Ben Lamm

Yes. Humans had some impact on it. Right. I think that that even more people agree that there was this massive flood that occurred and that was a could have been a global level flood. with rushing waters and sea rising whatnot. And then you've got, you know, what caused that flood, most likely meteorological, you know, astrological or meteorological.

Yes. Humans had some impact on it. Right. I think that that even more people agree that there was this massive flood that occurred and that was a could have been a global level flood. with rushing waters and sea rising whatnot. And then you've got, you know, what caused that flood, most likely meteorological, you know, astrological or meteorological.

Yeah, which only exists when you have certain levels of heat at certain impacts. It's like that... It's like that nuclear glass or whatever they call it.

Yeah, which only exists when you have certain levels of heat at certain impacts. It's like that... It's like that nuclear glass or whatever they call it.

But you remember like probably 10, 20 years ago, people, if you brought up the idea of a worldwide flood, they would just be like, oh, you're a fundamentalist Christian. Can't talk to you ever again.

But you remember like probably 10, 20 years ago, people, if you brought up the idea of a worldwide flood, they would just be like, oh, you're a fundamentalist Christian. Can't talk to you ever again.

Water canopy, you're weird. Don't talk to me again. I know. And now it's like, well, maybe there was a giant flood. Maybe it wasn't just a regional flood, right? Maybe it was done by impacts of comets, right?

Water canopy, you're weird. Don't talk to me again. I know. And now it's like, well, maybe there was a giant flood. Maybe it wasn't just a regional flood, right? Maybe it was done by impacts of comets, right?

vehicles yeah what was ezekiel talking about in the bible have you seen that stuff when have you seen those videos in the last um that have come out in the last year when there was the the most recent uap um uh craze and they'd show it and it looked like crazy ball lightning it almost looked like those things that used to put your you'd put your hands on your head stand up right and then they compare some of those to paintings uh from like you know from like

vehicles yeah what was ezekiel talking about in the bible have you seen that stuff when have you seen those videos in the last um that have come out in the last year when there was the the most recent uap um uh craze and they'd show it and it looked like crazy ball lightning it almost looked like those things that used to put your you'd put your hands on your head stand up right and then they compare some of those to paintings uh from like you know from like

500, 700 years ago.

500, 700 years ago.

Because you're looking through the atmosphere. I've always seen this stuff on the Internet. Until I was in Wellington, New Zealand, when I was with Peter. Peter, his house in Wellington is, like, on a body of water, the ones I wear. And we were talking, of course, like, the conversation went to ghosts and UFOs because, like, why not? Oh, you've seen them in your time?

Because you're looking through the atmosphere. I've always seen this stuff on the Internet. Until I was in Wellington, New Zealand, when I was with Peter. Peter, his house in Wellington is, like, on a body of water, the ones I wear. And we were talking, of course, like, the conversation went to ghosts and UFOs because, like, why not? Oh, you've seen them in your time?

We did a partnership with him. We actually made the largest investment in marsupial research, more than the Australian government. We made the largest investment in research for marsupial development of anyone. So we do this and then you get into the myth of it. Right. So you start reading it. Right. You start reading.

We did a partnership with him. We actually made the largest investment in marsupial research, more than the Australian government. We made the largest investment in research for marsupial development of anyone. So we do this and then you get into the myth of it. Right. So you start reading it. Right. You start reading.

No, I haven't seen them in person. I've seen them on his iPhone. This wasn't, like, a telescopic lens. This is an iPhone, and it looks exactly like what you see, I guess, on the Zoom ends.

No, I haven't seen them in person. I've seen them on his iPhone. This wasn't, like, a telescopic lens. This is an iPhone, and it looks exactly like what you see, I guess, on the Zoom ends.

So I'll see if Peter will give me his. I'm sure he would. And I'll send it to you because it's just weird to see. Oh, they're weird.

So I'll see if Peter will give me his. I'm sure he would. And I'll send it to you because it's just weird to see. Oh, they're weird.

But this was like not zoomed in. His wife's next to him. And it's just weird stuff.

But this was like not zoomed in. His wife's next to him. And it's just weird stuff.

That's all their, like... zero-point energy and moving and in gravitational wave type stuff. Do you go deep on this? I get bored.

That's all their, like... zero-point energy and moving and in gravitational wave type stuff. Do you go deep on this? I get bored.

I start reading all the books on the diocese and I want to be obsessive about projects. And so I'm pretty obsessed about extinction right now. And so got super deep in it. And then I started calling Pascal's like, hey, I've been watching these YouTube videos and I kind of think they're still there. And Pascal's like, no, no, stop it. Don't go down that rabbit hole. So I don't believe.

I start reading all the books on the diocese and I want to be obsessive about projects. And so I'm pretty obsessed about extinction right now. And so got super deep in it. And then I started calling Pascal's like, hey, I've been watching these YouTube videos and I kind of think they're still there. And Pascal's like, no, no, stop it. Don't go down that rabbit hole. So I don't believe.

I did a call with Hal. I got into that crowd for a while before I started Colossal, and I knew a bunch of those folks. So I talked to Lou. I talked to Hal. I did a Zoom with Hal.

I did a call with Hal. I got into that crowd for a while before I started Colossal, and I knew a bunch of those folks. So I talked to Lou. I talked to Hal. I did a Zoom with Hal.

And we have dire wolves today in 2025.

And we have dire wolves today in 2025.

Yeah. And if you look at the exponential rate of our technology curve, it's not that far.

Yeah. And if you look at the exponential rate of our technology curve, it's not that far.

I wouldn't say it's monkeying. It's a little monkey around. The selective precision genome engineering.

I wouldn't say it's monkeying. It's a little monkey around. The selective precision genome engineering.

I told you one edit makes 5,000, you know, confers 5,000 resistance to neurotoxins. So it's like a couple little edits here does a lot.

I told you one edit makes 5,000, you know, confers 5,000 resistance to neurotoxins. So it's like a couple little edits here does a lot.

I read that theory, too.

I read that theory, too.

I go down those rabbit holes because, I mean, I just think, once again, going back to the stuff of Kuku-Kan and Anunnaki and all this stuff.

I go down those rabbit holes because, I mean, I just think, once again, going back to the stuff of Kuku-Kan and Anunnaki and all this stuff.

It's just so... Strange yeah, and how and how you have certain things that are aligned as celestial they and you're like yeah But they could have picked a lot of constellations Yeah, why do they all pick the Pleiades or whatever it is right like right?

It's just so... Strange yeah, and how and how you have certain things that are aligned as celestial they and you're like yeah But they could have picked a lot of constellations Yeah, why do they all pick the Pleiades or whatever it is right like right?

Insanely detailed.

Insanely detailed.

Yeah. And also be able to predict well enough of where it was going, knowing that we were moving through space.

Yeah. And also be able to predict well enough of where it was going, knowing that we were moving through space.

Yeah, there's weird – the cool thing about this, but take a step back. Even though a lot of times people like Graham Hancock and others are ridiculed about it, and we get ridiculed even for the actual science that we're doing and proving every day, at the end of the day, it is still cool, and it's interesting. I don't want to live in a society or a universe where everything's figured out.

Yeah, there's weird – the cool thing about this, but take a step back. Even though a lot of times people like Graham Hancock and others are ridiculed about it, and we get ridiculed even for the actual science that we're doing and proving every day, at the end of the day, it is still cool, and it's interesting. I don't want to live in a society or a universe where everything's figured out.

Every day is amazing, and we're figuring out amazing things.

Every day is amazing, and we're figuring out amazing things.

Well, because he's been testing for the last 15 years all over Tasmania, right? So not just southern Australia, but all over Tasmania. So samples, poop, stuff like that. Samples, just everything, using camera traps. I think they officially say that the thylacine went extinct in 1936. But probably into the late 40s and early 50s, they still existed.

Well, because he's been testing for the last 15 years all over Tasmania, right? So not just southern Australia, but all over Tasmania. So samples, poop, stuff like that. Samples, just everything, using camera traps. I think they officially say that the thylacine went extinct in 1936. But probably into the late 40s and early 50s, they still existed.

It is great.

It is great.

I think that's why so many people subscribe to your podcast is because one minute you'll talk to a comedian and a UFC fighter, and the next time you're talking to someone that knows more about the ancient flood than anyone in the world.

I think that's why so many people subscribe to your podcast is because one minute you'll talk to a comedian and a UFC fighter, and the next time you're talking to someone that knows more about the ancient flood than anyone in the world.

Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you.

But, I mean, I think it's very unlikely that one still exists. It would make our lives a lot easier. Forrest really believes in it. He does. He thinks they're in Papua New Guinea.

But, I mean, I think it's very unlikely that one still exists. It would make our lives a lot easier. Forrest really believes in it. He does. He thinks they're in Papua New Guinea.

Yeah. He thinks in the western part of Papua New Guinea in the mountains.

Yeah. He thinks in the western part of Papua New Guinea in the mountains.

Yeah, yeah. Very difficult. And the separation of that topography separates the Papua New Guinea singing dogs, which could be competitive for them for predator prey, from where the Thylacine sightings were.

Yeah, yeah. Very difficult. And the separation of that topography separates the Papua New Guinea singing dogs, which could be competitive for them for predator prey, from where the Thylacine sightings were.

It's just another large canid that has a unique howl. Oh, wow. What does it sound like? I'm sure Jamie can find a video.

It's just another large canid that has a unique howl. Oh, wow. What does it sound like? I'm sure Jamie can find a video.

Papua New Guinea singing dogs.

Papua New Guinea singing dogs.

In that process, he's like, you know, I've also been working on mammoths and other things. I was like, wait, wait, what? And I was like, if you had one project, is it this mammoth project?

In that process, he's like, you know, I've also been working on mammoths and other things. I was like, wait, wait, what? And I was like, if you had one project, is it this mammoth project?

Yeah, that looks like a dog dog.

Yeah, that looks like a dog dog.

They're wild dogs in Papua New Guinea, but I'm sure people have domesticated them.

They're wild dogs in Papua New Guinea, but I'm sure people have domesticated them.

And hanging out with a fox. So once you have enough of that DNA, right, from all these different samples, and you can assemble it, you then have to build comparative genomic models to its closest living relatives, in the case of the mammoth, the Asian elephant. But I'm from software. So I just assume there's like the, you know, Google cloud of DNA.

And hanging out with a fox. So once you have enough of that DNA, right, from all these different samples, and you can assemble it, you then have to build comparative genomic models to its closest living relatives, in the case of the mammoth, the Asian elephant. But I'm from software. So I just assume there's like the, you know, Google cloud of DNA.

Like we backed up like we've all done 23andMe before went bankrupt. Right. So we should assume that I assume that the government or someone backed up and had kind of like the 23andMe of all species.

Like we backed up like we've all done 23andMe before went bankrupt. Right. So we should assume that I assume that the government or someone backed up and had kind of like the 23andMe of all species.

That doesn't exist.

That doesn't exist.

Which is insane. So there's like there's no back. There's no like Noah's Ark bio vault for life, like kind of like the seed vaults that doesn't exist. And so we're actually petitioning the U.S. government to help put a massive project together to help biobank. It's starting with just American megafauna and keystone species. So that doesn't exist at all.

Which is insane. So there's like there's no back. There's no like Noah's Ark bio vault for life, like kind of like the seed vaults that doesn't exist. And so we're actually petitioning the U.S. government to help put a massive project together to help biobank. It's starting with just American megafauna and keystone species. So that doesn't exist at all.

And so then Colossal had to go out and go build reference genomes for all the species, like the closest living relatives for all the species that we're working on.

And so then Colossal had to go out and go build reference genomes for all the species, like the closest living relatives for all the species that we're working on.

And then he went down this whole path about how he'd bring back mammoths, reintroduce them in the Arctic, help the ecosystem, use those technologies for conservation, use those technologies for human health care. And I kind of thought it was a fucking joke. I literally thought that like the smartest man I've ever met and been on the phone with. It was a joke.

And then he went down this whole path about how he'd bring back mammoths, reintroduce them in the Arctic, help the ecosystem, use those technologies for conservation, use those technologies for human health care. And I kind of thought it was a fucking joke. I literally thought that like the smartest man I've ever met and been on the phone with. It was a joke.

How do you create? That's synthetic biology. So you never have to get to 100%, right? You need to get to probably. Synthetic biology. Synthetic biology. Synthetic biology. That's where you are using all of these different genetic tools. Probably you've heard of CRISPR, all these other things, genetics, you know, which is, it knocks out, it breaks the DNA. It's not always the best tool.

How do you create? That's synthetic biology. So you never have to get to 100%, right? You need to get to probably. Synthetic biology. Synthetic biology. Synthetic biology. That's where you are using all of these different genetic tools. Probably you've heard of CRISPR, all these other things, genetics, you know, which is, it knocks out, it breaks the DNA. It's not always the best tool.

We can now actually make individual edits to, when you think of the DNA double, you know, helix, right, in those rungs of the ladder, those individuals are called nucleotides. We can change the letters. Like, that's how precise we can be. We can say at spot, you know, 4,000,008, I need to change that letter. Right. And so you change that letter.

We can now actually make individual edits to, when you think of the DNA double, you know, helix, right, in those rungs of the ladder, those individuals are called nucleotides. We can change the letters. Like, that's how precise we can be. We can say at spot, you know, 4,000,008, I need to change that letter. Right. And so you change that letter.

And then other times you actually synthesize big blocks of DNA. So when you notice that in the mammoth and in the Asian elephant, there's a difference. And if it's in these certain like protein coding regions in all these different regions of the genome that drive phenotypes or physical like attributes, like, you know.

And then other times you actually synthesize big blocks of DNA. So when you notice that in the mammoth and in the Asian elephant, there's a difference. And if it's in these certain like protein coding regions in all these different regions of the genome that drive phenotypes or physical like attributes, like, you know.

curved tusk, dome cranium, small ears, the subcutaneous fat layer, and, and then hair and coat color, you can actually then engineer that into the Asian elephant, right? Because you're only looking, you're only really looking at that point 4% difference, right? It's a lot of numbers, but you're only looking at that.

curved tusk, dome cranium, small ears, the subcutaneous fat layer, and, and then hair and coat color, you can actually then engineer that into the Asian elephant, right? Because you're only looking, you're only really looking at that point 4% difference, right? It's a lot of numbers, but you're only looking at that.

And so the better you can be at software, and the better you can be using AI and the computer models, the less edits you have to make, right? Because you're really just trying to target those core phenotypes.

And so the better you can be at software, and the better you can be using AI and the computer models, the less edits you have to make, right? Because you're really just trying to target those core phenotypes.

