John Kasich

No, you're doing it right. The first one was called Courage is Contagious and it was about individuals doing remarkable things. And then I kind of concluded that if individuals had some fellow travelers with them, they could do a heck of a lot more. And the faith institutions were a great way to be able to accomplish more things.

No, you're doing it right. The first one was called Courage is Contagious and it was about individuals doing remarkable things. And then I kind of concluded that if individuals had some fellow travelers with them, they could do a heck of a lot more. And the faith institutions were a great way to be able to accomplish more things.

Well, you know, me giving an answer like that is so silly because you could write your own couple of volumes about it. Of course, but you've been a practitioner. I'm the observer. You're the practitioner. I think that, you know, it's so interesting because, as you know, political parties have lost their influence, right? I mean, this is going to sound counterintuitive.

Well, you know, me giving an answer like that is so silly because you could write your own couple of volumes about it. Of course, but you've been a practitioner. I'm the observer. You're the practitioner. I think that, you know, it's so interesting because, as you know, political parties have lost their influence, right? I mean, this is going to sound counterintuitive.

Parties no longer screen candidates. They no longer fund them. They're all funded by special interest groups. So these people go to Washington, elected by this group and that group and the other group. And you would think that there would be less loyalty to sort of a Republican or a Democrat brand. But yes, it seems as though that brand kind of defines a person.

Parties no longer screen candidates. They no longer fund them. They're all funded by special interest groups. So these people go to Washington, elected by this group and that group and the other group. And you would think that there would be less loyalty to sort of a Republican or a Democrat brand. But yes, it seems as though that brand kind of defines a person.

I don't know if they have much of any influence, to be honest with you, Chuck. And maybe that's something I want to write about. Maybe you and I can write something together about that, about how that's an interesting thing, because people don't realize that.

I don't know if they have much of any influence, to be honest with you, Chuck. And maybe that's something I want to write about. Maybe you and I can write something together about that, about how that's an interesting thing, because people don't realize that.

You know, when I was first starting out, I had to go, you know, visit the screening committee, the central committee, the committee members, the this, the that, all that stuff.

You know, when I was first starting out, I had to go, you know, visit the screening committee, the central committee, the committee members, the this, the that, all that stuff.

Ich sah die Partei als mein Fahrzeug, nicht mein Meister, aber es war mein Fahrzeug, um Dinge in der Leben zu tun. Um es kurz zu machen, glaube ich, dass die Leute jetzt, erstens, Angst haben, sich mit ihrer Brand oder ihrer Gruppe zu verabschieden. Because they're afraid they'll be punished politically or they won't be liked. You know, they got to go if they're going to go to a party.

Ich sah die Partei als mein Fahrzeug, nicht mein Meister, aber es war mein Fahrzeug, um Dinge in der Leben zu tun. Um es kurz zu machen, glaube ich, dass die Leute jetzt, erstens, Angst haben, sich mit ihrer Brand oder ihrer Gruppe zu verabschieden. Because they're afraid they'll be punished politically or they won't be liked. You know, they got to go if they're going to go to a party.

They got to be in the right place, because if you're not in the right space, then you get shunned. And, you know, some people care about that. You know, it's not anything I've ever cared much about. And then there's the threat of the primaries, of course. And so if I go my own way and I start. Remember what was really crazy?

They got to be in the right place, because if you're not in the right space, then you get shunned. And, you know, some people care about that. You know, it's not anything I've ever cared much about. And then there's the threat of the primaries, of course. And so if I go my own way and I start. Remember what was really crazy?

You remember when Chris Christie hugged Obama because Obama brought all that money to New Jersey after the terrible storm?

You remember when Chris Christie hugged Obama because Obama brought all that money to New Jersey after the terrible storm?

It meant nothing more than respect. Yeah, well, it didn't work out that well for him because people went crazy. And now you see... Remember Charlie Crist?

It meant nothing more than respect. Yeah, well, it didn't work out that well for him because people went crazy. And now you see... Remember Charlie Crist?

You know, Chuck, I think what it gets down to is people would rather have, we all would rather have an easy road than a hard road. And it's just easier to be part of that group. It's easier to win re-election without a primary. It's just easier. And I just don't think easier is good in life. I mean, we'd all want easier, but we know that difficult has made us better.

You know, Chuck, I think what it gets down to is people would rather have, we all would rather have an easy road than a hard road. And it's just easier to be part of that group. It's easier to win re-election without a primary. It's just easier. And I just don't think easier is good in life. I mean, we'd all want easier, but we know that difficult has made us better.

And the parties had to keep track of how it was used. Now, I don't know how much it would change with where the political parties are today, because most of the people running the political parties kind of have this mindset as well. But it gives you a greater chance. I think to bring about reforms. Everybody talks about redistricting and all that.

And the parties had to keep track of how it was used. Now, I don't know how much it would change with where the political parties are today, because most of the people running the political parties kind of have this mindset as well. But it gives you a greater chance. I think to bring about reforms. Everybody talks about redistricting and all that.

I think this is a really significant thing because there's no screening process anymore. And people would say, well, that's not open. You know, the party bosses, you know, when you have adults who are trying to decide who's fit to represent people and who's not. I think that's probably necessary today. We certainly need to need to reflect on it for sure. No, that's true.

I think this is a really significant thing because there's no screening process anymore. And people would say, well, that's not open. You know, the party bosses, you know, when you have adults who are trying to decide who's fit to represent people and who's not. I think that's probably necessary today. We certainly need to need to reflect on it for sure. No, that's true.

I want you to dig into something that you said. One other thing, Chuck. I know this is the way it always is with you and me. You keep interrupting. I keep interrupting you. But vice versa. But, you know, the book Heaven Help Us is about courage and it's about faith in something greater than ourselves. And if all you care about is what's in it for myself. Then you fall short.

I want you to dig into something that you said. One other thing, Chuck. I know this is the way it always is with you and me. You keep interrupting. I keep interrupting you. But vice versa. But, you know, the book Heaven Help Us is about courage and it's about faith in something greater than ourselves. And if all you care about is what's in it for myself. Then you fall short.

But if all of a sudden you show courage and you go your own way, you know, it's fantastic. And life is so short and your ability to make an impact is so short that don't blow it. And without faith in a higher power that looks after us, that's a contributor to why people can have more courage, in my opinion.

But if all of a sudden you show courage and you go your own way, you know, it's fantastic. And life is so short and your ability to make an impact is so short that don't blow it. And without faith in a higher power that looks after us, that's a contributor to why people can have more courage, in my opinion.

Yeah, one sort, but not the kind of faith I'm talking about.

Yeah, one sort, but not the kind of faith I'm talking about.

But faith in democracy would mean that you believe that despite any turbulence that we might see from time to time, that there's enough checks and balances in the system that democracy will be preserved.

But faith in democracy would mean that you believe that despite any turbulence that we might see from time to time, that there's enough checks and balances in the system that democracy will be preserved.

I would say most times that would be right, but there have been times when people's minds have been, and we don't need to get into the ravages of the ability of human beings to be incredibly cruel to others, but by and large, I agree with you.

I would say most times that would be right, but there have been times when people's minds have been, and we don't need to get into the ravages of the ability of human beings to be incredibly cruel to others, but by and large, I agree with you.

And that can be protected too, by the way, by this bigger issue of faith. See, you've always been a skeptic that somebody that's been in politics could write a book like this, but I don't think so. I think now more than ever.

And that can be protected too, by the way, by this bigger issue of faith. See, you've always been a skeptic that somebody that's been in politics could write a book like this, but I don't think so. I think now more than ever.

Yeah, well, that's not why I did it.

Yeah, well, that's not why I did it.

Here's what surprised me, Chuck. If I'd have written a real ripper here and just attacked a whole bunch of people, The book would do better because I thought that people would be ready at this point in time for a little bit of going to your corners, chilling out, relaxing. Nope, it's dukes up, man. We're still brawling. Or in Canada, elbows up. Elbows up.

Here's what surprised me, Chuck. If I'd have written a real ripper here and just attacked a whole bunch of people, The book would do better because I thought that people would be ready at this point in time for a little bit of going to your corners, chilling out, relaxing. Nope, it's dukes up, man. We're still brawling. Or in Canada, elbows up. Elbows up.

At some point it's going to settle down, though. It has to. Even fighters get, that's why they only have 15 rounds. You can't go 16 because they can't keep fighting.

At some point it's going to settle down, though. It has to. Even fighters get, that's why they only have 15 rounds. You can't go 16 because they can't keep fighting.

I would say it's a uniter, if you were lucky. It would be a uniter rather than a divider. That's what I would think.

I would say it's a uniter, if you were lucky. It would be a uniter rather than a divider. That's what I would think.

Can't predict. I mean, just as you say, the people are pretty smart. So we have to see. We're just early. You know, we're 100 days in.

Can't predict. I mean, just as you say, the people are pretty smart. So we have to see. We're just early. You know, we're 100 days in.

Well, if I were advising somebody who was going to run, I would say you need to make sure that you are capable of raising money because Chuck Chuck Todd in the old world would pay attention to nobody who wouldn't pay attention to somebody that didn't raise any money and didn't have a good finance report. So that's one thing I tell them.

