be a law, there was going to be statutory reform to sort of outlaw Islamophobia.

In Canada. You know, there was going to be a law, there was going to be statutory reform to sort of outlaw Islamophobia.

And the liberals refused to define what they actually meant by Islamophobia.

And the liberals refused to define what they actually meant by Islamophobia.

Yeah. And you would hear the liberals say that every day, you know, Muslims in Canada are subjected to racist abuse and intimidation. And I remember because I'm a complete public opinion poll nerd. Data is the thing I need to get. Give me the data. Everybody's opinion. Who cares? Give me the data.

Yeah. And you would hear the liberals say that every day, you know, Muslims in Canada are subjected to racist abuse and intimidation. And I remember because I'm a complete public opinion poll nerd. Data is the thing I need to get. Give me the data. Everybody's opinion. Who cares? Give me the data.

And public opinion back then showed that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in Canada were actually demonstrated a higher degree of pride in their country than than what you might call old stock Canadians. And the main complaint that Muslims had about Canada was, it's so damn cold here. Nobody was worried about, nobody was freaking out. Perfectly valid complaint, by the way.

And public opinion back then showed that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in Canada were actually demonstrated a higher degree of pride in their country than than what you might call old stock Canadians. And the main complaint that Muslims had about Canada was, it's so damn cold here. Nobody was worried about, nobody was freaking out. Perfectly valid complaint, by the way.

It's just, I think we have to be very, very, very careful about understanding the nature of the problem. And we have to be very careful about the words that we use, the language that we use. And we all use these words, the kind of euphemisms, left-wing or progressive. Are you kidding me? What is progressive about the phenomena that we end up describing as progressive?

It's just, I think we have to be very, very, very careful about understanding the nature of the problem. And we have to be very careful about the words that we use, the language that we use. And we all use these words, the kind of euphemisms, left-wing or progressive. Are you kidding me? What is progressive about the phenomena that we end up describing as progressive?

How is this in any way an aid of human progress or civilizational progress? It's reactionary. It's regressive.

How is this in any way an aid of human progress or civilizational progress? It's reactionary. It's regressive.

It's changed.

It's changed.

Yeah, well, I'll go back, I think, to what I was inarticulately trying to describe about the trajectory of the left since the 1990s. I think by the 80s, I think, or the 90s, you could say that we'd won we, if I can say that, because I kind of came from the left, although I have no ideological commitments, and I'm kind of sour these days on the left. But anyway, we'd won all our bouts.

Yeah, well, I'll go back, I think, to what I was inarticulately trying to describe about the trajectory of the left since the 1990s. I think by the 80s, I think, or the 90s, you could say that we'd won we, if I can say that, because I kind of came from the left, although I have no ideological commitments, and I'm kind of sour these days on the left. But anyway, we'd won all our bouts.

We've won them all. Civil rights, equal rights for people of color. Gay marriage. Gay marriage, the right of women to equality in the workplace, the right of unions to organize, labor relations standards, environmental laws were coming along. We'd won all our big battles.

We've won them all. Civil rights, equal rights for people of color. Gay marriage. Gay marriage, the right of women to equality in the workplace, the right of unions to organize, labor relations standards, environmental laws were coming along. We'd won all our big battles.

Yeah. And I think, I mean, a mistake to get too weird, not to get too weird about it, but one mistake Marxists made was this idea that there is no more useful role for the bourgeoisie in the progress of human society. They actually were wrong about that because it was the bourgeoisie that led the charge against slavery and for women's rights.

Yeah. And I think, I mean, a mistake to get too weird, not to get too weird about it, but one mistake Marxists made was this idea that there is no more useful role for the bourgeoisie in the progress of human society. They actually were wrong about that because it was the bourgeoisie that led the charge against slavery and for women's rights.

Yeah, what is particularly concerning is that Canadian Jews are almost universally disconsolate, dejected, afraid, alienated, isolated, and they feel very strongly in the main that their government is not protecting them. That's because their government isn't protecting them. Yeah, they might be onto something. They might be, all right.

Yeah, what is particularly concerning is that Canadian Jews are almost universally disconsolate, dejected, afraid, alienated, isolated, and they feel very strongly in the main that their government is not protecting them. That's because their government isn't protecting them. Yeah, they might be onto something. They might be, all right.

So at any rate, by the 80s or the 90s, you know, we'd won. So something peculiar has happened, and there is this very dark phenomenon that has occupied all the places where the left used to be. And it is invariably... masochistic, sinister, self-hating. Let's tear down the liberal democracies. Let's cast Canada as this illegitimate, racist, colonial settler state.

So at any rate, by the 80s or the 90s, you know, we'd won. So something peculiar has happened, and there is this very dark phenomenon that has occupied all the places where the left used to be. And it is invariably... masochistic, sinister, self-hating. Let's tear down the liberal democracies. Let's cast Canada as this illegitimate, racist, colonial settler state.

Let's identify Israel as the epitome of everything that we loathe and despise. it's an ugly, ugly, ugly thing. And I mean, I think it's ugly. Maybe that's an opinion. I don't know. I think it's demonstrably true.

Let's identify Israel as the epitome of everything that we loathe and despise. it's an ugly, ugly, ugly thing. And I mean, I think it's ugly. Maybe that's an opinion. I don't know. I think it's demonstrably true.

And that was the thing that I was watching over the years is that, you know, I spent a lot of, well, my last major book was about Afghanistan and I spent a lot of time in Syria and the Northeast with the Kurds and

And that was the thing that I was watching over the years is that, you know, I spent a lot of, well, my last major book was about Afghanistan and I spent a lot of time in Syria and the Northeast with the Kurds and

Okay, here's a proposition. Everybody likes to beat up on the news media, right? I've come up in the news media in the old discipline. You spend six years as an apprentice before you're a journeyman in the old guild system. Six years as a reporter. After that, well, maybe you'll be allowed to have an opinion about something.

Okay, here's a proposition. Everybody likes to beat up on the news media, right? I've come up in the news media in the old discipline. You spend six years as an apprentice before you're a journeyman in the old guild system. Six years as a reporter. After that, well, maybe you'll be allowed to have an opinion about something.

Really elaborate conventions and disciplines in what was essentially a trade, a craft, right? Um, and with the, uh, you know, the golden era was about the 1980s, I would say 1970s, 1980s. And then with the advent of digital technologies and a whole bunch of other reasons, um, news, the news media, the conventional news media began to wither away and collapse.

Really elaborate conventions and disciplines in what was essentially a trade, a craft, right? Um, and with the, uh, you know, the golden era was about the 1980s, I would say 1970s, 1980s. And then with the advent of digital technologies and a whole bunch of other reasons, um, news, the news media, the conventional news media began to wither away and collapse.

And it's replaced by, you know, people talk about the mainstream media. Well, the mainstream media today is Twitter. That's the mainstream media now. And so in this period, it became increasingly difficult for journalists to actually tell a story. The results be damned.

And it's replaced by, you know, people talk about the mainstream media. Well, the mainstream media today is Twitter. That's the mainstream media now. And so in this period, it became increasingly difficult for journalists to actually tell a story. The results be damned.

It's much easier to basically fill your shift with three or four stories for deadline, each of which more or less uphold the narrative framework of the subscriber base that your media organization is targeting. A lot of it really is about the decline and the collapse of news media. I mean, I can talk about that a little bit because it's something I know.

It's much easier to basically fill your shift with three or four stories for deadline, each of which more or less uphold the narrative framework of the subscriber base that your media organization is targeting. A lot of it really is about the decline and the collapse of news media. I mean, I can talk about that a little bit because it's something I know.

