Taylor Kitsch
👤 PersonPodcast Appearances
And then we'll fight, work our way, roll, work our way.
Take my trident then.
I'd do it all over again, which is a beautiful thing.
Like, it's a very... It's an emotional reaction that, you know...
phrase his life and the other character Rafe's character he gets his trident taken but it's that's one thing we were talking about earlier I'm just like it's so fucking gray and in these really split decision moments that you have and these guys aren't fucking robots out there it's like they're emotional they're fucking trained like better than anybody but at times they have to make these decisions and
And then he's like, okay, find a rock.
that is like okay you're gonna put those girls on the black market or sell them or put them in the sex trade you don't get to live anymore i'm gonna do that but that's a beautiful thing too yeah and people can relate to it because totally if you were in that scenario what would you do and most people would like to believe that yes you're not going to live anymore yes exactly we have these talks on set all the time you know american primeval
We can romanticize the 1850s, or at least I did at the beginning of, like, this guy's a fucking mountain man.
Like, he's a motherfucker.
Like, if you see me on the river in 1852 and you're like, I want your jacket.
you're gonna just come up and kill me and take my jacket.
And then that war cry.
Like that's how fucked up the 1800s were back then, lawless.
And so we started shooting and I was like, we're shooting at 10,000 feet up there and you're cold and we're still spoiled, obviously.
Your trailer's 50 feet away, but it's like,
Which I'm so proud of.
I'm like, there's nothing in me that would want to be in the 1850s.
I worked on that forever.
I mean, when you go hunt, Utah, back country, wherever you're going, you're going to be in the shit.
And I had talked to Pete about it for months before, but we're just rolling so quick.
It's going to be beautiful and quiet.
You would literally just be out there and there's a couple giraffes.
Perspective sinks into you.
You're in the moment.
Then you're on a flight to New York in two days.
And I told our A camera, Brett, to get in tight.
It restores your soul.
And I think for me too, it's so good for the brain for all those reasons.
But also it's just like, if I'm sitting around feeling sorry for myself or whatever it is, bored, it's like, it's your fucking fault if you're bored out there.
There's a thousand hikes, go get into wildlife, go to the national park, go for a fucking walk, anything.
Fix your perspective.
After an intense roll or whatever it is, once I land in Bozeman, man, I get on the bike or whatever, go fly fish.
I mean, any shot with Pete is fucking tight, which I love.
It's like, it's a beautiful thing.
I just bought a $35 fucking protein shake before I came here.
Yeah, it's like, I don't know, probably like koala DNA that's going to give me hard for the next seven days or something.
And I'm like, B, I'm going to do this war cry, so don't go down to him.
Oh, you're adding protein and stuff?
But I was like, what's happening?
It's just a terrible way to live.
It's not good for the soul.
I mean, nothing's being filmed there anymore.
It's just weird, right?
And he's like, gotcha.
And so when I did it, Pete finally called cut and he goes, what the fuck?
What the fuck is happening?
i don't know either i'm not a big fan of la yeah yeah i lived here for 17 years did you love it here i did yeah yeah i love the lake life it's nice it's amazing it's a chilled city too it's like genuinely good people here yeah there are normal people yeah you know yeah in la everybody is like a failed actor want to be an actor trying to get on a reality show
Everybody's got something.
And they want something from you.
I was not fucking ready for that.
So this was really fun.
Thanks for having me.
It was a huge show for them.
We're number one right now.
Thanks for having me.
And, uh, it's those moments though, that, that he allows you to just go, you know?
When he's dialed, he's like lone.
He was just so present and early.
And he just, I mean, we were surrounded by seals as you know, every take and, uh,
I don't think you could do what we did to in prep of just like no producers, no Pete, no nothing.
And I think they're gone now.
It's just every morning, 7 a.m., 8 a.m.
We're up in the mountain with seals, with Ray Mendoza and amazing guys.
And we first week is like first day, man.
I'm Canadian, so I haven't shot a fucking gun in my life.
The first time you ever shot a gun was Lone Survivor?
But we pull into this like opening and he's like, there's going to be some deer on the right.
So first, Chris Caracci, who's a fucking legend, a man's man.
And I think he was like one on the first team, SEAL team units.
And the deepest voice you've ever heard in your life.
And like a fucking man.
And he took me under his wing.
And so our first day was live fire.
And Karachi took me aside.
He's like, hey, it's you and me.
And I'm like, let's go.
And I'm like as fit as I ever have been.
I was running Town Lake doing the MRF every fucking three times a week with weighted vests.
And just at Lake Travis High School there doing pull-ups.
And it was unbelievable fun training for that.
First day was live fire.
And lo and behold, a couple deer.
And that fucking gets you right.
You do not fuck around.
And they make sure of it.
And then I hadn't met Marcus yet.
And Foster had drove down, I think, from Texas to New Mexico with Latrell.
I was pretty jealous of that.
I was like, oh, you got to spend some real time with Marcus.
And I was playing Mike, obviously, and who is Mark's best friend.
And so we're on this fucking range doing live fire, like upside down reloads, combat reloads, jamming, blindfold.
It was just it was full on.
And Emil's actually a great shot.
He's like, okay, take that one.
Marcus comes everything goes full stop and Right when he's coming there's a PA on the other side, and she's bringing fucking banana shakes out
You know, 85, yeah, slap some headphones on the floor.
Which is not a good look for these actors.
And Marcus looks at these shakes and he looks at the actors and he's like, what the fuck is happening?
You guys don't get shakes in between.
And one of the actors just shamelessly goes up and grabs one of these banana shakes.
And he's just talking to Marcus, meeting him for the first time.
We're pretty far, but not crazy.
You might want to put that down.
Wait till he fucking leaves before.
And then it's just a beautiful experience, man.
The second week of training.
We were doing simunitions.
Oh, you would love it.
So this will break skin and they hurt.
It's like a hard plastic paint tipped and they fly like that, right?
Because they don't go as fast?
And so we have sims now and Mike would, my guy decides if we push left, push right, if we engage, get the fuck out of here, let's buy yourself some time, whatever.
Like, of course, I've trained with the M4 for loan and all this stuff.
I got to make these calls.
And so the SEALs are in tally gear, and they're like, go up the mountain.
They're all dressed in tally gear.
So we meet up at the bottom of this fucking mountain, and they're all in Taliban gear.
And you're like, oh, God.
So they're like, give us 10 minutes, and when you get ambushed,
But I've never, like, shot, shot.
We're going to watch and we're going to engage and we're going to see what you do, see what you've learned the last week.
And you're like, all right, let's go.
So it happens and you're just walking, right?
Just like we are in the film.
You're just walking and waiting to get ambushed.
You know shit's about to hit.
And so they hit and you hit the ground right away to figure out where the bullets are coming.
And you can hear them, which is...
It really sets you straight.
And so I'm looking over at Emil, and I'm like, fucking 12 o'clock.
They're just straight up in these trees.
I'm like, 12 o'clock, fucking push right.
We got to get the... Because we're in this open field.
We're in this open field.
And I'm like, get the fucking cover, dude.
We got to fucking fight our way to cover.
taking his time and he's like bro ah fuck alright it's fucking intense and I'm like push right I got Foster behind me who's like so in it he's fucking crawling through cactus and like bleeding and I'm on the ground crawling screaming at Emil Marcus comes out we got hammered I literally don't think we got through a mag
And he's like, fucking great shot.
Like, and Marcus comes out and we're not laughing, but it's too light.
Like we're taking it too lightly.
And I'm like, Emil, you got to push, man.
If I'm pushing, if I'm telling you.
roll up no deer and you can hear it though and it's like just losing his fucking mind and i'm like oh fuck and so the other seal he's like let's go so we walk and walk and walk and finally get around this corner and we have to put him down with a pistol and i was like
So Marcus comes in and he's like full stop.
And he goes, I thought he was going to rip Emil.
And he comes over to me and he's like, is this funny?
And I'm like, no, sir.
And he's like, do you understand the stakes of this?
Like every one of you are fucking dead.
You're all fucking dead.
And so he just rips me.
He's like, it's your fault.
This guy doesn't want to fucking move.
Do you understand that?
And I was just like, just leveled, right?
And it's a beautiful learning curve for me.
But I mean, anytime there's one time I won't kill you with these stories.
But one time I was like fucking proud of myself.
Like we got in a ditch where it was too much.
Simunition same thing and we got in a ditch and we're all here and I'm fucking looking downrange like like fucking we're in one We're still in a fight and then no joke Mark Simoes the sniper seal grabs my fucking shoulder and he's like boom and I'm like Where the fuck did you come from?
Like that's how good these motherfuckers are man.
So it was like it was just an amazing experience and
The more time I can root myself into this guy, especially when the stakes are so high like Murph.
I mean, physically, I did this little comedy in Canada.
And if you watch this movie, and I was training for Lone during this movie.
So it's called Skirwink Trail in Newfoundland.
Beautiful fucking trail.
And it's me, my best friend of 30 years, and my assistant, who is a...
great guy and we're training for loan getting ready doing like 50 pound runs uh weighted vests all this kind of skirt skirt wing trail so if you watch this movie like at the beginning to the end my body goes from like this to just stacked in this movie and so there's that but obviously 90 of this is mental right the seals
And so I just love that.
Pete did a beautiful thing bringing 19 guys died on the op and the rescue mission.
So it was like he brought all the families.
I think it was a week before we hit camera.
