DJ Louie XIV
Appearances
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Oh, I'm so thrilled to be here. I'm on this earth to teach about the divas. That's why I was born. So I'm going to fulfill my life's purpose.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Oh, okay. Good. Everybody soak this up like a sponge. The history of the Germanadas. We're going to go back to Sicily.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I would say I identify mostly as a lover, but I would say like a lot of my audience probably thinks I'm more of a hater than I am and it bothers me, which is why I know that I'm a lover. Does that make sense?
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
And do I love women? Let me tell you, women are my number one.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Like as people, as pop stars, like I don't need the rest. Just give me the women.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah, no. I mean, I honestly do think even good criticism is an act of love.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah. Not to be too philosophical here, but I don't feel like if you come from a hatery perspective, you can actually, like, do good art criticism.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Lover. Lover. Like a truly seminal album for me. I was 22 or so when that album came out. I had just moved back to New York. I was finishing school. I thought I was super cool and cunty and slaying the game. And I just started my... Also associated with the beginning of my DJ career.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
So I remember playing those songs as they blew up in the little bars I was playing in the Lower East Side, which is where she's from. So it was a whole thing.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
in the room would have happened she's my she's my literally that she's chooky just like Hamilton that's why you don't you're okay listen she's really like the same age as me so we're like sort of we move in tandem I feel like you know we're like right around the same everything we hit all the same milestones yes right exactly okay lover hater born this way
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Lover, my number one favorite Gaga album. Like the album where her like ambition met her like pop cultural zeitgeist and like everything happened perfectly. It's never been that good again, I would say.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Wow. I'm talking album two more than song.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Okay, so I've had an interesting journey with R-Pop. When R-Pop came out, that was kind of like a fissure point for me in my Lady Gaga journey. I just found it kind of ugly. But in retrospect, I see it as kind of like the last Imperial Gaga moment. And I appreciate it a lot more. I think it's two-thirds or so. I think Lindsay Zola, that's when the New York Times said this recently.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
It's like two-thirds or so misunderstood, one-third like true garbage. But like I miss that kind of like unbridled Gaga energy. Like I feel like we've never gotten like... unhemmed Gaga again. Like she's been a cautious creature since that moment because I think there was so much backlash to that album. But I see it as kind of like the end of the opening salvo of Gaga.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
So I have more love for it in retrospect than I did at the moment.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Pop girlies are spiritual to me. This is my church. Welcome to my sermon.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah, pink cowboy hat. That was her, I'm a singer-songwriter now. I'm stripping away artifice to give you the real me, which is a kind of...
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
raucous trope that I don't appreciate generally speaking I also think it was as much of a drag act as anything else that she's done before but it just like the songs aren't there like I just I don't I don't I think there's maybe two or three songs I would take from that record and she can keep the rest okay which two or three I'm curious
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I would say I've come to really enjoy the like sort of bizarre first single, Perfect Illusion. I like the sort of like kind of like barroom stompery song called Ayo. And I like the opening song, which is called Diamond Heart, which is kind of like Gaga in like Bruce Springsteen mode, which is another kind of good guys for her, I think.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
kind of like mid like I think Chromatica is like when I talk about Gaga being kind of like hemmed in I hear Chromatica it's like kind of return to dance floor after like Joanne which was like a detour for her but like missing some of the like chaotic craziness that like defines the best Gaga music like a little bit tame a little anodyne like not rough around the edges enough just sort of too pristine like kind of boring I think which brings us to hey lover hater mayhem
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I'm lover on mayhem. Oh, right. It's been since Born This Way that I have unabashedly had good feelings towards a Gaga album when it's come out. Yeah. And it feels good to be back.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah, 38-year-old gay men are, like, feeling their 22-year-old oats. Like, is that good or bad for society? I don't know. I'll let you guys be the judge of that. Wait, okay, so where are you guys at on mayhem?
