Wesley Morris
Appearances
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
28.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Hmm.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Well, okay, I disagree with everything. I think... Okay, first of all, I just want to be clear. I have no deep, visceral...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
problem with Mikey Madison winning I actually was I was happy for the surprise of it of those five nominees I wasn't terribly excited about I loved Fernanda Torres and I'm still here I think that Demi Moore we can talk about what Demi Moore is doing in the substance that I think made her deserving of an Oscar okay but my two favorite performances are two of my very favorite performances from last year was
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Their movie's got no nominations. And I just was kind of like, there needs to be an asterisk next to these five nominees. Who were the two performances? Nicole Kidman and Baby Girl.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
That is one of the greatest. I mean, this is true of Nicole Kidman in general in the last like 15 years. But that performance in Baby Girl is one of the greatest feats of psychological acting I have ever seen. I don't know how... I'm not an actor, and I don't know how you simulate... Any of the things that Nicole Kidman was asked to do and Harris Dickman, or is it Harris Dickson? Dickinson?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He is also great. That is one of the top, his performance is one of the top five performances I saw last year.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yes, supporting. I can live with supporting. We can talk about category fraud too. Yeah. Because two of our winners, total category fraudsters. And I anyway, I think that Mikey Madison is good in that movie.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
My problem with with the performance is only that the four guys she is working with in this film are extraordinary. All four of those guys is great. And all four of those guys are great. And, you know, Yura Borislav, I'm so out of practice with these names. I'm going to get some of them wrong.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But, you know, to single him out is right because, you know, he's got the scene at the end in the car, which is her great moment as an actor, too, in this movie. I like Nora. I like it more than fine, but I don't love it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I think that I'd be curious to hear you talk about what you love about Mikey Madison so much.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Here's what I'll say about Demi Moore. I... There's a shot at the beginning or toward the beginning of this film where she has left the set of her aerobics instruction...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
show her big hit uh fitness show she's going to the bathroom and on our on our walk from the studio i believe or maybe the executives i don't exactly know what where the hallway is going to and leading i know it's going to the bathroom but anyway there are all of these photos of of various versions of elizabeth sparkle to me more character in the substance on the wall and
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And they're all from different periods of this character's life. And I just felt like I was also watching the Hall of Demi Moore. And, like, all those portraits correspond, at least in my brain, they corresponded to some moment in Demi Moore's cultural life and her movie star life. And then she gets to the bathroom, and I believe there's, like, somebody's cleaning the women's room.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
So what does she have to do? She goes into the men's bathroom. That is the Demi Moore's shot or sequence maybe ever. Yeah. And this movie is so dialed in in its way because it's not about America. It's not about... It's like set in a kind of fictionalized Hollywood. We can talk about the kind of Europeanification and the sort of...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
The ways in which non-American filmmakers and ideas have officially made an inexorable mark on the Academy Awards and the Academy itself. It's just not going anywhere anytime soon. So we have to think about what the Oscars even are going forward. But anyway...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This movie, to me, and when she gets into the bathroom, you have the Dennis Quaid character in the bathroom talking about how over the hill Demi Moore is as an actress. Or, you know, Elizabeth Sparkle is as an actress. And I, from that sequence forward, this movie was as much about the actor playing this part as it was about the character she's playing.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And the total... I have never seen... Demi Moore is committed to a lot of parts. I mean, G.I. Jane being maybe the ultimate striptease, being an ultimate part commitment. She's never been the strongest line reader. She's never been the most convincing...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
when her when when she has to hit an upper register like anger is not something like verbal anger verbally expressed anger but she can make her face twitch her eyes can do that like um you know like they're yeah they're they're like sizzling a little bit when she's when she's suffering um And but her lower register, you know, you know, suck my dick that that that line and G.I.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Jane, I mean, she can sell those lower register rages. But this was something new for me with Demi Moore, where like her physical commitment to the part had emotional stakes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Uh, yes. And I think that, that's fair.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But if you're, I'm sorry.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah. But can I just real quick, like if you're an Iranian voter, do you care about 40 years? You don't, you're just doing best performance, which is great.