John Fetterman
Appearances
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
The truth story behind the hoodie thing, it's like I never went to anybody or Schumer, anyone to ask for that. You know, I read about that. I'm like, I'm like, I never asked for those kinds of thing. I was never going to like just give speeches, you know, hoodie there. So, yeah. But for me, I'm a comfort guy, and I'm also a lazy man, and I don't have to iron it.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
It's just easy to wash it, and I'm ready to go. And plus, it's hard to find suits, too.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Because for me, it's been born from my commitment to never... to pick on anybody. I mean, when I was very young, I got bullied and picked on. And that really kind of shaped a lot of my experience. And I'm not part of those communities, you know, LGBTQ kinds of things. But now, like that really started when I was a small town mayor, when gay marriage was illegal. Literally, it was illegal.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And then there was an opportunity. There was someone starting to sign those things. And I said, a hundred percent, I got on TV. I'm like, I'll sign them, come with me. And that was illegal. And then the governor at the time threatened to have me arrested. And then I said, well, Hey, you know, you know where I live, bring it, bring it. And I signed for those things.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And that was the first, I was at the time the only official in Pennsylvania willing to sign those. And they all became legal. And that was back in 2013. And so it's the same kind of thing. It's like marriage equality. I really support that. And if I was convicted of that crime, because technically it was a crime, I'm like, well, hey, then that might be the end of my political career. But
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
You know, I'll never, you know, degrade somebody based on who they love. And now for this, and I'm not dumb either. I know the polling. And now a lot of people are saying it's absurd, it's absurd kinds of thing. And now, so for me, that's when I felt like it's a time to really say, look, now for me, it's about I'm not going to bully or I'm not going to degrade those.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And now, you know, we're a 13 million population. People in our state. And it's a small, small number of people that are involved on that. And I have a I have a 13 year old daughter and she plays basketball and I'm not afraid that she's going to get mowed down.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
But but for me, but it turns into an issue that is more appropriate to be handled on a very hyper local level and not dropping them into a meat grinder and a national finds and weaponizing that. And I know I'm not dumb. I know that there'll be commercial saying, you know, Fetterman's for they them and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, hey. You know, like bring it in.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I'm not I'm not afraid to stand for my side on that, because for these kids, for me, how difficult that it is. And now in this kinds of a world, nuance goes to die and having a more meaningful conversation on that. It's difficult right now. So for me, I made that choice and I could have tried to kept my head down like a lot of my other colleagues decided to do that.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
But for me, even though I know it's politically unpopular, I think that's the kind of time to do that. And I do believe that a person's character is defined by the things that they're willing to do, even if that moves against their political interests.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
You know, he's in my opinion, he's going to get the worst of both worlds of that. I mean, he's going to be seen as just flip flopping and he's going to he's going to anger like his progressive base. And then and we all know why he's doing those kinds of things. So and then and then on the other side are going to know why he's making those kind of changes.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
So for me, like it's like he's going to own the worst of both of those worlds for that reason.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I did a video. I'm like, look, I mean, it was not, there was a time when it wasn't controversial. Desegregating the military was incredibly controversial at the time. I'm not going to serve. I'm not going to fight. I'm not going to bunk with black soldiers. Now, of course, that needed to change. And then there was, I'm old enough to remember when don't tell, don't ask thing.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And now it's like, regardless of who you, who you love. I mean, you know, that doesn't make you more lethal or more suitable to be a soldier based on who you love. That was really front and center with the Hegseth nomination. Well, what about women in combat and out based on their gender? And when you have gender neutral kinds of things that and then it's it shouldn't matter based on your gender.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And so regardless on how you identify, you know, that doesn't make you any more or less lethal. And as long as you're able to meet those kinds of a standard for me, it's about it's about the dignity, the dignity of the soldier. And I'm not going to degrade that based on their race, obviously, on their gender, on who they love and not how they identify.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And that's why I did that video, knowing that it's not politically popular. So that's why I decided to lean on that, because I think it's part of that narrative, that arc of whether what was really controversial and unthinkable based on race. And now we're along that arc.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
it was considered controversial, you know, it's like based on who you, who you, who you love. Like, I don't understand that. And, and I'm like, for me, like for, for, I say to my conservative friends, it's like, it's about freedom, freedom. It's one of those are the kinds of the fundamental kinds of things on, you know, I love the freedom to love who you love.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And, and now if you have that kinds of internal conflict about your gender, you know, I didn't experience those kinds of things, but I know people that have and they are coming from a very sincere place and they are trying to live their truths. And I don't think that they don't deserve to be ridiculed or turned into pariahs.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And definitely, you know, teenagers especially, I'm not going to be part of dropping them into that meat grinder.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I've been unapologetically pro-Ukraine. You know, I'm like one of the best things I've ever done as a senator. I voted for the aid for Israel, for Ukraine and Taiwan. I mean, like for me, that's a global struggle against democracy. And obviously, Russia was the aggressor. Well, I'm old enough. I say this before. I'm like when I grew up, I'm like Red Dawn.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I'm like, you're cheering for the Wolverines, the Wolverines. And Russia was the evil empire. And it is. It is. If you disagree with Putin, two days later, they find you because you fell out of a window. So I absolutely didn't agree with what happened in the White House. But I didn't jump on and started yelling. But two things can be true at the same time.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I certainly didn't appreciate what happened in the White House, but it's also undeniable that Ukraine doesn't have, you know, he doesn't have all the cards. I mean, what's true now, too, the president is the commander of chief, and he has the ability to shape and really alter the contour of that situation. And if we're moving towards peace, you know, I don't want to inflame that situation.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Again, Putin is a killer. And of course, Russia is our enemy always. And that hasn't gone to change. My hope is. is that it is moving towards because I do not believe that the war in Ukraine is sustainable. And I have met amputees. I have met them. I have met them. And they're getting all back to the front line. And now if you're sending those wounded men there, it's a terrible situation.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And if there's a path for peace, I don't agree those kinds of terms necessarily. And I fully support seizing. There's about 218 billion of seized Russian assets. And I'm absolutely like they need to seize that. And those are the kind of assets that should rebuild it. We should rebuild that. And I don't think we should extract those kinds of funds and repaid our nation.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I thought it was always a bargain to break and humiliate the Russia military and demonstrated their lack of capabilities.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
What I'm saying, though, is like, of course, we're you know, there are there are things that are concerned, but without realizing the circumstances and part of the reasons why we ended up in this place. I mean, I'm a big believer in American democracy. And right now, when we're 53 and 47 in my in the Senate here. And they they own the government right now.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And of course, they're going to lose the House. I hope they're going to lose the House. So they're going to do a lot of these things. I don't agree with a lot of those things. You know, do you do you think what they did during the so to if you thought that was smart messaging, if you landed? I mean, I, you know, I don't agree with that.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
What I'm saying, though, is what I witnessed wasn't helpful and that wasn't moving the ball for Democrats. I don't I don't believe that. And if you can't just all stand and cheer for a 13 year old boy that got I mean, I have a 13 year old myself, you know, got over cancer. I mean, that's the. That's the wrong message. I agree. Can't you do both?
