Becker Private Equity & Business Podcast
Breaking Down the USA-Canada Rivalry and Business Insights with David Pivnick of McGuireWoods LLP 2-25-25
Tue, 25 Feb 2025
David Pivnick, Partner at McGuireWoods LLP, joins Scott Becker to discuss the USA-Canada hockey rivalry, the NHL’s recent success in growing the sport, and the political dynamics between the two countries.
Chapter 1: What insights does David Pivnick share about the USA-Canada hockey rivalry?
This is Scott Becker with the Becker Private Equity and Business Podcast. We're thrilled today to be joined by brilliant David Pivnik, and David requires us to use the descriptor brilliant before his name. It's part of his contract. No, he actually is brilliant, and he doesn't require that.
We're going to talk today about a subject that David is oh so knowledgeable about, about business, politics, and sports. David, let's tee off by talking a little bit about USA Canada and the NHL sort of all-star extravaganza and how the NHL has done a great job of making itself relevant again. And what are your thoughts on the Canadian-USA rivalry? Is this all really just great fun for them?
Are they really that competitive? What's the gist of it? What's your take on this, the Canada-USA rivalry that's going on in the NHL All-Star Weekend?
Chapter 2: How has the NHL successfully grown its brand recently?
yeah look great question love to talk about it and i want to start by just i want to touch on what you said at the beginning which is the nhl got something right which i think is something we can all be as hockey fans be excited about and also somewhat shocked because the nhl constantly steps on its own feet and falls all over itself to do the absolutely worst thing for growing the sport
and building the brand of hockey in the NHL and gaining popularity in the States. And they finally did something so right and they deserve credit.
And I love the fact that, you know, at the beginning of last week, right after the Super Bowl, there was a lot of media discussion about how stupid the NHL was for, you know, canceling games effectively for two weeks right in the lull after football and not capitalizing on that gap in the sports scene. And instead, this four nations thing has just been a smash success.
The ratings are through the roof and people are talking about hockey in a way that basically never happens. So as you can tell, I'm pretty pumped about it. And I have to tip my cap to the NHL because they, like I said, consistently get lampooned for doing the wrong thing and not growing the sport.
And they absolutely, you know, this was a slam dunk or a great slap shot as the case would be very well done. In terms of the game coming up, look, I mean, clearly the U.S.-Canada hockey rivalry, so to speak, which I think has become much more of a real rivalry in recent years.
Canadians love to point to the historic records, but it's starting to narrow over the last few years, and particularly at the world junior level where the U.S. team continues to have increased success and the Canadian team has had a couple rough years in the last few go-rounds. It's great to see. This is going to be more of a rivalry and more of an even rivalry in the future. I think that the U.S.
team coming into the tournament, I think we talked about this before, I said I thought they had the best defense and also the best goaltending. That has certainly held up as the tournament has progressed, and I thought Canada's forwards were the strongest defenders. which they have sort of gone back and forth depending on the game. They look pretty anemic versus the U.S. on Saturday.
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Chapter 3: What political dynamics influence the USA-Canada hockey rivalry?
So I think tomorrow's game is going to be a great game. I think McAvoy being out on defense for the U.S. hurts quite a bit. And I'm expecting Canada to come out pretty inspired, even on the road in Boston, and to get the win tomorrow night. But I expect it to be a pretty tight and exciting game to watch.
Thank you very, very much. And what about the political overtones? Is this all a lot of hype, or has President Trump made an error in sort of picking a fight we don't need to have? Because obviously, I mean, you're our expert on Canadian-American relationships. You're the sort of... The guru, the expert, the genius on that area.
Chapter 4: How do President Trump's statements affect Canadian-American relationships?
How much has President Trump's language amped this up where you have Canadians booing the American anthem? Is this all good fun or is it going to turn into what's happening? Sort of the soccer hooliganism type stuff where you start to have fights between Americans and Canadians, which seems so stupid.
And if we have fights between Americans and Canadians, are you like the Tuchuks that have to pick one side or the other? And am I pronouncing Tuchuk right? I'm not sure I'm not. But their mother's Canadian. Their father's American. They've chosen to suit up for the USA. You're a Canadian and American. Do you have inner conflict?
