Jerod
Appearances
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
Yeah, unblocked helps large teams with old code bases understand why something has been done in the past. It helps them understand what happens if they make changes to it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
Basically, all the questions that you would typically ask a co worker, you no longer have to interrupt them, you don't have to wait for their response, you don't have to, if you're geographically distributed, you don't have to wait for that response, you don't have to wait for You know, you don't have to dig through documentation. You don't have to try to find the answer in Confluence and Jira.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
What we basically do is give you the answer by you just asking a question. The way that we got to the problem was a consequence of our kind of lived experience. We were actually going to call the company Bother, which is like, you don't bother me, I don't bother you, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
Instead of like being tapped on the shoulder or interruptive Slack messages, we could just use Bother and get the answers that we wanted.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
We didn't go with that name because it's a little bit of a negative connotation, but helping developers get unblocked by answering questions or surfacing data and discussions within the context of their IDE relative to the code that they're looking at is something that thousands of developers love so far.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
A lot of code generation tools help you write the code to solve a problem. We sit upstream of that. Our goal is to help provide the context that you need. If you think about where you spend your time when you're trying to solve a new problem, understanding how that system works, why it was built that way, what are the ramifications of changing something?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
That's the problem that Unblock tries to solve for you. We take the data and discussions of all of these, the source code and all those systems to provide that answer for you so that you can get that context and then you can go and write that code. We had this great example of a company who hires, you know, very competent developers.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Free-threaded Python (Interview)
It took them five days, that developer, five days to write 12 lines of code. And his feedback to us was it's not that it takes you five days to write 12 lines of code. It took them five days to get the information that they needed to write those 12 lines of code. And that takes probably about 30 minutes to write those 12 lines of code and rip off that PR.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Like, I don't know. There was also, I didn't read about it or I didn't read the post, but I think there was a post by Sam Altman this week about like, we're like a thousand days away from super intelligence or something like that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I agree. I agree.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
If it is true, let's assume that we are that close. There's nothing we can do to stop it. There's no one... I don't know. It could just be devastating. Already, we've put out all of the guitar tuning apps. They're gone. We don't need them anymore. We don't need the... We're just slowly going down this market until...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
This, this reminds me, I just read, uh, Charlie and the chocolate factory with my daughter and you know, her, her dad was, uh, like he was, he was like putting tooth, the, the lids on toothpastes, uh, and like then times changed and he had to evolve to be the repair man for the robot that does that. But what if you find Zen in just putting the toothpaste on the bottle, the lid on the bottle?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And that's why I still write TypeScript.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It's just table stakes now.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I do like types.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yes, absolutely. Well, I close my case. But do I type more or do you? Like when you go fix all of your type errors later on.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I have experienced eating steak with both of you. Oh, yes. It is intense, right? I would recommend.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I did. How was it? It was a lot of fun. Bigger? It was bigger. Yeah, I think. Yeah, it definitely was bigger. It was more fun. I had my family there that time.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
They had like a pool party thing. After the water park closed to the public, they reopened it just for that conference, which was awesome. That's cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Speaking of which. Now's a good time to let you guys know that at that conference in Wisconsin, Clark, I just happened to have a solid state drive and Clark gave me the recording from January. No way. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I only know of eaves as like the ceiling things, like the roof things.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
He was like, oh, do you want this? And do you have a means of taking this very large file? And I just so happened to have a two terabyte drive with me. And I was like, yeah, let's do it. And then I forgot to tell you guys. Hilarious. He gave you our proprietary intellectual properties, what you're saying. Yes. And I reposted it under my name.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Believe it. Yeah. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Take that back right now.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I would say that's true for any life-changing tool like Vim. I wouldn't necessarily say Arc, but Arc does have a lot of... Are you saying Arc is life-changing? No. You're not saying that? No. Okay. And in fact, I think it's funny that you came in right as they had a critical CVE. Did you see this?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
What was the CVE?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
They could execute code on your machine without you even visiting a website to initiate it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
The attacker. The bad folks. I didn't read it exactly, but I know that it was some vulnerability through Firebase or something.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But I don't use it anymore, unfortunately. Or fortunately. I just don't like Chrome. And it seemed like a better Chromium to use.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And replace it with crypto parts, though?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
That's good. And I brought it up because it was topical, but I don't think it's a reason to not use Arc. I don't use it anymore because I'm forced to not use it anymore at work. Why is that? Because it's not Chrome. And Chrome has enterprise tools that don't ship in Chromium, apparently.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yes, I said yes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Mm-hmm. If ChatGPT is to be believed, then yes. They have raised significant funding, including a $50 million round at a $550 million valuation.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
we all did three different things to find that information.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. I think that there's a lot of like really cool things in arc that are like UI level fundamental changes to the way that you would browse specifically the things like a split view, being able to split into three different panels and view things side by side. That's really awesome. Having the tab bar on the side and hideable and then like having, you can swipe between multiple tab bars.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
So like when I was using it, every project that I was working on had its own tab bar. And I could just leave those tabs open and then I wanted to go work on something else. I switch over to that one and go really nice. And you could rename tabs too. So, you know, the 40th Google sheet that you open, you can rename it to be something memorable so that you can actually get back to it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And that was all just like really cool stuff. This max stuff I have turned off completely. And that's because it's all just AI stuff. It's you want to search for something and the page, it will generate a page that cobbles together a bunch of stuff from around the internet into one page for you. Or it'll do like smart things about tidying your tabs or renaming them or things like that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I'm just thinking of Enya. I can't think of Eve.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
All of that, A, is not all that easy.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
useful when like it's just saving me one or two steps which i could just do on my own when i need them but then also like it kind of muddies things up because like a lot of companies don't want these ai features in they don't want them bleeding into to the workplace because they don't know how to control their data with that and when it's built fundamentally into the browser like that then companies can overreact and be like we're just going to block that browser completely
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Copilot is a massive loss. Last time I heard for Microsoft or GitHub, it costs them $30 a user and I pay $10 a month for that. It's just not that profitable because it's so intense to train these models.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I was skeptical of switching to Raycast when it was all free because it was like, I don't want to build up my workflow around you and then you die because you couldn't sustain yourself. And then I have to go crawling back to Alfred. Spotlight, man. It's right there. It's built in. That's true. Raycast does so much, though. It's so nice.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But yeah, like once they had that, and it was for pretty simple features. Like I have more than one Mac. I'll sync between those. That's totally worth it for me. And they have some AI stuff, which is pretty nice too. Like that's probably my primary interface into all of these chatbots is like through the Raycast interface for that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But it's also something that you can completely ignore if you don't want to use it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
That goes way back. I'm talking about Eve. I'm so non-cultured. I did listen to Enya in religion class. I remember that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Like a little meditation thing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Amsterdam. Amsterdam.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
React Summit, Amsterdam.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Well, Jared and Adam.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
My favorite one, because it's memorable and it's quick. It's only like two and a half minutes. And it's fun because there's no way that I can sing this properly. And that is Kiss by Prince. Because it's all falsetto. And it just like starts off with like, da-na-na-na-na-na-na-na.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Just websites, mostly.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah, Nginx. I did, oh, and probably Apache. Because I kind of stopped doing it. I was hosting a WordPress site for a friend. And I just log in. And it got really, there's malware everywhere. Yeah. All this extra PHP code. I had to manually go change 100 files. I was not smart enough at the time. I was in college.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I didn't use any kind of version control, so all of the files got modified and I had to manually go unmodify them.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And then you just like immediately go into it and you just immediately drop down and you're like, you don't even have to scream it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
You just like go from there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And you're just doing your best. Yeah. And you're going and making an ass of yourself and it's, it's wonderful. And then you can like, I think that that primes you for like conference speaking and talking on a podcast, like just make an ass of yourself or karaoke by yourself with no music on a podcast.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Are we allowed to mention WordPress? Or is that like some kind of... I think we have to.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
There's no limit to my embarrassment. I can, I can go lower for sure. What's your second favorite song? Ooh, I've got, it depends on the mood and like the mood of the room for sure. Okay. Read the room. You got to read the room. You got to work the room too. You really like, you got to have a wireless mic. You know, if there's a pool table, you got to be up on the pool table.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
You got to go up to a random, like the, the person who looks the most uncomfortable being there and just like get down on one knee and just belt it right into their face, get them into it or not. And you know, you get, you get everybody on your side that way. Or you get punched in the face. Yeah. Hasn't happened yet.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Ooh, not yet. That would be amazing. I haven't been to a setup that has that, like the bar.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Oh, my phone. Get your phone out of here.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I actually heard about this on Sunday. I don't know when WordCamp actually was, but I heard about it on Sunday from a friend who works at WP Engine and was telling me, oh, did you see this drama where they were calling us out on stage? And I was like, oh, that's...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
interesting i'm like i haven't heard of it because i'm not really in the wordpress scene but from what i do know from the periphery about like wordpress and automatic and matt mullenweg like he seems like a really nice guy so it seems out of character yeah to be like disparaging like singling you out specifically and like i can't remember if he said that they like
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
escorted their booth away or something, like made them get off.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And they definitely have a good reputation, too. I'm not a WordPress user. I don't want to ever use WordPress, to be honest. Ooh, dang. Fair. It's not for me.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But they like, you know, they, they've come in and like, I think automatic or maybe somewhere around that vicinity owns a Tumblr now. Right. And day one, uh, the, the journaling app and like, you know, yes, it seems like, oh, that's a good trustworthy company to be stewarding these, these apps that otherwise might just die off.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And a lot of people and pocket casts, they bought pocket casts and they open sourced it after they bought it. Yeah. I just switched to pocket casts. Oh, That's interesting.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. And it seems like, I mean, we all should be rooting for Matt and the WordPress side, right? The open source side. Because that's what...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
what so many people that we know try and do is like find some way to fund open source in a meaningful way and this is the same thing wordpress is a massively successful project but at the end of the day it is an open source project that needs funding it needs people to work on it it needs all that maintenance because as i personally found out it's quite easy to to get in there and hack now that wasn't wordpress fault probably it was probably just poor security on my
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
my Linode instance. I'll blame myself for that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Pretty much. I have a work phone and a personal phone, which I just upgraded to the 16 Pro Max. Oh, wow. The camera control button.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Which would be database costs on WP Engine's side.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But it is a config setting. It is. It makes total sense to me, especially if it's, I don't know because I don't use it, but if it is something that you could easily just go flip on, then it seems totally acceptable. If you're actually someone who cares, it's not gone. It's right there. But yeah, I don't know. This seems like a new angle for sustainable open source, which is just attack.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And I don't know that that's the right way.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
The max, huh? Those things, those suckers are big. It got bigger this year. Did it really? By shrinking the bezel, I think.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I didn't read Will Smith's blog post on this situation, so it carried more weight being on stage.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Roughly, but yeah, shrinking the bezel. So it is slightly noticeably larger, like reaching my thumb up to the top side. My work phone is a 14 Pro, so the smaller one. And so it was nice, I had both of them just to kind of compare. I just like the screen real estate of the Pro Max. I have an iPad Pro and I kind of don't use it anymore just because, I don't know, it doesn't fit my lifestyle anymore.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It's two orders of magnitude.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It is a huge difference, for sure. But I don't know. I keep coming back to how many companies are massively profiting on the backs of open source developers and contribute nothing back?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It's okay. There you go. He can leave it to the experts on WordPress like me to talk about this. That's right. That's right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I don't know. You have two fewer buttons than I do.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I haven't. Gosh, Nick. I like this, though. You like this? Press your luck, drop a word into Zulip, and then camp out in there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It can do one thing or many things, depending on how crazy you want to be.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
You don't know me, sir.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I could. And it's not something that has passed me, for sure. I mentioned that I actually worked at Flywheel for three months. You did? On my first day there, did I learn about WordPress? No. I set the record by day one adding 3,754 new emojis to their Slack.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
No, actually, I don't like that. You have to push and hold, I think.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
They didn't. I had metrics. I created impact on day one. I had metrics.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
To get it to do whatever you program it to do.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. But you can set it up to like for on my 15, I had it set up to open the camera because it was a nice and easy way to quickly and reliably get into the camera.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. I got a whole dedicated button for that. So I have it set right now because I'm an old guy, I guess, to the flashlight.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
But you can, like, through the magic of shortcuts, you could set it to run a shortcut, which could do some logic like, oh, it's, you know, you're at home and it's 3.30 p.m., so that means you probably are at work and you want to run this action. And, oh, it's 7 p.m., it's at night and you're off work and you, you know, want to turn on Enya. Like, you could have it set to do any of that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Don't Stop Till You Get Enough by Michael Jackson is my wake-up song. Really? Yeah. I downloaded that as a ringtone like forever when ringtones were things that you would seek out and download.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. Now it's my alarm sound like for waking up at 5 a.m.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I haven't gotten enough yet. I don't stop till I get enough.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
