Jack Sanders

No, because like you look at Tom Barringer and you see, you see the kind of guy who would be like, you know, maybe I'm going to leave my wife. Costner never would do that. Costner is this angelic kind of like, I'm entirely dedicated to Amy Madigan or Patricia Clarkson or whoever he's with in the movie. Tom Barringer is kind of like, whoa, is that guy still at the bar? Okay. You going home?

Yeah, yeah.

And then I think maybe like I think he's, like, stuck in between, right? Because he's, like, got movie star charisma, but he's got kind of a character actor's look. So he can't really be Richard Gere, for instance, right? Right. He's probably closer to, like, Sam Shepard.

Yeah, but Don Johnson's a movie star. Like, his face is, like, his demeanor is, like, really, like, movie star.

I'm asking you. Yeah.

don't you think yeah but he's extraordinary in platoon he's extraordinary he's great and by the way charlie sheen's really good and so is the foe it's really cool that ridley scott got to like watch an earlier version of platoon because he was thinking about captain berenger he had been inspired by the big chill because he liked like his tough guy look in that movie right but saw him in in platoon and was like holy shit i better jump on this while i can

But that is a good point, is that I probably, in our head, we're like, well, Barringer, why didn't you just make a Taylor Sheridan show? But there weren't Taylor Sheridan shows, you know? Right. Barringer would be basically going up against the same 10 stars for these movies, but he would not want to go down and play Sam alone.

Like, you know, he's not going to go back down to television once you're in the movies back then. What was the one he made? Was it The Substitute? Yeah. He's making, like, B-movies by the 90s.

Well, I liked Sniper a lot.

Because if you put someone prettier, if you put gear in this role, if you put gear into someone to watch a movie... It's not a realistic... Well, you're just like... Yeah. These women should be throwing themselves at this guy.

barringer it's like this guy hit the lottery he has the best wife in queens yeah but he somehow has like drawn the eye of mimi rogers's character who's in this vulnerable state because joey fucking lanza's running after right uh sorry lorraine brocco first movie um she's phenomenal and then scott said this was the hardest part to cast that we have a couple casting what ifs with that too um

She gets a little, they were going to find it in this.

Yeah. But it's a great debut. It's a great rookie season for her.

Well, because, like, throughout the film, you're just kind of like, Ellie has such a great charm and energy, and she's, like, wearing a hooded sweatshirt with a sweater over it. Yeah. Coming in with brown grocery bags and stuff and kind of pinching his butt and making everything, like, kind of work. And I think it would be very easy for that to be like, oh, man, drop the wife. Let's go.

More there from Mimi Rogers' career?

Oh, yeah. I forgot about that.

I don't know. I mean, she, she works a lot. I think that she obviously has a lot of other interests outside of just acting and just doing the movie star thing. Maybe she's more private after the Tom Cruise thing.

Became a little bit more, more walled off. That would be my guess. She had a cool movie. I can't remember the last time I saw it. The Rapture. I was going to say The Rapture. Michael Tolkien, right? That movie was awesome.

But kind of... Yeah, I feel like she's she's had like a very decent career, but definitely could have been like like she could have been Susan Sarandon in Boulder or something like that. Like there were definitely roles out there that she could have been in Thelma Louise, maybe.

It's like cocktail, but it's for masseuses.

Yeah. Well, for Craig, it are has-beens. For us, they were the big, beautiful faces on screen.

Yeah, she's great. She has to be, like you said, she has to be the princess that needs saving. Like, who's this person now?

Jessica Chastain.

And then when she's effectively vulnerable. Because you can see why she would want... the sort of protection and the masculinity of the Keegan character in her life.

Because like for one thing, she's got this like nebbish boyfriend, but for the other, like she's finally been like shown the outside world, like outside of her penthouse, outside of like the limo that can attack her, that can get to her. So like she does a really good job grounding it.

The opening reminds me a lot. It's like the New York version of the Lethal Weapon opening.

