Triple H
Appearances
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
This is the place where they can make me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They didn't have a clue what they were doing there. And it was literally the inmates running the asylum. I knew that, like, you knew you had a boss right here. You knew that there was one place to get the final answer from and that it came from one place. And that sometimes it's all you need is, whether you like the decision or you don't, you need somebody to make a decision. It can't be...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So we were going to go into this program differently. into that year. So it would have been a huge, what we would call push for me in the business. Yeah, yeah. It just would have really been the thing that launched me. Oh, so this is years into the business. This is not early. Yeah, this is years into the business, but early for me in WWE to a degree. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, we, I think this, and then you go to this guy and he's like, no, I don't want to do that. I want to do this. And he's got some kind of creative control, but this other guy's got creative control too. And it's just a mess. It's a mess. Um, So one of the things I said to Vince was, I said, I don't want to leave. I said, but if I have no choice, then, well, that's what I have to do.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But I said, let me just ask you a question. I said, I did the crime. I'll take all the punishment. But I have to know, is there a point where this ends? Is there a light at the end of the tunnel? I'm willing to go through all the shit. I'm willing to take it. I'm willing to do the time for what I did. But I got to know there's an end point on it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
If you say to me, I can't get out of this, then I got to go. But if you say to me, no, no, it'll be a period of time, and then you'll get the opportunity. As long as I'm still delivering to where you feel like I deserve that opportunity, if I can get that opportunity, then I stay. And he said, as far as I'm concerned— There's no issue with me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He said, as far as I'm concerned, when you walk out that door at my office, it's over. It's all done and you're on flat ground with me. He said, but I got to, for a period of time, I got to put this out to everybody else that you're fucked. And then once I feel like that's been enough, then as long as you're still delivering, you get the opportunity to come back up. So I left there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And one of the things that I said to him before I left is I went to the door and I stopped and I said, hey, I just want to ask you one thing. And I just want it to be something that you think about because it's been resonating with me is I understand everybody's point of view, but the world is changing and the business is changing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I said, if what we did was so bad, then why was the largest or the loudest reaction of the entire night what we did? Like if what we did was so bad, isn't our job to entertain those people that all paid? I guarantee you the one thing they left there saying is, holy shit, at the end they all came out. It was this moment. It was real, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like I said, the business is changing and we're either going to change with it or it's going to pass us by. And, um, he sat there for a second and he said, you might, you might be right, but right now isn't the moment. And, uh, and I, and I left and then, yeah, I went from being the guy that was going to win king of the ring to being the guy that was losing in the first round.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Jake Roberts, who was, you know, fairly old at the time was sticking the snake down my pants as a ha ha thing. And, you know, um, I got every shit detail, every bad thing I got given to me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And at that same point in time, you know, the business was going through transitional changes, right? So I'm, at that time, I'm still Hunter Hearst Helmsley. I'm the blue blood snob. There's still like, everybody's got to have
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Whoever was the worst...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
guy that they wanted me to get over like just go put that guy go go get so you would have to wrestle these guys that they're trying to build up and they all have to beat you yeah and and and you know i'm not i'm not on any media anymore i'm not featured in the shows i'm just you're just there you're a b-side fighter i'm just at best right in boxing we call it a tomato can yeah yeah at best and then so um
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, time went on and, you know, eventually it got to a point where I'm a big believer in like, if you're talented, And I'll say that about myself, I guess, in that manner. But if you believe in yourself and you believe in your talent, then they can't only hold that back for so long. That that'll eventually come out and it'll eventually rise to the top.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And it's not about the storyline they give you always or the thing they give you. It's about creating your moments. This is something I tell talent all the time. Maximize your minutes. So even if I went out there with a shit detail, I would find something in there for me to have a moment.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Whatever. You know what I mean? Like I would have that one moment where I at least felt like I came back and I was like, that was horrible, but I at least got this out of it. Made the best of it. Yeah. And, and you sort of have to, you have to get that, those moments.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It could be anything, but it just could be when you have an opportunity. At some point as the heel, you're going to have an opportunity to beat the shit out of the baby face. In what manner do you do it? So many people...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
get into a place in our business, I think, or anything else, like in our business where you believe in yourself and you believe in your ability and as writers, we're not using you to the best of your ability right now. That happens to everybody, right? And there's ebbs and flows in your career. Yeah. How you deal with that, though, is up to you.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
sort of gimmicks and characters that are not necessarily just like you're a wrestler, you're a fireman or a cop or the clown or whatever it is that the gimmicks are larger than life sort of cartoony characters. Um, But backstage, there's a group of us that hang out together that were known as The Click.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You can go out there and say, I'm going to fucking prove it to them every single night. I'm going to go out there and kill this, no matter what it is. Or you can go, they're not using me. They don't care. Fuck that, I'll show them. And go out there and not try.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Phone it in.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Scene stealer, guy in the background that just like where you just can't help but look at that guy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Exactly. And it could be all about... Exactly. And that's the thing, right? So you can either go negative on it. I can sometimes tell watching the show, like... That guy walking out, he's about to get beat by this other guy, and he thinks it's wrong that they're putting that guy over him. So he doesn't want to do it. We call it boo-boo face.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And so he comes out boo-boo faced, and he doesn't have that same fire. Now that same talent sometimes, oh, they're going over. This match is for them. They're going to go over. They come out like a big star, and everything they do is they're putting all the effort in and all that stuff, right? It's... It's easy to put the effort in when they're going away. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And when they're going with you and this is all about me, the trick is to put that effort in. You know, the trick is to still, you know, go to the gym, hit it just as hard, be in just as good a shape, be spot on on your game and do all those things that you need to do. Because when that one time that they give you something and that you see that hole, I can do that and steal this scene.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And you go out there and you do that. And now after a couple of times, that stuff starts to become undeniable. Because the truth is we just react off what the crowd does. So when the crowd starts to see that and they start to get into a talent, now you're giving that crowd what they want and they're respecting it and they're going with it. We have no choice but to follow that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sometimes. And what do you do?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Nah, you know, it just depends on who it is. You know, sometimes you just talk to them like, come on, guys, come on, step up or, you know, whatever it is. Sometimes you just can't help it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, Sean Waltman, Shawn Michaels, myself. Yeah. And I was kind of... They were kind of... Just friends that all hung out together. Sort of Luger gave them the name The Click because they were always together. I sort of come in at that same time. For whatever reason, I get along great with those guys. We all end up as a group. We're known as The Click.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
at that point now I'm trying to earn my way back up. But at the same point in time, you start to begin to realize like, Oh, well, fuck it. If, if it doesn't go well, then who knows? Like I can be here for a while. They can fire me. Or maybe this, this isn't the right place for me. So I go someplace else, whatever that is.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You start to get to a place that is, I don't want to say you don't give a shit because you do, you care more than anything, but, But you start to realize, fuck it. I'm just going to do my thing. You're free. It's a freeing thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. So when you see us get to a point after that, when I start to get sort of free of that junk. is the time we get to do DX. We had been on Vince for a long time prior to Kevin and Scott leaving that we wanted to do this group. We wanted to sort of take what we were doing personally and put it on TV because we thought people will really think this is cool. And Kevin and Scott are gone.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So that was sort of just us in real life, right? Just walking around the backyard, suck the shit. Austin gets to a place where he's allowed to flip people off.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But like Austin was in a place where he could flip people off. But prior to that, as we're coming out of that generation, you can't flip people off. You can't do that. You can't do anything. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
As, as talent, this is before any of this happens, Kev, Scott, myself, like we have this thing we would do where, you know, you'd get up on the turnbuckle and somebody be yelling at you, flipping you off or something. And you just look at them and be like, Hey, Hey buddy, right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That's all it would be. Or you'd be like, you know, just, just, and they got it. Right. And you move on. We, as the attitude era begins to form and sort of, I'm in a place where, Hey, I just want to get out of this purgatory I'm in. And Sean's the guy we, we get the Vince, Vince allows us to sort of. partner up on screen and DX becomes a thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And in the beginning now, we start doing all this crazy shit and he's like, what the fuck are you guys doing? Now, I've also, over that time when I'm punished, I think Vince liked the fact That he threw all this shit at me and I never blinked. You know what I mean? Like the only one time I ever went to him and bitched in all of it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And it was because he put me in a match with a guy that was almost impossible to work with. And then gave me like the worst referee that we had. And like the whole setup was bad. And it went really badly. And I came back and I went off and it was like... Hey, fuck it. If you're going to, if you're going to not allow me to have the chance to succeed, then fuck that. I'm out of here.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But you cannot give me that. You cannot give me, put me in a position where I cannot fucking succeed or cannot win and can't even do my job. Right. Like if you put me in that position, then I have no choice but to go because I cannot, I can't overcome that. What was it? It was working. I was wrestling a guy that was just terrible. They wanted me to have this long match with him.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They gave me the worst referee, which a referee can help you work around people's in, in, in abilities because, um, I can talk to the referee. So if, if I need a guy to do something, he's not doing something right. I can't just always walk over there and tell him like, So you tell the referee. I'm like, fucking tell him to stop doing that and fucking, you know what I mean?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Backstage.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like the referee can go over and tell him, he said, stop doing that. Right. And I have enough experience to where guys will listen, but I need that. Sometimes you need the help, especially on live TV. Yeah. Or even tape TV, you just need to have that help. Who was the guy? Ahmed Johnson, a guy named Ahmed Johnson. Oh, I remember him. He was terrible, yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He was like injuring people in the ring, right? He was hurting people, and he was just big. Yeah, big steroid-looking dude. Yeah, and you couldn't understand him, and he had an attitude problem. And just, you know, that's him. And... You know, it was just one of those things. And when I came back, I was pissed and I went to Vince and I got a promo on him and I thought he was going to go off on me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, fuck, I told you if you don't like it, fuck you, get out of here, whatever. And he didn't. He was like, that's fair. That's fair. And I was like, okay, well then fucking don't do it again. I just walked out, you know what I'm saying? but he, he was like, that's, that's fair.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You can't, if I put you, if I give dump that much shit on you that you just can never dig out of it, then, you know, so, um, so he, you know, change that. But I think he respected the fact that I, you know, I did the time. I never bitched. I never did anything. And now it was time for me to get out of jail. And when he did, he was like, I'm going to let you and Sean do this group thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Okay, so that's your reward. Sort of, yeah. But Sean and I immediately just go into like overdrive on it and start doing shit that he is just like.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, I don't think we were trying to fuck it up, but we just had that, like, we wanted that creative freedom to go do what we wanted. Yeah. And the thing was, I believe that Vince was starting to see the change happening. Yeah. And while everybody else was going, they can't do that, and they can't say that. The TV network was telling us, they can't do that, they can't say that. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He was being like, man, the fucking crowd is reacting to these guys.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So it's cultural.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Slightly before that, you go a generation before that, nobody even associated with each other. If they walked into a bar and there was a bad guy in there and a good guy walked in the bar, you'd just leave. So you basically keep the kayfabe going. Keep it going all the time. And that was at a period of time where guys were getting into fights over...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sometimes we're just following it. Yeah. But there's a mirror of sort of what is happening. And I think about that period of time, like, you know, we were, you know, we were pulling our pants down on TV and telling people suck it and all the... Suck the shit out of it. You've got to get a picture of the apron. Or suck the cook, not the cop.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was politically correct because we didn't put the U in suck. Who knows what he says? Sick the cook, who knows? But I believe he was starting to see... You know, Austin's a bit edgier. We're a bit edgier. And that stuff's really starting to get a reaction. And it's not following yet necessarily with ratings or whatever. But the crowd is telling us that's where we want to go.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And again, you're seeing Stern, you know, like the Maury Povich shows. And all these shows are like so edgy. Springer.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, I remember there was a show like, was it Hill Street Blues or something like that, where the actor at the time, and I remember his name, Dennis Franz, it was a scene where he, you know, he's at his apartment or something and he comes out and he walks down a hallway and they show his naked ass on TV for like, you know, 30 seconds. Dennis Franz? Yeah. What an ass to show.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But it was like, people lost their minds. They were like, how could they do that? And we were like, this is funny. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So there's a moment in time where Vince comes to us now that he's getting so much shit from the network. Probably hip-hop, too.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Same time. So it's like every form of media. Everything is rebellious and over-the-top and like... Attitude. Attitude and holy shit. And this is what year? Shock TV. This is late 90s, probably?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Okay, this is great. The pendulum swings. Yes, yes, yes. Right? And it's the overcorrection. Okay. And Um, we are the overcorrection and we're pushing it to an extreme and, um, do things on that. There's a moment where USA network was like, you know, we'd come back from the ring and Vince would be like, you guys are going to get us kicked off the fucking air. Like USA is pissed.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like you gotta stop this shit. You know, I'm gonna have no choice but to fire you guys. Right. And we're like, whatever, they're going crazy to some degree. You could say whatever. No, we were thinking whatever. We weren't saying it. And then there was two things on that. One is at one point, USA was out of their mind. We did a show and they sent us a letter.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
