Dr. Sanam Hafiz
Appearances
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
There were a couple of other types of autism called Rett syndrome or childhood disintegrative disorder. When the DSM-5 kind of redid autism, we got rid of all of those terminologies. We just made it one big spectrum of autism.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Over the pandemic, and I can tell you because I've been in practice in the center doing assessments for almost 18 years now, over the pandemic, people had a lot more time on their hands and a lot of people were taking to social media.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And obviously, it's not a bad thing that there's so much awareness of stuff, but there were articles being written that could not quite capture everything about what autism is. And the idea of neurodivergence really gained popularity. We went back to work and we only took maybe about three months off. When we went back to work, you know, the idea of autism sort of exploded.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Everyone wanted to come in and be evaluated and assessed for autism. Everyone was neurodivergent and there were some people who wouldn't take no for an answer. So it kind of became frustrating because, you know, I have actually said these exact words, but if you knew you were autistic, why did you bother coming to see us?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You know, we're people with licenses and doctorates and two or three decades of experiences. I've got other people in my team who've been practicing for longer than me. So I would tell them, look, we are not just giving you expert opinion with clinical discretion. We're also using standardized tests to tell you whether you're autistic.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And if you're not, what else might be going on that could mimic or look like autism? And a lot of times people are very grateful for it. And there are a lot of times that it's primarily to do with autism, where people are so married to the idea that all their difficulties stem from autism, that they're unwilling to accept what else it might be.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Yeah, I mean, look, some people, and let's talk about adults for a minute, they might just have certain personality traits. A lot of times I find that that's not always the only thing. They usually have a parent who also might have been on the spectrum or looked like they were on the spectrum. People who are, you know, back in the day, we would call quirky or odd or peculiar. And Yeah.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And younger children for the longest time, remember the diagnosis I said, PDD-NOS? So if there was a child who, let's say, wasn't speaking yet, or speech was a big part of the problem, and they were having temper tantrums, and someone suspected autism, but we didn't have enough information about it, we might just give them PDD-NOS.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So to this day, you know, now we have better tools and better understanding of autism. And if there are some other things going on, you know, very often I've put in reports and I've explained to the families that your child may have had a diagnosis of autism, but your child also is intellectually deficient.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And I ended up, my first job out of graduate school was as a neurodevelopmental psychologist in a hospital in Brooklyn. I enjoyed that immensely. And I started like a small private practice on the side, which evolved and became big enough that at one point I had like 100 contractors evaluating for me.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So it's hard for us to parse out the low cognitive functioning, the low intelligence from autistic features. And so this is why we need to see him again in a year and a half. So we can, you know, it's sort of like the oil and water, it separates and you get to see the different things.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
With older people, not children, but let's say teenagers or adults, we notice a tremendous amount of overlap in people who might have pretty severe ADHD, maybe some social emotional immaturity issues. And a lot of times anxiety or OCD. So a lot of rigidity around things can look like autism, especially if you combine it with neurological neurodivergence like ADHD.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Sometimes people who have severe social anxiety and can't make eye contact can appear autistic to the naked eye. Sometimes people with, you know, even mood disorder, PTSD and bipolar disorder can appear autistic if there's enough of a neurological spin to the way they present outwardly. And we do these tests, these very sensitive standardized tests like IQ testing.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And there's a measure for autism called the ADOS. It's the Autism Diagnostic Observation Schedule. We also give them self-reporting scales. And then we observe them through several sessions. And it's a team effort. And it's not always black and white. But we're able to tell them, hey, this test comes up. Yes, you rated yourself pretty high as autistic.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
But when we did the ADOS, which is a clinician administered test, you were able to have a lot of reciprocal conversation. Not only did you make eye contact, you were able to integrate nonverbal communication with verbal communication. For instance, you're sitting there, you're nodding. I can see your eye blinking exactly when I say something. You're holding your chin as I'm talking.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
I'm using my hands. I'm gesturing in emphasis, even though the majority of people who are all of the people who are listening to me are not going to be able to see this. But this is the integration of nonverbal communication into verbal communication. Autistic individuals have a very difficult time with that.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