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I was just about to say, Bill, there's so many moments like that in her career.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Right. But, you know, Strip Cheese. Wait, let's go back to 1990.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You're throwing too much at me. I know. Hold it. Wait, let's go back to Strip Cheese. That movie was more than a paycheck movie. Like, it was, I believe, well, it did pay her a lot if memory serves.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But it was also at the peak of her demeanness, right? She had a great 1990s. She had, I mean, she was a top five box office draw. She was in Indecent Proposal.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I don't think she had that in her is the thing.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You, what do you think? Cause it's not like she didn't get the right part.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
No, no. I think that that's not it. Because I bet you she and Elizabeth Shue are the same age. I think... Yeah, you're right. They probably are. I think that Demi Moore... And this is why she's so good in Ghost, by the way. I think that she presents as invulnerable, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, her whole thing when she became a real major movie star where people were paying money to see movies she was in was just about her toughness, right? I mean, she's often the only woman in these movies. A few good men, she's the woman.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
It's her worst part. And maybe like her worst piece of acting because she's kind of seemed secondary to everybody else's priorities. And so, you know, Rob Reiner is a great director of actors. So I don't know what his side of this.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, I'm sure that I mean, I can't say no. I definitely would have loved to have seen her play the part. I don't have an argument for why she couldn't have done it. Like, yeah, like cast her into casino. I thought you were going to go with basic instinct.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
No.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is why I want to go back to Mortal Thoughts, because it's a great combination of the thing I'm identifying about her that I like, which is the strength with these pockets of vulnerability.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Hmm.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You don't believe. And the thing about Mortal Thoughts is it's two women. Glenn Headley is the other woman because Glenn Headley used to be a thing. Right. And a wonderful actress. The two of them in that movie are wonderful.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, did it. Did it all. And this movie, Immortal Thoughts, I think, is it Alan Rudolph directed this movie? Yeah. From 1991? It's a Tubi classic.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Bill, I fell for it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I rewatched it. And there's more going on. It does not ultimately work because it's structurally... It should just go chronologically and shouldn't do all the sort of jumping around in time that it does. But Demi Moore...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
There's a struggle in here. I know I'm just thinking through like what, what is what worked for me and what the surprise was with respect to Demi Moore. Like there's a struggle in her, I think as an actor where she's trying to figure out like what the, what, how to modulate the, the shell that she sort of moves through movies with and,
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And in a movie like Mortal Thoughts, I mean, some of what's required for that part, she's playing a woman being abused by her husband. They conspire to kill him. I think I'm getting this right. They conspire to kill him, she and Glenn Headley. And then they spend the rest of the movie trying to figure out how to get away with murder.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
It's oh, whoa. You know, it's crazy. Yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah. And that was the movie didn't work also because you don't believe them as New Jersey housewives or whatever.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I listen to you guys talk about disclosure.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I don't like that. I don't like it. I don't think she's good. It's not a good use of Demi Moore.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, three straight guys talking about Disclosure is just... That was part of the gimmick. I know. It just was like... I'm like, there needs to be... But Ghost, she's really good, though. Ghost, I think, is the number one. That movie was a monster movie. Number one answer. Because that movie is not so secretly strange, right? It's not just the supernatural parts.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But I also love what she and Whoopi Goldberg get up to. Yeah, they have great scenes. I love her disbelief that the thing that she's being told is happening is happening to her. I believe her as a woman named Molly, which, you know, that's a huge, that's a big deal. Yeah. And I just think that that movie is so... It's so much about Demi Moore's character and the movie's about her.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And there's just... She's so soft in that movie. And the moments in which she has to, like, put a shield over herself, they work because you understand... The movie has given you enough of this, like, this vulnerable, you know... woman who just doesn't believe that this magical thing that is about, is it about to, that's about to happen to her is really going to happen.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Um, I just think it's a, I mean, it's strange because in 1990, who were your best actress nominees? Julia Roberts, Meryl Streep, Joanne Woodward, Kathy Bates, who won and Angelica Houston, I want to say for the grifters. Yeah. I mean, it's not like she was remiss. I mean, Julia Roberts took the movie star part of the movie star nomination for those five people.