Brittani Ard
Appearances
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And we were releasing every week. And so we didn't have a subscription. We didn't have like a way to binge or sort of do any of that, which I didn't understand any anyways. So I wouldn't have. But we're releasing every week. The end of June, so after four episodes had been released, Apple put us in the carousel.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
um the new and noteworthy and then you guys were like the top like banner on the yeah you were in the carousel at the same time because i like that's right that's what i want to add my creators we love and so we were both there but then they put me at the front so when you opened your apple app It was, you know, and it's my eyeballs, right?
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
It's just my eyeballs like deadpan as people still can't decide if they like the eyeballs or not, like if it's creepy or anyways.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And we struggle. And honestly, cover art is a huge thing. Like, our title and the cover art and the fact that we got put there, we were getting, like, what? Like, 20,000. I think we were at, like, 20,000, 30,000 downloads before we went to Apple.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
But I also had paid and had some promos and other people's- So you did a little bit of paid marketing when you launched?
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I didn't do a ton because by the end, I was out of money. But once we were in that Apple carousel at the top, July, I cannot even explain what happened in July because two weeks after that- I hit number one on Apple podcast. Like I and I remember watching over like two days as like we hit the charts. And then we started going up. And then I was like, we're still going.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And then I passed like Jon Stewart and The Daily Show. And then I passed Joe Rogan. And I'm like, wow. What the fuck is happening? And the funny Delulu part for me is that I didn't know that that was weird. I was shocked, but I was also like, oh, this is really cool. And everybody's like, who? What is, like, who are you?
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Four weeks in, we didn't have a full season out. Like we were still releasing every week and our reviews were not amazing. Everybody either loves it or they hates it. So we're right at like just under four stars, but it's either this is the best podcast I've ever heard or what is this trash? This is not true crime.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And it's, I mean, and it's, we have stayed in that same review spot this whole time.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And, but I also was not, I've never put out anything that people were able to review.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And people are reviewing my life. Yeah. And so some of them, some of the reviews are hilarious. Like, what is this person droning on about?
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Yes. All of them. Five stars. But I was like, I want to hit a million by my birthday, which was a week after episode eight would have released. So the whole season would be out. And I was like, no, let's hit a million by my birthday, which is eight and a half weeks after we launched the podcast. And again, delulu. I didn't even know that it wasn't a... Nobody would have done that.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
What ended up happening... that we don't understand is we almost hit 3 million in eight weeks. It became very quickly like a big story in the industry, your show. And nobody could explain it to me and I didn't understand. Right. And I still – it wasn't actually until like a month ago because I got this list of other people's podcasts that I can go guest on.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And they have like how many downloads and they usually get on an episode. And I'm looking at some of these kind of big podcasts and I'm like – Oh, yeah.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
There are some of these that I'm like, that's an amazing show. And they're getting 10,000 downloads an episode. And I'm like, I right now I have 950,000 downloads on app one. Which is, I mean, I'm going to hit a million on that first episode. And I really still don't fully understand. But because everything happened so fast, we didn't have ads in right away. They weren't host read ads.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
So, you know, it's all the span ads and everything. There was a lot of money left on the table in July. And because it blew up, it's like, oh, we need to keep the feed going. Like, you can't let the feed... Because I'm like, okay, I guess I'll do a second season. We'll keep it going, you know. And... The problem with that is that that is expensive.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I wasn't planning on this becoming my full-time job unless it really sort of did what it did, which... I wasn't financially prepared for. Two, like I had enough money to make season one work, but that's it. There's no reserves. And everybody is like, you have to keep your feed going, which is when I started getting offers from networks. And I had three offers from three different networks.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Every single offer was enough money to cover production. And that's it. And I lost a lot of freedom. And they wanted it to be a weekly series. And I didn't know that the quality would be the same if I switched it to that sort of churning out a weekly series. Because mine's storytelling. It's very different than an interview situation.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Yeah. And I didn't want to turn it into a chat show. And so then it's like, okay, I'm not. going to do this. I'm not going to keep doing this because I'm not going to work my ass off, not get paid. And I didn't know how to negotiate with the networks. I hired an agent that only made money if I went with specific networks.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And one of the things that there was one network that offered me a ton of money, would have paid for production and doubled like an income for me. And they had a thing in their contract that I almost missed because I don't know shit. And it was based on 3 million downloads a month. Yeah. And so I sent back and I was like, hey, these aren't my numbers every month.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
This happened and I hit that, but I don't know that I can hit that. I need a real... minimum guarantee on what my numbers actually are.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And I was supposed to release second season the end of October. Like I had a release date for second season and was literally like scrounging money trying to figure out how to keep it going because everybody was like, you have to, you just have to keep going. And I had talked to my production company and it was sort of like, let's figure out how to make second season