At this point, there's not much. At this point, it's not there yet, right? Well, I was running the beta on my 15, and I decidedly did not want to run the beta on my new phone, mostly because I just want to experience what's this phone like when it achieves its full battery potential? Because on the 15 Pro Max, I was at zero by 4 p.m. every day, and I wasn't doing anything with it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
So it was just draining constantly. That's terrible. Yeah. The Apple Intelligence features that it had, which were still limited, were pretty awesome. Like, the summary of, like, text messages, I could ignore a text thread all day and get a quick summary, and it was kind of comical sometimes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Yeah. It's at least it's not quite there. Like the, the better Siri there yet though.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
No, I'm talking about the beta and I'm not running that anymore, but on the beta, like the one nice thing is you do get the new animation for Siri, which is cool. But then you also get like, it holds some context. So I can be like, you know, how old is this actor on TV? And then I can say, oh, what movie did they star in? And I don't have to say their name again.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
It remembers from the previous question that I'm still in the context of that actor.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
That one's probably like embedded in Ram, you know, enough people ask that. Touche. I just asked Raycast and not Raycast AI. I just typed into the Raycast thing one quart and then OZ and it told me exactly what it was.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
I did see a video today that I can't speak to the validity of it. And I do have chat GPT Pro, but I don't have the advanced voice thing that they have. They announced that forever ago.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
Someone else, specifically someone else. Now it's specifically somebody else. Uh, but I saw a video on Twitter today of somebody using that to tune their guitar. And so chat GPT was like, you know, we're going to tune this string first and it sounds like this. And then he plays it and he's like, how about that? And she's like, no, go a little, like tighten it a little bit more.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The wrong place to slap a person (Friends)
And then she's like, yeah, that's cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Number six, official Python support is here. As Supabase has grown, the AI and ML community have just blown up Supabase. And many of these folks are Pythonistas. So Python support expands. Number five, they released log drains so you can export logs generated by your suit-based products to external destinations like Datadog or custom endpoints.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
It's hard to show up whenever you feel like you have to show up, not when you want to show up for the right reasons or even if you want to, but you feel like you have to perform versus just create and explore. We're seeing that on YouTube over time.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
There's lots of cycles where long-time YouTubers will step away because they feel like they have to serve the algorithm, not their creative selves or their audiences sort of like
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
have an expectation and they will publish something or put something out that is like off from center from what their normal content is like hey can you get back to talking about this thing that I expect you to come on monkey dance you know kind of put the quarter in kind of thing and that's kind of bad when it comes to Because you kind of – it's kind of a double-edged sword, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
You get out there and you do your thing and then it's like, well, you're kind of popular or you have some version of popularity. And that just kind of like compounds and morphs and grows. And some people like us, Jared and I, grow into a business and we're fortunate and we show up and we like doing it. And I think there's a part of our job even, Jared, that is chore and also very much love.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
And that kind of comes with anything. At some point it becomes toil, right? How do you stay in the game and love the game and kind of keep that privacy that you want to when you're famous? Or at least internet famous.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Number four, authorization for real-time broadcast and presence is now public beta. You can now convert a real-time channel into an authorized channel using RLS policies in two steps. Number three, bring your own Auth0, Cognito, or Firebase.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
I'm not very confident about this. So this might blow your mind, but I learned this recently. The confidence is memory of past success. So you have confidence and you move with confidence, I suppose, to use the word in the description or the definition. You can't do that. It's illegal. It's illegal, right? Yeah, it's illegal. Confidence essentially is memory of past success.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
And so I'm not sure that translates, if that's true, if that translates like that. But maybe self-assurance. I think that when you're secure as a person, secure in who you are, secure in who you want to be, your identity is intact. You're not wayward with who am I, what am I, why am I. I think it's a little bit easier to be more steadfast and strong in those regards. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
This is actually a few different announcements, support for third-party auth providers, phone-based multi-factor authentication, that's SMS and WhatsApp, and new auth hooks for SMS and email. Number two, build Postgres wrappers with Wasm. They released support for Wasm WebAssembly foreign data wrapper. With this feature, anyone can create an FDW and share it with the Supabase community.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
And that is an attractive trait, obviously, or traits.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Or do you have similar lack of fear in that area? I thought I'd call it a story. Suze, did you tell us a story about a speaking engagement? Was it private that you told us the story? Or is I'm remembering the wrong person? I feel like you told us a story. You were nervous when speaking. Does this ring a bell to you?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I'm going to put this on my camera. Check this out.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I was really into photography then. Oh, you took that picture, Adam, huh? I took this photo. Yeah. Nice.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We can include this as chapter two if you like, Jared.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You can build Postgres interfaces to anything on the internet. And number one, Postgres.new. Yes, Postgres.new is an in-browser Postgres with an AI interface. With Postgres.new, you can instantly spin up an unlimited number of Postgres databases that run directly in your browser and soon deploy them to S3. Okay, one more thing. There is now an entire book written about Supabase.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah. How did you end up mentioning the sponsor or the brand you worked for at the time?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
So given that, if you don't care for the attention put on you when you put yourself out there and your ideas, what is your perfect world in terms of when you show up to the world and you do what you do, what would the better or more preferred reaction be?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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David Lorenz spent a year working on this book, and it's awesome. Level up your Supabase skills and support David and purchase the book. Links are in the show notes. That's it. Super Bass Launch Week number 12 was massive. So much to cover. I hope you enjoyed it. Go to superbass.com slash launchweek. That's S-U-P-B-A-S-E dot com slash launchweek.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
What's up friends. I'm here with a new friend I made over at Speakeasy founding engineer, George Hadar. Speakeasy is the complete platform for great API developer experience. They help you produce SDKs, Terraform providers, docs, and more. George, take me on a journey through this process.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Help me understand exactly what it takes to generate an SDK for an API at the quality level required for good user experience, good dev experience.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Okay. Go to speakeasy.com. Build APIs your users love. Robust SDKs. Enterprise-grade APIs. Crafted in minutes. Go to speakeasy.com. Once again, speakeasy.com.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
It's wild to hear this because so many people, I don't really know why, I suppose, or what is drawing folks to this desire. But a lot of young kids, like I have young kids, and so I'm seeing them grow up and I'm seeing the friends that they are making and friends that I'd like them to make less friends with. And I just see their influences. And they're younger. They're not like in their teens.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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They're younger than teens. And I have an older daughter, too, and so she's in her 20s. And I'm seeing this shift between different folks. For a while, their people want to be YouTubers. They want to be Instagrammers or whatever this thing is. They want, for some reason, this spotlight. Even at a young age, and I'm not really sure what exactly it is that attracts them there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I suppose it's the opportunity of various influence. But I think even at a young age, I couldn't imagine having influence in my 20s. If I was influential in my 20s, like, wow, the world would suck a whole lot more or less or more. It would suck more. Yeah. Then it already does. It would not have been a positive thing for me to have any sort of primary influence on the world in my 20s. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It's so strange that people seem to chase some version of fame or influence. And that's wild.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Well, it's good to catch up with Suze again. Absolutely. You know, it's been years. That's no fun. A couple years. To be years. It's fun to catch up, of course, though. Right? That's the fun part.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I suppose, but it seems like it's a cultural norm where it's dramatically more than there was. Let me think of when I was a kid. Let me show some of my cards. I desperately wanted to be a ninja when I was growing up as a kid, right? And I think that's maybe a character. I wasn't seeking fame. Now, I can also say that for a long time there, I said I wanted to be a corporate lawyer.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
And the only reason was because I thought I could be rich. And I didn't know any better. I was young. Because you're a really good storyteller, right? Something like that. But other than that, I was not interested in like...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. Corporate lawyer ninja all the way. I think I'll answer your question, but I think what I'm driving towards is a little different. Okay. And I don't disagree with what you're saying necessarily, but I'll share the story because this is fun. This is fun stuff. This is fun. Susie, you having fun over there?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Okay, so you wanted to be Matthew Perry. No, not Matthew Perry. That's from Friends. Well, either. I guess so much either. But Jason Priestley, I was like, if I could be that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Sure. The wavy hair. I don't know. All of it. California. All of it. Yeah. You know, pick a... They were very cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
They were cool. And what an interesting TV show. What an interesting premise to even reflect on mentally right now. But I think what I'm talking about is different than that. And maybe it's different, but kind of the same. And I think what I mean by that is that it seems like kids are really into Jordans. There's like shows about Jordans, like, you know, pawn shops, getting them people.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Like, you know, that's always been a thing. Jordans have been a thing, but I think there's a lot of people trying to show off the things they do on the internet, primarily on YouTube, everything from really cool Lego building, which is like super admirable, very engineering focused, a lot of opportunity if you chase it. to Lego cooking. Who watches Lego cooking? Lego cooking? Lego cooking.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah, I am noticing some familiar background items for you. I think a while back on Twitter you got some, maybe in the last year, I don't know, some requests or questions about your pegboard back there and your desk setup and what you're doing on it. I don't know, it seems familiar to me. Am I catching that wrong? You're not on Twitter anymore though, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Never even heard of it. Suze, tell me. You're with me on this.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Oh gosh. Okay. So do you cook Legos? No. When you go and you find out Lego cooking, you're going to be like, oh yeah, this is the coolest. It is stop motion film. The person cooks. It's just stop motion film. It's very artistry.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And they make everything. So they take a hatchet and cut something and it's Lego inside. Like it's all Lego. Everything's Lego. Everything's Lego.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So that's cool. Stop motion video. I love it. I just feel like all this stuff in this media is getting people to want to – they see the people they look up to be famous through platforms. Right. And so it's obvious, like 90210, Jason Priestley. Although I didn't want to drive a Corvette and I didn't want to be any of those people. But I was like, if I could do that, I would have arrived.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
That's fair. What did you say? Something of power. Remind me of the phrase you said.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I'm glad you mentioned that because I think that's spot on because I think you may have answered my question, which is what is the reason why? I don't really think it's super strange behavior, Jared, to want to be famous, but I think it's kind of strange that it's so it's so pervasive. It's so out there for everyone. It seems at least and I could be just being hyperbole.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
But I think you're right, Suze, that when you're especially when you're younger.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Or X, whatever you call the platform these days.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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teens 10 to 16 you're trying to assert yourself you're trying to assert your any version of dominance regardless of gender you're trying to showcase that you can control situations or be in control of your own life and your own destiny and you're trying to direct things and I think that that probably is a reason is like well if I have this then I have I have power to assert my beliefs my ideas control over my future etc and
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Should I close the loop for you, Jared, on the names of all the NKOTBs? Yes, please do. Jordan Knight, Jonathan Knight. Yes, brothers. Joey McIntyre. Okay, the baby face. That's right. There's always a baby face in these boy bands, right? Yeah, there's the bad guy. Donnie Wahlberg may have been the bad guy. Yeah, I think Donnie was. And then Danny Wood.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I just reminded you.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Now, when I say... What does that make you think of? Hangin' Tough, right? Hangin' Tough. There you go. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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How far back was that? Because I recall it didn't seem maybe a year or two ago. I don't know. It seems familiar to me in terms of in my memory, but it doesn't seem like it was yesterday.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah, I'm not going to sing again. I just had to say that. I hummed, basically. It was not a sing. Hey, friends. I'm here with Todd Kaufman, CEO of Test Double. You may know Test Double from a friend of the show, Justin Searles. So, Todd, on the homepage for Test Double, you say, Great software is made by great teams. We build both.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
So, listeners, this is why Edward Kim, co-founder and head of technology at Gusto, says, quote, give Test Double your hardest problems to solve, end quote. Find out more about Test Double's software investment problem solvers at testdouble.com. That's testdouble.com, T-E-S-T-D-O-U-B-L-E.com. And I'm here with Farash Abugadije, founder and CEO of Socket, socket.dev.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So Farash, you put out this fire post recently on X. And I'm going to paraphrase. You say the XZ package backdoor was just the tip of the iceberg. Give me just a peek behind the scenes of this incident and what you mean by it's just the tip of the iceberg.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah. So how long ago do you think that might've been? A year, year and a half, two years?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Okay, friends, go to socket.dev. Security dependencies. Socket is on the front lines of securing the open source ecosystem. They're a developer-first security platform that protects your code from both vulnerable and malicious dependencies. Install the GitHub app or book a demo. Again, socket.dev. That's S-O-C-K-E-T dot dev. What is on your mind?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
What is it that's got your attention in terms of technical prowess, exploratory? Are you playing with hardware still yet? I did not catch your conversation with Quincy yet, but I'm understanding that you're now a white hat hacker and the NSA sent you a fidget spinner? Yeah. Without sharing the whole entire podcast. Now that's cool. Hold on. Yeah. Let's stop right there and talk about that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Well, without sharing, I mean, you can go probably listen to the conversation with Quincy, but like without like literally copying what was there, what are you into?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Okay. It's very important. I do recall questions being asked, popular in terms of what you've done. And I think it was like you made it yourself. I don't know. What's the situation?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
How do you cybersecurity?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Exactly. How do you cybersecurity? Like what exactly is cybersecurity? If it's so broad, I'm also sort of mesmerized and also enamored by the, you know, the idea of hacking things were being aware there's a box over there and there's some sort of vulnerability. I've got to find it. And there is a way in. But it's up to me to find the 10 or 15 or hundreds of ways you could get in.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
That to me is interesting. I'm not pursuing a person, but it's it's very there's a lure there for me.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Kali Linux, right? Spin up a VM of Kali Linux or install that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Did you enjoy the movie escape room?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
I've not seen Escape Room either. It might get you. What about Mr. Robot?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
I can concur with that. From what I understand of how do you cyber security, it was a joke to ask you how do you cyber security. It was not meant to be a perfect sentence.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah, sorry about that. I can attest that Mr. Robot was an amazing series. It doesn't go where you think it should. You may enjoy it, but it's very technically accurate and quite scary in terms of... Maybe how fragile the world is. You probably see that now that you're deeper into it, how fragile the world can be with cybersecurity.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