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Um, I don't know.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Any one of those people could have.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Oh, wow.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I haven't seen it in a while.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I also don't think it I also it's complicated. Right. He's probably going to be one of the last actors to be in this position. Right. We're like, he'll just he'll just be nominated to maybe maybe two more times before he actually wins. Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And I'm looking forward to Timothy Chalamet is the revenant because he definitely has it in him. Um, the, the question is like, is that script ever going to come his way?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I love listening to Sean talk about that stuff.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is a great point because I actually didn't even think about DiCaprio in that moment. And I thought I went I went past Leonardo DiCaprio and went to like Streep and Nicholson. Right. Right. Where he was the person. They weren't even making fun of him at some points. It wasn't even Conan O'Brien joking. It felt like he had clout. Yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
People were just shouting him out because they thought he was cool.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I thought it was great.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, as sports people, Bill, I think we just what we want is a little bit of honesty in terms of people's ambitions. Yeah. And if you think you can go all the way, he wasn't even saying I'm the greatest. He's like, I want to be one of the great.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
No, I think there's I mean, at least not yet.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
They don't talk about you that way. I mean, think I mean, this is not quite fair to the person I'm about. I'm about to name. But think about a show where like they would treat Karen Culkin this way. I think that there is real belief in Timothee Chalamet as more than just an actor. He embodies something that people seem to like. Also, it's important to say that
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
that he's just really good at being himself. And I don't know what that is, really, but I just enjoy when he shows up, you know, on some Canadian talk show show hanging out in the record store with the talk show host. I don't know if you saw that. I don't even know where I saw it. But it came to me, and I was like, I love this guy. He really went along with it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Maurice Stoudemire to like sign a fucking jersey for him like he he still has that authenticity and I don't know Hollywood beats that out of you sometimes and the difference between yeah I think the difference between him and DiCaprio also and this is also important he seems to be fine with it DiCaprio didn't like it yeah I don't know that he likes it to this day
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He liked the spoils. The spoils, yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Right. But he doesn't like the actual... He's not in it for Jimmy Kimmel, Conan O'Brien, kind of poking him in the ribs a little bit.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Chalamet, he's like, his skin is thick. He can handle it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Keep him on their toes, right? Like, I mean, let... He is willing to be the brunt of some brutal jokes. I'm thinking specifically about Tina Fey and Amy Poehler going at him at the Golden Globes. Yeah. He can... He just... He's like, if this is the price, if the price is... Having two funny people like roast me for some stuff they think I did or like the community thinks I did. I'll take it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I still don't have to do an interview.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Like, what do you think?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He relaxed.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, I mean, he's still mysterious to me. I don't pretend to know anything.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Of those five people. No, give me anybody.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, I really I'm just going to stick with Adrian Brody. I mean, he was the person who who when I saw him in the first in the opening shot of The Brutalist, I was just like, well, this is we're we're headed into there will be blood territory in terms of the acting is due. Um, I just think that this is a guy who I'm just going to I don't want to talk about the speech. I can't even.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, I don't even know what to do with this.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I a little bit understand where it came from, but then it took a turn and then I was like, no, you got to just anyway. But he was my... Of those five guys, I'll just stay with those five guys. He was my favorite of the nominated performances. And he also was the best. It was one of the best pieces of acting I saw last year, period. And I think what I loved about it was the restraint.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