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I remember, I remember, I remember when Joe Wilson, Joe Wilson, that jerk off yelled, you lie, you lie, you know, and, and everyone recoiled. And then like, that was appalled by that. And it's like, yeah. So, so now we became the Joe Wilson of 2025. And that was a loser in 2009. And I don't think that's a winner or it's appropriate anymore now in 2025. Yeah.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I don't agree with all those things. Yeah. I don't understand what their upside is. You know, I don't know what they get out a lot of that chaos. But now they seem to be wanting to triple down on some of that kinds of thing. But but I do believe, of course, is that, you know, if you become the party of chaos, you lose.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And the second Americans decide it's like, you know, you know, people aren't going to vote for chaos. And if you can create more and more and more kinds of chaos again, of course, there is going to be a backlash. So that's where we're at.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Most of them, the, the border, the border, you know, like I, I really pushed and got, they got Lakin, you know, I was like the co-sponsor for Lakin and then Israel, Israel. Absolutely. Yeah. You know, like, you know, so not not not most people like you.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
That was eight or nine years ago. I mean, and that was about very basic kinds of things. And like I've described, it's like, you know, the label left me, you know, like it wasn't that. So eight years ago, the world, you know, the world was much different. People thought that it was unthinkable that Donald Trump could win. And he did. Now, I would like to remind everybody, Trump won.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
you know, won two out of the three last cycles and he nearly could have won the 2020. So why? And I'm trying to figure out a way forward. You know, hey, I wish I had a deep blue state or a district and I can yell and get on and be like, ah, you know, but that's easy, you know, and then they can monetize that and they can jump on an email and raise money for their campaign for that thing.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
But for me, I'm trying to find a way forward for our party and I'm not going to be a mansion. I'm not going to be, you know, I'm not going to go independent or doing all those kinds of things. So, but you know, when, when you represent one of the most purple land in the country and,
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And I don't believe I stopped believing in on like cheap heat online and just yelling just because I don't agree with it on the time. If you yell at everything, then everything just becomes absurd. That's why, you know, does anybody call the police when they see or hear a car alarm going off? You know, no, people ignore that.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
So if everything, you know, and the world is on fire and that actually doesn't happen, people stop listening or just assume that that's really what you do. So I want to be very selective. And now like a constitutional crisis. The second the president defies the Supreme Court or any of that, that defines, that's literally the definition of a constitutional crisis.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And I'd be the first person to just be like, no, we have a, you know. So I think if you pick your own fights. So I like to believe that, you know, your words will matter more if it's not always spending time yelling and saying that the world's going to end.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Well, I think it's both. I mean, for me, if anything, what happened about Israel? What happened on 10-7? A lot certainly changed. I was shocked at the way that members of my party, the way they behaved for that. And also the border. I mean, you know, if you've been on my social media, I dropped a chart. And it's like, you know, what's real chaos? What's real chaos? You know?
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
250, 300,000 people showing up at our border every month. That's the size of Pittsburgh. And now like that's real chaos. That's chaos. And the Democrats have no, had no answer to say, well, oh, it's all going to work out. It's all just fine. You know, like everything's fine. There's nothing wrong there. So that really is, that's, that's true chaos.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And I, I, as my party tried to, you know, I tried to warn that we're going to, we're going to, be punished by this and trying to pretend that we're wrong. And I always knew we were going to get rolled on that bipartisan deal thing. Do you think Trump's going to give and walk that and give that away? I always say, like, I'm never going to pick a fine on fried chicken with Colonel Sanders.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
He owns the border and does, and that's definitely too valuable for him to hand that away. So it's obvious that we were going to get rolled on.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I'm not sure. I've witnessed that starting back in 2015-16.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I'm not like a you should, you should, you should guy. It's my own examples and the kinds of things that I happen to believe. And that's why I'm willing to talk to everybody. And that's not why I think that everything that comes from a Republican is bad or evil or it's terrible. And I try to find...
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Things that we can agree, and there's some things that we're not going to agree on, on all of those things. But I promise you, a lot of the messaging that's being emerging in every sense after the inauguration, I don't think that's going to be the kinds of messaging that's going to change our party in the ways that can avoid that we end up in a way not different than we were back in 2024. Yeah.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I think they've been there. They're very, very bizarre. We were forced to spend till five in the morning to keep having all these empty show votes, you know, trying to tie the Republicans to billionaires. I'm like, They campaign with a billionaire. I'm like, we love them. They announce it. They get in front of now. And now they just went at the State of the Union speech.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Hey, I love that billionaire. That's my partner. Having all of these silly votes till five in the morning, that never went anywhere. It all just vanishes and never goes anywhere. I don't agree with a lot of this messaging. It's not helpful.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I'm just going to continue to try to find a way forward, but I'm not going to spend time yelling online and dropping silly videos or just... You had lunch with Trump and I don't know, he's easy to flatter, right?
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
I mean, there'd be there'd be a lot of there's a lot of things. But I don't I don't flatter myself to think that, you know, like as a Democrat, a senator is going to carry how much weight on that. But I don't understand what they're getting out of the chaos. I'd like I'd like to say, like, if the Republicans stop being dicks, they're never going to they're going to lose an election.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And if Democrats don't stop getting kind of crazy or goofier or. fringy, then they're never going to lose another election. It's like there's a lot of overreaction. So I really don't understand a lot of the chaos. And then when they say things that are absolutely not true, you just diminish your own credibility.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
So I think if they make some of those small changes, but I don't agree with many of the things that happen. But when I do happen to agree that we do need to secure our border, and I do think we need to really stand firmly behind Israel. I do. I agree with a lot of those things. Well, Tim.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
We talked to a lot of different things. I talked to everybody as long as people are playing it straight. And that's what it was. It was a conversation.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
And again, you know, it's like That's one of the and I never divulge what happens in private conversations. I mean, you know, they're always we always have to have honor amongst the thieves. Otherwise, things would completely break down. I met with all of the secretary nominees and we all had conversations and I never just ran to the press or said things and did that kinds of things.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
It's like I play things straight. I will want people to play me straight. And as long as people do the same thing, I'm going to have a dialogue with with virtually anyone.