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Okay, before we got on, Peyton, I don't know if you heard this, but I was like, that is the most boomer ass, like, entree point to Gaga. Like, are you kidding me? That was the same exact moment that my parents were like, you know what? That Lady Gaga, she's got talent.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I'm sorry, I'm not trying to reveal your medical history.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Absolutely. Yes. Unfortunately that did happen and I did sift through both of those movies. Right. Right. I will say she's kind of the best part of both of those movies which isn't saying much.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I mean the Joker was really one of the worst movies I've ever seen in my life. Yes. But Okay, so here's how I would characterize it. I think Gaga had done a really effective job in the last half of the 2010s into the early 2020s of kind of moving above the fray of like pop star, qua pop star, like just kind of like singles game, having to have hits on the chart.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
She had a really spotty track record, but because of bringing boomers like yourself into the fold, she had done this thing where she was like, I'm bigger than that. I'm a movie star. I'm respected by rock lovers, parents... like me, I'm an Academy Award winner. And the Tony Bennett thing was a huge part of that too.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
She was like, I'm kind of old school, I'm an old school all around four quadrant entertainer. And I think her pop career had sort of gone a little, in my opinion, and other people will disagree, I think had kind of become secondary to her.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I think it had become this thing that she felt almost like compelled to return to because there's a huge group of core fans that like are still attached to 2008 through 2013 Lady Gaga when she was at her like peak zany kookiness. And that was huge for people, not just because the music was great and because that was a really exciting thing.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I mean, when she first blew up, like Hunter, I mean, you missed this train, but it was, she was a different person every single day. Like she walked out the house, she was like wearing a lobster on her head. Yeah.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yes. I mean, it was a really auspicious and exciting and singular pop star arrival. I can't think of a single other star's arrival in my personal lifetime that was that all-consuming and sort of crazy. Right out the gate, she just was huge. So you add that to the fact that she meant a lot to a lot of gay guys because Born This Way was this huge...
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
huge seminal album of a pop star really like expressing allyship and somewhat clunky but really really really like big you know bear hug ways from like a pop diva to their gay fans so there's a lot of core Gaga fans that are really attached to that era I don't think she's that attached to that era we could talk about Mayhem because it is kind of a return to that in some ways but
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
But I think she kind of moved on from that and became this kind of like grand dame, like, you know, multifaceted pop cultural figure who can do all this stuff. And then I think she would kind of every four years be like, oh shit, like the little monsters like need to get fed. Like you got to feed the little monsters.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Right. Yeah. And so she'd be like, I gotta throw like some bread and meat at them.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah, she's like tossing red meat at these like rabid F-words on the street. Okay, so... Sorry. So that's how I felt about her pop career for a long time. Like it just didn't... I just... I felt like she kind of lost the thread slightly and it was like sort of sad to me even though like I like songs from Joanne and Chromatica. Yeah. It just felt like her heart wasn't in it. So...
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Coming into this album, I was trepidatious because I still think she's spread sort of thin. And I still think like, I don't quite get, I don't know if she gets like who she is as a pop star in this moment, like in that part of her career. So for me, there was trepidation and anxiety going into this era.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
And then when I heard Disease and Abracadabra, it was this mixture of like, oh, these are really good Lady Gaga songs, but I don't hear like an evolution. Like I hear somebody going back towards like what they did in. Yeah.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
2009 2010 and like great great great pop stars in my estimation like Beyonce or Madonna don't do that usually like everything is about moving forward what's the next thing how do I like expand what I'm doing so I get I get shaky when I see stuff like that so that was where I was kind of like entering the album
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
She wanted to do everything except, like, put her whole pussy into a pop album. Am I allowed to say that? Yes. Like, I just felt like that was what she was like, oh, okay, like, let me leave, like, Tony Bennett and, like, House Labs and, like, my Oscar campaign to, like, all right, I'll throw it together, like, a little something here for them.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Not that she didn't try her, but I just didn't feel like she was inspired, I guess.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I think what I had to do was just, like, let go of, like, thinking of her in the trajectory of particularly, like, those two women who I think, who I kind of hold up as, like, Madonna and Beyonce. Yeah, it's, like, the gold standard of, like, what age... Like, not aging, because they're, like, whatever. Beyonce's, like, 42. But, like, in terms of, like, pop star aging. Like, escalating.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Being in this phase of your career where you're, like, past that zeitgeisty phase, but, like, you still need to, like, build out your career into something...