Well, if I were advising somebody who was going to run, I would say you need to make sure that you are capable of raising money because Chuck Chuck Todd in the old world would pay attention to nobody who wouldn't pay attention to somebody that didn't raise any money and didn't have a good finance report. So that's one thing I tell them.

Oh, secondly, I would also tell them that they need to have an agenda and they should start. You know, I don't know who I'm thinking more of the Democrats than the Republicans, because I don't know what the Republicans are going to do. I I don't know. Ich denke, es ist jemand, der ein Rekord hat, der, wie du sagst, ein bisschen empathischer sein kann.

Oh, secondly, I would also tell them that they need to have an agenda and they should start. You know, I don't know who I'm thinking more of the Democrats than the Republicans, because I don't know what the Republicans are going to do. I I don't know. Ich denke, es ist jemand, der ein Rekord hat, der, wie du sagst, ein bisschen empathischer sein kann.

Ich meine, einer der Jungs, den ich denke, hat einiges von Potenzial, Chuck, und du würdest es enttäuschen, und ich habe das schon gesagt, I don't know him well, but I've watched him. I was first caught my attention in a shooting in Kentucky and how he talked about it and combined compassion, his faith. I think Andy Beshear is a very interesting guy.

Ich meine, einer der Jungs, den ich denke, hat einiges von Potenzial, Chuck, und du würdest es enttäuschen, und ich habe das schon gesagt, I don't know him well, but I've watched him. I was first caught my attention in a shooting in Kentucky and how he talked about it and combined compassion, his faith. I think Andy Beshear is a very interesting guy.

I know that if the Democrats want to win and they go left again, they're going to lose. But I don't know who the Republicans will pick.

I know that if the Democrats want to win and they go left again, they're going to lose. But I don't know who the Republicans will pick.

That's right.

That's right.

What you and I love about politics is you just never know what's going to happen tomorrow.

What you and I love about politics is you just never know what's going to happen tomorrow.

Yeah, that's probably right. But again, it's right now. I really don't invest a lot of time looking at Ohio. Chuck, I'm like George W. Bush. I was there, so now I've moved on. Interesting. Do people try to drag you into it? Oh yeah, but I... How are they going to drag me, Chuck? I mean, nobody ever... I can't think of anybody that ever dragged me in politics anywhere.

Yeah, that's probably right. But again, it's right now. I really don't invest a lot of time looking at Ohio. Chuck, I'm like George W. Bush. I was there, so now I've moved on. Interesting. Do people try to drag you into it? Oh yeah, but I... How are they going to drag me, Chuck? I mean, nobody ever... I can't think of anybody that ever dragged me in politics anywhere.

So I'm just not going to be engaging in it. I mean, I love what Bush did about that. You know, he just doesn't engage. Very rarely does he say anything. And I think that's appropriate. When you're a former governor, just, you know, let somebody else be governor and let them pick the next governor. And I'm not even sure I'm going to show up at meetings with former governors. I haven't decided that.

So I'm just not going to be engaging in it. I mean, I love what Bush did about that. You know, he just doesn't engage. Very rarely does he say anything. And I think that's appropriate. When you're a former governor, just, you know, let somebody else be governor and let them pick the next governor. And I'm not even sure I'm going to show up at meetings with former governors. I haven't decided that.

But I can give you a handicap. I choose not to do it, but I of course... Being still in the media, I have an obligation to kind of analyze things, but I really shy away from Ohio. I will say one thing. I don't think Ohio is ruby red. Remember, when I got elected governor, every office in the state was held by a Democrat except for one. The Democrats had a horrible bench.

But I can give you a handicap. I choose not to do it, but I of course... Being still in the media, I have an obligation to kind of analyze things, but I really shy away from Ohio. I will say one thing. I don't think Ohio is ruby red. Remember, when I got elected governor, every office in the state was held by a Democrat except for one. The Democrats had a horrible bench.

They had terrible party leadership and they disintegrated. And so, you know, things change. And I think you tell me, do you think people in Youngstown are going to keep voting Republican?

They had terrible party leadership and they disintegrated. And so, you know, things change. And I think you tell me, do you think people in Youngstown are going to keep voting Republican?

Okay. You know what I mean by that?

Okay. You know what I mean by that?

Maybe sometimes you do it because you just think you want to do it.

Maybe sometimes you do it because you just think you want to do it.

What I found out was real simple. People did not care about these issues. They cared about personal contact and do you get them and do you care about them. And look, remember this. I go to New Hampshire, very low name ID, and I finish second. I beat Bush, Cruz, Rubio, all of them except Trump. I beat everybody else.

What I found out was real simple. People did not care about these issues. They cared about personal contact and do you get them and do you care about them. And look, remember this. I go to New Hampshire, very low name ID, and I finish second. I beat Bush, Cruz, Rubio, all of them except Trump. I beat everybody else.

And I found there that they didn't really care about balancing budget and cutting taxes and all that. It mattered, but what they really cared about was... I think he gets me. He's willing to listen to me. He's willing to understand my problems. And then I could get in a ditch with him and give him a, come on, we can get out of this ditch. We can do well. I'll be here with you.

And I found there that they didn't really care about balancing budget and cutting taxes and all that. It mattered, but what they really cared about was... I think he gets me. He's willing to listen to me. He's willing to understand my problems. And then I could get in a ditch with him and give him a, come on, we can get out of this ditch. We can do well. I'll be here with you.

It's why I was reelected so overwhelmingly in Ohio after balancing budgets, but expanding Medicaid, right? I mean, it was the combination of leave no one behind and try to lift everybody up. Ich denke, die Einheit in diesem Land ist wirklich wichtig. Es wird eine besondere Stimme und eine besondere Person nehmen, um das zu tun.

It's why I was reelected so overwhelmingly in Ohio after balancing budgets, but expanding Medicaid, right? I mean, it was the combination of leave no one behind and try to lift everybody up. Ich denke, die Einheit in diesem Land ist wirklich wichtig. Es wird eine besondere Stimme und eine besondere Person nehmen, um das zu tun.

Und wir sind besser, wenn wir einig sind und nicht so gut, als wenn wir dividiert sind. Und dann denke ich, es gibt ein paar Probleme, die wirklich zählen. People are worked up about the stock market, the bond market and everything else.

Und wir sind besser, wenn wir einig sind und nicht so gut, als wenn wir dividiert sind. Und dann denke ich, es gibt ein paar Probleme, die wirklich zählen. People are worked up about the stock market, the bond market and everything else.

If we don't figure out a way to tame this national debt, and I know nobody's interested in it, but I'm trying to figure out how we can get them interested in it, we're going to melt down like you've never seen when we start printing money. Okay, that's number one. And I'm going to actually work on that, I think, in the next couple of years, if I can figure a way to get anybody motivated around it.

If we don't figure out a way to tame this national debt, and I know nobody's interested in it, but I'm trying to figure out how we can get them interested in it, we're going to melt down like you've never seen when we start printing money. Okay, that's number one. And I'm going to actually work on that, I think, in the next couple of years, if I can figure a way to get anybody motivated around it.

But I think there's a couple other things. I think the healthcare system in this country is very seriously broken. And it is so hard to fix.

But I think there's a couple other things. I think the healthcare system in this country is very seriously broken. And it is so hard to fix.

If I were a leader and I had the power, I would convene hospitals, doctors, pharmacies, nurses, all the people that are connected to the healthcare system to sit down and say, how do we fundamentally change this in such a way that we are now treating people to keep them healthy rather than being rewarded for treating them when they're sick?

If I were a leader and I had the power, I would convene hospitals, doctors, pharmacies, nurses, all the people that are connected to the healthcare system to sit down and say, how do we fundamentally change this in such a way that we are now treating people to keep them healthy rather than being rewarded for treating them when they're sick?

And how do we open the whole system up to look at quality, to look at cost, to look at... Das ist, glaube ich, wirklich groß. Und ich denke, das andere, was wirklich groß ist, ist, glaube ich, einfach draußen, ist, glaube ich, Retraining. Es muss ein Leben langes Retraining-Programm in der Ära von AI und allem anderen sein, damit die Leute nicht denken, dass sie verletzt sind, weil Vielen Dank.

And how do we open the whole system up to look at quality, to look at cost, to look at... Das ist, glaube ich, wirklich groß. Und ich denke, das andere, was wirklich groß ist, ist, glaube ich, einfach draußen, ist, glaube ich, Retraining. Es muss ein Leben langes Retraining-Programm in der Ära von AI und allem anderen sein, damit die Leute nicht denken, dass sie verletzt sind, weil Vielen Dank.

Es war Bill Clinton, den du mitgebracht hast, der sagte, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Wenn du über ihn denkst, ist das, was mich verbindet, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Das ist die Patina, dann ist alles andere unterhalb davon, um zu demonstrieren, wer du bist. Ein weiteres ernsthafte Problem, das wir in diesem Land haben, ist die behavioral health. And insurance reform.

Es war Bill Clinton, den du mitgebracht hast, der sagte, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Wenn du über ihn denkst, ist das, was mich verbindet, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Das ist die Patina, dann ist alles andere unterhalb davon, um zu demonstrieren, wer du bist. Ein weiteres ernsthafte Problem, das wir in diesem Land haben, ist die behavioral health. And insurance reform.

