Aaron Day
Appearances
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Yes, yes. Hold on, turn off my loud air. Yeah, so this one's from Aaron Day, and it's about Roger Ver is facing a tax case so absurd it's clearly retaliation. Charged as a non-citizen for taxes he didn't owe, he's being punished for empowering individuals and challenging central banks. Stand with the anti-bill gate at freerogernow.org.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Yeah, the other one that I posted, it's an excerpt from a tweet from a guy named Amir. And he's basically defending Roger, even though he said that Roger is actually, I believe they had been in a lawsuit before that Roger sued him for $2 million. But he's saying, but that doesn't matter now since we're all libertarians and we must stick together. Crypto is under attack.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So it's a defense of him from someone who had been sued by him that's trying to defend him on principle.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Thank you for having me.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Sorry, Drew. Aaron R. Day. Yeah. I don't want to mess people up on the podcast.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, Bitcoin initially was a serious threat to central banks. I actually learned about Bitcoin in 2012 from Roger at a Free State Project conference called Liberty Forum. And in the early days, when I first received my first Bitcoin, it was faster, cheaper and easier to use than anything coming from the traditional financial system.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And you have to remember, Bitcoin was released just after the 2008 financial collapse. And so this is when people were worried about the banks and understood that banks always seem to get bailed out and that central banks are funding all of these wars all over the world. And so people started using it. I started using it in 2012 for day-to-day purchases. And by about 2017, it became very popular.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Large retailers like Overstock.com, Expedia and Microsoft were taking Bitcoin directly through their websites. And this is when the price really started to surge. But then all of a sudden, and as Roger outlines in his book, Hijacking Bitcoin, a small group of people decided to basically hijack Bitcoin
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And instead of doing what Satoshi outlined in the white paper, which is basically allow for large blocks, meaning that you can have a large number of transactions happening every 10 minutes, they decided to keep it artificially small, the block size, and limited the total number of transactions to basically seven transactions per second.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So right at this critical time, when people were actually using Bitcoin for commerce, the transaction fees jumped to about $50, and it was taking about 10 days to actually complete a transaction. So this completely destroyed the use case for Bitcoin as digital cash and as something that could be competitive to central banks or a central bank digital currency.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Bitcoin is a blockchain, and there are a lot of different blockchains. There are well over 20,000 different cryptocurrencies. They're not all their own blockchain. But the way to look at a blockchain is this, is to take a step back and look at most commerce runs using databases, centralized databases, like a Microsoft database, or an Oracle database.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And these are software programs where you can actually go back and change the data in the database. The benefit of blockchain is that it's immutable, meaning you actually can't go back and reverse or change any of the information in it. It is a chain of blocks. And in the case of Bitcoin, every 10 minutes, a new block is added.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So the way this works is there are computers all over the world trying to solve really difficult math problems. The computer that solves the math problem first gets to add the next block to the chain. And they get a reward for that in terms of what's called a Bitcoin mining reward. But they also get fees for the transactions that are added to that block.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Certainly, quantum computing has been identified as a risk factor because at a certain period of time, and I've actually just started to look at this new Willow system that they have. And so certainly, there is the ability to break the encryption at some point in time.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And so this is what's great about having a marketplace, which is there are different cryptocurrency projects working on coming up with different quantum-resistant technologies to be able to head that off.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
That's kind of interesting.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, and this is a specific risk for Bitcoin, because Bitcoin has kind of solidified their development. So Bitcoin, in essence, hasn't really done a lot of innovation for a number of years. They've kind of capped it where it is, so it has this small block size, and it's very difficult to get changes through.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
This is why Roger has started in recent years to promote privacy coins like Zeno and Monero, which have different technology and which tend to be more adaptive to the marketplace.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, certainly there already is a robust market for cryptocurrencies and there are already interesting market dynamics going on. Although I don't know if state-based currencies actually work very well. In fact, it's one of the things that I touch on in my book. If you actually look at state-based or fiat currencies, they have a 100% failure rate.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
The average state-based currency only lasts for about 27 years. And if you look at the dollar, which has been the global reserve currency for over 100 years, it is flashing bright red on all seven of the main reasons why a fiat currency fails. And so this has been a recurring problem. And so we have this boom and bust cycle of nation states that is largely driven by inflation.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
poor economic and monetary policy. And then we go from one global reserve currency to another. There are some interesting ideas with cryptocurrency that might be able to separate money and state and actually stop this boom and bust cycle. But it certainly is a competitive marketplace.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So from my perspective, what's happening to Ryder is a travesty, and it's actually tied directly to the emergence of central bank digital currencies. And again, since this is the field that I focus on, I truly think central bank digital currencies are the biggest single threat to human liberty. The ability to program, track, and censor money.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, a central bank digital currency, well, I actually would argue in kind of my recent analysis, we already have a central bank digital currency because the way money is created right now is the federal government issues an IOU to the Federal Reserve, and then the Federal Reserve creates the money out of thin air in an Oracle database.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Technically, it meets the definition of a CVDC, but that's not what people have in mind. There's more enhanced surveillance and programming. So it's basically the ability to program money at the individual unit and to be able to track each individual dollar and to be able to program that dollar.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So if the government doesn't like your behavior, they can shut off your money or they can program how you can spend your money to begin with.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Or perhaps, let's say the government decides they want to stimulate spending, they can say, listen, this digital money, the CBDC that you have in your account, if you don't spend it by the end of the month, we're literally going to take it away from your account. And so this basically gives them the ability to control human behavior at a very intense programmatic level.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, we've seen that in the United States. China has already rolled out a CBDC. What a lot of people don't realize is that 11 countries have rolled out CBDCs. At this point in time, there are 134 countries that represent 98% of global GDP at various stages of deployment. Half are beyond the research phase and are actually looking at implementation. So this is something that already exists.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