that there's a skit that we do that looks like a presidential... Clinton had just done the, I did not have sex with that, you know, sexual relations with that young intern. He had just done that speech. USA Network sends us a letter saying, and it was ridiculous, like, DX has gone too far. So from... here's the controls from the hours of eight to nine. They can no longer say these words.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You know, if somebody came to you and said, ah, that stuff's fake, whatever, or, you know, try to criticize it, you'd get the shit kicked out of you. And there was a lot of badasses in the business at that time that... We're not afraid to do that. You had guys like Harley Race and things like that that would really, you know, they were legitimate badasses.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They can no longer refer to their genitalia. They can no longer say this. These words are acceptable. These are not.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was eight to 10. Okay. So then it was, you know, during the nine o'clock to 10 o'clock hour, they can say these words, but they can't say these. And we were like, this is ridiculous. And Vince came to us and he was like, you guys happy now? They put restrictions on us and this is what we can and can't do. What do we want to do here? And we were like,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
This is going to sound fucked up, but let us use that. Let us use that. We'll do a skit tonight to open the show where we say all this shit that's on us.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So we do this presidential almost like this. We're in the Oval Office and we do this presidential thing, but it breaks down between Sean and I where he's like, God damn it. I'm like, fuck, you can't say that dude.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You're like, right. We're swearing. They're beeping out the swears and this whole thing. And then he ends it with, and I did not have sex with that young intern. Matter of fact, I was up all night and that's sort of the skit. And, uh, We do it. And, you know, I think Vince was partially nervous and he's a rebel and a maverick spirit. So I think partially he was like, fuck yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And we put it out there. And the next week we got a letter back from USA. Congratulations on the ratings. Funny how you used our skid against us, our own thing against us. But it worked. Congratulations. And that was the last they criticized.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yes. And same with Steve and some other people. Characters start to change. They're open to me not being called Hunter Hearst Helmsley anymore. Like, hey, what do you want to be known as? He came to me and was like, you want to use your real name? And I'm like, eh, not really. I have time and stuff invested in this. Everybody called me Triple H backstage.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I was like, let's just break it down to the nickname Triple H. And slowly over time, I'll change the character from what I am to where I want it to be. And he was like, okay. But there also comes a time when now you're talking about like scripted and what he can control and he can't. Vince is a control freak. Yeah. So one time we walk into TV and Sean— Oh, I didn't consider that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So he's blending, he's trying to blend his position from being the boss and us doing what we want to do. Um, and I'll tell two stories about the one. So one is that we walk into TV one day and Sean walks up, I walk in and he walks up to me. He's like, have you seen this yet? I'm like, no, what's that? He's like, it's a script. I'm like, what do you mean a script?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'm like, I read it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Wait, you never had scripts before for any of the promos you cut? No, he would give us the premise of what, you know, you need to talk about this or whatever, and we'd go out and do our own thing. It's probably easier than memorizing, like, a whole script. Yeah, sure, but when you're working with multiple people... The businesses have been flowed in this manner, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, and so, yeah, like... So he gives us his script, and Sean and I go to his office, and we're like, what is this? And he's like, that's the script for tonight. And Sean's like... It's terrible. And he's like, well, that's what I want you to say. And Sean, because Sean's the elder guy now, so he's the stage man for the group.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And if somebody questioned the business, they'd end up beaten up, knocked out, broken leg, whatever.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And he says, he goes, well, fuck, now that this thing's over, you guys are going to tell us how to do it? And Vince goes, yeah, that's what I want you to say. And Sean goes, well, it sucks. And I'm not fucking saying it. And Vince goes, well, I need you to go out there and I want you to read, say what's on that paper. I want you to read it. And Sean goes, here's the fucking problem.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You think like the Honeymooners is funny. We think Beavis and Butthead is funny. And you don't even fucking know what that shit is. He said, you're not in touch with these kids and we're not fucking... This is not what we do. And Vince goes, well, I don't care. That's what I want you to say. And this is where Sean, sometimes Sean would do shit.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I would think like, how does this guy get away with this without getting fired? Like he really crumpled up the paper and threw it at Vince and bounced it off his chest. And he said, why the fuck is saying it? He walked out of the office and I was like. Yeah, I'm with him. On the way out, you're like, whoop. And we went and did our shit. Holy shit. That's why.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
If you're going to say, fuck you, I ain't saying that. And you're going to walk in the other room and you better crush it and it better work. Otherwise, see you. Thanks for coming.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And also, he's fighting that. He's the old guard also. So he's fighting it, but he's seeing, like, this is not... Ratings are ratings. Yeah, this is... God damn, this is crazy. This is not our business. But yet again, right? And then now, once he...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
now once he realizes like okay on once he learns it and he applies himself in this war with wcw where we're getting our ass handed to us and he realizes like wow all of a sudden now dx austin at the front forefront of that but dx austin you know all these guys that it's starting to change we're starting to pick up momentum now again So now he's going with it because he's in a war.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So one thing about Vince, he ain't losing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. Yeah, though, as you move forward out of that, I think people became accepting of, it's just great entertainment. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I remember one time, We, we did a, I don't remember what it was about, but we did a, we did a promo where I was going to cut a promo on Vince. Okay. This is without him knowing. This is, he knows I'm going to cut a promo.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The Montreal thing hasn't happened yet.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
People know he's the boss, but he's the interviewer. And we're starting to blend that where we're telling people he's the boss and he runs it, but he's still interviewing people like he's not. So we haven't fully just gone all in. He doesn't become Mr. McMahon, the boss owner, until the Bret Hart Montreal stuff happens.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But so we're about to go out there and cut this promo and they're telling me you need to cut a promo on Vince. And who is they? Just the creative. And Vince is like, yeah, so when we get out there, you know, Sean's going to go off on me. I need you to go off on me, cut a promo on me. And I'm like, so I go to him beforehand and I'm like, hey, how hard do you want me to go on you?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And he's like, say whatever you want. And I'm like, you sure about that? He's like, say whatever you want. So we get out there and I don't even remember what I said, but I start to cut the promo on him. And like, Vin's a very intense person. So as I start to cut the promo on him, all of a sudden I see his eyes change and his whole demeanor changes. And I'm like, fuck. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
i just crossed the line here and like and uh but i finished the promo and i can see now he's like that whatever i said i don't even remember what it was sort of stuck with him and so when we came back and he came back a little later i was like hey you okay with that promo and he was like yeah it's fucking fine what he was basically saying is yeah you crossed the line with me
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But it was good business. It was good business. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, if it was good for business, he was all in. Right. And that was the thing. So to go back to the original story, which is the Stone Cold stuff. Yeah, so I get punished for King of the Ring. I'm not going to be King of the Ring. I'm out, all that stuff. Who they put in that spot is sort of coming out of similar thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The ringmaster, Steve Austin, who's just like this technically gifted wrestler. Steve hates it. Steve goes and pitches to Vince. I don't like this character. I want to do my own thing. Stone Cold Steve Austin starts to form. So they take me out of the spot. They go with Steve. Steve wins King of the Ring and cuts the Austin 316 promo.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So there's signs everywhere, John 3.16, in support of Jake Robich because he's very religious, because he's sort of reformed. Evangelical drug addict. And so Steve goes out there and cuts this Austin 316 promo, which at the time, I believe Vince was pissed about and hated it. You cross the line into religion.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, it's a click away, all the information. And what's fascinating about our business is as interesting as the characters we put on TV, right? So there's a moment where there's some people that are just interested in what they see on TV. There's some people that are just as fascinated, if not more so, with what happens behind the scenes, the sort of the...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, like this is terrible. It's all this thing. And I believe they went with the Austin. Everybody else was like, not everybody, but there's a few people who were like, I'm telling you that was, did you hear the reaction? It was great. They made the first Austin 316 shirts as a, Vince was like, I make those shirts. I guarantee you none of them sell. And they did it. And then they sold.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Vince was like, this is great.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Austin 316. To this day, Austin 316 shirts are still one of our biggest selling.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Just talk about cultural relevance, right? Unbelievable.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Steve was one of the... A few guys like Steve, when I started in WCW, he was there stunning Steve Austin. He's in the middle somewhere. And, uh, but he was one of the guys that was like, I'm a new kid coming in the door. And, you know, that's at that time, especially very tough in the business breaking in and, um, you know, young and try to get started.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And, uh, Steve was one of the few guys that would talk to me a lot and like come over and sort of like, Hey dude, I noticed you were doing this. Maybe try that. Whatever.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You're just ignored. Yeah. And yeah. And so Steve was one of those guys. So even when Steve came in and, um, you know, I liked him a lot and, and I, it's a weird thing in the business. Like one, once that wasn't happening for me, I just put it out of my mind and I was happy for Steve. As my career progressed later, it's a funny thing how life works.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I look back at that now and I think, I wasn't ready.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
i fucking wasn't ready yeah and i thought i was yeah you always think you always think you are right and you believe that you're ready i was not if they would have put me in that role i wouldn't have cut my version of an austin 316 yeah i wouldn't have been ready it would have floundered and i probably would have it's a great way of looking at yeah and um I know that now.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I can look back at that and say, like, I was pissed at the time or I was upset or disappointed. I was using it to fuel me to do other things and become something more. But the truth is, I would have fucked that up.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
who that person is in real life, the politics of it. They make up their own stories in some manner of the things that are going on. Well, I know that guy hates that guy and they don't get along at all. We will even perpetuate that through the internet and things like that, where it might not have anything to do with the story that is happening on the show, but we'll perpetuate that partially.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Exactly. Yeah. I just worked through it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. Yeah. 100%. You also get guys that are petrified of being a babyface because if you're a babyface and they start to boo you, you're failing. Oh, that's a different pressure. If they boo you as a bad guy... You're doing good.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Baby faces. Well, we were bad guys. And then Sean gets injured and Sean leaves. And I reformed the group with these other guys. Right, right. In that moment, we almost, like, they're so excited to see the group carry on. Yeah. And the stuff, we just transitioned who we were doing it to to the other side. And we, WCW at that point in time is on the attack. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We DX do the unthinkable and we go to their show. I go to their show with a fucking tank and my crew and I'm firing shots at the, like fake shots at the building and on a megaphone, you know, yelling at their fans and we're outside and it's like a riot. We go to their shows unthinkable, but it made us like the coolest. The real bad-ass. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And now like, Hey, these degenerates that six months ago we hated, uh, And literally, Sean and I had gotten to a point where we had some riots in towns because people didn't like us so much. Now, all of a sudden, we're like as popular as can be because we're defending the brand.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