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
more dynamic more three-dimensional like how do you continue to expand and interest people like i hold them up in the specific way and madonna through most of her like first 25 years and beyonce to this day has never really like done a like return to form type of album she's never done like a let me go back to making crazy and love sounding songs again like she's it's always been like what's the next thing what's the next thing i have to say like how can i expand my artistry
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
And I think like what I've had to do with mayhem and what I think she's helped me do because it's just good. It's good. Gaga pastiche is just like, like Gaga is just not that type of artist. Like it's just, she's a different thing.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Like it's a, I think I've had to just understand, like I've had to almost cleave her from that sort of well-worn track and sort of think of her differently because I agree with you Hunter. It's like, these are not to like beat this dead horse, but these are reheated nachos in a way, but they are spectacular. They're gourmet. They're like Jean Jordan. Yeah.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yes, I loved 5'2". I mean, she also really struggled physically, we should say. Yes, yes. That was crazy. I mean, like, thinking about what she had to go through. I mean, she's a really gritty performer. Like, this is somebody that, like, I mean, she will.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Pain. I mean, I barely can walk after I go to, like, one CrossFit for, like, a month. No, but I'm just saying, like, she really works that. Like, she's where she is for a reason. Talent and, like, really hard worker.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. I hope she's sleeping now because she's almost 40.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Killer to me is like, okay, so what I like about Mayhem a lot is that beyond just sort of going and re-indexing her own work, which I do think this is doing very well, it's also re-indexing her influences. Like, I think she's going back to what she, what formed her musical identity. Yeah. So I hear a lot of Prince on this album. I hear a lot of David Bowie on this album.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I hear Michael Jackson on Shadow of a Man. I hear, you know, Blondie. I hear Nine Inch Nails on Perfect Celebrity. Oh, yes. Wait, I heard that too.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yes, exactly. Exactly. So I think that that's a helpful angle that helps it get past just being like pure Gaga pastiche. Mm-hmm. So that's how I'm thinking about it. So Killa to me is like one of the most, like the songs I least feel like links directly back to old Gaga songs. Like I hear that song and I'm not able to draw one to one like I am with some of the other songs.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I'm like, oh, this is that and that and that. It sounds like Bowie. It sounds like Prince. It's got kind of that wild abandoned, like let's just try something sort of crazy feeling that I really missed from Gaga songs. It's kooky. It's weird. Some of the lyrics are like evidently silly, but I just think like it's so much fun. And like that's the kind of energy I'm looking for in a Gaga song.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
So that's a definite standout for me. I also love Zombie Boy, the song that comes after it, which is kind of becoming a little viral on TikTok right now. It's like a sort of disco. It's definitely Bowie. It's definitely a little bit Debbie Harry. It's also kind of got that like kooky Halloween core thing that was a core Gaga, early Gaga thing. Like Bad Romance, like kind of a Halloween classic.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
sort of generally a halloween classic so it's got kind of like fun campy like you know monster mash come disco vibes that i really appreciate love that song i like perfect celebrity which is a reheaty nacho kind of song in the sense that like gaga doing like fame commentary was like how she came up like that was her whole thing is like i'm doing you know i'm both becoming a pop star and i'm commentating on becoming a pop star which this song is also doing but it's funny it's lighthearted and it's just hits like it just it sounds so good
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
It's got that loud, soft, loud dynamic that you can hear in Smells Like Teen Spirit or something like that, where the verses are quiet and then the hook is just extremely loud and hits you over the head. And that's a really effective pop songwriting technique.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
so that's a great one and i also really love garden of eden which is a willfully sort of like tinny sounding song that references like her earliest work like if you go back and listen to the fame production's not like that ornate or like full because she just didn't have the resources yet she didn't have the digital dolby sound whatever like it sounds demo-y and i sort of think that that's a really fun kind of callback to her earliest music so those four i i really like i think that forms like the
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
What I like less is like Blade of Grass, which is like the sort of ballad at the end of it that's like a sweet song about like apparently her fiance proposing to her with a blade of grass from their backyard. I just don't think it's like that sturdy of a ballad for her. The Beast is kind of like whatever to me. I like the dance tracks.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I think those are working better for me than like the sort of like tacked on at the end ballads that are there to make Die with a Smile make sense.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
How Bad Do You Want Me, which could, I mean, that in and of itself. Right? How Bad Do You Want Me?
