Issa Rae

Yeah, there's a piece of you that you're giving so many of, I mean, so many of the women in my life know things that I just would never share with anyone that I've, As a closed off person, if I've opened up to you, that already means like you mean a lot to me and that I see a future with you. And automatically, if I deem you as a friend, then that's like for life.

Yeah, there's a piece of you that you're giving so many of, I mean, so many of the women in my life know things that I just would never share with anyone that I've, As a closed off person, if I've opened up to you, that already means like you mean a lot to me and that I see a future with you. And automatically, if I deem you as a friend, then that's like for life.

And so the idea that that gets cut off for any reason, and especially if I'm culpable or if I felt betrayed by you, that is devastating. And even in hearing this letter, this woman felt like she was even hesitant to become this person's friend to begin with. And then ultimately was just like, oh, okay, I see the value in my life.

And so the idea that that gets cut off for any reason, and especially if I'm culpable or if I felt betrayed by you, that is devastating. And even in hearing this letter, this woman felt like she was even hesitant to become this person's friend to begin with. And then ultimately was just like, oh, okay, I see the value in my life.

But there were tinges of selfishness there just even in terms of how she saw the friendship. But it still felt like She was, in any version of this, I don't know, I don't think that she was willing to be a full friend to this woman, is the way that I read it. And that's okay, but you just have to be honest about that. You can't have it both ways.

But there were tinges of selfishness there just even in terms of how she saw the friendship. But it still felt like She was, in any version of this, I don't know, I don't think that she was willing to be a full friend to this woman, is the way that I read it. And that's okay, but you just have to be honest about that. You can't have it both ways.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

Yeah, I think I don't disagree with that. But there is the, if you're always showing up, if you're always the one that's like checking in, if you're... Even if you're always the one providing the tickets, that's fine. Like, tickets to the games, I'm always the one with the tickets.

Yeah, I think I don't disagree with that. But there is the, if you're always showing up, if you're always the one that's like checking in, if you're... Even if you're always the one providing the tickets, that's fine. Like, tickets to the games, I'm always the one with the tickets.

If you find out your other friend has tickets and didn't invite you and you're not... Like, that's still... There's an imbalance. Like, I'm always thinking of you first because you're not thinking of me first. That's like... That's the unhealthy imbalance where it's just, okay, you're not going to show up for me in the same way that I show up for you.

If you find out your other friend has tickets and didn't invite you and you're not... Like, that's still... There's an imbalance. Like, I'm always thinking of you first because you're not thinking of me first. That's like... That's the unhealthy imbalance where it's just, okay, you're not going to show up for me in the same way that I show up for you.

I know your effort is. Yes. Even if it's just pizza. Like, girl, I know you like pizza and you invited me. This means a lot. And I will meet you where you're at because I know that this is your love language. But you can tell when someone's kind of checked out of any kind of effort or that you don't rank as high on their list of friends.

I know your effort is. Yes. Even if it's just pizza. Like, girl, I know you like pizza and you invited me. This means a lot. And I will meet you where you're at because I know that this is your love language. But you can tell when someone's kind of checked out of any kind of effort or that you don't rank as high on their list of friends.

So like, even if I'm not getting in your business.

So like, even if I'm not getting in your business.

So you actually brought up, like, this is the thing that I'm going through.

So you actually brought up, like, this is the thing that I'm going through.

Not that he... When you were going through it, right? Yes. And it was hard. Who did you talk to?

Not that he... When you were going through it, right? Yes. And it was hard. Who did you talk to?

Because we talk about everything. And there's... There's just... There are things that you don't know affect you until you talk about it. It could be nothing. It could be talking about a TV show episode that then leads to like, oh, this happened to me and this is how I was affected by it. And there's just... And nothing is off limits and that's the beauty of it is just...

Because we talk about everything. And there's... There's just... There are things that you don't know affect you until you talk about it. It could be nothing. It could be talking about a TV show episode that then leads to like, oh, this happened to me and this is how I was affected by it. And there's just... And nothing is off limits and that's the beauty of it is just...

You get to explore everything freely with no judgment. And that's also the devastation of, oh, I don't have this safe space anymore. You are the safe space. And I didn't even see that it was a malicious space. Which, you know, getting back to this letter, it's like this woman seemed like she was pouring her heart out to this woman. to Eva. And it was like hit or miss. I'm not even sure.

You get to explore everything freely with no judgment. And that's also the devastation of, oh, I don't have this safe space anymore. You are the safe space. And I didn't even see that it was a malicious space. Which, you know, getting back to this letter, it's like this woman seemed like she was pouring her heart out to this woman. to Eva. And it was like hit or miss. I'm not even sure.