When we were doing DX, Sean and I were, we had wanted to make the group bigger. And we liked Road Dogg and we liked Billy Gunn. Billy Gunn. X-Pac was actually in WCW at the time. Right. So we had said, look, Road Dogg was like Jesse James and Billy was Rockabilly. I mean, it was terrible, terrible shit. And we were like, look, put these guys together as a tag team.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Let them start to do their own thing. And if it starts to get over, when the time is right, we'll put them with us and we'll make the group bigger. But we can build two young stars out of this. They start to work together. It actually starts to work. They call them the New Age Outlaws and it starts to work on their own.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So we're like, we're telling Vince, like, let them do their own thing when the time is right. We'll pull them in, but let them do their own thing right now. And they're loosely associated with us. We would do things like, for example, they were trying to get going. DX was pretty over. They wanted to do a program with New Age Outlaws and the Road Warriors. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
road warriors didn't want to do it they wanted to work with us we just shot an angle with them on tv where we beat the shit out of we shaved hawks mohawk off and all this stuff um they thought road warriors thought they were getting into a storyline with dx what we did was as soon as we started to get the heat we let uh billy and road dog do it and we kind of stood off to the side yeah and they did all the big damage and they ended up road warriors ended up in a program with them which they didn't want to be in right we just we just backed out of it um
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
translates into or relates to this story of what you're talking about. So that group, The Click, were all very tight backstage. It's not like common knowledge. I wouldn't say everybody knows it, but there's a a section of fans that at that time, you know, this is before the internet are really beginning to understand what goes on behind the scenes and who's really tight and who's not.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
so we had had those guys associated with us but not with us sean gets injured sean goes to wrestlemania which is like this nightmare and you know at that point in time sean also was legendary drug problems and all this stuff um but now sean goes away and i think a lot of people thought that was it i'm done you know i'm never gonna get past where i am um whatever
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We talked about, like, let me take the helm. What is your pitch? Sort of, let's do the same group, but let me take the helm. Let's bring in Billy and Road Dogg, New Age Outlaws, which were kind of over on their own now. Let's put them in it. We'll reform DX. And X-Pac, whose contract, he was in WCW. So you bring him back over. His contract was up, and he was dying to get out of there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Because at that point, they were pretty fucked up, the whole group. So he left. The timing was perfect. So he just signed with us. He popped over. So the night after WrestleMania or whatever it is, I go out there and I cut a promo basically on Sean saying like, you told me Tyson was good. He wasn't. You told me you had this. Don't worry about it, kid.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And you didn't, you know, like it was a problem. Well, you're out. I'm in. So now. So you act as if you kick him out of the group. Yeah. Now I'm taking the fucking lead. So now what do you do if you need to start an army? You go find your friends. You go find your blood, right? You find your soldiers. I bring in the new age outlaws. I bring in kid.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Fuck yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, it's the, you know, everybody else is saying this isn't going to work. There's a lot of people, this isn't going to work. It's not going to work. He doesn't, he doesn't have it. Those other guys are, they don't have it. Like it's not going to work. It's Sean was the glue. Sean was the key. Sean was this. So what makes it work? We made it work.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Cause it, some people would say, did it got even bigger? It got even bigger. Okay. It did. It got even bigger. And that was the thing. So the, the, at that point, you know, and we still have China with me, which she was a glue to that thing. But, um,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
sort of in that, in that realm, you know, I knew that night when I went out there to cut that promo with kid and Billy and all that stuff and restart the group, it needed to be like, I needed to go out there and hit a home run or they're going to, Vince is very quickly going to go, everybody's right. And move on. Cause he's believing in it and he wants to see it work. So he's given me the ball.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Um, and we just went out there and, you know, my opinion, we knocked it out of the park and then they went with it and the rest is history, you know, and, um, it was, it was set up well. And, you know, we, we had other people to work with nation. The domination was coming up at that point in time with rock and all that stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So we had all these other people to work with and it just, it took off and, and, uh, we would just do the crazy shit. And then sort of, as we, that, that version of the group started to become popular. And then we get into the WCW stuff where we go on the attack after them. And then it's just game changer.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
These guys are friends and that guy isn't, and they don't like this guy and there's politics with that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yes, and he's also into the whatever it takes. Gloves are off, whatever it takes.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's a moment where... When we're going to do the first attack at WCW, we're going to go – because what they were doing was if we were going into an arena, they would book one of their TV shows like either same time or right before ours so that our ticket sales would tank, right? Booking the club down the street. Yep, yep. Of course. Right? And that was what was pissing us off.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, they were right down the street. It was their show. You roll up with the tank. So we rolled up with the tank. And, um, when we were getting ready to go do it, our show at that point in time, we were like, um, they were live like an hour earlier than we were. And then we were live later. Yeah. So we go there early, we shoot this stuff and we bring it back. And before we leave, um,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So, um, Kevin Nash and Scott Hall make a deal with WCW to leave.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We're all standing in a group because the only one that knew about this prior to us doing it was me. I was on a call with Vince and a few other guys on the writing team. Billy and Dog and Kid didn't know anything about it. They came to me like, I see a military shit out there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
logo on it like what the fuck are we doing and i was like dude i can't tell you yet vince wants to tell you guys but i'm telling it's fucking badass yeah and um it all stemmed off of a phone call where we were on and they were like down the road and vince was pissed and on that phone call was said like i'd fucking like to drive a tank down there and just fucking go nuts and he was like Ding.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Why don't we do that? Right. And but anyway, so somebody says when we get we're in the back getting ready to go and they were like, look, we're going to go down there and do this early, but we're not on the air yet. What if they finish their show and they send a truckload of guys down here to our show? Like we probably should get extra security and have this all beefed up so they can't.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Vince goes, why?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I was like, this is why we're going to win. And because what they did when we got there, we tried to go in their building. We went down the ramp and they put the door down. Wow. And they stopped us. And you're filming this whole time. We're filming the whole time, banging on the door.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's a thing, a Monday Night War going on. Vince is coming off of trials and all this stuff where the business is sort of down. WCW goes on the attack. And one of the things that they do is they start really coming after talent with big big checks and right. Whereas Vince sort of put you into a position where you were participating in the revenue of the business.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
This is so stupid. We had a whole contingency plan of where like... if they come out, if somebody touches one of us, we had like a fake camera and a real camera. If somebody touches one of us, I'm going to go down in the, cause they'll come at me first. I'm going to make such a commotion that everybody will look to me, switch out the cameras, take the real tape and get the fuck out of here. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It doesn't matter.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, but the wrestlers aren't going to. Okay. Everybody will talk shit and stuff like that. But for the most part. They know the business, too. Yeah. And so what's funny is we're outside doing this. Kevin Nash is coming back from the gym with Lex Luger. And he looks at him. He's like, somebody's got a tank outside of the business. Which, really, just a Jeep with a cannon on it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But he's like, what the fuck is going on, man?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
it has become a tank over the years but it was never a tank yeah and um but Kevin said he's like stuck in traffic they're coming back from the gym and now he like pokes his head out the sunroof and he's like looks like Hunter what are they doing you know so he goes in the building now and uh they used to call their production office the war room yeah and uh Kevin goes in the war room and he said like they're all in there talking about the show and stuff and he goes he's like looking around the room and he goes none of you guys are concerned uh
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
with what's going on outside huh and they're like what are you talking about and he goes dx outside the building shooting a cannon off and uh with a loud horn and thousands of fans all around them like none of you worried about that shit and they were like what you know that's how they got informed of it hilarious and then that's when we started coming down the ramp and that's when they shut them do you think other wrestlers in wcw knew it was over at that point i don't know
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I think at that point, it's a funny thing. We were scratching and clawing. I think for the most part, the guys in WCW were less concerned about the company and more concerned about, they're paying me a ton of money and I don't work much.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And at that point, it had started to become, it doesn't even matter if you show up. Your pay is guaranteed. Oh, wow. I'm injured. I can't wrestle. You fast forward not long after that because it was, this was, Austin was champ and Steve and I wrestle in Chicago at the Rosemont, which is now Allstate Arena. And then the United Center is on the other side of town, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They were at the United Center the week before us. Same what I'm talking about them booking, right? We had booked Rosemont. Yeah. They booked United Center like the week before us. Steve and I wrestle in a main event that night. We probably went like 40 minutes. We like, we give them a full on pay-per-view like, cause in the, you know, Rosemont sold out.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like we're, we're all in delivering on everything we do. And so that night we go back to the hotels, a lot of fans there. And I'll never forget people telling us like, dude, you guys killed it. WCW was here last week. We went to that show, like six of the top 10 guys didn't show up. Wow. You know, the main event, was Goldberg versus Big Show. Big Show, I mean, the Giant at the time.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Giant walked out smoking a cigarette. They got in a ring. Goldberg kicked him in the gut, gave him the suplex, and the whole match was like 15 seconds.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So if, if we went to Madison score garden, it was sold out. The gate is this, there's a percentage of that gate that gets paid to talent. That's divvied up amongst the talent, right? There's percentages. So if the business is good, you make more money. If business is down, you make less money. And that's why you protect the business. Yes. And so WCW, they were just paying guys money. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They didn't care. right we were fighting tooth and nail like we're turning this thing around and they didn't care and they were just they were phoning it in and i think at that point shit was so miserable backstage that they were just they were phoning it in wow and and that's you know that's the difference right like at the end of the day so you know we were getting to a place where at that point
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
this might take a little time, but we're going to win this. We'll crush these guys. Wow.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
would you give them it's it's part of the difficult aspect of what we do is you teach somebody to do the moves you can teach them when to do them you can kind of teach them crowd psychology but the charisma and who you are your your character it's like you know in comedy everybody's got like not everybody some people just very funny yeah other people have to have a shtick yeah right and and a gimmick of what they are um and no one can really tell you
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, hey, you know what you should, like, when I was a kid, Bobcat Goldthwait was like a big thing. He was like the crazy voice and all this shit. Like, nobody could go to him and go, you know what you should do?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, you know what you should do is you should affect your voice and do all this crazy shit and stuff like that, right? That was just him. It's really hard to tell somebody how to go do their thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
For us, as we were pulling into the Attitude Era, I say this a lot, Taker used to say to me all the time, as we got to be friends, he would, like, we'd go out or whatever, and then, you know, end of the night, he'd almost always say to me, dude, when you figure out how to be yourself on camera, you're going to make a fortune. And I would always think to him, what the fuck does that mean?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Some of it, yeah. But when you... Even then, after, right, when we start to... Like, that was kind of the him saying, like... Like, DX was way more us. But I still wasn't fully, like... I was trying to get out of the Hunter Hearst Helmsley stuff. I didn't feel like it was right for me just to one day stop and be something totally different. You have to build to it. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So when we get to the end of DX, the run as babyfaces, there's a moment where... I go to Vince, and I'm like, I want out of the group. And he was like, why? I said, I want to turn heel. Austin is white hot. Rock is on his way up, but he's going to be a baby face, a white meat baby face. There's no... So you felt it early on. He's so charismatic. There's no way he doesn't become that baby face.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We need the Darth Vader in this, right? You got two good guys. This is so smart. You need the bad guy. Yeah. I'm confident enough in myself. I can be that bad guy, but I got to get out of this group and I got to make the shift. And the other guys were like... what do you do? Yeah. Yeah. Because you also white hot. You're like, why would you leave this? Yeah. Don't ride this into the ground.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Guaranteed. So, you know, Scott Hall decides he's leaving shortly thereafter. Tevin Nash goes through this big thing where he doesn't want to leave, but they're offering him so much money. And, you know, our schedule in WWE was at that point in time, we were working hard. 200, 250 days a year. We're on the road all the time. Physically grueling.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We're making a fortune on merch and everything else. Don't do this. Like, don't do it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's not even necessarily, obviously everybody wants to be
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
champion at some point at the time of their career or something like that but it's not even about that it's about being on top yeah right like you don't have to be champion you just gotta how do you break through to be like the undertaker one of the guys yep yep you know and and that where your your shit resonates and sticks and stays generationally and all that stuff like how do you get into that place and i knew for me it wasn't while what we were doing was amazing that wasn't