And that should be done in terms of healthcare because the insurance, people are starting to hate insurance. Well, we know that. People are very angry about insurance. It's always great until you need it. I mean, all those things where people feel as though it's out of control are things that, and I think it includes healthcare, it includes insurance, it includes a loss of job.

And that should be done in terms of healthcare because the insurance, people are starting to hate insurance. Well, we know that. People are very angry about insurance. It's always great until you need it. I mean, all those things where people feel as though it's out of control are things that, and I think it includes healthcare, it includes insurance, it includes a loss of job.

I think nothing we can see right now, but it's the avalanche that could come our way. If we don't control our debt and it's finally, I feel your pain. We're in it together. That's what I would do.

I think nothing we can see right now, but it's the avalanche that could come our way. If we don't control our debt and it's finally, I feel your pain. We're in it together. That's what I would do.

No, if you gave the education establishment a trillion dollars, it would never be enough. Our education system is so broken. And that gets back to this ongoing training through a lifetime education. Chuck, come on. Our K-12 schools, not all of them, many of them. Let me just put it, many of them. Oh, I know. I didn't mean to get us on education.

No, if you gave the education establishment a trillion dollars, it would never be enough. Our education system is so broken. And that gets back to this ongoing training through a lifetime education. Chuck, come on. Our K-12 schools, not all of them, many of them. Let me just put it, many of them. Oh, I know. I didn't mean to get us on education.

But he was saying, oh, let me spend all this money on education. Nein, wir brauchen eine andere Art von Bildung. Ein Bildungssystem mit Technologie, wo wir individuelle Instruktionen für jedes Kind haben können, um herauszufinden, wie sie am besten lernen. Das ist eine andere Geschichte. Aber wenn es um Medicaid geht,

But he was saying, oh, let me spend all this money on education. Nein, wir brauchen eine andere Art von Bildung. Ein Bildungssystem mit Technologie, wo wir individuelle Instruktionen für jedes Kind haben können, um herauszufinden, wie sie am besten lernen. Das ist eine andere Geschichte. Aber wenn es um Medicaid geht,

Das Problem ist, dass, Chuck, das ist unglaublich, als ich Präsident geworden bin, glaube ich, dass die Medicaid auf 9% gestiegen ist. Ruhige Zahlen hier. Als ich Präsident war und es auf 600.000 gestiegen habe, war es auf 3,5% gestiegen. Jetzt ist der Herr, der Präsident ist, auf 9% gestiegen. Weißt du, warum? Pay everybody off. All the providers get what they want. You make them all happy.

Das Problem ist, dass, Chuck, das ist unglaublich, als ich Präsident geworden bin, glaube ich, dass die Medicaid auf 9% gestiegen ist. Ruhige Zahlen hier. Als ich Präsident war und es auf 600.000 gestiegen habe, war es auf 3,5% gestiegen. Jetzt ist der Herr, der Präsident ist, auf 9% gestiegen. Weißt du, warum? Pay everybody off. All the providers get what they want. You make them all happy.

Chuck, we're down in this country to, I have to give you what you want, because if I don't, you're going to be mad at me. That's how we exist today. And that doesn't work. You've got to call people to a higher purpose and explain to them why.

Chuck, we're down in this country to, I have to give you what you want, because if I don't, you're going to be mad at me. That's how we exist today. And that doesn't work. You've got to call people to a higher purpose and explain to them why.

And before we're done, we are going to talk about my book, because that's why I'm here.

And before we're done, we are going to talk about my book, because that's why I'm here.

Discuss.

Discuss.

That is just... You know what, I would never have known that if I hadn't been watching things because I'm aware of a for-profit operation involving primary care I keep telling them, you should go and become a not-for-profit. But they're for-profit because they get the share.

That is just... You know what, I would never have known that if I hadn't been watching things because I'm aware of a for-profit operation involving primary care I keep telling them, you should go and become a not-for-profit. But they're for-profit because they get the share.

Well, and then, you know, they did the tax system for the, you know, you know about that.

Well, and then, you know, they did the tax system for the, you know, you know about that.

No, no, no. But you see, you're trying to go at it. And on an individual basis. And I get all that, okay? How you have to take this piece, then that piece and the other piece. I'm going to give you three quick examples. Penny Kasich, take a penny out of every dollar. We got a equal group of Republicans and Democrats together in a room. And we were able to save a penny out of every dollar.

No, no, no. But you see, you're trying to go at it. And on an individual basis. And I get all that, okay? How you have to take this piece, then that piece and the other piece. I'm going to give you three quick examples. Penny Kasich, take a penny out of every dollar. We got a equal group of Republicans and Democrats together in a room. And we were able to save a penny out of every dollar.

And it doesn't sound like a lot, but you add it all up, it's pretty good. And both parties fought it. And we came very close to winning. If anybody in these groups, Republican or Democrat, if they objected, the savings were taken out. We had very few taken out. Let's go back to the budget itself when I was chairman and we were trying to get things done.

And it doesn't sound like a lot, but you add it all up, it's pretty good. And both parties fought it. And we came very close to winning. If anybody in these groups, Republican or Democrat, if they objected, the savings were taken out. We had very few taken out. Let's go back to the budget itself when I was chairman and we were trying to get things done.

Susan Molinari gave up transit subsidies as long as the guy in Iowa gave up farm subsidies. And we got it done. What I'm trying to tell you is, Chuck, you need a convener who can get people. We need Chuck Todd in the room. Okay, you walk in there, you're going to be intellectually honest about how we fix it. So the hospitals are honest, the pharmacies, pharmaceuticals.

Susan Molinari gave up transit subsidies as long as the guy in Iowa gave up farm subsidies. And we got it done. What I'm trying to tell you is, Chuck, you need a convener who can get people. We need Chuck Todd in the room. Okay, you walk in there, you're going to be intellectually honest about how we fix it. So the hospitals are honest, the pharmacies, pharmaceuticals.

We get everybody in the room and say, okay, how are we going to fix this system? Because it's costing more and more. There are more people who are not getting the kind of care they want. The quality is not what we want. And everybody would agree with that. If you just go at it one piece at a time, you'll never get there. It has to be done. And you can do it. I've done it two or three times.

We get everybody in the room and say, okay, how are we going to fix this system? Because it's costing more and more. There are more people who are not getting the kind of care they want. The quality is not what we want. And everybody would agree with that. If you just go at it one piece at a time, you'll never get there. It has to be done. And you can do it. I've done it two or three times.

And I can't remember which candidate, but the danger in that is, if you don't have some experience in government. I agree with that. If you don't have some, you're going to get lost.

And I can't remember which candidate, but the danger in that is, if you don't have some experience in government. I agree with that. If you don't have some, you're going to get lost.

If you're going to run for president, You have to have people around you that can tell you, no, no, no, no, not that, but look at this, and then let them do what they want to do. And when you're in office, I had more meetings where I'd stuff 20, 25 people in a room. Everybody got to participate. I made a decision. I empowered people. They reported to me. Look, the proof's in the pudding.

If you're going to run for president, You have to have people around you that can tell you, no, no, no, no, not that, but look at this, and then let them do what they want to do. And when you're in office, I had more meetings where I'd stuff 20, 25 people in a room. Everybody got to participate. I made a decision. I empowered people. They reported to me. Look, the proof's in the pudding.

You know, we... I hate to even go on. I had a great team of people. They all worked together. We created Jobs Ohio, the most important and dynamic economic development operation in America. Today, we've gone from 49th to like 7th. I mean, we're just kicking tail because we all work together. We work together. And that's how you get things done. And you need a leader.

You know, we... I hate to even go on. I had a great team of people. They all worked together. We created Jobs Ohio, the most important and dynamic economic development operation in America. Today, we've gone from 49th to like 7th. I mean, we're just kicking tail because we all work together. We work together. And that's how you get things done. And you need a leader.

And they got to have a sense of where they want to go. But you got to have a little bit of... of political experience.

And they got to have a sense of where they want to go. But you got to have a little bit of... of political experience.

We have examples in the book. One guy goes up to this place in Portland. He gets a group of his buddies from church and a couple of other churches. They go up and clean up the playground. They fix the whole school. He then turns it into a literacy program. The schools worked with them.

We have examples in the book. One guy goes up to this place in Portland. He gets a group of his buddies from church and a couple of other churches. They go up and clean up the playground. They fix the whole school. He then turns it into a literacy program. The schools worked with them.

There's a lady who's used the portal of the schools to be able to inform parents about all the things that might be available to them if their kids have trouble. There are the people who have worked in the foster care area. There's now a program going nationwide where the faith community is working with the government to foster care. And the government has praised these people.

There's a lady who's used the portal of the schools to be able to inform parents about all the things that might be available to them if their kids have trouble. There are the people who have worked in the foster care area. There's now a program going nationwide where the faith community is working with the government to foster care. And the government has praised these people.