The way he... The way his... There's something like an there's an anchor. It's so different from the piano from from the pianist performance. Right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Where that character seemed to be blowing through through the through the narrative. And part of what was beautiful about that performance was just that he was in a silent movie, essentially. And you were watching somebody do was like a like a Charlie Chaplin, but under the worst possible circumstances for a human being. And he just seemed to keep surviving in an almost tragic, realist way.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And this movie is the opposite, where it's everything about it is internal. And how many levers can he keep down on the emotional side? circumstances, you know, dealing with the Guy Pearce character, keeping his eyes open, you know, there's a wariness and a skepticism about what this character is up against at all times. There's that great scene. Oh, you haven't seen it, Bill, have you?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I'm going to tell you about this one scene. There's this one scene. Felicity Jones is his wife. She eventually makes her way over to the United States. They wind up living together in this smallish apartment with her cousin. And these three Holocaust survivors in this little apartment, the husband and wife have not seen each other in a long time.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And there is an expectation from her that they're going to do it. And this is truly, this scene between these two actors and between these two characters is like, I'm getting chills just thinking about it. It is one of the most loaded sexual encounters that also is freighted by, you know, watching it in 2024, 25, you know, 60 years, you know, 70 years of history.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And the history that these characters have with each other, we're like, they're just different people now. The Holocaust has changed them. The time they've spent apart has changed them. Her body's different. His interest in her body is different. It is... I'm not even gonna... I can't be more detailed about the scene because I don't want to ruin it for people who haven't seen it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I wasn't gonna skip it, but I just... That is one of the best directed, best acted scenes between two actors in a bed that I have ever seen. And I will say as a, you know, parenthetically, not a lot of bed scenes in Baby Girls. So they didn't have a lot of competition.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Um, we can talk about Hackman. Uh, no. Well, can I just say one thing? We can save it for after the break. But, um, I want to talk about, like, what these Oscars mean. Because this felt, these are different. Something has changed. I don't, it kind of is both promising, but also not, it doesn't feel good based on the way people are talking to me about the Academy Awards.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Um, and I'm curious what people in your life and world are saying.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But it's shifted.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
but I also think that those movies aren't like, that's just, they're not going to happen. And also the thing about the old way, and this is not nostalgia speaking, this is just, you know, facts. Um, You know, there were there was a kind of randomness to what the five best pictures wound up being of the five best picture nominees.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And, you know, there was a healthy movie going ecosystem or one that seemed healthy to like an average could seem healthy to an average moviegoer where there was a lot of movies to choose from. They weren't all trying to win Oscars. And sometimes the ones that weren't trying wound up mattering to a lot of people.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I was going to say, we don't count. I don't think.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I think that... But... i'm telling you you're mentioning your kids i'm talking to people your kids age and i'm talking to people older than we are in there oh yeah yeah yeah who are also like i'm out i can't y'all y'all got me to see conclave and then pull that shit at the end i don't i'm out like y'all trying to rope-a-dope me into having feelings i don't want to be having
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Now, as a conclave person, I will tell you that that dismount is pretty ingenious.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Oh, I loved it. It is such... I didn't think the movie needed it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I think that what we're going to call a twist was really ingenious because I think the movie earns it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
All right, but that's not my point. My point is I talk to so many people of so many different age ranges, like age demographics, right? Generationally, everybody's out. Like nobody feels like the movies are for them. And I don't know what to do with that because it's not Sean Baker's fault. It's not The Substance's fault. Do you think Nickel Boys was out here trying to win a bunch of Oscars? No.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is the story that Rommel Ross wanted to tell about, like, based on... like, you know, quote based on Colson Whitehead's novel. Like, he, there was, there was so much risk taken in these, by these movies, these Best Picture nominees this year. They, they, they were doing strange, unusual, weird things.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And I'm saying this as a person who saw Guillermo del Toro's The Shape of Water, which won Best Picture, a woman about a woman in love with a fish. Like, you know, strange things happen to Best Picture nominees or in Best Picture nominees. But this was the first year where I can understand what it is the public wants.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And what the public wants is movies that not only have they seen, but they want to have like a wealth of movies if they're going to be going to the movies like to a physical movie theater.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