I don't even know if I like you, girl. Oh, I guess I do like you, but it's too late. And so I think that that's, that's also a violation of just like, am I in your life or not? Do you like me or not? Are we, are we good or not? And now someone, something happened that's tragic. And I, I think

I don't even know if I like you, girl. Oh, I guess I do like you, but it's too late. And so I think that that's, that's also a violation of just like, am I in your life or not? Do you like me or not? Are we, are we good or not? And now someone, something happened that's tragic. And I, I think

You're one of the last people I heard from, so maybe I need to be real about what this friendship actually was.

You're one of the last people I heard from, so maybe I need to be real about what this friendship actually was.

I have to say that I'm also guilty, because part of this also triggered me in a way, because I am guilty of... Again, like you said, I am not a check-in-everyday type of person. I'm a very much... When I'm here, it's all about you, but I don't check in as often as I should with friends. And...

I have to say that I'm also guilty, because part of this also triggered me in a way, because I am guilty of... Again, like you said, I am not a check-in-everyday type of person. I'm a very much... When I'm here, it's all about you, but I don't check in as often as I should with friends. And...

I've been told that in the past and I've adjusted, but you just have to tell me, but it's not a natural instinct. And so with this, I understand like Eva being like, this is kind of a high maintenance friendship in a way where I can't, I'm not going to be the same type of giving friend that you are to me, but I will show up in the ways that I can. If you need me, I will always be there.

I've been told that in the past and I've adjusted, but you just have to tell me, but it's not a natural instinct. And so with this, I understand like Eva being like, this is kind of a high maintenance friendship in a way where I can't, I'm not going to be the same type of giving friend that you are to me, but I will show up in the ways that I can. If you need me, I will always be there.

And so that is... That would make me consider like, oh, am I a bad friend? Because I think about you, but I might not text you to be like, hey, I just want to make sure you're okay. But you should know that I would hope you would call me if you weren't okay and know that I would show up for you and be there for you. I'm not considerate.

And so that is... That would make me consider like, oh, am I a bad friend? Because I think about you, but I might not text you to be like, hey, I just want to make sure you're okay. But you should know that I would hope you would call me if you weren't okay and know that I would show up for you and be there for you. I'm not considerate.

I'm not a considerate friend in the way that I would like to be. That's a pronouncement there. It's true. It's like one of my biggest flaws because I'm just so work focused that I'm not like, I'll think about you, but not tell you that I'm thinking about you. Right. And that's fair.

I'm not a considerate friend in the way that I would like to be. That's a pronouncement there. It's true. It's like one of my biggest flaws because I'm just so work focused that I'm not like, I'll think about you, but not tell you that I'm thinking about you. Right. And that's fair.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Okay.

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

Can I ask you a question about the chair of angst? Yes. Did they ask you questions or was it more of like a venting space?

Can I ask you a question about the chair of angst? Yes. Did they ask you questions or was it more of like a venting space?

That's dope. But y'all had to make a whole construct with cigars and margaritas and whatnot.

That's dope. But y'all had to make a whole construct with cigars and margaritas and whatnot.

So a friend has never disappointed you?

So a friend has never disappointed you?

And have you had that happen to you with one of your friends where they've approached you and said, hey, you just show up in this way and I'm upset?

And have you had that happen to you with one of your friends where they've approached you and said, hey, you just show up in this way and I'm upset?

Have you ended a friendship?

Have you ended a friendship?

Oh, because you're a good friend. I keep hitting this, right? Because you're a good friend.

Oh, because you're a good friend. I keep hitting this, right? Because you're a good friend.

You seem like you're a good friend.

You seem like you're a good friend.

But I think you allow people to just be comfortable with you. And I think that that is essential in a friendship. And you may not challenge them in a way. But if a friendship isn't serving you, will you just... Ignore it and keep it going. I keep them around. You'll never be like, hey, I kind of don't like hanging around. You kind of get on my nerves.

But I think you allow people to just be comfortable with you. And I think that that is essential in a friendship. And you may not challenge them in a way. But if a friendship isn't serving you, will you just... Ignore it and keep it going. I keep them around. You'll never be like, hey, I kind of don't like hanging around. You kind of get on my nerves.

If it didn't matter.

If it didn't matter.

No, I'm just like, girl, you gave me a reason. Thank you. No, you are done. I had too many people I messed with. Because there's nothing worse than like, Like, having... Sometimes you just don't have time. And making a new friend who you're kind of not sure about. And then you have to, like, make plans together.

No, I'm just like, girl, you gave me a reason. Thank you. No, you are done. I had too many people I messed with. Because there's nothing worse than like, Like, having... Sometimes you just don't have time. And making a new friend who you're kind of not sure about. And then you have to, like, make plans together.