We just had a major outage, a BSOD across the world, and it's crazy. It's now sort of front and center to everyday citizens globally because it was a global scenario. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Okay, friends, here are the top 10 launches from Supabase's launch week number 12. Read all the details about this launch at supabase.com slash launch week. Okay, here we go. Number 10, Snaplet is now open source. The company Snaplet is shutting down, but their source code is open.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
What kind of signatures are they leaving? Like, what's the breadcrumbs they're leaving behind? Is it, like, literally a signature? Is it, like, a DAT file that's left behind with, like, you know, a one-liner?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
That sounds like not a very good hacker if they leave their signature behind. Or they leave a file that says, you know, don't delete me, read this message.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
I think actually when I saw this from you, I was like, what is that? Now I'm remembering you did not make it. So thank you for closing the loop on that. And that it was Ikea and that on Etsy, it's very hackable. Like a lot of people are making 3D printed things for it. Have you begun to like explore the vast world of SCADAS?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
How do they get their tasks? Are they just sitting in JIRA getting threat hunting tasks? I'm just joking, of course, but how do they get their missions? How do they know what systems? Are they active in literal crime scenarios? Are they working for folks like the NSA and the FBI or private companies like you were?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. What's the best way in to get into this, this layer of cybersecurity, whether it's threat hunting or, you know, looking at signatures or something like, what's the, is it go to school for it? Just get steeped in it, find a community. What's the best way in?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Now, do you 3D print yourself or do you save these for later when you get the printer? What's your experience with 3D printing?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Well, that's the thing. They're on YouTube getting impressed at a young age. And next thing you know, white hat hacker for the NSA. Yep. You said you did eight of 10. Is that right? How did you even get involved in this, capture the flag in the first place with the NSA? Like what made you find it, discover it, want to do it?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. Are you trying to find something like you may have said this and I glossed over, but like the goal is to find a secret or get into a certain place. What exactly, like what is the artifact that you find? Is it a physical or a digital physical thing or is it just access or is it something you take back and you show, Hey, here's proof I've got this thing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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What are the things you would look for on top? Like a new process ID that just seems obscure, doesn't belong?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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What we need is top, top. Top of the top. Top of the top.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Is there a big career in this? Obviously, as software eats the world and systems morph and you've got more and more things being obviously modernized, is this a lucrative, or not even lucrative since you're not chasing fame or money, but is there a major upside?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
If there's people listening to this thinking, geez, I haven't thought about this, or I've got a fancy for it, but I never considered that I'm super bored in this current position and maybe I can pivot.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
A lot of facets to you. Seriously. No wonder why people are so interested in you. Just throw on the pilot's license in there. Yeah, so many facets.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
They're releasing three tools under the MIT license for copying data, seeding databases, and taking database snapshots. Number 9, you can use PG Replicate to copy data, full table copies, and CDC from Postgres to any other data system. Today it supports BigQuery, DuckDB, and MotherDuck with more syncs to be added in the future.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Yeah. Motorcycles are scary. Yeah, for sure. I've never been a motorcycle guy personally. I just was thinking like, I see so many people here in Texas not wearing helmets because it's legal to not wear a helmet. And I'm like, you do not like your life at all. I mean, you have no concerns or cares because like there is no way you crash and come back from that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
You'll find her signature in something, I'm sure. She's got a pattern you can match to. Right. We should threat hunt Susan in open source. Mm-hmm. Yes, it was good catching up with you.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
It's good to see that you're well, good to see just generally your, you know, the way you approach life, you know, the way you approach decision making, even from things you're fearful of or concerned about or things that give you more comfort and safety. It's interesting to see that part of your life.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The great escape room (Friends)
Number 8, Vect2PG, a new CLI utility for migrating data for vector databases to SuperBase or any Postgres instance with PG Vector. You can use it today with Pinecone and QDrant. More will be added in the future. Number seven, the official Supabase extension for VS Code and GitHub Copilot is here. And it's here to make your development with Supabase and VS Code even more delightful.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I've been doing this a little bit lately in the end of our interview shows. Because I have thoughts and I just started calling it like closing thoughts and stuff. Because I just got thoughts afterwards that I just like reveal. And this one in particular, I talked about potential. And I don't know if you've ever heard me describe potential as kinetic energy stored waiting to be released.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Because I feel like that's my reservation with Zulip is they have so much potential. And it's not that they haven't achieved greatness by any means. I'm not trying to degrade or downplay the greatness they've done by any means. But I believe they have so much more potential to potentially unseat, not so much fully unseat the giants like Slack or Teams.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I love it. Okay, so they mean it when they say code breaks. Fix it faster with Sentry. More than 100,000 growing teams use Sentry to find problems fast, and you can too. Learn more at Sentry.io. That's S-E-N-T-R-Y.io. And use our code CHANGELOG. Get $100 off the team plan. That's almost four months free for you to try out Sentry. Once again, Sentry.io.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But when you look at the feature set that people really want, I feel like Zulip's got it. What they don't have, and we talked about this on the show, is the awareness. And something's got to change there. And that's where my uncertainty for them comes. It's like, you've got to figure out how to market. You can't be the best unknown tool in the marketplace. Right. Something's got to change there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And I don't know if it's dollars spent, but something's got to change with their, their GTN, their go to market strategy, how they talk about them, their awareness. Firefox famously get Firefox. We've lamented on this in positive and negative ways over the years. Like they did all that grassroots stuff with a very shoestring budget. Zulip can do something similar, I believe.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And that's where my reservation comes is like, they've got so much kinetic energy stored waiting to be released, this potential. And I want to see them do that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, perhaps in the spirit of open source, we can also help them do that. I think our adoption would be Useful in that sense. Let's talk about some other things going on. Of course, with open source companies, you're always afraid of a rug pull as we've experienced many of holes, especially of late. How about this?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I'm calling it the reverse rug pull in which they, I don't know, put the rug back elastic, elastic search open source. Once again, how about this reverse rug pull? So cool. That might be going a bit far, because it does imply that you have rug pulled in the past. So you were already not cool, and now you're putting the rug back.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So I don't know if it's so cool, because the better thing is just leave the rug where it was. It really held the room together. Sure.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That rug really tied the room together, did it not?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But yes, much cooler than the rug pull. We don't want to talk too much about this because we are talking with Shea Bannon, CTO of Elastic, soon, this month. He's coming on interviews for the deep dive. But yeah, Elasticsearch.com. Opened back up again. Went full OSI-approved AGPL license. And Shay's pretty excited, as you can just read into his announcement post from August the 29th.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And we're excited too, right? I mean, you called it so cool, so you must be for this move.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, it was just a saying. I don't know if I have that belief yet. The jury is still out for me. So when I read his words, I can read between the lines and hear the sentiment of positivity. Like he seems to be very excited. Yeah. His roots in terms of how Elastic was born was Hacker. And I think I was reading over on InfoWorld from our... Friend of the show, I suppose. Matt Asay.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Is that how you say his last name? It's either Asay or Asay. Asay. Matt Asay. And he, I'm going to paraphrase, but he talked about Bannon's, Shea Bannon's, initiation of Elastic was he personally paid for the trademark for Elastic to protect his work. He was the developer making it. In an apartment, I think in New York City.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And so very much like the stories we all hear about, which is why I'm kind of leaning back towards this so cool aspect. Because we all have dreams when we produce works in the world, our art. Sometimes it's code, sometimes it's pixels, sometimes it's both.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And I believe that in a position which we may not have fully agreed with and we can argue and have argued and have done shows on with the Elastic versus AWS scenario, that you've got to do sometimes what you've got to do. And we may not agree that, hey, let's now go closed source to protect Elastic. but I can at least respect their choice to do so.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I may not agree with it, but I can at least respect that they've had the fortitude to do so. And now to be in a position, the same hacker that made it initially, when you read his post on it, you can tell he's excited. You can tell that he's got joy writing the words and revealing this and going back to an OSI approved AGPL license.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And at least there is now a trajectory now for a, as he says, more open source in the world.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, I agree. Obviously we have questions, which is why we invited him on the show to talk. One of the main things I want to ask him about is he asserts in his post that their move was successful. Like that was a successful thing they did despite him not wanting to do it. And now it's provided this opportunity to go back and And I would love to get that all out in the open.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
How did it find success? How do they know it's successful? Because we recently covered RedMonk's analysis of open source rug pulls and whether or not they've been worth it. And to the best of her ability, I think it was Rachel Stevens over there at RedMonk, did the analysis on a bunch of at least publicly traded rug pulls so that you can get the data.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And she couldn't find any correlation between actually any sort of meteoric rise after the license change, especially ones that have been out there for a while, including Elastic. So that's an interesting thing. And we'll be talking with him soon to our listener. If you have specific questions, lines of thought, conversation that you'd like us to broach with Elastic CTO Shea Bannon, definitely,
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
let us know in Slack and Zulip. I don't know. Email editors at changelog.com. It's probably the safest place right now, unless you're already in our Slack or already in our Zulip, then just go ahead and use what you're already doing. That works.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
The only Bob Seger song I could name is Old Time Rock and Roll. That's like the worst one. All Bob fans kind of hate that song. I don't know the man's work, obviously.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I was just thinking, as you were suggesting that if they were going to pile on or start a new in Zulip, where would it happen at? You know, that's the, that is the challenge not to go back there, but that's the challenge of like, where does that live? Does it live in general under a topic called shows? Does it live under change law podcast? That isn't a channel yet. That will be a channel soon.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Interviews. Interviews. I think we are going to create one channel per podcast as I've already started to do where we publish new episode notifications for discussion. Yeah. which I haven't created one for this show yet because we haven't shipped an episode yet, although today or tomorrow, I assume, we'll have last week's going out. Yes, sir. With Ariz Zuckerman.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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In that case, I think you would just go to the changelog or interviews, I guess, and be like, questions for Shea Bannon, and you just... Start a topic called that. You don't have to post into an existing topic. You can start a new topic and we just, it could be ephemeral. It doesn't have to be a long lasting thing. Just post your conversation in there and then, then Bob's your uncle.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Bobby's your uncle. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That's my thought on the matter at least. But yeah, you do have to stop and think before you just start talking, don't you?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so that is the challenge. That's the other challenge with Zulip is I was, my reservation came from like, now everything has to be structured. And then you have to be the person who says you're off topic or that thread or, you know, like they do in forums. Remember that when you'd be like slapped around basically in forums like, hey.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Welcome to ChangeLog and Friends, a weekly talk show about how we podcast. Special thanks to our partners at Fly.io. Over 3 million apps have launched on Fly, including ours. And you can too, in five minutes or less. Learn how at Fly.io. Okay, let's talk.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You're missing out, man. I'll have to give you his greatest hits. It's on Spotify.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You're changing, you know, you're, you're hijacking, you know what I mean?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Like, yeah, hijacking. Well, the cool thing about Zulip, now we're turning into a walking advertisement. I've already done this once. You can just take an entire topic thread and move it to a different channel or messages that are on a topic. You can just take that entire set of messages and move them to a different topic.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So instead of saying you're hijacking, you just move them to where they belong and people are happy to be like, oh, okay, it's over here now.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So that makes it somewhat less of a one-way door into more of a two-way door.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
How about this? Reverse rug pull. We'll see if it's cool. There you go. Yeah? Yeah. And I guess we'll find out when we talk to Shea himself and release that episode and see how we feel about that because we'll see. Hey friends, I'm here with Brandon Fu, co-founder and CEO of Paragon.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I'm sure it is. I don't use Spotify, though. I only program against it. I've been coding against Spotify this week. I finally cracked it, man. I finally cracked it. We're going to get our data out of there. Is that right? Got it, dude. I'm pulling data out of their unofficial API. It's cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Paragon lets B2B SaaS companies ship native integrations to production in days with more than 130 pre-built connectors or configure own custom integrations. So Brandon, talk to me about the friction developers feel with integrations, SSO, dealing with rate limits, retries, auth, all the things.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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OK, cool. That's the front of the house. That's the UI layer that developers are getting. So what about the back end, the real limiting, the retries, etc.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Is it legal? No.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Okay. Paragon is built for product management. It's built for engineering. It's built for everybody. Ship hundreds of native integrations into your SaaS application in days. Or build your own custom connector with any API. Learn more at useparagon.com slash changelog. Again, useparagon.com slash changelog. That's U-S-E-P-A-R-A-G-O-N dot com slash changelog.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, let's talk about another change log news item that I did not feature in audio. I actually think I just put it in the list of links at the bottom, so I didn't write anything about it, but as a really nice post, by Christian Hollinger, or Hollinger, perhaps, why I still self-host my servers and what I've learned recently. I thought this one would hit home.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I don't know, honestly. I'm not sure it's not illegal. Well, I'm not sure it's not illegal. It's one of the two. Well, they had terms of service. It's either legal or illegal. I don't know. It's one or the other. I mean, listen, they let you log into a dashboard and look at it. So that's all I'm doing. Only it's a robot. I love it. I love bots. A robot doing it for us.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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With you, Adam, as a home labber, but maybe not a self-hoster, but maybe a self-hoster. This article is about two things, Christian says. why I still bother and what has recently taught me. Think of it as a brief retrospective and an encouragement for readers to go down the same rabbit hole. So Christian likes self-hosting and he thinks you should too.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It's a long post, but to summarize the two reasons, at least independence, reason number one and learning is good. Reason number two, are you convinced Adam?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I concur. It is a rabbit hole. I am convinced that you should at least attempt to do this. I don't think you should feel bad if you decide that it's not for you because it is a rabbit hole. It does require a certain level of responsibility over time, especially if your family or others around you begin to depend on those services and you can no longer dedicate the time necessary to keep going.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I suppose as long as you've got the time and the desire, then self-hosting is certainly fruitful. You will learn a lot. I learned a lot about many things that I just never had to really consider before. And I think that I'm a better conversationalist around technology because of it. And I think that I'm just generally more wise to the tech in the world.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Whereas before I had a once removed relationship with it where I would work with someone who was deeper in the knowledge and now I have firsthand knowledge.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, 100% agree. I have self-hosted many things throughout my life and I learned so much doing so. Both production and small business and friends and family stuff, whether it's self-hosted on machines in my house, which I have done for a long time. I had a Linux server that ran in my home and I ran all kinds of services off of that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And then also VPS, self-hosting, shared hosting, self-hosting, just managing your own things. And yeah, the amount of learning is really not to be compared with. You can't fake it. It's just real. But the learning comes through trial and it comes through things going wrong. And this post that he writes is like,