So mammoths were about the same size. They're a little bit bigger than Asian elephants, a little bit smaller than African elephants. So there were 11, you know, everyone argues over the definition of speciation because it's a stupid concept that humans made, not nature made. And so there are 11 different types of mammoths out there that evolved in different ways, and some of them were larger.

So mammoths were about the same size. They're a little bit bigger than Asian elephants, a little bit smaller than African elephants. So there were 11, you know, everyone argues over the definition of speciation because it's a stupid concept that humans made, not nature made. And so there are 11 different types of mammoths out there that evolved in different ways, and some of them were larger.

But the woolly mammoth, the one that we were pursuing that has that woolly phenotype, it was about the size of an Asian elephant. But to your question on size, it's actually a cluster of genes. We're finding more and more about how different genes also map across all species as well.

But the woolly mammoth, the one that we were pursuing that has that woolly phenotype, it was about the size of an Asian elephant. But to your question on size, it's actually a cluster of genes. We're finding more and more about how different genes also map across all species as well.

See if you can find that. The only unintended consequences was they were cute as fuck. Like people lost their minds, right? Like we're, there's, there's, I was, I was on the phone recently with a, you know, moderately aggressive, um, journalist and, uh, and it was going quite poorly as some calls go. Moderately aggressive?

See if you can find that. The only unintended consequences was they were cute as fuck. Like people lost their minds, right? Like we're, there's, there's, I was, I was on the phone recently with a, you know, moderately aggressive, um, journalist and, uh, and it was going quite poorly as some calls go. Moderately aggressive?

Well, then I stayed up all night just Googling George, and there was this weird mammoth through line, whether it was in 60 Minutes or Stephen Colbert, whatever he's in, there was this weird mammoth through line where he was just obsessed with these mammoths, and everyone kind of wanted him to do this. So I called him back the next day.

Well, then I stayed up all night just Googling George, and there was this weird mammoth through line, whether it was in 60 Minutes or Stephen Colbert, whatever he's in, there was this weird mammoth through line where he was just obsessed with these mammoths, and everyone kind of wanted him to do this. So I called him back the next day.

Some people, yeah, they, they, everyone likes to cut it. Look how cute.

Some people, yeah, they, they, everyone likes to cut it. Look how cute.

Yeah, so we get that a lot from kids. She wants a woolly mouse. So every week, every week, I don't have my laptop, but I should have brought it in here. Look how cute. But every week. Oh, my God, they're adorable. So these woolly mice aren't just adorable.

Yeah, so we get that a lot from kids. She wants a woolly mouse. So every week, every week, I don't have my laptop, but I should have brought it in here. Look how cute. But every week. Oh, my God, they're adorable. So these woolly mice aren't just adorable.

We basically said, look, what are the core genes that drive the hair phenotype or physical attribute of a mammoth from an Asian elephant to a mammoth? And then because we want to do this in the most ethical way as possible, there's about 200 million years of genetic divergence between mice and elephants. We didn't just want to ram mammoth DNA in there and see what happens.

We basically said, look, what are the core genes that drive the hair phenotype or physical attribute of a mammoth from an Asian elephant to a mammoth? And then because we want to do this in the most ethical way as possible, there's about 200 million years of genetic divergence between mice and elephants. We didn't just want to ram mammoth DNA in there and see what happens.

So we look for the mouse equivalent. Right. So we look for like all of us have similar genes. And so we can try to look for those genes and then edit those genes with the data we got from the mammoth so that we're then not just putting random genes in there that could either hurt the animal or kill them. Right. Or they may not even be compatible with life. Right.

So we look for the mouse equivalent. Right. So we look for like all of us have similar genes. And so we can try to look for those genes and then edit those genes with the data we got from the mammoth so that we're then not just putting random genes in there that could either hurt the animal or kill them. Right. Or they may not even be compatible with life. Right.

So we try to be really, really thoughtful about the woolly mice went like it went insane. There's people that are like making t-shirts, a meme coin. And so we made 36 mice. They're all they're all healthy. There's 36 mice that we made. And what was crazy about it is we're excited about it because it shows that the end to end process of taking data from an ancient DNA sample.

So we try to be really, really thoughtful about the woolly mice went like it went insane. There's people that are like making t-shirts, a meme coin. And so we made 36 mice. They're all they're all healthy. There's 36 mice that we made. And what was crazy about it is we're excited about it because it shows that the end to end process of taking data from an ancient DNA sample.

And comparing it to a living animal, making those changes, doing it with 100% efficiency. And that's really important and really hard. So we did it with 100% efficiency. Yeah, that's the difference.

And comparing it to a living animal, making those changes, doing it with 100% efficiency. And that's really important and really hard. So we did it with 100% efficiency. Yeah, that's the difference.

And that's the color that we think most mammoths were.

And that's the color that we think most mammoths were.

They were like a golden brown color, right? Because when we pull them out of the permafrost, they've been sitting in mud for quite some time. But if you see very fresh mammoths, like from Siberia and whatnot, like in Yakutsk and other places in northern Siberia that they actually have pretty well-preserved mammoths, they actually have kind of a dirty blonde meets gold meets brown fur.

They were like a golden brown color, right? Because when we pull them out of the permafrost, they've been sitting in mud for quite some time. But if you see very fresh mammoths, like from Siberia and whatnot, like in Yakutsk and other places in northern Siberia that they actually have pretty well-preserved mammoths, they actually have kind of a dirty blonde meets gold meets brown fur.

And so we did that. And now there's people that are making T-shirts that aren't us and pillows that are like legalized Wooly Mice. I'm like, they're not illegal. And then a meme account for the guy that did the like the CRISPR babies, you know, that went in trouble for, you know, making edited babies in China.

And so we did that. And now there's people that are making T-shirts that aren't us and pillows that are like legalized Wooly Mice. I'm like, they're not illegal. And then a meme account for the guy that did the like the CRISPR babies, you know, that went in trouble for, you know, making edited babies in China.

Seven days later, I'm in his lab, and we were off to the races on, okay, we're going to try to go build a company to bring back extinct species. So how do you decide what to start with? So we started with the mammoth first, right, because George had been working on it for eight years. We needed his core technologies. We thought that there was a huge application to elephant conservation.

Seven days later, I'm in his lab, and we were off to the races on, okay, we're going to try to go build a company to bring back extinct species. So how do you decide what to start with? So we started with the mammoth first, right, because George had been working on it for eight years. We needed his core technologies. We thought that there was a huge application to elephant conservation.

A meme account. Oh, wow.

A meme account. Oh, wow.

From the second lineage, they'll do one more gene, let that mouse live, and then they'll stack those edits over multiple generations. We've developed a system so that we can deliver all of those edits at one time, all over the genome, get exactly what we want.

From the second lineage, they'll do one more gene, let that mouse live, and then they'll stack those edits over multiple generations. We've developed a system so that we can deliver all of those edits at one time, all over the genome, get exactly what we want.

And then we have this what's called monoclonal screening, where we're screening the cells at the end, sequencing all the cells, which is expensive and sounds like overkill. But then we know that none of them have unintended consequences or off-target effects in the genome.

And then we have this what's called monoclonal screening, where we're screening the cells at the end, sequencing all the cells, which is expensive and sounds like overkill. But then we know that none of them have unintended consequences or off-target effects in the genome.

healthy and so so we try to spend a lot of time you know on that because we're certified by American Humane Society it's the oldest humane organization in the world and if you've seen the film that's like no animals were harmed in the making this film that's those guys so we've ended up so we really care about kind of not just the

healthy and so so we try to spend a lot of time you know on that because we're certified by American Humane Society it's the oldest humane organization in the world and if you've seen the film that's like no animals were harmed in the making this film that's those guys so we've ended up so we really care about kind of not just the

de-extinction efforts, the genome engineering efforts, but ensuring that the animals are healthy when they come out. And so the woolly mouse was a really interesting proof of concept. It shows that the edits that we are working on are working right, and we're getting exactly what we predicted.

de-extinction efforts, the genome engineering efforts, but ensuring that the animals are healthy when they come out. And so the woolly mouse was a really interesting proof of concept. It shows that the edits that we are working on are working right, and we're getting exactly what we predicted.

No, everyone keeps asking us that. But you know what? Museums actually are now calling us saying, and zoos are calling us saying, can we display the woolly mice? They're like, it'll drive so much value. It'll teach people about genetics and whatnot. So it's not our business model to sell our animals or to sell woolly mice, but it's kind of gone crazy.

No, everyone keeps asking us that. But you know what? Museums actually are now calling us saying, and zoos are calling us saying, can we display the woolly mice? They're like, it'll drive so much value. It'll teach people about genetics and whatnot. So it's not our business model to sell our animals or to sell woolly mice, but it's kind of gone crazy.

Yeah, if we ever put them, I think more likely we'd put them in a museum that needs to be free, like the Smithsonian or something like that, from an education perspective versus something that's more attraction-based. I think we'd do it more in the case of a museum.

Yeah, if we ever put them, I think more likely we'd put them in a museum that needs to be free, like the Smithsonian or something like that, from an education perspective versus something that's more attraction-based. I think we'd do it more in the case of a museum.

Yeah, they're going to live out their normal lives.

Yeah, they're going to live out their normal lives.

We may make new ones with new. These won't. They're all separated. They're all separated by sex. So we're not going to like a Jurassic Park moment where they change. They're all separated by sex. But if you if Jamie finds a picture of their habitats, they actually live.

We may make new ones with new. These won't. They're all separated. They're all separated by sex. So we're not going to like a Jurassic Park moment where they change. They're all separated by sex. But if you if Jamie finds a picture of their habitats, they actually live.

They live a couple of years, but they don't live like traditional lab mice that live in like a small little cage and all on top of each other. They actually live in pretty sweet digs that we made for them. We spared no expense. Cool little house. Yeah. And they're big and we put fun stuff in them to play with like this. And what's been crazy is we only named two of them.

They live a couple of years, but they don't live like traditional lab mice that live in like a small little cage and all on top of each other. They actually live in pretty sweet digs that we made for them. We spared no expense. Cool little house. Yeah. And they're big and we put fun stuff in them to play with like this. And what's been crazy is we only named two of them.

And we named him Chip and Dale because people were asking what the names were. And I was like, Chip is the only thing that I could think of at the moment. And now even on X, people are like, we need pictures of Chip. Where is Chip? We've only seen pictures of Dale. And there's like these incredible Internet sleuths that are like, that's not Chip. That's Dale. We need a picture of Chip.

And we named him Chip and Dale because people were asking what the names were. And I was like, Chip is the only thing that I could think of at the moment. And now even on X, people are like, we need pictures of Chip. Where is Chip? We've only seen pictures of Dale. And there's like these incredible Internet sleuths that are like, that's not Chip. That's Dale. We need a picture of Chip.

There was some ecological modeling that had been done to show that the reintroduction of mammoths back into the wild could actually have a net benefit to the ecosystem. And so that was an easy place to start.

There was some ecological modeling that had been done to show that the reintroduction of mammoths back into the wild could actually have a net benefit to the ecosystem. And so that was an easy place to start.

Get involved. Yeah. So we've just, yeah. Don't get involved with those people. We've not leaned in. Yeah.

Get involved. Yeah. So we've just, yeah. Don't get involved with those people. We've not leaned in. Yeah.

So it's more of a proof of technology. I think that the mouse model, because it's a 20-day gestation versus 22 months in elephants, it's a great way to test phenotypes. you know, with a mammoth, you have three ways to test if you got the edits right. One, you can do molecular tests. You can do DNA sequencing to see if it worked. Two, I guess there's four.

So it's more of a proof of technology. I think that the mouse model, because it's a 20-day gestation versus 22 months in elephants, it's a great way to test phenotypes. you know, with a mammoth, you have three ways to test if you got the edits right. One, you can do molecular tests. You can do DNA sequencing to see if it worked. Two, I guess there's four.

Two, you could grow a mammoth and see if it looks like it, but that's a lot of work in 22 months.

Two, you could grow a mammoth and see if it looks like it, but that's a lot of work in 22 months.

a lot of gestational time a lot of money uh i think there's a lot of risk in that the third and this is a little weird we created what's called induced pluripotent stem cells so we created cells that you can then turn into any type of tissue so we actually do have mammoth hair follicles growing in a lab so we have hair growing in petri dishes in the lab which is pretty cool if you come see the lab you'll get the whole willy wonka tour of it which is pretty cool

a lot of gestational time a lot of money uh i think there's a lot of risk in that the third and this is a little weird we created what's called induced pluripotent stem cells so we created cells that you can then turn into any type of tissue so we actually do have mammoth hair follicles growing in a lab so we have hair growing in petri dishes in the lab which is pretty cool if you come see the lab you'll get the whole willy wonka tour of it which is pretty cool

And then the fourth way is mice, right? Because it's like if we can then engineer them into mice, we can see immediately within 20 days if the edits were working, if there were any unintended consequences that would be detrimental to the animal. Wow. So we'll probably make more iterations of the woolly mice.

And then the fourth way is mice, right? Because it's like if we can then engineer them into mice, we can see immediately within 20 days if the edits were working, if there were any unintended consequences that would be detrimental to the animal. Wow. So we'll probably make more iterations of the woolly mice.

The thylacine's closest living relative is the fat-tailed dunnart, which is a mouse-sized marsupial. And it actually gestates in 13 and a half days versus 20 days. So there's no reason to do it in mice when you can do it immediately in the model species.

The thylacine's closest living relative is the fat-tailed dunnart, which is a mouse-sized marsupial. And it actually gestates in 13 and a half days versus 20 days. So there's no reason to do it in mice when you can do it immediately in the model species.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So we're working on the mammoth, the Tasmanian tiger, and the dodo for different reasons. We work with a lot of different private landowners, governments, and indigenous people groups. And a project that we announced through our Colossal Foundation about – Two and a half years ago is doing a population genomics map. We talked about biobanking a little bit.

So we're working on the mammoth, the Tasmanian tiger, and the dodo for different reasons. We work with a lot of different private landowners, governments, and indigenous people groups. And a project that we announced through our Colossal Foundation about – Two and a half years ago is doing a population genomics map. We talked about biobanking a little bit.

After we launched the company, it went crazy viral and all these other folks from de-extinction research started calling us, like folks from like the thylacine or Tasmanian tiger, which looks like a mythical creature. It's awesome. The best appear with the dodo. Everyone just started calling us and then we just started expanding our entire set.

After we launched the company, it went crazy viral and all these other folks from de-extinction research started calling us, like folks from like the thylacine or Tasmanian tiger, which looks like a mythical creature. It's awesome. The best appear with the dodo. Everyone just started calling us and then we just started expanding our entire set.