The slow ghost allows you to never speak to them again and never have to plan anything. And it's fine. Ouch. But even with your friends, I'm sorry. Your friends that you grew up with... Inevitably, you guys... Like, you grow up, you become who you're supposed to be, right?

The slow ghost allows you to never speak to them again and never have to plan anything. And it's fine. Ouch. But even with your friends, I'm sorry. Your friends that you grew up with... Inevitably, you guys... Like, you grow up, you become who you're supposed to be, right?

There are no friends that you've grown up with that you have where you're just like, I've outgrown them mentally or they, you know, don't necessarily, we don't vibe the same anymore. There's never been that. And that thought has never crossed your mind.

There are no friends that you've grown up with that you have where you're just like, I've outgrown them mentally or they, you know, don't necessarily, we don't vibe the same anymore. There's never been that. And that thought has never crossed your mind.

And they've never, since grammar school?

And they've never, since grammar school?

Okay, okay. But your friends that you hold now, your male friends, is that to say that you've never even fought?

Okay, okay. But your friends that you hold now, your male friends, is that to say that you've never even fought?

No, and that's not, like guys to me, y'all will be like, Like, y'all don't physically fight and be like, well, he the alpha, I'm the beta.

No, and that's not, like guys to me, y'all will be like, Like, y'all don't physically fight and be like, well, he the alpha, I'm the beta.

Let's go have a beer. Yeah. And no, if I physically fight one of my female friends, it's over.

Let's go have a beer. Yeah. And no, if I physically fight one of my female friends, it's over.

No, but in... But I get it.

No, but in... But I get it.

But the emotional fights allow you to get closer or... you know, decide this isn't the right relationship.

But the emotional fights allow you to get closer or... you know, decide this isn't the right relationship.

Something super dire.

Something super dire.

I haven't even gotten to that phase yet.

I haven't even gotten to that phase yet.

And do you know that it's so, oh, my, it feels so good after dinner.

And do you know that it's so, oh, my, it feels so good after dinner.

It's just like, there's no better feeling than like, I just got, ugh, I reconnected with my girl. She knows everything. I've been holding, I was saving this story for her because only she would understand it. Like, I can't tell, like, there's friendship. There's, even in my groups, there's my friends who, if I want to be mad at someone, and if I want to not know that I'm wrong, I go to her.

It's just like, there's no better feeling than like, I just got, ugh, I reconnected with my girl. She knows everything. I've been holding, I was saving this story for her because only she would understand it. Like, I can't tell, like, there's friendship. There's, even in my groups, there's my friends who, if I want to be mad at someone, and if I want to not know that I'm wrong, I go to her.

Because she's never going to tell me I'm wrong. It's always, yeah, girl, okay, who we... Right, who's next?

Because she's never going to tell me I'm wrong. It's always, yeah, girl, okay, who we... Right, who's next?

And then there's a friend that I go to where I'm just like, I need to know... The truth. Yes, I need to know the truth. I need to know that I'm not it and they're going to give it to me straight. And then there's just the loyal friend who's just like going to listen and I can grab. But everybody has a function in some way and they're just... It's just, it's cathartic. It's so, it's so beautiful.

And then there's a friend that I go to where I'm just like, I need to know... The truth. Yes, I need to know the truth. I need to know that I'm not it and they're going to give it to me straight. And then there's just the loyal friend who's just like going to listen and I can grab. But everybody has a function in some way and they're just... It's just, it's cathartic. It's so, it's so beautiful.

And that's why I'm just, I don't understand.

And that's why I'm just, I don't understand.

And it never came up.

And it never came up.

It also has to be around a crisis, right?

It also has to be around a crisis, right?

This is also why women live longer, I think, than men, because we're getting a lot of that out.

This is also why women live longer, I think, than men, because we're getting a lot of that out.

And not to take it there, but y'all keep it in here.

And not to take it there, but y'all keep it in here.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

For sure.

For sure.

That's why I'm like, you have to be honest about like, hey girl, like I'm, I have a lot on my plate and I'm, that's hard to say. Because I was, yeah, I was going to say like, I just want to be a dinner friend. And I guess in those situations where I've been confronted about like, hey, because I have been, I feel like I give you more energy. That I have just been like, I've blamed it on work.

That's why I'm like, you have to be honest about like, hey girl, like I'm, I have a lot on my plate and I'm, that's hard to say. Because I was, yeah, I was going to say like, I just want to be a dinner friend. And I guess in those situations where I've been confronted about like, hey, because I have been, I feel like I give you more energy. That I have just been like, I've blamed it on work.

I've blamed it on I'm busy, but I haven't said I don't want to devote the time to this. Saying that I have work is the excuse and they can choose to pleasantly ghost me and I wouldn't be as affected. The fact that Eva is actually affected by this is what's confusing me because you... you didn't dedicate the energy to want to be her friend.