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Here are the, one of the sections is like things that broke in the last six months, you know?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And it's like, yeah, you're going to have that kind of stuff. And it's similar to any sort of maintenance. I don't know how many large appliances and vehicles you own, Adam, but you and I are both old enough to know a house, a car, a laundry machine, anything that's significantly expensive and significantly complicated breaks, right? And when you own it, you own the break, you know?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And you're going to either pay to fix it or learn to fix it. And for me as a guy in my forties with a pretty large family, I don't have the patience or the time to self-host anymore, but I think everybody else should. Not everybody else, but given your circumstance, I think everyone should try it. And some people should do it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You know, I used to like bots more before there was artificial intelligence and now they're kind of scary. Like bots were controlled by us and now they're kind of like maybe not controlled by us. So like when I said I like bots, I kind of cringed internally. Like maybe I don't. I don't know.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And there's certainly things that I've thought about self-hosting, even though I don't have the time, because of privacy and autonomy and the independence that Christian speaks of. For me, more importantly than the learning, because I've already learned enough, I think, in the category, is there are things where I want the independence and the privacy.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And so that's why I consider it, even though I don't want to do it, because I know how much of a headache it can be
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. I'm definitely not in the, for me specifically, Adam, you must self-host all the things camp. I'm not in that camp.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, I asked you to self-host Zulip and you were like, eh, you're on the show. Remember that? No, I was like, I was not excited.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Well, it's just too critical. I do self-hosting for the things that are, that I don't mind being down. If somebody's like, Adam, why is Zulip not working? That's the worst world for me ever. I don't want to live in that world. I don't want to be responsible to that degree. I don't mind assisting. It's just not something I want to personally be responsible for.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Nor do I think I have the expertise currently to do so.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Well, you probably would earn it over time. I would earn it over time, but I'm like... Battle scars. Yeah, I mean... And you get better at it, and it can become faster.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Because you're like, oh, I know what probably went wrong.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Confidence is there. I'm sure I could do it. It's not about lack of confidence. It's about lack of desire to hold the responsibility. I would prefer Zulip to run as Zulip should run and be up for everyone all the time and it not be my problem.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So what are some things you're okay with hosting? Plex. Plex. PyHole. Stupid stuff. PyHole sounds like it's critical, though. It is, but it's so easy to run. Well, that's what you find out about a lot of these things. They're very easy to run. Yes. And then you just got to make sure that they're updated or fix them. Getting it set up is the hard part. Right. They run while they run.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Things go wrong here or there. A network connection goes down. A time database gets out of sync. An update fails. Usually for me it's like, oh, critical vulnerability in this thing that you don't care about anymore. And it's like, oh, I have to go update right now even though three people are using this. Like that kind of stuff.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But most of the learning and most of the pain comes through that initial setup with the new technology. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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For sure. You know, this person's, what is his name? Christian, is that right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Christian goes deep. You know, he is self-hosting and he gives a list of things that he is self-hosting. I'm trying to find a list quickly. To the top. My services, yes. Pilehole's in there. RouterOS, I won't read them all. Unify Controller's in there. TrueNAS is in there. I think he even mentions he does it via Proxbox, which I would never do after trying it once.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I feel like we still control them. Do we not? I mean.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I don't like to virtualize a NAS and virtualize the access to the disks. It's just too critical. So I feel like a dedicated box to your storage device is proper, even if it's overkill or a waste. You know it's done right. And you can pull the disk immediately if you need to and swap it and do some stuff with TrueNAS to ZFS or straight to ZFS if that's all you have.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So in the Babaverse book five.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
VS Code, I thought that was kind of interesting. Yeah, VS Code, I guess it's like a web-based version of it? Or how do you self-host VS Code? So, slight plug, I think they might be sponsoring this episode too. And I'm not saying this because they sponsored it. I truly like their technology. Coder.com is so cool. I think it might be like this because Coder.com is a cloud development environment.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So we've heard of this with like Codespaces, right? And Gitpod. Those are all primarily Docker container based where you're not running in a VM, you're running in a container. Right. And Coder.com does both, but what they do uniquely is when you, I ran, I actually have a Coder.com instance in Proxmox.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That's the deep cut that I don't have any access to.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So I dedicated a brand new VM I created from Ubuntu, made that the Coder box, and now I can turn that into a cloud development environment. I can have code a new project, a new instance, like a new provision of a thing for me and my developers, which is just me because I was just tinkering with it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That's okay though. That's okay. Okay. I think it's in the synopsis of the book where it's not plot ruining, but there's a premise of artificial intelligence not being nice. Okay. Let's just say, you know, trying to escape, trying to be nefarious. Sure. And it's a little scary. It's just a book though. That's just made up. For now, until five years from now when science fiction becomes fiction.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
and inside of Coder, the reason why I bring it up is not to plug them, is because whenever you launch the code, you launch VS Code, you can at least, you can launch Vim as well, so it's for all the hackers. You can launch VS Code in the browser, and it will connect to the code on the VM in the browser, like you're literally editing it like that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I think that's what he's doing here, is he's self-hosting Similar to that, but it's the dedicated layer of just VS Code, where it's remote connecting to somehow the code on your local machine via the browser, probably through the LAN. That's hardcore. That is so hardcore. I don't know why you would do that, but in the coder instance, you do it because of resources.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You want to take all those resources, CPU, RAM, GPU, whatever you need to dedicate to your environment into that CDE, that cloud development environment, versus your local environment. One more layer. This is something that I think is kind of cool is I have my Jekyll blog still yet. So adamstachowiak.com is a Jekyll blog, basically. I do not run that locally.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I have set that up to run inside of Docker because I don't want to fiddle with Ruby and any of the gems and stuff like that locally. Like it's all inside the Docker container, which I think is so cool and never have to mess with local stuff.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That is cool. I'm sure a lot of these services are Dockerized, which makes it a lot easier.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Jellyfin for sure is. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah. But I mean, he's got MariahDB running locally, Redis, InfluxDB, Jellyfin, as you mentioned, GitT, so he's like local Git server, local wiki, of course, Nginx because his website and his blog are both hosted at, I assume this is his house. Yeah. This is like a homesteading version of software, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Right? Yeah. Autonomy, man. Like, leave me alone. I'm going to run my life. But that's like, if you're gardening, then you're like, I want to be self-sustaining. Right. But then you're also tethered to technology because you're still self-hosting. So you're not, you're not like ejecting from the world, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You're not remote in Denver on a cliff or not Denver, like Colorado as a proper state on a cliff in the mountains remote. You're still tethered to technology.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Right. You're not living out in the boondocks of Montana.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. Right. I like Montana too. Yeah. Yeah. What this looks like to me, and I don't want to be negative Nancy or negative Tim or pick your name by any means, is if you're trying to be productive, this seems like a lot of yaks that could be shaved. On the daily, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Like if you're self-hosting your local Git server, provided this is all routinely easily maintained, your VS code is in the browser. You're maintaining whatever that is and whatever can go wrong could go wrong and you can fix it. But when it goes wrong, you got to fix it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Do you think that this is a list of shiny objects that can be distractions and or just simply things that need to be shaved like yaks?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I don't know because nerds are going to nerd out. I feel like some of this stuff is probably him nerding out, which is totally...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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fine to do so in the case of that like define productive if this is what you enjoy he obviously enjoys it so it's almost like similar to gardening where if you don't love gardening don't go plant a big garden because it's a whole bunch of work and the people who continue and persist in that They love the work. They love the process. And so for them, that's what it's all about.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And so, yeah, I mean, there's certainly some yak shaving going on. But, you know, if you enjoy shaving yaks, you get a yak, don't talk back. I don't know. I just got stuck on yak there. But go ahead. Christian closes with this, which might be a good end cap to our discussion. He says, If you're a software engineer, I recommend self-hosting things.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You learn a whole bunch of things through forced exposure to problems that you'll be less likely to encounter in your day job, which in itself is a benefit. Even better, I do believe you'll wind up using at least some of these things in your day job eventually, provided you work on something vaguely backend related.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
By hosting stuff yourself, you also get a reasonable level of autonomy or at the very least some hedging against the corporate dream of your entire life being a perpetually rented subscription. I think that's nice. Poetic. Good ender. I mean, it's certainly romantic. That part gets me.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That does get me. Not enough to do it, but enough to appreciate it. That's where I'm at. Cause like he mentions next cloud in one of his services. I don't want to be, I mean, maybe I do at some point, but I don't, at least right now, I don't want to be responsible for calendars being up, photos being up, file services being up. I mean, I just seems like, Ooh, but maybe next time makes it easy.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I just feel like in the moment without having tried it, it feels like a lot. And I speak to that because of the rented subscription. Right. The easiest place you spend money is like Dropbox. Calendar, I guess, comes with our Google Suite for our business. And in other cases, you're getting it for... Or iCloud if you have an iCloud account. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I'm skeptical. All right. I should say, sorry, nonfiction. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So you're, you are on this, you will own nothing and be happy, you know, world forum, world economic forum prediction several years back where it's like someone famously said and infamously, maybe even infamously said, you will own nothing and be happy. I just don't know about that. Like the perpetual, it feels like a long-term debt that society puts on you. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Like to own an iPhone, you kind of inherit a level of perceived debt. Necessary cost to maintain the service.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Not just the phone service itself, but the things that come with it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I was going to correct you, but then I was like, I know what he means.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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To use it. Like photos. I don't know if that's the right word, but I'm with you in spirit. I think that. Well, it's debt if you.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
What I mean by the reason why I say debt. You have to pay back. Is that you commit to a payment. Oh, you're renting. Right. You're indebted to pay for the service if you use the service.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah, totally. And like an idiot, I still can't, I never, I'm like, is it nonfiction or fiction? Every time in the moment.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yes. You have to pay for the service if you use the service. And if you stop paying for the service, then the service goes away. Right. And I think renting is totally reasonable in certain cases. Like I don't want to own a calendar service. I want to rent one because the calendar is only important over the next month, weeks, and maybe years. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But have you ever considered about your historic calendar? I couldn't care less what was on there. Every once in a while you go back and you're like, what day was that? And you check an event. And you're like, oh, I didn't put it in the calendar. And you're like, dang it. But if it's in there, it's kind of useful. But your past calendar events, I couldn't possibly care less. Rent that service.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
If it goes away, it goes away. Other things, photos. Opposite, right? Like the history is what it's all about with photos. That's the kind of stuff that I'm afraid to self-host.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Availability and history and reliability that it's there forever. Deletion of photos is very, very bad.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah. All right, let's move on to our final topic. So you know how we take episode requests? Do we?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It is kind of backwards, isn't it? It is. Because one's the negation of the other. Yeah. And you think you would start with the real thing and then negate it for fiction.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah, man. Oh, that's so cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It just takes a while sometimes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Is it at changelog.com slash request? That's right. Oh, gosh. That's a great URL. I love that. That is really nice.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Well, we read every request. And we don't fulfill every request. But every once in a while, we dig one out of the ashes. And we will fulfill it three years later. So shout out to listener Alex if you're still out there. If you're still listening, Alex, three years later, you're a trooper, man. We appreciate you. Because that's a long time to listen to. And you should be in Zulu. Anything.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And you should finally be happy that we've answered your request. This one's navel-gazy and self-serving to a certain degree, which is why we didn't do it for a long time. But I thought it'd be a nice end cap to a Friends episode with just the two of us where we can take at least one listener question slash request. Alex wants us to talk about how we podcast.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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how we produce podcasts. He said he's heard of some really cool workflows from both the Linux people and you guys, which I guess means we're not Linux people, about different ways you record and upload scripts. He says, you guys, if I recall, have some type of encoded timestamps to the MP3s. Destination Linux timestamped the episode while they record.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Jupiter Broadcasting uses some type of all-in-one container for recording, if he recalls. And we have Masterfeeds. They also have Masterfeeds. So just some of the inside baseball on how we produce our shows. Maybe some of the nerdier parts. I don't know. Some of it's boring, at least to us because we do it, but maybe interesting to other people.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And then the movie ruined it for me. Stranger than fiction.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I think it's super interesting to other people because I've been having some conversations with a future branded podcast we're producing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And they have questions and I have answers and they sit back and listen as if we have pulled up a glass of favorite drink near a campfire and it's just so fun. Yeah. Seriously. I didn't think what we've done. Really? Yeah. I didn't think what we've done is, you know, you don't know what you know until you try and teach other people, basically. Right. You know, and then they're like, wow.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Stranger than fiction. That's Will Ferrell.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I mean, to us, it's logical and simple because we've repeated it so many times that. And refined it. Right. We could probably do a lot of what we do to some degree in our sleep. Right. You know, figurative speech. I swear I'm not sleeping right now. Not literally in my sleep, but for example, I'll give you an example.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I never saw that one.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And this is not necessarily answering Alex's question, except for maybe to flex a little bit. And I'm not a flexer. I wrapped up this conversation yesterday for this future branded podcast that I'm not sure I can mention yet, which was why I'm being vague. And the idea was, okay, we've got the music components together and they can't,