They want to go look at they want to look at famous people. They want movie stars like Deadpool and Wolverine are movie stars.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Like this iteration, this Anthony Mackie, Captain America to like two people who aren't invested in the Marvel universe, Marvel cinematic universe. Like he's important. And we all know like what this iteration of Captain America is and does. If you read the comic, et cetera, et cetera. But like, do people, this is Anthony Mackie, a draw for people, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, the movie seems like it's doing OK, but my point, my larger point is this is just me saying once again to you, Bill, that the IP is still I think people are now tired of the IP even. Right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
The IP is worn out. It's welcome.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Wait, you guys have never done Rocky?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Was that the year that Gravity and was that the year of Dallas Buyers Club, Gravity, American Hustle?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
That deck was so stacked that Tom Hanks giving one of the best performances he's ever given. And Captain Phillips did not get a Best Actor nomination.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
No, because, I mean, here's, you know, you know me well enough to know that my taste in men... is eclectic, but I'm just going to say for the average person, they're not, they're not looking at Gene Hackman and going,
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He gets a little randy in some movies. He is... But I think there's something about his kind of average lookingness.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Like, you know, he did not wear a toupee. He did not hide his loss of his hair. He... always just seemed like he was perpetually 45 years old. Yeah. He came to us 45 years old. And like when he left, he maybe seemed 60. I don't know.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He just seemed permanently middle-aged, which is a thing that just will never happen now.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He could be somebody trying to break into the White House.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Anything. I think that his also that kind of does speak in some weird way to what America is. And I know this sounds like cheesy and corny and cheap, but like if you are coming to this country for the first time and you want to you like one of the many things that tells you that you're in the United States of America, it's probably Gene Hackman. Right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is a person who in all of the jobs that he could be doing seems credible in them. He's not conventionally good looking. Like the idea that he and Warren Beatty are supposed to be brothers and Bonnie and Clyde is just one of the most laughable things I've ever seen. Like, yeah, adopted brothers. I don't know. I just it's just it's comical. There is something also like unpredictable about him.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And it isn't so much that, you know, I think about him in the French connection. Right. One of the, if you think of, if you diagram the psyche of, you've diagrammed that sentence psychologically, this is like a terrible human being. He's a racist, like racist cop in New York City, shaking down people in bars just for kicks, basically.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, but you know, Popeye Doyle never had an Eddie Murphy to come and give one of the great rebuttals to the racism in the movies, right? Yeah. Or like to anybody's racism in the movies. Popeye Doyle stands as a singular character Because he's never brought in to heal. Nobody ever wags their finger in his face in a way that means anything.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Because ultimately, he's looking for what a moviegoer will recognize as a kind of narrative justice. He's trying to solve this mystery. And the command, the, like, easy, like, kind of sexy command that he has in those bar, in those shakedown scenes, you know, he just, it's just a great, dirty, filthy character. Yeah. And the character works because he's got swag, you know?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And he didn't, he could turn that on and he could turn it off, but you really...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is a great point.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Can I tell you how many years I thought that Tom Hagen was played by Gene Hackman? Right. I sometimes have to remind myself that Robert Duvall is not Gene Hackman in that movie.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Terms of Endearment works with Gene Hackman.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But you know what he cannot do? And never really tried. He never did crazy. Well, he did do comedy and he was pretty, the birdcage, that's the first thing that comes to mind.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Listen, I mean, I mean, I'm already out as like, you know, I'm out of myself as being like into Gene Hackman, but yeah, it does not take much. But no, his Lex Luthor, his Lex Luthor.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
My first Gene Hackman was Lex Luthor in the 78 Superman. And listen, he's sexy. He is sexy in that movie. And there's like, and he, I don't know what he knew, but he definitely seemed to understand that Lex Luthor thought he was sexy. And that was good enough for him.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, but he, oh wait, but this is my, I was going to say, speaking of which, he never did crazy. Crazy is the thing he never did. He never played.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, just go back to like one of his primes. Like he couldn't have played Travis Bickle. No.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Um, you also wouldn't have believed him as, as Woodward, right? You wouldn't have believed him as Bob Woodward.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah, exactly. He would have flown off the handle way before it was time. Right. And there, there are just some things like, this is an interesting distinction that we're trying to make here, which is that I'm saying he's never played crazy, right? He's never played a crazy person, like a psychopath, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You can say what you want about Little Bill and Unforgiven, but that guy was just... Evil's not the same thing as crazy.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Think about all the people he's mentored to. Right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But what is it? But what is that, though? Right. Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Was he 6'1"? Yeah, I think he was, you know, he was. He definitely seemed substantial, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Like there was, I mean, this is,