The Bulwark Podcast
Neera Tanden and John Fetterman: They're Playing With People's Lives
Very good. Okay, thank you.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Oh, yeah. No, no. It's just the whole setting. And I'll never forget. I was walking along the trail during a game, and a ball for the very first time, it actually – somebody knocked it out of it, and it landed right in the river there. Yeah. And I thought, what's happening here? I thought, and everybody I could see was yelling and screaming, trying to get it.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And then, and it was really kind of weird, but somebody actually jumped in the river to catch it. And I'm like, you know, I don't, you shouldn't do that because, you know, that's a big river and who knows. But, but no, that, I think at the time, that was the first time somebody, I think it was like, I think it was someone on the mats, but they knocked it out of the park for the first time.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Oh, well, of course. That's the official state religion.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Oh, yeah. Well, of course. People need to have to understand it. Are you ready for the Aaron Rodgers experience? Yes. Well, I watched that documentary about him and, you know, with the ayahuasca and a lot of the other stuff. And I'm like, I'm a Packer fan.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't know, but I think it's doing your due diligence to watch that documentary to really understand what's coming. No judgment, no judgment. Let's just say he's an individual and we're all unique individuals.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah, well, that's the thing. Like, I dress like a slob here, you know, so we all have our own kind of quirks. But again, anyway, I do recommend that documentary.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah, there's a lot of fear and there's a lot of anger and there's a lot of frenzy. You know, almost like a... desperation to just do something tangible or something like that. And for me, that's really came to head when we, it's like, well, are we going to shut the government down? And for me, I found that to be incredibly dangerous. I would even describe that as like a honey trap for a Democrat.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now you have the Republicans in the House, I assumed they were going to have all of their votes because they were all explained where this is the best chance in generations to goad the Democrats to shut the government down. And now we have Musk and the Project 25. It's like, you know, we could do whatever we want, you know, and then we would have, they would have to beg us to open it back.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
So like essentially daring us to that. And I honestly thought at one time, Chuck, that I might be the only one because I was genuinely surprised too where Schumer- You were the only one willing to say it out loud before the vote.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, I mean, for me, it's like I try to be like, hey, I get the energy. And I knew that that was going to a lot of people be upset. But I really just I'm like, I think it's important to remember, we used to be the party that refused to shut the government down.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And I don't think whether it's your own life or politically, you don't make your best judgment and your choices when you're angry and you just are desperate to do something tangible.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
For me, that... For me, that was such the first opportunity to release a lot of the steam. To me, that was putting the country before party by not shutting the government down. Now, for me, the damage for millions and millions of Americans and the kind of chaos, I'm not sure we are in the position to withstand that. I was really, really... Just deeply, deeply concerned.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now we are going to revisit that in the next five and a half months now. And I just I try to say, like, we can't shut this down. We got to find a better way to effectively push back or just fight. But with doing that with the truth that America handed the keys to the Republicans in the trifecta, and now they have the Supreme Court as like they're with a six to three slant for their side.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Americans, I hope we can realize that we do not have the ability to pass or block things except with the filibuster. But that's when what happened. I did not vote for the CR. But once it was unbundled, then I voted against the CR. But my vote was like, we can't shut the government down. And I understand the base wanted that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, I think it's trying to pick your spots on pushing back. Like, for example, the signal. I mean, that's shocking. I mean, and that is dangerous. That's the kind of unacceptable kinds of behavior and reckless. I really want to weigh in on that. And some of the other things, that's part of their plan. They design it to be like the flooding the zone thing. And
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
becoming like a nonstop firing off, firing off, firing off, pretty soon it won't take long before people stop paying attention to it.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, I mean, I, uh, there, there might be some that do care about it, but, but I do think I'd like to remind people that, that I like to think the administration's counting on people are all going to move on and, you know, they have, they have the playbook where never apologize, never back it up, never just, you know, keep pushing, keep going on.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now I, I don't know, but, but like, I will try to explain that a lot of my, uh, constituents really exactly sure what USAID was about.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But we also have to remember that people have a limited bandwidth. It's not like people are going to hook themselves in and listen to every last thing that we hang on or that we're sitting around in the parking lot at Walmart. I'm like, let me download the Ezra Klein, you know, It's like this is the thing.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
People have all different kinds of sources, whether it's social media, whether it's their friends, how that is. People sometimes forget that they are not preoccupied with a lot of the things that are happening here.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't know, but I think it's about – I like to think that when you speak or when you do have opinions, I think if there's less, people will maybe take more attention on those things or it might matter more. So there are plenty of things that I don't – I don't agree with the vast majority of these things.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But I would like to remind other folks, we don't have the ability to produce constant outrage because we have to find, you know, the governance is front and center here and in the face of a lot of things that I don't understand. You know, that doesn't mean we support these things. But when there is a vote, I...
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
We are in the minority, and they own the government right now until—and I do expect that we will get the majority back in the House in January of 27.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah. No. I mean, and it's the same time that happened in 2017, 2018, where people wanted to celebrate or see like... I don't think every small election is like the oracle, but it's something that we want to celebrate. But it also is part of... That just means that we went back to 27, 23 in the pennant senate.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
We're still a permanent minority effectively, and I witnessed that as lieutenant governor, as the president of the state senate there. That's the point that it was amazing that we captured that seat, but we're still at 27 to 23. It doesn't mean we still drive the train.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
After the debate. The infamous debate. That really blasted everything apart. That's reasonable. That we need a new messenger. We need to have a new way forward. We have to find something new. It has to be different. And the clock was ticking. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that's the thing. So I warned my colleagues. And I'm like, hey, if you blast this apart, I get that. But you are in a significant risk.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I am trying to explain that Trump is deeply popular in my state. And these are the states that are going to depend who's going to win. So that's a serious risk. And everybody decided to do that and how it happened. And that's why I'm saying right now, it's like in a rush, in a sense of desperation. Yeah. We made a quick decision and then how that worked out.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Sounds like you don't think that you think the decision was too rash. No, no, no. What I'm saying, though, it's like, you know, if you got what you demanded, then I think it's appropriate to own the outcome as well, too. And a rush to just do something in response to the stress and the impending thing. It's like I see now what's about shutting the government down. Yeah.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't know. I mean, I think there's a segment that are always going to support everything. And then there's some other there's a segment where some people are just kind of numb to it, where like, you know, like I can't follow it or I'm just kind of like I don't.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