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
that wasn't the setup for me. When I leave the group, now it's a full transition. Now I go to trunks. Now I take my hair down. I wet my hair. I start growing a beard a little bit. Like I start to grow. Now I become what I always envisioned myself being as a performer. Yeah. And
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I sort of realized, like Taker's words were, when you can be yourself, when you can just go out there and be authentic, but the hardest thing in the world to do when a red light is on you and there's 10,000 people there is go out and just be you. Because if you fail, it's you. If you fail, it's you. And it's so... It's a scary proposition. You're naked out there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Of course. If you don't like that, you don't like it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And so that, you know, and that's still, even then that becomes a transition of getting there over time. But it's a scary proposition. But I was all in on, I want to take that gamble and I want to see if I can get to be that guy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So there's a lot of people that do. I just had this conversation with Sean and this will piss off everybody. I just had this conversation with Shawn and I had it with Taker as well, within the last year. Because we were talking about like people helping to guide the business into the next generation and writing and storytelling and all that stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I said it to Shawn first, I said, Shawn, think about your career, everybody that you've run up against in your career. How many people would you say I absolutely 100% get it. Not a portion of it, not a piece of it. Like, get it. Get the modes of storytelling. Get the how to get the most out of something. Get all aspects of what we do. How many people would you say?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And he's like, well, I bet you I could count them on one hand. And that's considering greats in our business and all that stuff. And he's like, I bet you I could count on one hand. I said, I think it would be a struggle to fill up all the fingers on one hand. Really? Wow. Right? Um, it's, it's a different thing and people don't get it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The amount of factors that go into creating something, getting a character, doing all those things. And then it's, it's easy to look at it. And this is all stuff that I learned over, you know, 25 years. What are they? What are they? Bring it down. Like it's, it's, it's just so many things is hard to even put into context because like Every, everything matters.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So why don't you just do this with this guy? This will get him over. Well, you can't do this at this time because this guy is doing this and this doesn't work with that. And this guy got injured and that takes away from this. Oh, by the way, they hate each other. They won't work together. It won't be good. These factors don't work.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'm also getting pressure from the network to do this and I don't have this and we can't do that time wise, right? There's all these factors of, of, You're building out this elaborate set of dominoes set up. And then if one of them comes out, you're going to start all over. Because they all affect each other. And you don't think about it that way. So the amount of...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
thought and being able to see ahead of what's going to happen next is incredibly difficult. And that doesn't mean you're right all the time. It doesn't mean that at all. You could be wrong. You can understand all that, still be wrong 80% of the time, you know, whatever, but it's, it's the feel. Pat Patterson was one of the greatest Finnish guys in our business.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You guys are flying through cages. And in the same business, the best part of what you do is when you're on that stage, when you're in that ring. And that other 23 hours and 20 minutes of the day is the shit you put up with to get to do your job. But guys are doing it. It's grueling. It's relentless.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And, you know, the generation that was just slightly before me of talent that came in when I first came in was all like, you know, as they're teaching you things, you'd be like, let me teach you something here. I learned this from Pat, right? But I was fortunate enough to sit under the learning tree that was Vince.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And when I say learning tree, I mean the things of what to do and what not to do, right? I was fortunate enough to sit around Pat where when Pat was there, every day when we'd finish a production meeting, Pat would be like, what are you going to do? I'm going to get something. You want to meet me in the stands? We'll talk about this show. We'd start putting shit together.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And like, I'm learning all these from all these people. And, you know, Pat would always say the wrestling business isn't here. It's here. Right? And he was the first one to say that to me. He would be like, think about everybody you know in the business. How many people feel it here? Not many. It comes out of here. But the guys that really feel, he's like, they're few and far between.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It is. It is because they can feel when the ebb and flow and change and move and do all those things. And Pat would say to me all the time, there's a lot of guys here that are amazing. They don't feel. This isn't where it comes from from them. And he...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So it's a little convoluted at the time, right? In that moment in time, like I sort of... Vince has now become a full-on character. He's got a faction called the Corporation. Yes. I turn on DX to go with the Corporation, but the Corporation's like this hodgepodge of all these different people, and it kind of really doesn't work out well. It just becomes this mess of stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So you're just trying to navigate. It's like...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
i pop out of this thing that's working and i pop over here but now i've it's like going back a lot of times people think that that stuff like you're you're here so then you move into something else and you just go here you might have to take it very rarely works that way you're here yep and i want to get here but over here you got to go here and then climb back up back up to that sometimes it can work where you go right there but more times than not i
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I feel like whenever there's a complete shift in what you do, you go back and start over at the beginning.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So I sort of get the opportunity. I'm put in that position already. where I'm world champion. You know, this is at a point in time where they're flipping titles around a lot too. It's just different time in the business. But I'm in that sort of mix where I'm being seen in the Austin Rock conversation, the Taker conversation. I'm in that mix. I've been champ.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I can't remember if I was champ once or twice at that point in time, but I'm champ. And Steph, it's a funny thing because people's... thoughts about how this happened are different. I have this really strong creative relationship with Vince. Yeah. I know he has a daughter, but I don't, I've never even really met her.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Kevin gets in a place where they're offering ridiculous money, but he still doesn't want to go. And there's a moment where he tells me, Right when he has to give the answer, I'm home, he calls me, and he's like, I'm not going. I'm staying. I can't do it. And then, like, two days later, we're at TV, and he's like, I just gave Vince my notice. I'm like, I thought you weren't going.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And then she starts to be around the company, but I'm not working with her much or anything like that. But she's in a storyline with another wrestler, this guy Tess. Tess, yeah. And they are engaged to be married. Yeah. The lead writer at the time, he leaves the company in the middle of this. Okay. And, you know, I've heard him say that he knew exactly where this storyline was going.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Just nobody else did.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So when he leaves, there's like this giant gap where like Vince's daughter's engaged with this guy. To be honest, I hadn't even been paying that much attention to that storyline. It's just a concern of my shit more often, right? And I had a great creative relationship with Vince, but so... They so don't know where to go with this thing that they've announced this wedding's going to be on TV.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They have to do a thing where she gets hit in the head with a garbage can and loses her memory and doesn't remember who the fiance is just to buy some time. Right. So they can try to figure out how to get out of this thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So there's nothing... Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But so I know they're trying to figure out a way to get out of this wedding thing. Yeah. And meanwhile, I'm in a storyline with Vince where... Uh, Vince has made it like he's a baby face at this time, right? He is. And he has said like, I can never have another chance at the title. Like he's so pissed off at me, bans me from getting world title shots. And so we're in the middle of the storyline.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So one day I go to him and I'm like, this is thinking about our shit, right? Like, and how do, how do we get back to getting me in that mix after what we've done? And he's like, yeah, I don't know. I'm thinking about that too. And I'm like,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The thing with Steph, I said, well, what if she, you know, right before she's going to get married, she has a bachelorette party, blow it out like some big story on TV. She has a bachelorette party, but I show up and I, you know, it's a different timeframe. I'm making your drink. And while she's unconscious, I said, it's that you have it in Vegas.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I drive her through one of those wedding chapel things. I end up like, nobody knows about this, but I've filmed all of it. And now when the wedding happens, right. When they say speak now forever, hold your peace. I come out and I'm like, hold on a second. She can't marry him. Cause she's married to me. And I show the footage and Holy shit, I've ruined your life.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And now we create this storyline where like, if in order to get your daughter, like this wedding annulled. And so she can marry the other guy. You and I have to fight. And if I beat you, I get the world title shot. If you beat me, I annul the wedding. Yeah. And he's like, God damn, I love it. So that's what we do. Right. And this starts Steph and I now.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So originally, it's just supposed to be a one-off thing. We'd shoot the video in Vegas. Yeah. And... The video's hilarious when you were mouthing it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And he's like, basically, my wife said, you don't either take that money. I'm not raising this kid by myself with that schedule anymore. Like, you take that money. Oh, so they shrunk the schedule for WCW. Yeah, WCW was working, you know, they were mostly just doing TV shows. They were doing some live events, right? But probably the schedule was half.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's utterly ridiculous, but it just works. Right. Yeah. And this is the footage of me out there telling this story. So it's supposed to be just selling.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
She's good. So it's supposed to be this one-off thing. That makes us have the match. I go over, I get my world title shot. She moves on, does the rest of the stuff with the destiny, but at least gets them out of the wedding, right? And now it's the decision whether he's going to marry or not. The first time she goes on TV after this happens, like this is the cynical world we live in.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
She goes out on TV and I'm sitting at gorilla position next to Vince, where we run the show from. And like, I'm not working, I'm in the show, right? At this point, I'm just still a character. I'm helping out heavy with creative and helping produce stuff, but I'm really just as a character on TV.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And she goes out to cut the promo and I'm sitting next to Vince and she goes out there and they are booing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like chanting slut. And she's trying her hardest to be like, yeah, to be this sympathetic baby face and all this stuff. And Vince taps me and he's like, this is so good 20,000 people call your daughter a slut yeah this is money right yeah and uh sorry what are you thinking in that moment i'm a little bit like like holy shit like she's got mega heat
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So he looks back and he goes... And I'm, like, thinking to myself, like, wow, there's, like, there's legs to this thing, like, that we hadn't, at least I hadn't considered. You know, I was just, like, just trying to get to my storyline with Vince, and we throw this thing out there, and there's legs on it, and now we're like, holy cow.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So then, you know, the next week she goes out there as well, all this stuff. So then Vince comes to me, and he's like... what if she, uh, like one of the worst possible thing happens is like, she turns on me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We have this match at pay-per-view right at the moment in time where, holy shit, Vince might actually do this and beat triple H and who turns on him, but his own daughter to join his worst enemy in the moment of time. Yeah. And, and she comes with me and he, like he pitches it to me and he's like, and then like, I I'm so distraught. My world is so turned upside down. I leave. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I leave for a while and you guys run the show like as like the boss, like she's the boss's daughter. So she's got all the stroke. And now you become this maniacal, like tyrant, tyrant talent. That's, you know, world gets the world title. And it's just like out of control, firing people and just whatever, you know, and that's kind of starts a thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But so as this happens, like, I don't know, Steph at all. Sort of. Sort of. Well, I don't, but we're working together, right? So now our storylines are coming.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
but I don't and the thing is she's a sponge for the business right like Steph is like um she wants nothing but to be in this business right so sorry have you talked to her about that moment and what she was feeling is she like her dad where she's like she's thinking the same shit or is she like this she's like oh my god this is the greatest thing ever like they're blowing the shit out of me like you know she's very savvy yeah yeah
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And she's one of the few people, and I would say this as well, and people will think, oh, it's your wife. When I make that small list of people on one hand that get it, she's one of them.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, it was Ted Turner. It was TBS, right? A lot of money, a lot of... And there's a certain point in time where when you're just paying a lot of money and the revenue's not coming in, like, well...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I didn't even think about that line until I got out there. And I was like, oh, I got to say something about, you know, consummating the marriage or whatever. Like this is the worst. I'm talking to her dad. This is the worst possible thing I can say. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
No, I mean, he reacts in the ring, but, like, he's so good. And now, like, we're a full-on Attitude Era, like, where this is, like, he's all in, and he's full character. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, so... Like, I know, like, as we're doing it, I'm like, this is so good. And he knows it's so good. He is crazy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But you're feeling it. This becomes a thing. And the sort of the McMahon Helmsley era becomes like the. the main crux of the story, you know, like a fire McFoley. And I, you know, I end up in a match with him and then get him retired and, you know, make, make him retire.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I just, all this, all this stuff happens, but it's sort of at that point in time, this is how Steph and I get to know each other because she's like, if I have a match, she just wants to be there to hear how it all gets put together and how the, how that's all going to work and everything. So she's around all the time.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