You can't go in and proselytize. The greatest way to spread faith is not by what you say, but by what you do. And these people are not in there. And I think that to not have these solutions come from well-meaning people. Now, you go in there and you start preaching your stuff. I don't think that works. But the most important thing to me is, if you look at this book or anything else about faith,

You can't go in and proselytize. The greatest way to spread faith is not by what you say, but by what you do. And these people are not in there. And I think that to not have these solutions come from well-meaning people. Now, you go in there and you start preaching your stuff. I don't think that works. But the most important thing to me is, if you look at this book or anything else about faith,

It's because you feel so strongly about the call of a higher power that you're willing to have courage and believe, even if you start at square one, that you can be successful in the end. And it also forces us to think.

It's because you feel so strongly about the call of a higher power that you're willing to have courage and believe, even if you start at square one, that you can be successful in the end. And it also forces us to think.

If you have a liberal in a concert, okay, Chuck, you and I are driving, we're in Vermont, the middle of the winter, and we see this car in the snow bank, and you and I hop out, and these other two guys hop out, and we push the darn, we can't get it out, we're pushing and pushing, we're laughing, our hats are falling off, and we push it out, we go have a beer.

If you have a liberal in a concert, okay, Chuck, you and I are driving, we're in Vermont, the middle of the winter, and we see this car in the snow bank, and you and I hop out, and these other two guys hop out, and we push the darn, we can't get it out, we're pushing and pushing, we're laughing, our hats are falling off, and we push it out, we go have a beer.

We find out that, you know, that they're of a complete different philosophy, it doesn't matter. Right.

We find out that, you know, that they're of a complete different philosophy, it doesn't matter. Right.

It's like sitting at a University of Miami football game, getting their brains beat up by Ohio State, and you just have a great time with your buddies.

It's like sitting at a University of Miami football game, getting their brains beat up by Ohio State, and you just have a great time with your buddies.

Somebody told me that there was a guy in Columbus that saw the incompletion or whatever the heck it was. I don't remember. He turned off the television and went to work. And the next day he didn't find out.

Somebody told me that there was a guy in Columbus that saw the incompletion or whatever the heck it was. I don't remember. He turned off the television and went to work. And the next day he didn't find out.

Well, to go back to your example. The other thing, I've told you this before. We get to fixing things locally. And I want to bring up that Putman book called The Upswing. All of his work is fascinating.

Well, to go back to your example. The other thing, I've told you this before. We get to fixing things locally. And I want to bring up that Putman book called The Upswing. All of his work is fascinating.

But The Upswing says that the social gospel movement changed the country from an I-Culture to a We-Culture. Coming from the Gilded Age to the great 20th century in our country where we went from I to we. We're in an I-Environment, not a we. And secondly, the other thing is all change comes from the bottom up.

But The Upswing says that the social gospel movement changed the country from an I-Culture to a We-Culture. Coming from the Gilded Age to the great 20th century in our country where we went from I to we. We're in an I-Environment, not a we. And secondly, the other thing is all change comes from the bottom up.

Ich sage, du bist in meinem Leben der einzige größte Veränderung in unserer Gesellschaft, das sind die Bürgerrechte. Und es kam alles auf den Boden. Also, weißt du, wer wirst du mehr vermissen, wenn sie auf Verabschiedung gehen? Der Staatssekretär oder dein Trash-Mann? Ich meine, wir müssen also einsteigen. Und wenn wir in einer Rallye sind, ist das gut. Wir sind am Samstag in der Rallye.

Ich sage, du bist in meinem Leben der einzige größte Veränderung in unserer Gesellschaft, das sind die Bürgerrechte. Und es kam alles auf den Boden. Also, weißt du, wer wirst du mehr vermissen, wenn sie auf Verabschiedung gehen? Der Staatssekretär oder dein Trash-Mann? Ich meine, wir müssen also einsteigen. Und wenn wir in einer Rallye sind, ist das gut. Wir sind am Samstag in der Rallye.

Na, was werden wir am Montag machen?

Na, was werden wir am Montag machen?

What you're thinking about in terms of local news, you're right.

What you're thinking about in terms of local news, you're right.

And there's this young man. I know his mother is a dear friend of mine.

And there's this young man. I know his mother is a dear friend of mine.

und sein Name ist Jackson Rohrer und er schreibt für den lokalen Newspaper und du weißt in New York und er kümmert sich um Sport, der Kind ist wie ein großer, er ist wie jeder will ihn kennen, weil er schreibt über den Fußballteam, den Fußballteam und es ist wirklich cool und er ist wirklich er ist er jetzt will ein Journalist sein, aber ich weiß nicht, ob er einen Journalist

und sein Name ist Jackson Rohrer und er schreibt für den lokalen Newspaper und du weißt in New York und er kümmert sich um Sport, der Kind ist wie ein großer, er ist wie jeder will ihn kennen, weil er schreibt über den Fußballteam, den Fußballteam und es ist wirklich cool und er ist wirklich er ist er jetzt will ein Journalist sein, aber ich weiß nicht, ob er einen Journalist

To be an investigator, I think he, maybe, I don't know, we'll see.

To be an investigator, I think he, maybe, I don't know, we'll see.

Yeah, exactly right. Well, you and what you're doing now is very interesting. So, yeah, I get local news. It really does matter. It really does. Local matters. It does.

Yeah, exactly right. Well, you and what you're doing now is very interesting. So, yeah, I get local news. It really does matter. It really does. Local matters. It does.

Es ist die i-Kultur. Es ist die i-Kultur wieder.

Es ist die i-Kultur. Es ist die i-Kultur wieder.

Ich habe dir das vorher gesagt. Ich denke, es gibt etwas in dir, das sagt, nein. Es war ein Glaubensmovement, das es verändert hat. Das soziale Gospelsmovement hat das Land verändert.

Ich habe dir das vorher gesagt. Ich denke, es gibt etwas in dir, das sagt, nein. Es war ein Glaubensmovement, das es verändert hat. Das soziale Gospelsmovement hat das Land verändert.

But it started in one little place and it spread. And then we had the reform for child labor, the reforms around women. It doesn't take that. It takes a spark that comes where we are. And the other thing, you never know what can come. Und du weißt, diese ganze Sache, dass wenn wir nur eine Katastrophe hätten, würde jeder einig sein. Ich kaufe das nicht.

But it started in one little place and it spread. And then we had the reform for child labor, the reforms around women. It doesn't take that. It takes a spark that comes where we are. And the other thing, you never know what can come. Und du weißt, diese ganze Sache, dass wenn wir nur eine Katastrophe hätten, würde jeder einig sein. Ich kaufe das nicht.

Ich habe das gewohnt, aber ich meine, wir kommen momentan zusammen und dann gehen wir zurück in unsere Räume. Es muss eine andere Perspektive, ein anderer Sinn in jeder Person sein. Und Teil davon ist das. When I look at a person, I need to see the image of God, of which I will be held accountable for. If I see the image of God, I'm going to be really careful about the way I treat them.

Ich habe das gewohnt, aber ich meine, wir kommen momentan zusammen und dann gehen wir zurück in unsere Räume. Es muss eine andere Perspektive, ein anderer Sinn in jeder Person sein. Und Teil davon ist das. When I look at a person, I need to see the image of God, of which I will be held accountable for. If I see the image of God, I'm going to be really careful about the way I treat them.

And if I see nothing but another guy honking his horn at me on the road or road rage or any of that other stuff, then it's just like Katie barred the door. It's going to take that kind of some sort of a spirit renewal. And you saw a little bit of it, by the way, I think, with the Pope. Ein bisschen.

And if I see nothing but another guy honking his horn at me on the road or road rage or any of that other stuff, then it's just like Katie barred the door. It's going to take that kind of some sort of a spirit renewal. And you saw a little bit of it, by the way, I think, with the Pope. Ein bisschen.

Nobody liked him. The left didn't like him. The right didn't like him.

Nobody liked him. The left didn't like him. The right didn't like him.

It could be. And when I say they didn't like him, you know, the right didn't like him because they thought he was too loose with the theology. The left didn't like him because they didn't think he went far enough. You know, what you and I say, when people on the right and the left don't like you, you must be doing something right.

It could be. And when I say they didn't like him, you know, the right didn't like him because they thought he was too loose with the theology. The left didn't like him because they didn't think he went far enough. You know, what you and I say, when people on the right and the left don't like you, you must be doing something right.

I think it might be, Chuck, that he has too many people around him that don't tell him What's going on? And when you don't have people that tell you you're wrong and you need to think or change or modify.

I think it might be, Chuck, that he has too many people around him that don't tell him What's going on? And when you don't have people that tell you you're wrong and you need to think or change or modify.

Yeah, I think that's, you know, you think back to JFK and I don't know, he's probably been lionized about the Cuban Missile Crisis, but it just sounds to me like he had such an open discussion that instead of dropping the bombs, he, you know, he sent his brother to see Und dann kamen sie vorbei, weil sie einfach nicht zu dem Militär gehört haben. Sie hörten zu vielen anderen Leuten.

Yeah, I think that's, you know, you think back to JFK and I don't know, he's probably been lionized about the Cuban Missile Crisis, but it just sounds to me like he had such an open discussion that instead of dropping the bombs, he, you know, he sent his brother to see Und dann kamen sie vorbei, weil sie einfach nicht zu dem Militär gehört haben. Sie hörten zu vielen anderen Leuten.