All I know is that there were some other dynamic, too, that was very special. Two things in Pennsylvania was the assassination happening in – Oh, yeah. I mean, I was maybe 20 miles away when that happened, and I was following it. And when I saw those iconic images and thing about fight, fight, and there's blood everywhere, and it's like, wow.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I was even, I said that to a team member, like, there might be ballgame. And immediately, I saw people on shirts with that image, and there was palpable blood. And that really brought a lot of the energy together. And now I try, like, what if that was Obama? You know, like that was being in, like, fight, fight, fight. What that would have meant for the Democratic Party. Yeah.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And then the second thing was Musk. At that point, he was a Tony Stark kind of a figure. And people were really just thrilled to see him at a lot of the events. And of course, you had the money, too. But it brought everything together. And I can absolutely say that that's the kind of thing that cost us Bob Casey, too. Because my one shock in the 24th cycle was losing Bob Casey.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And I think it was 12 or 13,000 votes. Now, that definitely mattered, at least 13,000 votes as well, too. You ever met Musk? Briefly, but I haven't had an actual conversation. But I just want to say, I'd still be happy to do, even though he's becoming increasingly more unpopular. And I would like to just say, that's part of what's appropriate.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Fighting back, it does not mean let's go destroy someone's Tesla or put bombs in a dealership or doing those things, because it wasn't that long ago. The Democrats, we used to love Teslas as a
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Because a lot of times the Democrats, we've been frozen out of that because we don't have the votes. And the Republicans, a lot of them, and a lot of my colleagues privately are really concerned or where they may not even understand why are we doing this? And like now punching our allies in the face, you know, going after Canada.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
or going after Mexico, or going after the UK and all of these things. No matter how degree of chess you're playing, I don't understand what the upside is. If you really want to build something, then all it's building is chaos and confusion. I know business, they want certainty because then they can make investments or they can respond to the circumstances.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Like right now, the one that I just possibly – now, I understand there is an argument. Sure, we would be because we have a significant deficit, should be spending any money for foreign aid. Right. The one that I just will never understand is going after Social Security. That is the most sacred of sacred cows, and you have tens of millions of Americans that depend on that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I know and I love people that do that, and I will never understand to scare people and to sow that kind of chaos. What's your upside other than to enrage people and they're going to blow up, you know, your side's, you know, phones and definitely mine as well. And if you don't understand what's the upside to torment people that depend on it.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
There's a disconnection. There has to. There is. And now that's why I also kind of reject this idea that folks like Musk are involved just about money. I think just the opposite of that. I think it's about just being involved because he has – If anything, now you can see the stock prices of Tesla. It's actually costing them money. It's hard to understand that what you're doing is terrifying.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
They're terrifying people. Why you want to have... An elderly woman that are in a fixed income and to now them wonder now they can't get anyone on the phone to just get that reassurance. It's like that's that's cruel and it's unnecessary. And politically, it's absolutely a loser. Tariffs.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Because a tariff today is a changed tomorrow or six hours later, whatever. And now if your goal is to increase more manufacturing jobs, 100%. But how can you possibly count on these tariffs sticking around long enough till we can build the factory and all those plans? And then what really thing that I was truly shocked to is going after chips, going after the chip bill. That was bipartisan.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I thought everybody loved that. About American manufacturing.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
That's the thing. Now, I stopped playing the whatever degree of chess where it's just absolutely irrational. And that adds to part of the confusion and the frustration, and it makes it even more and more difficult to see the upside.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't know, but it was, you know, part of the whole signal gate. It was truly heartbreaking because it absolutely confirmed the vice president's contempt for the Europeans.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
It's just like, why? Why? It's just like walking into a room full of supporters, you know, and start swinging in there. And it's like, why? And, you know, I'm a student of history and I've watched a lot of that and what Europe's been for and what America did after World War II and helped rebuild these things. It's a remarkable, and now we are attacking these nations now, um,
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now embracing, I mean, we're roughly the same age. I mean, do you remember Red Dawn? I mean. How about, remember the miniseries America with a K? Yeah.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Russia was the evil empire and we were cheering for the Wolverines and, you know, the invasion of the Russians.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't know if we've switched or we've just kind of totally lost our way because Ukraine was our ally and we were in the same fight to defend and project and defend democracy. And that was heartbreaking as well too. And here we have, imagine a war must be feel like three years of war.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And in where you're living and they're firing missiles into your cities and you are sending your sons and your fathers, even in your grandfathers, back into the front line for nothing. And that it's not sustainable. And I don't understand what the upside for for backing people that that literally assassinates people that disagree or they throw out of my window. It's part of the mystery.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
After, one of the things I've done as a senator was I was proud of was to vote for that aid. And I was like, this is the last opportunity, I think, to deliver some critical resources to push back against Russia. And I don't know how that's ever going to happen again. again. And it's very clear there's contempt and there's no support.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And my hope is that it's brought to an end with a minimal loss of the Ukrainian soil and in a way where people, there's peace. And now that I guess they're trying to think that and hope that Russia is now going to get back into that of an offense thing. Neville Chamberlain thought that about Hitler. Oh, no. It's just part of, like, it's just, I don't get that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And, you know, picking fights on our allies, Japan or the UK or Canada, you know, it's incredibly disappointing. Do you have much of a relationship with Vance? With who? With Vance. No, I don't. And it's like his views. I mean, I guess I try to find ways like, well, at least I think we're very both fully supportive of Israel. And I was disappointed.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
became a bit of an outlier in the party for Israel. But I hope, and we're going to, it's like now, talk about Taiwan. Now, I think maybe we can agree that China is not even a frenemy. I think that's an absolute threat to the world order. And Taiwan, if they move towards the unification,
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
What kind of a message are we sending to the world where we are effectively turning our back to what Russia has done with Ukraine? And I think there's a lot of people for the Chinese government to start, you know, work the room and be like, hey, you know, like you don't want him around. Well, how about us? How about us? You know, let's be friends. Let's be buddy. And that's part of that, too.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I don't mean – isn't it inevitable now that Taiwan – is not going to be able to rely on the United States. I agree. That's the point. It's like the unification, I think it almost feels inevitable. And I don't- Probably without firing a shot. Yeah. But my point, it's like, what are we projecting to the world audience? What we're doing now in Ukraine?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Are we going to push back these kinds of governments that have been up to two months ago? It was unthinkable to just embrace.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, I originally thought, well, that's not new to the American experience. Truman wanted to purchase it, and it wasn't. And now one of the things Trump is right about is fixating on rare earth. Yeah, as well.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
We would be freaking out if Russia was trying to grab it or the Chinese was. So I do get that. And there is actually truth in it. But this idea that we got to get it one way or the other, that's shocking and disappointing and appalling. I mean, you can't invade. And put that in perspective, it's three times the size of Texas land, and it has fewer people than Harrisburg, are we gonna invade that?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I mean, it's absurd. Do we need a relationship with Greenland? We wanna strengthen it? Absolutely. I've met with, if it's the prime minister or the president of the Greenland, whatever, sat in this office, and I wanted to say, no one in this body is gonna say, no, let's invade you. But it's true, though. We want a strong relationship.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