I've blamed it on I'm busy, but I haven't said I don't want to devote the time to this. Saying that I have work is the excuse and they can choose to pleasantly ghost me and I wouldn't be as affected. The fact that Eva is actually affected by this is what's confusing me because you... you didn't dedicate the energy to want to be her friend.

And I'd imagine that you do have a set of friends that are hired to your friends that do get your time and energy, that you do consider those people. Or you're just a loner and don't know how to make friends. And that's a whole different situation. But I'm confused by the loss because you had this person who cared about you, invested in you.

And I'd imagine that you do have a set of friends that are hired to your friends that do get your time and energy, that you do consider those people. Or you're just a loner and don't know how to make friends. And that's a whole different situation. But I'm confused by the loss because you had this person who cared about you, invested in you.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

And make some friends with some guys.

And make some friends with some guys.

But even hearing you say this, you also have to have the recognition that maybe you're also not compatible. Because some of it, some friendships, the most beautiful friendships are just instinctive. They're instinctual. You don't have to. You don't have to try. You are the yin to the yang. You fit in like puzzle pieces.

But even hearing you say this, you also have to have the recognition that maybe you're also not compatible. Because some of it, some friendships, the most beautiful friendships are just instinctive. They're instinctual. You don't have to. You don't have to try. You are the yin to the yang. You fit in like puzzle pieces.

And then when there are missteps, you can talk about them comfortably without necessarily feeling like you're offending. And this feels very much like Eva had to try too hard to be something she was not to be something that she wanted and that she didn't really want and so I think considering that and that goes back to being honest with yourself but

And then when there are missteps, you can talk about them comfortably without necessarily feeling like you're offending. And this feels very much like Eva had to try too hard to be something she was not to be something that she wanted and that she didn't really want and so I think considering that and that goes back to being honest with yourself but

The best friendships I have, you haven't had to do all that. And the worst friendships I've had that I've silently ghosted or that have silently ghosted me, it was hard to manage. There was always something and it felt uncomfortable. So, yeah, being honest with yourself about that is crucial.

The best friendships I have, you haven't had to do all that. And the worst friendships I've had that I've silently ghosted or that have silently ghosted me, it was hard to manage. There was always something and it felt uncomfortable. So, yeah, being honest with yourself about that is crucial.

32? Oh, yeah, this is when people started falling off, girl. Your 30s is like when it... It whittles down to who's going to be there. And does she have kids?

32? Oh, yeah, this is when people started falling off, girl. Your 30s is like when it... It whittles down to who's going to be there. And does she have kids?

During the breakup, I'm curious if the friend ever came to her and was like, hey, this is what I need from a relationship. I feel like this is unbalanced. It seems like she was like, this is the last straw. Like, my relative died. You didn't show up. This has been unbalanced. And maybe it became clear to her in that moment, which I think she said. She said, like, all of a sudden, you ain't shit.

During the breakup, I'm curious if the friend ever came to her and was like, hey, this is what I need from a relationship. I feel like this is unbalanced. It seems like she was like, this is the last straw. Like, my relative died. You didn't show up. This has been unbalanced. And maybe it became clear to her in that moment, which I think she said. She said, like, all of a sudden, you ain't shit.

Like, I realize that. And that's just, that's the way the cookie crumbles. I wonder if Eva also fought for it.

Like, I realize that. And that's just, that's the way the cookie crumbles. I wonder if Eva also fought for it.

Do you guys do follow up? Well, we could. I need to know.

Do you guys do follow up? Well, we could. I need to know.

Well, one of the things is, I think you mentioned it, is if you have this other set of friends holding court and just being like, hey, guys, how do I... Yeah.

Well, one of the things is, I think you mentioned it, is if you have this other set of friends holding court and just being like, hey, guys, how do I... Yeah.

Am I... Take it to your counsel. Yeah, take it to your counsel.

Am I... Take it to your counsel. Yeah, take it to your counsel.

What are the ways that I don't show up? Have I been a bad friend? And, like, use that to become a better friend. I completely agree with that.

What are the ways that I don't show up? Have I been a bad friend? And, like, use that to become a better friend. I completely agree with that.

And one thing that I've done before, write a letter with no expectation of a response. If you really do care about how your actions impacted this person, write a letter of apology. say where you're coming from and let that person know, hey, I just wanted to get this off my chest. This is the way that I really valued you. I'm sorry I didn't show up for you in this way.

And one thing that I've done before, write a letter with no expectation of a response. If you really do care about how your actions impacted this person, write a letter of apology. say where you're coming from and let that person know, hey, I just wanted to get this off my chest. This is the way that I really valued you. I'm sorry I didn't show up for you in this way.