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It was a strange movie. Was it stranger then? But it was fiction. It was good. It was a good breakout role for him. It was different than all his preceding roles. It was like the first time he went out of the straight up comedy role. Right. And he did it. He accomplished it. He nailed it. In my opinion, he was solid. Really? Like I was rooting for him. He worked for the IRS. He was an auditor.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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here slash see the future vision that I can see coming because I've got the experience and we've got the experience and I know where we're trying to take them. They haven't done that yet. And so they have questions and reservations and apprehensions that need to be resolved. And the easiest way to do that is to give them a version, a listenable version of it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so yesterday within the span of an hour and a half, I think I sat down and produced a fake episode. that uses the intro music and the timing. I script-writed the intro and how I think it should work, how it blends into the show, how the show ends and how the music comes back in, how the show could end.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And I used all the components that we've produced for them and gave them three different versions because we have three different outros they're considering. The intro is solid and it's not being scrutinized in any regard. But the outro is like, they've got questions of how it should, should they be the same? Should they match up? How similar should they be?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And, you know, doneness is the enemy of perfection, right? If you can't just get it out there, it's going to... Perfection is the enemy of doneness. I said that backwards. You can't strive for perfection. You can obviously, you know, don't wait until it's perfect or seemingly perfect or all the answers are answered to get momentum and move.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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The reason why I'm telling you this story is that in the span of, you know, an hour, I... And solidified and created what has been in my mind for many months waiting to take action on when the time is right. And it's done. And I think when you listen to it, you'll be like, yeah, that's a pretty good version of what it's going to be.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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It's obviously four minutes, not 40 minutes like it might be or will be. It's a micro version. listenable. That's actually kind of compelling. And when I listened back to, I was like, I kind of want to listen to the whole thing now. And it's just a fake. It's just, it's just episode zero teaser.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. There's nothing. There's nothing. Well, there's something in there. Well, but not, not yet.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I told you I would reveal too much. Sure. But it's, uh, I was like, yeah, I would listen to this. This is cool. And the reason why I say that is because we've done it so much that, uh, In the span of an hour-ish, I created what is likely to be the future of that. Not two days or several days and, you know, had to go back and forth. It was just done.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You're just inventing the future right in front of their eyes. That's right. That's right. All right. Good. Solid flex. Stay tuned for branded podcast upcoming of Adam's design with a partner, which will be the second time we've accomplished such. We do produce Big Tent, Grafana's Big Tent with them, which is the first one. Yeah. And selective, but open to that process with others.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Very selective strategically because we're a small team. But to more directly answer Alex's question, maybe he's interested in tools, techniques, like how we do what we do and what we use.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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He's not interested in my flex. He's like, Adam, just be quiet. Yeah. Let Jared tell the true story here.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We're going to chapter that one, Adam flexes, and then we'll have the real answer.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Jared answers Alex directly is the next chapter. What's up, friends? I'm here with Cal Carberry, co-founder and CTO at Coder.com. So Coder.com is a cloud development environment, a CDE, and you run on all the clouds, AWS, Azure, GCP, you run on-prem, and you're no stranger to competition, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Who's the best comedian crossover to drama? Yeah. I mean, short list, right? You got Adam Sandler. You got Jim Carrey. You've got... Adam Sandler's the GOAT, bro. Yeah, he probably is. He's the GOAT. Did Mike Myers ever crossover? I think he tried to. Oh, Steve Carell's actually done pretty well. Yeah. Anyways, did you book your flight? I booked my flight. I booked my flight. We're booked, baby.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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The competition out there is well-known, but what shocks you, what surprises you about the state of cloud development environments and how developers are leveraging them?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So I've used Docker, I've used VMs, but take me into the technical details. What is it that's different between a VM and running something in Docker?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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jank it just makes more sense to give them a vm that we know works well it might be time to consider a cloud development environment and open source is awesome and coder is fully open source you can go to coder.com get a demo or try it right now or even start a 30-day trial of coder enterprise once again coder.com that's c-o-d-e-r.com coder.com
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And I'm also here with Todd Kaufman, CEO of Test Double, testdouble.com. You may know Test Double from our good friend, Justin Searles. So, Todd, on your homepage, I see an awesome quote from Eileen Nucatel. She says, quote, end quote.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Take me one layer deeper on this engagement. How many folks did you apply to this engagement? What was the objective? What did you do, etc. ?
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2024. Raleigh, North Carolina.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Very cool, Todd. I love it. Find out more about Test Double's software investment problem solvers at testdouble.com. That's testdouble.com, T-E-S-T-D-O-U-B-L-E.com.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Raleigh, North Carolina. I'm going to repeat what you say. We'll be there. I think we'll be there. I can't see why we wouldn't be there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And very cool use of... I mean, and it's gotten better, continues to get better. We've been on it for at least a couple of years now. Very few incidents. So we're happy with the software. We own a separate account for each of our podcasts and everybody logs into their own account. They record in there and that handles the majority of everything.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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the actual video and audio recording and syncing, and then we export out of there into Adobe Audition for editing. We have a kind of a three-step process in our editing. One's called prepped. So we prep the audio. This has to do with making sure all the tracks line up, all the boring stuff that people don't ever think about.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We're planning on being there. We're just not sure where our booth is at yet. We don't know where our booth is at, but we'll have a booth, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Sometimes prepping the sounds, trying to get a different version in case the audio of a specific track isn't great. And then we edit it, content edit. This is usually our editors. Shout out to Jason and Brian who content edit our shows. And their job is to basically cut out all the bad parts, which is just awkwardness, weird pauses, et cetera. They do their work, ums and ahs.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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At that point, they leave markers. So Alex asked about timestamps and chapters and all that stuff. We don't do any timestamping or markering while we record. Seems like the ideal time to do it, but actually when you're in the moment, in the groove, you're not actually thinking about, oh, this is a great, except for earlier when I said, here's a chapter.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Every once in a while I'll think about it, but you just want to be able to just be free from all that and just enjoy the conversation. We aren't doing anything. I think Riverside has, oh yeah, they have a mark clip button right there that we could use to set a marker. But we don't do that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We will have a booth. We will have options, I believe. I think we have an option of in the main area near the ballrooms where we normally are. But where we have normally been is highly sought after. Right. And they had a swell of sponsorships in the end.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Sometimes there are things that we know about, and so we'll just tell our editors afterwards, like, hey, look out for this. You can drop a marker here, a marker there in our locals as we go. And I've done less of that than I used to. I used to do it more. But Jason and Brian take good care of us, so they handle the edit, then they pass it back to us for mastering, which is all the final stuff.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Chapters, ads, voiceovers, music, final edit decisions if there's any content editing to do. All of this is in just big old Dropbox folder, basically. That's organized. by show and by episode, and separate Adobe Audition sessions for each phase. So very much a manual version control system that works just fine just by copying files and renaming them.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And then we mix down a WAV file and an MP3 file and we upload them to our website. Hit publish, baby. Now that's both detailed and glossing a bunch of stuff, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yes. Yeah, the cool thing about the way that Adobe Audition works is that you have a file type called .sesx. And those files point to a local file set, essentially. It's like a timeline. I imagine it's probably, I've never actually read the file type. I thought it was proprietary. It's like an XML file, I think. It's very XML-like, yeah. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so when you make these copies of it, the file is like a couple megs at most. So like, for example, Jared mentioned the prepped version of this. We have a show coming up today on these ergonomic, really awesome keyboards from ZSA. And the prepped file is 130 kilobytes. The edited version is 2.2 megabytes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And because the master version only has a couple things added to it, it's the same file size. Now, once those changes go in, I'm going to produce that right after the show or after this recording that we're literally talking into right now. I'm going to go do that work in the master file. And that file size will grow probably to at most three megabytes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So like these session files are very small and are supported by the local file system, which has... Recorded sessions in their imported files, all these different things that are sort of like file system stuff that Adobe Audition uses.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Adobe Audition has been really good to use, I would say, over the years because it moves from person to person pretty easily as an independent file system or an independent directory that you can copy and do whatever you need to do with it. And so we've been very happy on that front.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so money trumps non-money. And I guess we're in the non-money bucket. We're non-money people.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And even chaptering within in the WAV file, when we do that, there's a span that you can put like a marker and another marker and join those together and make them a chapter or a two-point marker. I'm not even sure what they call those things, honestly. Merged markers, something like that. And let's turn it into chapters.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Range marker, I think. Yeah. Been very easy to do that. And I think it's important probably, Jared, for you to talk about some of the stuff you're doing with the WAV file. Can I interview you a little bit on this process? I feel like maybe they might get more mileage on an interview version versus a monologue version of it. Absolutely. So I know what we do. We mix down a WAV file. Right.
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And then we mix down through a process called match loudness to get to the MP3 because there's some things that happen in this match loudness process that make it broadcast worthy. It kind of pulls levels up inside the MP3 file to make it, you know, the levels normalized and stuff like that for production audio out in the world. And so the WAV file has chapters in it. It's larger than the MP3.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I would say we bring the money but we're not given the money I mean we are we're so money that we don't even know it that's right but we don't actually have the money so it's different yeah I get it we'll be there though it's cool we're flex we'll have our microphones we'll have stickers who knows what else we'll have I'm hoping we have at least one TV with clips.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We then drag that WAV file into match loudness and push go essentially, or run I think is the word for the process. And then a minute or two later, depending upon the machine you're using it on. Out comes this MP3, right? Right. And so we upload the MP3 into our CMS, our website, our application. And then before that, though, we also sort of drag and drop this WAV file.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Can you talk about what you do to introspect that WAV file to pull out the chapters, to pull it into the CMS process? And then some things that happen with the MP3 when it comes to like date changes or title changes or slug changes, how those things permeate into the final CDN that actually goes out to the world. Right.
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So there's really two sources of truth for any piece of information about an episode, right? And those two sources are the RSS feed, or feeds in our case, in which the episode lives, and then the ID3 tags inside of the MP3, the final artifact. And those two sources of truth should be synchronized and match.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so the obvious place to do that work is in our admin, because our admin is where we author a lot of that information, including the title, the date published, the duration. We pull that out of the MP3, but all the information is stored in our CMS.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so the way that the chaptering works and really the way that all metadata works is every time you save that episode in our admin, it's taking the result of the episode information that's in our database. It's rewriting a brand new MP3 that has that exact same match data. So it's always the same.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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The MP3 does not contain the chapter information until our admin contains the chapter information for that same reason. The chapters need to be outside of the MP3 because they also have to be in the RSS feed. We also use them on the website. We use them in multiple places. And so the data has to be outside of that MP3. And so the way that we get that is out of the WAV file.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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So the MP3 gets uploaded into our admin. The WAV file is huge in comparison. MP3s range from 50 megs. Well, changelog news is like 7 megabytes. Anywhere from 10 megabytes to 100 megabytes, sometimes bigger for Adam's epic interviews. But the WAV files, that's raw audio, uncompressed. And so we're talking gigabytes, right? So we don't actually want to upload the WAV file to our admin.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We just want the information out of it. And so every episode post audition has four artifacts, two WAV files, two MP3 files, one for regular changelog people. And then the it's better folks get their own file. It's better. That's right. For plus plus. When you drag the WAV file into our admin, it's just dropping it into the local browser session. It's not uploading it to the server.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah, we'll have our clip gallery behind us, hopefully. So if you're going to be at All Things Open 2024, which is at the end of October, 27th through the 30th, I believe, is our official trip dates.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And the browser via our good friend JavaScript uses, I can't remember what library we're using, wave.js or something. Something somebody else wrote to basically introspect the WAV file. which can get at the markers, pull them out, match the timestamps, and basically create for us a bunch of chapter objects in the form. And that's how that works. So the WAV file is then discarded.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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When you hit save, the WAV file is not going anywhere. It just disappears. MP3 gets uploaded along with the chapter information.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah, the chapter information can live in the admin episode before the MP3 does. Yep. Right? Because it's its own data set, basically, which informs the RSS feed. That's right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And you can go back and edit it later, and it will reflect into the MP3 and into the RSS feeds. And so that's why I want that to be the source of truth versus the WAV file. The WAV file is kind of like a starter for your chapters, basically.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Right, it's the... Starter's a good word, I suppose. I was trying to go with a different word. The kindling. The initial vehicle to get it there, I don't know. The transport layer. Yeah, just like the baseline data set. It's actually the conduit between Audition and Web.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You could completely ignore it. You could author all your chapters by hand in our admin by hitting add chapter, start time, end time. You could do that if you were a fool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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We're not fools. The cool thing too is to go technically a couple layers into the details, the WAV file does not get uploaded as you mentioned. It infers and informs the admin of all the chapter data.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And the cool thing I think of is afterwards, if there's a typo, which I will go and save and then preview the webpage, because sometimes in audition, it's not easy to see all those typos because the interface of audition has small type. And I'm in my forties, as you've alluded to you being in your forties. It's not that my vision is bad. It's just, you know, it's small.
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And so I'll see things differently when previewing it as the, you know, future episode page of this episode, for example. And I'll notice that I fat fingered something or whatever may have happened. And I will change it in the admin versus having to re-upload a new WAV file. Now that does mean that the WAV file is no longer the source of truth, which is obvious because it's not meant to be.