But I think a lot of it too, I think, is language. It's simple language. that probably ends up with most ordinary people who are only casually interested in the struggle for democracy in China or events in the Middle East or this strange creature that has come to occupy all the spaces where the Liberal Party used to be. It's the language that we use. How conservative are the conservative?

But I think a lot of it too, I think, is language. It's simple language. that probably ends up with most ordinary people who are only casually interested in the struggle for democracy in China or events in the Middle East or this strange creature that has come to occupy all the spaces where the Liberal Party used to be. It's the language that we use. How conservative are the conservative?

How liberal are the liberals?

How liberal are the liberals?

You can't call Donald Trump a conservative. He's anything but. And I don't think you can call... Justin Trudeau liberal, really, in any conventional sense. No, I don't. Very authoritarian, very much a sort of state capitalist thought control kind of way of looking at politics.

You can't call Donald Trump a conservative. He's anything but. And I don't think you can call... Justin Trudeau liberal, really, in any conventional sense. No, I don't. Very authoritarian, very much a sort of state capitalist thought control kind of way of looking at politics.

And I think, I mean, for people to understand this phenomenon, this thing that... that kind of burst into the consciousness of most Canadians on the 8th of October, immediately after the Simchat Torah pogrom, the atrocities undertaken by Hamas in Southern Israel at the Supernova Music Festival in the Kibbutzim around the Gaza envelope. Immediately afterwards, the event was celebrated.

And I think, I mean, for people to understand this phenomenon, this thing that... that kind of burst into the consciousness of most Canadians on the 8th of October, immediately after the Simchat Torah pogrom, the atrocities undertaken by Hamas in Southern Israel at the Supernova Music Festival in the Kibbutzim around the Gaza envelope. Immediately afterwards, the event was celebrated.

Be very, very careful when you use the term we. 20%, only 20% of Canadians voted for Trudeau in the last election. He hasn't gained anything. He's lost a lot. Yeah. Yeah. I think a lot of people are scared of the unknown. I think they're willing to step out into the cool and the dark. But there are still people who will not vote conservative. Fair play. It doesn't really matter.

Be very, very careful when you use the term we. 20%, only 20% of Canadians voted for Trudeau in the last election. He hasn't gained anything. He's lost a lot. Yeah. Yeah. I think a lot of people are scared of the unknown. I think they're willing to step out into the cool and the dark. But there are still people who will not vote conservative. Fair play. It doesn't really matter.

We're going to see an absolute rout of the Liberals in the next election. One of the things we haven't even discussed is the rise of the indépendantistes in Quebec, the Bloc.

We're going to see an absolute rout of the Liberals in the next election. One of the things we haven't even discussed is the rise of the indépendantistes in Quebec, the Bloc.

That's a very real possibility. Although one of the things that's interesting about Quebec is that all of these things that bedevil us, and are increasingly bourgeois sensitivities about race and gender. Quebecers aren't phased. Meh. They don't care. They do not care. In Quebec, in the French, poor land Quebecers, they're not woke. The left in Quebec is not woke. And that I find fascinating.

That's a very real possibility. Although one of the things that's interesting about Quebec is that all of these things that bedevil us, and are increasingly bourgeois sensitivities about race and gender. Quebecers aren't phased. Meh. They don't care. They do not care. In Quebec, in the French, poor land Quebecers, they're not woke. The left in Quebec is not woke. And that I find fascinating.

I think they have a real sense of themselves. A lot of it doesn't really, you know, laïcité, their idea of, you know, extreme secularism, doesn't sit well with me. But what the hell? They seem to know what they're about.

I think they have a real sense of themselves. A lot of it doesn't really, you know, laïcité, their idea of, you know, extreme secularism, doesn't sit well with me. But what the hell? They seem to know what they're about.

There's also an argument that I've heard that a lot of young Quebecers, they don't remember back in the day. They don't remember the old days. They're not interested in separatism. So who knows? Who knows? But it does add a layer of complexity to this that...

There's also an argument that I've heard that a lot of young Quebecers, they don't remember back in the day. They don't remember the old days. They're not interested in separatism. So who knows? Who knows? But it does add a layer of complexity to this that...

Because the Jews are terrified. Because the Jews are persecuted in this country.

Because the Jews are terrified. Because the Jews are persecuted in this country.

Yeah, you could put it that way. I think it would be of concern to me even if they were not the canary in the coal mine. Yeah, that's... I mean, if it's a personal question, you know, it's an odd thing. I mean, it's a family thing. My association with the Jewish community goes back a long way. I'm a Tague. I'm Irish Catholic. Yeah. But it's complicated.

Yeah, you could put it that way. I think it would be of concern to me even if they were not the canary in the coal mine. Yeah, that's... I mean, if it's a personal question, you know, it's an odd thing. I mean, it's a family thing. My association with the Jewish community goes back a long way. I'm a Tague. I'm Irish Catholic. Yeah. But it's complicated.

And it is a concern of mine and the company that I keep. But it's such a terrible state on Canada's reputation, too. The thing is when you talk to old Jews, right, like really sophisticated guys who've been in and out of office or university professors, and they will tell you, you know, with their voice cracking— I have never seen anything like this in my life. Yeah, right.

And it is a concern of mine and the company that I keep. But it's such a terrible state on Canada's reputation, too. The thing is when you talk to old Jews, right, like really sophisticated guys who've been in and out of office or university professors, and they will tell you, you know, with their voice cracking— I have never seen anything like this in my life. Yeah, right.

I feel exactly the same way. All the communities I talk to, the Hillel on campus, you know, synagogues across the country, people are afraid, and they feel abandoned, and they feel as though their government has abandoned them. Yeah, well, they made a calculated decision. This is worth noticing. And what am I? I'm just a guy. I'm a reporter. I'm a writer. So I've done my best to...

I feel exactly the same way. All the communities I talk to, the Hillel on campus, you know, synagogues across the country, people are afraid, and they feel abandoned, and they feel as though their government has abandoned them. Yeah, well, they made a calculated decision. This is worth noticing. And what am I? I'm just a guy. I'm a reporter. I'm a writer. So I've done my best to...

actually celebrated and Hamas was praised and this was characterized as a great act of heroic resistance against the illegitimate colonial settler state of Israel and We saw this from one end of the country to the other City after city day after day week after week And what we have seen in the year and a bit since that day, a 670% increase in anti-Semitic incidents, give or take.

actually celebrated and Hamas was praised and this was characterized as a great act of heroic resistance against the illegitimate colonial settler state of Israel and We saw this from one end of the country to the other City after city day after day week after week And what we have seen in the year and a bit since that day, a 670% increase in anti-Semitic incidents, give or take.

to document this and to bear witness to it. And I don't know what's going to come of it. I'm here talking to you about it. There you go.

to document this and to bear witness to it. And I don't know what's going to come of it. I'm here talking to you about it. There you go.

But- Yeah, that was funny the way that happened. I said, you know, Jordan Peterson, he's like one of these big forehead guys. Everybody likes him. You know, Barry, Barry, you talk to him, Barry. And, you know, he's great, but, you know, you meet up with him in New York or wherever. And then Barry said, well, actually, he's on Vancouver Island.

But- Yeah, that was funny the way that happened. I said, you know, Jordan Peterson, he's like one of these big forehead guys. Everybody likes him. You know, Barry, Barry, you talk to him, Barry. And, you know, he's great, but, you know, you meet up with him in New York or wherever. And then Barry said, well, actually, he's on Vancouver Island.

