The Dr. John Delony Show
Nutrition Expert Debunks Health Misinformation (With Dr. Layne Norton)
Wed, 08 Jan 2025
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Chapter 1: What are common nutrition myths?
I'd love to have you on the show. It's real people going through real life stuff. Go to johndeloney.com slash ask ASK. Fill out the form, and we'll see if we can get you on the show. Today, we have a very special guest, fresh off his world championship weightlifting victory. World champion. This isn't the first time or the second time. I think it's the third or fourth. I don't know.
He wins everything all the time. The strongest man in the world, and he happens to be one of the world's most renowned athletes. He happens to be one of the world's most renowned experts on nutrition, protein, getting beefcake-y, and taking down people who lie on the internet about nutrition. I'm talking about Dr. Lane Norton, who's also a good friend and big-time advocate for what we do here.
Over the past three or four years, Lane has helped me personally with some challenges I've had.
We've navigated life together, and I'm so happy that we finally got the opportunity to sit down in person to talk through everything from what's it like being wrong, exercise and nutrition, like what's the chaos out there in the world versus what is actually real when it comes to nutrition, when it comes to exercise. We talk about...
How can some people be so good in certain parts of their lives and then just be train wrecks in others? We talk about so much. We run the gamut here. This is one of my favorite conversations I've ever had from a true, not an Instagrammy or a TikTokky, but a true expert.
Somebody who coaches people, who performs themselves, knows all the academic insights, and who can distill it all down for knuckleheads like me to understand. So sit back and enjoy this conversation with my friend, Lane Norton. You are one of the most graceful people I know behind closed doors. And you have a thing in your guts about charlatans. Where does that come from? Like you...
More so than most people I know. You have... I think of it this way. Me and a buddy are walking down the street and somebody mouths off. And they mouth off about me. I often wouldn't hear it. I have a... Thing in my guts. If I hear somebody mouth off about a kid, I snap. I get irrational to the point that I've had people grab my arm and say, keep walking. All right.
You and I can both be scrolling social media on the same thing. And one guy pops off and I'm like, what an idiot. And you have this thing in your guts where you're like, stop. I'm going to go burn that guy's house down. Where does that come from?
I think for me, when I first got into this industry, it was like early 2000s. And it was basically by posting on bodybuilding message boards. I started to get a name on there, started to write for different websites, different magazines, and then started my coaching business. And I was kind of one of the first people to do online coaching at scale. Okay.
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Chapter 2: How can misinformation affect health?
That group of people will probably never be in the same room again together. It was awesome. And he said, you know, I was just okay with being wrong. I was just okay with being wrong. And when I got to grad school, I think I just had so many of my ideas crushed repeatedly that I'm like, oh, it's okay to be wrong. It's okay. And so I'm not upset at people for being wrong.
I think what I'm upset about is people, because everyone was ignorant at some point. Sure. Right? That's right.
But when you have been shown something repeatedly that not only says that what you're saying isn't accurate, actually the opposite thing, this is true in a lot of cases, like some of these people that I debunk, and you're still doing it, you know, it's either, you know, there's kind of two roads you can go down. Either they're making money from it, and so they don't, they're not, they can't,
They can't really change course. But I actually think the more powerful portion of this is people tie their identity into some of this stuff. They tie their identity into a diet or a supplement program or a style of training. For sure. And I can even identify with that, right? Yeah. And so... Is it a sense of justice for you? Yeah.
Yeah, and I think, again, going through the graduate school experience where I got to, like, see myself be wrong so much, and even, I'll never forget the first talk I ever gave at Experimental Biology, which is like the Super Bowl for nerds, right? It's like 300 people in a room. I'm in my third year of grad school, and I was giving a talk, and I thought I knew this stuff. And a professor gets up,
And he totally dresses me down in front of a room of scientists. And it was embarrassing. It hurt. And I went and sat down, and Lehman was sitting next to me. And he said, you know, you did pretty good. He goes, you're not supposed to go that hard on a graduate student as a professor, and I want to talk to that guy. But... I don't hold it against that guy.
In fact, it was really good for me because I remember what that felt like. And I'm like, okay, I'm going to know my stuff next time. That's it. I'm going to go and get the answers so that I understand the nuance of this stuff. So I'm not up there looking like an idiot. Right. And so I think like that took me five minutes to self reflect and go, okay,
okay, maybe that guy went a little bit too hard on me, but I allowed it to happen.
Yeah, yeah. I set the table.
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Chapter 3: What is the relationship between sugar and health?
Yeah.
And so that's kind of how I look at treats and processed food and all that kind of stuff. Okay, if you're sedentary and you don't expend much energy every day, yeah, your budget's going to be pretty small. It doesn't make sense for you to allot some of that towards a piece of cheesecake or ice cream or whatever. No, probably not. But if you have a larger budget...