So we want to understand from the bison that are still here in America, what's genetic diversity? What's been lost? You know, what's the number of inbreeding? So we go through this whole process to try to understand. And then we were giving a report back to MHA Nation. Chairman Fox, it's one of the largest organizations.

So we want to understand from the bison that are still here in America, what's genetic diversity? What's been lost? You know, what's the number of inbreeding? So we go through this whole process to try to understand. And then we were giving a report back to MHA Nation. Chairman Fox, it's one of the largest organizations.

indigenous people groups in the United States, one of the largest tribes based in North Dakota. So we're giving them a report out on this. We went to their nation, wanted to share this. And then, you know, we're curious. So we said, what other projects would you work on that we could do that's helpful outside of helping bison? And they said that we needed help with wolf conservation.

indigenous people groups in the United States, one of the largest tribes based in North Dakota. So we're giving them a report out on this. We went to their nation, wanted to share this. And then, you know, we're curious. So we said, what other projects would you work on that we could do that's helpful outside of helping bison? And they said that we needed help with wolf conservation.

They brought up that. They said that we needed help with more bison conservation. They said if we do stuff around eagles and fish. And so we kind of got that feedback. And when Chairman Fox was walking me through their cultural heritage museum, he actually stopped on this incredible picture of a white wolf. And he said, you know, that's the great wolf.

They brought up that. They said that we needed help with more bison conservation. They said if we do stuff around eagles and fish. And so we kind of got that feedback. And when Chairman Fox was walking me through their cultural heritage museum, he actually stopped on this incredible picture of a white wolf. And he said, you know, that's the great wolf.

And and he talked about the ancestral knowledge that was passed down and that's been lost and how many people believed that it could have even been a dire wolf from Game of Thrones. It's cool. I love the show. That's interesting. So he did that. We talked about that. And then, you know, three months later, I was in North Carolina.

And and he talked about the ancestral knowledge that was passed down and that's been lost and how many people believed that it could have even been a dire wolf from Game of Thrones. It's cool. I love the show. That's interesting. So he did that. We talked about that. And then, you know, three months later, I was in North Carolina.

And understanding that for a completely different meeting around financing. And in that meeting, the Red Wolf program came up. I don't know if you know anything about the Red Wolf, but it's kind of a disaster. You know, it's the only endemic wolf to America. It's only endemic to America. It's a red wolf. It's beautiful. And there's like 15 left in the wild.

And understanding that for a completely different meeting around financing. And in that meeting, the Red Wolf program came up. I don't know if you know anything about the Red Wolf, but it's kind of a disaster. You know, it's the only endemic wolf to America. It's only endemic to America. It's a red wolf. It's beautiful. And there's like 15 left in the wild.

With massive loss of genetic diversity, massive bottleneck. And I was like, wait, we're supposed to be this country of innovation. We can't save our own. When you think of like the American West, right, you think of wolves, you think of like, you know, eagle soaring, you think of like trout bears catching trout, you know, you think of bison.

With massive loss of genetic diversity, massive bottleneck. And I was like, wait, we're supposed to be this country of innovation. We can't save our own. When you think of like the American West, right, you think of wolves, you think of like, you know, eagle soaring, you think of like trout bears catching trout, you know, you think of bison.

The thought that we could lose one of these amazing icons, we were like, we have to do something about this. We have to figure something out. And so we put that kind of on the list. And then in a weird series of events, we've had all of these kids over the last three years and teachers and parents sending us pictures of woolly mammoths or dodos or thylacines.

The thought that we could lose one of these amazing icons, we were like, we have to do something about this. We have to figure something out. And so we put that kind of on the list. And then in a weird series of events, we've had all of these kids over the last three years and teachers and parents sending us pictures of woolly mammoths or dodos or thylacines.

We get boxes of this every single week, which is pretty cool. So we're going to make a colossal kids corner at our new labs. And in that, we've had all this – some Hollywood talent, like – Tom Brady, others that have invested in the business, they're just excited about it. Most of them learned about it through their kids, kind of like with the woolly mouse with you.

We get boxes of this every single week, which is pretty cool. So we're going to make a colossal kids corner at our new labs. And in that, we've had all this – some Hollywood talent, like – Tom Brady, others that have invested in the business, they're just excited about it. Most of them learned about it through their kids, kind of like with the woolly mouse with you.

And so everyone's excited about it. And then we talked again to MHA Nation. They brought up the dire wolf again. And so we thought maybe there was an opportunity to bring back an American species because dire wolves were only found in the U.S., in North America, but predominantly in the United States, coastal United States.

And so everyone's excited about it. And then we talked again to MHA Nation. They brought up the dire wolf again. And so we thought maybe there was an opportunity to bring back an American species because dire wolves were only found in the U.S., in North America, but predominantly in the United States, coastal United States.

And we thought if we could do something that could bring back the dire wolf, also help wolf conservation and bring people from like sci-fi, fantasy and kids more into science and into the conversation around conservation. We thought it was a cool idea, but we had no idea if we could pull it off.

And we thought if we could do something that could bring back the dire wolf, also help wolf conservation and bring people from like sci-fi, fantasy and kids more into science and into the conversation around conservation. We thought it was a cool idea, but we had no idea if we could pull it off.

dead dire wolves that were trapped in permafrost or is no most are most of the dire wolf skulls out there uh there's thousands of them in la brea tar print so if you go there they have this beautiful wall but because of heat and acidification there isn't anything that's protected like there's nothing you can get from that but about six years ago uh a group including best shapiro our chief science officer uh sequenced a tooth that was found in a cave just a single tooth right

dead dire wolves that were trapped in permafrost or is no most are most of the dire wolf skulls out there uh there's thousands of them in la brea tar print so if you go there they have this beautiful wall but because of heat and acidification there isn't anything that's protected like there's nothing you can get from that but about six years ago uh a group including best shapiro our chief science officer uh sequenced a tooth that was found in a cave just a single tooth right

And in that tooth, they actually found a they actually got point one five X or coverage of the genome. So they got about 15 percent of the genome. But that's not really enough. You need to get up to about 10 X, meaning that you can read the entire genome about 10 different times so that even if there are gaps, you understand enough of the core kind of.

And in that tooth, they actually found a they actually got point one five X or coverage of the genome. So they got about 15 percent of the genome. But that's not really enough. You need to get up to about 10 X, meaning that you can read the entire genome about 10 different times so that even if there are gaps, you understand enough of the core kind of.

coding regions that you could bring back that animal.

coding regions that you could bring back that animal.

It's done by AI and software, yeah. So we built, part of our business model is building technologies to solve these really complicated problems that are much harder to solve than just solving them for existing species, open sourcing that for conservation for free, but then also taking those technologies that we can monetize for humans and spinning them out.

It's done by AI and software, yeah. So we built, part of our business model is building technologies to solve these really complicated problems that are much harder to solve than just solving them for existing species, open sourcing that for conservation for free, but then also taking those technologies that we can monetize for humans and spinning them out.

So our first computational analysis company was called FormBio and we actually spun it out of the business. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

So our first computational analysis company was called FormBio and we actually spun it out of the business. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Yeah, let me walk through the whole process. So first you have to find ancient DNA, which is pretty shitty on a good day. So the minute we take DNA out of our bodies or out of anything, it starts to degrade at an insanely rapid rate. So we definitely need to find a lot of samples. So we actually have about 109 mammoth samples ranging from 3,000 years old to 1.2 million years old, which is awesome.

Yeah, let me walk through the whole process. So first you have to find ancient DNA, which is pretty shitty on a good day. So the minute we take DNA out of our bodies or out of anything, it starts to degrade at an insanely rapid rate. So we definitely need to find a lot of samples. So we actually have about 109 mammoth samples ranging from 3,000 years old to 1.2 million years old, which is awesome.

So I'm the CEO and co-founder of a company called Colossal Biosciences. We're the world's first de-extinction and species preservation company.

So I'm the CEO and co-founder of a company called Colossal Biosciences. We're the world's first de-extinction and species preservation company.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Wow. But it's also fragmented. It's like a shitty jigsaw puzzle that you don't know what the box is, and someone's stolen part of the puzzle. And then, oh, by the way, people have taken other puzzle pieces and put them in there. So there's all kinds of problems with that. So this is really an AI and compute problem. It's not as much a human problem. So you have to get a lot of samples first.

Wow. But it's also fragmented. It's like a shitty jigsaw puzzle that you don't know what the box is, and someone's stolen part of the puzzle. And then, oh, by the way, people have taken other puzzle pieces and put them in there. So there's all kinds of problems with that. So this is really an AI and compute problem. It's not as much a human problem. So you have to get a lot of samples first.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

And then you have to start mapping them to their closest living relative. And genotyping allows us to understand that that's Asian elephants, right? So Asian elephants are 99.6% the same as mammoths. They're actually closer related to mammoths than they are to African elephants. Really? Yeah, which always blows people's mind.

And then you have to start mapping them to their closest living relative. And genotyping allows us to understand that that's Asian elephants, right? So Asian elephants are 99.6% the same as mammoths. They're actually closer related to mammoths than they are to African elephants. Really? Yeah, which always blows people's mind.

Thank you. Yeah, so these are staying on, you know, like these are not going back into the wild, right?

Thank you. Yeah, so these are staying on, you know, like these are not going back into the wild, right?

That and the fact that mammoths were alive when we were building the pyramids or aliens or whoever was building the pyramids. Like literally like humans were building the pyramids while mammoths existed. And sometimes that blows people's mind because they always think of them as in this like weird, like prehistoric, like 65 million years old dinosaur.

That and the fact that mammoths were alive when we were building the pyramids or aliens or whoever was building the pyramids. Like literally like humans were building the pyramids while mammoths existed. And sometimes that blows people's mind because they always think of them as in this like weird, like prehistoric, like 65 million years old dinosaur.

Right now they're on a 2,000-acre secure expansive ecological preserve with 24-7 care. We have an animal hospital that we built. Wow. People are always like, you guys raise so much money. And I was like, well, because we didn't just spend it on the labs. You have to spend it on the animal care, the facilities.

Right now they're on a 2,000-acre secure expansive ecological preserve with 24-7 care. We have an animal hospital that we built. Wow. People are always like, you guys raise so much money. And I was like, well, because we didn't just spend it on the labs. You have to spend it on the animal care, the facilities.

Yeah, so this is Ramos and Remus playing in the snow on the preserve when they are three months old.

Yeah, so this is Ramos and Remus playing in the snow on the preserve when they are three months old.

Three months, they were north of 45 pounds. Wow.

Three months, they were north of 45 pounds. Wow.

God, they're so big. Oh, they just get – as they've aged, they've just got more and more beautiful.

God, they're so big. Oh, they just get – as they've aged, they've just got more and more beautiful.

We didn't know, right? And so we ended up getting a – Is this a full-grown one? No, they're still five months old. So they're 80 pounds at five months. So – Wolves typically grow 12 to 14 months. So they're not full grown yet. Wow. And how big is it already? 80 pounds, about five and a half feet. And the mane. Yeah. And so a couple of things about the wolves, Jamie, if you go back. Yeah.

We didn't know, right? And so we ended up getting a – Is this a full-grown one? No, they're still five months old. So they're 80 pounds at five months. So – Wolves typically grow 12 to 14 months. So they're not full grown yet. Wow. And how big is it already? 80 pounds, about five and a half feet. And the mane. Yeah. And so a couple of things about the wolves, Jamie, if you go back. Yeah.

So we didn't know this, right? We knew that they were a Pleistocene wolf. We knew that they existed naturally. And went extinct about 12,000 years ago when a lot of megafauna went extinct, like during kind of that younger dry ice kind of cooling period. They went extinct as well, right? And we knew, all we know, because all we have is, we don't have frozen dire wolves or frozen samples.

So we didn't know this, right? We knew that they were a Pleistocene wolf. We knew that they existed naturally. And went extinct about 12,000 years ago when a lot of megafauna went extinct, like during kind of that younger dry ice kind of cooling period. They went extinct as well, right? And we knew, all we know, because all we have is, we don't have frozen dire wolves or frozen samples.

We literally just know from skeletal remains that they were 20 to 25% larger. They were stockier. They probably weren't as fast based on kind of their body weight as a normal wolf would be. But we knew that they had thicker skulls, larger cranium and whatnot. And we assumed that they're there.

We literally just know from skeletal remains that they were 20 to 25% larger. They were stockier. They probably weren't as fast based on kind of their body weight as a normal wolf would be. But we knew that they had thicker skulls, larger cranium and whatnot. And we assumed that they're there.

And we did find this out in the genome, which is pretty cool that they are white because there's like this misconception for a while that they were red because some scientists wanted to make a paper and assume that they are red. So they get their papers.

And we did find this out in the genome, which is pretty cool that they are white because there's like this misconception for a while that they were red because some scientists wanted to make a paper and assume that they are red. So they get their papers.

So the last one went extinct about 4,000 years ago.

So the last one went extinct about 4,000 years ago.

Yeah. And they have this beautiful, we didn't know this, but they have this beautiful like mane-like quality to them. And when they're babies, you saw a couple of pictures, their fur almost feels like polar bears. It's crazy. Wow.

Yeah. And they have this beautiful, we didn't know this, but they have this beautiful like mane-like quality to them. And when they're babies, you saw a couple of pictures, their fur almost feels like polar bears. It's crazy. Wow.

It's not. It's like typical wolves. But it's incredibly thick. It grows in kind of these clumps. But then as they've grown in, they've started to get this kind of like mane to them, which is incredible.

It's not. It's like typical wolves. But it's incredibly thick. It grows in kind of these clumps. But then as they've grown in, they've started to get this kind of like mane to them, which is incredible.

On Wrangell Island. Yeah.

On Wrangell Island. Yeah.

Well, the female, she's only six weeks old, so it's two years old. So if you keep going through a couple other photos. Wow. Yeah, I mean, they're just beautiful. I mean, it's funny. Someone actually said on our team, they almost look like Shetland pony wolves at some point, right? Right. There's something. They're so stocky. They're stocky. They're thicker. Yeah.

Well, the female, she's only six weeks old, so it's two years old. So if you keep going through a couple other photos. Wow. Yeah, I mean, they're just beautiful. I mean, it's funny. Someone actually said on our team, they almost look like Shetland pony wolves at some point, right? Right. There's something. They're so stocky. They're stocky. They're thicker. Yeah.

They are, I mean, they're absolutely beautiful. So this is Khaleesi, who looks like a baby. And we nailed it. We named her. Can we hear it?

They are, I mean, they're absolutely beautiful. So this is Khaleesi, who looks like a baby. And we nailed it. We named her. Can we hear it?

So they've been around for a long time.

So they've been around for a long time.

We named Khaleesi for George R.R. Martin, obviously.