Und natürlich kamen sie zu der richtigen Schlussfolgerung und beobachteten Khrushchev an einem Zeitpunkt, als Khrushchev dachte, er hätte uns auf den Rund. Open. Open is the way it is.

Und natürlich kamen sie zu der richtigen Schlussfolgerung und beobachteten Khrushchev an einem Zeitpunkt, als Khrushchev dachte, er hätte uns auf den Rund. Open. Open is the way it is.

But you have to be comfortable with yourself, secure in the knowledge that however smart you are, it's okay to have people smarter than you around, that you can make good judgments, that you have good instincts and a good gut. I mean, that's how it works.

But you have to be comfortable with yourself, secure in the knowledge that however smart you are, it's okay to have people smarter than you around, that you can make good judgments, that you have good instincts and a good gut. I mean, that's how it works.

If you go too fast, it's not only going too fast to implement one thing, it's also having too many things you're trying to do at once, which was a mistake I made, because I had so many things I was doing when I was first elected as governor, that I think a lot of people didn't know what they were. Had I slowed it down a little bit, let people see it, it would have been more effective.

If you go too fast, it's not only going too fast to implement one thing, it's also having too many things you're trying to do at once, which was a mistake I made, because I had so many things I was doing when I was first elected as governor, that I think a lot of people didn't know what they were. Had I slowed it down a little bit, let people see it, it would have been more effective.

Weil Sie denken, dass der Pentagon die Möglichkeit hat, Reformen zu verteidigen? Das ist im Vergleich zum Bildungs- und Industriekomplex.

Weil Sie denken, dass der Pentagon die Möglichkeit hat, Reformen zu verteidigen? Das ist im Vergleich zum Bildungs- und Industriekomplex.

It's the parents who say, my kids' school, you know, education's not great, but my kids' school's good. And they think that, you know, if we just pour more money in, it'll all be better. And it doesn't work. And so this is a case where... I think you need to go with a group of the willing, a coalition of the willing.

It's the parents who say, my kids' school, you know, education's not great, but my kids' school's good. And they think that, you know, if we just pour more money in, it'll all be better. And it doesn't work. And so this is a case where... I think you need to go with a group of the willing, a coalition of the willing.

What schools do you want to join to do things differently and then show that those things can work? This is one maybe where you cannot do it comprehensively, unlike what I said about healthcare. You think this is something that is community by community? And a coalition of the willing. I mean, look, you can get to the point where a teacher is a helper, not really a teacher.

What schools do you want to join to do things differently and then show that those things can work? This is one maybe where you cannot do it comprehensively, unlike what I said about healthcare. You think this is something that is community by community? And a coalition of the willing. I mean, look, you can get to the point where a teacher is a helper, not really a teacher.

That the kids can learn through technology in a different way. Jimmy learns different than Sally. Let them learn on the basis of how...

That the kids can learn through technology in a different way. Jimmy learns different than Sally. Let them learn on the basis of how...

Yeah, I think that's one way. And I do think that it's pretty darn clear that the KIPP schools do a great job. But there's such resistance.

Yeah, I think that's one way. And I do think that it's pretty darn clear that the KIPP schools do a great job. But there's such resistance.

No, I can tell you.

No, I can tell you.

Because... If you take Abigail Wexner, who runs a KIPP school out here, she takes the kids that come from the toughest places that I mean, and they're all going to college. I mean, I believe I've seen it. I've seen it.

Because... If you take Abigail Wexner, who runs a KIPP school out here, she takes the kids that come from the toughest places that I mean, and they're all going to college. I mean, I believe I've seen it. I've seen it.

Eine Frau hat mir einmal gesagt, als ich nach Philadelphia nach den niedrigsten Schulen ging, als ich mein erstes Buch geschrieben habe, hat sie gesagt, jeder Vater liebt sein Kind, aber manchmal muss man sehr tief hin, um dieses Liebe zu finden. Und ich denke, es ist ein anderer Ort, wo ich denke, die Kirchen könnten kritisch wichtig sein, um das System zu verändern.

Eine Frau hat mir einmal gesagt, als ich nach Philadelphia nach den niedrigsten Schulen ging, als ich mein erstes Buch geschrieben habe, hat sie gesagt, jeder Vater liebt sein Kind, aber manchmal muss man sehr tief hin, um dieses Liebe zu finden. Und ich denke, es ist ein anderer Ort, wo ich denke, die Kirchen könnten kritisch wichtig sein, um das System zu verändern.

Wir haben unser Zeit lang darüber gespart, wie Trump nicht hören will. Biden's people wouldn't let anybody near him. Because they might tell him something to get his attention. And the cover-up by the media is a disgrace.

Wir haben unser Zeit lang darüber gespart, wie Trump nicht hören will. Biden's people wouldn't let anybody near him. Because they might tell him something to get his attention. And the cover-up by the media is a disgrace.

Well, and the other thing is they all want access, so you know, if you want to get access to Tiger Woods, you better not write anything negative. No, there's something to that, but it goes back to, I mean, you're right about, but look, I... I didn't want to just trash Trump without some fair trashing of Biden and his unwillingness to hear other things. Oh, I think Biden was a failed president.

Well, and the other thing is they all want access, so you know, if you want to get access to Tiger Woods, you better not write anything negative. No, there's something to that, but it goes back to, I mean, you're right about, but look, I... I didn't want to just trash Trump without some fair trashing of Biden and his unwillingness to hear other things. Oh, I think Biden was a failed president.

And he thinks that he would have won.

And he thinks that he would have won.

Are you kidding me?

Are you kidding me?

Tuck, I endorsed the guy. I know you did. I mean, I was the first Republican. You know, now they were all endorsing Kamala Harris and all that stuff. And I was the first one out there doing it. And I thought he was going to be a healer. And he was anything but that. You know, I talked to him the night that I endorsed him at their convention. He called me.

Tuck, I endorsed the guy. I know you did. I mean, I was the first Republican. You know, now they were all endorsing Kamala Harris and all that stuff. And I was the first one out there doing it. And I thought he was going to be a healer. And he was anything but that. You know, I talked to him the night that I endorsed him at their convention. He called me.

Do you know that I never spoke to him for the next four years? Not a single word.

Do you know that I never spoke to him for the next four years? Not a single word.

Das ist eine Art Heresie, aber ich muss dir diese Geschichte erzählen. Biden hat mich zu der Universität in Delaware eingeladen und ich bin mit ihm zu einem Event gegangen. Und sagen wir, der Event war, ich war wahrscheinlich eine Stunde und eine halbe, aber sagen wir, es war eine Stunde. Er hat für 15 Minuten gesprochen und ich für 10 Minuten.

Das ist eine Art Heresie, aber ich muss dir diese Geschichte erzählen. Biden hat mich zu der Universität in Delaware eingeladen und ich bin mit ihm zu einem Event gegangen. Und sagen wir, der Event war, ich war wahrscheinlich eine Stunde und eine halbe, aber sagen wir, es war eine Stunde. Er hat für 15 Minuten gesprochen und ich für 10 Minuten.

No, but it's just the way it was and the way it worked out. So I got home, I called McCain because he was, at the time, he was very sick. And I said, checking on him, John, how you doing? And how do you feel about your faith? And he goes, you don't have to worry about me, Johnny. And so it was very nice. And I said, well, I just went to this event for Biden.

No, but it's just the way it was and the way it worked out. So I got home, I called McCain because he was, at the time, he was very sick. And I said, checking on him, John, how you doing? And how do you feel about your faith? And he goes, you don't have to worry about me, Johnny. And so it was very nice. And I said, well, I just went to this event for Biden.

And, you know, he spoke 50 and I spoke 10. He goes, yeah. He says, that's Biden, isn't it? He said... He said, that's why we love him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He said, you know, I went to a funeral once and I was sitting next to Dan Inouye and Biden was doing one of the eulogies.

And, you know, he spoke 50 and I spoke 10. He goes, yeah. He says, that's Biden, isn't it? He said... He said, that's why we love him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He said, you know, I went to a funeral once and I was sitting next to Dan Inouye and Biden was doing one of the eulogies.

And when he finished, Inouye poked me in the side and said, McCain, if you ever do one of those eulogies, don't forget to mention the corpse.

And when he finished, Inouye poked me in the side and said, McCain, if you ever do one of those eulogies, don't forget to mention the corpse.

Exactly. I still laugh at that. We miss McCain. That was one really great man. We miss him.

Exactly. I still laugh at that. We miss McCain. That was one really great man. We miss him.

Hey, it's always great. It's always great to be with you. You're just, you know, I think if people watch this, they see, you know, my friends, when they see us, they just see the kind of the connection, the magic, whatever it is, the sparks. And it's a lot of fun. So we're going to do great.

Hey, it's always great. It's always great to be with you. You're just, you know, I think if people watch this, they see, you know, my friends, when they see us, they just see the kind of the connection, the magic, whatever it is, the sparks. And it's a lot of fun. So we're going to do great.

Yeah, I think the system's terrible and this transfer portal and all that stuff. We've just turned it into the minor leagues. I mean, if you want a minor league, you know, I remember talking to a A head football coach of one of the NFL teams. He was at a golf course with me. I've known him for a long time. He campaigned for me once.