And also, if you allot some of this and you are able to moderate it, and I hope everybody's different, but if you are able to moderate it and it helps keep you consistent, like for me, if I know I can have the foods I like, but I just got to kind of fit them into my budget, I'm fine.
I remember having tacos with you once. I was like, I don't know how. I think he had one drink and two tacos. And I have chips and queso and taco. I'm like, I'm going to get another taco. Yeah, I just get out of control. But again, it goes back to know thyself, right?
Yeah, know thyself. And again, I've had... I actually stayed with a couple one time where the girlfriend was doing her master's in psychology.
Ah, yeah.
And she was like, here's what I noticed about Lane. When he's in control of his food, he by default
picks very low calorie options but he also didn't turn down any dessert i made he didn't turn down so i am in my head doing this budget and doing this exchange like if i want to go out and have a few drinks well then i'm not going to eat as heavy of a dinner right right or i'm gonna hold over i'm gonna not eat as much earlier in the day so that i can have more later It's budgeting.
So I saw how much damage this stuff caused people that I worked with, this messaging. And I think that's what got me kind of vitriolic about it. Yeah. And I have actually tried to pull that back a little bit. I've tried to save the vitriol for like the repeat offenders, where it's like very obvious that they don't care about getting it right.
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Chapter 4: Why is exercise important for weight management?
I can remember very clearly one time, uh, uh, this one guy I've called out a bunch, um, He would never say me by name, which is very smart on his part. But he was kind of trying to respond to some things I'd said about artificial sweeteners. And he said, in this study, they gave subjects artificial sweeteners. By the way, when they say subjects, it was in rats. They gave subjects aspartame.
And they gained more weight and XYZ. And I'm like, hmm. And then he said the PubMed ID. And I'm like, I'm going to go read this study.
Yeah.
Mistake.
Don't give the PubMed ID to me.
And it turns out, yeah, it was in rats. And also... Is it 12x their body weight or something? No, they actually lost weight. The group being the Nutrition Sweeteners lost weight. I'm like, not only was you get this wrong, it's the opposite of what you said. And even like, there was a very well-known scientist who was on a really big podcast with a podcaster who I have a good relationship with.
And I was watching the interview and he said, you know, they did this study where they had everybody drink either a liter of soda a day, a liter of diet soda a day, a liter of full fat milk or a liter of water. And in six months, the people drinking a liter of cola gained 10 kilograms. The group drinking the diet cola gained two kilograms.
And I can't remember the water or the full fat milk he said. I think they said they lost weight or whatever. And he said it was a study out of Copenhagen. So I'm like, all right, where can I find this thing? So I spent probably five hours trying to track down this study and finally found it because he mentioned it in a blog and I was able to find the original study.
And I'm like, so he either didn't read this study at all or... He fabricated the results. So, yes, it was a leader of those things. It was actually semi-skim milk. It wasn't full-fat milk. There was actually no differences between the groups in the amount of weight gain. Like the cola group gained the most weight, but it wasn't statistically significantly different from the other groups.
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Chapter 5: How does obesity impact overall health?
Chapter 6: What role does accountability play in dietary choices?
And when you...
Which is defined clinically as?
Clinically, I believe for males over 25% body fat and for females over 30%, I believe. And there's BMIs that you can use as well. It just depends on what measure you're using. And so your risk of cardiovascular disease, cancer, mortality, they all go up. You...
Without getting too into the weeds, there are people who are obese who are metabolically still healthy, meaning they don't have abnormal blood lipids. They don't have abnormal blood glucose. That tends to be more of a rarity, but it does happen. Usually these people actually have more fat cells, and I could go into the biochemistry as to why, but it won't help anybody.
But even when you standardize for that— people who are obese, even if they are healthy obesity, they still have increased risk of mortality, cancer, and cardiovascular disease. Because adipose tissue, excess adipose tissue, is a metabolic organ. And it secretes its own hormones. It secretes inflammatory markers.
It has, when it gets large enough in mass, it starts to dysregulate signaling in other tissues. Liver, muscle tissue, And so one of the most powerful things you can do, and again, not saying you have to be a six-pack shredded. That's not it. In fact, if you look at even people who are obese, you get the majority of the health benefits in the first 5% to 10% of weight loss.
In fact, they were doing a study at Illinois when I got there. Lehman's Lab was doing a study that I wasn't involved in, but I just helped out because I was an idiot first-year grad student. All right. they were seeing resolution of obese women's blood markers within like four weeks of just like starting to get the calorie deficit.
It's really impressive how quickly things will clean up when you start, like the human body is very resilient.
So I don't think we have, I don't think we spend enough time there because guys like me are always saying it's hard. It's going to be a journey. It's going to be whatever with the right trauma therapist with me. It was five or six gnarly sessions. Of the six, two or three were bad. They were tough. And then I saw a huge shift, right?
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