No, I agree. So that's part of the truth in that we need the Chinese have us by the balls on the rare earth. Right. market, and now that's part of the Ukraine deal, and that's part of the Greenland. That is true, but it's also not bonkers or insane to talk about Greenland because that is part of the American- ED HARRISON No, I accept that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, it's also, too, though, it's like, you know, we have a special responsibility to push back about that. And that has, you know... It's heartbreaking. I thought we should be proud of our role there to really protect the world and be that. That's a source of pride. And now it seems something to be ashamed of or to want to turn our back to.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, you know, it doesn't mean you can't, you know, you can engage on every last thing. There's tragedy that there's very little you can do, like absolutely the genocide in Sudan, the catastrophe there that's happening.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But but for me, that's not being like a policeman, but it's about being the force, the wall standing against these forces that have been trying to to to pull our world into chaos and to more war and. So I think that used to be the best part of the American experience. Even Ronald Reagan understood that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And that's why a lot of people in my party voted for that, because we can agree that we are the shining city on the hill. And I don't know why we seem to have lost being proud of that. Well, tell me about the Mar-a-Lago visit. How was it? Yeah, no, that was... Some people are like, why are you doing that?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, that's the point. I mean, like, why wouldn't you? Now, imagine, like, flip the script. Now, if there was a Republican senator and President Obama said, hey, would you like to have a competition? And he refused. Yeah, well, that would be outrageous, even in a very small way. I think it was a spouse of a Republican senator. He refused to shake the hand of Vice President Harris.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
You know, whatever. Having a conversation with, it doesn't mean that you agree on everything. There's no ring to kiss. How did we lose this? No, it's like, that's the thing. For me, it's like, it's an opportunity to understand where the president's coming from and had a conversation. And it was, he played it straight. It was about 75 minutes. And I have no regrets on things.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
So for me, that's exactly what it was. It wasn't about trying to get pictures or turn it into, it's just straight up.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
For me, it's increasingly more to find that because the chaos and the blowback, like I thought one of we could agree on is a secure border. And about that is being very fully supportive of Israel. Another thing we can agree on about Israel. absolutely strong military unapologetically about lethal. So there's things we can agree and protecting the American steel industry too.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But now when you are tearing apart the government or scaring about social security or these other things, it's getting more and more difficult to find a way to work together. Like we even talked about maybe even protecting the dreamers. Now, it's getting more and more difficult to find a way to work together because it's being more and more toxic and even the absolute lack of civility.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Somebody asks you who's the leader of the Democratic Party, what's your answer? It's almost like an oxymoron.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
No, that's the thing. So I think we all have to decide on what you'll be. And I want to be the guy that's not going to lie to my fellow Democrats. I'm not going to pander. I'm going to project what I believe is the truth about the true north, a true north to emerge from it. For me, the point of shutting the government down, to me, there was no release for that frustration and anger.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
What's going to happen? We're only two months into this administration. What happens after two more months? Another two more. After six months, we're going to get back to that same CR when that expires. Will there be votes here in the Senate to keep the government open? Probably not. But I'd like to remind, too, to people listening, it was only because of the zombie votes.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
You know, the ones that, you know, my colleagues, the majority of the votes that delivered breaking the filibuster were those that are now they're not running for reelection or they're in their last term.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But free riders, free riders.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Vote no, hope yes? Think about that. You know, Durbin, King, Shaheen, Peters. And I know my friend from Hawaii has other kinds of considerations. But he did it. That shows, look, whatever you want to, you know, it's funny. People want to question motive. But that's what leading's about. Without that block, our government would be, we'd be talking about what now that it's been shut down.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
They wouldn't have reopened it. Without those votes. Republicans wouldn't have reopened it. Yeah. No, of course not. I mean, where's our leverage? For what? Don't you think Musk would have preferred it? Of course, of course. And Vought, you know, they could just sit down in a big room with a big table and be like, what do you want?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I know, and it's like the one thing that they could never do individually, we are handing it over to them, and I'm screaming like we can't do that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, to be clear, I wasn't part of the conversation.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
No, I was really an outlier. I'm like the guy. I dropped it on social media, like I can't ever be. I was front and center. And I was genuinely shocked. But for me, where our party is at- My concern is, you know, I agree with what leader Schumer did, and I'm not going to attack leadership right now.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
If we are going to attack or go after anyone, that should be the- So you're not calling for Schumer to step down? No, I mean, and I'm not aware of any Julius Caesar kinds of et tu, Brutes, you know, coming like that. No, honestly, and I was just- We're past the Ides of March. Yeah, we did. Yeah, no, no. Good, good reference.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But what I will say is that after two months, we reached that point where we were going to do something unthinkable, and now there is no, an emergency release- And what happens next? Where does this go when this pressure and the outrage and the other kinds of things continue to build, build, build? Where does this will manifest itself?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Can I just say this too? I think we could all agree what Justice Roberts made a pushback against, intimidating judges. What I wish she would say is that I regret my Citizens United ruling because that's what turned billionaires as titans in this conversation.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Exactly. You all need one. It's like an arms race for that. If you change Citizens United, that would transform Americans' politics. That would be the most one simple, strong, to change things you know and you know for people if you're campaigning against about a larky that's all that's all part of it it's like unlimited money unlimited voice and that you know so unlimited influence
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And it's what's true. Whether if it's Elon Musk or anyone else, they could drop $50 million into a campaign easier than I could buy you a cup of coffee.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah. And you have the resources to destroy, you know, truth. You can drop you can drop 10 or 20 million dollars in a market. Other than overturning Citizens United. What is there any other way to deal with this? My cycle in 22, I thought, I mean, that was that was the most expensive. Till the next one. Yeah. And now and now I think Ohio was half a billion. And so was Bob.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
It's like getting outraged.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I'm trying to warn people. It's like if anyway, if this ever gets to Justice Roberts, that single case transformed and set us lock and loaded to go against what we now are living right now.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Well, I've said this. I've said that. It's like, you know, like now some of the messaging is we're bashing the billionaires, but we happen to like the ones that donate to us or support us, too. And now you want to change it? take unlimited money out of there. And now suddenly, if the most you can give is $250, then they have no kinds of, so that's really, that's the cancer.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And that's really the underlying truth. And that's, we've arrived in that moment.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Oh, I mean, I am focusing right now on just the burgeoning kinds of chaos and trying to find a balance and find a way forward. And, you know, doing things that I know that will anger parts of my base. I hope that there is room in my party for someone wants that kinds of truth or just. Are you trying to plow a path forward for somebody like that? Or do you want to take the path? I don't know.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
You're not saying no. I'm not afraid of being honest. And now if there is going to be blowback or I'm punished, I get that. But for me, I think it's more important to be honest and to descript the – excuse me, to describe the danger of where we possibly at. And we have to stop and think before we make another significant mistake that's even more and more difficult to come back from.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
What I'm saying is that there will be a 2028. It's like- Oh yeah, it's coming. One way or the other. No, but where I'm at though is where I'm at though, seriously, honestly, our party, our party, can I address this now? You know, this conspiracy that I'm going to leave my party. It's like, that's bonkers. I'm not.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now there's other people that are now saying, well, we should go independent or run. Like, could you imagine if I start saying these things? It's like, I'm a Democrat. You know, they used to call me, you know, crazy socialist communist. And now some people are saying, well, he must be MAGA or whatever. It's like, I'm still just a Democrat and my values haven't fundamentally changed.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