yeah it's a time bomb yeah you know any fool can run a business in the red take a genius to do that yeah so um kevin and scott are leaving sean and i are staying uh there's another guy in the group sean waltman but he isn't at madison square garden but we're doing a show at madison square garden it's their last time at madison square garden they're leaving shortly thereafter and um
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And what's a funny part of the story is she, I'm talking to my mom one day on the phone and she's like, what's going on with you and that Stephanie? I said, what are you talking about? And she's like, I don't know. Like, you're not that good of an actor. I can see it in your eye. Like what's going on there? And I'm like, this is Vince's daughter. Like fucking nothing's going on.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, don't be, don't be crazy. Right. I don't know this at the time, but Steph's mom says to her, like,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Oh, wow. And she's like, what are you talking about? It's one of the boys. Nothing. And she's like, I don't know. I see it in your eyes the way you're looking at him and stuff like that. Like, you sure there's not something that, you know, like my mom, her mom both see it on TV, but neither one of us. Dad got no clue. Steph will say this and I say this.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I believe he started to see it and I believe he actually liked it and was trying to push us at that point. And then there comes a time when we do get together and then there's a time where he takes that away. Like it's going to cause too much problem in the business. And you guys can't, you can't, can't see each other.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. I don't, I'm not like, I don't remember the exact timing of it, but yeah, this is starting to sort of get it. And then how, what's the storyline for tearing you guys apart? There isn't, we're still in a storyline together. Right. But he's just saying personally, put the outside.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
you gotta you guys can't you can't do this and did you guys listen as good obedient soldiers we tried and then it just doesn't you know like when you when you get one something you guys gotta go get it right and so it we tried and i honestly think at that point like you know as you asked earlier like is he just saying this to try to see what you'll do yeah i
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I believe there's a lot of that that he was like, no, you guys can't see each other anymore. Let's see if he really likes my daughter. Let's see what he's willing to go through to get it. And, you know, for me at the time, I'm sort of gambling everything on... You know, when people say like, oh, well, that's how he got to the position and all that shit. Like, no, I'm not fucking... I'm like...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'm gambling. If this doesn't work out, I'm fucked. Like I'm done. But at the same point in time, it's like, you know, when you meet the right person, you meet the right person. And yeah, it becomes this. Yeah, it's just this crazy time. So we're kind of doing this shit on TV and, you know, and now everybody's attitude towards me is changing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, I'm already sort of, you know, I'm going to production meetings before this ever happens. I'm going to production meetings. I'm creative. I'm having creative input with Vince. I'm, you know, people see me all day long. I'm with Pat Patterson talking over finishes and helping with their shit.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Which they don't necessarily see as a good or bad thing, but like they just see, so there's a lot of, whether it's jealousy or whatever that is, right? Oh. Now when the rumor starts that, hey, he might be seeing Steph, that's a whole fucking different ballgame of.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I don't know if jealous is the right word, but I have a mega heat.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Okay.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So, as I was saying a little bit ago, the guy that's going to leave the creative guy, that's going to leave. So at that point in time, I was already having, you know, I was talking a lot with Vince and, uh, Sean and I would talk a lot with Vince on the phone about creative directions and he'd ask our opinions about different things here and there. And, and, um, so I already had that relationship.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sean gets hurt, goes away. Shortly thereafter, the, the, the other writer leaves when he leaves. I go to Vince and say, um, I just remember the TV that we were at where the guy left that day. He just didn't show up that day. He goes work for WCW. And, um, As we're getting ready to leave the show, I go to Vince and I say, hey, man, I know how hard this creative shit is.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sean comes to me during the day and he's like, hey, I mentioned something to Vince about us all going out at the end of the show and having a moment together. And I said, what did Vince say? And he was like, yeah, I guess if that means a lot to you or something like that. And so it was kind of very vague.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And when you're trying to do it by yourself with nobody to bounce shit off of, I can't imagine how hard that is. And he just left you high and dry. I said that we were done that show. I was going home for like three or four days. We would do like 18 day loops on the road or 10 day loops and then go home for three or four and then back out on the road for another 18 or whatever.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So I was getting ready to leave to go home for like three or four days. And I said to Vince, I said, I know how difficult that's going to be. I said, I ain't got shit going on. I didn't have a girlfriend or whatever. I was just going home. And I said, if you need to bounce, whatever it's worth, if you need to bounce some ideas off of somebody, I'm going to be home. And I sort of almost was...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
after i left i was like kind of like that was fucking stupid i don't know i should have said that it was kind of embarrassing like like he needs my fucking hell right but i said it and left and then i went home and like i don't know it's like the next day or day after something like that you know home my phone rings and it's his office and agents like talk to you and i get on the phone with him he's like hey the other day you said uh if i needed to bounce some shit off somebody and you know you were home you got any time right now and i was like yeah
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was just general creative. It was just asking me my opinion.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, I think so. And I think he also just sees, like, for whatever reason, I have a knack for the creative.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I see the bigger picture. Yeah. And... You are the game.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And then shortly thereafter, he comes to me and he's like, hey, what do you think about coming to the production meetings at TV? Like when we get to TV, come to the production meetings. And I was like, I mean, if you want me to. And he was like, look, it's a pain in the ass. You know, like call time for a talent might be 1 o'clock. Production meeting might be at 10 o'clock. Yep.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So now you're there all night. We're coming from another town, right? Yep. If I'm driving five hours from the other town to get to this town, now I got to be there at 10 a.m., not one, right? So different world. He's like, I understand that'll be, you know, tough, but I'd love to have your input in there. And I'm like, okay.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So to me, like, I'm like, well, if he's opening that door, I'm not fucking turning that shit down. So, you know, I'd ride over to the next town with everybody. And then in the morning, I'd be like, hey, guys, I got to be at the building early today. I'm going to go over there at 10 o'clock. They'd show up at one. I'd already have been in the production meeting.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So, and once Pat sees me now in the production meetings, I think at first they were like, why is he in here? You know? And then once we all start to get into it, Vince is really good when he wanted to like include you in shit. So we'd be in the production meeting and he'd be like, what do you think? Me? Do you remember the first thing you pitched? I don't.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But what was weird about it was... It's funny, that's not how I... So what's weird about it is, to the business is... Scott and I are going to wrestle earlier in the show, like a street fight. Yeah. And I beat Scott and the whole thing. And then Sean and Kevin are going to work a cage match for the WWE, F time F, I think WWE title, whatever. And the close of the show.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But, you know, I just give my opinion or whatever. And I'm sure I came across as fucking to everybody else egotistically. What the fuck does he know? Probably said a bunch of really stupid shit, but it was enough for him to say, like, he's contributing here. And then Pat started to sort of like, hey, let's, you know, I got these finishes I got to go over. You want to come help me with those?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, because all the shit that you don't, You just think about your side of it. And then you don't think about all the other side of it and the things that need to happen or how they're shot or camera angles or how they're thinking about this and really what's important. Oh, this is important. It's not even about me in that moment in time. I just need to be small over there and not be seen.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That needs to be the big focus. You just think totally. It's a 360 approach as opposed to just a little slice. Yeah. Yeah, your little slice is different than all of it. Timing-wise, is this before quad injury? Oh, yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Oh, long before that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Long, long before that. So my, my quad injury happens 2001 and, and I completely, my left quad completely like exploded. Right. Like it, my, my capsule exploded everything. So when I get to Birmingham where Dr. Andrews at the time is like, he is the orthopedic guy for like, you know, everybody. Right. So I go see him. And you know, one of the things they tell me is like, well, you have to,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sergio on this right away. Like he was like, I don't even know how you finished this match. Like you have nothing attached. Like it's a, but you shouldn't even have been able to stand up. Right. Um, and you know, we finished that match and everything. And then he's telling me like, look, um, There's nobody in a contact sport like this, an impact sport that's ever returned from this injury.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
If you do it, you'll be the first one. And to this day, he still uses it as a case study. Wow. So he said, like, I'm going to put the pieces back together, but whatever you can do after that is going to be on you. So I never left Birmingham, Alabama for nine months. Wow. I checked into the Embassy Suites Hotel. I went and had my surgery.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, I'll just I'll lead you into what's supposed to happen. So at that point in time, I'm I'm starting to get some momentum going in my career. And there is a plan in place that I am going to win a very. especially at the time, was a very prestigious tournament called the King of the Ring.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Um, I would, I would rehab like the best, this guy, Kevin Wilk is like the best rehab guy on the planet, especially at that time. Um, I thought, well, if I'm going to be able to do this, I gotta be with the best. So I checked into the embassy suites hotel. I lived there for nine months. I would go every day. I would go start, I'd eat breakfast at the hotel. I'd go to the
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Rehab, the second they'd be open, I'd roll in. I'd stay till lunch. I'd go to lunch with Kevin and those guys, the therapists. I'd come back. I'd do a second session in the afternoon when they'd get done at like 5 or 6. I'd go to the hotel. I'd drink a shake. I'd drive to the gym. I'd have the van take me to the gym across the street on like a fucking wheelchair at first.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'd go, I'd train my upper body. I'd go back to the hotel. I'd eat something. I'd watch wrestling tapes until I got tired. I'd go to sleep. I'd get up in the morning and do it again the next day. I did that for nine months.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
No, no, WWE covered my hotels. I paid for my surgery, all that stuff. That's one great thing about the company. They cover everything. But the commitment aspect of it is I didn't, I wasn't taking a chance on not coming back. But at that point, I'm not even really talking to Vince at all.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So what happens is this kind of now puts Steph and I into a position where... this is where we really start to have a relationship because, you know, she comes to see me in Birmingham. Like, obviously we have a relationship. She cares about me. I can't remember if we were at that part supposed to not be together, whatever, but like I'm in Birmingham. She's coming to see me. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That's where it all locks in. Like she's basically, whenever she has off days, she's coming down to Birmingham to spend a day or two with me, not every week, but like here and there when she can. And, um, you know, she helped get me through it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So I go away. When I leave, I'm one of the most hated guys in the business. Um, we had just done a thing where stone cold wanted to refresh on his character. So he turns heel and we're together and we do this thing. We call it two man power trip. And it's us just beating the shit out of everybody. Like we, we have, he's like world champ.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So us coming out there to have a moment together is sort of contrary to the show. Of course. And... But now when the time comes to do this, Scott and I wrestled earlier. We have this knock-down, drag-out street fight. And then now Kevin and Sean go in there. And we're kind of at the end of the show.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I've got the intercontinental title at one point we're tag champs. Right. And, and we're actually, uh, The match where I get injured, we drop the tag titles to another team. That night, that's when I get injured. But we're on this killer run, and we're both like the worst heels there. But I was already that sort of top heel. And and I leave nine months later when I come back.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
For me, it was the biggest pop I'd ever heard. But it was also me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I think it's Darth Vader leaving the franchise for a couple of films.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And then he comes back and you're like, oh my God. Right? Like, yeah. Can we watch this? So what's going through your head? You haven't said any... So pause it just for a second. So understand as a performer... It doesn't matter how big you are. You go away for nine months. When you come back- You don't know if they'll even remember you. Exactly. Yeah, you're like, well, they care.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You're scared to death. And it's funny, I'm backstage at Madison Square Garden and Austin comes up to me. Now, Austin had been out for a long period of time with his broken neck and all that stuff. And Austin comes to me and he goes, what's going on, kid? And I said, just getting ready for this. And he goes, you freaking yourself out? You think they're not going to remember? So he already knows.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You think they're not going to care? And I said, yeah. I said, man, I don't want crickets. Like, fuck, I don't know. And he goes, dude, you're going to blow the roof off this place. He said, have you heard them? Every time they mention your name, they're going apeshit. They've been chanting fucking Triple H all night long. Oh. Oh, I didn't know that. So throughout, there's this excitement.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's a thirst. He's like, you're fine. This is going to be off the charts. But still, I'm like, I hope so. I really hope so. And I'm standing at gorilla position right outside the curtain. Like, I'm next. So they play a thing. The studio, this kid, Adam Panucci, who's an incredible editor, did a package for me about my return. And it was set to U2's Beautiful Day.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And the way the garden was set up in the past, there's a side vom that guys would always stand at to watch the show. Vince would stand at this curtain. His dad would stand at that curtain. That's where they would watch from. And Scott and I were standing there. And we kind of get to the end of the match. And...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And he, he puts the, so he builds this video. It's incredible. They put that out. It runs for the weeks leading up to, and then I'm going to return at Madison Square Garden, which when Vince told me, Hey, uh, we heard you're going to get your clearance and all that stuff. He said, uh, I said, yeah. And he said, what do you think about, uh, returning at the garden. And I was like, holy shit.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like to us, that was the biggest of the big Madison square garden was like our WrestleMania.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So many moments at the garden. And so I'm like, Jesus Christ, that's like a storybook thing. Right. So they do these videos, but we get to that moment and I'm standing at that curtain while they go to... So they play a thing, they play that video and it says, up next, the game, right? The crowd just roars.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They're chanting all during the commercial and I am standing like a fucking idiot at that curtain thinking like... Please don't be silent. Please don't be silent. Like, you know, I'm petrified. Like I'm going to walk out there and they are not going to give a shit, you know?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And then, you know, and then, and then the music hits and, you know, you just, you're just so inside your own head that it's, it's crazy. And, you know.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