Okay, that's only like three hours from where I am, so that's how it happened.

Okay, that's only like three hours from where I am, so that's how it happened.

You know, here's the former director. I forgot his name. He's a lovely guy. The former chief commissioner of the Human Rights Commission. federal said, this is all, you know, it's horrible, it's ridiculous. And I think they know damn well that there's absolutely no way that any of this will withstand a charter challenge.

You know, here's the former director. I forgot his name. He's a lovely guy. The former chief commissioner of the Human Rights Commission. federal said, this is all, you know, it's horrible, it's ridiculous. And I think they know damn well that there's absolutely no way that any of this will withstand a charter challenge.

And the point of this is, well, the point of this, and this is the case that he makes that I think is persuasive, is they're just trying to scare you. They're just trying to shut you out. They're just trying to put you on notice.

And the point of this is, well, the point of this, and this is the case that he makes that I think is persuasive, is they're just trying to scare you. They're just trying to shut you out. They're just trying to put you on notice.

Here's how what we've been discussing, particularly anti-Semitism, directly relates to this concern of yours in the matter of Bill C-63. And it also directly relates to how I've been attacked for merely noticing that a lot of what we've heard about mass graves, this archipelago of mass graves across the country at residential schools is a fiction.

Here's how what we've been discussing, particularly anti-Semitism, directly relates to this concern of yours in the matter of Bill C-63. And it also directly relates to how I've been attacked for merely noticing that a lot of what we've heard about mass graves, this archipelago of mass graves across the country at residential schools is a fiction.

There is a proposal, and it's supported by the Justice Minister, Arif Farhani. Yeah, he's fun. He's a lot of fun. He's everything you'd hope he'd be. Insert a concept called residential schools denial, which is an absurd abstraction. To insert it into the same section of the criminal code, that outlaws incitement against the Jews by Holocaust law.

There is a proposal, and it's supported by the Justice Minister, Arif Farhani. Yeah, he's fun. He's a lot of fun. He's everything you'd hope he'd be. Insert a concept called residential schools denial, which is an absurd abstraction. To insert it into the same section of the criminal code, that outlaws incitement against the Jews by Holocaust law.

It's all terrifying. Well, that's... And the other one, and I think we didn't even talk about this, the most pernicious, is this recent construction of anti-Palestinian racism.

It's all terrifying. Well, that's... And the other one, and I think we didn't even talk about this, the most pernicious, is this recent construction of anti-Palestinian racism.

As hate speech. Well, yeah, but if you look at the definition of it, and again, Trudeau says he's willing to adopt this in some form, as has the Justice Minister said the same.

As hate speech. Well, yeah, but if you look at the definition of it, and again, Trudeau says he's willing to adopt this in some form, as has the Justice Minister said the same.

The standard definition of anti-Palestinian racism, devised by the Arab Canadian Lawyers Association, which I've never heard of before, and I think this is all they've ever done, is any utterance of a conventional Zionist standpoint. cannot but be understood as anti-Palestinian racism. Right, right.

The standard definition of anti-Palestinian racism, devised by the Arab Canadian Lawyers Association, which I've never heard of before, and I think this is all they've ever done, is any utterance of a conventional Zionist standpoint. cannot but be understood as anti-Palestinian racism. Right, right.

It depends on how you add it up. I mean, a lot of Jews don't even bother to call the cops anymore. There's no point. We've seen drive-by shootings at Jewish schools. We've seen synagogues firebombed. We've seen one synagogue in Toronto has been attacked half a dozen times in a few weeks. We've seen Jewish businesses smashed, their windows smashed.

It depends on how you add it up. I mean, a lot of Jews don't even bother to call the cops anymore. There's no point. We've seen drive-by shootings at Jewish schools. We've seen synagogues firebombed. We've seen one synagogue in Toronto has been attacked half a dozen times in a few weeks. We've seen Jewish businesses smashed, their windows smashed.

That if you confront or deny or dispute the Palestinian narrative, if you dispute the Nakba, if you deny the right of Palestinians their claim to title of all of historic Palestine, then you are engaging in anti-Palestinian racism. In other words, then you're a Zionist. Okay, so let's tie... Of the mildest kind.

That if you confront or deny or dispute the Palestinian narrative, if you dispute the Nakba, if you deny the right of Palestinians their claim to title of all of historic Palestine, then you are engaging in anti-Palestinian racism. In other words, then you're a Zionist. Okay, so let's tie... Of the mildest kind.

It's in there. That is beyond the pale. No Jamesons.

It's in there. That is beyond the pale. No Jamesons.

apart from the fact that Trudeau is a dead man walking, quite apart from all that, I don't think there was any serious expectation that any of these laws, these initiatives would survive a charter challenge. It's all about intimidation. Think that was true with C-16? All about intimidation.

apart from the fact that Trudeau is a dead man walking, quite apart from all that, I don't think there was any serious expectation that any of these laws, these initiatives would survive a charter challenge. It's all about intimidation. Think that was true with C-16? All about intimidation.

And I think one of the things that our friends in Hong Kong in the democracy movement insisted upon was do not obey in advance. Do not obey in advance. Whatever they threaten you with, just say what you need to say and what you mean to say and bring it on. Let's have you then. Let's see the whites of your eyes. And I think that's the position that we all have to adopt. Yeah, well, it's hard.

And I think one of the things that our friends in Hong Kong in the democracy movement insisted upon was do not obey in advance. Do not obey in advance. Whatever they threaten you with, just say what you need to say and what you mean to say and bring it on. Let's have you then. Let's see the whites of your eyes. And I think that's the position that we all have to adopt. Yeah, well, it's hard.

I think all of that stuff is going to—it's gone. It's in the dustbin of history. Well, I'm hoping you're— You're being foolish by running off to America.

I think all of that stuff is going to—it's gone. It's in the dustbin of history. Well, I'm hoping you're— You're being foolish by running off to America.

Jewish neighborhoods, you know, throngs of anti-Zionist protesters in their neighborhoods.

Jewish neighborhoods, you know, throngs of anti-Zionist protesters in their neighborhoods.

Well, I think Canadians would, but it's a very good question about whether or not the professional and managerial cast would.

Well, I think Canadians would, but it's a very good question about whether or not the professional and managerial cast would.

Yeah, it's, there is my own, I've come to the conclusion that there's very little distinction that you can draw between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism. People will have all kinds of complaints about Israel. God bless them. The Israelis do. all kinds of complaints about their own government.

Yeah, it's, there is my own, I've come to the conclusion that there's very little distinction that you can draw between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism. People will have all kinds of complaints about Israel. God bless them. The Israelis do. all kinds of complaints about their own government.

And I think also it is complicated by, since October 7th, the very real, deep anguish and suffering that is being endured by the people of Gaza. I think it's very, very, very important to... notice this and to be able to talk about it. And one of the things that was really difficult for me to get at in my piece is that that's almost an impossible conversation for ordinary, decent people to have.

And I think also it is complicated by, since October 7th, the very real, deep anguish and suffering that is being endured by the people of Gaza. I think it's very, very, very important to... notice this and to be able to talk about it. And one of the things that was really difficult for me to get at in my piece is that that's almost an impossible conversation for ordinary, decent people to have.

Grant, thank you very much. You bet, you bet. Good talking to you.

Grant, thank you very much. You bet, you bet. Good talking to you.

Because as soon as you begin to discuss various policy prescriptions that might be useful in getting aid and comfort to the suffering of the people of Gaza, the conversation is immediately taken over.