So that's kind of where I'm trying to fight back against these weird forces.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I'm betting my career on that, that there has to be enough people. There's going to be a correction back to the center. I don't know. There's always going to be reaction and overreaction and all those things. But I'd like to remind people some of the things that were pushed in 2020 made it very difficult to win in 24.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And now if we push back and now we bring back to some of these kinds of positions, I'd like to remind everybody there's the seven states that decide who's going to be in the Iron Throne. And then so... Let's not forget. Then some of the strongest, loudest voices are coming from the deepest, deepest blue areas.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
In fact, I ended this, there was a gigantic crowd the night before the election. You know, there's a lot of big events. It's you know, I'm not in the business of saying, well, there's a big crowd. So that means it's going to work out, because if it did, you know, Hillary Clinton would have been president. And now we would be celebrating Harris president. So that's that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
So for me, it's about remembering it all. gets decided by the same states. And now I send and I sell every thought through a jury in a Walmart parking lot in Scranton. And how is that going to sound? How is that going to land? Explain it this. Because that's You know, I wouldn't describe an average. I would just be like, these are voters. These are the people that decide this.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And I don't look down and say, what's wrong with you? You're voting against it. I'm not going to talk down. And we don't even have the time to talk about our problem and the challenge that we have with with men as well, too. So so for me. You know, when you ask that, is there someone with that in that lane? And that's what I'm literally betting my career, that there is one.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah, well, no, but I did. But speaking of that, you know, my oldest is 16 and now I'm helping him learn how to drive. So, yeah, so that's going great. And I'd like to remind people that's another reason why I want to stay in that fight, because I want them to grow up in an environment.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Yeah, yeah. I agree. But I hope people listening realize how it's even worse than you might think inside. Inside Washington.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
No, it is. It is. And it's like I ask, like, what's 12 times 4? 48. Well, that's how long his term is. And we're down two. And there's a lot of ground to cover. Two months. 46 months to go. Yeah, exactly. And 46 months. And that's why we all just have to say, well, look, they are taking us in a direction that our side, we never agreed.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
There's not one single Democrat in my caucus that agrees with all of these things that are happening. Yeah. But remember, I revere democracy. And in November of last year, it decided they want this. They signed up for this. Elections have consequences. Yeah, exactly. There are consequences. And that's why we get a chance to revisit that for the midterm.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And then that's why I do expect that we'll get back the majority in the House.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
It looks like you're in great... I'm so grateful. My heart now, my heart is functioning in an absolute normal range and now any lingering kinds of impact of the stroke, minimal with that I use captioning for certain kinds of interviews, but otherwise I'm coming up on three years ago where that... almost ended my life. So I, I, you know, every day was gravy and I'm just grateful for that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I'm grateful to tell you that.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
Congratulations on your new. Thank you, my friend. Appreciate it.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I am. I have a story, though. They were kind. They invited us to like a public event. And my 10-year-old was really, really excited. Of course, I mean, he likes baseball. But he also was like – because he found out that his girlfriend was there because she's very famous on TikTok.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
And he's like, oh, I get to meet – Livvy, and that's kind of like Pittsburgh version of the KC, Tay, and Travis connection.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
But yeah, my son was like, oh, I mean, is Livvy going to be there?
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
At least for my 10-year-old, yes. But again, it's the power of the TikTok. But yeah, that's my pirates. But yeah, that dude is remarkable, and I hope he gets to stick around, but we know how that often goes.
The Chuck ToddCast
Chuck Todd Reacts to Special Elections + John Fetterman on Donald Trump & 2028 Presidential Run
I mean, that's how it goes. But what is also true that I think the PNC Park is the best place in America to take in a ball game. And I think any of the new stadiums really all try to capture that energy and the whole experience. But now I do, you know, one year, you never know that now the Pirates are going to be contenders. Baltimore might fight you on Camden Yards versus PNC Park. Yeah, yeah.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
No, I mean, I never thought that was serious. I think that was designed to be very provocative. And they wanted to kind of shock the nations in the region where it's like either if we can get this right, I mean, especially after it happened, what, 10-7? I mean, they've been unable to just deliver a stable society and prosperity for the Palestinians.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Well, then, hey, we have to have and drop these kinds of radical, shocking kinds of ideas.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
No, I think there's a lot of experts that have been really wrong about the situation here after 10-7. And I think it was always right to follow. I followed Netanyahu through that because to me that was following Israel. And I think the smart thing was we have to break and seriously degrade Hamas, but they've done that. And they did that same with Hezbollah as well, too.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Now, Hezbollah, everybody thought that Hezbollah was the ultimate badass in the Middle East, and it turned out that they really didn't have those kind of capabilities. And then they also discovered that Iran never had these kinds of capabilities before. too, and not able to protect and project those kind of values to create and fund that kind of access of evil there in the Middle East now, too.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And now that same thing happened in Syria as well, too. Everybody, all the so-called experts were wrong. And Israel did those kinds of very difficult things to develop. And that's the first opportunity to have actual real peace in that region. What do you think is the desirable outcome in Gaza?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
The desirable outcome is a state, a nation, whatever, is that they are now – they're going to turn their back on this idea. A Palestinian state? I mean, whatever, but just a state of some kind. The final outcome, the ideal outcome, is that Palestinians would have a state or Gaza or whatever that –
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
That their government is not front and center and they're committed to destroying Israel and they could focus on building their nation instead of trying to destroy Israel.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Oh, well, I'll never understand the way the Trump administration seems to have this weird kind of dynamic relationship with Putin. I'll never understand or respect that. When I was growing up, I mean, hey, Russia was the bad guy. And it's like I grew up maybe Red Dawn and, you know, used to cheer for Wolverines. And I mean, it was all understood. I'll never understand that.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
To me, what Ukraine, their struggle with Ukraine was no different than in Israel or what's going on in Taiwan. For me, it's a war on democracy. And now we're always going to stand for democracies.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
By definition, if they openly defy court ruling or from the Supreme Court, then that, by definition, that is a constitutional crisis.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
It's absolutely possible. That's possible. But you're not going to see me on MSNBC or on A Nation yelling and screaming that we are in constitutional crisis. But when we arrive at that one, I'll be the first person to describe that to people, that we are in a constitutional crisis. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely, the Trump administration is going to test and push the boundaries.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And the second he defies a court ruling, then by definition, that is a constitutional crisis.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I think I want to be the I want to be the honest one. And I'm punished in terms of fundraising or that I'm not the one yelling and screaming and jumping on and saying the things. I'm not dumb. I know what I know what's selling right now, but I'm committed to being I'm never going to lie to you and I'm not going to tell you everything's awesome. So I think for me.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I'm going to move against my own political interest and try to say the things that people may not agree or whatever. But like the border, that's another one. I mean, I tried to explain that there is rage on the ground over border and the chaos and the Democrats. We got the Democrats. the border wrong, and we're going to pay for that. And then I paid for that to have those views.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I think the Democratic Party was wrong on Israel, and I followed Israel through that. And I was trying to warn that Trump's coming in hard. And we really got to watch out. And that's turned out the case as well, too. And now I'm trying to describe where we're at right now. And perhaps maybe that's not what's necessary or what's wanted. Do you feel that you have very few allies in the Senate?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Yeah, I do feel I do not have a lot.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
No. I don't know. I mean, it's not saying that they won't sit next to me or anything, but it's been difficult. But remember, a lot of my colleagues come from much different kinds of backgrounds or they have a much different kinds of situation. uh, in their, their own states.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