Just like Night City.

And then they say versions of the title of the movie multiple times.

Thank you for watching over me.

It's really hard to lose money on $12.3 million.

They're going to put up the image where it's like, come in Monday and it's just going to be Berenger. And people are going to be like, seriously, what the fucking movie is this? These fucking guys. I can't even reverse Google image search this.

That's my burner. My army of guys.

Raj.

Pauline Kael said, Ridley Scott put so much morbid, finicky care into this silly little story that he's worried the fun out of it.

Isn't he doing like Fields of Gold in the 90s?

Police guy. Police are good. Yeah. I love the police. I bet you do. You've mentioned that before, and it also seems like you're kind of banned. Not in a pejorative way. Love them.

Because it's just so impressive that they're making all that music together.

Tom Thibodeau is like, I'll try it.

Nice.

Literally, what did he say when you said that? He was just... Because I'm sure these guys... He gets a lot of stuff.

But for the most part, fun hangs. Did you notice, though, that it starts in the afternoon and that it's, like, 2 in the morning and they're still at the house?

Decent storytelling, though, too. Like, it's like, this guy's getting promoted. That's the most important thing. And, like, he's got, like, this... All his friends are over, but the cake is for his promotion to getting into this new district and precinct in Manhattan. Right. And it's like, yeah, because it's really hard to get up the ladder in this thing.

But also levels of them.

The tie also really brings his outfit together. She's right. It's great. The paisley tie is whatever, but he puts on this new tie, and I'm like, look at this guy.

There's paparazzi. For some reason, I think because we just watched it in Boston, I was thinking of heat when the tie thing is happening because it's like when Jeremy Piven's like, my daughter gave me the right. He's like, I don't give a shit.

What does the old one say?

Yeah. And it's just another example of him being like kind of overwhelmed by architecture first in Claire's apartment. But he walks into the Guggenheim and he's just like, it's also awesome chase location because of the spiral hallway. Right. In the Guggenheim. So when he goes after Venza.

Oh, yeah. I love her.

So they go to, like, Bemelman's or someplace? Like, they go to a nice bar?

The way that they kind of do it, it isn't that they're connecting on like a personality experiential soul level. It's more just like, we're two people who are currently trying to escape our immediate circumstances. And it's very present tense. Like it's not going to work. You're not going to move in with me. We're not going to Europe together, but like right now, right here, it works.

And so when you think about it like that, it's kind of nice that they're not telling each other their life stories. Would you have had her smoke or not smoke? I could see her doing a Virginia Slim or something elegant.

I have some cigarette awards coming up.

I think that there would have been a cigarette out of just pure tension. Just like, oh, I stopped smoking. Maybe in the...

Maybe she's like Larry Bird. She can put a case away for a game.

I think that there's definitely... There's a way to have shown, like, the way Mike has sex with both of these different women as, like, illustrated of, like, his sort of choice he has to make.

It's a little bit chased the way it happens. It's, like, almost close to Top Gun Maverick laughing, you know? Right. But I think Mallory probably would have turned the temperature up a little bit.

I think there's got to be a big ensemble that you're excited about seeing.

Well, I feel like it's, uh, we've got like 40 some minutes and you're just haven't said Joey Lanza yet. He's coming up. Okay.

I have Venza. Joey Venza. I don't know why I wrote down Lanza. Joey Venza with Keegan's family at the end is pretty amazing. It's ridiculous, but it's just an incredible scene in the diagram. Ridiculously compelling. Yeah. And I also have the Studio 54 style club, which they shot in the Queen Mary at the beginning.

Random guys. I think someone to watch over me has a bunch of really random choices by random actors.

But my number one is... I think it's when Ellie finds out about Claire, honestly.

It is also like a perfect music to be listening to in 1987.