And, man, you know, I'm going –
I'm in the elevator at the Hyatt in Santa Fe or Albuquerque, and I'm fucking nervous, like throw-up nervous, because I'm meeting Dan Murphy now.
And I'm like, did I do enough?
Am I really fucking ready?
Am I worthy of this shit?
And then we all have that fucking voice in our head that's like, you're a pile of shit.
And that's why I prep so much because it eliminates, it's like a fight, right?
UFC or anything, these guys fucking, you prep to eliminate that self-doubt so you can be like, I'm fucking ready for you.
You know, so it's the same mentality.
And so that was my first words to Dan were like, I'm going to everything I have into this.
I'm going to do it as authentically as I know how.
And he was just so fucking gracious with me.
Gave Mike's firefighter patch and just told me some amazing stories.
And I'm super close with the Murphy family still.
But I love Pratt, man.
you gotta have it, especially with Pete's process.
Like if you're, he, he's so off the cuff sometimes.
And if it's an idea he has on the day, which he really leans into his gut instinct.
Just because we walked right up on it.
And obviously that's guided him pretty fucking beautifully, but you just gotta be ready for anything.
And if you don't prep, you're not rooted.
You're not ready for anything, you know?
So, um, that one was a special one.
Yeah, I try, for sure.
You try to stay in the character?
No, I try and be with you in the moment, at lunch.
And so I was just like, okay, this is part of it.
It's got to be weird, though, right?
It is weird because you're on top of the fucking mountain.
You're taking the ski lift up there.
And then you're having lunch with the Taliban guys.
And they're coming, and they're like, hey, man, we're big fans.
And you're like, this is fucking weird.
We're supposed to be shooting at each other for 20 minutes.
I'm about to fucking blow your head off, man.
And so, I mean, Wahlberg's quite light in between, so that can be infectious in a good way.
Ben is very, like, he carries that weight in a beautiful way.
That's why he's so good.
But yeah, there's definitely a tone, right?
Especially when you're surrounded by the SEALs.
It's such a quick reminder of what you're doing or serving.
And then we ate it and all that kind of stuff.
But yeah, you're up on that mountain having a sandwich, helping camera crew move their shit.
And then lunch is always quick.
So you're right back into it.
And it depends on the day.
Like the climb up to Murph's death was you're just carrying more weight that day.
You just cannot fuck around.
You better get that fucking right.
And I remember being, Emil comes up to me and he's like, hey, if we get off tonight, I'll go full circle with this.
If we get off tonight, you want to go see Eddie Vedder?
I love me some Vedder.
And that was in Albuquerque.
And so we go to Vedder, meet him.
Vedder calls him up, sings a couple songs to him.
It was an unbelievable night.
And Pete, the next day, comes up to me.
And we're back up in the mountain doing some, the fall off the cliff.
We're doing that the next day.
And Pete's like, hey, your death scene, I want to talk about it.
But that was my one experience.
And I'm like, all day, what do you want to know?
I got some thoughts on it.
And, you know, I talked to Marcus in the hotel and he remembers one specific thing he'd like me to do.
And so Murph was pushing himself up with his rifle, climbing up this rock.
So I'm like, that's really all I want to make sure for Marcus's sake that I get that in.
But I did go with my bro loves hunting.
And he's like, yeah, yeah, we're going to shoot this in a parking lot.
uh at just outside uh on off the highway in albuquerque and i'm like yeah right and he's like no no i want to control the light and have a beautiful landscape behind murph and i'm like pete you you're fucking killing me we're gonna do this in a fucking parking lot and so it was my last day as murph
I'll always have a playlist for whatever character.
And Explosions in the Sky, who's Austin, who was at the time Austin-based, great guys, and Pete uses them all the time.
Um, and they're just acoustic, no lyrics, which is, they're fucking amazing.
And we went out in Montana and there's on a friend's ranch in any of the back country.
And so there's one song that has a heartbeat in it.
And that was my song for Murph and it slows down in it.
And so I go, you know, like prepping in the, in the trailer, I walked down through this fucking parking lot and I'm like, Oh dude, I'm not in it.
I'm not ready for this.
And then I'm getting mad at Pete for putting me in a parking lot to do this shit.
I'm looking at fucking Sandia hotel, uh,
Getting ready to go like this most epic death on, you know, it doesn't get more epic than that guy, really.
Put in the tunes and they built this big stage that was like four feet high and the rocks and then surrounded it by green screen.
And cameras on the Phantom camera, which is that uber slow motion, that's where you see the spit coming out of Murph's mouth and all this.
And I just broke down, like just I puddled myself right before it was just like months and months and months of thinking about it.
And, uh, and prepping and putting so much pressure.
And then I had explosions in my head and I was like, God damn, this is like, you're overwhelmed with emotion.
And Pete comes up and he's like, get it out.
And so I took five minutes, camera crews waiting.
And I love tracking animals for photography.
We did like, I told Pete, I want that rifle to him to climb up with the rifle.
And, um, I think we did three takes and,
And then the camera crew, Jacques, he's a DP.
He DP'd American Primeval, but he was a camera op on loan.
So it's the same thing.
And he was working that slow-mo camera, and he just goes to Pete.
He's like, we've got it.
This is the first time I've told this story.
went and the first time i saw this film man was in uh i think it wasn't redskins it was denver the broncos we go and show this to the broncos and uh robert griffin iii was the quarterback i think
Um, getting up fucking before light hits, just getting deep.
And I was with Ben Foster, and Ben had seen it.
And I watched it the first time with the Denver fucking Broncos sitting in this theater.
And I was a mess, a mess, yeah.
It's just the pressure, right, I think?
And then my first email was to Dan, his dad, and he thanked me, and that's all that really, and Marcus.
But, yeah, they thanked me, and that was really all I fucking need.
You're way up there too.
Maureen, Johnny, Dan, the whole family.
And there's a destroyer, a fucking beach, a male UPS, or not UPS, but like a fucking...
Calling, all that kind of stuff.
stamp or whatever named after him there's fucking it's insane there's all these huge uh honorary plaques and statues and all this kind of stuff so if you let it like overwhelm you it definitely can yeah but it's been i mean that's where all this my love for these guys is is really stemmed from that you know um that's where it's like
And, uh, it's just so fun.
I've played seals a lot and it's, it's, I'm never raised military or my grandfather served, but it was, it's an infectious group, man.
And once you get in tight, your adrenaline's just buzzing.
It's like a brotherhood.
And people don't understand these guys are the best fucking problem solvers on the planet.
They're doctors, they're lawyers, they're fucking smart.
I've just been embedded.
And I think once you're in with these guys, you know, um,
you don't take it for granted.
It's like, I've made calls to a buddy of mine that, one of the most decorated SEALs alive, and he trained me for Lone, Ray Mendoza.
He just came out with Warfare, that movie, that's his best friend, his story, and unbelievable guy.
And we had eyes on this like big boy.
But I'll call Ray, and Ray was doing second unit on Terminalist, Dark Wolf, and he's like a brother to me.
And no joke, you're like, hey, man, I need a favor.
And he's like, he'll fucking bury someone for you, man.
This guy, like, yeah, what do you need?
And it's like, it's just that whole brotherhood that it's like unquestionably, undeniably loyal.
And like Marcus, like, I mean...
we're chatting a lot lately just because I'm shooting in Huntsville in a couple of weeks and he's not far, but like my, my sister, I took some time off to help my sister cause she was using drugs.
And so then I'm doing the he's like working his way up the mountain up this pass and I'm doing the antlers against the tree and then the antlers and getting it angry, getting it worked up and it starts bugling even more.
And I just needed somewhere to fucking go.
Just, I can't be in Austin.
She's still using, she's still relapsing.
I fucking Marcus call Marcus.
I'm like, let's I, this is what's going on.
He's like, bring her here, bring her to the ranch.
There's no fucking fentanyl.
There's no meth on this fucking ranch, man.
And so I, she's not using at the ranch.
So we went to the ranch and
And 10 days, I know she's going to be fucking clean.
Because there's just... All we're doing is driving around looking for hogs.
Or, like, hanging out, fishing, whatever it is.
But he's just a beautiful guy, man.
And where he is now is just... He's lighter on his feet.
It's so beautiful to see.
He was hurting on loan.
Going through a lot of fucking surgery still.
They're just so loyal and just great guys.
And you're like, I'm not even taking the shot.
And he like, he pulls his fucking mask down and he's like getting into it.
Yeah, she's clean 10 years now, just under 10.
She's, it's really kind of like, that's where that nonprofit comes from.
Um, I just started it called Howler's Ridge.
And, um, I didn't even know, like when she got clean, like there's some fucking crazy stories I can tell you.
But she's she got clean and she hit me up and she was at a sober escape with all the girls she got clean with.
And I'm like, what is that?
And it's basically a reunion with all the people that you went through your sober living or whatnot.
I see him like army crawling up there.
The last place she got clean was she was supposed to be there 90 days.
She's there nine months.
Well, yeah, that's what I said.
And so she was at this sober escape and so Howler's Ridge is basically a place I think we all know an addict if we're not ourselves and And we're gonna help vets as well, but it's the sober side of addiction.
So it's a place anytime you're using
At least through my experience watching my sister die a couple times, get Narcan'd a couple times.
I mean, I've seen her detox on my fucking kitchen floor, which is the worst fucking sight of anybody to watch someone in so much pain.
This spot is for her, you know, where it all started.
And this is, I think anytime you're using, right, we're all habitual humans.
You work out six, seven times a week.
It's more of like a bonding experience, man, than anything for us.