Because as soon as you begin to discuss various policy prescriptions that might be useful in getting aid and comfort to the suffering of the people of Gaza, the conversation is immediately taken over.

by a vast constituency of opinion that uses the suffering of Palestinians, sometimes imagined, but quite often real, to weaponize, weaponizing that suffering to the purpose of a deep and fanatical ideological commitment to the destruction of the state of Israel and to driving the Jews into the sea. So, you know, whether you're a Jew or a Gentile, that conversation is almost impossible to have.

by a vast constituency of opinion that uses the suffering of Palestinians, sometimes imagined, but quite often real, to weaponize, weaponizing that suffering to the purpose of a deep and fanatical ideological commitment to the destruction of the state of Israel and to driving the Jews into the sea. So, you know, whether you're a Jew or a Gentile, that conversation is almost impossible to have.

And, yeah, I think, you know, most people associate anti-Semitism, I think, with, you know, sort of skinheads, people who... understand their lineage from the Nazis or whatever. That has not been a phenomenon in Canada for a long, long, long time. And there is something that has taken its place. Far and away, anti-Semitism in Canada is what you might call a left-wing phenomenon.

And, yeah, I think, you know, most people associate anti-Semitism, I think, with, you know, sort of skinheads, people who... understand their lineage from the Nazis or whatever. That has not been a phenomenon in Canada for a long, long, long time. And there is something that has taken its place. Far and away, anti-Semitism in Canada is what you might call a left-wing phenomenon.

You know what, afterwards you should send it to me.

You know what, afterwards you should send it to me.

The whole diversity, equity, and inclusion phenomenon, there's absolutely no room for the Jews there. It's impossible.

The whole diversity, equity, and inclusion phenomenon, there's absolutely no room for the Jews there. It's impossible.

You mean American Jews? Well, I'm going to talk about Canadian Jews. Things are a little weird in the United States. And I mean, I think I can understand a lot of the intellectual community, the strata in the United States, you know, finding Donald Trump vulgar and repugnant. And that's why a lot of Jews, I think, didn't vote for him.

You mean American Jews? Well, I'm going to talk about Canadian Jews. Things are a little weird in the United States. And I mean, I think I can understand a lot of the intellectual community, the strata in the United States, you know, finding Donald Trump vulgar and repugnant. And that's why a lot of Jews, I think, didn't vote for him.

The Israelis, interestingly... supported Trump more than a Kamala Harris presidency. Mm-hmm. You know, they kind of went, oh, yeah, well, you know, I'd like to admit it, but I hope Trump wins.

The Israelis, interestingly... supported Trump more than a Kamala Harris presidency. Mm-hmm. You know, they kind of went, oh, yeah, well, you know, I'd like to admit it, but I hope Trump wins.

I think other people have used the term cultural Marxism, which kind of, you know, it certainly borrows the language of Marxism and borrows the language of the left, but of course replaces the proletariat, the working class. is replaced by this kind of, you know, rainbow coalition, ethnic, racial, and gender subsets and subgroups.

But the other thing I think that's important to understand about antisemitism, it's not just like any other prejudice. It's not just another bigotry. It's a conspiracy theory. It's always been a conspiracy theory. And I think a lot of people who perhaps were once Marxists or are informed by the intellectual tradition in Marxism

can easily get that wrong, can easily imagine that, you know, the powerful hand of the international bourgeoisie has, you know, their names often end in Stein and Berg. And the next thing you know, you know, it's the Jews are being thrown down wells. And I think just to understand where we are in Canada particularly,

I think it's really necessary to understand the trajectory of the left over the last 25, 30 years. Well, go back a little further.

With the collapse of the Soviet Union, right? Much of the Democratic left was perfectly content with this, was very happy about this.

Yes. Yes. Much of the democratic left was, or at least resigned to it and confused by it. And then during the 1990s, the primary iteration of left-wing activism and politics was anti-globalization, showing up with these massive demonstrations at the IMF and the World Bank and the World Economic Forum. And then came 9-1-1. And 9-1-1 was kind of like a blunt trauma wound to everybody's head.

Everybody went a little bit weird. It was such a shock. I mean, it was like out of a movie, some kind of a science fiction movie. And immediately what happened was, you know, the iteration of the international left and the activist milieu changed. was cloaked in anti-war activism, right? And it shouldn't have taken much effort on the part of the mass media.

Unfortunately, and I have to confess as a lifelong journalist, the media was not at all helpful in Failing to recognize that this phenomenon that was being presented on the nightly news and on the front pages of the paper as an anti-war movement, they were actually on the other side. They weren't against war. They were on the other side.

And at the core of it, at the very, very core of it, whatever you happen to think about Afghanistan or Iraq, at the core of it was anti-Zionism, this thing called anti-Zionism. And that had sort of percolated from the 1970s. A lot of it was informed by Soviet propaganda, but from the United Nations, you know, the Durban Conference, the proposition that Zionism is racism.

Now in Canada, the way Irwin Kotler put it to me, I think very well, who, he's kind of my lodestar, I confess. Tell everybody who he is. Well, he's a former Canadian justice minister. He founded the Raoul Wallenberg Center for Human Rights, and I'm a senior fellow with the Raoul Wallenberg Center.

And he's beloved of persecuted Democrats the world round, whether it's Hong Kong or Belarus or just about anywhere, Russia. Anyway, the way he put it to me was that in Canada, particularly, Canadians, the United Nations is kind of in our DNA. Right. You know, the way we understand our role in the world, our place in the world. I mean, we were there at the Foundation of Israel.

We were there in the crafting of the United Nations Declaration on Human Rights. We were there in all of the protocols and conventions that arose from the ashes of the Shoah. This was a very Canadian thing and something to be proud of. But what we haven't really noticed over the years is the way the United Nations has been taken over by the Organization of the Islamic Congress.

It's been taken over by the police state bloc. The last time I looked, I think Beijing was basically in control of seven of the 11 major United Nations agencies. And then you get the United Nations Relief Works Agency, which is this strange agency.

strange organization that keeps alive the prospect that Israel is just a temporary aberration and that somehow the massively growing Palestinian refugee population, it's not really a refugee population, will somehow be sorted by the restoration of a Palestinian or an Arab sovereignty. in all the places where Israel currently exists.

So it's really hard for Canadians to sort of think, hmm, maybe the United Nations, maybe these, are we the baddies, you know?

The way I see those tangling together, if we can think of it in terms of the Liberal Party or the Trudeau Liberals, right? not the same as a lot of what a lot of people imagine the liberals to be, is that this kind of intellectual slovenliness that the sort of blind adherence to United Nations declarations and so on

and the entire panoply of its colonial settler state politics, its diversity, equity, and inclusion politics.

It's just there's no way that it can defend itself against a virulent, lurid, blood-curdling, anti-Semitic, anti-Zionist.

Okay, here's Trudeau. Here's Trudeau. Here's the thing about Trudeau. Yeah. There's really not much there. I hate to be uncharitable. I think it's time to be uncharitable. Okay. Well, there really isn't much there. I think you've been very interested in the phenomenon of narcissism. There you go. The world is a vanity mirror.

And you have to remember when he came along, it sort of parallels the rise of Trump in the United States, right? When he was first elected, just a few months from the election of Donald Trump. And Donald Trump, you know, said all these scary things about Muslims and then Justin Trudeau, you know, tweets, well, everybody's welcome to Canada. It doesn't matter. You can be a Muslim. We love you.