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Yes, Sunday through Wednesday.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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But the change happens in the web, not in the MP3, or sorry, the WAV file, which can take minutes, sometimes 15 minutes if you're on a non-Apple Silicon Mac. Yeah, too long. Like I've learned. Too long. You know, it could take, you know, 10 minutes sometimes to mix down from the session into the WAV file.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Find us, talk to us, high five us. Adam gives hugs if you're into that kind of thing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And so that could be too long, like running tests, just too long. Forget it. Right. Just do it in the browser.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And sometimes you'll catch a typo on an episode that you're listening to a week and a half later. Maybe Adam mastered it. So it's not even on my machine. Like Dropbox hasn't synced it. I don't want to go sync his session down, remix it down, et cetera. So I just go into our admin, make the change. and we're good to go. So that's really cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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All of the MP3 chaptering abilities, shout out to our friend Losh Vickman, who we hired a couple years ago to write a Elixir library, which allows us to write ID3 v2.3 tags, which we couldn't previously do with our FFmpeg-based solution, which is why we didn't do chapters as quickly as we wanted to. All of that you can find in old episodes. There's a Kaizen with Losh.
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There's also an episode that I thought was really fun called A Guided Tour Through ID3 Esoterica where we talk about all the cool stuff Losh learned along the way. as he wrote that library, which we now maintain, although it's had very few changes because it works pretty much as advertised over the years. It allows us to embed images and links as well. Super cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Sometimes. I've pulled back from the hugs.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And, you know, not to flex or anything, but I feel like we have the best chaptering game in the biz. That is a flex, isn't it?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Flex as you'd like. I concur, and I agree.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Our chapters are pretty on point.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I'm such a chapter snob now, man, really. I feel like anybody who's an avid podcast listener listening to podcasts that don't have chapters or haven't appreciated or come to appreciate chapters in podcasts are missing out so deeply. And maybe it's just because, you know, we're professionals. And we quality assurance our stuff that I want to jump around more than the other listeners.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Yeah. But certain individuals, depending upon how they look at me, it's hug time.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Cause like, there's a lot of listeners. Like I don't jump around the podcast, so I have no need for straight through.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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But I'm like, I kind of want to just jump to that one spot.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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especially when the chapters are so well named you know so so much care and love but well for me that's the fun part is yes we get to inject a lot of fun you know really i wouldn't call them easter eggs but like the the fun is in the chapter names and sometimes the chapter metadata that like i know seven people are gonna notice or or less but someone's gonna notice and get a giggle
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Hey, friends. I'm here with Dave Rosenthal, CTO of Sentry. So, Dave, I know lots of developers know about Sentry, know about the platform because, hey, we use Sentry and we love Sentry. And I know tracing is one of the next big frontiers for Sentry. Why add tracing to the platform? Why tracing and why now?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Hopefully, or even just roll their eyes. But yeah, chaptering is something that we really take seriously and put a lot of, put a lot into and I guess don't care so much that a lot of people get a lot out of it. We'd love more people to. But it's kind of like that thing with Steve Jobs and Johnny Ives where they were designing the inside of a thing or the back.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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How should one approach if they're interested in an Adam hug?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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And they didn't care if nobody else saw how cool it looked on the inside because they knew. They knew how cool it looked. So that's how we do chapters. It's probably the most technical and interesting part of our flow. Everything else is relatively bog standard. Yes.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I think the chaptering is the, is the bee's knees, man. It's the cat's pajamas. It's the good stuff. And I think our workflow affords us the ability to do that with such care because in the, you know, going back to when, when we marker taking the time in that post-production process to, Took a bit to get used to because it is a time slot. You got to dedicate to it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Great question. Oh, geez. I would say longingly. Longingly. And with a slight smile. Arms wide open or is that too much?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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You know, you may dedicate more. I may dedicate less. You may dedicate less. I may dedicate more. Who knows? But I, you know, doing that pass is like the final step. I would just say like chef's kiss moment, opportunity on a show. And maybe we take it too seriously and others take it less seriously.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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Like you just mentioned with Steve and Waz, like designing the inside of this thing that nobody gets to see, but they know how cool it looks. I feel like that's the cool stuff for us. There was a couple chapters I can't get to them that I can think of. I don't know.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
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I was going to bring out one from a recent show, but it's so contextually adjacent from this conversation, it won't really translate well. But if you go, dear listener, and you go through even like Lady Bird, like that episode, episode 604, has 42 chapters. That's a lot. And the final chapter, 42 is an awesome number too, by the way.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
The final chapter is Cozy Lo-Fi from Caitlin Colt. Because Andreas' wife produces lo-fi music that you probably could listen to when you're coding on YouTube. Good stuff too. I've been listening to it. Have you? And that was his plug. And so we decided to put, I think it's actually called Cozy Lo-Fi is the name of that track. And so we put that in there as its own chapter dedicated.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You can just go, just jump to that chapter right now and listen to it. To me, that's the cool stuff. It's the details in podcasting that really... And I would just say, Marco, if you're listening... I love your software for the most part, but this latest update to Overcast, I am not super happy with it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I would say come with a handshake and convert to hug. Right. Well, that's the easy version. Like you shake the hand and you lean in. Yeah. You can do the back pat and then you can be like, you can whisper in his ear, I want the whole thing, you know, something like that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I want to take this moment to tell you that chapters are so cool, and the way chapters work now is not so cool in Overcast. I liked it so much better when I clicked on a chapter, the page didn't go away. And now you have to go back to it again and find where you were at before you can use it as a jumper. Like a table of contents that did not move when you moved around.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
The audio would move because it's audio, but the interface did not hide. The chapters are a leaf page that pop up. And as soon as you click on one, it goes away. And then when you click on it again, it doesn't even take you to where you're at in the chapter list. It takes you to the top. And so you got to scroll, scroll, scroll to where you're trying to be at.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And so the experience of chapters has drastically changed in my opinion. And I'm super sad. Please change it, Marco, if you're listening.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
a plea from one particular user and if not we'll just chapter this in the audio and link directly to this chapter and send it to you there you go so one quick chaptering story before we move on as we're just hanging out on chapters this chapter will never end A recent JS Party episode is called a Nick-level emergency.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So Nick Nisi, whom you may know from JS Party and also from Changelog and Friends and other changeloggy goodness, is a big TypeScript fan. And the Node.js people recently added some TypeScript-related features, and Nick wanted to have an emergency pod about it. It was not worthy of an emergency, and so... We did it anyways. We made fun of him along the way, and we called a Nick-level emergency.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
That's JS Party number 333, which is a fun ride of itself. But then I got this idea for the chapters. Since this whole thing was Nick's emergency, I'm going to have him referenced in every single chapter. And so there's 22 chapters on that episode. And if you go read them, every single chapter has the word Nick in it somewhere. Chapter three, Node adds TypeScript stripping for Nick.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Chapter four, Nick would absolutely love this. Chapter five, Nick, I'd rather be TypeScripting. You get the point. That's the kind of nerdery I'm talking about. Why not, right? Have some fun. Probably less than seven people realize this. Less than 7%, huh? You think so? Well, how do you know? How do you know how many people will look at your chapters?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Give me the full hug, Adam. Yeah. Okay. There you go. That's getting weird. But hey, if you do that, well, then you listen to the show and you follow orders or at least entertain our silliness.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
We need to chapter pixel tracking technology ASAP.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, I do appreciate that level of detail that we can put into it, which I believe the hardest core of hardcore listeners do appreciate. Just imagine the experience of hearing about us for the second or third time, and maybe you're not a full-time listener, but you've been linked up to an episode page, and you land there, and somebody says they talked about X. and pick your variable, right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
They talked about, you know, Nick level emergencies on this thing. And he was mentioning his desire for what's new in ECMAScript 24. You can jump right to that chapter. And that chapter is also a linked chapter that goes out to an entire article on the new stack About it. Because that's probably what Nick did in show notes was like, hey, this is what my reference point is. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So they can go right to minute 18 and 26 seconds and listen to what's new. So when they come there, they kind of get this version of instant gratification. Whereas podcasts... generally require you to dedicate, in this case, 51 minutes potentially, to hunt for the goodness. Chapters point you directly there. Now, I mentioned initially, chapter snob, that's me.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Even on YouTube, like if I'm listening, if I'm watching anything on YouTube, like a recipe, you know, I've been like all in this chef stuff, you know. If I find a video that's like next level chicken parmesan and I want to like examine their recipe, I don't need to know it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Like if I've experienced, I could chapters, let me bypass the things that are not for me versus having to listen to the whole thing or watch the whole thing or whatever it might be. Like if you are on YouTube or you're podcasting like we are, and you're not chaptering and you have anything that's more than five minutes, Sad, man. I would just bail on it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I'm just not going to give your content time because you have not respected my time.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So here's a feature for YouTube I've been thinking about. Because we do now allow YouTube to slurp in our audio episodes. And you can subscribe to JSParty, GoTime, what have you, on YouTube now. via the playlist at youtube.com slash changelog. And so this is YouTube's official way of adding audio podcasts as a feature to their platform.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So there we go. All things open 2024. Also, our show with Alia Abbott has actually borne fruit, which is rare for us. Like we've actually, we followed up Zulip. We're trying out Zulip. In earnest, meaning we're actually using it and we've invited people into it and we got people in there. And we are checking it out. Now, I thought we'd talk about this on Kaizen, which is coming up just next week.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And they re-host like Spotify does, but they do not respect chapters in your feed or in your MP3 or anything like that. And so we do not have chapters on YouTube, whereas we did go out of our way and implement Spotify's specific requirements for chapters on their platform. We do not have them on YouTube.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
What I'm thinking about doing is creating a second feed for every one of our podcast proppers that includes the chapters as timestamps in the show notes, which is how YouTube works as a creator. The way you add chapters in YouTube is super lame and manual.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
It's probably actually a good solution for non-technical people because you basically just put a section of your description, a list of timestamps with a title, and it will turn those into the chapters inside YouTube. That's how it officially works. There's no chaptering functionality in their YouTube studio. You just put it in the description and it turns those into chapters.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And so I might start writing for every one of our podcasts a second feed file that's just for YouTube. and point YouTube at that one, and everything is going to be completely identical, except for we put the chapters in the show notes as timestamps, and that would give us chapters on YouTube.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I don't want to do that in our feeds generally, because it bloats them quite a bit, and our feeds are already pretty bloated due to being complete episode catalogs versus like the last 100 episodes. So our feed files are already pretty large, but that's something I've been thinking about doing for YouTube just to get the chapters information out to YouTube. However...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
There's just not that many people listening on YouTube yet. Or maybe ever, because we're a non-video podcast. A good episode, I think most recent Changelog News outperformed, and it was only a couple days ago. 500 people listened to that on YouTube. Typically we get 100-ish per episode over there. But I think having chapters over there would be appreciated. So I'm thinking about doing that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I haven't done it yet. Now we're basically Kaizen-ing, so maybe we should stop.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, there's a little Kaizen in all the conversations. You know, you're always part of Kaizen is always be improving. That's always, you know. That's right. Improve without ceasing. All right. What's left? I would say what is left is just to thank everyone who is paying attention to this enough to care about this last how we produce podcast section. Maybe you don't care. Maybe you do care.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Maybe you care about how we, maybe you got some ideas. Maybe you're like, man, have you tried this? Or I like that workflow, but what about that? Our stack is open source. And I would say open to contributions. There is a Zulu for that. So, or a Slack for that potentially, where maybe you can hop in there into a dev channel. And if you've got some ideas, you know, obviously it's open source.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You can fork it and do what you want, but you know, you can contribute, you can leverage the code base to learn. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You know, almost, I wouldn't say instantaneously, but pretty close to instant whenever it makes sense. And so I think RSS feeds are pretty solid.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So much so that I actually pulled down the master feed and I have it opened up in Zed just to look at a raw RSS feed from the master feed, which is just humongous.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
It's like 12 megs.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
uh i'll tell you i curled it down it is 11.7 megs oh i drilled it and it took me three seconds to curl it down that's a pretty long time for an xml file i mean that's 12 megabytes it should be almost instant right not for 12 megs i suppose i mean an xml file is not usually that big though that's a pretty big xml file
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But our Kaizen is busted at the seams. So why not just do quick first impressions here? What we think about Zulip after using it for two weeks-ish? Maybe 10 days in earnest?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
It is. It's got over a thousand episodes in there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
But it's got a lot of cool stuff in there. So all that to say is our code base is open source. If you're curious on how these things are implemented, look at that. Obviously, we are still in the process of potentially fully adopting Zulip. So there may be a place for you to have a conversation if you want to contribute. So you can hop in there and share some of your ideas, of course.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Or just fork and do and PR away. There you go. But yeah, it's been fun to talk about self-hosting and the non-cool, cool rug pulls that are reversed and stuff. I'm excited about that stuff.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
All right, that's all we got for this week. Thanks for hanging out with us. Coming soon to a friend's near you, Kaizen. Coming soon to a friend's near you, Natalie Pisonovich talking AI code editors. Coming soon to the changelog, Elasticsearch. What else is coming soon on the changelog? Oh, coming soon on the changelog, Jimmy Miller talking about the best, worst code base.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