At this point, I'm just so, I am out of my mind geeked. Like, almost uncontrollable, so... Oh, that's awesome. Now, for me, this... Like, even just riling up the crowd like this is... This is foreign to me. I'm used to being... I did it when we were in DX, so obviously I'm used to doing it. But to me, this is... I've been a bad... I've been the bad guy now for... For so long. For so long.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, this is... And how does your quad feel? This is just all emotion to me. Is your quad healed up? It's healed. You know, it's a funny thing that you... You can be 100%. You can practice. You can get on the field. You can do all the stuff until you go out there live. You just don't know. So the first few matches, it was a bit. But you're not even doing anything. You're cutting a promo.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
This is a promo, and Kurt Angle's going to come out. I do a little something. I'm basically just cutting a promo saying I'm back, and I'm entering myself in the Royal Rumble. Are you supposed to be a heel at this point? I think we all knew that there's no way I'd come back and I'm a bad guy. Right. And the thing for me is I've never been a good guy without a crew around me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So now I have to do it. And I'm not comfortable as a good guy. It's foreign to me. It's almost like I have to go into the ring and think, what would I want myself to do if I was the bad guy? Huh. What would, what would, wait, wait, wait. If, if I was the bad guy and I was working with me, what would I want me to do? Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. I have to like retro.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sean is kind of looking back at us and Scott says to me, like, are we supposed to go out there? I'm like, I don't know, dude. And then Scott looks at Vince and he goes, are we supposed to go out there? And he's like, kind of like, we're all unsure. And then Scott's like, fuck it. I'm going. And he just goes, right. And I think in his mind, I'm quitting. Yeah. I'm out of here anyway.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's another step in my process because the business at this point is not me thinking it's a feel thing and you're just kind of doing what's right. Yeah. And I almost have to think about it in a way of like, what would I want my reaction?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. What would I want my reaction to be? Yeah. And so I'm not comfortable and it's, I'm just not comfortable as a good guy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
This, I honestly, I know I'm going to walk out there and I'm going to say, I'm back. Yeah. I'm entering myself in the Royal Rumble and then Kurt's going to come out. I have zero, like, I remember thinking about it, like, I just almost can't even lay this out word for word because I feel like I'm going to be so emotional when I get out there. Oh, wow. Whether excited or whatever that is.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Are you holding back tears a little bit? Yeah, yeah. It's just going to be so overwhelmingly emotional for me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
uh given everything that i went through to come back that i don't know i'm going to be able to remember it anyways so i just know i'm back i'm entering the rumble you know and then the kurt shit yeah and so i just kind of say what i'm saying i don't even really can we go to it good thing you had the water bottle if the tears came you could have just and it's a funny thing is that you don't want to show that emotion but the truth is the crowd just wants the emotion you want the real shit oh here it is you can see it
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So they're going crazy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You bring the mic to your mouth and they go even crazier. Yeah. But I also know I got to get off the air because I think I'm the last thing in the show.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The bad guy interrupts and then I be, you know, big turtle.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's no cost to fucking, I'm going. And I'm like, I'm like, well, fuck then. They were kind of looking, waving back at me and I'm like, shit. All right, here I go. So we go out there. And we have this moment. And I mean, the garden sold out and they go ballistic.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So it's a funny thing, and this might be completely off. I have like a theory that, and I don't mean this in a negative way at all. To be the baby face, you have to have you have to be a little bit more selfish. You have to be. And so... Austin was a great baby face, but he's not selfish. It's sort of, he was such a, because his character was a bad guy that they just loved. Yeah. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. Yeah. So it's a little bit different, but you know, you always hear the stories about the top sort of good guy in the business. And there's just a... Because it's all about you. As a bad guy, your job is to make the other guy look good. Keep yourself alive doing it. Keep yourself hot doing it. Keep yourself all that stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But the truth is the biggest reaction that you get as a bad guy is when you give the good guy the comeback.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So I know I do all this horrible shit to this person. The biggest reaction we're going to get, if I'm working with Rock and he's the bad guy, I mean, he's the good guy, I'm the bad guy. I do all this horrible stuff to him. Well, I know when he starts to finally make that big comeback on me and kick my ass, I'm going to fly all over the place for him. That's the magic, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
The bad guy sort of creates that. You're only as, I feel, you're only as good as a good guy in the business as you are the bad guys that you have to work with.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like it's this crazy moment of like most people, I believe in that time, probably in the garden, especially in New York is so savvy to everything. Like they know we're all friends. They get it. Right. And they know they're leaving. And. This is like an incredible, real, real-life moment.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We talk about it all the time, like in the Rocky movies, right? Like, so... In the first Rocky, he just, you know, and Rocky's not about boxing, but it's about overcoming, right? But the bad guy in Rocky is Paul Creed. He's just this arrogant guy. And this guy wants to prove himself against him. He doesn't have to win, but he just has to stay the distance. And he does. They get to the second one.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Okay, but now he has all these things he has to overcome in his life and it's still the same bad guy, but he's got to overcome that. And the first one was a fluke and blah, blah, blah. He overcomes that. Now you get to the third one. Now he's succeeded as the baby face. So what do they do?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They have to make Mr. T the ultimate bad guy that is so mean and so nasty, talks shit about his wife and ends up... Sort of causing Burgess Meredith so much stress, making that he dies. And now Rocky's got to avenge. He just can't fight. He gets a shit kicked out of him. Now he's got to find a way to come back against all that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And when they get to the next one, now he's the champ again or whatever it is. They create a Russian guy. Yeah. Because it's the Cold War and all that shit. But they create the Russian guy that's so bad, they make Rocky befriend Apollo Creed. It's great. Who then gets killed by the big Russian guy and he's got to go to Russia to like... To avenge the loss. Right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's sort of, how can we make the bad guy... to give him something to fight against. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Some of the things that we try to do now, a lot of it in our creative is like, I've always believed bad guys have to be justified. Might, might be fucked up reasoning, but they have to have their, their way of looking at it is really warped. Yeah. They've got to be justified. They can't just do like, you know, like, why are you doing that? Like, cause I'm a bad guy. You know what I mean?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Plus they were already trying to, they were trying to put that story out there to normalize it for the government. You know what I mean?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Probably one of the big moments where it actually happens. So we do it. When we come back, everybody's gone. Like everybody. And like, usually there's at the garden, like there's people back there, the agents, all this. So we come back, everybody's gone. I'm like, that's not a good sign.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I've got to find a way to... And now... And John's reasoning for that is like, fuck, for 20 years, I've had to listen to you people tell me Cena sucks, let's go Cena, Cena sucks. I've had to, you know, you shit on my ideas, you shit on these things, all this stuff like that. Every turn I've tried to make, and all I've ever done is give you everything I have, and it wasn't enough.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You always want more. It's like, so there's this... place of justification where you can go like, I kind of get that. Yeah. He's done with it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. He should be the most beloved guy ever in anything. And now in his mind, he's protecting the business. from somebody like Cody, who in his mind is just copying him and phony going into this thing, and they love him for it, and he's angry about it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, they love him for this, and wait, you guys, I gave you everything. Why did I get the love? Exactly. So you get the resentment. She's justified in all of it, and it's kind of what works with the story, no matter how... And look, I'll say this from a...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
a bold standpoint it would have been so easy for john who's making movies and is one of the busiest people i know to say look i'm coming back for a year let's just give me a belt i'm gonna go out there and do my greatest hits yeah and people will love it and i'll sell some merch and then it'll be done and i'll say thank you very much and i'll ride off into the sunset yeah he could have very easily done that but when we threw the heel idea at him he was like
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Fuck yeah. He jumped at it. Yeah, like, man, this is challenging to me. I love the challenge. When we pitched it, I got off the phone with John And, you know, he seemed very excited. But within, like, the next five minutes, I got, like, six texts from him. You know what I mean? Where I was like, oh, my God, he's in. Oh, and then started pitching ideas.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, he's like, he couldn't stop thinking about it. And he's just, he had to talk to somebody about it because he was on a movie set. So he just kept texting me about it. And I was like, oh, and this has piqued his interest. And, you know, it's cool to see John... He's been gone and in and out for a long time. If you're doing that, you're not that same level to see him so...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
engaged and so like passionate about this now and what he's doing and the whole thing. It's, it's so cool to watch. So cool.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's funny that Nick Kahn, who's a president of the company with me... Shut up, Nick. I like Nick, man. He's the best. He's absolutely the best. Like, he's really... I couldn't do this without him, but, like, he's the best. But... He always has this thing like the most charismatic guy wins, doesn't matter. Doesn't matter your policy, doesn't matter anything.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Whoever the most charismatic guy is in the debate wins. And you can historically look at that and it's pretty accurate, right? And I think Trump's ability as an orator, as like him or hate him the way he does it, but he's... He's charismatic in so many ways. Um, and like, I think he likes getting under people's skin. I think he likes generating. I mean, he plays a great heel the way he does. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But so Sean goes and talks to Vince and Vince says, well, that was a lot different than what I thought it was going to be. And Sean said, hope I was okay. And he said, well, did that mean something to you? And Sean goes, met the world to me. And he goes, then I'm okay with it. And we left. And we used to stay in, at the time, we stayed in Newark. And there's a place, a diner.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's, it's just, it's, it's, it's amazing. And it's genius. And it worked in our business there. Do I think he got that from our business? I think he innately understands that. It's been his whole life. You think about that. There's a lot of billionaires in the world, I suppose. Why was he the most famous one?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Why was he the one that was in People magazine every week and with everybody under the sun? Why was he seen as the epitome of that
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
you know that that billionaire sort of status and all that stuff because of his charisma and his character and who he is and the way he can speak about it and do all those things he just captivates people and i think it's why he is where he is also understanding heat and and i thought the vince dog did a good job of explaining this like heat isn't necessarily everybody loves you
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's just energy towards you. Realistically. Yeah. That is the, the, you know, heat is that everybody hating you, but like in our business, our parlance. Right. But like you can't have heat as a, as a baby. You can, but like, it's, that's not normally how we, we would just say the baby faces, man, he's over. Oh, so heat is only a negative thing. Sort of. In our business anyways.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Negative meaning sentiment. It's a positive thing, but it's about someone acting negatively. Like, man, he's got a ton of heat. That's me saying, man, that heel is over. As a baby face, I would say that baby face is like, he's over. Cody Rhodes is over. Drew McIntyre's got a lot of heat. Right? Got it, got it, got it, got it. Both very over. So it's a different...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, especially if they do it well, right? The hardest job right now to me in the business is making a baby face that everybody loves. Because... Everybody's got something they like differently. And so if you're too good of a good guy, they're just like, Bambi Pambi, like, you know, goody two shoes, right? And they hate you for that. It's hard. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So it's hard to keep the majority of people liking a good guy for a long period of time. That's why like a CM Punk is so, he's so popular because he's kind of not a baby face.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's like anti-authority. He's an anti-authority, anti this, anti that, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Punk... same with seth same with roman same with cody like yeah roman too they can verbally get all that reaction that you need like they almost don't have to ever wrestle on tv or do much stuff on tv because they're they're characters such and they can talk you know punk can talk you into just about anything on the stick he's great did baby faces last longer in different eras