We named Khaleesi for George R.R. Martin, obviously.

Who's an investor in Colossal.

Who's an investor in Colossal.

They weren't, I mean, now they appeared about two and a half million years ago as far as we understand. And they were mostly a Pleistocene species. But as we moved into the Holocene and kind of the period that we're in right now, they existed. They existed all the way up until they had this like small genetic bottleneck on Wrangell Island.

They weren't, I mean, now they appeared about two and a half million years ago as far as we understand. And they were mostly a Pleistocene species. But as we moved into the Holocene and kind of the period that we're in right now, they existed. They existed all the way up until they had this like small genetic bottleneck on Wrangell Island.

Well, everything in nature murders something, right? Yeah. Like we were. Well, cows murder grass. Yeah. And people are now saying you can hear grass and other plants like scream.

Well, everything in nature murders something, right? Yeah. Like we were. Well, cows murder grass. Yeah. And people are now saying you can hear grass and other plants like scream.

So I guess we all are bad.

So I guess we all are bad.

So they love to chew on horns. So we have different phases. We built a 145-page animal guide. These are actually different horns from different elk and other species that we're putting out there.

So they love to chew on horns. So we have different phases. We built a 145-page animal guide. These are actually different horns from different elk and other species that we're putting out there.

So we're feeding them still. So they eat a combination of bison meat, horse meat, and some— Do you plan on letting them kill things eventually? So we're just about to introduce carcasses to them, so giving them— part of a carcass, letting them feed, building in that dynamic between the two brothers for now. And they are starting to exhibit some hunting behavior.

So we're feeding them still. So they eat a combination of bison meat, horse meat, and some— Do you plan on letting them kill things eventually? So we're just about to introduce carcasses to them, so giving them— part of a carcass, letting them feed, building in that dynamic between the two brothers for now. And they are starting to exhibit some hunting behavior.

I mean, they are on a seemingly wild 2,000-acre preserve with just them, so they do have the ability to hunt on that preserve. But they're not doing it yet. They're starting to exhibit kind of the first inklings that it will trend toward that. But we want them to live... We want them, and we're going to probably make two or three more.

I mean, they are on a seemingly wild 2,000-acre preserve with just them, so they do have the ability to hunt on that preserve. But they're not doing it yet. They're starting to exhibit kind of the first inklings that it will trend toward that. But we want them to live... We want them, and we're going to probably make two or three more.

We want a solid little social pack that we can monitor, that can live a seemingly wild life, that we can understand more about them. Wow. It's cool. But the other thing that's equally cool to it, going back to the Red Bull story, can you— Which is crazy to me that you have reignited these 10,000-year-old hunting genes.

We want a solid little social pack that we can monitor, that can live a seemingly wild life, that we can understand more about them. Wow. It's cool. But the other thing that's equally cool to it, going back to the Red Bull story, can you— Which is crazy to me that you have reignited these 10,000-year-old hunting genes.

Including size, including size. We understand more about like, we, you know, we looked at what genes made really a dire wolf, a dire wolf, like what was separated. And the beautiful thing for us is that we had a 13,000 year old tooth and a 73,000 year old skull. So we could actually understand the genetic distance with that much genetic distance between them.

Including size, including size. We understand more about like, we, you know, we looked at what genes made really a dire wolf, a dire wolf, like what was separated. And the beautiful thing for us is that we had a 13,000 year old tooth and a 73,000 year old skull. So we could actually understand the genetic distance with that much genetic distance between them.

We could actually understand, you know, what truly was fixed and conserved in the dire wolf genome and what wasn't just population genomics, right? If there's If you and I are 50,000 years apart, you know, there's a lot of different mutations in that time period. But if we can then really say, OK, you know, what made Ben Ben and what made Jojo? Oh, here's the overlaps.

We could actually understand, you know, what truly was fixed and conserved in the dire wolf genome and what wasn't just population genomics, right? If there's If you and I are 50,000 years apart, you know, there's a lot of different mutations in that time period. But if we can then really say, OK, you know, what made Ben Ben and what made Jojo? Oh, here's the overlaps.

It allowed us to really understand that. Wow.

It allowed us to really understand that. Wow.

And so I was I was like so I was in, you know, because I bottle fed. And Romulus was partly raised with me. I could go out to the preserve. I'd check on him quite frequently. It's in the northern United States. We don't say where it is. But mainly because we're for not just the animal's health, but for human health. Ever since we launched the woolly mouse, we've had...

And so I was I was like so I was in, you know, because I bottle fed. And Romulus was partly raised with me. I could go out to the preserve. I'd check on him quite frequently. It's in the northern United States. We don't say where it is. But mainly because we're for not just the animal's health, but for human health. Ever since we launched the woolly mouse, we've had...

Very excited people just show up at our labs are not open to the public. And we've had lots of people just show up wanting to see the mice. And so showing people too much of the preserve, we're always very, very nervous about we scrub all the videos and whatnot to ensure that no one can pick it out. We assume people will be moderately excited.

Very excited people just show up at our labs are not open to the public. And we've had lots of people just show up wanting to see the mice. And so showing people too much of the preserve, we're always very, very nervous about we scrub all the videos and whatnot to ensure that no one can pick it out. We assume people will be moderately excited.

And where's Wrangel Island? It's northeast of Siberia.

And where's Wrangel Island? It's northeast of Siberia.

Yeah, so we've done, I'm not trying to challenge them, but we've done everything we can to protect it.

Yeah, so we've done, I'm not trying to challenge them, but we've done everything we can to protect it.

From people that are like.

From people that are like.

Yeah. Yeah. They have that family has like the largest private zoo and preserve. Just so wild. It's so crazy.

Yeah. Yeah. They have that family has like the largest private zoo and preserve. Just so wild. It's so crazy.

Yeah, it's crazy. But I was in the – so of the 2,000 acres, we have a subsection of it that's about six and a half acres where we have an animal hospital, a storm rescue shelter. We have a couple of natural dens that we've built for them as well as an animal husbandry area.

Yeah, it's crazy. But I was in the – so of the 2,000 acres, we have a subsection of it that's about six and a half acres where we have an animal hospital, a storm rescue shelter. We have a couple of natural dens that we've built for them as well as an animal husbandry area.

So that way when we want to take photos of them or videos of them or do blood tests, they're in a seemingly more contained area. And – It's funny. Two weeks ago, I was up there, and I was actually sitting on those logs in one of those pictures, and Remus came. Romulus, who I spent the most amount of time with. Remus came up, came pretty close, and I was able to touch him again.

So that way when we want to take photos of them or videos of them or do blood tests, they're in a seemingly more contained area. And – It's funny. Two weeks ago, I was up there, and I was actually sitting on those logs in one of those pictures, and Remus came. Romulus, who I spent the most amount of time with. Remus came up, came pretty close, and I was able to touch him again.

Well, there's a couple different theories, right? One of the theories with Wrangel Island is that they actually, there's lots of inbreeding. So there's lots of, like, genetic bottleneck, which happened because there's not a different species there. How large is Wrangel Island? I'm not quite sure. Can you give me a photo again, Jamie?

Well, there's a couple different theories, right? One of the theories with Wrangel Island is that they actually, there's lots of inbreeding. So there's lots of, like, genetic bottleneck, which happened because there's not a different species there. How large is Wrangel Island? I'm not quite sure. Can you give me a photo again, Jamie?

But I thought at that moment, and he kind of skittished away. I was like, that's the last time I'm touching Remus. Like, what am I doing? And I mean, don't get me wrong. I had our animal. Yeah, I have animal care teams there and everything. And they have been some, there's some level of,

But I thought at that moment, and he kind of skittished away. I was like, that's the last time I'm touching Remus. Like, what am I doing? And I mean, don't get me wrong. I had our animal. Yeah, I have animal care teams there and everything. And they have been some, there's some level of,

habituation between the care team they really know and love the care team but they're still wild animals right and so probably hunted humans yeah I don't I don't I don't we don't know right but the rise of kind of going back to their extinction the rise of the change in kind of this younger driest period and the change the massive I don't know the some of the stuff that there's like several different prevailing theories one of which is human predation right that like the rise of humans led to the extinction of the megafauna

habituation between the care team they really know and love the care team but they're still wild animals right and so probably hunted humans yeah I don't I don't I don't we don't know right but the rise of kind of going back to their extinction the rise of the change in kind of this younger driest period and the change the massive I don't know the some of the stuff that there's like several different prevailing theories one of which is human predation right that like the rise of humans led to the extinction of the megafauna

That's kind of, you know, I think I think the answer is probably a combination. Could have there been an astrological event? They're starting to be more and more data around that.

That's kind of, you know, I think I think the answer is probably a combination. Could have there been an astrological event? They're starting to be more and more data around that.

I've seen Randall Carlson talk about it. Graham Hancock talk about it. And they just got the shit beat out of them.

I've seen Randall Carlson talk about it. Graham Hancock talk about it. And they just got the shit beat out of them.

Well, yeah, it's yeah. And it happened. Yeah, and it definitely also happened in kind of a regional sense, right? Because you see different, which also tracks to the theory, right? So not only do you have these different layers that you can prove from a sedimentation perspective, but there was also a massive glacial lake.

Well, yeah, it's yeah. And it happened. Yeah, and it definitely also happened in kind of a regional sense, right? Because you see different, which also tracks to the theory, right? So not only do you have these different layers that you can prove from a sedimentation perspective, but there was also a massive glacial lake.

And some of the glaciers up there that rapidly liquefied, they then dumped in the ocean that also changed ocean patterns. So you went from a period, you know, in that kind of transition from Pleistocene to Holocene, there was this period of insanely accelerated cooling.

And some of the glaciers up there that rapidly liquefied, they then dumped in the ocean that also changed ocean patterns. So you went from a period, you know, in that kind of transition from Pleistocene to Holocene, there was this period of insanely accelerated cooling.

It tracks all over the world. It's like those, it reminds me of those stories where they show people, like, the side of the Sphinx. And they're like, oh, man, that's a lot of water erosion. And then they, like, flip the photo and then you see the head of the thing. It's like, that's not water erosion. It's Dr. Rogers.

It tracks all over the world. It's like those, it reminds me of those stories where they show people, like, the side of the Sphinx. And they're like, oh, man, that's a lot of water erosion. And then they, like, flip the photo and then you see the head of the thing. It's like, that's not water erosion. It's Dr. Rogers.

And so essentially, though, Wrangell Island and then there's another island called St. Paul Island, which is also between Alaska and Russia, also is where they were. Those were kind of the last two places that we know mammoths existed today.

And so essentially, though, Wrangell Island and then there's another island called St. Paul Island, which is also between Alaska and Russia, also is where they were. Those were kind of the last two places that we know mammoths existed today.

Well, that I'm not a scientist, but that's and I don't come from academia. I'm just an entrepreneur that knows how to build teams of smarter people than me. And I find cool shit interesting. And I try to work on it. Right. And what's crazy to me is the academic system, you know, once again, non-academic, I'm sure I'll get crucified for this, but I don't read the comments. Don't read the comments.

Well, that I'm not a scientist, but that's and I don't come from academia. I'm just an entrepreneur that knows how to build teams of smarter people than me. And I find cool shit interesting. And I try to work on it. Right. And what's crazy to me is the academic system, you know, once again, non-academic, I'm sure I'll get crucified for this, but I don't read the comments. Don't read the comments.

I don't read the comments. Trust me, I don't read the comments. Good for you. I sleep quite well. Nice. But, you know, the academics, we have 95 of the top scientific advisors in the world, Nobel laureates and whatnot. We fund 17 academic universities, right, all over the world. We fund 40 postdocs. right, all over the world, right? And they're doing this.

I don't read the comments. Trust me, I don't read the comments. Good for you. I sleep quite well. Nice. But, you know, the academics, we have 95 of the top scientific advisors in the world, Nobel laureates and whatnot. We fund 17 academic universities, right, all over the world. We fund 40 postdocs. right, all over the world, right? And they're doing this.

So we're very integrated with different ideas from academia and these scholars. And our top people that were at Colossal came from academia. So I think we try to be very academically friendly, but they live in this world, this super kind of like fortune and glory world where it's like, It's a popularity contest if someone has a paper because their entire motivation is publisher or pair.

So we're very integrated with different ideas from academia and these scholars. And our top people that were at Colossal came from academia. So I think we try to be very academically friendly, but they live in this world, this super kind of like fortune and glory world where it's like, It's a popularity contest if someone has a paper because their entire motivation is publisher or pair.

So one of the other things that people bitch about us is they're like, you guys don't write scientific papers for every single thing you're using. We're not an academic university. We're not. I don't have to write a paper on anything ever. We do a couple here and there because we want to share our knowledge with with the community. Right.

So one of the other things that people bitch about us is they're like, you guys don't write scientific papers for every single thing you're using. We're not an academic university. We're not. I don't have to write a paper on anything ever. We do a couple here and there because we want to share our knowledge with with the community. Right.

But we get this feedback of like if we wrote a scientific paper for every single thing that we did that went through peer review, like we would have 3000 scientific papers and no mammoths ever. Right. Because we just be sitting around writing fucking papers all day long.

But we get this feedback of like if we wrote a scientific paper for every single thing that we did that went through peer review, like we would have 3000 scientific papers and no mammoths ever. Right. Because we just be sitting around writing fucking papers all day long.

You can't say anything because if I submit it, we know these other people don't like me. If I submit a paper there and we totally agree with you and we'll help you. But we submit a paper. They judge my paper. It gets rejected. Then I don't get my grant. So then I can't continue my research. I have to fire my postdocs. So it's a complete scam of a system. Right.

You can't say anything because if I submit it, we know these other people don't like me. If I submit a paper there and we totally agree with you and we'll help you. But we submit a paper. They judge my paper. It gets rejected. Then I don't get my grant. So then I can't continue my research. I have to fire my postdocs. So it's a complete scam of a system. Right.

And so we went through this phase where it's like we didn't have enough scientists. We didn't have labs. We didn't have money. We weren't doing anything for conservation. So we went through this whole like. philosophical perspective of all these things that people threw at us from the scientific community. And some of our biggest people that hate us are people that we denied their funding.

And so we went through this phase where it's like we didn't have enough scientists. We didn't have labs. We didn't have money. We weren't doing anything for conservation. So we went through this whole like. philosophical perspective of all these things that people threw at us from the scientific community. And some of our biggest people that hate us are people that we denied their funding.

There is actually another working hypothesis that they actually ran out of water. They ran out of access to fresh water on the island.

There is actually another working hypothesis that they actually ran out of water. They ran out of access to fresh water on the island.

