Mal

Don't say that.

It's not her flesh. I went home to visit a friend this weekend and I ended up helping them with a lot of things around their house and it's Texas. So it was hot and the days were very long, but Dipsy audio app was the perfect companion. Dipsy is the audio app that lets you immerse yourself in these spicy, sexy stories that transport you to your wildest fantasies.

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Do you look back on The Bachelor as as a whole, as a positive experience and something that helped you in your journey?

Thank you for being here. I'm so excited to talk to you. Thank you for having me. Yeah, of course. We obviously all know you from The Bachelor, Bachelor in Paradise, the current show you're on, Gotta Get Out. Yeah, you got it. Yes, we just finished watching it last night. It's a great show. Everybody wants. It's really cute. It's funny.

I'm curious if you feel like this experience at The Bachelor opened you up to other parts of yourself.

But I want to talk about your autism and your queerness and how they intersect. And to do that, can we talk about kind of your early life and your early childhood and what you were like and maybe some of the signs now that you look back on?

Okay, let's depart.

So what... After The Bachelor was when you came out with... Well, actually, on Bachelor in Paradise, you were one of the first queer relationships to come out of that. Yes.

In America.

They did.

How did you decide to really put that out there and...

It's interesting. It's like an interesting way to think about it or go about it because I feel like most people would be so... Well, no.

Did you have to, or they were like totally welcoming of that?

Such a sweetie. But then she showed up.

Honestly, though, with men, I'm kind of the same way. Huh? With men, I'm the same way.

okay so how long after the bachelor or what actually scratch that what led you to want to be tested for autism like was there a catalyst was something going on i stopped drinking alcohol why because i had a problem well who told you that

Shit. Okay. So then you end up in the hospital and you, after that, you just never picked up drinking again? Correct.

Meaning like you're trying to tell yourself don't pee controlling.

porn is something that stands out to me.

It's so interesting. I've never heard of that like rule bound rule. Is that a specific type or is that just like a symptom of autism in general?

maybe it has nothing to do with, but just interesting how you say like in your past, you were so scared of being scolded and like, you know, scared of breaking rules.

That is so interesting. It makes so much sense. And just one note, like I've had a lot of people come and sit on this couch and tell me that they've had the same experience with being gay. Like someone would say, I think I'm gay. And they would say, no, you're not gay. You know what I mean?

So it's like this denial of somebody's like when they're trying to tell you who they are or say like, hey, I might be this thing.

It's like the best thing you could do for that person is to validate that.

Go down the line with them, because if not, all they did was like.

Yeah. Like you don't know yourself.

But they do.

Yeah.

So when you... went and got your diagnosis, what are the tools that they gave you that have really changed your life and help you?

We talk about her late in life autism diagnosis and the tools that she's gotten since that have really helped her out in life. This episode is an absolute treat. Enjoy. Oh, he's eating her feather. Bugs is eating her feather. I went to visit a friend this weekend and I ended up helping them with a lot of things around their house that they hadn't gotten to yet.

So they know how to speak your language.

Right.

What do you think the biggest misconceptions are about autism or autistic people?

Okay. Were there certain... situations or certain moments that felt really isolating to you?

Debbie, I'm obsessed with you. You are fun.

I'm obsessed. And I appreciate you being so open and teaching us a lot. And I feel like it is beautiful that this thing has become a vessel for you to express yourself. I feel like maybe that's the connection. Like for a lot of people, once you figure out you're queer, you're like, oh, okay, I figured I finally figured it out. And then there is so much more room to explore and express yourself.

And so maybe that's the link, but whatever it is, I think it's a beautiful thing.

Yeah, that's beautiful. Merging. Do you have advice for anybody who may think they are autistic or queer?

Where can people find you?

We just need the we need to get the lesbians talking about you.

Okay, we play a game.

It's called You Haul or You Ghost.

So she's perfect in every way except for this, like, one little... Quirk.

You hate her perfume, but this is like her favorite perfume.

But what if she's like, this is what my mom wore and what my grandmother wore. I want to wear this perfume.

Wait, OK, hold on. Backtrack. I where were you coming from? And Virginia, you're coming from Virginia. OK.

My grandma smells great. I have never seen her.

I'm sorry.

I like that.

You know, I had an ex-boyfriend who had moved a lot like.

What about if this is like a very L.A. specific thing? And I feel like I'm guilty of this because I have it in my Instagram bio. If they have their states listed in the that they've lived in.

Yeah. So, yeah. It's so interesting to me. I feel like reality TV, it is a vessel for a lot of people to get out of where they are. Yeah. Yeah, it can be for sure. Because Matilda and I, we also met on reality TV. She was casting me for a show that she created. What was it? And she it was a lesbian like docu follow kind of like a lesbian housewives type thing.

And I think about it and it's like the contracts you sign for reality TV are fucking crazy. But you're not thinking about that. You're just like, I don't care. I want to make money and I want to get out.

Thank you all for listening to today's episode. As always, help us spread the agenda by writing an Apple review, rating us on Spotify and sharing with everyone you've ever met. And if you haven't yet, join our subscription community, Made It In, for exclusive Made It Out media shows, content, and chat rooms at madeitout.supercast.com.

Made It Out is produced by Matilda Jordan and worked on solely by lesbians.

Wait, okay, so did you have an inkling that you might be gay?

sicko yeah that was me yeah but i feel like we all did stuff like that when we were makes me feel better because i feel no don't feel bad i don't think i haven't even told my therapist about some of this it's this couch it just draws it out of you good lighting you know i just feel happy to be here i used to go on craigslist looking for girls like what do you mean they're on craigslist yeah they were on craigslist do they have sex with you for money and

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No, this was like pre dating apps. We didn't have dating apps. So it's like, I didn't know. Well, yeah. Cause like, I didn't know I was trying to figure out my sexuality and I was like, I don't know where to turn. So I would go on like women seeking women on Craigslist. That is so funny. Did you ever find? Yes. I actually, okay. Weirdly enough, this, I found this girl.

I swear. What was her name? And I cannot remember for the life of me, but I kind of believe it because Demi and her cousin or something grew up literally right down the street from me in Texas. Cause she grew up in Texas too. So I'm kind of like, okay, their family is from like, she could be, I don't know, but she claimed to be.

So I, my first lesbian situation might've been with Demi Lovato's cousin. If you're out there, let me know. I don't know.

Yeah. And then, and then what would you do? You'd be back on Demi.com. Probably.

Truly, truly. Cause I used to do that too. I would be like in full relationships with guys who cares if I ever fucked them, but I would be masturbating to them.

Literally, I've never heard it said like that, but yes. It did. I resonate with that. Oh, my God. Okay, but then, so what led you to Bachelor? Like, how did that all kind of happen?

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and possible misconceptions of what I have of autism. That seems like it could be a really scary... No, that's what everyone thinks.

Okay. So that, but what about like the social situations and with the other people? Cause that seems like a lot of people all the time.

So do you feel like you were more yourself?

Yeah.

I agree with this. I was not ever one of those people that dated a bunch of people at one time. I couldn't manage it.

Yeah. I mean, now I feel like if you're putting that energy out there, you'll attract that back. If you're getting rid of all of the people that are kind of fucking around with you.

Certain terms apply, so be sure to check the site for details. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sarah.

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