I have a bunch of small stuff too. I really just for the top note is people reacting to adultery in an adult way. So like, you know, it's a little bit dated. Personal experience here? No, but just like, I think that

Where you're like, why are you bringing this energy to this scene, my man? Right. It's like, doesn't matter. You're dead anyway.

the crisis and like lorraine brocco is not just like you're out yeah you know it's not like our marriage is over she's kind of like working with it and working through it i kind of liked it like just watching them you know have like an adult reaction to it now it would be like here's my essay for the la times about when my husband cheated on me and his name was mike

Here's when I entered a polycule. I really like the kid, Tommy. Tommy was an excellent little kid. Yeah.

And he was a perfect 1987 kid with a little cyclist hat. And it's just like, lay back, Mac. I got my skateboard. It's like Bart Simpson.

And number one, this is an age of the worst that's actually age of the best. And it's one of the little details of this movie that makes it worth completely rewatching. One of the other cops is this guy named Kuntz.

And when Keegan finds out that his family has been taken hostage by Venza, it's revealed that Kuntz just has a little stud earring. Yeah. And I really, really thought for a second about coming in today with a study. Just sneaking it in. But just like, I feel like I should just start like, yeah, check it out. I'm not having a midlife crisis at all.

I love that. I think a lot of faces. So someone to watch over me has... you'll see, like, oh, there's Jerry Orbach. There's Mark Moses. Like, a lot of guys that are just kind of floating around in there. And I gotta say, for us, I think flawed rewatchables... Do you demand a little bit of sexual intercourse? Like, I think it helps to have like a little bit of sex, a little bit of violence.

uh i think it went away like in the in the 80s like i think this is the last gasp this was the last old lady i don't remember anyone ever referring to even even my mother as how's your old lady doing it's offensive it's the rare thing that's offensive to all parties it's offensive to the person you're saying it to it's offensive to the lady everyone loses uh

For the perp ID? For any cop scene?

What do you got? I know you picked up on this.

No, it's Scotty Berenger's bachelor friend who he moves in with. His apartment. He's got the bunk beds.

Check out the bathroom. Real nice. Yes. But that went to the end. He's just like, we're going to have to figure out the bedroom because... What does he say? Like, Renee is a moaner?

That guy had a heat check for like two minutes.

I love this shot of Barringer on the New York 80s subway, standing up.

I'd go Roberta.

It's Upper East Side is supposed to be? Supposed to be. Okay. I mean, I guess then Guggenheim gets best real estate, right?

I love the nightclub, which is shot in the Queen Mary, but it's supposed to be a New York nightclub.

Yeah, let's go. Venza kind of goes zero to 60 there on him. Is it Benza or Venza? Venza. Joey Venza.

I know. But just even like the hint of it or like the neurosis around it, I think it really helps.

Well, Venza doesn't seem to think that he, he's got a real like invincibility armor to him where he's just like, nobody is going to ever catch me for cold blooded first degree murder in a public place and also intimidating witnesses and taking cops, families, hostages.

Yeah. This goes to Joey Venza smoking while holding a .357 Magnum to a child's head. And then angrily throwing the cigarette.

Andreas Katsoulis.

Just actually think for a second.

how many hands it takes to uh take out a cigarette from a pack and light it but also restrain a child and hold a gun to his head so how many hands like we're gonna i mean like it's just amazing he probably asked the kid to hold the gun on himself and then we have the ed falco and coppa in a word for the character that got three times hotter by smoking yeah i thought of you yeah when she when he takes this kind of dangling from the side

I had the Vincent Chase award for are we sure this character is actually good at this job for the New York Police Department. It's just like, we know who killed Wynne Hawkins. We know exactly what he looks like and what he's doing. But we just kind of got to let him kind of work it out.

But isn't that a crime in and of itself? If Claire's like, Joey Venza just beat the shit out of me in a bathroom, wouldn't that also be something?

You did like that. Like what do you have? Like the entire world bugged. Like how are you doing this? What's his strategy? So he's going to have Claire come kill Claire and then he's going to walk out. I don't know. I really don't know.

