Jon Tester
Appearances
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Great to be here. Thanks for having us, Chuck. We appreciate it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
So I'm not a journalist. I'm a farmer and a U.S. senator. I'm a policy guy. When the election happened and I was unemployed, a journalist that I respect a lot in Montana emailed me and said, hey, would you be interested in doing a podcast? And I thought about it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And I thought, you know, one of the things I think is always a challenge is where do you go to get information that's good information so you can make a good decision? And I thought, you know what? Maurice is solid. She's good at what she does. One of the best in the state of Montana. And why not? Let's give it a go.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And if it, you know, it's one of these things that if it bombs, it bombs and we'll figure out something else. But if it works and it goes and it's valuable and people think it's a good source of information and we can get good people on, It's worthwhile to do. So that's pretty much why we did it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Besides that, it's turned out to be a lot of fun, you know, and an opportunity to actually deliver some information, get some opinions from folks that we trust. And it's been solid. It's been good. It's been fun.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Oh, absolutely. No, I mean, look, I think the area between the two mountain ranges tend to be forgotten about a lot. And we're both products of who we are. I'm a product of rural America. Some would say it's even frontier America. And that's the approach I'm going to take when we're talking about issues.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And I think it's really important to talk about issues, but then especially at this moment in time, people want to know how they can be effective as citizens, how they can make sure their voices are being heard. And so whether we're talking about tariffs or whether we're talking about public lands or whatever, the many issues we've talked about,
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
We usually try to end up the show saying, well, now here's what you can do. And by the way, sitting on your hands is not an option here. If you feel that these issues are important to you, then you got to be part of the ecosystem. But no, there's no doubt about it, Chuck. We are going to bring a perspective. Some would call it a rural America perspective.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
I'll just call it a perspective that's not an east or west coast perspective to the issues that are out there.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, I mean, you're exactly right. I mean, we're taping this show in a recent Florida state shooting just happened where two people lost their lives and got hurt. And, you know, that kind of stuff just rips your guts out. But I'll also tell you this, you're exactly right. From a protect your home perspective, in rural areas, man, it takes a long time just because of distance, no other reason.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
No, that's all it is. It's not anything else, right? No. Just distance. It just takes a while for folks to get there. So you need to have some way to protect your homes. But that does not mean any extent that anybody out there that's a gun owner should should say, you know, that Florida state shooting needs to happen. It doesn't need to happen.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And you can still protect yourselves and you can try to stop those kind of things from happening. But you're exactly right. And I've never even even thought about that, that if if the center of the universe was Omaha, Nebraska. Right. or anywhere else in the middle, you're right. The perspective would be different and probably noticeably different, quite honestly.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, well, look, I would applaud that effort when I was a U.S. senator because it's 2,000 miles from here to Washington.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
That's true, but that's Bozeman, and Bozeman's still four and a half hours from where I live. So I still have a shot to get to the airport that has the nonstops. But the bottom line is that you're right. From a news perspective, the areas that are more rural versus urban get reported on. But quite frankly, don't don't get reported on nearly as much as they probably should.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And because of that, I might add, political people tend to pit urban versus rural when we have the same challenges out there. We have to have the same challenges for the most part, with the exception of distance. We all want to be able to, you know, have good health care and put food on the table and have a good job and be able to send their kids to college, all that stuff.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I'm going to tell you that I think that I've been involved in state politics and federal politics since since 98. So a little over 25 years. And I see the change. Right. I think it's changed. The absolute biggest change. We always had young TV reporters that were looking to go to bigger markets. That's always been.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
But what we always had is we had seasoned reporters working for print media. That isn't happening anymore. Those seasoned political reporters are gone. And those political reporters not only reported on what was going on in Washington, they reported on what was going on locally. And they held us all accountable. And they were the local historian in some ways. They knew
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
more about this stuff than anybody right absolutely they they had they had the uh the corporate memory to go be able to go back and institute the memory i should say to be able to go back and be able to report and say this is what happened back in 1979 and this is and it's no different or by the way these guys are screwing up because they're doing this and that accountability
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
is critically important for a democracy to work and work well. Without that accountability, you've got public servants that are out there doing stuff that they shouldn't be doing, and nobody knows about it. And it's not to the best interest of their constituents and certainly not the best interest of democracy.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
They shouldn't be. They absolutely shouldn't be. And you contributed to a lot of things. I actually contributed to campaign finance and the amount of money that's coming into these. But that's probably a different topic for a different show that we could talk all day about. But the bottom line is, is that we need Robert C. Byrd back in Congress.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Robert C. Byrd would be going crazy right now with Congress giving up the responsibility and saying, go ahead, do it by executive order. We're not going to pass a law that either does this or pass a law that says no.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And I watched, you know, you watch the Sunday shows, and I've watched many people in leadership and stand up and go, well, you know, the tariff thing, absolutely, the president has the power to do this. The only reason the president has the power to do this is because you guys aren't calling bullshit on it. That's why he's got the power to do it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Well, yeah, that kind of screwed up. That philosophy doesn't work today.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