The door is still open to be friends if you'll walk through it again, but feel free not to respond. I just wanted to get this off. Like, if you really feel badly about it, write her a letter, but don't expect a response. I like that.

The door is still open to be friends if you'll walk through it again, but feel free not to respond. I just wanted to get this off. Like, if you really feel badly about it, write her a letter, but don't expect a response. I like that.

Honestly, you want a low-maintenance relationship. You want a low-maintenance relationship.

Honestly, you want a low-maintenance relationship. You want a low-maintenance relationship.

What's the next letter? Thank you so much. Thank you, guys.

What's the next letter? Thank you so much. Thank you, guys.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Thank you so much. I was just nodding and mm-hmm back there. I had so many times I wanted to jump in. Well, what's been going on? How are you? I'm doing really well. I'm out here still just writing. You mentioned a restaurant that is called Somerville that's in my neighborhood that I'm really excited about. What made you say, all right, I want to open up a restaurant?

Thank you so much. I was just nodding and mm-hmm back there. I had so many times I wanted to jump in. Well, what's been going on? How are you? I'm doing really well. I'm out here still just writing. You mentioned a restaurant that is called Somerville that's in my neighborhood that I'm really excited about. What made you say, all right, I want to open up a restaurant?

You know, it's twofold. I've always said if I wasn't a writer, I'd be a bartender or a waitress. Yes.

You know, it's twofold. I've always said if I wasn't a writer, I'd be a bartender or a waitress. Yes.

I like the food environment. I love serving. I love hosting. And there is a degree of that. And I love eating out. And so since I was young, even doing playdates with my brother, my little brother, our playdates would be... Restaurant. Restaurant. Yes. And I would be the bossy restaurant owner. Sounds familiar. And then also... I remember my best friend and I have the same birthday.

I like the food environment. I love serving. I love hosting. And there is a degree of that. And I love eating out. And so since I was young, even doing playdates with my brother, my little brother, our playdates would be... Restaurant. Restaurant. Yes. And I would be the bossy restaurant owner. Sounds familiar. And then also... I remember my best friend and I have the same birthday.

And it was like the 30-something birthday. You were Capricorn, too.

And it was like the 30-something birthday. You were Capricorn, too.

That's why we bossy. Yeah, I know. I don't like to admit it. I don't want to give my mother that satisfaction. But we were just out. We always celebrate our birthday together. We went to dinner. Uh-huh. And we're just like, let's go. Like, we're trying to go out. And in your 30s, you're not trying to go to a club. You're trying to go to a place to lounge and have a good time. It was so hard.

That's why we bossy. Yeah, I know. I don't like to admit it. I don't want to give my mother that satisfaction. But we were just out. We always celebrate our birthday together. We went to dinner. Uh-huh. And we're just like, let's go. Like, we're trying to go out. And in your 30s, you're not trying to go to a club. You're trying to go to a place to lounge and have a good time. It was so hard.

To find. We went to like so many different spots and it just wasn't the right vibe. It was just, and it infuriated me. I was like, we are both from LA. We cannot find a spot with us that's just a good time that'll cater to us. And that was like my villain origin story where I was like, I want that in my neighborhood.

To find. We went to like so many different spots and it just wasn't the right vibe. It was just, and it infuriated me. I was like, we are both from LA. We cannot find a spot with us that's just a good time that'll cater to us. And that was like my villain origin story where I was like, I want that in my neighborhood.

I have been very lucky that I've had you know, friends since high school because I'm from LA and there is a sense of this feeling like my job. Like I don't, I didn't come, I didn't move here to become myself. I was already here and I grew up around this environment and a lot of the people that I went to school with are my friends still. And even my name, my name is Joey Sajope.

I have been very lucky that I've had you know, friends since high school because I'm from LA and there is a sense of this feeling like my job. Like I don't, I didn't come, I didn't move here to become myself. I was already here and I grew up around this environment and a lot of the people that I went to school with are my friends still. And even my name, my name is Joey Sajope.

That's how I grew up. And so even the Easter egg of it, It's like, those are people who don't really know me. And the people who are my friends, you know, call me by name or my nickname. And so there's such a distinct separation. But I've definitely had friendship breakups. Yeah. Some as a result of working together as we both descended.

That's how I grew up. And so even the Easter egg of it, It's like, those are people who don't really know me. And the people who are my friends, you know, call me by name or my nickname. And so there's such a distinct separation. But I've definitely had friendship breakups. Yeah. Some as a result of working together as we both descended.

Some as a result of not being able to handle the change in position, the time. Like I have a friend who I thought I was going to be friends with forever. But she went through two major milestones, kind of traumatic milestones, really young. She got married when we were in college and divorced. When none of my other friends had experienced those things.