The next thing you know, he's on the front page of the Rolling Stone magazine. He's the toast of, you know, Vogue photo shoots. He's the leader of the free world.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think a lot of people, you know, he's not my cup of tea. but a lot of people were really swept. He was sort of like this matinee idol. A lot of people got caught up in that.

But as far as the intellectual milieu, if there was such a thing, around his emergence... Well, I mean, everybody was willing to give him a chance. I was willing to give him a chance. I remember speaking to him back when he was running for office, running for, you know, in the election. that period. And I was definitely willing to give them a shot. Why? Well, we spoke a lot about Syria. Yeah.

And I have many friends and comrades who are associated with the Syrian revolutionary movement. And what the NATO countries, what was being asked of the NATO countries at the time was a no-fly zone over Syria. All we need is one NATO country to say, yes, we need to do this. Because the Americans couldn't really understand what was going on.

And everyone hoped that it might be Trudeau who said, yeah, I'm in. And he did give me, and of course there was the whole Syrian refugee issue, and he did try to, he made a lot of capital, political capital out of that. We can come to that in a moment. But to understand who he represents and what he's all about, You have to wind the clock back further.

You remember when Michael Ignatieff was briefly the leader of the Liberal Party?

Well, he's a very smart guy, Michael Ignatieff.

He was an intellectual heavyweight. Yeah, he was actually. I like Michael. I mean, just as an intellectual.

You know, if you can imagine a kind of... Oh, I don't know. A TikTok account run by a 19-year-old college girl in charge of a G7 country. 14-year-old. Okay. But anyway, so he emerges. How does he present himself to the Liberal Party as a worthwhile leader of the party? Yeah. And for this, he turned to McKinsey & Associates. Consulting firm. Massive global consulting firm.

The apologist for dictators everywhere. I think, I don't know how many billions of dollars they've had to pay out in lawsuits for boosting... oxycontin sales in the United States, a fellow by the name of Dominic Barton, who happened to be a Canadian who spent half his life in China as the head of McKinsey.

Trudeau brought him in, and essentially to add gravitas to his candidacy for the Liberal Party,

It is a small town. Yes.

Ottawa. He was essentially a function of the Canada-China Business Council. This is a really important thing for people to understand. His entire campaign was built around the proposition, and this is how he sort of lent gravitas to himself, that the key to the future is China. Canada's future is China. The middle class prosperity is all about China, China, China.

And this immediately, you know, he immediately accrued to himself a lot of money and a lot of power and a lot of help. The Demare Corporation, the Power Corporation in Montreal, those whole circles. And of course, his father...

And people don't like to talk about this when they talk about Pierre Trudeau, but he was probably the most important propaganda asset for the Chinese Communist Party during the Maoist period in the English-speaking world. That's nothing.

So, you know, and Trudeau would trade in this and say, well, you know, they know me in China, you know, I can have a family name. And a lot of that was sort of glossed over. People didn't notice what was going on.

Well, all I can tell you is that, you know, two things happened in 2001. What happened, the atrocities in New York and Washington, the Al-Qaeda atrocities, and the moment that the West put a knife to its own throat only three months later by admitting China into the World Trade Organization. This is a massive event.

And I mean, I think there were a lot of people of good faith who imagined that the more China modernized and became capitalist, they'd become more like us. People who understood China knew this was rubbish. It was not going to happen.

Yeah, yeah. Okay? And, I mean, anybody who's followed Canadian politics at all

In the last five years, we'll be aware of the scandals associated with the intimacies between the Trudeau liberals and the United Front Work Department of the Chinese Communist Party and the Organization Department of the Politburo of the Chinese Communist Party, the manipulation and monkey wrenching of elections in 2019 and 2021. Yeah, we still don't know the full extent of that.

Yeah, the whole commission has yet to report, you know, sort of report.

Well, more than background rumors. One of the things that's difficult for people to grasp is that You know, a lot of people ask me, my goodness, the Chinese must have something on Justin Trudeau. Some compromise. He doesn't see anything wrong with it.

If you take all the crazy things—well, I don't. Some of the things that the Democrats are saying about Trump and Russia were not crazy. But if you take all the extreme accusations that the Democrats were making about Trump's associations with the Kremlin in the 2015 election—

Multiply that by 10, and you have in the real world Justin Trudeau's collusions and complicity with the Chinese Communist Party. In the open, by the way. And this is the thing. To understand Justin Trudeau, you have to understand he sees nothing wrong with this.

When he got elected, immediately after he got elected, in the first election, he sat down with a reporter from the New York Times and said, this is what basically Canada is. He saw a post-national state.

No core identity, no mainstream. And immediately the question should have turned to, I remember talking to Jerry Butts about this, his sort of principal advisor, because we used to be quite chummy. And, you know, John Ralston Saul. Jerry doesn't take much of me. He doesn't like me either.

You know, John Ralston Saul, the philosopher, he wrote this concept of Canada as a postmodern state. And it was kind of a nuanced, interesting philosophy, whatever. And I remember talking to Jerry. I said, Trudeau kind of got that wrong. I mean, wasn't he kind of channeling John Ralston's soul? He said, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. He meant it, post-national. And so here's the question.

Well, if you hang around with the Canada-China Business Council long enough— If you enthusiastically support, for instance, the largest overseas acquisition in the history of the People's Republic of China, the, you know, Sinox acquisition of Nexen. Flesh that out a little bit.

Well, yeah, it was at a time when, just before Justin Trudeau was elected, when the Chinese Communist Party was buying up all the major, really key strategic sort of spigot points in the oil patch in Alberta. And the Harper government, the cabinet, was terribly divided about this.

and um eventually the good guys the good guys won the people i considered the good guys when harper said okay that's it you know sure it's a lot of money they're offering us twice the share value for every purchase they're making but no we do not want canada's energy sector to be owned by the organization department of the politburo probably better than that than stephen will bow

Oh, yeah, the post-national stuff. This is really key. How do you do national security in a post-national state? What does it even mean? You see, I don't think they really thought this through. What are Canada's national interests if we're a post-national country?

And as I say, I don't know that I want to describe it as an ideology. It's kind of like an ideational package. This notion that Canada is this racist, colonial, settler state that has engaged in genocide after genocide against its indigenous peoples. And we're the liberals, and we're the nice ones. And so that's essentially what Trudeau was all about.

And I think, you know, there's an adage that what starts with the Jews doesn't end with the Jews.

That's very true. And I don't want to dispute that, and I don't want what I'm about to say as a contradiction of that. Mm-hmm.

uh my personal view is that if it did end with the jews it would still be evil yeah so big deal kind of a deal a lot of people was put it this way you know first they'll they come for the saturday people and then they'll come for the sunday people right right yeah canada happened the other way around it happened on the weekend of may 29th yeah may 29th 2021 when justin trudeau lowered the flag on parliament hill

And on the Monday ordered the flag lowered on all federal buildings across the country, owing to a report out of Kamloops about the discovery of a mass grave. And on the Tuesday, the chief of the Kamloops First Nation said, well, actually we didn't say mass grave. But the flag stayed down. The flags were at half mast. For how long? Like six months? Seven months, I think it was.

And the people, God bless them, who managed to get them back up again were the Mohawks. Thank God for the Mohawks.

Yeah. They said, look, you know, we have a lot of people who are veterans and we lower our flags on the 11th of November and also on Aboriginal Veterans Day. So how the hell are we going to lower the flags if they're already lowered? Do something about it.

You can wrap it up this way. This strange thing that we've just described, right? A lot of people talk about woke politics or whatever. It's not wicked because it's anti-Semitic. It's anti-Semitic because it's wicked.