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
part of the thing that i've got for jane hackman is he just seemed meaty like there was some there was often some meat on those bones like he seemed big bone is really what it was like not fit at all but not interested in fitness not vain there's no vanity right um he just whoever he's playing it's just there to do the work because often these are working people all these guys have jobs
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And even the guy that he plays in the birdcage, the senator, the bigoted senator who never changes but keeps going along with the program. And part of the comedy of the movie is you fully expect him to give himself over by showing up and coming out of the... Some crazy plot twist or something. But instead, he's just like... Man, this is the world.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
It's very Billy Wilder of him, the approach he takes in The Birdcage. Michael Nichols directed it, so it's not a crazy thing to have a smart performance stay in a lane because the director knows the payoff will be there at the end.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He couldn't have done it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He doesn't burn slow like that. He's eruptive. He's eruptive.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
The the thing. Well, he would have been the president of the network, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Nicholson was the anchor. But what I'm saying is Hackman, you would have more believed him as the president.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He would not have made sense as any of he wouldn't have made sense as William Hurt or Albert Brooks. But, you know, that same era of Hackman, he has a he has a cameo appearance in Postcards from the Edge. Do you remember this scene?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He's the director of the movie Meryl Streep is fucking up in. And the Meryl Streep character, this is based on the Carrie Fisher memoir. Um, she's playing this, this, this drug addicted actress who bottoms out and she goes through rehab and she, her redemption essentially is going back into this, into the post-production studio to do voiceovers. And Gene Hackman's her director. Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And he, the thing that we're talking about with this mentorship is, I think a version of what it looks like is this director telling this Meryl Streep character to get her life together. And, you know, giving her this, I mean, it's not another chance. The movie still needs to be looped. Um, and she's there to do her, do her voiceovers.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And it's just this wonderful sequence where you learn something about the movies. I didn't know what that process was until this, until Postcards from the Edge, another, another Mike Nichols movie. But he's so warm and firm and clear about what it is that he needs. But he's also got a sense of humor. Um, that, and he's not, I don't know who this character is. He's Gene Hackman. Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Whatever that means. Um, like, but, but, but fatherly and in a, in a really like touching way.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
No, that's doctor nomination for him in that movie, by the way.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
uh, Royal Tenenbaums. Uh, I would say the last great Hackman performance was close to the end.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah. And one, I mean, the thing that you love about, that's the one performance. I think anybody's given in a Wes Anderson movie where it felt like Wes Anderson, which is giving him, giving the enterprise over to this actor. I don't know anything about anything with that movie.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I just know how I feel watching it versus watching him in it versus watching anybody else in any other Wes Anderson movie. That's the one where I felt like Gene Hackman just one overrode the vision. And, you know, most people, a lot of people think that that's their favorite Wes Anderson movie.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I think in part because Gene Hackman is the one person who's one of the rare people to act in a Wes Anderson movie who feels differently alive than From the sort of dioramic project of the film. And he frequently exists on the streets of that city, right? He does not exist. He's not in the houses that much. He doesn't live in my memory as being an indoor cat. He's an outdoor cat in that movie.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And like anything outside, Wes Anderson just seems to have less control.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
He's such a soundstage, interior design-oriented person. And something about Gene Hackman out in those streets is just classic. It's very on-brand for Hackman and very disorienting for Wes Anderson. And the Tenenbaums is greater for it because there's a tension there that exists between his energy and the movie at large's energy.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Sally Field. Am I missing a very obvious one? Because like the two of them seem like they just feel it just should have worked. He did a movie with Barbra Streisand. Oh, that underrated, by the way. All night long. All night long.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