They can learn eye contact to some degree, even though it looks tilted and awkward or forced, they cannot learn how to do this and they cannot learn how to do this at the same level that I'm doing it right now.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So those are the things that you can't always put into words or really explain to a lot of people who really believe that they check off all the criteria, maybe on paper, but not when I see them.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
If you are a parent, for instance, and you're listening to this and you're wondering about your child, look for things like eye contact. Look for a child having a really difficult time. And I don't mean a child who is having a temper tantrum because they didn't get what they wanted.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
I mean a child who likes to sleep on a specific pillow or likes to eat very specific foods or doesn't like loud, unanticipated noises or has issues with textures or really either struggles to make friends or has no interest in socializing. or they don't understand or display inflection. Their language doesn't have the intonation, the music of language. They don't understand sarcasm.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
They don't get jokes. Those are the things to look for. If you're an adult, the funny or the ironic thing is that if you're an adult and you may be on the spectrum, you don't necessarily recognize that you may be on the spectrum. Having an awareness, a hyper-awareness of yourself, sort of the inward navel-gazing, is not something autistic people can do very well. That is a defining feature.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And now we have a small center, about five psychologists and a decent sized team that does administrative and psychometric type tasks. So I spend my time managing or directing the center, seeing patients. I see patients every day and I do some forensic and media work like we're doing right now.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So when people come and really go to bat for their diagnosis, I go, if you were truly autistic, you probably couldn't do that.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
It is not something that goes away, doesn't change. And when people sort of deny that they may not be autistic, they're actually shutting off the things that you can't fix. You can't cure autism. What you can do is treat the things that sometimes come along with autism. So even if that is true. Let's say you're an Asperger's type person.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
The way to correct that is to go into cognitive behavioral therapy with someone who knows autistic people who can teach you social strategies, work with you on eye contact. We're not trying to change who they are. We're trying to make them feel more at home or more easy to get along with or maybe go to an interview and get the job that they want and not feel left out.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Medication for anxiety can be helpful. Medication for ADHD can be helpful. The key is first to get a full assessment so you understand where you really belong on that spectrum. And you know, when people tell me they've had a diagnosis, I am very curious where they got that diagnosis. Who diagnosed them? What tools did they use to give them that diagnosis?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Because the majority of people I know don't own an ADOS, have never been trained on an ADOS, and don't have the faintest idea what the ADOS is. And it's a very critical tool. Everyone on my team has a doctorate and is licensed and primarily does assessments.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
I still have everyone trained on the ADOS every two years because there's so much research and critical thinking about autism that comes out every couple of years.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Gifted individuals tend to have a tremendous overlap with autism. I actually have a table that I use from the Davidson Institute and the CDC. And it's basically the overlap or the similarities between people who are gifted and the people who are autistic. Sometimes a gifted person can in fact be autistic. There is no rule that makes autism mutually exclusive. You can have both.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
But sometimes what looks like autism is really giftedness. Being gifted is a bit of a blessing and a curse. I have yet to meet someone who got told that they were gifted, who went, oh wow, look at me, I'm gifted. They feel like it is a burden. The brain never slows down. The brain never shuts down. The brain never takes a break. The brain is firing on all cylinders all the time.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And it's exhausting.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Comprehend the mind. And my Instagram is just my name, Dr. Sanam Hafiz.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Yeah, great work. Thank you. As a mental health provider, I thank you.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So my specialization is assessments, is diagnostics. So you name it, whether it's ADHD, learning disabilities, autism, but also to parse out bipolar disorder from depression or to diagnose schizophrenia. The brain is a beautiful organ, but it's very small. And so it's sometimes a lot of things overlap. You could have something neurological, but also have something psychiatric going on.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