But you know what has made this country what I think has made this country great my entire lifetime is that Congress hasn't just rolled over all the time, that they've actually challenged the president. They've actually had the debate on the Senate for the House and and did their jobs as the forefathers set it up.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
What we've seen and it didn't happen just with the Trump presidency, as you just pointed out, it's been. No, this is a 21st century phenomenon. It's been going on. And the truth is, is that we're all more concerned, and I think it's because of campaign finance, about raising the money to run for elections rather than the job we were elected to.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And that's to make sure we put in good policy that allows our kids and grandkids to be successful and keep this country a democracy.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
So to go back just a little bit, as you've already pointed out, Montana was the state that mined the copper that wired this country. And 100 years ago, a little over 100 years ago now, those dudes had a lot of money, the copper kings. They had a lot of money, and they ran this state, quite honestly. It wasn't the Aggies, it wasn't the cattle guys, it wasn't those copper guys.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And it came down to a point where when... When when the legislatures picked the senator, they went in with a bag of cash, literally went in with a bag of cash and said, here, vote for this dude. You get this money. And they did it and they got it accomplished. That resulted in the people going, the people going, this is baloney. We're going to make sure this doesn't happen again.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And they were they passed voter initiatives to stop it and had some of the best campaign finance because it put caps and made everything transparent. And you guys had the toughest campaign finance laws in the country for a long time. Because it was being abused over 100 years ago, that's why. People said, this isn't how it should work. My voice isn't being heard anymore.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
It's just the rich dude's voice is being heard. And it happened, and it worked. And it worked well until Citizens United and McCutcheon and all those court decisions came down to court that the Supreme Court did that I argue may be some of the worst that they've ever done. And it's resulted in, in Vallejo before that in 1976,
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
where they said money equals speech, when in fact it might, but it also says that if you got a lot of money, your speech is a hell of a lot louder than if you don't have money. And so it's really skewed the system. And what has resulted, by the way, A campaign like mine, my first one in 2006, all in, both sides, primary, everything, $27 million. This last one I just got done, over $275 million.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
You were not short of cash either.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
It's a huge area. It was so much money. And this has happened actually ever since 2006. TV stations run on two year budget cycles. Why? Because these races come up and they they make enough money. I watched a station. They had a brand new set. They said, boy, this is nice. They said, thank you.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
That's right. They're really unhappy that Bullock and Tester aren't around anymore.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, the other thing I want to add is that people probably don't vote on this. You're exactly right, Chuck. But I do think people are concerned about it. And not just Democrats, not just Republicans in a very bipartisan way. I think they see the negative parts. And one of the things that we're seeing right now is we're seeing nobody doing town hall meetings.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
They've been told, don't do town hall meetings. What's the only time that you could really get a senator or a congressman to do a town hall meeting? During election. Now they don't even have to do it then. They just put the ads up and then they go underground and just let the ads do the talking. And it's really, I think people are getting sick of it. I really do.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And I think there is going to be an opportunity, if handled correctly, to be able to make some, ain't going to be able to fix it all in one fell swoop, be able to make some steps in the right direction to put more transparency on this money and find out who's trying to influence your opinion on this election and why.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
It shouldn't be. I think part of it has to do with, I think, leadership on both sides. Yeah, I think this is an advantage for each one of their parties.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah. No, that's right. And instead, let's just do the right thing. Let's just fix it. I mean, and by the way, you know, this, the candidates do have the caps. They do are supposed to be transparency. The problem is, is the money. And I would say most of the money is flying through these C4s, which is total dark money.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
So let me give you a real one that happened last week. Making the weather. We're going to talk about men playing girls basketball. And I say to people, show me one example in the state of Montana where this is happening. Just one example. But no, that's what the ads on TV were about, for God's sake. So it wasn't about the national debt. It wasn't about climate change.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
It wasn't about what we're going to do in health care. It wasn't about education. None of that. It was about men playing women's sports. And by the way, it may happen somewhere in the country, but it sure as shit doesn't happen here. We'd know about it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
No, I don't think so. I think it's spot on. I think, you know, I might not look like it, but occasionally I go down to the gym and you'd find out all sorts of things that were going on in people's heads that were normal. And then... And they would say stuff that's absolutely crazy. And and I think you're exactly right.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
That's why I say on the podcast many times, I know the people in the Senate and they're better people than this. They should be holding the president accountable. And I get emails that goes, how can you say these are good people when they're not holding?