Yeah, I think the system's terrible and this transfer portal and all that stuff. We've just turned it into the minor leagues. I mean, if you want a minor league, you know, I remember talking to a A head football coach of one of the NFL teams. He was at a golf course with me. I've known him for a long time. He campaigned for me once.

He said, you know, John, the thing that we're missing, the baseball has a minor league, we don't. Well, we now do.

He said, you know, John, the thing that we're missing, the baseball has a minor league, we don't. Well, we now do.

Well, the one thing that's fun is it is fun to talk about sports because it's pretty neutral. And when you have an argument there, you know, you can, it's okay.

Well, the one thing that's fun is it is fun to talk about sports because it's pretty neutral. And when you have an argument there, you know, you can, it's okay.

Well, this is a crazy time, Chuck. It's a crazy time because I'm one of a handful of people. I happen to really like the NBA playoffs. And by the way, Cleveland just destroyed Miami. I mean, that was, I thought Miami would win.

Well, this is a crazy time, Chuck. It's a crazy time because I'm one of a handful of people. I happen to really like the NBA playoffs. And by the way, Cleveland just destroyed Miami. I mean, that was, I thought Miami would win.

I didn't even like the end.

I didn't even like the end.

I'm right. I mean, it's going to be very tough. But if you do, it'll be because Evan Mobley took that next level. Or that guy Hunter that came from Atlanta, who's really been terrific. And can anybody beat Oklahoma City?

I'm right. I mean, it's going to be very tough. But if you do, it'll be because Evan Mobley took that next level. Or that guy Hunter that came from Atlanta, who's really been terrific. And can anybody beat Oklahoma City?

And then, of course, one other subject we have to cover, as you heard when I was talking before we came on the air. So next Friday night, me, my buddies, Metallica. I love it. Now, in case you haven't heard this, we're going to be right in Columbus. And Miley Cyrus sang with Metallica. No kidding. Absolutely incredible. I bet it was. What the heck is the name of that song? Nothing Really Matters.

And then, of course, one other subject we have to cover, as you heard when I was talking before we came on the air. So next Friday night, me, my buddies, Metallica. I love it. Now, in case you haven't heard this, we're going to be right in Columbus. And Miley Cyrus sang with Metallica. No kidding. Absolutely incredible. I bet it was. What the heck is the name of that song? Nothing Really Matters.

If you can hear it, and it was really great, and only to be exceeded by heart, singing Stairway to Heaven with the boys sitting up in the stands at the Kennedy Center Honors. Yeah, I mean, check it out. Those are some really cool things to see.

If you can hear it, and it was really great, and only to be exceeded by heart, singing Stairway to Heaven with the boys sitting up in the stands at the Kennedy Center Honors. Yeah, I mean, check it out. Those are some really cool things to see.

Oh, well, I will have enjoyed myself.

Oh, well, I will have enjoyed myself.

Yeah. All right. Thanks, Chuck. We'll see you soon.

Yeah. All right. Thanks, Chuck. We'll see you soon.

No, you're doing it right. The first one was called Courage is Contagious and it was about individuals doing remarkable things. And then I kind of concluded that if individuals had some fellow travelers with them, they could do a heck of a lot more. And the faith institutions were a great way to be able to accomplish more things.

Well, you know, me giving an answer like that is so silly because you could write your own couple of volumes about it. Of course, but you've been a practitioner. I'm the observer. You're the practitioner. I think that, you know, it's so interesting because, as you know, political parties have lost their influence, right? I mean, this is going to sound counterintuitive.

Parties no longer screen candidates. They no longer fund them. They're all funded by special interest groups. So these people go to Washington, elected by this group and that group and the other group. And you would think that there would be less loyalty to sort of a Republican or a Democrat brand. But yes, it seems as though that brand kind of defines a person.

I don't know if they have much of any influence, to be honest with you, Chuck. And maybe that's something I want to write about. Maybe you and I can write something together about that, about how that's an interesting thing, because people don't realize that.

You know, when I was first starting out, I had to go, you know, visit the screening committee, the central committee, the committee members, the this, the that, all that stuff.

Ich sah die Partei als mein Fahrzeug, nicht mein Meister, aber es war mein Fahrzeug, um Dinge in der Leben zu tun. Um es kurz zu machen, glaube ich, dass die Leute jetzt, erstens, Angst haben, sich mit ihrer Brand oder ihrer Gruppe zu verabschieden. Because they're afraid they'll be punished politically or they won't be liked. You know, they got to go if they're going to go to a party.

They got to be in the right place, because if you're not in the right space, then you get shunned. And, you know, some people care about that. You know, it's not anything I've ever cared much about. And then there's the threat of the primaries, of course. And so if I go my own way and I start. Remember what was really crazy?

You remember when Chris Christie hugged Obama because Obama brought all that money to New Jersey after the terrible storm?

It meant nothing more than respect. Yeah, well, it didn't work out that well for him because people went crazy. And now you see... Remember Charlie Crist?

You know, Chuck, I think what it gets down to is people would rather have, we all would rather have an easy road than a hard road. And it's just easier to be part of that group. It's easier to win re-election without a primary. It's just easier. And I just don't think easier is good in life. I mean, we'd all want easier, but we know that difficult has made us better.

And the parties had to keep track of how it was used. Now, I don't know how much it would change with where the political parties are today, because most of the people running the political parties kind of have this mindset as well. But it gives you a greater chance. I think to bring about reforms. Everybody talks about redistricting and all that.

I think this is a really significant thing because there's no screening process anymore. And people would say, well, that's not open. You know, the party bosses, you know, when you have adults who are trying to decide who's fit to represent people and who's not. I think that's probably necessary today. We certainly need to need to reflect on it for sure. No, that's true.

I want you to dig into something that you said. One other thing, Chuck. I know this is the way it always is with you and me. You keep interrupting. I keep interrupting you. But vice versa. But, you know, the book Heaven Help Us is about courage and it's about faith in something greater than ourselves. And if all you care about is what's in it for myself. Then you fall short.

But if all of a sudden you show courage and you go your own way, you know, it's fantastic. And life is so short and your ability to make an impact is so short that don't blow it. And without faith in a higher power that looks after us, that's a contributor to why people can have more courage, in my opinion.

Yeah, one sort, but not the kind of faith I'm talking about.

But faith in democracy would mean that you believe that despite any turbulence that we might see from time to time, that there's enough checks and balances in the system that democracy will be preserved.

I would say most times that would be right, but there have been times when people's minds have been, and we don't need to get into the ravages of the ability of human beings to be incredibly cruel to others, but by and large, I agree with you.

And that can be protected too, by the way, by this bigger issue of faith. See, you've always been a skeptic that somebody that's been in politics could write a book like this, but I don't think so. I think now more than ever.

Yeah, well, that's not why I did it.

Here's what surprised me, Chuck. If I'd have written a real ripper here and just attacked a whole bunch of people, The book would do better because I thought that people would be ready at this point in time for a little bit of going to your corners, chilling out, relaxing. Nope, it's dukes up, man. We're still brawling. Or in Canada, elbows up. Elbows up.

At some point it's going to settle down, though. It has to. Even fighters get, that's why they only have 15 rounds. You can't go 16 because they can't keep fighting.

I would say it's a uniter, if you were lucky. It would be a uniter rather than a divider. That's what I would think.

Can't predict. I mean, just as you say, the people are pretty smart. So we have to see. We're just early. You know, we're 100 days in.

Well, if I were advising somebody who was going to run, I would say you need to make sure that you are capable of raising money because Chuck Chuck Todd in the old world would pay attention to nobody who wouldn't pay attention to somebody that didn't raise any money and didn't have a good finance report. So that's one thing I tell them.

Oh, secondly, I would also tell them that they need to have an agenda and they should start. You know, I don't know who I'm thinking more of the Democrats than the Republicans, because I don't know what the Republicans are going to do. I I don't know. Ich denke, es ist jemand, der ein Rekord hat, der, wie du sagst, ein bisschen empathischer sein kann.

Ich meine, einer der Jungs, den ich denke, hat einiges von Potenzial, Chuck, und du würdest es enttäuschen, und ich habe das schon gesagt, I don't know him well, but I've watched him. I was first caught my attention in a shooting in Kentucky and how he talked about it and combined compassion, his faith. I think Andy Beshear is a very interesting guy.

I know that if the Democrats want to win and they go left again, they're going to lose. But I don't know who the Republicans will pick.

That's right.

What you and I love about politics is you just never know what's going to happen tomorrow.

Yeah, that's probably right. But again, it's right now. I really don't invest a lot of time looking at Ohio. Chuck, I'm like George W. Bush. I was there, so now I've moved on. Interesting. Do people try to drag you into it? Oh yeah, but I... How are they going to drag me, Chuck? I mean, nobody ever... I can't think of anybody that ever dragged me in politics anywhere.

So I'm just not going to be engaging in it. I mean, I love what Bush did about that. You know, he just doesn't engage. Very rarely does he say anything. And I think that's appropriate. When you're a former governor, just, you know, let somebody else be governor and let them pick the next governor. And I'm not even sure I'm going to show up at meetings with former governors. I haven't decided that.