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
So first of all, I don't want to, I'm not the first person to make this observation. I don't want to take credit. It was a widely sort of reported on thing by everybody who heard the song for the first time. But it's called How Bad Do You Want Me? And like, it stands out from the rest of the record because I think it's the only one that really sounds like it's trying to do contemporary pop.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
And contemporary pop, obviously, in many ways, is defined by Taylor Swift. So it sounds like Taylor Swift. And I've been trying to decode this.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
why because in some ways I think that's the craziest thing she does on this album like why did she go in and like make a Taylor Swift like in the midst of this whole album that's like about funk and 70s and then her own sort of like 90s and then her own kind of like history why all of a sudden is there just one random like Jack Antonoff ass song in the middle of this album like I don't understand so I've been like toying with this in my head a lot and I'm thinking like
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
My best explanation is, did she just do it to kind of prove that she could, kind of? Like, I have this recollection. Do you remember the song, not to bring this into the room, do you remember the song Do What You Want featuring R. Kelly?
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Yeah, it's a great song. Obviously not the R. Kelly part. She redid it with Christina Aguilera. Yes. And anyway, that was kind of like actually a really pivotal moment because that kind of derailed the art pop campaign and it never recovered. And in some ways her career kind of didn't for a while.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
But she talked about that song when she was promoting art pop and she said that she wrote that song because she just wanted to prove that she could write that kind of like electro R&B song. She just wanted to show that she could do it. And so I've had that in mind with the how bad do you want me Taylor thing.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Like I was like, maybe because like she's, this album makes very little concessions towards how contemporary mainstream pop sounds right now. Like this album doesn't sound like the radio. It doesn't sound like other stuff that's happening right now.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
No, it doesn't sound like Sabrina Carpenter. Right, exactly, exactly. So I thought maybe this was just kind of her one like wink, wink, like if I needed to, I could do this. I'm not gonna, but like just so y'all know, like here it is.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
I could if I wanted to. And she does, it is a good Taylor Swift song. I mean, it's like a well-made Taylor Swift song. And let's just say like she's had one thing that's been pegged to her lately is that she can't get to number one without a feature because like her last three number ones have been Shallow, Rain On Me with Ariana Grande, and Die With a Smile with Bruno Mars.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
He can't win an Oscar, but can get to number one with Lady Gaga. That's so fucking funny. Yeah. So she has had that kind of dogging her. And I'm like, listen, if she wants another number one off this album, she should call up Taylor and she could do a duet. And we know Taylor is a little monster because the song that played before she came on stage at the Heiress Tour was what? Applause.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Follow Pop Pantheon, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to podcasts. We're on social media, Pop Pantheon Pod on all different platforms. And I'm at DJLOUIEXIV on Twitter and Instagram.