It has nowhere else to go. This is what history... So why draw that distinction? Because this is what history tells us. about the agony of the Jews. And I really wish we had been able to kind of emerge from this. Everybody loves dead Jews. Everyone wants them to cry, isn't sad. But God forbid they should stand up on their own two feet and say, actually, no, we're restoring Jewish sovereignty.

in our ancient homeland, and you will not take that tone with us anymore, thank you very much. You know, everybody would prefer sort of be like, you know, sing Pete Seeger songs and pat Jews on the head. When Jews say, actually, no, we're, I mean, thanks for the help, but we're gonna stand up for ourselves.

This is what a lot of people on the left could not abide when the Jews began to get saucy in this way. And interestingly, this is very tied into the way the sort of Trudeau liberals understand indigenous people in Canada. And it's tied into the whole sort of from Turtle Island to Palestine that you keep hearing in the activist milieu.

Well, it was actually a white guy who came up with that.

Was it Gary Snyder? He was a poet in Chicago, I think. Anyway, I mean, there is some vague reference that can be drawn to, I think, an Anishinaabe creation, but whatever. I think it is a bowdlerization of the magnificent cultural diversity of indigenous peoples in this country, which we could talk about because you live in an interesting place, or we're filming this in a very interesting place.

But the idea

that if indigenous people would stand up and say actually okay this whole territory as far as the eye can see you idiots you never signed a treaty with us we still own the land under british and canadian constitutional law uh aboriginal title is is enforceable and we're gonna start like we're gonna start acting like we own the place you better deal with us you're not gonna chop down all our trees and ship them off to china

Thank you very much. You're going to leave a lot of the wealth in the countryside with all our white neighbors. We're going to work in sawmills. We're going to produce wealth from this territory. People like Justin Trudeau's liberals do not want to hear this. They would rather come to you and say, oh, yes, would you like a wellness center? You know, stroke you on the back.

Oh, you know, victims, survivors. And by the way, here's $380 million to busy yourself rummaging around in graveyards for the next 10 years. This is, I think, really important to understand about this phenomenon. It is a kind of liberal racism, a liberal racism of low expectations. So there's all that. But there's also the fact that there's now 1.8 million Muslims in the country.

And I don't want to, you know, this is really fighting words for me because, you know, a lot of my friends are Muslims and Arabs and my compatriots and my circle. And we have to be very, very, very careful about the way we talk about this. But the reality of it is that when you have this notion of Canada, this, you know, This multicultural. Yeah, this multiplicity of diversities and so on.

What you find is that there are certain organizations and institutions in this country that are very well financed and resourced by the federal government. and are intended to speak on behalf of, for instance, Canadian Muslims.

Well, it is essentially an investigation of the state of anti-Semitism in Canada. And I spent quite a bit of time and effort on this, 16 in-depth interviews, maybe another 16 interviews. not so in-depth interviews, a lot of research, a lot of time and trouble trying to get this sorted.

One of them is the Muslim Association of Canada, which is explicitly devoted to the theology of Hassan al-Banna, the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, the fountainhead of Islamism, who was a collaborator with and a philosophical fellow traveler with Adolf Hitler. So this is a bit of a problem, you know? I mean, this is not gonna work out well in the long run.

And there's only 350,000 Jews in Canada. Right, right, right. It's a small town.

Yeah, like Thomas Mulcair, who's kind of an old-fashioned social democrat, you know, somebody who speaks the same language I speak, quite frankly.

Yeah, yeah. And he said, you know, Canada's position on Israel is incomprehensible. You insist, because you need to, that Israel has a right to defend itself. And yet you will refuse to send any munitions to Israel or anything at all that might be used as a part of an airplane that might be in the Israeli Air Force. And she went so far as to, I think it was General Dynamics has a plant in Quebec.

So it's actually American material going to Israel. And she said, no, we're not going to issue an export permit for that either. So Israel has a right to defend itself, but Israel is not allowed to have the means to defend itself. So Mulcair says, this is incomprehensible. It's just gobbledygook. It's mumbo jumbo. You know, talking to Melanie Jolie, the foreign affairs minister.

And her response was, Thomas, have you seen the demographics of my writing? Yeah, right.

And if you look at the Democrats of her writing, or it's probably the demographics of her writing, Hansa Karsherville. The immigration into that writing has been off the charts. I mean, immigration into the country has been off the charts. Right, to add another dimension of complexity as well.

Yeah, and we should talk about Polyev because when we're talking about Trudeau, we really are talking about a dead man walking. Yesterday, his government almost collapsed.

And just for fun, her replacement, Dominic LeBlanc, used to be Trudeau's babysitter. Now, just imagine if Donald Trump appointed his babysitter as the Secretary of the Treasury.

And I think part of Barry's motivation was that she was sort of vaguely, dimly aware that something very, very unseemly was occurring in Canada. And she and I knew one another. We were kind of chummy. And I've covered, I've been sort of interested and concerned about anti-Semitism for about 20, 25 years now, actually, for reasons we might discuss.

Here's the thing. The other thing that Americans have to understand is that Canada is a bilingual country. constitutional monarchy, one of the most decentralized federal systems on earth that is thinly populated and spread out across the top of the most dynamic cultural phenomenon in the history of nation states. So the role of a Canadian prime minister has always been,

to unite the country, to keep, you know, the role of federal policy has always been to allow Canadians to have a conversation amongst themselves. It's why we fund the CBC and the Canadian Council for the Arts and what have you. And it's a difficult thing to do because we are very, very culturally diverse. I mean, in every traditional sense of the word, the French speaking people of Quebec

the poor land Quebecers, are a nation in every conventional sense of the word. And Canada is, well, yeah, I guess we're kind of a nation, but it's complicated. I mean... It is vastly complicated, and it's a huge landscape. So the function of a prime minister has to be to unite the country.

Something core. Something that when push comes to shove, it's possible that we might be able to muster fire in the belly.

Quite so.

The other thing about Trudeau is that it's a complete rejection of that, a complete reversal of that. It's just like, meh, we're a post-national country. And immigration, fine, you want to come in, yes. You know, Dominic Barton, who ended up being our ambassador to China, the guy who came from China's McKinsey and Associates and who crafted Trudeau's campaign campaign,

at the very, very, very beginning of his rise to politics, says, yeah, we should actually have about a half a million people coming into Canada every year. We should aim for 100 million. We should at least double our population, you know, in the next generation or two.

Yes, we have.

We don't know how many people live in this country, Jordan. Yeah. We know from a recent census it's about 41 million. But on top of that, we have, well, for instance, over the next 12 months, 5 million people who live in Canada on various kinds of temporary permits and so on. So it's one-eighth of the population. Within the next 12 months, those permits expire.

Then there's another between 50 and 500,000, according to the official guess. of the Immigration and Refugees and Citizenship Department, who are what they call out-of-contract workers, which are undocumented workers. Now, for Americans to hear these numbers, you know, America's 10 times as many people, it's 10 times as populous. So, you know, just do the math, right?

If there's 5 million, if there are 50 million Americans or people living in the United States whose temporary permits expire within the next 12 months and who have all given every impression that they do not intend to leave. Yes, why would they leave? So Pierre Polyev's coming along, right? Yeah.

And the interesting thing about Pierre Polyev, this goes back to what we were talking about earlier about language. Is this liberal or what the hell? Pierre Polyev, when he talks about housing, when he talks about employment, when he talks about access to health care, when he talks about wages, he's Bernie Sanders. Americans have to understand this. Try to imagine Bernie Sanders.

