The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast
527. Gay Marriage, Surrogacy, Divorce & Hookup Culture | Katy Faust
Thu, 6 Mar 2025
Jordan Peterson sits down with author, speaker, and founder and president of the children’s rights organization Them Before Us, Katy Faust. They discuss the ethics of surrogate pregnancies, the importance of both the mother and father in the home, the purpose of marriage being for the child — not the adults, and the abysmal outcomes of no-fault divorce in our culture. Katy Faust is the founder and president of Them Before Us, a global movement defending children’s right to their mother and father. She publishes, speaks, and testifies widely on why marriage and family are matters of justice for children. Her articles have appeared in Newsweek, USA Today, The Federalist, Public Discourse, WORLD Magazine, The Daily Signal, the Washington Examiner, the American Mind, and the American Conservative. She is on the advisory board for the Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. Katy helped design the teen edition of CanaVox, which studies sex, marriage, and relationships from a natural law perspective. Katy and co-author Stacy Manning detailed their philosophy of worldview transmission in their second book, “Raising Conservative Kids in a Woke City.” She and her pastor husband are raising their four children in Seattle. This episode was filmed on February 13th, 2025. | Links | For Katy Faust: On X https://x.com/advo_katy?lang=en On Instagram https://www.instagram.com/katyfaustofficial/?hl=en Them Before Us website https://thembeforeus.com/ Them Before Us on X https://x.com/ThemBeforeUs?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor Read Katy’s books on parenting: Them Before Us: Why We Need a Global Children's Rights Movement (2021) https://a.co/d/4l8WVET Raising Conservative Kids in a Woke City: Teaching Historical, Economic, and Biological Truth in a World of Lies (2023) https://a.co/d/8sN4Blb Pro-Child Politics: Why Every Cultural, Economic, and National Issue Is a Matter of Justice for Children (2024) https://a.co/d/7p0k6nL
Full Episode
This is a worldview that does not discriminate between single, married, gay, straight, fertile and infertile. This is a world where if you're going to put children first, all adults must conform to those fundamental rights. Let's wrestle that out. That means that it is going to run up against all of our self-interest at some point.
I have a friend, and he was interested in children, but his partner was interested in children, and so they had children with surrogacy.
There's one demographic in this country that's truly in the closet. It's kids with same-sex parents who desperately miss their mother or father.
Do you know of any data that isn't biased pertaining to that?
Forcing children to sacrifice something so adults can have what they want. Nobody has a right to a child. Children have a right to their mother and father.
And that lands us back into the, well, is it better that the child exists or not, argument.
It all comes down to the same thing. And the question is, what does it mean to be human? I'm going to scrap this out with you.
Hello, everybody. I had the opportunity today and sit down and talk to Katie Faust. Katie is an author. She wrote Them Before Us, published in 2021, Raising Conservative Kids in a Woke City, 2023, and Pro-Child Politics Online. Katie is the founder and president of an organization called Them Before Us. And she advocates on behalf of the intrinsic and inalienable rights of the child.
Her contention, which we discussed at length in the YouTube conversation, is that family policy, educational policy, economic policy, policy surrounding marriage should prioritize the natural rights of children, partly because children have inalienable natural rights, partly because they're voiceless and need to be defended, and partly because it seems self-evident that nothing that
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