It's one way to get out of an affair. There's Chekhov's gun from earlier in the movie where they're like, where's the gun? And he's like, oh, it's in the closet.

I will say it's... I had it in maybe What's Aged the Worst, but we just did have a decade where, like, the bad guys in movies were psychos. And now we try to ascribe all this, like, meaning and, like, motivation to, like, why bad guys in shows and movies do things. Like, why is he doing this? Back then, it was just, like, the guys in Commando were just psychos.

Yeah.

It's more like 19th century English people did that, but I don't know why.

But he's really trying to act. Incredible workplace changes over the decades. This captain is like, so tell me a little bit about this relationship you got going.

I just had to focus on the sound effect. I don't know why Ridley Scott can't just go in and fix that as a digital copy.

He also always seems to have a tux.

Yeah.

I think Vens is the best thing that ever happened to Mike and Ellie. I think that his entrance into Claire's life while dangerous and costing Wynn Hawkins his life It just starts this snowball going downhill where Mike and Ellie, they were probably head towards a life of recrimination, financial stress, all this stuff, struggling to make ends meet.

This is the thing is that I feel like you and I are Wilbon and Kornheiser here where I'm like, that's your girl, Mimi Rogers. But I'm like mesmerized by Lorraine Bracco in this.

Then this crazy tuxedo killer comes into the world and it shows them what's important and it probably reinvigorates their sex life.

You're getting so excited to diagram the different places we could have humping in this movie.

This is eight sex scenes they could have had. There is also the like he could have brought home like an expensive dress and dressed Ellie like Claire. Yeah. Oh. Oh, yeah.

I'm sure that Sharon Stone probably got the right end of that deal.

That's the thing about me.

I would just throw... I was trying to figure out whether Sarandon would have worked for Claire. I was just thinking about that.

Susan Sarandon for Claire. Yeah. I don't think she would work as Ellie. I think you need somebody more Queens-y than... Is Geena Davis too young?

Well, I mean, okay.

Orbach. I think Orbach.

Because like you said, he's like really trying to go for it in that scene where he's just like, Mike, what is this?

Yeah, you can.

It's great when she shows up again and he's just like, oh, Jesus Christ.

Well, you've already got Craig Googling full body masseuse. Yeah.

Could Caruso have been Scotty? Could Caruso have been Mike? A little early, right? But definitely, like, in the vein of the stuff that he's good at. He kills Venza at the end.

90?

Well, this is 87. Like, it's Platoon. He gets recognized in Platoon, like, this 12-month period.

Well, I mean, like, a lot of Goodfellas takes place in Queens, right? Do people think of Goodfellas as a Queens movie?

It's Jesus.

Isn't this why we love this like 85 to 95, 97 run where you get all these like erotic thrillers and indie movies, like where it's body double body heat, sea of love, big, easy fatal attractions, sexualized and videotape. all the way up through Eyes Wide Shut even, where you're like, this is just really interesting. There might be a genre movie happening around it.

I think you're right. Apex Mountain for the Guggenheim? What are the other candidates? Well, just like, I guess the Guggenheim museum just looks great. Existing would probably be bigger than being in. But in a movie, no, in a movie.

Oh, I just don't, I didn't remember that.

No, I think Talented Mr. Ripley is hot socially.

When he trips over Tommy's skateboard, he's like, Tommy! Skating!

Picking nits. What the fuck is Venza doing? Like what, what, what is the plan? Is he Kaiser? So say like, how has he just got, he runs rough shot up. First of all, what, what is Venza made his money doing? Is he the mob? Is he in the mafia?

Because the beginning of the movie, it's basically he is given probably dirty money to Wynn Hawkins to open this club or to do whatever he's doing. And now Wynn is buying him out. He's like, I don't want to be bought out. So he just kills Winn. But he murders a guy in cold blood, tries to intimidate a witness, gets caught at the Guggenheim doing it again. Yeah.