And that is why we don't have flying cars, we don't have mammoths, and until Elon, we were not going to live on Mars, right? And so, like, we didn't have, like, I think— Well, it takes time. Yeah, but it doesn't come—but also academia is really focused on point solutions, not full systems, right?

And that is why we don't have flying cars, we don't have mammoths, and until Elon, we were not going to live on Mars, right? And so, like, we didn't have, like, I think— Well, it takes time. Yeah, but it doesn't come—but also academia is really focused on point solutions, not full systems, right?

So if you want to go to Mars or you want to bring back a mammoth, you have to design the entire system, and you have to innovate across everything. Whereas in academia, you're only incentivized to get that piece of paper and get that approved. Right.

So if you want to go to Mars or you want to bring back a mammoth, you have to design the entire system, and you have to innovate across everything. Whereas in academia, you're only incentivized to get that piece of paper and get that approved. Right.

So some combination of genetic bottleneck and that occurred.

So some combination of genetic bottleneck and that occurred.

I'm not a scientist, but we should just... And guess what? When new data shows up that changes your old data, you shouldn't get mad about that. You should celebrate it. Exactly.

I'm not a scientist, but we should just... And guess what? When new data shows up that changes your old data, you shouldn't get mad about that. You should celebrate it. Exactly.

I just wish we could get philosophy, we separate philosophical perspectives from science.

I just wish we could get philosophy, we separate philosophical perspectives from science.

One of the things that we fight about all the time, you know, because it's like, once we got the scientists, and once we got the money, and once we proved that we are the most advanced synthetic biology company in the world, once In-Q-Tel, which is the funding arm of the CIA and other governments started investing in Because of our technologies.

One of the things that we fight about all the time, you know, because it's like, once we got the scientists, and once we got the money, and once we proved that we are the most advanced synthetic biology company in the world, once In-Q-Tel, which is the funding arm of the CIA and other governments started investing in Because of our technologies.

And once we started proof points, the last arguments that we have against some of those scientists are philosophical. It's not a mammoth. It's not a dire wolf. And it's like this concept of speciation is a human construct that we are trying to impose on nature that flows more like a river than a rock.

And once we started proof points, the last arguments that we have against some of those scientists are philosophical. It's not a mammoth. It's not a dire wolf. And it's like this concept of speciation is a human construct that we are trying to impose on nature that flows more like a river than a rock.

So you map them next to it. And there was a study that came out about, and once again, this goes back to the status quo of scientists, of academic scientists. There was a paper that came out a few years ago because they didn't have much data. They said that dire wolves weren't closely related to wolves. They were closely related to jackals.

So you map them next to it. And there was a study that came out about, and once again, this goes back to the status quo of scientists, of academic scientists. There was a paper that came out a few years ago because they didn't have much data. They said that dire wolves weren't closely related to wolves. They were closely related to jackals.

And that's because at the time, they only had 0.15% of the genome, right? They just didn't have all the data. That's not negative. They just didn't have all the data. Now we know that they actually were closely related to wolves because we have more data. Which wolves?

And that's because at the time, they only had 0.15% of the genome, right? They just didn't have all the data. That's not negative. They just didn't have all the data. Now we know that they actually were closely related to wolves because we have more data. Which wolves?

uh gray wolves or the the precursor to gray wolves right so um so they were closer to to the wolf ancestry line in kind of the broader canid group and family group and so what we found is so once you do that we start looking at all these genes and we start to understand what the difference is and we start to see that in certain parts of the genome that are responsible for size for muscle for cranial facial that there's differences right so we can start to map and say okay where are the differences between gray wolves and where are the differences between gray wolves and dire wolves

uh gray wolves or the the precursor to gray wolves right so um so they were closer to to the wolf ancestry line in kind of the broader canid group and family group and so what we found is so once you do that we start looking at all these genes and we start to understand what the difference is and we start to see that in certain parts of the genome that are responsible for size for muscle for cranial facial that there's differences right so we can start to map and say okay where are the differences between gray wolves and where are the differences between gray wolves and dire wolves

And they're actually mammoths because there's, you know, mammoths themselves. Yeah. Mammoths themselves are closely related to the Asian elephant. Which is on the left? Yeah, which is on the left. So they have that dome cranium. They have the small ears. They have a little bit of a hump structure. Mammoths, because they have these massive, massive tusks, right?

And they're actually mammoths because there's, you know, mammoths themselves. Yeah. Mammoths themselves are closely related to the Asian elephant. Which is on the left? Yeah, which is on the left. So they have that dome cranium. They have the small ears. They have a little bit of a hump structure. Mammoths, because they have these massive, massive tusks, right?

And then with those, we have a lot of different tools that we can then go use to make those changes from the dire wolves in a gray wolf cell line.

And then with those, we have a lot of different tools that we can then go use to make those changes from the dire wolves in a gray wolf cell line.

And then once you go through that process, we didn't talk about this earlier, you do the same process called somatic cell nuclear transfer, which is effectively cloning, where you take the nucleus of one cell, you put that into another egg cell, and then you take that embryo and you insert it into a surrogate. And is this a 100% dire wolf or is this a new thing?

And then once you go through that process, we didn't talk about this earlier, you do the same process called somatic cell nuclear transfer, which is effectively cloning, where you take the nucleus of one cell, you put that into another egg cell, and then you take that embryo and you insert it into a surrogate. And is this a 100% dire wolf or is this a new thing?

So this goes into the philosophical thing. Right. So if you look at speciation, right, there's basically the scientists don't agree on how you classify a species. So you've got certain people that will say, well, if a species is dictated by something that can't breed, that's literally a definition. Like if this animal can't breed with this animal, then that's its own species.

So this goes into the philosophical thing. Right. So if you look at speciation, right, there's basically the scientists don't agree on how you classify a species. So you've got certain people that will say, well, if a species is dictated by something that can't breed, that's literally a definition. Like if this animal can't breed with this animal, then that's its own species.

Then you have other people, you have the paleontologists, and some of them love us, like Kenneth Lacovara, who's arguably the number one paleontologist in the world that loves us. But then you have other paleontologists who just hate us. And they do it based solely on tooth morphology, because they argue that's the only thing that is going to be persistent over time.

Then you have other people, you have the paleontologists, and some of them love us, like Kenneth Lacovara, who's arguably the number one paleontologist in the world that loves us. But then you have other paleontologists who just hate us. And they do it based solely on tooth morphology, because they argue that's the only thing that is going to be persistent over time.

And I asked a paleontologist recently that hates us. I said, if I made a mammoth that was giant with pink curly fur, and it had the right tooth morphology... You're saying that, based on your scientific papers, that you would say that's a mammoth. And she's like... Yes, but that doesn't matter. And I'm like, well, we'll do it. Why does she hate you guys?

And I asked a paleontologist recently that hates us. I said, if I made a mammoth that was giant with pink curly fur, and it had the right tooth morphology... You're saying that, based on your scientific papers, that you would say that's a mammoth. And she's like... Yes, but that doesn't matter. And I'm like, well, we'll do it. Why does she hate you guys?

Because, why does anyone, you know, anytime you do anything in this world now that's like moderately bold or polarizing, people give you pushback. But this is heavily bold.

Because, why does anyone, you know, anytime you do anything in this world now that's like moderately bold or polarizing, people give you pushback. But this is heavily bold.

It's definitely in the realm.

It's definitely in the realm.

Yeah, so when you see – well, and we have more stuff to come that I think will be equally interesting.

Yeah, so when you see – well, and we have more stuff to come that I think will be equally interesting.

Well, there's philosophical and religious. And so like back on speciation, you know, polar bears and brown bears are two different species. Right. But they may produce viable offspring all the time. And a bear expert will tell you that a polar bear is just a aquatic adapted, cold adapted bear. Right. And so I always ask people that. Their offspring, they can have children, right?

Well, there's philosophical and religious. And so like back on speciation, you know, polar bears and brown bears are two different species. Right. But they may produce viable offspring all the time. And a bear expert will tell you that a polar bear is just a aquatic adapted, cold adapted bear. Right. And so I always ask people that. Their offspring, they can have children, right?

Yeah, exactly. So there's different species.

Yeah, exactly. So there's different species.

ways to characterize it making a mule yeah but there's different ways to say something or something right and so you know we are not the same right if i don't know what percent you probably from 23 and me or something have some percentage neanderthal you don't say that you're an admixture or a hybrid you just say you're human you don't you don't really but that's a good point though because neanderthal if you want to talk about us different species just because they could breed with us god they're so different

ways to characterize it making a mule yeah but there's different ways to say something or something right and so you know we are not the same right if i don't know what percent you probably from 23 and me or something have some percentage neanderthal you don't say that you're an admixture or a hybrid you just say you're human you don't you don't really but that's a good point though because neanderthal if you want to talk about us different species just because they could breed with us god they're so different

Yeah, we get the Jurassic Park occasionally. Believe it or not, we get that.

Yeah, we get the Jurassic Park occasionally. Believe it or not, we get that.

But like I said, there's six different ways. There's actually a species definition that's based solely on geographics, and there's a funny paper out there around one species of toad that they built a road through, and the same toads live on two sides of the street, and they're different species. And they're the same fucking toad. Just because there's a road. Just because we as humans changed.

But like I said, there's six different ways. There's actually a species definition that's based solely on geographics, and there's a funny paper out there around one species of toad that they built a road through, and the same toads live on two sides of the street, and they're different species. And they're the same fucking toad. Just because there's a road. Just because we as humans changed.

It's called geographic isolation of speciation. So it's just crazy. And so the only arguments that we now have is, but is it a mammoth? And it's like, well, then don't call it a mammoth. I asked people, did you see Jurassic Park? And they're like, yeah. I was like, what was Jurassic Park about to you? To me? Yeah. If you're going to take your kids to see Jurassic Park, what is the movie about?

It's called geographic isolation of speciation. So it's just crazy. And so the only arguments that we now have is, but is it a mammoth? And it's like, well, then don't call it a mammoth. I asked people, did you see Jurassic Park? And they're like, yeah. I was like, what was Jurassic Park about to you? To me? Yeah. If you're going to take your kids to see Jurassic Park, what is the movie about?

And you've talked to lots of folks in kind of the mammoth world. They actually move their heads quite slowly. They had to have this entire ridge of extra muscle in order to do that.

And you've talked to lots of folks in kind of the mammoth world. They actually move their heads quite slowly. They had to have this entire ridge of extra muscle in order to do that.

Dinosaurs. Dinosaurs. Is it because they took ancient DNA and they mixed it with a bunch of other stuff? Are they dinosaurs or are they genetically modified animals, GMOs, genetically modified organisms that have inserted genes from lots of different things? Or are they dinosaurs? If they serve the ecological function, this is what's called functional de-extinction.

Dinosaurs. Dinosaurs. Is it because they took ancient DNA and they mixed it with a bunch of other stuff? Are they dinosaurs or are they genetically modified animals, GMOs, genetically modified organisms that have inserted genes from lots of different things? Or are they dinosaurs? If they serve the ecological function, this is what's called functional de-extinction.

If they serve the ecological function and they have the lost biodiversity and phenotypes that made that animal unique, like the polar and a bear and a bear, they're just that animal. So these goes into this starts the whole religious and philosophical debates where it's funny because the scientists who should not fall into these philosophical debates when they don't like what you're doing.

If they serve the ecological function and they have the lost biodiversity and phenotypes that made that animal unique, like the polar and a bear and a bear, they're just that animal. So these goes into this starts the whole religious and philosophical debates where it's funny because the scientists who should not fall into these philosophical debates when they don't like what you're doing.

That's what they go to.

That's what they go to.

Oh, it's just like it's by their own definition. They're like, well, it doesn't have enough DNA. So I was like, so I said, but the second direwolf that we have, the second genome that we have from the tooth has is has less of the same DNA than the skull. Does that mean that it wasn't a direwolf? And it just turns into an you're missing the point conversation.

Oh, it's just like it's by their own definition. They're like, well, it doesn't have enough DNA. So I was like, so I said, but the second direwolf that we have, the second genome that we have from the tooth has is has less of the same DNA than the skull. Does that mean that it wasn't a direwolf? And it just turns into an you're missing the point conversation.

The general point of the people is that they want to pick one speciation definition and adhere us to that. And if you do that, no animal, including our animals, will fall into one species, right? It's just people that are using the framework that they set that isn't consistent kind of based on the argument that they want to make.

The general point of the people is that they want to pick one speciation definition and adhere us to that. And if you do that, no animal, including our animals, will fall into one species, right? It's just people that are using the framework that they set that isn't consistent kind of based on the argument that they want to make.

Well, I mean, that is one definition. There is another definition saying that it's only a species if it can't breed with another thing. So if I genetically modify them to make it where they can't breed with wolves, does that mean they're now their own species? It just gets into this dumb philosophical perspective because we made up this construct.

Well, I mean, that is one definition. There is another definition saying that it's only a species if it can't breed with another thing. So if I genetically modify them to make it where they can't breed with wolves, does that mean they're now their own species? It just gets into this dumb philosophical perspective because we made up this construct.

But one of the things that's awesome also about the Asian elephants is some Asian elephants, some of the ones that are born actually have they look they're not mammoth like, but they have a lot of fur on them and they kind of lose it over time.

But one of the things that's awesome also about the Asian elephants is some Asian elephants, some of the ones that are born actually have they look they're not mammoth like, but they have a lot of fur on them and they kind of lose it over time.

100 percent. Right. But I think that if we don't do big, bold things, it's it's important. You know, one of things we should definitely show is this is just like the guy in Jurassic Park. This is basically the same conversation. Don't worry. But John Hammond, I don't think that they were really focused on conservation unless there was a subplot that didn't make it to final cut.

100 percent. Right. But I think that if we don't do big, bold things, it's it's important. You know, one of things we should definitely show is this is just like the guy in Jurassic Park. This is basically the same conversation. Don't worry. But John Hammond, I don't think that they were really focused on conservation unless there was a subplot that didn't make it to final cut.

So if we could show the red wolf, I think that'd be amazing because all the technologies that we made on the path to bring back the dire wolf, we, one, make available to conservation.

So if we could show the red wolf, I think that'd be amazing because all the technologies that we made on the path to bring back the dire wolf, we, one, make available to conservation.

Yeah. So, uh, if you go to, um, the one more, yeah. So this is a red wolf. Uh, that's hope that's the world's first cloned red wolf. So I've actually made more red wolves than I've made dire wolves. So I've made four red wolves, one female. Are you just releasing these fuckers? No, no, they're, they're in a, they're in an ecological preserve as well.

Yeah. So, uh, if you go to, um, the one more, yeah. So this is a red wolf. Uh, that's hope that's the world's first cloned red wolf. So I've actually made more red wolves than I've made dire wolves. So I've made four red wolves, one female. Are you just releasing these fuckers? No, no, they're, they're in a, they're in an ecological preserve as well.