I mean, and also the trade union vote has gone to conservatives. This has never happened before. The working class vote has gone to Pierre Polyev. I don't know. I mean, I'm not a partisan conservative. I don't know if I've ever written a conservative sentence in my life, by the way, although most of my friends seem to be conservatives. I don't know how that happens.

And so she said, well, it looks like Glavin's the guy to do this story. So I did this story. And it's about 6,700 words long. It's a very deep investigation. And it has attracted a heck of a lot of attention. Unfortunately, it doesn't make Canada look very good. I wrote this primarily for an American audience.

So my great fear, and I'll close with this, and you can challenge me. Tell me I'm wrong, or if you like, whatever. You can argue. I think we've got about... year or two before everything starts to come unglued. And I'm very worried about this. I've always been an optimist. I've been an inveterate optimist.

But I actually haven't seen in Polyev a degree of sophistication in comprehending the nature and the scope of what he's going to be facing.

I thought it was Alabama. Is it Mississippi? Same thing.

No, that's never going to happen.

Well, the Liberals might, but it might be some iteration of a Liberal Party that older Canadians are more familiar with.

Well, their history.

I found Americans, God bless them, they haven't the faintest idea what's happening in Canada. They have an idea of Canada. embedded in their brains, and it's really hard to shake them from it. Canada is not the place that you will find in Michael Moore documentaries. Canada is not the place that you'll find in any aspect of American media, actually, particularly over the last 10 years.

Well, here's an interesting story. You find this a lot, this sort of speculation about, well, oh, this Trump thing, you know, could it happen in Canada? Right-wing populism, yada, yada, everyone wets their pants. Oh, my God, not here. Well, it actually did happen here, and it happened back then, and it was the reform part.

Well, one of the things I think Conservatives should remember about the Reform Party is the result of the Reform Party was they reduced the Conservatives to three. And they ushered in a decade of liberal rule. So, good luck to you lads. Canadians, I think, are, you know, this is something I also want to stress. The overwhelming majority of Canadians are not anti-Semites.

I would say probably the overwhelming majority of Muslims are not anti-Semites, although that's hard to say. It also depends to some degree on how you phrased the question. That's right. In fact, I refer to a study... of Muslim public opinion.

And it was actually the proportion of Muslims who agreed to answer a particular question about suicide bombing and about whether or not the state of Israel should be allowed to exist. It was pretty high. There was, do you remember, there was a big debate about five years ago, six years ago, about Islamophobia.

In Canada. You know, there was going to be a law, there was going to be statutory reform to sort of outlaw Islamophobia.

And the liberals refused to define what they actually meant by Islamophobia.

Yeah. And you would hear the liberals say that every day, you know, Muslims in Canada are subjected to racist abuse and intimidation. And I remember because I'm a complete public opinion poll nerd. Data is the thing I need to get. Give me the data. Everybody's opinion. Who cares? Give me the data.

And public opinion back then showed that the overwhelming majority of Muslims in Canada were actually demonstrated a higher degree of pride in their country than than what you might call old stock Canadians. And the main complaint that Muslims had about Canada was, it's so damn cold here. Nobody was worried about, nobody was freaking out. Perfectly valid complaint, by the way.

It's just, I think we have to be very, very, very careful about understanding the nature of the problem. And we have to be very careful about the words that we use, the language that we use. And we all use these words, the kind of euphemisms, left-wing or progressive. Are you kidding me? What is progressive about the phenomena that we end up describing as progressive?

How is this in any way an aid of human progress or civilizational progress? It's reactionary. It's regressive.

It's changed.

Yeah, well, I'll go back, I think, to what I was inarticulately trying to describe about the trajectory of the left since the 1990s. I think by the 80s, I think, or the 90s, you could say that we'd won we, if I can say that, because I kind of came from the left, although I have no ideological commitments, and I'm kind of sour these days on the left. But anyway, we'd won all our bouts.

We've won them all. Civil rights, equal rights for people of color. Gay marriage. Gay marriage, the right of women to equality in the workplace, the right of unions to organize, labor relations standards, environmental laws were coming along. We'd won all our big battles.

Yeah. And I think, I mean, a mistake to get too weird, not to get too weird about it, but one mistake Marxists made was this idea that there is no more useful role for the bourgeoisie in the progress of human society. They actually were wrong about that because it was the bourgeoisie that led the charge against slavery and for women's rights.

Yeah, what is particularly concerning is that Canadian Jews are almost universally disconsolate, dejected, afraid, alienated, isolated, and they feel very strongly in the main that their government is not protecting them. That's because their government isn't protecting them. Yeah, they might be onto something. They might be, all right.

So at any rate, by the 80s or the 90s, you know, we'd won. So something peculiar has happened, and there is this very dark phenomenon that has occupied all the places where the left used to be. And it is invariably... masochistic, sinister, self-hating. Let's tear down the liberal democracies. Let's cast Canada as this illegitimate, racist, colonial settler state.

Let's identify Israel as the epitome of everything that we loathe and despise. it's an ugly, ugly, ugly thing. And I mean, I think it's ugly. Maybe that's an opinion. I don't know. I think it's demonstrably true.

And that was the thing that I was watching over the years is that, you know, I spent a lot of, well, my last major book was about Afghanistan and I spent a lot of time in Syria and the Northeast with the Kurds and

Okay, here's a proposition. Everybody likes to beat up on the news media, right? I've come up in the news media in the old discipline. You spend six years as an apprentice before you're a journeyman in the old guild system. Six years as a reporter. After that, well, maybe you'll be allowed to have an opinion about something.

Really elaborate conventions and disciplines in what was essentially a trade, a craft, right? Um, and with the, uh, you know, the golden era was about the 1980s, I would say 1970s, 1980s. And then with the advent of digital technologies and a whole bunch of other reasons, um, news, the news media, the conventional news media began to wither away and collapse.

And it's replaced by, you know, people talk about the mainstream media. Well, the mainstream media today is Twitter. That's the mainstream media now. And so in this period, it became increasingly difficult for journalists to actually tell a story. The results be damned.

It's much easier to basically fill your shift with three or four stories for deadline, each of which more or less uphold the narrative framework of the subscriber base that your media organization is targeting. A lot of it really is about the decline and the collapse of news media. I mean, I can talk about that a little bit because it's something I know.

But I think a lot of it too, I think, is language. It's simple language. that probably ends up with most ordinary people who are only casually interested in the struggle for democracy in China or events in the Middle East or this strange creature that has come to occupy all the spaces where the Liberal Party used to be. It's the language that we use. How conservative are the conservative?

How liberal are the liberals?

You can't call Donald Trump a conservative. He's anything but. And I don't think you can call... Justin Trudeau liberal, really, in any conventional sense. No, I don't. Very authoritarian, very much a sort of state capitalist thought control kind of way of looking at politics.

And I think, I mean, for people to understand this phenomenon, this thing that... that kind of burst into the consciousness of most Canadians on the 8th of October, immediately after the Simchat Torah pogrom, the atrocities undertaken by Hamas in Southern Israel at the Supernova Music Festival in the Kibbutzim around the Gaza envelope. Immediately afterwards, the event was celebrated.

Be very, very careful when you use the term we. 20%, only 20% of Canadians voted for Trudeau in the last election. He hasn't gained anything. He's lost a lot. Yeah. Yeah. I think a lot of people are scared of the unknown. I think they're willing to step out into the cool and the dark. But there are still people who will not vote conservative. Fair play. It doesn't really matter.

We're going to see an absolute rout of the Liberals in the next election. One of the things we haven't even discussed is the rise of the indépendantistes in Quebec, the Bloc.