You need that for your brain.
So do I. And once you get in that habit, I change.
If I don't work out in three, four days, I'm a fucking asshole.
And I get, and I beat the shit out of myself.
So we all create this environment, whether it's good or bad.
And I think with my sis, I just didn't have anywhere to take her.
And I needed to pull her out because there was a time I she relapsed like four or five times in L.A.
And I was just finishing True Detective when I got her.
And I mean, there's stories, but like it's pretty fucked up that whole system because you have someone that's dying, right?
It's someone you raised or your brother, fucking best friend, whatever.
And I bring her to this.
Well, first she had to detox, which is an incredible story.
My mom calls me and she's like, she's been using for this long and I go full hero mode.
I didn't even know what fentanyl was.
This is right after True Detective.
I really wasn't exposed to it.
I knew heroin, of course.
Whenever the end of... You didn't know what fentanyl was?
I knew, like, with the seals.
Um, they had fentanyl patches for the pain.
And then of course, like, but that's really all I fucking, if that, like, obviously I educated myself on it after and it's 20 to 25 times worse than heroin to deathbed drug, put you to sleep.
So I got this call and I'm like, I'll get her sober in two weeks, bring her down like hero mode.
And she comes and I had no idea what was going on.
She had used right before she flew.
And so she was in withdrawal.
Oh, God is fucking right, man.
And your muscle contractions are so bad that I had this little one bedroom apartment in Marina Del Rey, 15, like literally a hallway from here about this long, actually.
And she's just pacing because she can't sit still because the muscle contractions are so bad.
And it just goes through your body.
And I'm like, Shells, just go to bed.
Take my bed and just try and sleep.
She's like, no, no, no, no.
And so she tried sleeping, going, laying down.
Muscle contractions are so bad.
And I'm like, okay, let's go for a walk.
And the beauty of our relationship and what I think was a huge factor in getting her clean was the transparency.
Like, you got to fucking be real with me.
Tell me when you used.
Tell me how often, like, everything.
She did, which is so tough to hear.
Um, and so we ended up walking down Abbott Kinney at three in the morning and no one's obviously out there.
And we just did this crazy walk and talk and I'll never forget it.
And, uh, it's just heartbreaking.
And I get her and I call, um, I don't even know if she needs to detox.
So I called the hospital Marina Del Rey and they're like, no.
We don't take anybody that's using right now.
They have to be detoxed, and we may be able to help them after.
So I'm like, okay, what the fuck is, okay, we got to detox.
And so I call this place, and they're like an hour away, and she's like, I have a bed for her, and bring her at 6 a.m.,
But it takes a lot of work.
I mean, I got this little Wrangler, a two door Wrangler and she's in the backseat, my mom in the front.
And she's like almost kicking the fucking glass out.
Cause the muscle contractions of my Jeep.
And I was like, Holy, like such a wake up call that I had no idea it was this bad.
So reality is kind of setting in.
And, um, she kept asking for methadone.
Cause she had detox before and methadone and, um,
And so I go to this fucking house and I knock on the door and she's in the backseat She's got her little backpack and it's this fucking woman like Butchy in like presence she opens the door.
It's a different hunt, right, than just rifle.
She's like just a matter of fact.
And I'm like, oh, she's grabbing her bag.
She's like well bring her here.
She comes and Shels is like, doesn't say hi, nothing.
She's like, I need methadone.
And she goes, well, when did you use blah, blah, blah and all this?
And she tells her and she's like, oh, you haven't even bottomed out yet.
It's just rifle up there, at least in that area, it's like sometimes your hunt's under an hour.
We don't treat drugs with drugs here, honey.
You're gonna have some Gatorade and some topical muscle relaxer and you're gonna sweat this out.
It's funny now, but Shelby goes to her knees
And she's like, I need methadone.
And she's like, you're getting Gatorade, muscle relaxer, and you're going to watch some movies.
And you can smoke no phone.
Four and a half days later, she called me and she's like, your sister's good.
Bring her to a sober living just by Venice high.
And it's 30, like when someone's fucking almost ready to go, you're I'll do anything.
And so it's 30,000 for the month and it's sober living.
You'll have one session, which isn't enough.
Uh, cause she has some trauma and, um,
And I was like- One in 30 days?
And I was like, we need a lot more than one a week.
And so I drove, and my sis was a runner.
And, uh, so the, you sign this fucking contract and it's like, if she runs, if she leaves, if she does this, this, this, and that you, she's out, we kick her out and we keep your money two hours in gone.
You know, with bow, you're in one.
I get a call from this LA number and I'm like, no fucking way.
Okay, there's 30 grand gone.
I'm going to find another one.
She went to another one.
Yeah, I got twice a week.
Two days later, she runs again.
So I'm down 65K in three days.
bleeding cash and then i figure out like another spot she stayed like 30 days relapsed and then um yeah she kept relapsing and then uh multiple times narkand up in calabasas there's a place and she left and uh this one girl she had uh night terrors
And so they would she had I would walk around Joe with this fucking Ziploc bag of pills of like antidepressants for her night terrors, sleeping pills, all these things to just take away this trauma for whatever beat it would be within a right.
And there's an amazing doc up there and South African guy that deals with women addicts and trauma.
And she was there for a while and that was,
really great and she got a hold of these sleeping pills and they're supposed to give you one every night and the girl put the bottle up on the little half door you know those doors swinging doors yeah and um so she grabbed the bottle
And she was, as a lot of these sober livings are, they're pretty incestuous.
And the guys sleep with the girls, vice versa, obviously.
And she was dating a kid named Mike there.
And so she went to that part of the house and said goodbye to Mike.
And to this kid's credit...
um he was like that's a little weird you didn't say good night you just said goodbye and so she goes up hammers 60 something sleeping pills oh jesus yeah and uh he goes and tells he's like hey this ain't right you got to go check on her so long story short call the ambulance and the medic to his credit is like go grab the fucking bottle
Throwing up the grass, checking it all the time.
And grabs a bottle and shows this medic, and he's like, we're pumping her stomach right now in the ambulance.
And what saved her life were their time release.
Isn't that fucking crazy?
So I got this call, and I lost my mind for giving her the bottle.
But yeah, at that point, she kind of just...
Fucking ran again, went to a drug house.
She hates using needles so someone would shoot her up.
So as you know, if you're fucking sober, 92 days, whatever it was, if you use what you were using before, you're fucking gone.
You live in Montana now?
Because your tolerance is gone.
So they dropped, it's a fucking movie.
They dropped her off at the stupidest hospital and she got Narcan.
I didn't know any of this part.
I didn't, I wasn't privy to this yet.
I'm just driving around looking for her.
And anyway, just to go back to that environment, I'm like, I'm out of money.
I got to send you back home to Vancouver.
And she's like, you put me to Vancouver, I'm going to die.
And I'm like, well, it ain't working well here either.
Five, just over five years now.
And, uh, she was at a psych ward on 34th and Lamar.
Uh, that was a fucked up story, but, um, for like 10 days.
Um, but anyway, she got, she went to this place called the Westy house in new Westminster, just outside Vancouver.
And so it was a woman's only, and she was there, she ran there and I got her back in and she got clean and hasn't looked back since.
I didn't even know what Al-Anon was.
And I was at 360 Bridge.
There's a church just across 360 Bridge.
And I was at this Al-Anon.
So I'm waiting for the call of like, okay, she's finally overdosed and gone.
What made you choose that?
And so I'm a mess, and I'm in Al-Anon just waiting for this call, and I'm judging everybody in this fucking Al-Anon.
Man, flying into Austin, I was here 16 plus years.
There's this woman across from me.
She's like, yeah, my husband, he used, and yeah, I got Christmas with him.
And I'm like, fuck, that's easy day.
I'm like, you don't even know what the fuck I'm dealing with over here.
And then you hear another story, and you're like, that's bullshit.
It does help, or help me a lot.
And I come out, and this one guy...
He's like, hey, you're heavy.
You want to talk or anything?
You didn't say a word in there.
And I'm like, right when he said that, my sis called and she was downtown Vancouver.
So it's just memory fucking lane.
And she had just used and got scared straight.
Some guy had followed her and sexually abused a friend of hers in front of her.
And she's like, I can't do this no more.
So she was scared straight.
she got she was downtown vancouver called me and she's like can you get me back in westy house and i call susan was her name and um call her back and i'm throwing everything i'm like i will uh support you guys can you give us a bed can you get her one more time i know she's not allowed back and all this and she goes i'll call you back
This is where it all started, man.
This episode is brought to you by Visible.
Like Friday Night Lights.
We were like school for the deaf just down the street.
Got her a bed, and she was there nine months.
Dylan Field was just across the airport.
That's a fucking good question.
That's a good question.
I know at times it was like, she has, we have nieces and nephews and she wanted to get clean for them, but that didn't last.
I think it was that moment of getting scared straight.
Like you just can't keep doing this.
So, so many memories of Pete and I. We were staying at the Four Seasons shooting the pilot.
I think that's what it is.
It's so subjective, right?
We all know somebody that's like, I stopped drinking yesterday.
Like my buddy over there, you just met.
It's just like he went for a few weeks and he hasn't had booze since.
sometimes it just clicks and they're like, fuck this life.
I don't want it anymore.
And some just can't break that habit.
But yeah, it varies so much.
Um, but yeah, she's a lot like me too.
Yeah, it's a beautiful story.
And I want to fucking kill that guy, by the way.
Learned to box here at Richard Lord's.