And so, but you're, you're gonna, you're gonna die when you hear what I went through on this. So I found out that, you know, we try to pair every de-extinction project with a species preservation project outside of making all of our technology for free, right? Everything that we make that has an application to conservation, anyone in the world can use to help save animals.

And so, but you're, you're gonna, you're gonna die when you hear what I went through on this. So I found out that, you know, we try to pair every de-extinction project with a species preservation project outside of making all of our technology for free, right? Everything that we make that has an application to conservation, anyone in the world can use to help save animals.

They don't pay us a dime. It's all open source. It's all free. We have 48 conservation partners. The team that's running the Northern White Rhino Project, we're their exclusive genetic rescue partner. We're working with elephants in Botswana, working elephants in Kenya. So anybody can use our technologies for free, right? We're working on chytrid, a terrible fungus in Australia.

They don't pay us a dime. It's all open source. It's all free. We have 48 conservation partners. The team that's running the Northern White Rhino Project, we're their exclusive genetic rescue partner. We're working with elephants in Botswana, working elephants in Kenya. So anybody can use our technologies for free, right? We're working on chytrid, a terrible fungus in Australia.

And so if that's not enough, I found out that, you know, that there's only 15 of those red wolves back in the wild in North Carolina. So I met with the upcoming governor.

And so if that's not enough, I found out that, you know, that there's only 15 of those red wolves back in the wild in North Carolina. So I met with the upcoming governor.

So are those the ones that you would find like in Thailand? Yes. And Thailand and then parts of different parts of India and the Indian subcontinent. I actually rode one of those once with my family. I don't recommend it. Did you go to one of those places that you take care of them?

So are those the ones that you would find like in Thailand? Yes. And Thailand and then parts of different parts of India and the Indian subcontinent. I actually rode one of those once with my family. I don't recommend it. Did you go to one of those places that you take care of them?

We'll get to that. We'll get to that. So they're only recognized by U.S. Fish and Wildlife there. But this incredible woman from Princeton, you know, top of her field, she's one of the top wolf geneticists in the world, Bridget Von Holt, identified a population of wolves in Louisiana that have red wolf-like characteristics. So she started darting them Taking samples.

We'll get to that. We'll get to that. So they're only recognized by U.S. Fish and Wildlife there. But this incredible woman from Princeton, you know, top of her field, she's one of the top wolf geneticists in the world, Bridget Von Holt, identified a population of wolves in Louisiana that have red wolf-like characteristics. So she started darting them Taking samples.

And what she found is they actually have more, quote unquote, red wolf in them than the red wolves that are being identified in in North Carolina.

And what she found is they actually have more, quote unquote, red wolf in them than the red wolves that are being identified in in North Carolina.

Yeah, but they've all been like these guys, like the ones in North Carolina have all inbred with coyotes. All the red wolves have some coyote in them because they look like coyotes. Well, the ones in North Carolina even look more like coyotes.

Yeah, but they've all been like these guys, like the ones in North Carolina have all inbred with coyotes. All the red wolves have some coyote in them because they look like coyotes. Well, the ones in North Carolina even look more like coyotes.

Yeah, because the reality is every single species is what's called an admixture. Everything is inbreeding with everything on some level, right? And so everything in life is an admixture. It goes back to the Neanderthal. So this binary idea that we have is silly. No, it's a human-caused construct, right? Right. It's insane. So I went to some folks from the last administration, right?

Yeah, because the reality is every single species is what's called an admixture. Everything is inbreeding with everything on some level, right? And so everything in life is an admixture. It goes back to the Neanderthal. So this binary idea that we have is silly. No, it's a human-caused construct, right? Right. It's insane. So I went to some folks from the last administration, right?

And I took some data with me, and I said, hey, we really want to help this Red Wolf program. We don't need any money. We open source all of our technologies. And we've used a technology that's non-invasive for cloning where we actually take a vial of blood, we isolate what's called endothelial progenitor cells, basically the inner lining of your blood vessel, right?

And I took some data with me, and I said, hey, we really want to help this Red Wolf program. We don't need any money. We open source all of our technologies. And we've used a technology that's non-invasive for cloning where we actually take a vial of blood, we isolate what's called endothelial progenitor cells, basically the inner lining of your blood vessel, right?

Because there's no nucleus in blood cells. So we catch those. And when we catch those, we then isolate them, we grow them, and we clone from them, right? Which is amazing because if you think about typical cloning from an animal welfare perspective, A lot of times you have to anesthetize the animal. You have to take ear punches, skin biopsies.

Because there's no nucleus in blood cells. So we catch those. And when we catch those, we then isolate them, we grow them, and we clone from them, right? Which is amazing because if you think about typical cloning from an animal welfare perspective, A lot of times you have to anesthetize the animal. You have to take ear punches, skin biopsies.

It's actually a pretty invasive, terrible process to do cloning. We can simply do it. Every single zoo takes blood from their animals to check certain levels and whatnot. We give blood all the time. And so it's about as non-invasive as you can get, right?

It's actually a pretty invasive, terrible process to do cloning. We can simply do it. Every single zoo takes blood from their animals to check certain levels and whatnot. We give blood all the time. And so it's about as non-invasive as you can get, right?

And so we found a way, which we're open sourcing on Tuesday, is open sourcing this model of how you go clone from blood, which is a game changer for biobanking because now you don't have to go herd an animal, take pieces of the animal, anesthetize the animal.

And so we found a way, which we're open sourcing on Tuesday, is open sourcing this model of how you go clone from blood, which is a game changer for biobanking because now you don't have to go herd an animal, take pieces of the animal, anesthetize the animal.

We can just take bloods and put them in freezers and be able to bring them back or clone them if there's a lack of genetic diversity using this thing. So I went out to Washington. With my team. I showed them, showed them hope as a baby and little videos of, and you may have videos of, of, of hope, Jamie. I don't know if it's in the folder. It showed him videos of hope.

We can just take bloods and put them in freezers and be able to bring them back or clone them if there's a lack of genetic diversity using this thing. So I went out to Washington. With my team. I showed them, showed them hope as a baby and little videos of, and you may have videos of, of, of hope, Jamie. I don't know if it's in the folder. It showed him videos of hope.

And I said, Hey, you know, there's, there's only a handful of, uh, we made these four wolves from three different genetic lines. Um, we made these from, we made these from three different genetic lines, right? So there's actually more genetic diversity in these wolves, uh, than what's alive in the population. And we said, we'd like for you to help protect the work that's being done in Louisiana.

And I said, Hey, you know, there's, there's only a handful of, uh, we made these four wolves from three different genetic lines. Um, we made these from, we made these from three different genetic lines, right? So there's actually more genetic diversity in these wolves, uh, than what's alive in the population. And we said, we'd like for you to help protect the work that's being done in Louisiana.

And then how many wolves would you like us to make using that population as well as frozen samples that are dead? And we'll just give them to you. There's no cost. Here was the feedback. We need to spend five to six years on an internal study and spend $22 million to see if it's possible to clone wolves. And I was blown away. I was like, oh, I'm so sorry. I wasn't very clear.

And then how many wolves would you like us to make using that population as well as frozen samples that are dead? And we'll just give them to you. There's no cost. Here was the feedback. We need to spend five to six years on an internal study and spend $22 million to see if it's possible to clone wolves. And I was blown away. I was like, oh, I'm so sorry. I wasn't very clear.

This is a cloned wolf. Like here, you can fly with me to the preserve. You have to sign an NDA, but you fly with me to the preserve. And they're like... We need to spend five to six years and 20 plus million dollars to go understand this. To understand this podcast. We'll give you all of the technology. And if you tell me you want 100 wolves, I'll just make you 100 wolves.

This is a cloned wolf. Like here, you can fly with me to the preserve. You have to sign an NDA, but you fly with me to the preserve. And they're like... We need to spend five to six years and 20 plus million dollars to go understand this. To understand this podcast. We'll give you all of the technology. And if you tell me you want 100 wolves, I'll just make you 100 wolves.

I got to drop my hydrogen tablet in here.

I got to drop my hydrogen tablet in here.

And we'll even engineer in more genetic diversity for you. And the response was, we'll get back to you. We went to, we tried to have three other meetings, no showed and canceled, every time, when we were there.

And we'll even engineer in more genetic diversity for you. And the response was, we'll get back to you. We went to, we tried to have three other meetings, no showed and canceled, every time, when we were there.

I just got back from a meeting with the Department of Interior, which Fish and Wildlife rolls up to, and they're very, very focused on innovation, not regulation, which has been pretty amazing. And immediately they said, we celebrate, Doug Burgum, the Secretary of Interior there, who we met with, said,

I just got back from a meeting with the Department of Interior, which Fish and Wildlife rolls up to, and they're very, very focused on innovation, not regulation, which has been pretty amazing. And immediately they said, we celebrate, Doug Burgum, the Secretary of Interior there, who we met with, said,

we celebrate he's a huge conservationist huge teddy roosevelt guy member of the explorers club and he's like that we do not have a celebration when animals come off the endangered species list only about three percent ever come off and we're really good at putting them on and we celebrate putting them on so we have to do something about this and if you're saying that we could productionize species and as long as we have the right support to rewild them

we celebrate he's a huge conservationist huge teddy roosevelt guy member of the explorers club and he's like that we do not have a celebration when animals come off the endangered species list only about three percent ever come off and we're really good at putting them on and we celebrate putting them on so we have to do something about this and if you're saying that we could productionize species and as long as we have the right support to rewild them

People can use your technologies for free to make more of these different species that are critically endangered while also biobanking the samples along the way. He's like, why wouldn't we do this? And I was like, why not with the previous folks? And they said that we need, you know, five years and 20 million that they were going to spend internally.

People can use your technologies for free to make more of these different species that are critically endangered while also biobanking the samples along the way. He's like, why wouldn't we do this? And I was like, why not with the previous folks? And they said that we need, you know, five years and 20 million that they were going to spend internally.

They weren't going to ask us to do the feasibility. So they were going to spend it internally on this. And we're like, we'll just do it for free. And he's like, we will completely support the initiative and we're going to help get you plugged in so you can help biobank our species and also help us support, you know, red wolf conservation.

They weren't going to ask us to do the feasibility. So they were going to spend it internally on this. And we're like, we'll just do it for free. And he's like, we will completely support the initiative and we're going to help get you plugged in so you can help biobank our species and also help us support, you know, red wolf conservation.

Soulless red wolves from hell.

Soulless red wolves from hell.

Yeah. Are we going to? I think you focus on the species that are critically endangered and are keystone species, meaning the environment needs them. Right, but you're bringing them back. But the ones that we drove to extinction, right? Okay.

Yeah. Are we going to? I think you focus on the species that are critically endangered and are keystone species, meaning the environment needs them. Right, but you're bringing them back. But the ones that we drove to extinction, right? Okay.

Really quickly, yeah.

Really quickly, yeah.

I think most likely it's a combination. We do know that when early anthropologic effects from humans, that when early man went onto a landmass at scale, that we start to see that. We see that in Australia and other places. But to your point, it's much slower. It's much, much slower.

I think most likely it's a combination. We do know that when early anthropologic effects from humans, that when early man went onto a landmass at scale, that we start to see that. We see that in Australia and other places. But to your point, it's much slower. It's much, much slower.

We, so we get, everyone seems to have their favorite animal up for us to save, right? Like the vaquita.

We, so we get, everyone seems to have their favorite animal up for us to save, right? Like the vaquita.

That would be my favorite. Dire wolves, you got to come, maybe at some point you'd see them, but. I want to. They're amazing. I mean, they're, they're, they're just beautiful animals. Yeah. Um, so, uh, we, they're, they're, so saber, saber tooth tiger is a class of, we put it, that is a class of, Most commonly, people think of the Smilodon as the saber-tooth tiger.

That would be my favorite. Dire wolves, you got to come, maybe at some point you'd see them, but. I want to. They're amazing. I mean, they're, they're, they're just beautiful animals. Yeah. Um, so, uh, we, they're, they're, so saber, saber tooth tiger is a class of, we put it, that is a class of, Most commonly, people think of the Smilodon as the saber-tooth tiger.

There's not, to date, been really great Smilodon DNA. There is great homotherium DNA, which is another type of saber-tooth cat.

There's not, to date, been really great Smilodon DNA. There is great homotherium DNA, which is another type of saber-tooth cat.

They classify them differently, you know, based on it. Obviously, you've been studying this, so you're thinking about doing it. I'm not... I mean, we like to study ancient DNA, right? Like, you know, one of the things where I think that, you know, John Reeves is 100% right is... People say there were no saber-toothed tigers in Alaska. That's just an incorrect statement.

They classify them differently, you know, based on it. Obviously, you've been studying this, so you're thinking about doing it. I'm not... I mean, we like to study ancient DNA, right? Like, you know, one of the things where I think that, you know, John Reeves is 100% right is... People say there were no saber-toothed tigers in Alaska. That's just an incorrect statement.

There were probably no smilodons there, but there are homotheriums, which are a saber-toothed cat.

There were probably no smilodons there, but there are homotheriums, which are a saber-toothed cat.

I've held things in his – I've held a direwolf skull in his – I hope he's fine with me saying that – in his facility. Okay. Yeah, I think he's talked about that.

I've held things in his – I've held a direwolf skull in his – I hope he's fine with me saying that – in his facility. Okay. Yeah, I think he's talked about that.

Yeah, so Homo Theorem is still a saber-toothed cat. But what happens is, this goes back to that philosophical perspective. They think that only, so if you look up Smilodon in comparison.

Yeah, so Homo Theorem is still a saber-toothed cat. But what happens is, this goes back to that philosophical perspective. They think that only, so if you look up Smilodon in comparison.

It has the largest known teeth. But when people think of saber-toothed tiger, this is what, or saber-toothed cat, this is what they think of. Those are crazy.

It has the largest known teeth. But when people think of saber-toothed tiger, this is what, or saber-toothed cat, this is what they think of. Those are crazy.

I mean, probably having to pierce things like mammoth hides in them because they're quite thick.

I mean, probably having to pierce things like mammoth hides in them because they're quite thick.

I love, because we don't, you know what's amazing? We don't have the DNA from it, so we have no idea what the color pattern is, which you can see here, right?

I love, because we don't, you know what's amazing? We don't have the DNA from it, so we have no idea what the color pattern is, which you can see here, right?

So we do have, there have been some really well-preserved pups and others in the permafrost of homotherium. Whoa.

So we do have, there have been some really well-preserved pups and others in the permafrost of homotherium. Whoa.