I don't understand what, and there's no district attorney in New York consulting on like any of this, like, well, this is what we got to do here.

And for what it's worth, as people have pointed out on the internet, actually like once a witness protection takes place over a couple more than a day or something, the FBI takes you to like a secure location. She would not be like, I'm at my apartment going out in New York city a lot. Oh, people on the internet pointed that out? Yeah.

That's a pretty good point. Yeah. She would be in a motel somewhere in Hackensack, New Jersey, waiting for trial.

So there's a cop movie happening around it. But what you're there for is this guy's midlife crisis and this crossroads that he comes to where he's like, God, this is like a complete fantasy land up here in Manhattan. But then I have like this decent life. And you're actually kind of like, you can see both sides of it.

I have to travel for work. It's like your girlfriend is under constant threat from the Joker.

Also, Mike would probably just stand outside the ladies' room. Do you know what I mean? It wouldn't be like, oh, cool.

It's the two of them. He murdered Wynne Hawkins. He's killed Wynne Hawkins. He will later almost kill a small child. He could have just stabbed Claire in the bathroom and left. He could have done the shot card.

I think I'm all good. You're good. Do you know what I mean? It's not even an untouchable. I don't need to see Ellie and Mike the next day. Is this a new part of the category? I don't need to see how Claire got here. There's no character in this where I'm like, other than Joey Venza, there's nobody else that I'm like, we need more of this. Can I make the prestige TV case?

But it would be like, that would be the kind of show that we would watch the first episode and be like, this fucking rules. And then it would be like episode six and Joey Venza would be like, you know, we're learning about square garden to do something like what the shit is going on.

Apple loves like rich people by the fifth episode.

There are not really that many erotic shows on TV.

no matter where you are in your life, you can kind of see like, I can see why this would be pretty seductive, but also you got your kid and your wife over here and you're doing good.

God damn, Andreas. I didn't know I was working with a two-armed man. I thought, much like Tobias Harris, you can't go left. Turns out you can kill in the name of probastic or contract law. You better stop intimidating witnesses or Sergeant Barnes is going to send you away a long fucking time, big boy.

It's all going down, yeah. Nobody's safe. Nobody's safe. It's a nobody's safe show. How about Andor? Are you going to check that out? You keep telling me to. Yeah, a novelistic approach to the Star Wars galaxy.

She's a porn actress. It's great.

Yeah, this is generational wealth that we're talking about, right? Yeah, what's going on here? Do you think that she's like a... Is she like one of the Gettys?

I feel like she had a bad relationship and Neal's the rebound, the safe kind of like he's... Maybe with some guy for five years but it somehow didn't work out. But I feel like she probably is supposed to be like a Mary Astor kind of like, you know... What does she do for a living do we think?

But it's just like, she doesn't, there's no feeling into it.

That's right. I forgot about that.

Did anyone check more boxes than Claire? I think she would just be difficult to approach. If you bump into her at the Oak Bar, the Oak Room.

Italian count next. Like there's, she's got to go for the stars next.

It would be great if she dated Wally Backman next.

Mike and Ellie break up. He's made destitute by the divorce. Has to pick up another job working security and dies of a heart attack at 45. Start smoking heavily.

I definitely would not want the bunk bed in Scotty's bachelor pad.

I would like the carousel should be called, you should probably go home now. Right.

In 1987.

What do you think about... I was going to say, I was trying to articulate the light. Is it good that Mike cops to the falling for Claire to Ellie? Like, could he have just played that, like, yeah, look, it's a couple more night shifts. Don't worry about it.

No, she doesn't. He, like, he's clearly, like, he wants to admit it.

Yeah, I think that the marriage was a good life lesson.

That's the ending? Well, this is the thing with... Someone to watch over me is a way better midlife crisis movie than it is a cop movie.