But, uh, the, the presidency is determined on the kinds of states like my own, you know, I don't know, will a critical mass of people will appreciate being a Democrat that's trying to be honest and describe things, what happened and why it was going to happen and why, and remembering that, you know, the polling has this almost at six out of 10 view us as, as a seriously damaged brand.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
You know, it's like it's not criticizing Democrats that sell there right now, but I'm trying to describe what happened. My concern is, you know. In the Pennsylvania State Senate, you know, we've been in an effective minority position, permanent minority. And I'm concerned about that here in the United States Senate.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Well, there really wasn't any reaction. People here in the Senate, they're very, I don't know, very polite. I mean, you know, even after like Medendez, Medendez was walking around and people would be like, oh, what happened to you? You They're not talking about the gold bar. No one's asking, hey, how many gold bars were in your mattress kind of thing.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Regardless, whoever is going to be the next president, if they hold the Senate, you're never going to pass any kind of legislation.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Uh, no, no, we, we, we don't really have a lot. I think we kind of, I mean, I respect Bernie and, but, uh, but I think that I don't think there's a lot of connection, uh, for, for me. Uh, but, but I'd like to remind everybody where we are right now. It could have been in, you know, we got, we got very fortunate in some of those seats as well. Um,
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Now, if we're in a permanent minority, and then we have the Supreme Court as well, too, it's an incredibly precarious position for Democrats. And for me, I want to find a way forward. And right now, it's difficult to find a way forward when now the Trump and their plan for chaos, they pumped in three feet of raw sewage into here, and we have a Dixie cup to bail out with a lot of that.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And the ongoing chaos... the ongoing chaos. I mean, it's like you have 15 or 20 things you have to respond to. And that velocity, you know, with social media and in like the New York Times and other kinds of media, they're all dropping here. What about here? What about here? What about here? What about here? And all those things.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And it makes it even more difficult and discrimination of like, what really should matter? What really is just more about chaos? So it's an incredibly difficult situation in terms of what really matters because we have a minority position. And that may not be satisfying, but I'm trying to describe where we are.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Yeah, I mean— It's a pretty vivid metaphor. I can't—I mean, the ongoing chaos, and that's the thing. It's like, well, and then I don't want our party to turn into just about performative kinds of things. I mean, that's the thing. And if those things worked, you know, they impeached him twice. They put him—he was on civil trial. He was on criminal trial.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And then, again, after the assassination and through all of those things, it's like maybe that's not the way we should be going. Maybe we shouldn't become the party of scolding and shaming and trying to tell people, hey, you're too dumb. Hey, we know more than you do on those issues. And I'm not exactly sure what the exact answer is.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
So people weren't now, they weren't talking about it or anything. I don't think it was controversial, but for me, it was a decision where, and of course, I never exactly knew how that was going to look going down there, but I had the opportunity to sit down and meet with the president. I mean, to me, I thought that was I doing my job.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I feel like that's my version on that and really talking about and describing this and remaining a committed Democrat. and reminding people we've lost Bob Casey. That's Senator Bob Casey. Here in Pennsylvania. And we've just lost two, possibly three of my colleagues that they don't want to be in the 26th cycle as well, too.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Yeah, just like right now. I described it as like the plan was to pump three feet of raw sewage into, you know. Do you hate the job? No, no. It's an honor. It's an honor. And to me, I think my honor and my duty is as a committed Democrat. I mean, in all of the kind of silly kind of narratives that I'm going to move my party or become a Republican, I would be a lousy Republican, right?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Why would you be a lousy Republican? Because I'm unapologetically pro-choice. I'm unapologetically pro-LGBTQ. I can't ever understand why people wouldn't be front and center in opposing Putin and Russia. I mean, there's a lot of things that I just can't possibly carry that. I'd be a terrible Republican. But I'd like to say, I know and I love a lot of Republicans too.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And that's why I couldn't, I don't work, I don't, call Trump a fascist because I know those people in my life aren't fascists. They're not terrible people. They're not bad Americans or anything. I don't think it was helpful to use those kinds of extreme kinds of terms. And when you unload the clip of the extreme kinds of terms possible and it doesn't have any impact, then what's left?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And then, you know, for how many years and how many cycles can you jump on cable and yell and scream and the world's on fire? And that actually hasn't happened at this point. Remember, this started in 2015, and here we are 10 years later, and... everything that's been said and done. Remember, you know, grabbing the used to be the end of his political career.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And here we are and what's happened and it's, it hasn't worked. Uh, and that's why I'm saying, let's figure out a way to re to turn our party into a more effective machine to, to address that rather than using the same kinds of tactics that, In many ways, it's actually made him more stronger and popular. You know, like, do people realize he hung his mugshot in the Oval Office? He signed that.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I mean, like, it's the ultimate own. It's like he's raised millions off of that picture. you know, it's made him more popular. And now he's hanging it in the Oval Office. And we, you know, Democrats were gleefully like, hey, he's a convicted felon. He's a convicted felon. Well, that's off-band for us, for one.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And because for me, for me, I want to find things that we can work together. And there's going to be a lot that I'm going to disagree. So, yeah. They don't need my vote or any Democratic vote for a lot of things that they're going to want to do. And they're not going to have a lot of support for much of it anyway. I don't think it was controversial.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
But two, if that's only done was made him more popular, I think that captures the futility on a lot of these things that just never worked.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Anything's possible. I mean, I have to believe somebody could even bet on that online. If they want to, they can go right in. I'm not betting on that. But for me, I would like to remind everybody
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
It's been a remarkable kinds of outcome that was a lot of people were disappointing, including myself, but trying to find a way forward and doing it in an honest way and saying things that it's not so much about criticizing. It's about describing and trying to explain to some people that maybe haven't experienced, especially that kind of moments like the assassination or the kind of energy that
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
and the kinds of devotion that exists in states just like in Pennsylvania.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
All right. Thank you.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I don't think anybody, I mean, some people may have found that controversial. But for me, it's just doing a job and having a conversation. And I would like to remind everybody, more Americans picked him to be president than my team. So that doesn't mean that half our nation are fascist or they're terrible or that, you know, that.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
No, I mean, we all work. We work together in the Senate by definition, meeting with the president. That's not capitulation. That's just as meeting with the president and you're in the Senate. And the people that are saying that are ones that aren't tasked to try to get things done. It's easy to just, you know, for me, those are the kind of things, I mean, that's cheap shots from the cheap seats.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Because for me, having a conversation doesn't change anything. It just means like, hey, maybe we can find out something that we can work together. Otherwise, you know, maybe not. Right.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Well, I mean, you know, her vote wasn't really supposed to be controversial, but the whole vibe changed radically, and many of my colleagues... weren't going to, it was going to try to find people that were more conventional and qualified compared to people that were just, they just completely, people, there's no way they could possibly work with those things.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Trying to find those people, like I voted for other ones like Duffy, and I worked for, you know, other ones that You know, people that they're not my choices. And now, you know, I think all of us in the Senate, we voted for Rubio, too. You know, our politics are different. And now he are doing things that I don't necessarily agree on all of those things. I mean, that's part of it.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And it didn't used to be super controversial for people of the other party voting for Rubio.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