Some as a result of not being able to handle the change in position, the time. Like I have a friend who I thought I was going to be friends with forever. But she went through two major milestones, kind of traumatic milestones, really young. She got married when we were in college and divorced. When none of my other friends had experienced those things.

And I didn't, as a friend, know how to handle that or have the capacity to handle that. And that was actually strike two, I think, on my part for her. Strike one was her father died when she was in college. And she was the first friend whose parent had passed away. And I felt like I wasn't equipped enough. to like truly be there for her in the way that she needed me to.

And I didn't, as a friend, know how to handle that or have the capacity to handle that. And that was actually strike two, I think, on my part for her. Strike one was her father died when she was in college. And she was the first friend whose parent had passed away. And I felt like I wasn't equipped enough. to like truly be there for her in the way that she needed me to.

And that was around the time when I started like rising in my own career. And I felt like she never took my career seriously or my aspirations seriously. So we fell apart and drifted apart and we tried to come together, but we were just in different places. And that was one of my most painful friendship breakups because it wasn't, Yeah. In that way. Right. But I haven't had any like

And that was around the time when I started like rising in my own career. And I felt like she never took my career seriously or my aspirations seriously. So we fell apart and drifted apart and we tried to come together, but we were just in different places. And that was one of my most painful friendship breakups because it wasn't, Yeah. In that way. Right. But I haven't had any like

You're famous. I'm using you type things.

You're famous. I'm using you type things.

That took so many turns.

That took so many turns.

Yeah, there's a piece of you that you're giving so many of, I mean, so many of the women in my life know things that I just would never share with anyone that I've, As a closed off person, if I've opened up to you, that already means like you mean a lot to me and that I see a future with you. And automatically, if I deem you as a friend, then that's like for life.

And so the idea that that gets cut off for any reason, and especially if I'm culpable or if I felt betrayed by you, that is devastating. And even in hearing this letter, this woman felt like she was even hesitant to become this person's friend to begin with. And then ultimately was just like, oh, okay, I see the value in my life.

But there were tinges of selfishness there just even in terms of how she saw the friendship. But it still felt like She was, in any version of this, I don't know, I don't think that she was willing to be a full friend to this woman, is the way that I read it. And that's okay, but you just have to be honest about that. You can't have it both ways.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

Yeah, I think I don't disagree with that. But there is the, if you're always showing up, if you're always the one that's like checking in, if you're... Even if you're always the one providing the tickets, that's fine. Like, tickets to the games, I'm always the one with the tickets.

If you find out your other friend has tickets and didn't invite you and you're not... Like, that's still... There's an imbalance. Like, I'm always thinking of you first because you're not thinking of me first. That's like... That's the unhealthy imbalance where it's just, okay, you're not going to show up for me in the same way that I show up for you.

I know your effort is. Yes. Even if it's just pizza. Like, girl, I know you like pizza and you invited me. This means a lot. And I will meet you where you're at because I know that this is your love language. But you can tell when someone's kind of checked out of any kind of effort or that you don't rank as high on their list of friends.

So like, even if I'm not getting in your business.

So you actually brought up, like, this is the thing that I'm going through.

Not that he... When you were going through it, right? Yes. And it was hard. Who did you talk to?

Because we talk about everything. And there's... There's just... There are things that you don't know affect you until you talk about it. It could be nothing. It could be talking about a TV show episode that then leads to like, oh, this happened to me and this is how I was affected by it. And there's just... And nothing is off limits and that's the beauty of it is just...

You get to explore everything freely with no judgment. And that's also the devastation of, oh, I don't have this safe space anymore. You are the safe space. And I didn't even see that it was a malicious space. Which, you know, getting back to this letter, it's like this woman seemed like she was pouring her heart out to this woman. to Eva. And it was like hit or miss. I'm not even sure.

I don't even know if I like you, girl. Oh, I guess I do like you, but it's too late. And so I think that that's, that's also a violation of just like, am I in your life or not? Do you like me or not? Are we, are we good or not? And now someone, something happened that's tragic. And I, I think

You're one of the last people I heard from, so maybe I need to be real about what this friendship actually was.

I have to say that I'm also guilty, because part of this also triggered me in a way, because I am guilty of... Again, like you said, I am not a check-in-everyday type of person. I'm a very much... When I'm here, it's all about you, but I don't check in as often as I should with friends. And...

I've been told that in the past and I've adjusted, but you just have to tell me, but it's not a natural instinct. And so with this, I understand like Eva being like, this is kind of a high maintenance friendship in a way where I can't, I'm not going to be the same type of giving friend that you are to me, but I will show up in the ways that I can. If you need me, I will always be there.

And so that is... That would make me consider like, oh, am I a bad friend? Because I think about you, but I might not text you to be like, hey, I just want to make sure you're okay. But you should know that I would hope you would call me if you weren't okay and know that I would show up for you and be there for you. I'm not considerate.