Because he relapsed with her and used with her at that drug house.
So that like for me is a big part of Howler's Ridge.
And then with the vets is we just chatted.
I love these guys and the families.
And so hopefully we'll have you talk about Ibogaine.
I know we can't do that in Montana yet, hopefully.
But I hope up there on Howler's Ridge we can maybe in a year or two.
Um... If you don't know this guy, he's fucking amazing.
We'll see what happens that we can do some of that up there.
they're they just they're all fucked up and then they're hooked on pills and the pills are just you can cookie monster a fucking jar if you want and they'll refill you like and there's different outlets like virginia hawaii florida doctors in each one that are sending you yep and it's that's you literally at your doorstep you're getting these jars of pills
And these guys obviously have addictive personalities.
There's a doc on him, actually.
That's what makes them so fucking great.
He's up... I don't even know if he's still around.
Well, beautiful, right?
And it's funny because...
not that I'm cocky or was cocky with Dark Wolf, but I had played this guy already before and I lose my trident in it.
And Mendoza's kind of getting the parade rest ready and the whole ceremony ready for it.
And he's just a brother of mine and,
He was pretty old when he taught me how to box.
And it was a big moment that I learned because these workups, say you work up on a Thursday and you go at 2 a.m.
And you go take a couple guys out and you come back, whatever, celebrate, probably have a few drinks, and then you have another workup on Tuesday.
But let's say you and I go in the fight and I die.
on that Thursday op, you're back in workup Tuesday morning.
So this is one thing that really kind of punched me when I was talking to Mendoza, because he was talking about some stories where he lost somebody.
I was like, there's literally no fucking time to mourn.
There's no time to register the loss of this.
So you're just harnessing this pain and all these emotions.
wicked dude just zend out he was probably in his mid 60s so he'd be up there now but um yeah pete literally was like before we hit camera it was like hey you want to go box and i was like all right
And you're just like, okay, I guess I'm back in the fight.
And I'm going to do this for at least another few months before I'm out on my six-month tour.
and that really kind of knocked me out and that set me free to play this guy a lot more like just knee-jerk emotion and way more of a live wire because it's like who we talk about how subjective morning is
You know, it's like everyone mourns differently.
So it's like I just made that choice with Ben of just like, this guy's just a fucking mess.
And let him just emotionally make these decisions then.
And that's where I took him.
And we don't know the half of it.
Think obviously with Red Wings and stuff like that with loan, but then you talk to these guys in between takes and They're pretty transparent, which is beautiful that they're talking about it and all this but it's like Where are they putting this fucking energy after they're out?
Like they gotta find another purpose.
That's so fucking heightened when you're serving.
There's no bigger purpose You're fucking killing bad guys
Like, that's incredible.
With your brothers right next to you.
Like, that's a heavy fucking thing to carry.
And then when they come out, now what?
I'm going to go walk fucking Walmart and just be a dad, and that's just a whole other life?
That's one of the things I really loved about Hurt Locker.
I mean, you look at Marcus, too.
After Red Wings, he went back to Ramadi.
Which is, wanted to die with his boots on.
I mean, these guys are fucking, this is kind of the UFC, right?
Of like, these guys are modern day fucking gladiators, warriors.
And I know they're not in the front lines or down range, but it's like, you got a guy like Marcus or the Mendoza or these guys that are just truly born warriors.
There's just a, there are a different breed.
More mental than physical.
I mean, Mendoza was running buds too.
And he would say a lot of times you look at these fucking scrawny guys.
And then you got the D1 athletes that haven't had or gone through a whole lot because they're gifted athletically.
Up here, though, they're not as strong.
And that fucking scrawny guy over there is bringing that D1 athlete with him.
And comfort can kill you.
He's got his own gym in L.A.
Now you're going even harder.
Even like me with acting, it's...
I do not spar with him anymore.
Like I live for it, I love it.
And I honestly do believe I've just worked my way through stubbornly.
Like I'll just outwork people.
It's not like I was gifted this talent or it truly isn't.
I'll just outwork people.
And then now it's like 44 now, which is crazy.
And now I'm starting to be like, okay,
You're thinking about kids.
You're thinking about, I need a little more balance.
But then I start this balance, and it scares the fuck out of me, and I don't like it.
It's the comfort, right?
It's like, oh, Kitch, don't take this.
Just go keep fly fishing.
It's Dirty Pete is his fucking boxing name.
Just go on a motorcycle trip, which is great, and I'll still do it.
But I'm just so conscious of it, of like, don't get fucking comfortable.
I bet you he didn't fucking tell you that, did he?
But there is that, I think, I don't know, do you have that with the fear of failure still?
Of it all falling apart?
That and, like, I'm on set in two weeks and I'm fucking scared.
And it's a heavy role, shit ton of dialogue.
No, why is it Dirty Pete?
But I can't sit on that fucking couch because I'm like, what the fuck are you doing, Kitch?
Because he's earned that, man.
So, you know, you'll do body shots only or stuff like that and spar.
It's with me when I'm brushing my teeth.
Or you're looking through my girlfriend.
Yeah, you're barely listening.
Fucking, what if I do this in this scene?
Keep each other honest.
And then you go back to being spaced out after apologizing.
Or I'll just literally be like, I'm going on a bike ride and I'm gone for two, three hours and then I'm running shit in my head or it's so true.
But fuck, you get them once.
I equate it to like when we're rolling.
It's like you ain't hiding no more kids.
You're fucking you're in it.
Once you get exposed to that elk, it's like this is your fucking moment.
We're going to see if you did the work.
And it's like you're on camera in like a week or something like that.
That was my gladiator.
That scene, I lost a bunch of weight for it.
And then Howard Berger did my makeup for that, and he's fucking incredible.
That scene meant a lot.
You saw who that guy is raw, naked.
With his Shoshone brother.
Starving, covered in scars.
And then goes into that teepee with the chief, the mother of his wife that he lost.
And I wrote that scene, man.
And so Pete and I came up with It's Only Pain.
And then I broke my foot and got a fucking bone cut out of it on that show.
And you know the scene where- You got a bone cut out of it?
Why'd they cut a bone out?
So there's a scene where I go down to get horses, and I kill five or six guys at this skinning camp, and I think it's episode two, and Betty Gilpin, who's amazing, comes down, and she's like, didn't trust me, and she comes down, and I have to kill these guys.
And then you, like, take it, and you're kind of shocked at first.
During that sequence, I broke this, my foot, and they call cut, and I go to Dashnaw, the stunt coordinator,
And I'm like, oh, it's broken.
And he's like, I've worked with him for 15 years.
And he's like, don't fuck with me.
It just goes from, like, 2 to 11 so quick.
And I'm like, no, Dash, it's broken.
I got the shooting pain in my groin.
And he's like, get the fuck out of here.
And they spray fucking Biofreeze on my foot.
And I'm like, guys, come on.
And so I go to Bozeman and he's like, it's this small bone right on the side of your foot right there that goes up and down right here.
Connecting my big toe.
It's on the side bone on my big toe.
And so he's like, oh, you can wear a boot.
It's a small bone, so you won't need to, it'll heal itself.
But, yeah, it's the best workout.
So I go back and I'm in a boot doing this fucking show.
And I got a six foot six Wrangler.
So when I get off that horse, 90% of the time, I think his name's BJ.
And he's below me off camera taking my weight because I can't step off the horse because I'm in a fucking boot.
And then six weeks goes by or a month and I go back to Bozeman and take my boot off and he does one last x-ray and he's like, you need to be in surgery today.
That's a shitty call to Netflix and Pete.
So I got surgery, and then right before surgery, he's like, we can pin it, but you're going to be super active, and it may not take.
Or I can cut it out and put bone wax on it.
Yeah, didn't know there was a thing of that either.
I think it just is a protective coating over it.
Still don't know what it means.
It's... If I'm fly fishing or on uneven ground, it's... Or if I'm doing, you know, if I'm tracking or doing something side-hilling, which I fucking hate.
Side-hill hiking, I hate it.
I have a terrible knee as well.
That's where it bites.
Yeah, so I dealt with that.
I had to be on the couch for six weeks.
But my first day back was those two scenes.
And I had called Pete.
And I'm like, hey, I wrote this scene I'd love.
Because that scene was exposition with my mom at first.
We were talking about Red Feather and stuff.
I mean, even when we shot American Primeval, his little garage setup, man.
And I'm like, this is my first day back after losing them that I haven't seen her since I've lost her daughter and her grandson.
So this guy can't get through anything.
So that was the crutch, and thank you for noticing.
That's the crutch of that whole arc to that guy.
Cold plunge, steam room.
He's got to have it for that brain of his.
I had time, which was great.
I did this one film called The Bang Bang Club here.
I was just living off Lamar here.
I play this drug-addicted true story about these war photographers during the apartheid, right before the first free election, Mandela's election.
Kevin Carter is his name.
He won a Pulitzer for this epic shot that he took.
Got a lot of flack for it and ended up taking his own life.
But that, I had 30 days to prep, and I lost 35 in 30 days.
And I remember going just over I-35 here to this dock, and my heart rate was fucking low 20s.
Because all I was doing was running, coffee, and I would...
The broth can be super salty, sodium heavy.
So I'd filter that and then just have broth and broccoli for dinner.
And then I got a thyroid problem from that.
And that doc was like...
Hey, you're going to fail this physical, just so you know.
And I'm like, what do I got to do?
I'm going to Africa next week.
And he's like, do some pushups.