But I can give you a handicap. I choose not to do it, but I of course... Being still in the media, I have an obligation to kind of analyze things, but I really shy away from Ohio. I will say one thing. I don't think Ohio is ruby red. Remember, when I got elected governor, every office in the state was held by a Democrat except for one. The Democrats had a horrible bench.

They had terrible party leadership and they disintegrated. And so, you know, things change. And I think you tell me, do you think people in Youngstown are going to keep voting Republican?

Okay. You know what I mean by that?

Maybe sometimes you do it because you just think you want to do it.

What I found out was real simple. People did not care about these issues. They cared about personal contact and do you get them and do you care about them. And look, remember this. I go to New Hampshire, very low name ID, and I finish second. I beat Bush, Cruz, Rubio, all of them except Trump. I beat everybody else.

And I found there that they didn't really care about balancing budget and cutting taxes and all that. It mattered, but what they really cared about was... I think he gets me. He's willing to listen to me. He's willing to understand my problems. And then I could get in a ditch with him and give him a, come on, we can get out of this ditch. We can do well. I'll be here with you.

It's why I was reelected so overwhelmingly in Ohio after balancing budgets, but expanding Medicaid, right? I mean, it was the combination of leave no one behind and try to lift everybody up. Ich denke, die Einheit in diesem Land ist wirklich wichtig. Es wird eine besondere Stimme und eine besondere Person nehmen, um das zu tun.

Und wir sind besser, wenn wir einig sind und nicht so gut, als wenn wir dividiert sind. Und dann denke ich, es gibt ein paar Probleme, die wirklich zählen. People are worked up about the stock market, the bond market and everything else.

If we don't figure out a way to tame this national debt, and I know nobody's interested in it, but I'm trying to figure out how we can get them interested in it, we're going to melt down like you've never seen when we start printing money. Okay, that's number one. And I'm going to actually work on that, I think, in the next couple of years, if I can figure a way to get anybody motivated around it.

But I think there's a couple other things. I think the healthcare system in this country is very seriously broken. And it is so hard to fix.

If I were a leader and I had the power, I would convene hospitals, doctors, pharmacies, nurses, all the people that are connected to the healthcare system to sit down and say, how do we fundamentally change this in such a way that we are now treating people to keep them healthy rather than being rewarded for treating them when they're sick?

And how do we open the whole system up to look at quality, to look at cost, to look at... Das ist, glaube ich, wirklich groß. Und ich denke, das andere, was wirklich groß ist, ist, glaube ich, einfach draußen, ist, glaube ich, Retraining. Es muss ein Leben langes Retraining-Programm in der Ära von AI und allem anderen sein, damit die Leute nicht denken, dass sie verletzt sind, weil Vielen Dank.

Es war Bill Clinton, den du mitgebracht hast, der sagte, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Wenn du über ihn denkst, ist das, was mich verbindet, ich fühle deine Schmerzen. Das ist die Patina, dann ist alles andere unterhalb davon, um zu demonstrieren, wer du bist. Ein weiteres ernsthafte Problem, das wir in diesem Land haben, ist die behavioral health. And insurance reform.

And that should be done in terms of healthcare because the insurance, people are starting to hate insurance. Well, we know that. People are very angry about insurance. It's always great until you need it. I mean, all those things where people feel as though it's out of control are things that, and I think it includes healthcare, it includes insurance, it includes a loss of job.

I think nothing we can see right now, but it's the avalanche that could come our way. If we don't control our debt and it's finally, I feel your pain. We're in it together. That's what I would do.

No, if you gave the education establishment a trillion dollars, it would never be enough. Our education system is so broken. And that gets back to this ongoing training through a lifetime education. Chuck, come on. Our K-12 schools, not all of them, many of them. Let me just put it, many of them. Oh, I know. I didn't mean to get us on education.

But he was saying, oh, let me spend all this money on education. Nein, wir brauchen eine andere Art von Bildung. Ein Bildungssystem mit Technologie, wo wir individuelle Instruktionen für jedes Kind haben können, um herauszufinden, wie sie am besten lernen. Das ist eine andere Geschichte. Aber wenn es um Medicaid geht,

Das Problem ist, dass, Chuck, das ist unglaublich, als ich Präsident geworden bin, glaube ich, dass die Medicaid auf 9% gestiegen ist. Ruhige Zahlen hier. Als ich Präsident war und es auf 600.000 gestiegen habe, war es auf 3,5% gestiegen. Jetzt ist der Herr, der Präsident ist, auf 9% gestiegen. Weißt du, warum? Pay everybody off. All the providers get what they want. You make them all happy.

Chuck, we're down in this country to, I have to give you what you want, because if I don't, you're going to be mad at me. That's how we exist today. And that doesn't work. You've got to call people to a higher purpose and explain to them why.

And before we're done, we are going to talk about my book, because that's why I'm here.

Discuss.

That is just... You know what, I would never have known that if I hadn't been watching things because I'm aware of a for-profit operation involving primary care I keep telling them, you should go and become a not-for-profit. But they're for-profit because they get the share.

Well, and then, you know, they did the tax system for the, you know, you know about that.

No, no, no. But you see, you're trying to go at it. And on an individual basis. And I get all that, okay? How you have to take this piece, then that piece and the other piece. I'm going to give you three quick examples. Penny Kasich, take a penny out of every dollar. We got a equal group of Republicans and Democrats together in a room. And we were able to save a penny out of every dollar.

And it doesn't sound like a lot, but you add it all up, it's pretty good. And both parties fought it. And we came very close to winning. If anybody in these groups, Republican or Democrat, if they objected, the savings were taken out. We had very few taken out. Let's go back to the budget itself when I was chairman and we were trying to get things done.

Susan Molinari gave up transit subsidies as long as the guy in Iowa gave up farm subsidies. And we got it done. What I'm trying to tell you is, Chuck, you need a convener who can get people. We need Chuck Todd in the room. Okay, you walk in there, you're going to be intellectually honest about how we fix it. So the hospitals are honest, the pharmacies, pharmaceuticals.

We get everybody in the room and say, okay, how are we going to fix this system? Because it's costing more and more. There are more people who are not getting the kind of care they want. The quality is not what we want. And everybody would agree with that. If you just go at it one piece at a time, you'll never get there. It has to be done. And you can do it. I've done it two or three times.

And I can't remember which candidate, but the danger in that is, if you don't have some experience in government. I agree with that. If you don't have some, you're going to get lost.

If you're going to run for president, You have to have people around you that can tell you, no, no, no, no, not that, but look at this, and then let them do what they want to do. And when you're in office, I had more meetings where I'd stuff 20, 25 people in a room. Everybody got to participate. I made a decision. I empowered people. They reported to me. Look, the proof's in the pudding.

You know, we... I hate to even go on. I had a great team of people. They all worked together. We created Jobs Ohio, the most important and dynamic economic development operation in America. Today, we've gone from 49th to like 7th. I mean, we're just kicking tail because we all work together. We work together. And that's how you get things done. And you need a leader.

And they got to have a sense of where they want to go. But you got to have a little bit of... of political experience.

We have examples in the book. One guy goes up to this place in Portland. He gets a group of his buddies from church and a couple of other churches. They go up and clean up the playground. They fix the whole school. He then turns it into a literacy program. The schools worked with them.

There's a lady who's used the portal of the schools to be able to inform parents about all the things that might be available to them if their kids have trouble. There are the people who have worked in the foster care area. There's now a program going nationwide where the faith community is working with the government to foster care. And the government has praised these people.

You can't go in and proselytize. The greatest way to spread faith is not by what you say, but by what you do. And these people are not in there. And I think that to not have these solutions come from well-meaning people. Now, you go in there and you start preaching your stuff. I don't think that works. But the most important thing to me is, if you look at this book or anything else about faith,

It's because you feel so strongly about the call of a higher power that you're willing to have courage and believe, even if you start at square one, that you can be successful in the end. And it also forces us to think.

If you have a liberal in a concert, okay, Chuck, you and I are driving, we're in Vermont, the middle of the winter, and we see this car in the snow bank, and you and I hop out, and these other two guys hop out, and we push the darn, we can't get it out, we're pushing and pushing, we're laughing, our hats are falling off, and we push it out, we go have a beer.

We find out that, you know, that they're of a complete different philosophy, it doesn't matter. Right.

It's like sitting at a University of Miami football game, getting their brains beat up by Ohio State, and you just have a great time with your buddies.

Somebody told me that there was a guy in Columbus that saw the incompletion or whatever the heck it was. I don't remember. He turned off the television and went to work. And the next day he didn't find out.

Well, to go back to your example. The other thing, I've told you this before. We get to fixing things locally. And I want to bring up that Putman book called The Upswing. All of his work is fascinating.

But The Upswing says that the social gospel movement changed the country from an I-Culture to a We-Culture. Coming from the Gilded Age to the great 20th century in our country where we went from I to we. We're in an I-Environment, not a we. And secondly, the other thing is all change comes from the bottom up.