I'm not a considerate friend in the way that I would like to be. That's a pronouncement there. It's true. It's like one of my biggest flaws because I'm just so work focused that I'm not like, I'll think about you, but not tell you that I'm thinking about you. Right. And that's fair.

Yeah.

Okay.

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

Can I ask you a question about the chair of angst? Yes. Did they ask you questions or was it more of like a venting space?

That's dope. But y'all had to make a whole construct with cigars and margaritas and whatnot.

So a friend has never disappointed you?

And have you had that happen to you with one of your friends where they've approached you and said, hey, you just show up in this way and I'm upset?

Have you ended a friendship?

Oh, because you're a good friend. I keep hitting this, right? Because you're a good friend.

You seem like you're a good friend.

But I think you allow people to just be comfortable with you. And I think that that is essential in a friendship. And you may not challenge them in a way. But if a friendship isn't serving you, will you just... Ignore it and keep it going. I keep them around. You'll never be like, hey, I kind of don't like hanging around. You kind of get on my nerves.

If it didn't matter.

No, I'm just like, girl, you gave me a reason. Thank you. No, you are done. I had too many people I messed with. Because there's nothing worse than like, Like, having... Sometimes you just don't have time. And making a new friend who you're kind of not sure about. And then you have to, like, make plans together.

The slow ghost allows you to never speak to them again and never have to plan anything. And it's fine. Ouch. But even with your friends, I'm sorry. Your friends that you grew up with... Inevitably, you guys... Like, you grow up, you become who you're supposed to be, right?

There are no friends that you've grown up with that you have where you're just like, I've outgrown them mentally or they, you know, don't necessarily, we don't vibe the same anymore. There's never been that. And that thought has never crossed your mind.

And they've never, since grammar school?

Okay, okay. But your friends that you hold now, your male friends, is that to say that you've never even fought?

No, and that's not, like guys to me, y'all will be like, Like, y'all don't physically fight and be like, well, he the alpha, I'm the beta.

Let's go have a beer. Yeah. And no, if I physically fight one of my female friends, it's over.

No, but in... But I get it.

But the emotional fights allow you to get closer or... you know, decide this isn't the right relationship.

Something super dire.

I haven't even gotten to that phase yet.

And do you know that it's so, oh, my, it feels so good after dinner.

It's just like, there's no better feeling than like, I just got, ugh, I reconnected with my girl. She knows everything. I've been holding, I was saving this story for her because only she would understand it. Like, I can't tell, like, there's friendship. There's, even in my groups, there's my friends who, if I want to be mad at someone, and if I want to not know that I'm wrong, I go to her.

Because she's never going to tell me I'm wrong. It's always, yeah, girl, okay, who we... Right, who's next?

And then there's a friend that I go to where I'm just like, I need to know... The truth. Yes, I need to know the truth. I need to know that I'm not it and they're going to give it to me straight. And then there's just the loyal friend who's just like going to listen and I can grab. But everybody has a function in some way and they're just... It's just, it's cathartic. It's so, it's so beautiful.

And that's why I'm just, I don't understand.

And it never came up.

It also has to be around a crisis, right?

This is also why women live longer, I think, than men, because we're getting a lot of that out.

And not to take it there, but y'all keep it in here.

We were all... There at the house, bringing her favorite snack. Like, this is, took off work.

Playing and doing a text, like, you know, she's not going to be good. Like, she doesn't need this right now, you know?

For sure.

That's why I'm like, you have to be honest about like, hey girl, like I'm, I have a lot on my plate and I'm, that's hard to say. Because I was, yeah, I was going to say like, I just want to be a dinner friend. And I guess in those situations where I've been confronted about like, hey, because I have been, I feel like I give you more energy. That I have just been like, I've blamed it on work.

I've blamed it on I'm busy, but I haven't said I don't want to devote the time to this. Saying that I have work is the excuse and they can choose to pleasantly ghost me and I wouldn't be as affected. The fact that Eva is actually affected by this is what's confusing me because you... you didn't dedicate the energy to want to be her friend.

And I'd imagine that you do have a set of friends that are hired to your friends that do get your time and energy, that you do consider those people. Or you're just a loner and don't know how to make friends. And that's a whole different situation. But I'm confused by the loss because you had this person who cared about you, invested in you.

Yeah. Yeah.

And make some friends with some guys.

But even hearing you say this, you also have to have the recognition that maybe you're also not compatible. Because some of it, some friendships, the most beautiful friendships are just instinctive. They're instinctual. You don't have to. You don't have to try. You are the yin to the yang. You fit in like puzzle pieces.