So I did pushups and got my heart rate into the low 40s.
And then I was hurting.
They would shoot me out on Bang Bang Club.
Like, just shoot your coverage and go.
And then I ended up getting a nutritionist there.
And she helped me a little bit.
But that was a quick shoot.
But that's where I think I fucked my body on that one.
And then Koresh again, lost weight for that.
That was great, by the way.
That was, I was just prepping right there, too.
That was almost too long a prep.
Here's me saying I love prep, but I had six months to get into that head space.
And it just, the last month I tried to pull out of the show.
Yeah, because I was just, this is, I was just, you're holding, hoarding all this energy.
And I lost the weight learning to play guitar and sing, which was a fucking comedy.
That literally helped me.
I'd listen to Dave and I'd be like, wow.
Why figure out the right why I think so yeah Go to his childhood, which was fucking terrible Like you don't become a cult leader To great healthy parents
always giving you hugs siblings and you decide to be a cult leader yeah he memorized the bible by 15 which is fucking that says enough right there but he was like tied to a radiator on his birthday abused pretty hard I almost bought his car
A little bit of an ego.
I'm that way with motorcycles too.
And I got to set, we shot actually in, Waco wanted nothing to do with us.
So we shot that in Santa Fe.
It's grown enormously, too.
His motorcycle came for sale and obviously they knew we were making it.
I kicked tires on it and, uh, they wanted to just, it was probably worth two grand.
They wanted 15 or something.
And it was just like, go fuck yourself.
Honestly, like you just said, what am I going to do with his moto?
Have you had one and it just fucking ran, just gone?
Just like his residence.
Different energy there.
I'd have to tear the building down.
Conditioned them over years.
And then what is Kundalini?
And then I called my manager, Steph, and she's like, give it a day.
And then the Dowdle brothers who wrote and directed, terrific guys.
And I think one thing that set me free probably on month three, because I was really stuck on everything we've just said of like, why am I playing some guy that's pretty fucking reprehensible in a lot of ways?
But I was judging him.
And that was like really a big block for me because I couldn't understand him more.
And so once I started to not cast judgment or my own judgment on him and just trying to understand and root him.
Then I was like, okay, I'm going to fly now.
Of like, this is his childhood.
This is why he's doing this.
And so it's your guys' job can judge away and do all this.
But for me to play this guy, I can't bring that to him.
You've got to be that piece of shit.
I've got to do it and try and root that.
When you got done with the role, was it like a thing that you had to cast off yourself?
The Bang Bang Club fucked me.
I was hurting pretty bad after.
I didn't know my process very well.
And Kevin Carter was just really, really troubled.
And I think it was Mandrax, which is an animal tranquilizer that he would take.
And he would have night terrors and all this.
There's photos of him.
They called it the Bang Bang because they had these police scanners.
And once they would, this is early 90s in South Africa.
And once they heard it on the scanner, it's like a bang bang.
And they would be there a lot of times before the cops, like some kind of civil rights or civil fight would happen.
And they would get, hear it on the scanner and they'd go like Scooby-Doo kind of shit.
They'd get there before the cops a lot of time or the military.
And they'd be in the middle of this shooting it.
Photographing it and you see pics of Kev that are just like him in like one shoe high hiding behind like a fucking barrel in the middle of this gunfight and
Like they would get really into it.
And then he was a guy that just kind of took everything to heart.
You know, just he would see some fucking pretty abysmal shit and just be like, take it, you know, wear it.
And it just hammered him.
And so he would take these drugs and just to sleep and just to get over, get through it.
But yeah, that was really tough coming out of him just because I didn't know myself enough or process be able to really kind of separate.
You almost like became a part of him.
And then the weight and all that.
And then with Dave, yeah, I was so ready to gain the weight back and just wipe my hands with it.
I always go on a motorcycle trip after, and that sets me free, helps me a lot.
I'll write letters and just burn them.
They say when you're like, if I get therapy or something or it's like write a letter and literally watch it burn.
And that is something like that's a mind trick.
Just like if there's trauma or something.
And that was the first time I started having really bad nightmares in South Africa.
And, um, and I just, that started fucking with me a lot.
And then I was really happy.
It was only a four week shoot.
Did you try that tranquilizer, whatever the fuck it is?
So you can know what it's like?
I've only smoked weed three times in my life.
First time was- But just weed?
Savages with Oliver Stone.
I was surprised he still smokes weed.
And I was in rehearsal and he asked me and I hadn't smoked weed ever before.
And I'm playing this guy, this obviously a SEAL, but that smokes weed, grows weed, sells weed, gets into the cartel.
And you smoked with Oliver Stone the first time?
No, my first time he gave me some of his medicinal, and I went with a buddy who smokes weed all the time, and I was staying at the Shangri-La in Santa Monica while we were filming, and my buddy brought over...
Yeah, that was no joke.
And I was that actor where it was like, I got to be in trauma too then.
Right, right, right, right.
Living in a fucking mini hotel room in South Africa.
But I've learned my process a lot more.
Did you have to refine it on your own?
Did you get help doing this?
Yeah, it was Waco that really kind of set me straight in my process, really helped me figure out, like, my me.
Because it's all self-exploratory shit as well as acting.
And then you're just way more conscious of it, of like, okay, like even with relationships, of like, okay, that's, I can get quite short, like be, like True Detective, I was oddly an asshole through the whole thing.
And I had my best friend of 30 years with me helping me on that.
And I was drinking, like, to blackout.
But I was just a fucking mess.
And my buddy was, like, played in the NHL, AHL, was a fighter.
Like, he would fucking murder me.
You would get shitty with him?
And I would poke him, man.
And I would poke him, man.
And we'd go to this shithole bar.
It's called Sports Harbor.
I don't even know if it's open anymore.
But I would fuck around.
And I didn't have to find out, but I definitely was getting that really I was conscious of it.
And he would have to have a moment with me of like, hey, you said this last night or whatever.
Cause after I shed it or after it wrapped, I was with my sis right after, but I was fine.
I didn't touch anything.
But during, I was no bueno.
Even getting ready for this, I play this director of corrections in Texas.
It's a true story about the longest...
hostage situation in the U.S.
It's 11-day hostage negotiation, and Freddy Carrasco is going to be played by Luna, Diego Luna, who's, I can't wait to see what he fucking does with this.
But I play the director of corrections, so we're negotiating for 11 days.
And he's got to be quite hard on the guys in his war room.
And he kind of comes in and he takes over the negotiation.
And he's never done a negotiation before so he makes a mistake here or there and he he fucking pays the Piper psychologically for it because it doesn't end great and And so I'm starting to get into that mindset and when I'm with a buddy or something like that I can be quite short and you start to see it filtering in I'm like, okay and
Yeah, hit it, and it just goes into the bush, and you've got to track it, find it.
Jim is settling in me like I can start to feel it a little bit more.
That fucking monologue Daniel Day has on the porch where he's like, to his brother, I think it is, where he goes, I don't like people.
He is the best to do it.
There was so much to it.
He's got something coming out soon, too.
His son, I think, directed it.
which is going to be a fucking banger.
I think he plays a soldier that comes back.
I heard horror stories of you.
I was just with Sheridan the other day.
And of course, Pete and every car.
Everyone's like, you're going to have a fucking blast.
I think, I mean, you look at anybody that's great at anything, you have to, it's the amount of sacrifice you're willing to give to it.
And I think it's that, like, the fear of failure and also I don't want to fucking watch it and be like, oh, Ketch, you didn't.
That would fucking kill me.
after a film or at the premiere or something that were like, hey, I'm sorry, man, I just wasn't there.
You know, I'm like in my head, I'm like, no, I know.
Oh, I had Charlie Sheen on yesterday.
Eight years, almost eight years.
I learned so much on that, man.
I mean, living in Montana, I got to this cowgirl friend of mine who I met at that ranch had been working with this shaman just outside of Livingston.
Or the uppers and downers and everything.
Isn't there a doc on him that just came out?
Yeah, that's what it's about.
It's a lot of insurance on the studio, yeah.
What is he, like 60 now?
Yeah, you can track them, though.
And I was telling her I'm playing a guy that kind of raised by Shoshone and all this and like that was kind of where I hung my hat of like if this guy lost his family at six or seven and then adopted or sold to the Shoshone, this is who he is.
I'm going to watch that doc.
I mean, that whole family is pretty epic.
Oh, how old was Martin Sheen then?
Yeah, just leaking all over the place.
Oliver Stone's directing it.
Dude, that guy ruled in that movie.
Willem's an amazing guy.
He's more Shoshone than he is white.
Well, that's how you adjust.
That was his drug of choice.
So I started working with this shaman, which was incredible, and then went down to the Shoshone Reservation, Wind River, worked with the elders there.
What was the baseball movie?
Oh, he was awesome in that movie.
I grew up watching that.
What was his bottom out?
Yeah, losing two and a half men or something.
I think Apocalypse was like a two-year shoot.
It's tough, man, because obviously going there, you're like – and they knew I was coming.
They just kept asking for money, too.
Back then, too, to make a movie like that, yeah.
Then you got Platoon, like you said.
And the most formative years, too.
But it's like you're talking to these elders, and it's like we meet five minutes in, and I'm like, so what do you guys do when you bury your wife?
That's old school movie making, though.
I've got to – I had dinner with Gibson one night, Mel Gibson, and I've worked with – what's his – Brendan Gleeson.
That was a big one for me.
You get out of that movie.
When he screams freedom at the end of it.