Lemme Say This
Encore: Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 52
Thank you both so much. This was so fun.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
He has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangione.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
This assailant starts firing at him. And the suspect. He has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangione.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Oh, I'm so thrilled to be here. I'm on this earth to teach about the divas. That's why I was born. So I'm going to fulfill my life's purpose.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Oh, okay. Good. Everybody soak this up like a sponge. The history of the Germanadas. We're going to go back to Sicily.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I would say I identify mostly as a lover, but I would say like a lot of my audience probably thinks I'm more of a hater than I am and it bothers me, which is why I know that I'm a lover. Does that make sense?
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
And do I love women? Let me tell you, women are my number one.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Like as people, as pop stars, like I don't need the rest. Just give me the women. Yeah, no. I mean, I honestly do think even good criticism is an act of love.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Not to be too philosophical here, but I don't feel like if you come from a hatery perspective, you can actually, like, do good art criticism.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
lover lover like a truly seminal album for me i was 22 or so when that album came out i had just moved back to new york i was finishing school i thought i was super cool and cunty and slaying the game and i just started my d also associated with the beginning of my dj career so like i remember playing those songs as they blew up like in the little bars i was playing in the lower east side which is where she's from so it was a whole thing yeah you were really like like that you
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
in the room when it happened she's my she's my literally that she's chooky just like Hamilton that's why you don't you're okay listen she's really like the same age as me so we're like sort of we move in tandem I feel like you know we're like right around the same everything we hit all the same milestones yes right exactly okay lover hater born this way Lover, my number one favorite Gaga album.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Like the album where her like ambition met her like pop cultural zeitgeist and like everything happened perfectly. It's never been that good again, I would say.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Okay, so I've had an interesting journey with R-Pop. When R-Pop came out, that was kind of like a fissure point for me in my Lady Gaga journey. I just found it kind of ugly. But in retrospect, I see it as kind of like the last Imperial Gaga moment. And I appreciate it a lot more. I think it's two-thirds or so. I think Lindsay Zola, that's when the New York Times said this recently.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
It's like two-thirds or so misunderstood, one-third like true garbage. But like I miss that kind of like unbridled Gaga energy. Like I feel like we've never gotten like... unhemmed Gaga again. Like she's been a cautious creature since that moment because I think there was so much backlash to that album. But I see it as kind of like the end of the opening salvo of Gaga.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
So I have more love for it in retrospect than I did at the moment.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Pop girlies are spiritual to me. This is my church. Welcome to my sermon.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yeah, pink cowboy hat. That was her, I'm a singer-songwriter now. I'm stripping away artifice to give you the real me, which is a kind of...
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
raucous trope that I don't appreciate generally speaking I also think it was as much of a drag act as anything else that she's done before but it just like the songs aren't there like I just I don't I don't I think there's maybe two or three songs I would take from that record and she can keep the rest okay which two or three I'm curious
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I would say I've come to really enjoy the like sort of bizarre first single, Perfect Illusion. I like the sort of like kind of like barroom stompery song called Ayo. And I like the opening song, which is called Diamond Heart, which is kind of like Gaga in like Bruce Springsteen mode, which is another kind of good guys for her, I think.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
kind of like mid like I think Chromatica is like when I talk about Gaga being kind of like hemmed in I hear Chromatica it's like kind of return to dance floor after like Joanne which was like a detour for her but like missing some of the like chaotic craziness that like defines the best Gaga music like a little bit tame a little anodyne like not rough around the edges enough just sort of too pristine like kind of boring I think which brings us to hey lover hater mayhem
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I'm lover on mayhem. Oh, right. It's been since Born This Way that I have unabashedly had good feelings towards a Gaga album when it's come out. Yeah. And it feels good to be back.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yeah, 38-year-old gay men are, like, feeling their 22-year-old oats. Like, is that good or bad for society? I don't know. I'll let you guys be the judge of that. Wait, okay, so where are you guys at on mayhem?