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, because the business was set up differently. So like in the generation prior to this, so like Vince's dad, Vince senior, when he had the company, like, you know, he would have Bruno as champion or Backlund as champion. And then he would bring in heels sort of, it was a heel factory, right? Like a heel would come in. So, uh,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We all drive back. If we were doing the Garden, Long Island, all that stuff, New York was a big hub. We'd go stay in Newark at the airport and just make the balance. So you could stay in one place. Yeah. So we went back, we all had dinner together at this diner and stuff like that. And we were all like, well, that was crazy. What just happened and all that shit. And, um, you know, big moment.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
George Animal Steel or Stan Hansen or whoever the heel was would come in. They'd beat up the number two good guy to get heat on them. Then they'd get their way up to like Backlund or Bruno. Then they'd Do, you know, two or three around the horn with him, Madison Square Garden, do all the stuff, all the big clubs, do all that stuff, get all that out of it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Then once they blew that off and he was done with Bruno, he'd go back down to the number two guy who would now get his revenge overcome. That guy would leave. He'd go to another territory. Another bad guy would come in and then cycle it out and repeat to some degree.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
People always want to move. There's a saying in our business, people want to see you do well. They just don't want to see you do too well. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's on us to try to keep it, right? Yeah. But yeah, at some point, he'll probably get to a place where they're just... You know, look, John was... White meat baby face for a long period of time. I just saw him do an interview the other day where he said like, I don't remember what WrestleMania was like 22 or something like that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He and I wrestled in at WrestleMania in Chicago and I was bad guy and John was the ultimate good guy and I was the big bad guy at the time. But as we built that, no matter what we were doing, the more I beat up John, the more they liked me. The more John would try to make comebacks, the more they were booing John. And even in the match, it was like 50-50, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I remember having a conversation with John about it because it was bugging him. It was just starting to happen. And I remember saying, like, ah, who cares? You're the Yankees and the Red Sox all in one package. Yeah. It's sold out, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's a point in time in that where, yeah, you just start to go, man, that's not the reaction I'm trying to get. I'm not trying to make them say Cena sucks or anything else, but yet there they go with it, and I'm doing all the right things. They're just, for whatever reason, starting to joke on it. Well, maybe that's culture, right? It is. I truly believe that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Look, name somebody in pop culture that has been popular forever. No one says a bad word about him.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And even just in saying that, you've just made half of the population love him even more.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And because of who he is outside and all that stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's tough.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah, 100%.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So the next day I'm off the next day, I'm going to, I'm driving up. I lived in New Hampshire at the time, driving back up and, uh, As soon as I get home, there's a message from Vince's office, his secretary saying, Vince would like to see you first thing in the morning tomorrow. And I'm like, fuck. Like, this isn't going to be good. Like, he ain't calling to go like, dude, wonderful job.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
like any picture of Keanu he's like on the subway with his hat on he's like he's fighting the actors that need the attention every second people start to sour on them a bit when you see them constantly at TMZ you see them constantly in the paparazzi you see them all this stuff and it becomes too much you become desensitized to it then you start to be like fuck that guy's bullshit and you're gonna fuck up and you start to turn on it yeah and I do think that that longevity is part of scarcity as well
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And that wanna come at him in a way that sort of they feel like, oh man, he's getting screwed over there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's like something unjustly unfair. Yeah. Yeah. You have to try to create that. It's the most, I say it all the time, it's the most difficult thing in our business to do is create somebody that is universally loved and keep them there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I would be crowned King of the Ring, which would then launch me into a program or an angle with Shawn Michaels, who was champion. I think at the time when they brought it up, he was either champion at that time or was going to be champion by that time. And I was going to sort of escalate myself up into that higher level of being a heel, a bad guy. And Sean was a babyface champion.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You just have to tell them, like, I think, you know, Hey, let's, let's cool this down for a little bit. Let's step you out of it. And let's, you know, and there's always, you know, a lot of times we don't even, it's not our call. Cause somebody will get injured or something will happen. And you're just like, this was a kind of a, you never want to say that to them. Like, well, you got injured.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was a good thing. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I say this all the time. He would show up with like this massive entourage, everybody hooting and hollering and just crazy and all that stuff. And, uh, we'd talk for a little bit and then he'd be like, all right, you want to get down to work? And I'd be like, yeah. And he'd whistle or something. And he'd be like, all right, business, everybody out. And everybody would stop talking.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Anybody that stayed would stop talking. Everybody else would get out of the room. It was like a laser focus. Like, and like the first time we trained together, we did like two hours or whatever. And, uh, then I had to go on the road and then I came back, I think to like Vegas or something like, and, uh, We get same thing. Everybody's there. He tells everybody to get out.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I go, all right, I just want to review what we talked about last time. He goes, can I say it to you? And he like went on for like 20 minutes and told me like everything. And I was like, damn. All right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You know, he's like a huge WWE fan growing up. Of course. That's where the whole Money Mayweather thing came from. Yeah, that makes so much sense. He had that conversation with me about like, look, I knew Pretty Boy Floyd was only going to get so far. You can make the argument that I was the greatest boxer, but the real argument is what's the greatest box office and how do you make that?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I need to create a character and I need an avenue in which to sell that character. He created the character and then he went and sold 24-7 to HBO. And then that was the avenue in which to sell the character.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, is my day off? I got to, you know, I got to go there. So I like literally turn around, drive all the way back, go back to the office the next day. And this is the meeting where like, Everybody's freaking out. And Vince was even putting it on. I wasn't so sure that he was upset with it. Everybody else.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And the genius of what he did was not only make people hate him, but I will make you believe this other guy might have a chance. Yeah. All these guys. This is. This guy's got an unorthodox style, and Floyd's starting to get older. He's showing you flaws in his buildup of 24-7. He's showing you the flaws. There's too much family drama going on. He's not focused. He's not training right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He's eating like shit. All these things. Meanwhile, they're showing Ortiz or these other guys. He's looking incredible. Incredible.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You're like, I walked him to the ring. Right. So for the Marquez fight, the ring is one of the craziest things ever. First of all, I'm backstage with them. I go, I show up and they're like, Hey, champ wants to see it. So I go on the back and he's laying on the couch watching basketball game. I tell him, he's like, what's up?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And you know, we talked for a few minutes and then I'm like, all right, man, I'm gonna get out of your hair. Let me go back out here. And he's like,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He's like, I'm just sitting here.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Hang out. So I'm like, okay. So I sit down for a few minutes. We talk a little bit. As soon as he's breaking the conversation, I'm like, all right, man, I'm going to get out of your way and let you do a thing. He's like, I'm telling you, man. I'm just sitting here. I said, well, I know it's game day, man. I know you got shit to do.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He's like, if I haven't done all the shit I need to do before today, I've already lost. I've done everything there is to do. Ain't nothing going to change it now. I'm going to put my gloves on a little bit. You sit through the whole thing. I'm going to start to warm up. Then I'm going to go out there and fight. Simple as that. And like, okay. I sat down and he just went back to watching the game.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like he was Saturday on his couch. And then the other crazy thing was we sit there. I sit there. Uh, at one point he's talking shit to like Bernard Hopkins. He's in the corner. Marquez is throwing punches at him and he's leaning back talking shit in between Bob and we've been talking shit to fucking Bernard Hopkins, which I'm like, Crazy. Yep.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They get us up in the last round to walk us into the ring. And so, like, we're in there, like, just 10 seconds after it's over. And he's walking back towards us. The bell rings. They get me in the ring. He's walking back towards us. And as he's walking back towards us, I kind of look at him, and he's, like, very lightly covered in sweat. Like, very lightly.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He's not, like, he wasn't working that hard. And as he's walking, he goes, I just motherfucking beat Pacquiao twice. Right.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
He understood it. That ability. How many people did he make you believe this is the guy? Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was unbelievable. Like, that was the thing. And he made it seem like, oh, Canelo's going to kill this guy. And then he walked in there. It made me feel like the part when Canelo throws a big wild punch and he looks over there to see, like, who are you trying to punch? You know, like, just...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But that's the shit why people, every time they wanted to see him, somebody please shut this guy up and knock him out. And then he would, you know, just go in there and it was almost like it was easy.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And you have to understand all the producers and agents backstage that help with the show and everything are a generation before. So they're of the generation of protect the business at all costs. Bad guys don't ride with good guys, right? To some degree. They all go nuts when they see this. And now... Kevin's leaving. Scott's leaving.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You know, it's a funny thing. Our business, you can make our business so complex.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
the truth is is the same stories have been being told since the beginning of time yeah bad guy good guy good guy fights bad guy bad guy does something terrible to the good guy i think good guy makes a comeback hopefully good guy wins if you want to tell a good story make people keep coming back sometimes you got to have the bad guy win so that you get to right like i use that as sometimes the there's uh we'll be writing a show and we get to the end and you know there's
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
People that filter through the show. So one of the producers will read the show and he'll be like, I'm just going to say this whole show is heat driven. Like every bad guy goes over. Every bad guy looks good. The whole thing is bad guy, bad guy, bad guy. Might not be the best live experience. And I'm like, Empire Strikes Back, dude, we're good. Right? Today's the bad guy's day.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And we're good with that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Look, sometimes you're wrong, but the truth is, you know, you can't, you can't judge the story you're being told by the moment in time you're in and how people are reacting to it. Because hopefully if you're smart, you know where the story's going. And if you believe in the story and the payoff, you're going to go through times where people are like, this sucks. I don't like this.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And you're okay with that. Yeah. Yeah. Because, you know, most people are saying this sucks. I don't like it, but I'm going to tune in next week and see if they fix this or whatever, because it's terrible. How long can you stretch that out? Yeah. You know, and that's the thing. And look, I'm not going to say we're always successful at it. Nobody's got a hundred percent batting average.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I like to think we're pretty good at it, but you cannot panic.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Rock says it all the time. You know, when he'll come in and they'll like, that was stupid. Rock did this thing. And he was like, just shut up and enjoy the ride. Because he knows where it's going. Yeah, or we know where we're going to get it to, or we're confident in the fact that we will get this places it needs to go.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And to those producers and agents, well, look, it looks bad for Vince. It looks like the inmates are running the asylum and he doesn't have control over these guys. This group, the clique, is doing whatever they want and they spit right in your face. And if you don't do something, it looks bad. It's a disrespectful type thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Sometimes you're in the build for something and, you know, people don't take that. Like, well, I wish they would have done this.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
No, I think because usually if you, and that happens for sure, but like usually, here's the beautiful thing about our world. The internet's not real life, right? And the bitching and the fucking complaining that is on there, it's not real life. like we can, you could, you could read the internet and it'll sound like this thing is dead.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's not, you know, like, and I'll use Cody as the example, Cody's already jumped the shark. He's dead as a baby face. He's like, really? Cause I don't know. I'm in an arena with 10,000, 15,000 people every night going to ape shit for me selling the most merchandise. He's like, yeah, like, but the sure. Whatever you want to say on the internet, that's the, that's the golden rule.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
So the beautiful thing for our business, unlike a movie or a TV show or, even a book or anything else. It's like, we have a focus group.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
You go out and you do stand up, right? Like you do your stand up for a year before you do the TV special or whatever. Because you're trying out all the shit and you're seeing what works and what doesn't. If you're terrible at your job, you just do it the way you want to do it. It bombs.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