It's very common to have overlapping diagnoses, yes.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So it's a really well-structured and it's complex, but a simple process. We start with a very detailed initial assessment that allows me to interview. And if we're going to talk about children, then I interview the parents. I interview the child. I observe. I get the teachers involved. And so we kind of develop a profile, a background.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You know, children are, they don't exist and they're not an island. They don't exist in isolation. They're an eco, they're part of a big ecosystem that involves, you know, who lives at home, their family history, genetics, the teachers, the school, the kind of services they get.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And so to do an evaluation without taking all of those factors into account would be such a disservice, as you can understand, right? And so I call my initial assessment a probe. I'm probing, I'm digging, I'm asking questions as in, so who goes grocery shopping in your home? And you'd be amazed at what a lot of simplistic questions can bring up about a family. I ask, has anyone been diagnosed?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And a lot of times the answer is like, no. You know, back in the day, no one ever went to a psychologist or a psychiatrist. Or, you know, my culture has been very sort of suspicious or mistrusting of mental health. So we don't have a lot of that. But I dig and I find out that there are often people
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Family members, relatives, people they've never met where there was a fair history or at least a narrative that there was something going on with them, mental health wise. So I try to show families that, look, you may have a grandparent that you've never met, but their DNA has met you, right? Their genes have somehow made it down to you and into your child.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And it really does open up a lot of dialogue with families that have never considered that. So that's one aspect of it. Then I basically take all that data that I've gathered, a lot of the quantitative data that I've gathered, and I go back to my team and we design what we call a testing battery.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So in my center, because what we primarily do is diagnostics, we have standardized measures that test for everything from your IQ to your academic functioning to your neurological and psychiatric functioning. And we designed a battery of tests, a set of tests based on what the patient might have come looking for, but also what that initial assessment evoked or brought up.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And I say, well, I also want to look at this, this and this. And so when we set out to test, we're looking at all facets of a child's functioning or an individual's functioning. If you were to come to my office, we would use the same exact paradigm, if you will, on you.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So, you know, it's interesting. It differs, but it really doesn't differ because people are people. And so a five-year-old might have an in-progress, like it's a site under construction, right? When you're five, your cognitive functioning is not set in stone yet. You're still developing. You might be getting services at the school level.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You have parents that control or determine a lot of what's happening with you. A 25 or a 35-year-old are in, even if they're adult, they're in two developmental milestones or developmental stages that are very different.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So a 25-year-old, maybe someone who just got out of school, maybe someone who's getting a job and lives with a bunch of roommates, maybe someone who's struggling and has moved back in with his or her parents, they may not have a lot of history about themselves, right? So a lot of times they say, if you have a parent around, especially if you have a mom around, ask her, ask her these things.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You know, ask her if she recalls having concerns about, let's say, let's talk about autism. I see a lot of adults very concerned that they may be on the spectrum. and really almost sometimes even fighting for that diagnosis.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And I say, well, if you have a parent around, ask them when you spoke, ask them when you walked, ask them how related you were, if you made eye contact, if you toe walked, if you flapped your hands, if you had tantrums. So a lot of times the adults of 25 and 35 year olds may not have a lot of historical narrative about themselves because they've never asked anyone.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
But I will say, do you recall getting pulled out for services? Do you recall struggling when you were younger? And so that does bring up a lot of stuff that doesn't always point to autism. And so we cannot do psychiatric testing or personality measures with a five-year-old, but we can do that with a 25 and a 35-year-old.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So when we do the assessment process, when they come back to us for testing, we use, like I said, a battery of tests. And at the end of that assessment model is an appointment that's almost always with me to discuss the results and findings.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So what they get after I give them the results and the diagnoses, they get a report, a written, detailed 30, 40, 50 page report that entails all of that data, that entails a summary of the findings and what that means, diagnoses and very detailed recommendations. Because a neuropsychological evaluation can look really fancy, but if you don't tell people what to do with that, it's useless, right?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
It's essentially doesn't mean anything, just fancy words and tables on a report. So I am very, very detailed and very committed to having people, patients of mine, find resources and find ways to remediate or help themselves. Of course, when someone brings us a five-year-old, the world's my oyster, right?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
I can recommend a million things and, hey, come back every year and a half so I can keep reassessing your kid. But what do I do with a 25 and a 35-year-old that has missed a lot of time to make some of those changes? But also, life gets in the way. Spouses get in the way. Jobs get in the way, you know? And so...