people in in their cabinet because that's the way the the rules work and when you have to work with people uh and if you are able to develop a relationship uh you know otherwise they don't need any of these votes they could just tell us to sit it in the corner because you know we have 50 51 52 or even 53 votes here so this person's definitely going to have the job
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I'm changing. It's that the second you become a chaos agent or the party now is perceived publicly that they are the party of chaos, then that means ultimately you're going to lose the next election because no one wants to vote for chaos. We all voted for Hey, we want to make our government more efficient. We want to save our money. We want to, I mean, remember we have about $36 trillion of debt.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I mean, it's reasonable to say, Hey, now let's, let's remake our government. The second you become chaos. And then that makes it much more difficult and it makes it virtually impossible to, to, to defend those kinds of things. And I, you know, when you're able to penetrate, even to you have people who, When I'm walking around in Costco and I'm like, hey, I'm freaking out about this.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I'm really converted about that and stopping. You know, if they're here to buy a chicken or to buy toilet paper and the front and center is like, hey, this is really freaking out. That really penetrated. But I didn't have that kind of energy on the ground in Pennsylvania when he announced he was going to be involved in the campaign.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
In fact, for a lot of people, that was the feature of the Trump campaign. And that started to turn into more of chaos. And that's why I'm saying it's like folks were voting and believed in the Dodge vision. And I'm not sure what you're getting out for the chaos.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
So I think two things should be true that if you want to save money, we want to find ways to make us more efficient, but not do it in a way that is a chaos bomb. And makes it virtually impossible for people to find allies when you're involved in this process.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
That's possible, too. They just want chaos. Absolutely. That's the campaign he did sign up on that. And I would remind everybody, like, this is Trump's last term. So he's not ever going to be accountable to voters more. And he ran on that idea. Like, we are going to shake things up. We are about revenge. We are about making sure that view... is made front and center. And that's that is happening.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Yeah. And if chaos is the entire point, then that's I don't think a lot of people voted for that. I think that they wanted corrected chaos, not just chaos for chaos.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Oh, well, I mean, I'm not sure a lot of people, average people, know what an oligarch is. I mean, that's kind of like the weird kind of terms that get thrown around. And people not really sure what that really means. Or it's like populism. Like if you could show up in a Walmart parking lot, it's like, what's an oligarch?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
For me, it's like I've described that money, the money is the real cancer there. And now Musk discovered now he has the ability to to move the needle and helping with money. And now Trump has the kind of unlimited resources that now it can keep his senators and other house members in line that if they don't follow that, well, you can dump 20, 30 or $40 million into in primary.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And we can punish people that may not happen to agree with him or willing to vote for his nominees. You've seen that happen as well. Unlimited money has turned all of us in some way into all OnlyFans models in some way. We're all just online hustling for money. And with the more lug that we show, that makes more money. And, you know, it's not a lot of dignity in that racket either as well, too.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Well, I'm not because I'm not the guy that's – I all know what helps pay the bills and brings money in and going on MSNBC and yelling and saying a lot of provocative things. And I have colleagues that are doing those things. And I think if you look back on their first quarter, it's probably going to be pretty strong.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And a lot of the things that are being said by those things that are very provocative to generate – A lot of coverage. I guarantee you that ended up in a fundraising email or in kinds of other kinds of fundraising.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I think the people that voted for him largely love what they've seen. But the second the chaos touches their lives, if they're farmers, now that they're not able to sell their goods, or if the steel workers lose their jobs, or if the chaos touches their lives, then that's going to change that. Or if you destroy the Department of Education, again, going after education, that's a loser.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
We've witnessed that same kind of moves in with Tom Corbett. That was the first first term Republican governor, governor of Pennsylvania. And that used to be a layup for a second term of governor. But my my governor, Tom Wolf, beat him and he pushed back and he beat an incumbent, which that's ever the first time that ever happened in Pennsylvania, going against education.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
You know, red kids, blue kids, every kid needs to need they have to read. And all average voters, they are like, hey, you know, like that's one of those bipartisan things, education. And if you go against education, that's going to become part of the chaos. And maybe they just want to make it just for chaos on for chaos.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
But that's going to be part of you're not going to have people buying in a majority of getting involved on on that.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
for me, it's not about what's woke. Um, and like, just for me, it's about, it's that I'm never going to pick on anyone and I'm never going to turn that into a, a, a punching bag. I mean, I'm never going to derive some kind of political capital off of, of degrading a fellow human being is that, uh, And that for me, that's what's personal.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Like in that video that I stood up for the trans community, like I know it's not popular politically, but that's exactly the time I wanted to lean on that. This is Senator John Fetterman. I'm standing in front of my office and two flags. That are two core values of mine. I am an unapologetically pro-military. Also very pro for the LGBTQ communities.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And I would like to remind... And for me, I'd like to remind everybody, it was really controversial to desegregate our military. And it was very controversial. You know, our gay Americans were not able to serve. And now women weren't going to be involved to serve in combat roles. And now all of that, that's not controversial anymore.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
And that's part of the—that's what's understood to be making a stronger military. So I think the trans thing, for me, it's about the dignity of the soldier. And I'm never going to support degrading somebody's dignity. Some Americans have been kind of they thought that became too woke or that, you know, the Democratic Party became too preoccupied with that. You know, the Harris is for they them.
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
Trump is for you kind of a thing. But but for me, it's not about woke. What is too woke in your mind?
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
No, but I think the Democratic Party increasingly get it more and more difficult for men, specifically white men, to make that choice. I think it's incredibly difficult sometimes. And as long as the party makes it more and more difficult for men, then ultimately they're going to
The New Yorker Radio Hour
John Fetterman on Trump’s “Raw Sewage,” and What the Democrats Get Wrong
I think one of the Republican superpowers is they're immune to cancel culture. And it's just much more it's just it's much more people are more free to vote. They don't have to have a very strict kind of orthodox that if you don't agree with that, that must make you a bad person. That might make you a racist. That might make you homophobic or those kinds of things.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
It was a hit piece, a one source hit piece and on some anonymous sources.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
And then the whole nation just had like a meltdown, like, oh my God, the Senate's on fire because I dress like a slob. And then there is health issues.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
You know, my aspiration is to take my son to the restaurant that we were supposed to go during his birthday but couldn't because I had checked myself in for depression. And being the kind of dad, the kind of husband, and the kind of senator that Pennsylvania deserves, you know, that's truly, that's what my aspiration is.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
This isn't a matter of who's tough or who's not. I would just beg men, you know, you're not too macho. You know, it's no big deal. It's like... The only person you're really going to hurt more than anyone else is actually your family.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
It's a privilege and it's a duty to talk about this because I want everybody, now you have an enormous platform, I want anyone who's listening to this that sees this, if you are suffering from depression, please get help. Please get help because it works. It works.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
And I want to be very clear. I thought what Israel chose to do about blowing up the pagers and then walkie talkies. And then after targeting and eliminating membership and leadership of Hezbollah, I absolutely support that. And in fact, if anything, I love it.
Today, Explained
Is John Fetterman ok?
I've never noticed anyone to believe that their mental health has been supported by spending any kind of time on social media. And if they do, I'd love to meet that person, you know, who that is.