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Okay. Before we got on, Peyton, I don't know if you heard this, but I was like, that is the most boomer ass like entree point to Gaga. Like, are you kidding me? That was the same exact moment that my parents were like, you know what? That Lady Gaga, she's got talent.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I'm sorry, I'm not trying to reveal your medical history.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Absolutely. Yes. Unfortunately that did happen and I did sift through both of those movies. Right. Right. I will say she's kind of the best part of both of those movies which isn't saying much.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I mean the Joker was really one of the worst movies I've ever seen in my life. Yes. But Okay, so here's how I would characterize it. I think Gaga had done a really effective job in the last half of the 2010s into the early 2020s of kind of moving above the fray of like pop star, qua pop star, like just kind of like singles game, having to have hits on the chart.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
She had a really spotty track record, but because of bringing boomers like yourself into the fold, she had done this thing where she was like, I'm bigger than that. I'm a movie star. I'm respected by rock lovers, parents... like me, I'm an Academy Award winner. And the Tony Bennett thing was a huge part of that too.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
She was like, I'm kind of old school, I'm an old school all around four quadrant entertainer. And I think her pop career had sort of gone a little, in my opinion, and other people will disagree, I think had kind of become secondary to her.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I think it had become this thing that she felt almost like compelled to return to because there's a huge group of core fans that like are still attached to 2008 through 2013 Lady Gaga when she was at her like peak zany kookiness. And that was huge for people, not just because the music was great and because that was a really exciting thing.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I mean, when she first blew up, like Hunter, I mean, you missed this train, but it was, she was a different person every single day. Like she walked out the house, she was like wearing a lobster on her head. Yeah.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yes. I mean, it was a really auspicious and exciting and singular pop star arrival. I can't think of a single other star's arrival in my personal lifetime that was that all-consuming and sort of crazy. Right out the gate, she just was huge. So you add that to the fact that she meant a lot to a lot of gay guys because Born This Way was this huge...
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
huge seminal album of a pop star really like expressing allyship and somewhat clunky but really really really like big you know bear hug ways from like a pop diva to their gay fans so there's a lot of core Gaga fans that are really attached to that era I don't think she's that attached to that era we could talk about Mayhem because it is kind of a return to that in some ways but
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
But I think she kind of moved on from that and became this kind of like grand dame, like, you know, multifaceted pop cultural figure who can do all this stuff. And then I think she would kind of every four years be like, oh shit, like the little monsters like need to get fed. Like you got to feed the little monsters.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Right. Yeah. And so she'd be like, I gotta throw like some bread and meat at them.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yeah, she's like tossing red meat at these like rabid F-words on the street. Okay, so... Sorry. So that's how I felt about her pop career for a long time. Like it just didn't... I just... I felt like she kind of lost the thread slightly and it was like sort of sad to me even though like I like songs from Joanne and Chromatica. Yeah. It just felt like her heart wasn't in it.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Coming into this album, I was trepidatious because I still think she's spread sort of thin. And I still think like, I don't quite get, I don't know if she gets like who she is as a pop star in this moment, like in that part of her career. So for me, there was trepidation and anxiety going into this era.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
And then when I heard Disease and Abracadabra, it was this mixture of like, oh, these are really good Lady Gaga songs, but I don't hear like an evolution. Like I hear somebody going back towards like what they did in.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
2009 2010 and like great great great pop stars in my estimation like Beyonce or Madonna don't do that usually like everything is about moving forward what's the next thing how do I like expand what I'm doing so I get I get shaky when I see stuff like that so that was where I was kind of like entering the album
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
She wanted to do everything except, like, put her whole pussy into a pop album. Am I allowed to say that? Yes. Like, I just felt like that was what she was like, oh, okay, like, let me leave, like, Tony Bennett and, like, House Labs and, like, my Oscar campaign to, like, all right, I'll throw it together, like, a little something here for them.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Not that she didn't try her, but I just didn't feel like she was inspired, I guess.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I think what I had to do was just, like, let go of, like, thinking of her in the trajectory of particularly, like, those two women who I think, who I kind of hold up as, like, Madonna and Beyonce. Yeah, it's, like, the gold standard of, like, what age... Like, not aging, because they're, like, whatever. Beyonce's, like, 42. But, like, in terms of, like, pop star aging. Like, escalating.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Being in this phase of your career where you're, like, past that zeitgeisty phase, but, like, you still need to, like, build out your career into something...