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And then third season, I'll do freelance, you know, and learn it. But I was trying to keep my feed going while I'm trying to figure out how to do self-production.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And my topics are intense. I don't want a random person in the room with me. I need to have some sort of relationship so that I feel comfortable sharing. I will come in and talk on a microphone for an hour and a half. It turns into a 30-minute episode. That is edited by somebody that is very thoughtful and is in my head about how I want to share the story. I can't just go.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
But ours is because it's storytelling and it's not just the editing and interview. Like Sydney is in my brain. I mean, which I tell her all the time is this, like, it's scary for me and I've been here for a long time, but she came in and like got me. Yeah, it's a real art. It was huge to the success of the show.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Theoretically, I was originally gonna do like a DIY sort of thing. Like I'll just record this. I can learn it and hire, have the production company do the sound engineering and sort of the, some of the stuff that I didn't want to learn, but you know, I can get a microphone and figure out how to get the audio That was my original plan.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Because she really told it in a way that was authentically me and I could keep it going.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
With Sid's help. And so what ended up happening in October is I was like, we're not releasing second season. I just can't afford it. I'm going to go independent now. It was like, okay, I guess I'm going to start a production company.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Which thankfully, I do have other businesses and I have done that before. So that side of it, the business side of it has never been the scary side for me. Like I can start an LLC. I can do all of that. I know how to, I built my own website. Like I can do all the backend, thankfully, but started BDE, Unlimited Productions, which there are 10 or 11 different
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
things that BDE stands for, you guys can let me know what you think it is. It is exactly what you think it is. But even getting the studio set up and then bringing Sid on as my producer, she's independent. So if anybody else wants Sid, we, you know, we can do that.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And if she has time, I keep her kind of busy right now.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I'm trying. I want BD to, you know, produce them. So it's sort of like, okay, let's... And that is the other thing is finding other revenue sources. But started the company and pushed back the release, signed with True Story, which is, it felt so calming. because it didn't feel like this pariah of, I'm selling my soul to share my story. And that really is what it ended up being.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And I think there's so many people, these network people, they came from the music industry You know, I have a lot of friends that are in that industry that get kind of raked over the coals in that industry. And it's that same model that they're doing to podcasters. And podcasts are huge now. I mean, the ad sales and the revenue, it is...
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
It's huge. And there's so much like you need it. And it's for me to even talk to you, someone that has been doing it for a few years more, like that knowledge is invaluable. And to have somebody that's willing to share, but that's how people get their podcasts is across promotions.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And then once I met with them and we sort of went through, like, here's what the cost would be to get a season and how long it would take to sort of recover that cost, you know, if the show gets monetized with ads and stuff. But even when I first went in, I didn't understand any of that part of it.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Because it only grows the podcast, which only grows the network.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I send him emails all the time. And my subject line is always like new girl question.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And his contract is two pages. Yeah. And it's essentially that is all taking up like this is your company name. This is my company name.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Whereas some of the network deals.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
So onerous. Insane. I think that we went through like five or six rounds of negotiations on that and it didn't get better. It was getting worse every single time. And the lawyers are lawyering.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
So I would say that I had some delusions about how it worked and in probably a good way because I was like, okay, I'm going to do this. And I ended up going with the production company and having them do the majority of everything. I did have a lot, I would say a lot of input in some of the storyline stuff, like the I wanted it to be a certain way.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
With all that. But it also adds another cost.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
More people. And in our case, a lot of our stuff can't be video because a lot of my guests are anonymous. Yeah. Or, you know, other people that are telling their story are anonymous in certain ways. But when we can add video, that's just another thing to learn. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. in any way.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
it is very very appreciated and that's how especially independent shows we don't have a company that's fronting the cost for our shows this isn't like we have to make it work some car company that is doing a podcast that is essentially an ad yeah right it's that is a big ad for that company but yeah
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And so they allowed me to, you know, work with them on sort of the meat of it because I didn't want it to just be this show about a bad boyfriend. You know, I really wanted it to have a heartbeat and some depth. So You know, decided to have them do the full production, which is very expensive.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, in the beginning, it was super fun because we had like 10 reviews and we had five stars. And I was like, oh, we're doing such a good job. And I think we have like...