We don't. I don't want to say we do or don't. We have not done the analysis on that, on homotherium yet.

We don't. I don't want to say we do or don't. We have not done the analysis on that, on homotherium yet.

We do have the genome of it, though.

We do have the genome of it, though.

Okay, so that has brown hair. Have you seen the American short-faced bear?

Okay, so that has brown hair. Have you seen the American short-faced bear?

That's the thing I'm probably the most scared of. Yeah, you can't bring that back. 17 or 18-foot giant bear. You can't bring that back. We're not working on it. I'm just saying it.

That's the thing I'm probably the most scared of. Yeah, you can't bring that back. 17 or 18-foot giant bear. You can't bring that back. We're not working on it. I'm just saying it.

Those are great. Yeah, I love those. I just didn't want you to think we were going a different direction.

Those are great. Yeah, I love those. I just didn't want you to think we were going a different direction.

I think there's a video on my Instagram of it.

I think there's a video on my Instagram of it.

Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

But if you scroll down a little bit further, you'll see and just like if you just do a quick scroll, you'll see that we actually have gone out and partnered with all these different groups, even though we don't have thylacines. We have quarterly meetings in Tasmania around rewilding the thylacine with in one of the groups that we have involved in is the Logging Commission.

But if you scroll down a little bit further, you'll see and just like if you just do a quick scroll, you'll see that we actually have gone out and partnered with all these different groups, even though we don't have thylacines. We have quarterly meetings in Tasmania around rewilding the thylacine with in one of the groups that we have involved in is the Logging Commission.

Going back to your how do we live with nature, kind of like with your example with the cattlemen and the ranchers. Well, the biggest economic driver right now in Tasmania is actually the logging commission.

Going back to your how do we live with nature, kind of like with your example with the cattlemen and the ranchers. Well, the biggest economic driver right now in Tasmania is actually the logging commission.

So if you think that you're going to reintroduce an animal back without them or their lobbyists having an end to the forest, without them having a perspective, then I think that's just a naive way to look at the world.

So if you think that you're going to reintroduce an animal back without them or their lobbyists having an end to the forest, without them having a perspective, then I think that's just a naive way to look at the world.

And so we going back like the thylacine and mammoths and others, we try to build these working groups in ahead of time so that people can get excited about, you know, you know, what are the challenges? What are the unintended consequences? And that's not our job to persuade them. It's just our job to kind of listen to them and then figure it out.

And so we going back like the thylacine and mammoths and others, we try to build these working groups in ahead of time so that people can get excited about, you know, you know, what are the challenges? What are the unintended consequences? And that's not our job to persuade them. It's just our job to kind of listen to them and then figure it out.

And, you know, that that approach of like listening to our critics and listening and being inclusive in these communities has helped us, I think, traumatically think through what our rewilding strategies are.

And, you know, that that approach of like listening to our critics and listening and being inclusive in these communities has helped us, I think, traumatically think through what our rewilding strategies are.

And the woolly mice are not getting released. Right, right, right.

And the woolly mice are not getting released. Right, right, right.

Yes.

Yes.

So on the evolve part, this is actually kind of weird. So you do ecological field studies. So you work with ecologists, conservationists, predator experts, like people that understand predation, people that understand the land. So you have to work with these kind of big working groups. We have a project going on right now in central Tasmania, which is amazing.

So on the evolve part, this is actually kind of weird. So you do ecological field studies. So you work with ecologists, conservationists, predator experts, like people that understand predation, people that understand the land. So you have to work with these kind of big working groups. We have a project going on right now in central Tasmania, which is amazing.

You know the old school Looney Tunes, like Wile E. Coyote, where he goes through a wall and there's a hole, or the Kool-Aid Man, right? Well, if you had that cutout, we made cutouts and painted them of thylacines, but also of cats and dogs and wolves and other things. And we put them out near camera traps in central Tasmania.

You know the old school Looney Tunes, like Wile E. Coyote, where he goes through a wall and there's a hole, or the Kool-Aid Man, right? Well, if you had that cutout, we made cutouts and painted them of thylacines, but also of cats and dogs and wolves and other things. And we put them out near camera traps in central Tasmania.

And when we've reviewed the data, you'll have like a quoll or a wombat or one of these animals kind of walking through or even a wallaby kind of walking through. And they'll see a cat. They'll see a cat and they'll kind of look at it. Remember, to your point, for them, it's multiple generations, right? Because these animals don't live hundreds of years.

And when we've reviewed the data, you'll have like a quoll or a wombat or one of these animals kind of walking through or even a wallaby kind of walking through. And they'll see a cat. They'll see a cat and they'll kind of look at it. Remember, to your point, for them, it's multiple generations, right? Because these animals don't live hundreds of years.

So I kind of fell into it. I didn't wake up and say, I saw Jurassic Park. I'm super stoked. I love animals. I want to go work on this. I'm just a weirdly curious person. So there's this guy named George Church. If you don't know George, you should look him up. He's the father of synthetic biologies at Harvard University. He's six foot seven with narcolepsy. He's just the best, right?

So I kind of fell into it. I didn't wake up and say, I saw Jurassic Park. I'm super stoked. I love animals. I want to go work on this. I'm just a weirdly curious person. So there's this guy named George Church. If you don't know George, you should look him up. He's the father of synthetic biologies at Harvard University. He's six foot seven with narcolepsy. He's just the best, right?

And so when they see the cutout and shape and the coloration and size of a thylacine, they freeze and they absolutely freak out. Wow. Yeah. So we've been collecting this data for 18 months. We're publishing a paper on it. That is so cool. There's like generational trauma that is baked in to their DNA to avoid a thylacine.

And so when they see the cutout and shape and the coloration and size of a thylacine, they freeze and they absolutely freak out. Wow. Yeah. So we've been collecting this data for 18 months. We're publishing a paper on it. That is so cool. There's like generational trauma that is baked in to their DNA to avoid a thylacine.

This enormous thing with this robotic pretensile arm. Yeah, it's crazy. As long as you're cool to them, they're cool to you. Yeah, they sense it. Right. Yeah. I mean, we see that nature with a lot of animals. Right. If you sense it and they don't feel like they're, you know, being backed into a corner or fearful, then they're not going to be around that.

This enormous thing with this robotic pretensile arm. Yeah, it's crazy. As long as you're cool to them, they're cool to you. Yeah, they sense it. Right. Yeah. I mean, we see that nature with a lot of animals. Right. If you sense it and they don't feel like they're, you know, being backed into a corner or fearful, then they're not going to be around that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So I don't have like road noise. I'm like, this is going to be really hard to get out of here.

So I don't have like road noise. I'm like, this is going to be really hard to get out of here.

No, I can't.

No, I can't.

Well, I hate flying, too, which sucks because I fly. Yeah, I don't like it. I fly all the time.

Well, I hate flying, too, which sucks because I fly. Yeah, I don't like it. I fly all the time.

Because the worst is when you're sitting there, and there's now been these renders of planes that have glass or plexiglass. I'm like, I don't want to see that. I get mad if I get on a plane and the people don't shut the windows. I'm in the tube. It's lit on fire. I just want to go.

Because the worst is when you're sitting there, and there's now been these renders of planes that have glass or plexiglass. I'm like, I don't want to see that. I get mad if I get on a plane and the people don't shut the windows. I'm in the tube. It's lit on fire. I just want to go.

Because if you think about the point where you're sitting in a chair, and then you look down, and you have a floor, you're like... There's not that much. There's like 10,000 feet or 3,000 feet below me.

Because if you think about the point where you're sitting in a chair, and then you look down, and you have a floor, you're like... There's not that much. There's like 10,000 feet or 3,000 feet below me.

A Delta Airlines life. Yeah. It wasn't like crazy airline you've never heard of.

A Delta Airlines life. Yeah. It wasn't like crazy airline you've never heard of.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And I go to D.C. a decent amount. And so, like, the whole D.C. thing, like, absolutely freaked me out.

And I go to D.C. a decent amount. And so, like, the whole D.C. thing, like, absolutely freaked me out.

Yeah. Because sometimes I stay at some of those hotels that are right on the river, and you see the choppers fly. You see the choppers fly. You see the choppers fly.

Yeah. Because sometimes I stay at some of those hotels that are right on the river, and you see the choppers fly. You see the choppers fly. You see the choppers fly.

Yeah, you're out.

Yeah, you're out.

Bye-bye. If I saw a ghost, I'm like, all right, I'm moving.

Bye-bye. If I saw a ghost, I'm like, all right, I'm moving.

I'm not scared of thylacines. I'm not.

I'm not scared of thylacines. I'm not.

So I was like, I'm going to be very nice on all of my requests on Croc.

So I was like, I'm going to be very nice on all of my requests on Croc.

So some of our animals I've been around and they're starting to get quite large, which I'm sure we'll talk about at some point. Yeah. That. Yeah. At some point, though, you're still kind of like they are wild animals. So you have to maintain some level of healthy distance.

So some of our animals I've been around and they're starting to get quite large, which I'm sure we'll talk about at some point. Yeah. That. Yeah. At some point, though, you're still kind of like they are wild animals. So you have to maintain some level of healthy distance.

Did you see that study that came out a couple weeks ago that having two eggs, I'm going to get the numbers wrong, but you have two eggs, if you have at least two eggs a week, that it lowers the probability of Alzheimer's by like 47%. Yeah. Yeah.

Did you see that study that came out a couple weeks ago that having two eggs, I'm going to get the numbers wrong, but you have two eggs, if you have at least two eggs a week, that it lowers the probability of Alzheimer's by like 47%. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

They're saying that Gary said it was, I think it was Gary that was telling me that he thought it was like, it's now becoming a more popular belief that it's diabetes type 3.

They're saying that Gary said it was, I think it was Gary that was telling me that he thought it was like, it's now becoming a more popular belief that it's diabetes type 3.

I feel incredible. I mean, isn't it nuts?

I feel incredible. I mean, isn't it nuts?

I mean, part of the reason I started Colossal, I mean, I told you the story about how I got with George. But before that, I built a handful of different technology companies. My last company was a satellite software and defense company and was building it, running it. And this was in early, late 2019, early 2020. I had to be in Tokyo and I had to be in Shanghai. So I came back.

I mean, part of the reason I started Colossal, I mean, I told you the story about how I got with George. But before that, I built a handful of different technology companies. My last company was a satellite software and defense company and was building it, running it. And this was in early, late 2019, early 2020. I had to be in Tokyo and I had to be in Shanghai. So I came back.

I went to CES, the big consumer electronics show in Vegas. Saw everyone in the world, right, that's there because it's stupid big. A week and a half later, I'm in NASA Marshall with the director there because we're doing some work for NASA at the time of my last company. And I was with one of my number two, my number two of the company, this guy named Greg, who's our chief strategy officer.

I went to CES, the big consumer electronics show in Vegas. Saw everyone in the world, right, that's there because it's stupid big. A week and a half later, I'm in NASA Marshall with the director there because we're doing some work for NASA at the time of my last company. And I was with one of my number two, my number two of the company, this guy named Greg, who's our chief strategy officer.

He was coughing. He wasn't feeling well. We both were kind of feeling like shit. I was like, oh, we've been on the road a lot. We've been drinking. We came back on a Friday, a Friday night. We had we were going back on Slack around talking about aliens and shit. And then the next day I got a call from his wife that he had a sudden cardiac event.

He was coughing. He wasn't feeling well. We both were kind of feeling like shit. I was like, oh, we've been on the road a lot. We've been drinking. We came back on a Friday, a Friday night. We had we were going back on Slack around talking about aliens and shit. And then the next day I got a call from his wife that he had a sudden cardiac event.

And so that for me was a big wake up call because I got really sick during COVID. Like I was on that early strain of COVID. And there's definitely multiple strains. I don't care what anyone tells you. There's definitely multiple things that came out of the thing. And so I got super, super sick. And, you know, I now rarely drink. I rarely have caffeine.

And so that for me was a big wake up call because I got really sick during COVID. Like I was on that early strain of COVID. And there's definitely multiple strains. I don't care what anyone tells you. There's definitely multiple things that came out of the thing. And so I got super, super sick. And, you know, I now rarely drink. I rarely have caffeine.

You know, I've kind of tried to cut out some exercise regularly. And looking at all these things that people think are weird or that used to be weird or alternative, like, you know, a dry sauna, a cold plunge, red light. I do that every day now. Every day. Every day.

You know, I've kind of tried to cut out some exercise regularly. And looking at all these things that people think are weird or that used to be weird or alternative, like, you know, a dry sauna, a cold plunge, red light. I do that every day now. Every day. Every day.

Yeah, lifting weights on a regimen, everything.

Yeah, lifting weights on a regimen, everything.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Please. So we have the ancient genome. So you have to collect and assemble. Right. And that's a lot of people just think of us in the lab, like just a bunch of people in the lab. But that's like some Indiana Jones shit. Like we're literally going into the permafrost and like collecting dead samples from the permafrost, which, you know, you've had, you know, John Reeves on here.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Please. So we have the ancient genome. So you have to collect and assemble. Right. And that's a lot of people just think of us in the lab, like just a bunch of people in the lab. But that's like some Indiana Jones shit. Like we're literally going into the permafrost and like collecting dead samples from the permafrost, which, you know, you've had, you know, John Reeves on here.

Well, I don't want to be, like, I now have a nine-month-old son, right? And he, like, wants to hang out, and, you know, he's going to get bigger. And if I can't pick him up, that's a sad day, you know? And I've kind of gotten this mindset of, like, you know, I see people that are older that are in wheelchairs or can't walk. It's kind of a blessing to walk. It is.

Well, I don't want to be, like, I now have a nine-month-old son, right? And he, like, wants to hang out, and, you know, he's going to get bigger. And if I can't pick him up, that's a sad day, you know? And I've kind of gotten this mindset of, like, you know, I see people that are older that are in wheelchairs or can't walk. It's kind of a blessing to walk. It is.

So why would I squander that blessing? Why would I not lean into it and make sure that when I'm 90 I can walk?

So why would I squander that blessing? Why would I not lean into it and make sure that when I'm 90 I can walk?

And I'm on the journey. I'm not at the end, right? It is a constant journey.

And I'm on the journey. I'm not at the end, right? It is a constant journey.

But since I started working with Gary, have you seen this function test? Have you done the function test? What is the function? It's like function health. It's like a it's just a suit. It's just all if you go to your doctor, like I do quarterly blood work. But then I also then do this, the function test, which is a massively all encompassing type of blood. It's like two tests twice a year.

But since I started working with Gary, have you seen this function test? Have you done the function test? What is the function? It's like function health. It's like a it's just a suit. It's just all if you go to your doctor, like I do quarterly blood work. But then I also then do this, the function test, which is a massively all encompassing type of blood. It's like two tests twice a year.