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
more dynamic more three-dimensional like how do you continue to expand and interest people like i hold them up in the specific way and madonna through most of her like first 25 years and beyonce to this day has never really like done a like return to form type of album she's never done like a let me go back to making crazy and love sounding songs again like she's it's always been like what's the next thing what's the next thing i have to say like how can i expand my artistry
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
And I think like what I've had to do with mayhem and what I think she's helped me do because it's just good. It's good. Gaga pastiche is just like, like Gaga is just not that type of artist. Like it's just, she's a different thing.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Like it's a, I think I've had to just understand, like I've had to almost cleave her from that sort of well-worn track and sort of think of her differently because I agree with you Hunter. It's like, these are not to like beat this dead horse, but these are reheated nachos in a way, but they are spectacular. They're gourmet. They're like Jean Jordan. Yeah.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yes, I loved 5'2". I mean, she also really struggled physically, we should say.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
That was crazy. I mean, like, thinking about what she had to go through. I mean, she's a really gritty performer. Like, this is somebody that, like, I mean, she will.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Pain. I mean, I barely can walk after I go to, like, one CrossFit for, like, a month. No, but I'm just saying, like, she really works that. Like, she's where she is for a reason. Talent and, like, really hard worker.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. No sleep. I hope she's sleeping now because she's almost 40.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Killer to me is like, okay, so what I like about Mayhem a lot is that beyond just sort of going and re-indexing her own work, which I do think this is doing very well, it's also re-indexing her influences. Like, I think she's going back to what she, what formed her musical identity. Yeah. So I hear a lot of Prince on this album. I hear a lot of David Bowie on this album.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I hear Michael Jackson on Shadow of a Man. I hear, you know, Blondie. I hear Nine Inch Nails on Perfect Celebrity. Oh, yes. Wait, I heard that too.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yes, exactly. Exactly. So I think that that's a helpful angle that helps it get past just being like pure Gaga pastiche. Mm-hmm. So that's how I'm thinking about it. So Killa to me is like one of the most, like the songs I least feel like links directly back to old Gaga songs. Like I hear that song and I'm not able to draw one to one like I am with some of the other songs.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I'm like, oh, this is that and that and that. It sounds like Bowie. It sounds like Prince. It's got kind of that wild abandoned, like let's just try something sort of crazy feeling that I really missed from Gaga songs. It's kooky. It's weird. Some of the lyrics are like evidently silly, but I just think like it's so much fun. And like that's the kind of energy I'm looking for in a Gaga song.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
So that's a definite standout for me. I also love Zombie Boy, the song that comes after it, which is kind of becoming a little viral on TikTok right now. It's like a sort of disco. It's definitely Bowie. It's definitely a little bit Debbie Harry. It's also kind of got that like kooky Halloween core thing that was a core Gaga, early Gaga thing. Like Bad Romance, like kind of a Halloween classic.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
sort of generally a halloween classic so it's got kind of like fun campy like you know monster mash come disco vibes that i really appreciate love that song i like perfect celebrity which is a reheaty nacho kind of song in the sense that like gaga doing like fame commentary was like how she came up like that was her whole thing is like i'm doing you know i'm both becoming a pop star and i'm commentating on becoming a pop star which this song is also doing but it's funny it's lighthearted and it's just hits like it just it sounds so good
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
It's got that loud, soft, loud dynamic that you can hear in Smells Like Teen Spirit or something like that, where the verses are quiet and then the hook is just extremely loud and hits you over the head. And that's a really effective pop songwriting technique.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
so that's a great one and i also really love garden of eden which is a willfully sort of like tinny sounding song that references like her earliest work like if you go back and listen to the fame production's not like that ornate or like full because she just didn't have the resources yet she didn't have the digital dolby sound whatever like it sounds demo-y and i sort of think that that's a really fun kind of callback to her earliest music so those four i i really like i think that forms like the
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
What I like less is like Blade of Grass, which is like the sort of ballad at the end of it that's like a sweet song about like apparently her fiance proposing to her with a blade of grass from their backyard. I just don't think it's like that sturdy of a ballad for her. The Beast is kind of like whatever to me. I like the dance tracks.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I think those are working better for me than like the sort of like tacked on at the end ballads that are there to make Die with a Smile make sense.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
How Bad Do You Want Me, which could, I mean, that in and of itself. Right? How Bad Do You Want Me?