And then when there are missteps, you can talk about them comfortably without necessarily feeling like you're offending. And this feels very much like Eva had to try too hard to be something she was not to be something that she wanted and that she didn't really want and so I think considering that and that goes back to being honest with yourself but

The best friendships I have, you haven't had to do all that. And the worst friendships I've had that I've silently ghosted or that have silently ghosted me, it was hard to manage. There was always something and it felt uncomfortable. So, yeah, being honest with yourself about that is crucial.

32? Oh, yeah, this is when people started falling off, girl. Your 30s is like when it... It whittles down to who's going to be there. And does she have kids?

During the breakup, I'm curious if the friend ever came to her and was like, hey, this is what I need from a relationship. I feel like this is unbalanced. It seems like she was like, this is the last straw. Like, my relative died. You didn't show up. This has been unbalanced. And maybe it became clear to her in that moment, which I think she said. She said, like, all of a sudden, you ain't shit.

Like, I realize that. And that's just, that's the way the cookie crumbles. I wonder if Eva also fought for it.

Do you guys do follow up? Well, we could. I need to know.

Well, one of the things is, I think you mentioned it, is if you have this other set of friends holding court and just being like, hey, guys, how do I... Yeah.

Am I... Take it to your counsel. Yeah, take it to your counsel.

What are the ways that I don't show up? Have I been a bad friend? And, like, use that to become a better friend. I completely agree with that.

And one thing that I've done before, write a letter with no expectation of a response. If you really do care about how your actions impacted this person, write a letter of apology. say where you're coming from and let that person know, hey, I just wanted to get this off my chest. This is the way that I really valued you. I'm sorry I didn't show up for you in this way.

The door is still open to be friends if you'll walk through it again, but feel free not to respond. I just wanted to get this off. Like, if you really feel badly about it, write her a letter, but don't expect a response. I like that.

Honestly, you want a low-maintenance relationship. You want a low-maintenance relationship.

What's the next letter? Thank you so much. Thank you, guys.

Mm-hmm.

Thank you so much. I was just nodding and mm-hmm back there. I had so many times I wanted to jump in. Well, what's been going on? How are you? I'm doing really well. I'm out here still just writing. You mentioned a restaurant that is called Somerville that's in my neighborhood that I'm really excited about. What made you say, all right, I want to open up a restaurant?

You know, it's twofold. I've always said if I wasn't a writer, I'd be a bartender or a waitress. Yes.

I like the food environment. I love serving. I love hosting. And there is a degree of that. And I love eating out. And so since I was young, even doing playdates with my brother, my little brother, our playdates would be... Restaurant. Restaurant. Yes. And I would be the bossy restaurant owner. Sounds familiar. And then also... I remember my best friend and I have the same birthday.

And it was like the 30-something birthday. You were Capricorn, too.

That's why we bossy. Yeah, I know. I don't like to admit it. I don't want to give my mother that satisfaction. But we were just out. We always celebrate our birthday together. We went to dinner. Uh-huh. And we're just like, let's go. Like, we're trying to go out. And in your 30s, you're not trying to go to a club. You're trying to go to a place to lounge and have a good time. It was so hard.

To find. We went to like so many different spots and it just wasn't the right vibe. It was just, and it infuriated me. I was like, we are both from LA. We cannot find a spot with us that's just a good time that'll cater to us. And that was like my villain origin story where I was like, I want that in my neighborhood.

I have been very lucky that I've had you know, friends since high school because I'm from LA and there is a sense of this feeling like my job. Like I don't, I didn't come, I didn't move here to become myself. I was already here and I grew up around this environment and a lot of the people that I went to school with are my friends still. And even my name, my name is Joey Sajope.

That's how I grew up. And so even the Easter egg of it, It's like, those are people who don't really know me. And the people who are my friends, you know, call me by name or my nickname. And so there's such a distinct separation. But I've definitely had friendship breakups. Yeah. Some as a result of working together as we both descended.

Some as a result of not being able to handle the change in position, the time. Like I have a friend who I thought I was going to be friends with forever. But she went through two major milestones, kind of traumatic milestones, really young. She got married when we were in college and divorced. When none of my other friends had experienced those things.

And I didn't, as a friend, know how to handle that or have the capacity to handle that. And that was actually strike two, I think, on my part for her. Strike one was her father died when she was in college. And she was the first friend whose parent had passed away. And I felt like I wasn't equipped enough. to like truly be there for her in the way that she needed me to.

And that was around the time when I started like rising in my own career. And I felt like she never took my career seriously or my aspirations seriously. So we fell apart and drifted apart and we tried to come together, but we were just in different places. And that was one of my most painful friendship breakups because it wasn't, Yeah. In that way. Right. But I haven't had any like

You're famous. I'm using you type things.

That took so many turns.