That's a very real possibility. Although one of the things that's interesting about Quebec is that all of these things that bedevil us, and are increasingly bourgeois sensitivities about race and gender. Quebecers aren't phased. Meh. They don't care. They do not care. In Quebec, in the French, poor land Quebecers, they're not woke. The left in Quebec is not woke. And that I find fascinating.

I think they have a real sense of themselves. A lot of it doesn't really, you know, laïcité, their idea of, you know, extreme secularism, doesn't sit well with me. But what the hell? They seem to know what they're about.

There's also an argument that I've heard that a lot of young Quebecers, they don't remember back in the day. They don't remember the old days. They're not interested in separatism. So who knows? Who knows? But it does add a layer of complexity to this that...

Because the Jews are terrified. Because the Jews are persecuted in this country.

Yeah, you could put it that way. I think it would be of concern to me even if they were not the canary in the coal mine. Yeah, that's... I mean, if it's a personal question, you know, it's an odd thing. I mean, it's a family thing. My association with the Jewish community goes back a long way. I'm a Tague. I'm Irish Catholic. Yeah. But it's complicated.

And it is a concern of mine and the company that I keep. But it's such a terrible state on Canada's reputation, too. The thing is when you talk to old Jews, right, like really sophisticated guys who've been in and out of office or university professors, and they will tell you, you know, with their voice cracking— I have never seen anything like this in my life. Yeah, right.

I feel exactly the same way. All the communities I talk to, the Hillel on campus, you know, synagogues across the country, people are afraid, and they feel abandoned, and they feel as though their government has abandoned them. Yeah, well, they made a calculated decision. This is worth noticing. And what am I? I'm just a guy. I'm a reporter. I'm a writer. So I've done my best to...

actually celebrated and Hamas was praised and this was characterized as a great act of heroic resistance against the illegitimate colonial settler state of Israel and We saw this from one end of the country to the other City after city day after day week after week And what we have seen in the year and a bit since that day, a 670% increase in anti-Semitic incidents, give or take.

to document this and to bear witness to it. And I don't know what's going to come of it. I'm here talking to you about it. There you go.

But- Yeah, that was funny the way that happened. I said, you know, Jordan Peterson, he's like one of these big forehead guys. Everybody likes him. You know, Barry, Barry, you talk to him, Barry. And, you know, he's great, but, you know, you meet up with him in New York or wherever. And then Barry said, well, actually, he's on Vancouver Island.

Okay, that's only like three hours from where I am, so that's how it happened.

You know, here's the former director. I forgot his name. He's a lovely guy. The former chief commissioner of the Human Rights Commission. federal said, this is all, you know, it's horrible, it's ridiculous. And I think they know damn well that there's absolutely no way that any of this will withstand a charter challenge.

And the point of this is, well, the point of this, and this is the case that he makes that I think is persuasive, is they're just trying to scare you. They're just trying to shut you out. They're just trying to put you on notice.

Here's how what we've been discussing, particularly anti-Semitism, directly relates to this concern of yours in the matter of Bill C-63. And it also directly relates to how I've been attacked for merely noticing that a lot of what we've heard about mass graves, this archipelago of mass graves across the country at residential schools is a fiction.

There is a proposal, and it's supported by the Justice Minister, Arif Farhani. Yeah, he's fun. He's a lot of fun. He's everything you'd hope he'd be. Insert a concept called residential schools denial, which is an absurd abstraction. To insert it into the same section of the criminal code, that outlaws incitement against the Jews by Holocaust law.

It's all terrifying. Well, that's... And the other one, and I think we didn't even talk about this, the most pernicious, is this recent construction of anti-Palestinian racism.

As hate speech. Well, yeah, but if you look at the definition of it, and again, Trudeau says he's willing to adopt this in some form, as has the Justice Minister said the same.

The standard definition of anti-Palestinian racism, devised by the Arab Canadian Lawyers Association, which I've never heard of before, and I think this is all they've ever done, is any utterance of a conventional Zionist standpoint. cannot but be understood as anti-Palestinian racism. Right, right.

It depends on how you add it up. I mean, a lot of Jews don't even bother to call the cops anymore. There's no point. We've seen drive-by shootings at Jewish schools. We've seen synagogues firebombed. We've seen one synagogue in Toronto has been attacked half a dozen times in a few weeks. We've seen Jewish businesses smashed, their windows smashed.

That if you confront or deny or dispute the Palestinian narrative, if you dispute the Nakba, if you deny the right of Palestinians their claim to title of all of historic Palestine, then you are engaging in anti-Palestinian racism. In other words, then you're a Zionist. Okay, so let's tie... Of the mildest kind.

It's in there. That is beyond the pale. No Jamesons.

apart from the fact that Trudeau is a dead man walking, quite apart from all that, I don't think there was any serious expectation that any of these laws, these initiatives would survive a charter challenge. It's all about intimidation. Think that was true with C-16? All about intimidation.

And I think one of the things that our friends in Hong Kong in the democracy movement insisted upon was do not obey in advance. Do not obey in advance. Whatever they threaten you with, just say what you need to say and what you mean to say and bring it on. Let's have you then. Let's see the whites of your eyes. And I think that's the position that we all have to adopt. Yeah, well, it's hard.

I think all of that stuff is going to—it's gone. It's in the dustbin of history. Well, I'm hoping you're— You're being foolish by running off to America.

Jewish neighborhoods, you know, throngs of anti-Zionist protesters in their neighborhoods.

Well, I think Canadians would, but it's a very good question about whether or not the professional and managerial cast would.

Yeah, it's, there is my own, I've come to the conclusion that there's very little distinction that you can draw between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism. People will have all kinds of complaints about Israel. God bless them. The Israelis do. all kinds of complaints about their own government.

And I think also it is complicated by, since October 7th, the very real, deep anguish and suffering that is being endured by the people of Gaza. I think it's very, very, very important to... notice this and to be able to talk about it. And one of the things that was really difficult for me to get at in my piece is that that's almost an impossible conversation for ordinary, decent people to have.

Grant, thank you very much. You bet, you bet. Good talking to you.

Because as soon as you begin to discuss various policy prescriptions that might be useful in getting aid and comfort to the suffering of the people of Gaza, the conversation is immediately taken over.

by a vast constituency of opinion that uses the suffering of Palestinians, sometimes imagined, but quite often real, to weaponize, weaponizing that suffering to the purpose of a deep and fanatical ideological commitment to the destruction of the state of Israel and to driving the Jews into the sea. So, you know, whether you're a Jew or a Gentile, that conversation is almost impossible to have.

And, yeah, I think, you know, most people associate anti-Semitism, I think, with, you know, sort of skinheads, people who... understand their lineage from the Nazis or whatever. That has not been a phenomenon in Canada for a long, long, long time. And there is something that has taken its place. Far and away, anti-Semitism in Canada is what you might call a left-wing phenomenon.

You know what, afterwards you should send it to me.

The whole diversity, equity, and inclusion phenomenon, there's absolutely no room for the Jews there. It's impossible.

You mean American Jews? Well, I'm going to talk about Canadian Jews. Things are a little weird in the United States. And I mean, I think I can understand a lot of the intellectual community, the strata in the United States, you know, finding Donald Trump vulgar and repugnant. And that's why a lot of Jews, I think, didn't vote for him.

The Israelis, interestingly... supported Trump more than a Kamala Harris presidency. Mm-hmm. You know, they kind of went, oh, yeah, well, you know, I'd like to admit it, but I hope Trump wins.