I think it's a push among the actors. It would be kind of crazy to give it to Bracco, so I'm going to go Ridley.

She was like a great poker player too. Is that what you do?

I mean, maybe she was fascinated by her taking down big pots.

Do you think you like it more now after Bill started crying, laughing, talking about all the places that they could have fucked?

Yeah. I was like, did I admit, like, is there really no nudity in this movie?

I guess it must be fall in New York. It's appropriate for the weather.

He was like, I wanted to show you some of my world. So we're going to sit next to Fireman and watch Gastineau.

Cause he has a mustache earlier. He should have, but this was 87. We're getting, we're getting towards the nineties. So I think guys were.

It would be funny if there was like a Tommy skateboarding sequence where he's like doing all these tricks and stuff. But Mike's just daydreaming about nailing. Tommy breaks an ankle.

So I love the way this movie opens the first few scenes outside of the nightclub part where you're getting to see Tom Berger's character, Mike Keegan. He's got this...

Duplex in Queens And he's making breakfast for his family And it's very homey But you can see him tripping over skateboards The kid is really fun But when he's like done with his napkin He just throws it into the kitchen Like everything about it is like Charming but like a little like Man we're really like living on top of each other We're cramped in here And then when he goes to Claire's apartment He gets lost in it It's so big that he can't find his way back There's so many doors Right

And Ridley Scott never like overdoes it. He does it by visually showing you what a completely different universe this guy is in. And that's where you get to the Ridley Scott part of this where it's like, this guy is so talented to be doing basically like a pulpy erotic thriller. Yeah. And he's able to elevate it, I think.

chris so the watch it's doing well huh and then you're like yeah it is doing well and you could just tell these people are doing 130 interviews in five days we've kind of now arrived back at that where it's like the you know the sinners cast and they're like do your favorite dogs reverse rank right five yeah there's more creativity while eating your favorite snack but you're answering for hayley steinfeld just like okay man like

Yeah, he obviously wanted to make something that paid tribute to 40s and 50s noir movies.

But also brings like his very modern, very commercial sensibility. A lot of people and I have talked about how, you know, you watch a Ridley Scott movie and if you close your eyes, sometimes you think it's a Tony Scott movie. I wonder whether or not, you know, we can have the like,

in the director what ifs casting what if stuff like we can talk about whether this would be a cooler tony scott movie that way more action we have three more action scenes um but really like is also really really good at uh like locations so like picking a place to set action that just feels like the apartment the guggenheim the nightclub like yeah he's just fantastic at like being

What happens at the pub? It is pretty crazy. He makes these two films that are essentially genre-defining for the decades to come for Blade Runner and Alien. And you would think that he would pretty much be in what we would consider almost like a Kubrick zone in terms of every four years, I'm going to make a mind-altering masterpiece. But he just really likes working.

And he really likes... He still does. It's a lot of Soderbergh-y, right? Knocking out two movies a year, practically.

So this is kind of like an interesting it's funny to see him come almost full circle now where he'll just make you know the house of Gucci or something like that because he's interested in this mystery in the heart of like the high fashion world. This is clearly just something that that piqued his interest and also like I think you said like he just wanted to shoot a nighttime New York movie.

I feel like he needed a couple more Westerns. He has a really great Westerns face, and I feel like he needed...

Yeah, something like he needed some kind of like, go play Wyatt Earp, man. Or, you know, and I think that he had... But could he have been in Touchables guy instead of Costner?

I figure about 30 grand, like having cash.

He bought them, Charlie.

I remember I like walked home from campus or actually one of our rich kids had a car as a freshman, which you weren't supposed to do. But rich kids always figure out a way to stay ahead. And I'll just never forget like because the funny thing was like Shaq got it of all the people Shaq understood what it was really about.

And Nolte was just shattered when fucking French Lick wanted all sorts of benefits. All right.

Probably. Terry Garr?

Yes.

Why don't you just go to the hospital?

Hmm.