And so I do that test. And after working with Gary for a while, you know, now my my biological age or my actual age is 43. My my biological age is 35.

And so I do that test. And after working with Gary for a while, you know, now my my biological age or my actual age is 43. My my biological age is 35.

And it's just been working for a year with Gary taking the right supplements, getting the right routine, giving myself nutrients. You know, I buy – and you can actually taste a difference, right? Like if you go to a store and get a steak or chicken, even if it's like free range and all that shit – It tastes great. It tastes better than something that you buy that's terrible at a store.

And it's just been working for a year with Gary taking the right supplements, getting the right routine, giving myself nutrients. You know, I buy – and you can actually taste a difference, right? Like if you go to a store and get a steak or chicken, even if it's like free range and all that shit – It tastes great. It tastes better than something that you buy that's terrible at a store.

But when you order from some of these true Amish places and places that have actually grown the food completely natural, that doesn't have just a fake... pre-purchased certified organic, you can taste the difference in the nutrient density. It's insane.

But when you order from some of these true Amish places and places that have actually grown the food completely natural, that doesn't have just a fake... pre-purchased certified organic, you can taste the difference in the nutrient density. It's insane.

Yeah. So that's what I order now. So I order a bunch. So I do elk steaks. I do a lot of steaks from this farm that Gary recommended to me. It's just great.

Yeah. So that's what I order now. So I order a bunch. So I do elk steaks. I do a lot of steaks from this farm that Gary recommended to me. It's just great.

They do have bison, too. Yeah, it's Parker Pastures. They're just, like, when I have a steak from these guys, like, it's been, like, you can taste it. And I've had, like, my brother-in-law and my father-in-law had friends. I was like, no, no, we're going to try these steaks out of the freezer. I was like, we're not just going to buy something.

They do have bison, too. Yeah, it's Parker Pastures. They're just, like, when I have a steak from these guys, like, it's been, like, you can taste it. And I've had, like, my brother-in-law and my father-in-law had friends. I was like, no, no, we're going to try these steaks out of the freezer. I was like, we're not just going to buy something.

It looks different. Yeah, it looks different.

It looks different. Yeah, it looks different.

It's disgusting. Yeah. It's it smells like death. It literally I mean, I guess it is death. It's just over time piled up death. Have you visited, John? Yeah, I visited, John. You went to the boneyard? Yeah, I went to the boneyard. What's it like there? It's crazy. It's exactly what you'd expect. I didn't know John. So I'm on the board of trustees of the Explorers Club.

It's disgusting. Yeah. It's it smells like death. It literally I mean, I guess it is death. It's just over time piled up death. Have you visited, John? Yeah, I visited, John. You went to the boneyard? Yeah, I went to the boneyard. What's it like there? It's crazy. It's exactly what you'd expect. I didn't know John. So I'm on the board of trustees of the Explorers Club.

Yeah, it looks completely different, but the taste- It tastes different. You want to eat more of it. I feel full, but I want to finish it, and I also feel like I'm like- My body likes this because it's getting shit that it hasn't been getting.

Yeah, it looks completely different, but the taste- It tastes different. You want to eat more of it. I feel full, but I want to finish it, and I also feel like I'm like- My body likes this because it's getting shit that it hasn't been getting.

It's awesome. It is so great. But in the early days of Colossal, that was one of the things that we got asked by, like, heads of state, like not, not by like, you know, just random people, random people on the internet do it mostly like some people at large, uh, at different locations. They're like, can we eat them? Can we eat a mammoth? What's it taste like?

It's awesome. It is so great. But in the early days of Colossal, that was one of the things that we got asked by, like, heads of state, like not, not by like, you know, just random people, random people on the internet do it mostly like some people at large, uh, at different locations. They're like, can we eat them? Can we eat a mammoth? What's it taste like?

That was like, that question came up faster than we thought. And this isn't the, I know that wasn't the first weird.

That was like, that question came up faster than we thought. And this isn't the, I know that wasn't the first weird.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

It was also domestic, the question happened domestically.

It was also domestic, the question happened domestically.

Yeah, it's been... Go buy a car, you retards.

Yeah, it's been... Go buy a car, you retards.

We get the dinosaur question. Probably the number one question we get is the dinosaur question.

We get the dinosaur question. Probably the number one question we get is the dinosaur question.

We know that some dinosaurs had feathers. We know some had hair, like kind of precursor to feathers. And we know some that were just scaly. We have preserves of them. We can see in the fossil record whether they had it, right?

We know that some dinosaurs had feathers. We know some had hair, like kind of precursor to feathers. And we know some that were just scaly. We have preserves of them. We can see in the fossil record whether they had it, right?

Have you seen the Watson? No. Can we pull up a Watson? So this is a bird that lives today in the Amazon. Watson. It's called a Hudson. I don't know how you spell it. It's like H-O-A-T-Z-E-N or something like that. We can find it. Yeah. Apparently it also smells terrible. But if you type in, oh yeah, it's the Hudson.

Have you seen the Watson? No. Can we pull up a Watson? So this is a bird that lives today in the Amazon. Watson. It's called a Hudson. I don't know how you spell it. It's like H-O-A-T-Z-E-N or something like that. We can find it. Yeah. Apparently it also smells terrible. But if you type in, oh yeah, it's the Hudson.

And then if you click in and find a baby picture, it's got these little creepy hands. It looks like kind of like a bird-like dinosaur. We did the Geno on this for fun. Oh, yeah, you can see it. It climbs. So before it ever climbs, it actually climbs up everything.

And then if you click in and find a baby picture, it's got these little creepy hands. It looks like kind of like a bird-like dinosaur. We did the Geno on this for fun. Oh, yeah, you can see it. It climbs. So before it ever climbs, it actually climbs up everything.

And then it evolves. Like if you, the first kind of like quote unquote dinosaur bird out there, it actually, yeah, it crawls. It crawls like it doesn't fly. You know, most birds just sit there with their little like wing nubs and just don't do anything. These guys actually climb. What about terror birds? Oh, yeah. Those are scary.

And then it evolves. Like if you, the first kind of like quote unquote dinosaur bird out there, it actually, yeah, it crawls. It crawls like it doesn't fly. You know, most birds just sit there with their little like wing nubs and just don't do anything. These guys actually climb. What about terror birds? Oh, yeah. Those are scary.

So we take these expeditions. We did an expedition to Alaska to do mammoth retrieval. And then we're also doing some cultural studies with some of the indigenous people groups around mammoths. Like, do you want mammoths back? Is this a good idea, right? Because we try to be pretty inclusive. Yeah. And they were like, oh, we got to meet the biggest landowner in Alaska, John.

So we take these expeditions. We did an expedition to Alaska to do mammoth retrieval. And then we're also doing some cultural studies with some of the indigenous people groups around mammoths. Like, do you want mammoths back? Is this a good idea, right? Because we try to be pretty inclusive. Yeah. And they were like, oh, we got to meet the biggest landowner in Alaska, John.

Millions, right. The oldest DNA that we have is about 1.5 million years old. That's it? Yeah. So dinosaurs are out of the picture. So you can – a guy you should talk to about – not that, but that's interesting – is Kenneth Lacovara. He discovered the four largest dinosaurs of all time, including Dreadnoughts, which is just – It's the craziest thing ever. Dreadnought. Dreadnoughtus.

Millions, right. The oldest DNA that we have is about 1.5 million years old. That's it? Yeah. So dinosaurs are out of the picture. So you can – a guy you should talk to about – not that, but that's interesting – is Kenneth Lacovara. He discovered the four largest dinosaurs of all time, including Dreadnoughts, which is just – It's the craziest thing ever. Dreadnought. Dreadnoughtus.

And going back to the issues that... What is Dreadnoughtus? Oh, Dreadnoughtus is amazing. So, I don't know if it looks like that. Imagine if it did. Yeah, go to that.

And going back to the issues that... What is Dreadnoughtus? Oh, Dreadnoughtus is amazing. So, I don't know if it looks like that. Imagine if it did. Yeah, go to that.

It's the size of a fucking...

It's the size of a fucking...

Going back to this crazy notion of museums, he found it in Argentina. And he's amazing. Kenneth Lacovara, he's amazing. He found it in Argentina, discovered the species, named the species. And he brought it to New Jersey to do all the modeling and all that. The government changed. And they yanked it back. You know the old school, like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark? That's where it is.

Going back to this crazy notion of museums, he found it in Argentina. And he's amazing. Kenneth Lacovara, he's amazing. He found it in Argentina, discovered the species, named the species. And he brought it to New Jersey to do all the modeling and all that. The government changed. And they yanked it back. You know the old school, like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark? That's where it is.

It's basically in a warehouse. So it's on display for people in a museum. It's literally, this goes back to some of these governments and these museums. It's literally like not on, it's in a bunch of crates in Western Argentina. Really? Yeah. And it's like the coolest thing ever. This is. Yeah. So, yeah, that's like of ours lab. And so but but it's it's truly, truly amazing.

It's basically in a warehouse. So it's on display for people in a museum. It's literally, this goes back to some of these governments and these museums. It's literally like not on, it's in a bunch of crates in Western Argentina. Really? Yeah. And it's like the coolest thing ever. This is. Yeah. So, yeah, that's like of ours lab. And so but but it's it's truly, truly amazing.

Like a lot of them, they've created artificial bones to fill in the blanks, fill in a lot of like sometimes they'll get like a jawbone and they're like, and here's the reconstruction.

Like a lot of them, they've created artificial bones to fill in the blanks, fill in a lot of like sometimes they'll get like a jawbone and they're like, and here's the reconstruction.

When it's only a percentage complete.

When it's only a percentage complete.

And they're like 4%. Yeah.

And they're like 4%. Yeah.

They look absolutely, if you look at it, they look like the scariest things ever. And then you put a whale on there and you're like, oh, that's not the worst thing.

They look absolutely, if you look at it, they look like the scariest things ever. And then you put a whale on there and you're like, oh, that's not the worst thing.

And I was like, okay, great. I'm excited. So go meet him. We pull up. He's in a different car. And he's like, and I think he wanted us to follow him. He's like, get in. I was like, okay. And he's a big dude. He's enormous. I'm not that big of a dude, right? No, especially after. John's a giant. Especially after Gary Breck has been working on me. I'm a smaller dude. Right.

And I was like, okay, great. I'm excited. So go meet him. We pull up. He's in a different car. And he's like, and I think he wanted us to follow him. He's like, get in. I was like, okay. And he's a big dude. He's enormous. I'm not that big of a dude, right? No, especially after. John's a giant. Especially after Gary Breck has been working on me. I'm a smaller dude. Right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It looks like an alien monster.

It looks like an alien monster.

There was one species that we don't have DNA for that would be amazing to bring back because the ecological benefit is there was a giant beaver. Yeah. A giant beaver sounds amazing and stupid.

There was one species that we don't have DNA for that would be amazing to bring back because the ecological benefit is there was a giant beaver. Yeah. A giant beaver sounds amazing and stupid.

I don't know. It would probably be in the late Pleistocene.

I don't know. It would probably be in the late Pleistocene.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, on the dinosaur bones.

Well, on the dinosaur bones.

That could have been the same thing. 12,000 years ago.

That could have been the same thing. 12,000 years ago.

Oh, because of the American lion?

Oh, because of the American lion?

American cheetah.

American cheetah.

No, I've never seen one in real life.

No, I've never seen one in real life.

Can anything catch them now?

Can anything catch them now?

It looks like from a Star Wars movie.

It looks like from a Star Wars movie.

And so like I literally get in. I get in the car. There's a there's a bunch of stickers and there's one that has butterflies on it that says give zero fucks. And I was like and then there's just move the gun over. So I move the gun over and he goes, listen, and this is the first words out of his mouth to me. If I stop short, you hand me that gun.

And so like I literally get in. I get in the car. There's a there's a bunch of stickers and there's one that has butterflies on it that says give zero fucks. And I was like and then there's just move the gun over. So I move the gun over and he goes, listen, and this is the first words out of his mouth to me. If I stop short, you hand me that gun.

yeah and they are they're literally on the side there yeah they this is what would have been so amazing to like look at what the earth looked like you know 12 000 years ago it is it is cool like america like to to your point when you travel and you go to these different places where you have that are truly more remote right and i'm not just talking about like yellowstone but you know like when you've said like going to kruger national park or looking at some of these places in africa when you go to central tasmania

yeah and they are they're literally on the side there yeah they this is what would have been so amazing to like look at what the earth looked like you know 12 000 years ago it is it is cool like america like to to your point when you travel and you go to these different places where you have that are truly more remote right and i'm not just talking about like yellowstone but you know like when you've said like going to kruger national park or looking at some of these places in africa when you go to central tasmania

it's almost like a weird Disney movie. Like at dusk, you've got like echidnas running around and you've got wallabies jumping through. And they all just come through and you're like, it's like that scene in like Ace Ventura, right? Where he sings and like everything fucking comes to him. And I remember the first I was like, this isn't real. Like, are these animatronics?

it's almost like a weird Disney movie. Like at dusk, you've got like echidnas running around and you've got wallabies jumping through. And they all just come through and you're like, it's like that scene in like Ace Ventura, right? Where he sings and like everything fucking comes to him. And I remember the first I was like, this isn't real. Like, are these animatronics?

There's no way there's this much life in biodiversity. And it's all and it was all just like, you know, the echidnas are running. The wallabies are jumping. You've got like wombats like kind of like kind of scurrying along. And you're just like, there's all these weird, dumb animals that are just excited. You know, they're so strange to us. Right.

There's no way there's this much life in biodiversity. And it's all and it was all just like, you know, the echidnas are running. The wallabies are jumping. You've got like wombats like kind of like kind of scurrying along. And you're just like, there's all these weird, dumb animals that are just excited. You know, they're so strange to us. Right.

In terms of how we think about them, because you never see them. But then there's just like this insane plethora of them. They're just so many. It's crazy.

In terms of how we think about them, because you never see them. But then there's just like this insane plethora of them. They're just so many. It's crazy.

So they say that- Because that was kind of the only thing that was- for Tasmania and lower Australia. And have you seen a Tasmanian devil in person? Not in person. They're awesome.

So they say that- Because that was kind of the only thing that was- for Tasmania and lower Australia. And have you seen a Tasmanian devil in person? Not in person. They're awesome.

They're cool as shit. They're awesome. They eat in these little packs. And the reason why they call them Tasmanian devils is because they make the weirdest – I mean, they make – if I heard the sounds that they make, if you're out in the woods and you hear that sound, you're like, this is Sasquatch. This is crazy.