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
So first of all, I don't want to, I'm not the first person to make this observation. I don't want to take credit. It was a widely sort of reported on thing by everybody who heard the song for the first time. But it's called How Bad Do You Want Me? And like, it stands out from the rest of the record because I think it's the only one that really sounds like it's trying to do contemporary pop.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
And contemporary pop, obviously, in many ways, is defined by Taylor Swift. So it sounds like Taylor Swift. And I've been trying to decode this.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
why because in some ways I think that's the craziest thing she does on this album like why did she go in and like make a Taylor Swift like in the midst of this whole album that's like about funk and 70s and then her own sort of like 90s and then her own kind of like history why all of a sudden is there just one random like Jack Antonoff ass song in the middle of this album like I don't understand so I've been like toying with this in my head a lot and I'm thinking like
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
My best explanation is, did she just do it to kind of prove that she could, kind of? Like, I have this recollection. Do you remember the song, not to bring this into the room, do you remember the song, Do What You Want, featuring R. Kelly?
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Yeah, it's a great song. Obviously not the R. Kelly part. She redid it with Christina Aguilera. Yes. And anyway, that was kind of like actually a really pivotal moment because that kind of derailed the art pop campaign and it never recovered. And in some ways her career kind of didn't for a while.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
But she talked about that song when she was promoting art pop and she said that she wrote that song because she just wanted to prove that she could write that kind of like electro R&B song. She just wanted to show that she could do it. And so I've had that in mind with the how bad do you want me Taylor thing.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Like I was like, maybe because like she's, this album makes very little concessions towards how contemporary mainstream pop sounds right now. Like this album doesn't sound like the radio. It doesn't sound like other stuff that's happening right now.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
No, it doesn't sound like Sabrina Carpenter. Right, exactly, exactly. So I thought maybe this was just kind of her one like wink, wink, like if I needed to, I could do this. I'm not gonna, but like just so y'all know, like here it is.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
I could if I wanted to. And she does, it is a good Taylor Swift song. I mean, it's like a well-made Taylor Swift song. And let's just say like she's had one thing that's been pegged to her lately is that she can't get to number one without a feature because like her last three number ones have been Shallow, Rain On Me with Ariana Grande, and Die With a Smile with Bruno Mars.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
He can't win an Oscar, but can get to number one with Lady Gaga. That's so fucking funny. Yeah. So she has had that kind of dogging her. And I'm like, listen, if she wants another number one off this album, she should call up Taylor and she could do a duet. And we know Taylor is a little monster because the song that played before she came on stage at the Heiress Tour was what? Applause.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
Follow Pop Pantheon, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you listen to podcasts. We're on social media, Pop Pantheon Pod on all different platforms. And I'm at DJLOUIEXIV on Twitter and Instagram.
Lemme Say This
Causing Mayhem (with DJ Louie XIV) | 46
This assailant starts firing at him. And the suspect. He has been identified as Luigi Nicholas Mangione.