When the king pulls the helmet off the king and he sees he's fighting for the other side and then you cut to Gibson, it's those fucking blue eyes that he's trying to register that it's the king, his king.
And that moment for me was just like, oh, my God.
And you're asking these heavy, heavy questions.
That was a cool dinner, though.
He told me some stories of Braveheart.
Of just riding the horse to all these cameras.
Like ripping the horse to one camera, seeing the shot, going to the next, seeing the shot, going in, doing the speech, looking to play back.
That is true meaning behind it all.
And then he's like falling asleep, standing up.
Like, that's, like, epic stuff.
And talk about realism.
Oh, no, they were horrible.
Like my dad played the bagpipes.
So she took a long beat and she's like, I'll get back to you on that.
He played actually in the world championships in 95 in Scotland.
And then he, so the pipes to me, like I remember he was an alcoholic and not a lot.
He wasn't around a lot.
And I remember some of my best memories were like, you know the fucking sound of the pipes when you're putting air in?
It's the worst sound in the world.
It's like a rabbit getting bludgeoned.
And we would be at Christmas.
All my cousins, his side of the family.
And he would walk downstairs and you could hear this, these fucking pipes getting air put in.
I'll get back to you on that.
And you could tell he had a few.
And he would come up and stand in the middle of the living room and just rip the pipes.
And then I went into this other room.
And everyone's just like full stop and just beautiful.
And he'd play in Barbados.
He worked in Barbados doing a lot of like the pavers, the golf paths.
And he'd play at funerals.
That's a good question, but it's a great story.
So primeval, I was fly fishing in the Madison, just West Yellowstone.
I had four days off, so I went home to Bozeman and was fly fishing.
at the school there and this other elderly woman comes in a wheelchair and she sits there and she's like, what do you wanna know?
Only my favorite spot in West Yellowstone, my bro calls me,
And I'm like, I just caught like a 20-inch rainbow or something.
And I'm fucking ripping into my brother being like, this fucking, I'm killing it.
The rod's on fire right now.
So my dad raced cars as well.
And his race car name, or we called him Gooey growing up.
And he's like, Gooey's got 48 hours to live.
And I was like, ah, fuck.
Literally, just verbatim like that.
Like I saw him the last 19 years, I saw him twice.
And one time was in Montana and he had early onset dementia and my brother drove him down.
But so I drive, I take my adventure van, drive up to Kelowna, my hometown.
And I've got this big beard from primeval.
And I hadn't talked to one of my brothers in years.
And then I was still close with the oldest and get to the hospital.
And he's, I turn his wheelchair around and
And I'm like, hey, hey, Gooey.
And he's like, who the fuck are you?
And he's on like oxygen.
And I'm like, I'm your youngest son.
And he's like, what are you doing here?
So I've shot one deer in my life, and it was after Lone, and I was on Latrell's.
And so we just sat there for hours and she was incredibly transparent and just really open.
And I'm like, I'm just here to say hi and hang out for a couple days.
And he was like on point.
Like his brain was going.
And it was a little like I hadn't seen my one bro forever.
And I was limping with that fucking toe.
And so we go up to his room.
This is a Friday at noon-ish.
And he's great, though.
So we have this young doctor.
I go and sit down with him.
I'm like, dude, he's dialed.
What do you mean he's going to fucking die?
And he's like, this is what happens.
Sometimes when somebody like this, he doesn't know he's dying.
And I would take all this and go to Pete and be like, listen, if we're gonna, we gotta honor these guys, so let's do it right.
But he is, like all three of us brothers, all three of his sons were there.
And everything, he's just dialed into it all.
And just very present.
And he's like, the doc is like, man, I have a feeling all three sons haven't been together with him.
And I'm like, in 25 years.
And so we were all there.
And I had my assistant back in Santa Fe.
And I was like, hey, my dad played for Kelowna Pipe Band.
And I was like, call her.
I'm like, you got to help me here.
Get a piper and to come play for him.
at the hospital and she's like on it and she was great and uh the next the next or friday night i'm like gooey what do you want for breakfast and he's like give me something i shouldn't have give me like a fucking costco muffin and uh and a stupid amount of whipped cream and a coffee
And so of course I go overboard and bring him this fucking ridiculous, the big chocolate chip muffin and the coffee in the next morning.
But he had gone from like dialed to he's hurting.
And he was all ears and the Shoshone was very tough to learn.
And so we got this piper to come.
We fucking, we're not allowed to do this.
We bring them out in the courtyard
And and the piper comes and he's asleep.
And she's like, what do you what do you want me to play?
Like they know of my dad that he had played for the Kelowna Pipe Band.
And and I'm like, I don't know many songs.
And I just obviously Amazing Grace and stuff like that.
And so she's just rips it.
And he wakes up, and we're all buckled emotionally, right?
Because this whole, the pipes to us is just like, that's our father.
That's like our only memory, one of our only memories for him.
So she plays two songs, and he's falling asleep again, and he wakes up, and I'm like, Gooey, you got one more song.
He was a mama's boy, loved his mom.
And he's like, play one for my mother.
So I think at that point he knew he was about to go see her.
And, yeah, so we have all this on video.
And his brother was there and his wife and his best friend growing up.
Yeah, so we'll do two-hour sweats.
And so we fucking – the nurse comes out after the pipes.
Obviously, the whole fucking hospital can hear this.
And so we obviously got caught.
And she's like, bring him up now.
And so we're like, yes, yes, ma'am.
So we fucking have him in his bed.
And you know those wheelchair ramps?
It's like a hard 90 degree.
And my middle, I'm the youngest of three boys.
And then my other bro's like 6'2", big boy too.
And we're fucking, we got him and we're stuck in that turn.
So now it's like weekend at Bernie's.
And this is like a pain movie where it's like he's fucking, I'm like, hey, Gooey's stuck.
boys, he's stuck, we can't get over this fucking corner, because the bed's too long, and we're dying, like, we needed a laugh.
And so I look down, and Gooey's arm is like fucking crooked, jammed in that bar.
So I'm like, oh, whoa, whoa, back up a bit.
So we back, loosen it up, and it's like, it's not broken, but we, he didn't feel any of this shit.
So we're, like, crying laughing because it's like a weekend at fucking Bernie's moment.
It's our dark humor, man.
Yeah, so fire is always burning before you start the sweat, and then he'll grab river rocks from Yellowstone River, and then the fire's going, and he'll bring these rocks that are in the fire into the middle of the sweat lodge.
You got to laugh in those moments.
Yeah, I guess you have to.
Yeah, because we were just buckled 10 minutes earlier.
Get him to the room, and he's in and out sleeping.
The next day on Father's Day, I had to drive back to Bozeman and we have dark humor.
And so everyone's in the room and I'm like, all right, get the fuck out of this room.
Everybody like a joke, but the nurses are like, oh my God, what happened?
And I'm like, oh, I'm sorry, it's a joke.
I just want 10 minutes with them.
I gotta go back to work, but I'm gonna say goodbye.
And so they leave and he's like kind of in and out of consciousness and he would wake up and look right through you.
Like he's trying to be with you or present or I don't know, that's kind of how I took it.
And he's fighting consciousness, I guess.
And small little side note, I was driving and the shaman who was helping me for primeval
He texted me once I got into Canada and he was like, hey, I had a dream.
You got to fucking call me.
And I'm like, I don't know if I believe this stuff, but I'll call you.
And so I call him and he's like, hey, something's up.
And I'm like, I've told three people that my dad's going.
And he's like, I had a fucking dream that you're about to lose someone.
I don't know if they're close to you.
This is a crazy call, but I'm going to listen to this.
And I'm like, man, I'm on my way to say goodbye to my dad.
He goes, okay, that's what it is.
I don't know what that is.
And he's like, tell me about your dad.
What kind of guy was he?
I'm like, not very present.
He drank a lot and, you know, some regrets, of course, and this and that.
And he goes, okay, I'm going to set up an altar and pray for him.
And this is what I think is going to happen.
He's not going to cross over very easily.
because of the life he's lived.
And so when I'm one-on-one with my dad, I started the conversation.
I'm like, Gooey, it's me.
And he had soft hands.
That's one thing I remember.
So I grabbed his hand and our humor.
I'm like, yeah, these are a little fucking soft, Gooey.
Like, maybe you should have worked harder.
Like, no calluses, like, nothing.
And there's four doors to this one.
Just, you know, just trying to... And then I went into, like, the nonprofit, and I'm going to do this, and I'm going to try and give back, and this and that, and I promised them.
And during that conversation, he would try and like be conscious and he was fighting to be there present, but he was, I think gone.
And you'll talk, you'll fast the day before and you'll he'll put the river rocks in the middle and they're smoking hot.
Um, and then two hours I left and then I, on the way home, I broke all and he had passed on father's day.
And then, um, then I was back to work on Tuesday, fucking riding banana bread, my horse.
With like Shea Wiggum, who's an amazing actor.
He played Jim Bridger in that, but, um,
Yeah, Pete was great with me on that.
I think it... I mean, how crazy.
Art simulating life and vice versa.
I'm playing a guy mourning, and then all of a sudden, like, my father, who I didn't really have, died.
But it's still your dad, you know?
And Pete was like, hey, do you want to ride banana bread into this shot or walk him?
And I'm like, I'll ride him in.
And I was doing a scene with Shea Whigham.
It was beautiful because...
I was upset that some knew that it's my news to tell, you know, but some had already knew the crew.
So I was a little rattled at that when I got to set because everyone was very fragile with me, which I understand.