that should be good yeah yeah looking forward to that one so stay tuned right here and uh if you're a nerd and you like pretty things go curl down our rss files and just appreciate that formatting because you know it's a lot of hard work putting in those suckers and nobody reads them but computers yeah chapter data is in there all all the stuff it's uh it's a lot of stuff in there
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Very cool. It is hard to appreciate that stuff. And I would say one more back in your list, because this came out after that, is ergonomic keyboards from ZSA. Cool stuff. That's right. Scroll up, hit play. That's right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
You know, I did not expect me to like it as much as I like it. Really? I really was only trying it... Out of seemingly force. Like no one was forcing me, but I felt like we really had to. Well, we said we would. Well, yes, we did. So yes. But there's no force there. You can always make empty promises or at least empty words to some degree.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Or down. I'm looking forward to that episode, although I'm looking back at it as we publish. Yes. The time travel of... out of sync podcast recordings. All right, let's call it a show. See y'all in the next one. Bye friends.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
ChangeLog++ members, stay tuned for an even deeper dive into our RSS feeds and how I rewrote all the XML rendering in our app, mostly because I didn't like the way it looked.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And don't forget, it is still September, so you still have time to trade a five-star review for free ChangeLog stickers. Write up a thoughtful review or blog post, send proof to stickers at changelog.com, and we'll mail the goods directly to your front door. That sounds good. I'll have that. Thanks again to our sponsors, Sentry, Paragon, Kuder.com, and Test Double.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And of course, to our longtime partners at Fly.io. To our Beatfreakin' residents, The Goat, Breakmaster Cylinder. Yeah, music's good. And to you for listening, we appreciate you spending time with us each week. Next week on The Change Log, news on Monday, Jimmy Miller tells us about his best, worst code base on Wednesday, and Gerhard Lazu joins us for Kaizen 16 on Friday. Have a great weekend.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Leave us a five-star review if you want some stickers. And let's talk again real soon.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
So, Jared, is there anything else we could talk about with this RSS feed? Let me count the lines. Let me count the ways. 88,724 lines is the length of the LOCs on this file.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, well, that's our entire episode history in a single file. So that's kind of interesting to think about. That is the changelog in a nutshell. Literally is. It is. Everything that we've done is in.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, I don't mean to like not do it, but I mean like I was begrudgingly trying it out. I know you were.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I felt it. I felt your begrudge for a minute.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Because you're like, you set it up, you invited me, and then you were like, I can tell you're like, and I did my thing. I did what I was supposed to do.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah. Yeah. Well, I felt like I had at least done that. But, you know, what clinched it for me, and this is where we were chatting in our own DMs in there, was I was like, I really just feel like we need more realness to it. I can't just DM with you and be like, yeah, I like it. Let's do it. That's not going to be it. You know, we've got to have some real stuff in there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And wow, in addition to my mind changing or at least my judgment, my prejudgment. Sentiment.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
changing. There's people in there. And I would say there's more deep conversation in Zulip than has ever been in Slack. Now there's been lots of conversation, but like, it seems like it's deeper and longer because the thread is there. The topic is there. I don't know something. Yeah. Something uniquely different is in Zulip.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And now when I go back to Slack, I really just feel like, like I have no idea where the conversation's at. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, a couple of things that have struck me. The first one is required topics makes you think a little more before you do something or say something. And so there's a little more intentionality to what you have to do, which is friction. which sometimes stops you. It's like, I think you said it, this feels more like real-time email.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And because when you start a new email thread with somebody, you have to put a subject in that email. And that's what a topic is really. And so it does feel a little bit more like that compared to Slack. The second thing is, and our community folks have figured this out quickly, it feels like it's built by nerds more so than Slack does, even though Slack has some nerdy things for sure in there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Nerds built this, and that's really cool. You can feel that love. And then the third thing is, we've already had a success story with one particular community member who already interacted with the Zulip team and their dev channel and had influence on the way the product was being built. And that's the open source ethos that we love. We would never have that kind of access with Slack.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
We've known folks inside of Slack for years, off and on, engineers. And we're like the smallest fish in that huge ocean of users. So that's pretty cool. It has its problems, it has its warts, but yeah, kudos to the Zulip team for putting together something pretty cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yeah, and I think when you look at, like the first thing I start to think about when I evaluate something is the experience and the user interface, which is not simply just design, it's also experience. I thought because while they're not venture-backed, not that they're less talented, they've got less resources to apply to eke out all the UX permutations.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And I really just thought it would be less polished. And that's not true. Like the built by nurse thing, the keyboard shortcuts is what's selling me. It's hard selling me like being able to navigate around.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
It's completely keyboard driven. Like you can drive it without your mouse a hundred percent if you want to, which is really cool.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Which is why when I go back to Slack, I feel like I'm clicking everywhere and it's so fatiguing in comparison, like one-to-one going back and forth because we are straddling the line. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Where we've got a micro version of our community in our Zoloft and there's conversations happening, there's topics, there's like, I feel like it's pretty fleshed out in a way, like it's on its way to being fully fleshed out.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And then we're going back to Slack for other conversations because we haven't made that cutover yet. And I'm not sure if we will. Maybe we can talk about that here on this conversation. I don't know the answer right now. Yeah. I mean, I kind of feel like I know the answer. What is it? I feel like it's, yeah. Like Zulu is the future. Okay. That's how I feel.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I feel like, so I didn't share this with you yet. Cause I've been, you know me, I'm a reserved, I suppose. I haven't been talking a lot in there. I've been observing people, conversating and participating through observation and here and there jabbing in with some stuff. But the web public stuff is super interesting and,
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I think it could be cool to find ways to make the change law community not so much bigger to be bigger, but this idea that I've always shared, and I think you've adopted it too, is this idea of no imposters here. Everyone's welcome. And that same idea where maybe Zulip, because we have this full history and we can self-host it and all the things, we're not locked into their cloud.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
We can begin there and move to our own self-hosted version of it. I feel like we have a lot more room to really lean even heavier into community where we could have before, but we've had to pay for it. And it was a significant cost in the Slack world. Where maybe we didn't put that kind of pressure on ourselves to do so because of our known limitations. Whereas now I feel like unfettered.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Now we can literally do what we want. And I don't know this to be true, but I can hypothesize that it would be. That we can get pretty good buy-in and support from Zola. Yeah. In whatever ways. Like if we have ideas for how to make this even more community focused, then I think that there's... I agree with all of that.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
And I think that there's definitely ways where we could increase the amount of community discussion around the shows by deeply integrating into Zulip versus what we have been doing previously, which is some of the ideas being tossed around in our community. channel about sharing certain channels publicly and allowing people to lurk.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Yes, allowing people to lurk, sign up, integrating the actual comments of our episodes into that directly, the discussion. So yeah, there's a lot of opportunities for nerdery and tomfoolery that previously were kind of just, they were non-starters because you were just deepening a relationship with an entity that you really couldn't go deeper in any sort of communal way. It was like,
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
What are those barnacles on top of the whale? We like just a little bit bigger barnacle, you know, living off this whale.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, we're not their customer either. We're not who they're optimizing for. No. And I don't think that, and so I suppose now that this thought has come into my mind in this moment, the only hesitation or reservation I have is the uncertainty of their future, which is not to say that I think their future is uncertain. Whereas Slack, maybe it's the same.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I mean, geez, products die every day and they get deprecated. So yeah, exactly. Who knows? Even though they've got maybe more deeper pockets or... Way deeper. Yeah, whatever. I think my only concern with Zulip is that reservation of how will they persevere?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
I know the team is capable of doing it. Sure, but even if they don't, then it's an open source project that we self-host, and maybe we just don't go deeper than that. We just continue to use it as is. I mean, as is. It's got completely serviceable community chat. Completely serviceable without any changes. Yeah, great point. Obviously, improvements always welcome.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
Reverse rug pull, so cool? (Friends)
Well, I guess my reservation came from the fact that while I know it's open source, I'm used to things like we're using in Slack not being open source. And so my brain hasn't said, okay, this is open source. So that reservation can be degraded down to 50% versus 100% reservation. Because that's super cool. I don't know if you listened to the show yet, but I monologued a little bit.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I'm never like, you don't measure up, you're out of here for any reason, even if the person is owed that response. I would always be kind in my delivery of any negative news whatsoever. And I just do not, desperately do not like to burn any bridge. I like to leave opportunities open, leave doors open. Now, if there's scenarios where there clearly need to be
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I will close the door and lock it, but I won't burn the door down, you know, or the bridge down to keep using the bridge metaphor. I would just be like, you know, this bridge shall not be crossed ever again, but I won't burn it down, you know? And that's just how I operate in life, really. I don't like to burn bridges.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
What's up, friends? I'm here with Dave Rosenthal, CTO of Sentry.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I think you hit the nail on the head with the word facet there. I think that's what it is, is like perspectives and facets within an ecosystem. It doesn't have to be, oh, what is the latest feature that's being scrutinized, which there's, you know, some in the Go world. What's the latest feature? What's the latest release? How does that work?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I think it's more about the culture of being a developer that I think shows are more interesting around. It's like, I know that you're steeped in this cloud native go world where that is very much the way things are. However, you know, I also want to know why you think the way you think or how you react to a certain piece of news that affects every developer to some degree, shape or form.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
So Dave, when I look at Sentry, I see you driving towards full application health, error monitoring where things began, session replay, being able to replay a view of the interface a user had going on when they experienced an issue with full tracing, full data, the advancements you're making with tracing and profiling, cron monitoring, code coverage, user feedback. and just tons of integrations.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I will say, however, I am totally unschooled on founder mode. I have purposely not. I've heard of it. I know it's out there. I can assume what it means, but I have not read the essay. I have not even read Brian Cantrell's response to it and other people kind of like jumping on the bandwagon of it and how great it is. I've only been on the peripheral to know it exists.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I do not know the details of the essay, and I have not begun to listen to this episode either to hear y'all's perspective. So just put my card out there. I am non-steeped in founder mode.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Steep me if you have to.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Close some loop if you don't mind.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Give me a glimpse into the inevitable future. What are you driving towards?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
You think founder mode, if you're not in that founder position, you get positioned as a cog. Is that right?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Mm-hmm. Gotcha. I did some Googling while you were talking there, just briefly. I wrote one thing into, I actually kind of enjoyed this about Google now where you can just sort of treat like a prompt. And so I just said, summarize founder mode. So rather than going to chat GPT or some paid product, I'm just like, okay, let me just throw this into Google. And it's for the most part on, on par.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
They summarized it by saying that founder mode is a way of running a company that involves direct involvement and oversight or, quote, micromanagement. And it says great founders have hired executives and it's not worked. This is summarized from Sam's newsletter on Substack, this part of it at least. is in summary that great founders have hired great executives and it's not worked.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Instead, the thing that works is in quotes founder mode, which is direct involvement and oversight of what would typically be called micromanagement. And then the lens for this mode is towards startups and scale-ups.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
So likely the founders should be directly involved in raising new funds or directing the product or micromanaging to some degree this user experience or this developer experience, which has become all the rage the last several years. It's like, we are DX-focused.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
We're developer experience-focused and not our friends over at getdx.com-focused, a different kind of developer experience, but cut from similar cloth. What's up, friends? I'm here in the breaks with Kyle Carberry, co-founder and CTO over at Coder.com. Coder is an open source cloud development environment, a CDE. You can host this in your cloud or on premise. So, Kyle, walk me through the process.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
A CDE lets developers put their development environment in the cloud. Walk me through the process. They get an invite from their platform team to join their Coder instance. They got to sign in, set up their keys, set up their code editor.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Very cool. Thank you, Kyle. Well, friends, it might be time to consider a cloud development environment, a CDE. And open source is awesome. And Coder is fully open source. You can go to Coder.com right now, install Coder open source, start a premium trial, or get a demo. For me, my first step, I installed it on my Proxmox box and played with it. It was so cool. I loved it. Again, Coder.com.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
That's C-O-D-E-R.com. A while back I wrote this because I felt this, it wasn't called Founder Mode at that time, but what I was experiencing and why I wrote this was a result of Founder Mode now that I have retrospect and that's why I pulled this up. So a while back on my blog, which I do not write too often, I'll link it up in our show notes, is I wrote a post called I'm a Cog.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And this is in light of reading Linchpin from Seth Godin. And then in light of being pressured into this founder mode world where I've got skills, abilities, growth opportunities, but the organization was very hearing this and hearing you, it was founder mode. And we were a startup. We were a scale up. And so it makes sense why this pressure was there.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And so I wrote, and I'll share more if you'd like, but I'll just share what I think is probably the essence of how I felt at the time.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
about being a cog it was acceptance as i'll say this is this quote i'm a very sharp highly specific purposefully purposeful cog as part of a much bigger much more grand machine i play a very specific part highly needed part so that others can do the same i serve the unit the team and its mission not myself I also have a military background.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
So I came from... That sounds like a military person speaking. Yeah, I have this military background too. So it was always team. It was never I, it was always we. And so after reading Seth Godin's Linchpin, which I think is not really founder mode, but it's founder mode-esque. It tells you to be a linchpin. Don't go into an organization...