If you're good at your job, you tweak things, you change things, make it seem fresh still all the time, but you're, you're shifting along the way until you get to where it's just right. And then you go put it out there. Right. We, as we begin to tell these stories, you, No. This is working. This is not working.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And whether people are bitching online or people... The reaction of people live... Is what you can trust. Right? Right. Jey Uso's terrible. It's never going to... What are they doing? They're yeeting. Dude. They're yeeting. Again, merch. Reaction in the crowd. Everything he does. Like... Yeah, it's just opinion of a few people.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Hey, man, that didn't go the way I thought it was going to go. They didn't take that or they didn't react to that or that didn't click the way we thought it was going to. What if we do this instead? And you pivot and you move, right? That's all the time. That's being a good storyteller.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That's being, you know, and I think in our business, our business slightly has changed now because of TV and the live nature of it and stuff. So the guys in the back as they're doing this, a lot of them put their matches together beforehand, move for move, and then they go out there and they do it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
my generation was taught differently and was a bit more like, um, have a premise of where you want to go, start to go there. But if it's not working, you have to go in a different direction. You can do that on the fly, you know, um, not as a brag, it's just a different generational thing. So like I've gone, I wrestled taker at WrestleMania one time and like, um,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I don't think Vince took it that way, but I think that's what he was. He always had a saying, perception is reality. And perception amongst them was this. And so, you know, as soon, I knew, I wasn't sure. I'm like, well, I'm either going to get fired or this is going to be like, I'm going to get like, this is going to be heavy. And, um, What a drive from New Hampshire. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
we sort of put together the finish and it was, you know, like, I don't know, the finish was probably 15 minutes long or whatever. We knew where we wanted to go with the finish. And then we'd sort of put it together. And now it's early that day. And I went to take it. I'm like, Hey, we get the,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
the finish finally down now you want to talk about the rest things like they just call it out there wow all right that sounds fun i wonder if it's more believable that way i feel like it is because you don't know yeah yeah and there's times sometimes when you have all that stuff laid out where it starts to look dancing and people are just going to choreograph right to the next thing you want to be like jazz like improvising yeah i think that's the trick like in your business
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I would imagine that comedians start to get to a place where they know the reaction and then they just start to go with what they believe is going to happen.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like I'm always more impressed with a comedian that's like doing something and then somebody heckles them and he like just goes on for six minutes and rips this person a new asshole and does all this stuff that, you know, like there's no way that was planned. You know what I mean? To me, that's, Yeah. It's off the cuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But the other one where you just off the cuff, you have it and you're just that to me.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That's what I was going to say. To me, then the art form becomes when you have it down to a science, but you still go out there and make it seem like it's the first time you've ever said,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
They gave me something. Exactly. Yeah.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I think there's stuff in our business where sometimes talent, like, I don't understand why, like, look, why am I not the cop guy? I hear my reaction I get every night. You hear the reaction you get every night. You're not out there for the other reaction.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's different, and it's tough. You don't need to explain that to somebody. It's tough, right? It hurts their ego. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It wasn't as big as you thought it was. No, it was. I heard it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Before I got into the wrestling business, trying to get into the wrestling business, I ran gyms where I lived and all that stuff. And there was a guy that... you know, he was trying to be a standup comedian and I don't, you know, I don't think he ever made it. And I never heard of him after that, but like he was taking, there was like, it was at the time when, um, like comedy was really taken off.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. Late, late eighties and shit. Like comedy was huge, like just massive. And he was trying to do it. And he was like taking, uh, like a class. I remember him telling me like, and I'm, I'm enrolled in this class with this guy who's like a famous comedian. I don't remember the name. And, uh, I was like, fuck you take him. comedian classes.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But then I was like, well, I guess sort of like what we do, right. Like what I'm trying to do. And, but he would tell me, you know, he'd come in and he'd be trying shit out on me all the time, but then he'd be telling me things that he learned about like callbacks and, you know, different things. And it's the same, it's the same thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We're just physically, you, you, you go out there, comedians go out there and they tell a story and, And over a long period of time, they tell this story and the bits and pieces of the story that ebb and flow and bring it back to the beginning. And when you don't know the jokes come in and the guy's telling a story, they think, wow, all of a sudden he got real serious.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Then he hits you with the thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Yeah. It's, it's the distract. It's the right. Like all these things are the same in our business. Just the, the medium of which we paint the picture is different.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Logan... If a top star comes to me... Don't work me. Now he's getting all diplomatic.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, okay.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Okay. And I'm a big believer in like, if you're going to do something that in your mind, you know, it's kind of fucked up. Like you cannot cry afterwards with whatever comes about from it. Like you made the decision to do it. So if the, if the ramifications of that are way worse than you thought, well, that's on you. You made, you made the choice. So, um, Yeah, it's a pretty heavy meeting.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well put it this way. If, if somebody, I know that he knows you, I know that you guys know each other to a degree. So him saying to me, Hey, I know where's he sitting. Oh, he's over behind Cole.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
yeah hey could you move him over here because he doesn't he wants to be able to address hard camera and still oh so that's how you get the look to you right so to me i'm like okay well they're friends like nothing like he's not going to go over to you and go like literally the week and i think he fucking set me up because like literally yeah no no he sent me an invite to his fucking wedding
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, I give a fuck. Well, you do realize he's a guy that sort of. plies his trade on getting clicks and downloads and records.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
No, well, let me tell you something. He kind of pulled you into it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
No, no. Look, the AJ part was already planned to happen. I didn't know he was going to do this stuff with you beforehand.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
What would Vince do? That's what I'm saying. I am saying that if I see a celebrity in the front row of your stature, that if something might happen, it's not terrible for us. Wow. Okay. Good to know. Whether you come out shining or whether it's a little bit at your expense, it's not a terrible thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I just feel like that if we go to Madison Square Garden again, I'd like to invite you. And then whatever happens to Logan at that event from you is just... All I'm saying is I have a way of getting in there without the metal detectors.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'm all for it. Look, WrestleMania is two weeks away. I'm busy. I can't go to something like that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
That's Easter weekend. Which is what a guy would say if he was going to show up unannounced.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'll definitely 100% be there.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I have. This is the beautiful thing about our business is people will debate this shit all day long. I say this about our business all the time. If you don't like it, there's nothing in the world I can say to you to make you like our business. If you do like it, there's no explanation necessary. You just get into it, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And Vince is like, look, it's unfair. It's all these things. But Kev's leaving. Scott's leaving. I can't do anything to them. Kid wasn't there, but Shawn was there. But he's the WWE champion.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But as into it as you are, there will be moments in time in our show where I could say, like,
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
somebody will say like hey those two really got at it and i was like no not part of the show and then they'll be like no no no i saw that one i was there and i know that he did one thing that pissed the other guy off and then it got real for a second with those two when you're not sure yeah it's like trying to explain vagina to gay guys i'm listening Or you could flip that scenario, too.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
But some of us have been in there. Or dick. I've got one, but I'm not. I don't know that I'm buying the explanation.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I say this a bunch. Well, look, you have to play to what is acceptable in the world. Because you can say, like, in the attitude era, well, a lot of that stuff wasn't acceptable. No, yeah, it was. My kids were going to school and saying it every day and doing all the stuff and wearing the shirts and all the things, right?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Like, there are certain things that are acceptable, certain things that are not in the moments in time. We have to work with our partners, obviously, and what can work and what can't work, and there's leeway in that. But as a guy that sat...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
you know, front row and center as the attitude error was becoming, and then what it would become were in that same zone of pushing the envelope, pushing the envelope, but also of mainstream acceptance of like, it's, you feel it on my Netflix every day. You feel it. Yeah. It's, it's, you know, and it, and it's global, right? We are, you see us now kind of
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
we've always been a global product, but now is sort of the first time that I think we can capitalize on that, where we can go any place on the planet.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
There's not much I can do to him. So you're like, I guess we call it a wash, right? We just move on, huh? Yeah, and he was like, well, you know, here's the thing. A lot of people are saying I should fire you. And I'm like, okay, what are you saying? And he said, I don't want to fire you. I think you're incredibly talented. I think I want you here. But, you know, I've got to do something.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It was unbelievable.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
part of the show they don't know how to do it outside this year we'll be in france and paris that'll be off the charts we're gonna go to perth again um in australia you know the middle east is always off the charts um you know and we haven't even touched south america go to mexico like all these things that are upcoming and we will be doing um and you've got to go to the middle east and then tell them all that sammy zane is really from ireland the biggest heel turn ever
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's one of the things, like, it just depends on who's an entertainer and who's... Oh, so it's a possibility. Yeah, there's always that possibility. Look, Brock Lesnar, Ronda. Of course. There's always that possibility. We're always wide open to it. Um...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I think there's also possibilities that as we are recruiting now D1 athletes coming out of colleges and our NIL program and everything else of how we're recruiting, there are people that are coming into us that want to do WWE-style entertainment for a living, but are like... I might want some of that UFC stuff. Look, I'd dip my toe in that water of taking a shot at UFC if I could, and...
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
you know whether that's realistic or whether it's not like some of those guys have massive amateur backgrounds and have trained in that stuff but are looking to do what we do but would also throw their hat in that ring so who knows you know the the I would say never say never on that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I would say the bigger collaboration between us and UFC is what you're seeing happen now where we're like going into areas and sort of doing like a... almost like a weekend kind of takeover thing where we go in with... I'm making this up, but a SmackDown on a Friday night and then UFC's in there on a Saturday and then we're in there with something on a Sunday and then we do a Monday Night Raw and, you know, we've gone in there and done this whole sort of weekend takeover of stuff.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I think seeing... Bits and pieces of things like that. And with the inclusion also within TKO of pro bull riding and all that stuff now, there's just a lot of avenues. It's an entertainment conglomerate. Yeah, there's a lot of avenues on that sports and entertainment. And that's going to breed crossover for sure. Yeah, and live events.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It's funny to me that people make sometimes the distinction between sport and everything's entertainment. The news is entertainment. It's all entertainment. And what I love is that we are sort of the ultimate variety show and we can do a bit of everything. So we can have, you know, stuff can be serious. It can be emotional. It can make you angry. It can make you laugh. We can have comedians on.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
We can have musicians on. We can have Bad Bunny wrestling in a match. He's awesome, by the way. Incredible, right? We can have Travis Scott there. We can have you there. We can have... We can include so many things and be a part of just everything. And I think you see that resonating across society where as big as it was in the Attitude Era, we were still seen as like this crazy offshoot thing.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
It very much is just a part of culture and culture. um, a part of everybody's sort of everyday vernacular. The amount of times I see, I hear our insider terms being used in the regular world. Oh, kayfabe, babyface. It's crazy. This is just common parlance. It's just jabroni.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Does he have a mustache?
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
and so he goes you know you were going to win king of the ring that's going to go away you're going to do this program with sean that's going to go away you are going to and this is one of vince's favorite sayings but this was the time when he said it to me when i hit the artist he said you are going to have to learn to eat platefuls of shit and like the taste of it damn and uh Okay.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Well, there he is standing outside the Performance Center, so clearly he's on the radar. Of course, yeah. He's definitely... I will, you know, look, in my position now, like, I have a team of people that are across all this stuff, so I guarantee you they know who he is. God bless. We'll get eyes on him. Tommy, you're going to make everyone feel invincible, bro.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
Thank you. Appreciate it.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
And I said, so the one thing, you know, I was accepting of it, obviously hit hard, but I was accepting of it. And I said to him before I left, I said, here's a, cause he said, but if you want to leave, he said, I understand this is not all on you. If you want to leave, if you think you can get a job with Turner, with those guys. If you want to leave, I understand that.
Andrew Schulz's Flagrant with Akaash Singh
Triple H: WWE Champs are Selfish, John Cena’s Heel Turn, & How Vince McMahon Never Loses
I'll make it where there's a loophole in your contract. Oh, that's decent. And you can get out. Did you consider it? No, I didn't. I had come from there. Yeah, of course. Right? So before I came in, so I kind of knew, even though it had risen dramatically and their business had gone through the roof, I was like, I don't want to be there. I'm here for a reason.