John Hansman
Appearances
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
There is minimum distance that depends on the conditions. So if it had been cloudy and they were being controlled by radar, there is a minimum distance that has to be separated, which is actually very large. As a result of that, that slows traffic down into areas into Reagan, etc. So you would actually have to shut off the jet traffic to allow a helicopter to go by.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
And it's not just the military helicopters. At the same time, there was a medevac helicopter that was operating in the airspace. So this is really a result of Reagan being so close to And they've worked out procedures where the helicopters stay over the water and move around so that there are sort of standard procedures.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
And the minimum when you're given visual separation and you accept the responsibility, which the helicopter did. is that you then, you're responsible for staying out of it, but there is no minimum distance at that point. It's just where you feel safe and clear.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
It's like driving your car around a parking lot. Don't hit the other car. Don't hit the other airplane. So, I mean, you're used to the different dynamics and speeds in whatever. And, you know, they should have been able to do it. So was there a miscalculation? Did they get distracted? Did they see the wrong target? Were they using night vision goggles or something? We don't know that.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
This is what will be the focus of the investigation. So I think that, you know, you wouldn't do this on purpose. So there was clearly some sort of... And the thing that we try to do in accident investigation is to dig into the cause. What is it that would have caused the pilots to be head down? And we don't know what that is right now.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Yeah. I mean, would something go on in the helicopter? Was somebody sick and they got distracted? That's what I'm saying. There can be distraction. There could be equipment problems. This was a training mission. They could have been focused on what they were doing on the training, so we don't know. But they, up until that point, appeared to be operating normally.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Yeah. I mean, you know, but doesn't look very good right now.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Thanks, Megan. Thank you. Thank you.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Well, we're obviously still looking at all the information that's coming in, but Um, apparently, uh, this was sort of good visual conditions. You could, airplanes could see each other, um, in a, uh, area like Washington, um, national, you have, uh, military operations to the Pentagon and things like that. And you have the airport right there.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
So it's not unusual in these kinds of conditions for the air traffic controllers to allow the airplanes to look at each other and self separate in this case. The controller had given the clearance to the helicopter to avoid the traffic, to basically have them in sight.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
And apparently, for whatever reason, the helicopter pilots got distracted or something happened and they didn't see the airplane and collided.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Yeah, I think, and I don't know if you want to play it again, but the helicopter is actually, it's just a very light dot that's moving from left to right, okay? In the airplane, you're actually seeing their landing light coming at you. In the bigger picture, there was another airplane behind, So what happens in a place like Logan, or I'm sorry, National, you'll have multiple airplanes lining up.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
So this is the way you might. So the one you see now in the distance is an airplane that's behind, right?
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
Yeah, the helicopter is coming from left to right in the image. So it's a very faint line. They don't have a very light thing. And so this is one of the issues. Did the helicopter pick up the wrong traffic? They were given the location when they acknowledged the traffic over the bridge at 1,200 feet. So they knew where to look. They saw a target there. Was it the right one? It's not clear.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
The other thing that we understand is that this was a night training mission. One of the things that happens in night training missions is the pilots will be actually using night vision goggles. Normally, you would not use night vision goggles in the city. You would use it in a dark area. But who knows, were they through the goggles?
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
In the goggles, things kind of blow up, so they're harder to get depth perception.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
You wouldn't be using them near the city because what happens is when you have lots of lights, they kind of glare out or they blow out on the image. So it's hard to distinguish things. So use the night vision goggles in dark areas. And when you get to where there's lots of lights, you would normally not use them. So I would be surprised if they were using them.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
The one other thing I would say is that, go ahead, I'm sorry.
The Megyn Kelly Show
Tulsi vs. the Establishment, Kash on Hot Seat, and RFK's Final Push, with Glenn Greenwald, Calley Means, and More | Ep. 996
So the controller did point out a few seconds before that, did see they were close and did confirm to the helicopter, go behind the jet, don't go in front of it. So there was acknowledgement on the part of the controller. They did do a reminder to the airplane. It may have been too late by that point.