But I was like, whoever told you guys, it's not your story to fucking tell.
It's mine if I want to share it with the crew or whoever.
But so I was a little upset on set.
It was so beautiful, man, because a lot of these older guys on set would just come up and be like, man, my father was this guy to me, this guy.
And then he brings river water from a spring or whatever.
But, you know, I just I feel you.
And they would share all their father stories.
So it was a beautiful experience.
And Betty Gilpin was amazing.
I just buckled, like walked away from the Fort Bridger.
And I just was pretty emotional.
And Pete was like, amazing.
And then we shot the scene.
And then I got to my trailer.
And literally to the minute of when I went down, that was the minute he got cremated.
And then but I do think it was really cathartic to be playing that guy.
And then you have you fast and then you have your intention ties.
And then I had a beautiful sweat after and I mourned him the right way.
You know, it did knock me, though, for like, I'd say six months after I was like.
Am I doing everything or enough?
Am I living my life enough?
Because even if he's not in your life, you're still like to witness that is it was heavy, but I had mourned him.
And, uh, you know, I'm in a good spot now, but it was an interesting thing of, uh,
You just take stock, I guess.
I've never lost somebody close to me, especially in that way.
So, yeah, it was just a blessing to be still on set working and doing that.
So you would sit down with them for an hour or two and talk about what you want out of this.
That's what I was fucking literally saying.
Um, sometimes it's like, do I want to have a kid or a buddy of mine was using heroin for something?
And like you said, even if like I had enough time to understand he was going.
But when they're gone, it's just totally different.
And then you just take stock and you're like, okay, am I doing enough?
Like I didn't hold, I wasn't that son that was like, fuck, where were you?
Why didn't you do this for me?
And you learn that as you get older.
So I would bring him and have a sweat and just give him my energy in this sweat to help him or my dad passed or something or some, it can be light too.
Yeah, and I was with Latrell and a couple other seals on his ranch, and
But still, even today, you know, there's... But the pipes.
So every time I hear the pipes, I'm like, ah, it gets you.
I do want to go to Scotland.
It doesn't have to be so heavy.
So the guy, I hired three pipers for his funeral.
And I got this on fucking video.
And I pull into the parking lot, a little church in the middle of my town.
And they're doing the fucking putting the air in the bag.
And I was like, this time it crushed me.
And I took a video from my truck and I went out, introduced myself.
And he's like, you're not going to fucking believe this.
And I'm like, he's older guy.
And he's like, I played next to your father at the world championships.
This is the guy playing the funeral.
And he was fucking amazing.
And he stayed a while.
And then it was like this little church.
You go into this little gymnasium kind of spot.
Like before, like I start a movie in a couple of weeks and I'm just going to go do a sweat and get ready for that.
And he stayed and played in the back.
And some of my, that I didn't know, but some of my dad's favorite songs.
So I have those on video too.
But it was just beautiful.
And it brought all three boys back together, you know.
Now we're on good terms.
It's been super cathartic.
I was the only one to speak at the funeral.
And I'm in the pew and it's his sister who I hadn't seen in a decade.
And my two brothers and their kids and my oldest is just a puddle.
He's wearing sunglasses and just a mess.
And the priest was actually quite great.
And then my other brother was in front of me and he was a puddle.
And he doesn't like speaking.
And I don't either as me.
I get a little nervous or whatnot.
I'm always good if I'm in character or hiding behind something.
But the priest was like, OK, now's the time to say something.
And the whole church is just like.
And I look at Damon, my other brother, Brody, and Damon looks back at me.
He's like, now's the time.
And I just whatever he's going to energy he's going to give me to go into this shoot.
And then my auntie Lee just squeezed my hand.
I'm like, I'm fucking saying something, aren't I?
She's like, yes, you are.
So I get up and I just said, you know, if there's any light to this whole situation, it's that all three of us brothers are back on great terms now.
Trying to root him emotionally to those circumstances that were so foreign, like the emotional beats of like, I just didn't understand it.
And then for the for Primeval, it was fucking beautiful.
I didn't understand how someone could do what he did.
And then he was very woe is me.
Like he played the victim incredibly manipulatively well.
And I would always say he's like a great coach and he would, a great coach would be like with you, he could train you and push certain buttons, but then he'll do something totally different with someone else and incredibly manipulative.
So I think just trying to root that and understand, I don't think I'll ever understand some of the actions, obviously, to that level, like how someone can do that.
Like I wasn't a good rider.
But it is all out of fear and insecurity and trauma.
Like that part of it, I did understand.
And memorizing the Bible as a defense mechanism.
I'm still not on horses anymore.
Because when he's with, there was over 20 theologians that would get on the call with him.
And I listened to Child Protective Service calls, obviously all the Nesner calls, which was played by Michael Shannon, who's amazing.
And, uh, and every time he got his back to the wall and they had a point or had something or had a level up on him, he would go right into Bible speak, which nobody could keep up with him on.
And he gave me like my horse has a feather.
So he would gain that upper hand.
And I would just go into a fucking dialogue about a dragon with one eye is about to come and show its face and bear its teeth and take the children.
Like, what the fuck do you say to that?
If you're on the call and you're trying to have a rational conversation of like, let the children out.
If you really watch, I have four horses in it, but my first horse has a feather in him.
We want these kids out.
And he just goes into this Bible speak.
You're like, there's no real rebuttal to that.
And that was, he did this with child protective services too on those calls.
He would just go right.
And that was such an anchor to him because nobody could play a card like that.
And he would go to like Oxford and have debates with theologians in the classes.
And that's how he recruited a lot of people that he would win these debates and they would come and join.
And I wanted to do all these in honor of the horses, which obviously the Shoshone do.
Like, really, like, he would write these letters to people and send tapes to Australia and get them to come.
Like, this was incredibly smart guy.
Like, that you have to give to him.
I mean, even the way he's talking about God and the end of days and how he needs to bear, I think, around 22 children that are going to go up with him and ride a cloud up there and all these crazy things.
He had the answers to aliens.
But people, I do want to know.
To your point, though, it's like...
he ended up shooting himself in the head, right?
Which ironically, you don't go to heaven if you do that, which is, but also like he does all this shit.
And I don't know, just that was a big thing for like Paul Sparks and I played my right hand man of like when we shot that death scene of like, man, like I do wish to your point, he was still alive and we could learn shit.
So he just taught me a shit ton about horses.
All these guys, they end this.
They drink the fucking Kool-Aid in the bed.
It's such a fascinating perspective that I do wish we could break that down and maybe learn something from this than just him shooting himself in the head and burning in the house.
just to honor that tribe and honor what they do and to be as authentic as possible.
I mean, nine people survived that.
One of the survivors, Thibodeau, was there with us, his drummer.
What did he say he was like?
It goes back to your point that he still was thinking that he's coming back.
And this didn't come out until our last week of shooting because I got along incredibly well with him.
And he did give us he did write a great book and give me insight to moments that I asked to be in the show.
But I mean, he was going, I don't know, to North Dakota or the Dakotas to someone had blueprints for an alien warship.
So that helped me root Isaac so much.
And he was going to see these blueprints.
And we're just in between takes.
We're in between takes sitting in our set chairs and me and Paul Sparks.
And we're like, hey, what are you doing after this?
And, you know, you're surrounded by seals.
And he went on and told us he was going to look at blueprints to this worship.
So those are the type of guys though that- Wind up in cults.
Like very helpful, was great to us and was very open.
But I mean, a lot of majority of people are followers, right?
I think it was the new light.
He called it the new light.
This is a while ago, but I think it was a new light.
And he got all everyone together and he's like, I just had a word with God and it's the new light something.
And it's where I'm going to I'm the only one now that is going to sleep with the women.
And this guy named Norm, I think he was Australian.
Anyways, this guy was like, fuck that shit.
And like 20, 30 people laughed.
But a lot stayed, right?
Yeah, that's a good point.
I never thought about that.
He did say tanks were coming, and they're here.
So literally, that was a big moment.
That was a big moment.
That must have been freaking out.
The Seven Seals, he was rewriting the Seven Seals, his final days.
There's a guy that ironically was Dick DeGuran, his lawyer.
Yeah, and you meet him when he's mourning, right?
And he was speaking in Santa Fe when we were shooting this.
So I'm like, full fucking stop.
We're going to hear Dick DeGuran speak.
He's speaking about his experiences as a lawyer.
And I went and introduced myself.
And there's a crazy story.
It was Dave's mom who called him.
And was like, this is what's happening.
He was on a fishing trip, I think.
And he's like, yeah, I'm going to go.
So he showed up to the compound on the perimeter that was set.
And he's like, I'm that guy's lawyer in that house.
You need to take me over there.
FBI puts him in a fucking tank.
And he goes to the front door in a tank.
And the door has this big piano.
I've tried getting this in the show, and we couldn't.
And he's lost his wife and his son, and he married into the tribe.
So there's a big piano at the front door, blockade.
Dave wasn't allowed to walk by the windows, all this kind of stuff.
This is deep into the 51-day standoff.
And Dave's right-hand man, played by Paul Sparks and another, his lawyer, Harvard grad, I think, answered the door.
And Dick's like, oh, I see the bullet holes in the ceiling, a couple bodies that the ATF didn't allow you to take out.
You got a case here, but where's Dave?
And they show him the house and all this kind of stuff.
So it's like, he's like, let's get you one.
So the female chief, I married her daughter and had a son.