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
That's right. And if you if you they know what's right, there's there's something else going on out there, whether they're worried about their safety or worried about political retaliation.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Absolutely right. And Lisa is one of my favorite people. I work with her on the infrastructure bill. She is solid. I mean, I will tell you that trust is something that doesn't exist in Washington, D.C. One, the reason the infrastructure bill went is there was trust developed between the senators. We knew we weren't going to stab one another in the back.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
We were going to do the right things for the right reasons. That is Lisa Murkowski in a nutshell. Do I agree with her all the time? No, but I don't agree with my wife all the time. So that's normal, okay?
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
fact is she does what she think is right and in this particular case you're exactly right uh i would love to get her on our podcast to talk about what she's my greta garbo brother i the only person i could never book on my 10 years of meet the press
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, that's true on one hand. On the other hand, maybe it will help or influence the other folks in the United States Senate to make sure the Senate acts like Robert C. Byrd thought the Senate should act and hold the executive branch accountable. I think she sees it. You can tell it by the note that she put out. And quite frankly, she's disturbed by it greatly.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And I will tell you, I am too, by the way. There's barely a day that goes by that I don't think about who's going to do the job that they were elected to do. And should just Congress go home and we'll save the $165,000 a year that we're paying these dudes? Because they're not doing anything. They're not doing what they need to do that the forefathers had in mind.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And instead of reading the Constitution and looking for loopholes, they ought to just read the Constitution, period, instead of carrying it around in their front pocket and bringing it out while they got the flag wrapped around them, because we're losing that right now. We're losing it right now, right, wrong, or indifferent.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
What's going on in Washington, D.C., the forefathers would never recognize at this moment in time.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Let me tell you a quick story, Chuck. So when I was a U.S. Senator, we did a little Zoom broadcast with some folks from Viacom, which is a parent company. And one of the people had a background of the barn with the brand on it. Yep.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
And a bunch of Angus cattle in front of it. And, you know, me being the guy who's trying to, you know, break the ice, I said, geez, you raise Angus cattle? And they said, no, that's the background for Yellowstone. And so what I've got to tell you is that I've never watched the show before. I've never watched it. I truly have never watched it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
My brothers, they're much older than me, so they got nothing to do with watch television. They love it. They absolutely love the show, or did love it. But as far as it's... Images of Montana, look, it's bringing people in. It's helping with the economy. There's no doubt about that. But as far as its accuracy, I really can't tell you. I doubt it's accurate, but I haven't really seen it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Wow, you don't watch it.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
So I watch, I don't stream much at all. I watch a lot of sports, okay? If I'm watching, I shouldn't say I watch a lot of sports. If I'm watching TV, it's usually baseball, basketball, or football. All right, let's go. Who's the baseball team? Who's your baseball team? So when we first moved to the farm, Wednesday night was baseball night in Canada. This was before satellites.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
We got, oh, that's bridge TV. And quite frankly, the Expos or the Blue Jays were on every Wednesday night. And I got both fans. So are you a Nats fan? Are you with me? Are you a Nats fan? So I'm a Nats fan, but I never admit it, okay? Never admit it. Oh, wow. On Washington, D.C. I'm really proud.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Exactly. As well, they should. And they had a great team. It's before I fully. Oh, the 94 team. Oh, even before that, we're talking early eighties. We're talking, you know, 81.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Yeah, the pitcher. They had a fun team to watch. Let's just put it that way because they had people who could steal bases. They had people who could run the ball down. They played decent defense. Their pitching was good, and it was fun to watch.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
You're there. Wrong idea. Bad idea. Those folks are friends of mine, and I want to keep them friends. I'm not sure they want to be friends of mine right now because of all the crap that's going on. But it would be good if they came into the country. That would be good for Team Blue. I mean, I called Trump's bluff. You're like, all right.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
I'd rather have him as our best friend and neighbor and keep working with him as we have in the past because they're good people and they deserve to be treated better than us.
The Chuck ToddCast
The Decline Of Local Journalism + Money Is Corrupting Politics
Absolutely. Thank you.