Ich sage, du bist in meinem Leben der einzige größte Veränderung in unserer Gesellschaft, das sind die Bürgerrechte. Und es kam alles auf den Boden. Also, weißt du, wer wirst du mehr vermissen, wenn sie auf Verabschiedung gehen? Der Staatssekretär oder dein Trash-Mann? Ich meine, wir müssen also einsteigen. Und wenn wir in einer Rallye sind, ist das gut. Wir sind am Samstag in der Rallye.

Na, was werden wir am Montag machen?

What you're thinking about in terms of local news, you're right.

And there's this young man. I know his mother is a dear friend of mine.

und sein Name ist Jackson Rohrer und er schreibt für den lokalen Newspaper und du weißt in New York und er kümmert sich um Sport, der Kind ist wie ein großer, er ist wie jeder will ihn kennen, weil er schreibt über den Fußballteam, den Fußballteam und es ist wirklich cool und er ist wirklich er ist er jetzt will ein Journalist sein, aber ich weiß nicht, ob er einen Journalist

To be an investigator, I think he, maybe, I don't know, we'll see.

Yeah, exactly right. Well, you and what you're doing now is very interesting. So, yeah, I get local news. It really does matter. It really does. Local matters. It does.

Es ist die i-Kultur. Es ist die i-Kultur wieder.

Ich habe dir das vorher gesagt. Ich denke, es gibt etwas in dir, das sagt, nein. Es war ein Glaubensmovement, das es verändert hat. Das soziale Gospelsmovement hat das Land verändert.

But it started in one little place and it spread. And then we had the reform for child labor, the reforms around women. It doesn't take that. It takes a spark that comes where we are. And the other thing, you never know what can come. Und du weißt, diese ganze Sache, dass wenn wir nur eine Katastrophe hätten, würde jeder einig sein. Ich kaufe das nicht.

Ich habe das gewohnt, aber ich meine, wir kommen momentan zusammen und dann gehen wir zurück in unsere Räume. Es muss eine andere Perspektive, ein anderer Sinn in jeder Person sein. Und Teil davon ist das. When I look at a person, I need to see the image of God, of which I will be held accountable for. If I see the image of God, I'm going to be really careful about the way I treat them.

And if I see nothing but another guy honking his horn at me on the road or road rage or any of that other stuff, then it's just like Katie barred the door. It's going to take that kind of some sort of a spirit renewal. And you saw a little bit of it, by the way, I think, with the Pope. Ein bisschen.

Nobody liked him. The left didn't like him. The right didn't like him.

It could be. And when I say they didn't like him, you know, the right didn't like him because they thought he was too loose with the theology. The left didn't like him because they didn't think he went far enough. You know, what you and I say, when people on the right and the left don't like you, you must be doing something right.

I think it might be, Chuck, that he has too many people around him that don't tell him What's going on? And when you don't have people that tell you you're wrong and you need to think or change or modify.

Yeah, I think that's, you know, you think back to JFK and I don't know, he's probably been lionized about the Cuban Missile Crisis, but it just sounds to me like he had such an open discussion that instead of dropping the bombs, he, you know, he sent his brother to see Und dann kamen sie vorbei, weil sie einfach nicht zu dem Militär gehört haben. Sie hörten zu vielen anderen Leuten.

Und natürlich kamen sie zu der richtigen Schlussfolgerung und beobachteten Khrushchev an einem Zeitpunkt, als Khrushchev dachte, er hätte uns auf den Rund. Open. Open is the way it is.

But you have to be comfortable with yourself, secure in the knowledge that however smart you are, it's okay to have people smarter than you around, that you can make good judgments, that you have good instincts and a good gut. I mean, that's how it works.

If you go too fast, it's not only going too fast to implement one thing, it's also having too many things you're trying to do at once, which was a mistake I made, because I had so many things I was doing when I was first elected as governor, that I think a lot of people didn't know what they were. Had I slowed it down a little bit, let people see it, it would have been more effective.

Weil Sie denken, dass der Pentagon die Möglichkeit hat, Reformen zu verteidigen? Das ist im Vergleich zum Bildungs- und Industriekomplex.

It's the parents who say, my kids' school, you know, education's not great, but my kids' school's good. And they think that, you know, if we just pour more money in, it'll all be better. And it doesn't work. And so this is a case where... I think you need to go with a group of the willing, a coalition of the willing.

What schools do you want to join to do things differently and then show that those things can work? This is one maybe where you cannot do it comprehensively, unlike what I said about healthcare. You think this is something that is community by community? And a coalition of the willing. I mean, look, you can get to the point where a teacher is a helper, not really a teacher.

That the kids can learn through technology in a different way. Jimmy learns different than Sally. Let them learn on the basis of how...

Yeah, I think that's one way. And I do think that it's pretty darn clear that the KIPP schools do a great job. But there's such resistance.

No, I can tell you.

Because... If you take Abigail Wexner, who runs a KIPP school out here, she takes the kids that come from the toughest places that I mean, and they're all going to college. I mean, I believe I've seen it. I've seen it.

Eine Frau hat mir einmal gesagt, als ich nach Philadelphia nach den niedrigsten Schulen ging, als ich mein erstes Buch geschrieben habe, hat sie gesagt, jeder Vater liebt sein Kind, aber manchmal muss man sehr tief hin, um dieses Liebe zu finden. Und ich denke, es ist ein anderer Ort, wo ich denke, die Kirchen könnten kritisch wichtig sein, um das System zu verändern.

Wir haben unser Zeit lang darüber gespart, wie Trump nicht hören will. Biden's people wouldn't let anybody near him. Because they might tell him something to get his attention. And the cover-up by the media is a disgrace.

Well, and the other thing is they all want access, so you know, if you want to get access to Tiger Woods, you better not write anything negative. No, there's something to that, but it goes back to, I mean, you're right about, but look, I... I didn't want to just trash Trump without some fair trashing of Biden and his unwillingness to hear other things. Oh, I think Biden was a failed president.

And he thinks that he would have won.

Are you kidding me?

Tuck, I endorsed the guy. I know you did. I mean, I was the first Republican. You know, now they were all endorsing Kamala Harris and all that stuff. And I was the first one out there doing it. And I thought he was going to be a healer. And he was anything but that. You know, I talked to him the night that I endorsed him at their convention. He called me.

Do you know that I never spoke to him for the next four years? Not a single word.

Das ist eine Art Heresie, aber ich muss dir diese Geschichte erzählen. Biden hat mich zu der Universität in Delaware eingeladen und ich bin mit ihm zu einem Event gegangen. Und sagen wir, der Event war, ich war wahrscheinlich eine Stunde und eine halbe, aber sagen wir, es war eine Stunde. Er hat für 15 Minuten gesprochen und ich für 10 Minuten.

No, but it's just the way it was and the way it worked out. So I got home, I called McCain because he was, at the time, he was very sick. And I said, checking on him, John, how you doing? And how do you feel about your faith? And he goes, you don't have to worry about me, Johnny. And so it was very nice. And I said, well, I just went to this event for Biden.

And, you know, he spoke 50 and I spoke 10. He goes, yeah. He says, that's Biden, isn't it? He said... He said, that's why we love him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He said, you know, I went to a funeral once and I was sitting next to Dan Inouye and Biden was doing one of the eulogies.

And when he finished, Inouye poked me in the side and said, McCain, if you ever do one of those eulogies, don't forget to mention the corpse.

Exactly. I still laugh at that. We miss McCain. That was one really great man. We miss him.

Hey, it's always great. It's always great to be with you. You're just, you know, I think if people watch this, they see, you know, my friends, when they see us, they just see the kind of the connection, the magic, whatever it is, the sparks. And it's a lot of fun. So we're going to do great.

Yeah, I think the system's terrible and this transfer portal and all that stuff. We've just turned it into the minor leagues. I mean, if you want a minor league, you know, I remember talking to a A head football coach of one of the NFL teams. He was at a golf course with me. I've known him for a long time. He campaigned for me once.

He said, you know, John, the thing that we're missing, the baseball has a minor league, we don't. Well, we now do.

Well, the one thing that's fun is it is fun to talk about sports because it's pretty neutral. And when you have an argument there, you know, you can, it's okay.

Well, this is a crazy time, Chuck. It's a crazy time because I'm one of a handful of people. I happen to really like the NBA playoffs. And by the way, Cleveland just destroyed Miami. I mean, that was, I thought Miami would win.

I didn't even like the end.

I'm right. I mean, it's going to be very tough. But if you do, it'll be because Evan Mobley took that next level. Or that guy Hunter that came from Atlanta, who's really been terrific. And can anybody beat Oklahoma City?

And then, of course, one other subject we have to cover, as you heard when I was talking before we came on the air. So next Friday night, me, my buddies, Metallica. I love it. Now, in case you haven't heard this, we're going to be right in Columbus. And Miley Cyrus sang with Metallica. No kidding. Absolutely incredible. I bet it was. What the heck is the name of that song? Nothing Really Matters.

If you can hear it, and it was really great, and only to be exceeded by heart, singing Stairway to Heaven with the boys sitting up in the stands at the Kennedy Center Honors. Yeah, I mean, check it out. Those are some really cool things to see.

Oh, well, I will have enjoyed myself.

Yeah. All right. Thanks, Chuck. We'll see you soon.