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
couple thousand reviews you know and it is so there's apple and those reviews people rate and review and as creators we don't get to respond you know they just put it up whatever they're thinking in the moment which as a creator i'm putting out whatever i'm thinking in the moment so right that's the deal you make i mean it's definitely like you're putting art into the world like you like that's kind of my ethos is like well like what people think about it is like
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And at the end of every one of my episodes, and I know yours, we say, please rate and review us. We understand. I will say that there are some people that are a little overly harsh, especially personal stuff. So I stopped looking at Apple reviews because it's just so wild all over the place.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And I'm like, I just there were a few people that made some comments about my sister and how my family handled, you know, the case after she was killed. And just for anyone that was paying attention, this December at the New Year's Eve is the 20th anniversary of her death. So my sister passed 20 years ago. This isn't a case that is ongoing.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
You know, it isn't a case that we could even reopen at this point. But so that's an entirely different, like we did our best with what happened, but people were mean on the reviews, some of them. And then we had amazing reviews and I had opened up on my website. I have a, you know, connect with me directly and all through July,
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
So many emails and messages of people that were so supportive and also felt comfortable and wanted to share their story. And that's really how this season two has developed. And so that part is wonderful. Spotify, I love Spotify. the comments on episodes because somebody can leave a comment, I can leave one reply, and then that's it. It's like internet gold.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And to the snarky ones, I usually am politely aggressive. if they were aggressive to start, which a lot of it is like, I hope you find something that you do enjoy listening to. There are so many options. One comment, one guy, my favorite one, he was like, I hate this show. I cannot figure out how to get it out of my playlist and all these like big long review.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And I was like, imagine taking the time to leave this comment instead of learning how to use your app. Yeah.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Unfollow the show. It's really not that complicated. So those ones drive me crazy. I did get in a Reddit rabbit hole. And I avoided it for a little bit. And then a couple people were saying things that were just wild assumptions that really sort of pissed me off. Like, I don't mind if people don't like me. I don't like misinformation that's based on assumptions.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I self-financed, which it will be years before I actually get into the black as far as like paying myself back for the first season while trying to keep production up on the second, which is why we took production in-house. And I started my own production company because it just isn't sustainable.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
You listen to a couple hours of my life, you don't know the whole story. You don't know me. I'm a high school dropout. I dropped out my sophomore year of high school. Everything that I have done has been literally built from zero dollars. My family moved here with zero dollars. in their stuff in their car and built everything. And I'm not saying that I don't live a lovely life now.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I built it and I have earned every fucking dollar. So my story isn't, there are millions and millions of stories that are so much worse in so many horrific ways. Share your story because somebody relates to you too.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, and one person, the review said, it sounds like this person is just telling their story, talking about themselves.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Actually the name of the show.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
like it's meant to be like what was your first clue my face on the cover or like i was thinking about i'm like isn't that what most podcasts are this is something that is in this genre you know like this is something that is interesting to me and i want to share it do you find it interesting then listen and that's that's it and so um i will say that
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Getting into this side of the world, I had the best entrance because it blew up, because it went viral. And so, yeah. You know, for it, which is why in season two, I'm sharing other people's stories because it is a big lift. And so it's like here I I can I do have a space now for other people to share their stories. And I I want to be able to continue that.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
It's originally it was really overwhelming. It was amazing because I was getting messages of support and I, you know, related to this or I related to that or this made me feel a certain way about something else in their life. So and that's really why I told my story. So it was amazing. But then to read through hundreds and hundreds of these messages, especially when