And so they're back in the foyer and the piano's against the wall and they're talking.
And he's like, okay, I don't, I want to help, but I don't know where Dave is.
And he's like, you got a fucking case.
And the right-hand man just goes, Dave was in the fucking piano listening to this whole thing.
And so he got back in the tank and Dave got briefed of their walk through there.
And anyways, Dick DeGiarin was his lawyer on that.
What a fucking story though.
And I wanted to be in that piano and shoot that.
That would have been unbelievable.
And so when you meet Isaac, he's just in mourning.
That's how nuts he was.
He hid in the fucking piano.
So scared to get shot or didn't trust anything.
But those guys apparently in that tank, they were like ripping Dick DeGuran and like spitting on him and doing this kind of shit because they're like, you do know they just killed a bunch of ATF guys in that shootout as well.
And you're going to go fucking be this guy's lawyer?
And everything is full circle.
He was selling like homemade bulletproof vests and was like, had these.
I'm like, yeah, let's go.
And the ATF were kind of spiraling out.
Like their funding was about, they were about to get defunded and they needed a win.
they needed it what was it the ridge uh ruby yeah there you go so they dropped the ball huge on ruby ridge right say that again yeah so which is at the very beginning of waco and they needed a fucking win here find a cult leader into weapons selling ammunition i think and bulletproof vests and this kind of stuff and this guy's got these kids and all this is perfect
Everything is circular with them.
And that started it of just like, we're going to go get this guy.
And there's a famous tape that we put in the show too, where Dave was like,
You know, why didn't you just like he did this run all the time and was kind of just out and about working on the house, running around.
So the only way he could reunite with his family is to die honorably, right?
He had a fucking go cart track around the the compound.
And he's like, why wouldn't you just arrest me when I'm on a run, when I'm on this or that?
But they needed a lot of press and they needed to get funded again.
So they made this a spectacle and then it fucking turned into what you saw.
Like they were they wouldn't let fire trucks come and take that fire out.
And then they're playing that music of animals being like mutilated into the compound.
Yeah, then they were flying the ATF flag.
I asked for that to be put in, but we didn't put it in.
But they were flying the ATF flag while it was burning down.
So that influences the way I fight.
Picture I-35 right here, fucking tanks and all these armored trucks, everything going down I-35.
And they're just sitting right in front of the house.
51 days is fucking crazy.
So the way Isaac fights is all in.
The kid in the back, I think.
The videos, 20-something kids.
And so we're on the ranch.
I just got chills thinking about this.
Probably, I bet you a month, six weeks until you shed it.
Go do something that makes you feel you and alive.
Do you, like, dream of that guy?
There's a fight, I think, in episode two, which was fucking insane.
Yeah, your subconscious... It's funny because it's like...
That's you marry yourself emotionally to said circumstance.
And so my subconscious and I'm sure a lot of actors will say it's like you're wide open.
And so you're more vulnerable.
I'm way more emotional.
And so because you just do the work and you're just your subconscious is open.
So it might your dreams.
Once I start dreaming a little fucking crazy visceral stuff, that's when I know I'm getting closer for sure.
little bit detox you yeah and fucking exercise the ghost and then it's like you play this guy you know what's fucking crazy was ACL and I was walking and prepping for Waco and randomly out of nowhere this guy is talking about Waco and that it never happened
And we didn't rehearse.
Like this is so random.
And I was with my buddy who's out there and I was like, holy shit, what the?
And we have these one guy's black feet.
we gotta do this story now.
There's people out there that believe that it's just one conspiracy theory that never happened.
There's people that believe a lot.
Just to say that alone just feels like, sorry?
unbelievable guy and I kept using him because he's a great stuntman and So Pete's like you guys are gonna fucking roll down this hill And I want you to fight your way to the river and then we'll cut and then I want you to fight in the river this is like
You know when you get older and people will just straight up, like when they talk at you telling you false shit.
Usually I'll bite and be like, you're an idiot.
This is what is actually happening.
But no, now it's like, all right.
Sometimes it's exhausting though.
How do you believe that?
But they like double down, triple down on it.
Yeah, I just had one of those moments.
Used to be a lot more of those people before the internet.
That's a dangerous game.
I don't read shit, which has really helped me.
It really, like... That's very healthy.
I don't read any reviews.
I learned the hard way, man.
I got hammered on John Carter.
That put me in a dark spot.
But yeah, had to rebuild everything.
But yeah, you're down that tunnel and you're just like,
Like, they're not just like, he's a bad actor.
It's like, this guy should die.
You're a terrible person.
I know you're just trying to write a saucy article, but holy shit.
That's a lot of fucking sauce.
A lot of vitriol there.
Yeah, I was just asked.
Clickbait, negative always beats.
You get more clicks on a negative hit.
And then, you know, that was the beauty of, like, Friday Night Lights.
Like, I never... There weren't reviews, really, and I was just... We didn't have social fucking media.
In Austin, no real producers on set or writers.
We're kind of Pete set it up so great.
And you're just going there slinging, trying shit, failing, trying again.
It was such an amazing experience.
Without any of the weight of like, is this going to be successful?
What does that even mean now?
maybe 28 degrees in that river.
You guys watch this movie till I slept through half
The safety guy is like, whoa, whoa, whoa.
That's a good question.
And like, I don't like the ending.
Even like John Carter was like one of the highest tested movies in Disney's history.
And we got hammered, obviously.
But it's like I don't know how much that moves the needle or anything.
And this is all like on the go.
So JJ dashing on my double is like all in.
This is near the end of the shoot too.
I mean, Terminal is season one.
And the people spoke, man.
Like, that's why Dark Wolf is dark.
You know, it's because people wanted to see why Ben is fucking the way he is and made that decision.
If it didn't, there's no way we would have got that Greenland.
And I don't know how many acres, but he used to have like giraffes on the ranch and shit.
Incredible love of history.
He's a walking encyclopedia.
And that fight was just so fucking intense.
I mean, when he comes onto set, and we're shooting this, episode five, he came to Budapest, and his energy, like, he's like a kid in a candy store, man.
It's like, I'm fucking gassed out, tired, and, like, just...
getting beat up and here comes car and it's just the light it just brings an energy to that set that it's just like man we're so lucky to be here and you're like you know what you're kind of fucking right we are yeah and i just love that guy man super supportive right when i got the role yeah he's like not pressing me he's like i know you've played a seal before if you want any of my notes who ben is and he's like if you want that long leash here it is
Like, he's been nothing but amazing with me so far.
Yeah, so during, if it's you and me, it's like you will walk the area, make sure there's no sticks or whatever that we're going to impale us.
Even like little notes, man, I would get with the gun work and all that kind of shit.
And obviously you listen.
But it's just like he comes at you with just more excitement.
And you don't take it personal.
And you want to get it fucking right.
And when you have him and Jared Shaw, who's another SEAL, and Mendoza, who's a SEAL, and we got an Army Ranger who writes a lot of it.
We're surrounded by these guys every day.
So if they want, if anything is not authentic, you're, I mean, the bullshit meter is, like, fucking two feet away.
And I love that, though.
Because they're doing a lot of my work for me, helping me, making me look like fucking Ben.
A lot of that stuff, like, one of my best buddies is Seal and had, like, 200 guys under him, fought in Ramadi and bomb specialist guy, wicked dude.
there's a moment in the CIA room and in, in episode one that was written.
And then I kind of, I've been hearing this from him for so long.
And so it's kind of ingrained in me of just like how there's always someone to answer to.
And you're never really getting the full transparent part of what they're putting you out for.
So I'd heard all these stories for like the last, since loan, I met him on loan.
And so that scene, I was like, this is for you, man.
I'm just going to fucking go and have at it with this CIA guy.
And he was at the premiere and watched it and loved that beat.
But it's like I get to serve some of these guys that they don't get to have those moments.
And during the fight, I'll be like, okay, I'm going to flip you.
And that's so fun for me to just fucking go and light them up in that room.
One of my favorite scenes.
So I steal from these guys.
Even like, and I get it.
I got hammered or Ben got hammered for being the twist of season one, right?
I'm the guy who kind of orchestrated a lot of it.
And I was talking to Marcus because I'm like, how the fuck am I going to root this guy, this seal that's like best friends with Reese?
And now all of a sudden the twist is like,
man I had a hand in this I'm the guy that put you guys down that tunnel on that op and your whole fucking platoon died for the most part and I just literally it was like a little moment that I had with Latrell where he was talking about going back and dying with his boots on and I was like really settle into what that means this warrior is just decidedly going to die over there serving
And then it's like, okay, I'm going to get on top.
It's beautifully tragic.
And I was like, that is where I hung my hat with Ben of like how I can root this crazy twist of like, I'm making this decision for you, but you're going to go die with your boots on instead of this fucking, you're going to die rotting in this hospital bed, no insurance, your family, all this kind of shit.
I'm like, I'm going to take that decision for you.
So that's where I rooted Ben for season one.
And then I go and open the Mike Murphy Museum with Dan and Marcus and a lot of other SEALs, obviously.
And then Pete will be yelling behind camera to be like, okay, now work your way on top of them.
And a lot of the SEALs were like, I fucking get it.
You know, but a lot of people just were like, how could you?
And I get that part, too.
How could you and I get it?
And how fucking gray it all is.
And how it goes back to like you're in mourning of a buddy.
You broke this promise.
And now I'm on an op and I get in front of the guy that killed this guy's family.
I'm going to fucking put him down.
The beauty of Ben too in this is he's accountable for it.