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
I insist, look, if you don't follow some of these things, things are not going to change. But even if you implement three or four of the recommendations out of the 20 that I'm making, when you come see me back in 2025, you're going to see that you're a very different person than you are now. Because the change isn't going to happen overnight, but consistency is what matters.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
What you said about our sound during this podcast is true for valuations and treatment as well. Consistency and a commitment to doing it day in, day out is what's going to make a big difference. And yes, a year and a half, two years later, people come back and they are like, they're born anew. But a lot of that, we just did the job of assessing them, diagnosing them and giving them the direction.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
A lot of that is really on them. They do the work.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So we explain them what their diagnoses mean clinically, what the implications are, why there's so much of an overlap. They start to make those connections. When we give them the final report, we also give them resources. We give them resources such as psychiatrists who are in their neighborhood who take insurance.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
We give them psychologists or therapists in their neighborhood who take their insurance with individuals who are on the spectrum of or have ADHD, we have resources in the community in New York City, entire agencies and charities that are dedicated to working with those populations. We refer them to a state agency if they're under the age of 18. There's a state agency called OPWDD.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
It basically stands for Office of Persons with Developmental Disabilities. It is funded by New York State. It's a federal agency. It's a state agency that gets federal funding and they can get set up for services and help basically throughout life. They get something called a Medicaid waiver and it allows them to access those services. Now, let me bring you back to that 25-year-old.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Now, let's say a 25-year-old, when they turned 18 or 20, they graduated from their school's special education program. They went to an adults with disabilities program, but they also graduated from there. You can't stay there indefinitely, right? And maybe they trained them to do some sort of a job. And so they have a job.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You know, something simplistic, perhaps, you know, they get mail from the office and they feel a sense of, you know, community and a sense of contribution to their life. But mom says, listen, I'm getting older and I'm worried that my son may have a job, but he can get taken. And these are real stories, by the way.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
My 25-year-old autistic son goes online and has gotten scammed and we've had to get the police involved. Or my son ignored the jury duty notice three times till we got a warrant or something. These are things that happen to people because you don't wear a sign on your chest that says, I'm autistic. And a lot of autistic folks look very neurotypical. You can't tell.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So one of the things that I've been a huge advocate for is how do we keep them safe, right? Safety is a big deal. And I recall this one patient I was seeing since he was maybe 14 years old. The last time I saw him, he was maybe 17 or 18. No, the time before last. And I said to his dad, I said, look, your son is autistic, but he does not look autistic. I mean, I don't know even what that is, right?
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
A lot of people don't. And I said, if something happens and he had suddenly grown to be very tall and very big, if something were to happen in public, if he reacts, if he bolts, he just looks like a big black guy. And I worry about him because what does that mean? The next time dad comes back and he goes, Dr. Hafeez, I gotta tell you, he had a seizure. He passed out in a McDonald's.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
When he woke up, there were cops looking at him, EMS, and he bolted and he was a big guy. And I had asked him to have him like make, and this is like, 10 years ago, I had asked dad to maybe make a bracelet and make him wear it that said, hi, my name is so-and-so, I'm autistic. And when the cops saw that, he told everyone, stop, stop, stop. You're going to freak him out. He's autistic.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Thank you. Thanks for having me on.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
And the dad was like, had I not done that, I am really shook by what could have happened to my son that day.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So it's important for parents, aging parents sometimes, to take stock of their child's situation and say, what happens to them when I'm gone? So I then also guide them towards what we call surrogate court. It's a court that allows you to bring a case to the judge, to the court, and say, this child has profound developmental disabilities. They cannot make decisions for themselves.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
They may be intelligent on paper, but they have autism or a defining disability that will not allow them to make that decision. So I need to be able to assign another adult to either take full guardianship, which the courts are not crazy about, or specifically financial and medical guardianship or conservatorship. So there are ways to address, but you have to address everything.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
You can't just be like, okay, we'll put them on medication. That'll be the end of it. You got to teach them skills. You got to get them into job training, but you also got to take care of the legal end of things. That's what I try to do with that end goal in mind.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
Yeah, so we do both. We do follow up with them. We do an evaluation in another year and a half, but we're not a treatment facility. So we connect them to a lot of treatment providers, psychiatrists, therapists, like I said, charities, institutions, agencies. Then they then provide the services we recommend in our reports.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So I have a doctorate in psychology and the doctorate was very sort of scientific for a doctorate in psychology, very evidence-based cognitive behavioral therapy with a huge emphasis on assessments and evaluations. And then it turned out that I absolutely just loved it. I love the diagnostic part of neuropsychology.
Tony Mantor: Why Not Me the World
Dr. Sanam Hafiz: Unfolding Neuropsychology – From Holistic Profiling to Navigating Adulthood Challenges in Autism and Giftedness
So that's a huge debate. You know, when I started working, autism was, it had very clean, clear demarcations. You know, if you were not fully autistic, like textbook autistic, we could look for features of Asperger's or people who are maybe PDD, NOS, we used to call them, pervasive developmental disorder, not otherwise specified.