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
and just be a cog, be somebody who is a change maker, somebody who could be leaned upon. A linchpin in the true terminology is back in the day, you know, back in Hugh Glass's day, the wagon wheel had to be held on to the wagon via this thing called a what? A linchpin. That linchpin was not there. They still use them on trailers and all kinds of things. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
The wheel was no longer on the thing that made the wheel purposeful anymore. And so to summarize how I felt here, I really felt like I was fine with being a cog. I was, I was cool with that. That doesn't mean I want to be truly crap or be sure, you know, not treated well. It was that I was okay with being not a linchpin.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I said later, I said, I'm starting to wonder if the concept shared in Seth's book, linchpin was a bit arrogant or self-centered. Aren't we all indispensable? Aren't we all replaceable? Like, and so to like, To strive for being a linchpin was almost like striving for perfection. Perfection is just seemingly unattainable and almost the enemy of profits and the enemy of done.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
We've heard that several times. It's like, you know what? I'm cool with being a cog. I'll just recognize my purposefulness in being a cog and what role I play so that others on my team can do the same.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
How many times have I been laid off? Almost maybe once, I think maybe. I haven't ever really been fired. To answer that question, I would not be happy about being let go, for sure. Let go, laid off, I don't care how you term it. It's never a positive thing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
But if my experience there was positive, if the founder or founders treated me with respect and I was removed from my position in a way I think was kind, And my team still had care for me. Like when I left pure charity, the thing I did prior to in, you know, Jared was like, dude, we should, you should do this full time. And in 2015, I finally listened to Jared and my wife and I left pure charity.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And I wrote this post when I was at pure charity. And so the founder was applied to me there. That was later on penned by Paul Graham. I think that if, if I'm treated well and I'm removed from a position in order for it to move along, um, I think I'd be okay with that. I would not be happy about being let go.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
But if I was treated with respect and let go properly, but I think if I was let go improperly or not treated with respect or kindness on the way out by my team or the founders, then yeah, I'd have a personal problem with that and not be okay with it. But I mean, like... If the mission continues, having been an entrepreneur and a runner or a leader, I've had to share some bad news.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
As you know, Johnny, we shared that early on. And so I think that I have both sides of those coins in my brain when I share my sentiment back to you to respond to that question. So I think, no, I would not be okay with it. But if it was done well and with respect and kindness, then I would be okay with it. And I would find a way to move on to the next thing.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Certainly disappointed, like, man, I really want to be on that train. I was working hard to be on that train. I was purposely purposeful as a cog, as I've written here. I was on my own personal mission. I'm serving the team, not myself.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And so that's my DNA as Adam, when I apply myself in any organization, whether I run it or not, whether it's a volunteer group at church or my business, you know, I apply myself similarly. So I think, yeah, disappointment, not resentment.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Okay. Let's see you get there. Let's see you get there tomorrow. Yeah. Perfectly. How will systems be different? How will teams be different as a result?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Yeah, a much bigger mission than you can have an office. an impact on as a, as a cashier. I mean, I guess you can actually do a lot as a cashier too. Sure.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Okay. Ego is the enemy.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
No, I can understand what he's saying. I think. Oh, sorry. I can't respond to my bad. You can, but let Johnny respond. Sorry, Johnny. Go ahead.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I really feel like I should just read this whole blog post to you guys. Nah, don't do that. Like everything Johnny just said, there's like echoes of what I wrote down here. I'll read two lines for you. Okay. I say this, I'm going to read this to you, Jared, appreciating what I think is your, you're not desiring to be perfect, but you're striving to be an indispensable member of the team.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
If not, you know, owner of the organization kind of thing. Yeah. So this is what I wrote. To think that you can truly be indispensable is a farce. It's not possible. It's a trap of the prideful.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I say that though, while appreciating, while appreciating the work that goes into strive for being indispensable. Not literally to be indispensable, but to strive to be indispensable-like. That's a great trait, too.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I love it. Okay, so they mean it when they say code breaks. Fix it faster with Sentry. More than 100,000 growing teams use Sentry to find problems fast, and you can too. Learn more at Sentry.io. That's S-E-N-T-R-Y.io. And use our code CHANGELOG. Get $100 off the team plan. That's almost four months free for you to try out Sentry. Once again, Sentry.io.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Can I speak for you for a second, Jared? For me? Yeah. Am I not doing a good job? No, I think you are. I want to layer it on, I guess, one more layer for you. Having worked with Jared for many, many years, Jared is not the kind of person that requires praise to show up and be effective.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And to be on mission, to be driven, none of his, to my knowledge, my experience with working with him for many years, he doesn't require praise to have his ambition. And I think Jared has a high standard set by himself. And it doesn't matter if you agree with the standard or not, he's going to strive for it.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And he doesn't need you to recognize he's striving for it or reaching it to continue to show up and be effective. Gotta do a good job, Jared.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
You know, I think that people should do that more frequently, too. Like if they know they especially the person kept thriving in the community like you have.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
circle back and be like hey you know i don't know how this all panned out for you i can kind of see what you've done since then but by the way when you left it really hurt the organization it was a mistake right i almost feel like that could be like a good just a good feeling to give people you know something to say to people I don't know. It's certainly a good reconnection moment, too.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Or they need to hang their hat on somebody, a patsy. Something went wrong. Come back here and run this thing so we can fire you nine months later.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
What's up, friends? I'm here with a new friend of ours over at Assembly AI, founder and CEO Dylan Fox. Dylan, tell me about Universal One. This is the newest, most powerful speech AI model to date. You released this recently. Tell me more.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Very cool. So Dylan, one thing I love is this playground you have. You can go there, assemblyai.com slash playground, and you can just play around with all the things that is assembly. Is this the recommended path? Is this the try? before you buy experience, what can people do?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Okay. Constantly updated speech AI models at your fingertips. Well, at your API fingertips, that is. A good next step is to go to their playground. You can test out their models for free right there in the browser. Or you can get started with a $50 credit at assemblyai.com slash practical AI. Again, that's assemblyai.com slash practical AI.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And I'm also here with Dennis Pilarinos, founder and CEO of Unblocked. Check them out at getunblocked.com. Unblocked helps developers to find the answers they need to get their jobs done. So Dennis, you know we speak to developers. Who is Unblocked best for? Who needs to use it?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Have you seen the movie Revenant?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
The next step to get unblocked for you and your team is to go to getunblocked.com. Yourself, your team can now find the answer they need to get their jobs done and not have to bother anyone else on the team, take a meeting or waste any time whatsoever. Again, getunblocked.com. That's G-E-T-U-N-B-L-O-C-K-E-D.com. And get unblocked.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Yeah. Leonardo DiCaprio, his character, I believe his name was Howard Glass. But this guy is like famous in the, I don't know, the era before there was electricity, basically. I don't know. There may have been electricity, but it was like. The days of yore. Yeah.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Back in the day when you used to have to fill the weapon or the gun with the powder and the gunpowder and all that to fire it, you know, that kind of day. And I won't tell you because it's worth checking out, but it would make you fear bears even more.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
We're holding out for the right one.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Apparently no one's out looking for jobs. I saw this video. I think it was on YouTube of that kind of thing. And it was one of those things where the person plays both roles. They're like the recruiter and then they're like the person. And it was like a company. It was like an HR person at a company was one role.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And the other person was somebody who would go out and find the talent, like a talent scout. Yeah. And they would say, probably kind of like nodding to what you're saying here, Johnny, is they would go out and find people, and they would say, those are all great candidates and all, but we're holding out for that one, that one. Now, those are 10 great candidates. Keep them on ice for us.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Keep them on ice. Keep them interested. Let them know we're interested. All right. I need you to go out and find me five more that are better than those folks there. But keep those 10 on ice. And then they come back with the five more like – You know what? Those are good too. But I really feel like there's a winner out there. Keep all 15 on ice. Let them all know we're still interested.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And that might even play into the whole multiple interviews, these song and dances that people, you know. And here you are on the other side in between siphoning through savings or ranking up credit card debt or whatever it might be to make ends meet and somebody's playing you. Not cool. No. Not cool at all. Not cool at all.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Fine. I want to be a cog then. Okay. I'm fine with being a cog. Sorry. I don't have any positions for cogs. I interrupted real quick. I wanted to throw that joke out there. Go ahead. We have nine cogs available, but they're all, I can't find any good cogs.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
See, let people go with respect, hire with respect, show up as an employee with respect, right? Some care in the process. Not everybody's going to do that, though. They're not. Fake jobs, man.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
That's true. Hugh Glass. To close a loop. Hugh Glass. H-U-G-H Glass. A very famous person. It's like Paul Bunyan. A tall tale. He had conquered such massive encumberments, I would say, in life. Bears. He recovered from this. I guess I'm going to kill that one plot for you.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Yes, exactly. What would make it go away? It can't exist anymore because the relationship doesn't exist. And so the .io, I mean, I get how it's applied, but what makes it go away? That they can repurpose it?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Obviously. But like he survived circumstances no one should survive and has been through things that not many people have been through. And so his tale is bigger than him. And so that's why Hugh Glass is a well-known name if you pay attention to those kind of stories.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Well, I think it's out there. I'm just like, I'm just joining the club. You're just naming them now. Just throwing some stuff in the bucket with you. .co.uk.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I couldn't help but look up nomo.io. Because I was thinking if that's available. That's a pretty good joke, isn't it? It'd be kind of cool to use that as a drum to beat on to petition to not let I.O. go no more.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Yes. I mean, an LLM could never be that witty and fun. You know? Maybe. Eventually. Maybe.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
We got to have you on more. I miss you, Johnny. I can't wait to see you again in person, man. It's been too long. We need to make it happen. We need to make it happen.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
While we're at it, let's give away 20% off. If you're thinking about going to All Things Open, you can go to the registration site and use the code MediaChangeLog20. And then we have some free passes, Jared. Yep. Are they gone? Have we given them away yet? I think we have a few left. Okay.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
You've got to join Zulup, which is our new place.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Let's get rid of them. We need hugs, high fives, and handshakes, and we can't do that unless you acquire the free pass and come to the conference.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
There you go. That's the two requirements is you got to acquire the free pass or pay your own way if you're that kind of person, except a 20% off, and then show up. That's right. And we're booth 66, y'all. Oh, it's official. 66 is our booth. Nobody knows what 66 is. All right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Nope, don't get it. Oh, man, we need to work on your dad joke abilities. School me. Give me a quick schooling. I want to know what you're laughing about.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Oh. Just for you, Johnny. Not everybody listening. Is that to all of our listeners as well? This is just to Johnny. Just to Johnny. As in I'm sorry. As in I'm sorry and welcome back officially. Six, seven years later. As in I'm sorry from a decade ago.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Absolutely, absolutely. Audience, if you're feeling the same way Johnny's feeling, you know what to do. Media, change log 20, get 20% off, or come into Zulip and get a free pass from Jared. While supplies last. While supplies last. Very limited supply. We love all things open. Todd and team run an amazing conference. It's worth going to. And yeah, all that good stuff. All right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
That's all for today. Bye, friends. Bye, friends.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Okay, gotcha. Gotcha. You want to connect these dots for you, Adam? Hugh Glass. Hugh Glass. I've been schooled. Thank you. I'm there now and I've tracked with you and I'm laughing with you now. I actually met somebody yesterday or the day before who was quite witty and he would joke a lot, right? Sarcastically.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And I'm cool with that, except for when you're laughing and I'm not because your joke is funny. But it's only funny to you because it's so insider baseball. It's only insider to you. Right. And I had to explain, I'm like, I want to laugh with you and I can't because the joke is only for you. Right. And so you make me feel foolish and I want to laugh with you. So just give me a little bit more.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I don't mind the sarcasm. I don't mind the witty jokes and stuff like that, but just bring me inside a little bit.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
And I do. And I do. But like, it was so, the person had done it so much. I was like, yeah. I can only laugh a few times like that until I'm like, I'm not giving you one. Yeah. I'll give you a couple. And after like three or four, I'm like, explain that one to me. Cause I want to laugh with you. And I feel like a fool. Cause I, it sounds funny. Give it, give it to me.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
So anyways, it's been a minute, Johnny, like way too many minutes. You're like one of my favorite people in the entire world. Every time I see you in person, I want to give you the biggest hug ever. You're such a cool dude. You're such an inspiration, really, too. And I think the joy you have for all you do is infectious. That's my favorite thing about you. Always the big smile.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
Always welcoming to people. Always kind. And I think those are some traits we admire to have in life.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I don't have my journal near me, but I do journal. And I just journal to the day, that kind of thing. And the paraphrase of what I journal was, it could always be worse. It doesn't mean you should always be like, oh, man, I can't be sad about my circumstances. It's more like, you know what? It really could be worse. I mean, because my family has been through some things. We've had loss.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
We've had just various things throughout our years. And it really could always be worse. So find the joy, the glass half full versus half empty in life. And so I don't know that that's specific for you, but you just said so. But my demeanor for you has always been, or my assumption of your demeanor has always been, man, you're just so joyful to be around.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
You're always happy, always smiling, always bringing something fun, never a downer, never a complainer, you know, in any way, shape or form. So I've always appreciated that about you.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I remember vividly because it felt like firing, and I'm not a firing kind of person. I don't like to deliver bad news to anybody, but I'm also naturally comfortable in confrontation. Not fist fight confrontation, but more like if I've got to deliver bad news, I think you could probably tell me right here now on the podcast, Johnny, if I was gracious about it. I feel like I was. Yeah, you were.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
But I really tried to be kind-hearted in delivering not always positive news. And I really can't remember what it was. I think we were early on even, I would say potentially even green. We hadn't had the network yet. Jared and I had only done this single podcast. It was our first non-Changelog show. Right.
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
I would say our invitation to go was Brian Kettleson and then Eric. And so I feel like we were in some ways like being shepherded into the go world by them, you know?
The Changelog: Software Development, Open Source
The indispensable cog (Friends)
sort of you know take on things right that that i have no control over right so i kind of have to be like you know what next time and it happened right so the universe works right the universe works in interesting ways it does i'm also you know and jared i think you're this is why we make great partners is that we're i'll say we because this is how i am and i'm assuming this is how you are because i don't see you acting this way i do not like to burn bridges with anybody