I have some inner conflict, actually. I will say I like. Both teams and, you know, if they were playing anyone else, it'd be easy to know who I was cheering for. This game's a little bit tough. It's Kachuk. You were sort of close. I think you managed to mispronounce it two different ways. But, you know, you're in the ballpark, which is good. And I do think, you know, for them...
Playing for the same country their father played for, and obviously their dad, Keith Kachuk, had a great career, you know, makes a lot of sense. And those guys are kind of the heart and soul of the U.S. team. I'm sure you've seen, you know, they were texting, the two of them, you know, Matt Kachuk and Brady were texting with J.T. Miller and basically agreed before the game.
they were going to drop the myths and get a fight going to sort of kick things off. So I view that less as a critique on the booing and the anthem and more on them rallying, you know, rallying behind the stars and stripes and wanting to send the right message in a big game for their team, which, you know, that's a, it's a fun part of hockey, whether you like fighting in the game or not.
And so I'm glad that they kicked it off in that way, in terms of your more political question and, I mean, look, we've talked about President Trump's statements on Canada before. I think much of it is hyperbole that's not likely to lead anywhere.
But, you know, it's not ideal to create distaste in the eyes of, you know, a close friend, not just a neighboring country, but one of the greatest, you know, relationships between two countries, I think, in the world in terms of, you know, a peaceful, unprotected, you know, border, you know, close trade relationship, close partnership on a lot of fronts.
So I think it's unfortunate from that standpoint. But I view that more through the lens of how actual items like tariffs are going to play out rather than trying to evaluate it based on, you know, whether or not the anthem's getting booed. I think if the crowd in Montreal is wants to boo the anthem. You know, it is what it is. There's plenty of things about Montreal that I think warrants booing.
Let me ask you that question. Is Montreal and Quebec, is that still considered part of Canada or do you, for all practical purposes, the rest of the country consider that sort of a French Parisian outlier, or are you still consider it part of Canada? I guess that's the question.
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Chapter 5: What are the cultural differences between Quebec and the rest of Canada?
Chapter 6: How do Canadians perceive the booing of the American anthem?
So, you know, that's never passed, and I don't think secession will happen, but it's, you know, different parts of Quebec inspire different levels of affection amongst Canadians.
And I don't mean this in a negative way, but you're sort of a gritty, sort of blue-collar acting, Ontarioan, Toronto person, Do you ever feel like you're just a lot less sophisticated compared to the people from Quebec and Montreal? Just a little, and I don't mean this offensively, a little dumber than the Quebec and Montreal folks.
So I appreciate the implicit insult in there. I'm not sure if I think I'm honored to be called blue collar. I don't think I get that description a lot, although I'm a little offended. You think my disdain for the Quebec was because I don't feel smart enough to deal with them. I assure you that's not the particular problem there, but appreciate where you were going with the question.
So what is the answer? Are you okay, esteem-wise, given the difference in average intellect between Ontario and Quebec?
I mean, look, amongst the various provinces, I don't think there's a legitimate debate that Ontario is the best province. I recognize other provinces might incorrectly contest that point, or I guess citizens of other provinces. But I just think objectively, you know, Ontario, Alberta, and British Columbia are the three profitable provinces that sort of drive the rest of the country.
And I think Ontario and British Columbia are clearly the best of the provinces if one were ranking best. such things. So, you know, with that in mind, I'm not going to stoop to trying to dignify your question about how Quebec might feel or whether I should feel sufficient for Quebec.
If you could actually rank the provinces from best to worst in Canada, which it seems like implicitly, I didn't realize this, that Canadians do, you know, how do you compare British Columbia and Ontario to, let's say,
florida and california how do they compare i mean as long as you're ranking and stirring up trouble in such a incomprehensible way compare them to some of the u.s states where does uh british columbia let's compare it to texas because they're both big oil wealth like areas what's the what's your sense i mean you can't really compare ontario
to a state in the US that has real commerce, but let's compare it to like North Dakota. How do you compare Ontario to North Dakota and how do you compare British Columbia to Texas?
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