But he and Sally Field seem like they would have had a really good connection.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Can you name those names again?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
What's the year?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Ooh, that's right.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
That's like 1981, isn't it?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yeah.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, I know we're not talking about Richard Gere here, but, like, you know, it's funny because, like, to compare Richard Gere to Gene Hackman is interesting, right? Like, why does it work for Hackman and not for Richard Gere?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Yes, yes.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
That's the one that they wouldn't make, right?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
What was that original title? Was it called 2000 or 4000? Whatever her fee would have been. I think that's what the original title was.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, I feel like there was some Hackman money left on the table if he never did a movie with Sally Field. Cause that would, that, that's a no brainer to me. Um, Murphy's law instead of, instead of, um, or Murphy's romance, sorry, is the Sally Field, James Garner movie that got James Garner, his only Oscar nomination. Um, I feel like Gene Hackman could have been a good Hackman.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Here's my one minute. Here's my one minute three. I don't know how many words are going to be. Here's my review of White Lotus season three. I'm watching the pit. You're watching the pit. I'm watching the pit. ER is back. I'm not watching White Lotus. White Lotus had his chance with me, Bill. This show doesn't know what it's about. I'm watching the pit.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Oh, I'm in the pit. I'm in the pit. No, you never gave up your stock. Can't. Oh, I, are you kidding? Did I ever own stock? I was like, I should have bought stock. No, you had some stock. I mean, this would have, I mean, the vesting happening here is extraordinary. Are you watching this show bill?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Y'all can keep your White Lotus. Y'all, you can have it. Eat it up. I don't want it. I don't want anymore. I had my fill. Y'all don't know how to feed me. The pit. This show, and it's crazy that, like, the most excited I've gotten talking to you was about this show and not about anything else. But, you know, I do.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
If we were talking about Baby Girl or Hard Trues, which has the other great performance from last year by Marianne Jean-Baptiste, I'd be psyched to talk about that. But we're talking about The Pit. And I... It's such a strange...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
viewing experience if you ever watched er and i actually would love to know how people feel who haven't watched er ever to watch it for the first time because within like five minutes you are someplace you know you've already been even though you don't know where you actually are and Everything about it is familiar. This show is made by John Wells, who is responsible in part for ER.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
And it's the structure is basically one hour. Like every episode is one hour in this in this staff. It's 24 across the ER. Basically, yes, that's exactly you said it. I went over my head because I was enthusing about you watching the show. But you are 100 percent correct. Formally, that's the that's the show. I don't know how anything that happens on this show actually happens.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
What are the retakes like?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I'm in character.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Noah Wiley giving the TV performance. Nobody's going to do better than Noah Wiley on this show.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Nobody doing.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, you didn't because I haven't seen him. I haven't seen him since 2001. He's been doing some good stuff.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I think it might have been. TNT's Snowpiercer or the Bong Joon-ho's Snowpiercer?
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You know, he was on TV. He might have been that show, actually. You're right. I remember seeing him and being like, well, I'm glad the checks are still coming in.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
It's great.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
This is more than I'm glad the checks are still coming in. This is an extraordinary... Everybody on this show, even if you're not... Even if the acting isn't good, you have to be present in a really...
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
interesting way like a like a way that feels new to me for television and it is just the pit it's thrilling it's really anything and suspenseful and i love it anything to plug personally yeah i'm working on a podcast uh i turned in my book you'll be happy to know i don't believe it is there video evidence of it
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
I mean, there's still a lot of work to do, but it'll, we're going to make it, we're going to make it really good. I think it's going to be, it's going to work. I can't wait to read it. But yeah, I'm working on a show, a podcast. It's just, it's going to be me talking to people. I can't wait to invite myself on it.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
You, well, I mean, I would have invited you had you not already just invited yourself. You know, you're, you know, you're invited.
The Bill Simmons Podcast
Mavs Fans in Hell, Bleak NFL Situations, an Oscars Recap and RIP Gene Hackman | With Peter Schrager and Wesley Morris
Nice to see you too.