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Season one was being released because I was new to this and my story got harder and harder as the episodes went out. And so I'm processing myself, you know, what's happening. I talk to my therapist a lot about how I talk to listeners because I'm not a therapist. I cannot provide therapy. resources myself. I can be a space to share with.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
You know, I can provide links and places where people can get resources. And so I love hearing the stories, but I can't fix the problems. I can just create a space where people can connect. And, and, and that's, it's, but it's really hard because I, um, I do video calls, um, 25 minute video calls with listeners.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Um, and it's, it's a lot, but I set it up so that I'm like a couple of days a week, I have a couple hours, you know, that I will do this. And, um, Very specific. I said and I had a long conversation about it, too, because I was like, you need to be in therapy because I'm I'm doing this, but she's editing this. I mean, she's going through and like, oh, here's. Here's how this goes.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
It is a lot because it is this is it's heavy stuff. And I think it's really important to get it out there. And I, you know, until Sid and I don't whatever. Do you think I'll ever run out of something to say? Because I don't know. I always think I will. And then I and then I keep talking. But, you know, it's worth it to me. I think that you are moving the needle around.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
on awareness in an abuse that is, as you said, grossly under reported and prosecuted. And it's just, it's not out there. And So it's hard and it's expensive, but I think it's worth it. And I think that there's so much power in this medium.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And it's scary. And I don't want anyone listening to be like, oh, my God, I don't want it. I don't want to jump into this. It sounds like so much.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
In season two, we cover all sorts of different topics. We're not sticking with just dating or grief. We have domestic violence, sexual abuse,
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
um just regular old divorce life we span all topics and i'm excited to keep that going um i am working on turning this into a memoir so that there's more depth around season one and season two stories and you know a sunday dinner cookbook i'm super excited about but yeah and then we're gonna just see what happens and season five is
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, I doubt that. I don't know that there's anything that will keep either of us out of trouble. True. But I think we can handle it. Yeah. I think we have a good handle on the trouble.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Are your, do you swear on your show? I'm trying to, I don't think I've ever heard that you swear.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, I haven't met your dad yet, but I want him to like me. So here's what I'll say. He's lovely. So what I'll say is that every day I give less Fs about
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
how other people think you can say fuck on my it's okay like you can swear on my show yeah i don't edit i want your dad to like my dad will still like because my dad loves you so your dad's adorable um but yeah like i i give less fucks about how people want me to tell my story yeah and so i'm gonna just keep telling it's a liberating era and then it's like if you don't want to listen don't listen yeah
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Thank you so much for coming to my studio.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And if I come and you're just in here recording, you know, it's fine.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, and you don't have to get into details, but the deal would not have covered the cost of production.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And storytelling, I mean, it's not just one episode. This is, you know, a whole season like you do with a case. It's the whole season is one case. That's a big story.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
You do way more reading. I do zero reading. Yeah.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Well, and there's even a, like Mike Weber, what they do there is phenomenal how they handle these sorts of situations. And you just don't see that in hospitals around the country. Right, right. I mean, their program is, it isn't that there are more cases where he's at. Yeah, of course. It's that they do a better job recognizing it. And so it's, you know, to spread that even is huge.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
And respectful. I mean, that's one of my favorite things about your show is that you feel like you're a part of the story and it doesn't feel like you're just invasive in it, if that makes sense. Yeah, thank you. It's a powerful thing that you can do both, you know, and do it in such a way that it doesn't seem like you're just trying to, you know, pounce. Yeah.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
Right. You have to, I mean, essentially manifest that.
Nobody Should Believe Me
Case Files 12: Talking Shop with Brittani Ard
I mean, essentially it was my savings. So I had a savings and I was like, okay, I'm going to full send this and see... Because if I was going to do it, I wanted to do it right. I wanted the production to be well. I didn't want to be in my closet recording it. And so it's like, okay, if I'm going to do this, let's try. But I had enough money for a season, essentially. So we released...