But one of the things that I like to point out to people is people don't understand how bad the current system is with the dollar today. 92 percent of our financial transactions are already digital. We really only deal with 8 percent cash. Our money is already being tracked. There are 13 different federal programs involved in tracking our money.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And I won't go through all of them, but I'll give you two. The IRS is now working with banks using AI to monitor our financial transactions. And the NSA does bulk data collection. And through the Patriot Act, they can actually come in and shut down your bank account and issue something called a national security letter where you can't even talk to anybody about it, including a lawyer.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So this isn't some future dystopian situation, nor is this China. This is the United States today.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, this debanking has been going on for a long time. We had something called Operation Chokepoint 1.0, where a whole variety of different categories of businesses were actually targeted and explicitly debanked.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So a lot of people in kind of the gun industry, people doing payday lending, a whole long list of categories where these were legal businesses, but they were explicitly targeted and explicitly debanked. What we're dealing with today and what Marc Andreessen touched on is really Operation Chokepoint 2.0, and this is part of Biden's whole policy.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Biden issued an executive order in March of 2022 called Executive Order 14067, and it actually authorized the federal government to not only explore CBDC, but to take a whole of government approach to cracking down on crypto, which they've done. So whether it's the IRS or the DOJ or the Treasury or the CFTC, this is what they've been doing.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And so, you know, I have multiple friends that are in prison that didn't commit any crimes that actually have gotten swept up in this. And it's basically a complete dragnet. And then Elizabeth Warren with her consumer protection board has been going crazy over this as well.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So this has been a deliberate politicized attempt to weaponize the banking system to go after enemies in a very targeted basis. And I'll say this, this is really interesting to do, is go and read the contract that you have with your bank. What you will find is four things. One, they can cancel your account without cause.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Two, they can actually sell or share your data, financial transactions, without your consent. They can change the fees without your consent. And then they can change the whole terms of the contract without your consent. This is the default nature of the relationship that we have with the banking system. And then truck point 1.0 and 2.0 are just layers on top of that.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Why wouldn't buy Bitcoin for a whole variety of reasons? It's slow, expensive, and it's actually trackable. And now, you know, the government basically can identify all of your transactions and then basically decide, well, we're going to have a whitelist or a blacklist. And so this means that Bitcoin isn't fungible. One Bitcoin... isn't the same as the other.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
One thing about gold is you've got to make sure with all of these things, and this is true also of cryptocurrency, you want to have these assets in your own self-custody. And I will say I've been living out of the banking system. I actually got rid of a personal bank account in 2019. So I live on crypto, gold and silver. So I'm very acutely aware of the ins and outs and the pros and cons of this.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And so very recently I've been interested in, and it's because Roger pointed it out, privacy coins. we really need to go back to having private money. I mean, that's what cash always was. We always had this presumption that our financial transactions were private. And now it's the complete opposite. Now it's AI working with the banks or Bitcoin, which is completely an open ledger that's tracked.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So you use privacy cryptocurrencies. If you are going to use gold and silver, I actually use goldbacks. I actually carry these things. It's one one-thousandth of an ounce of gold. You can actually spend gold in spendable form. And I think one of the most interesting things is the actual merger of precious metals and crypto.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So imagine having a cryptocurrency, a privacy cryptocurrency, that's actually backed by gold, that you can redeem for physical gold, but that's separate from the state. So I think there are some really interesting models here where we can get the best of both worlds.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
But, you know, Bitcoin isn't the answer, and certainly we have to look out for all of the surveillance going on with the traditional banking system.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Not yet, but the one that I know of will be in 2025.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Well, yeah, what I like to say, well, I'm sorry. I was going to say it's the 99% of crypto that makes the other 1% look bad.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
No, I was meant to put this up a little bit later, but actually I pressed the button too early. But this is about how they were able to take a system that's not quite like Bitcoin, but they were able to.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
It's obvious that they arrested the founder of Telegram and really put the pressure on him and said, hey, you got to give us some back doors here because and they say it's always to protect the children. It always comes back to that. It's to protect the children. And that's how they're going to try and get their claws into crypto with Bitcoin. They're saying, well, it's to stop child trafficking.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
That's their excuse every single time to take away freedoms. It always goes back to it because it's the easiest way to convince people. Aaron, go ahead.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
I was going to say, Roger has done more to spread digital cash across the world, literally, than anyone. And it's not just Bitcoin. A lot of people don't know this. Roger's invested in well over 40 companies. I mean, you can go to his website, rogervere.com, and you can see all the different things. And his emphasis has always been not on one particular coin or another.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
It's been on, you know, experimenting in the marketplace and finding which cryptocurrencies work the best for people all over the world. So he hasn't been As much as he has the name Bitcoin Jesus, he hasn't been religious about it at all, or particularly weighing in on one or the other. The third most valuable cryptocurrency is a currency called XRP. Roger was the co-founder of that.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And now he's spending a lot of his time on privacy coins. I think the reason that he is arrested is part that he exposed that Bitcoin was hijacked, which this could be a whole other segment, but basically the people that hijacked and made the changes to Bitcoin to keep it slow and expensive so that it isn't usable as cash, those same people funded all three US CBDC pilots.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
So now Bitcoin has been taken out of the running. It can't be used as an alternative to CBDCs, and the same people that made those changes are actually funding the CBDC development. So Roger was exposing that, I had actually interviewed him about three weeks before he was arrested, and he was about to start to get real traction on this, and the world was about to learn about it.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
But the other thing is, three days before he was arrested, he was at a cryptocurrency conference talking about the importance of privacy coins and privacy tokens as a way to stop central bank digital tyranny. So Roger was not only exposing the hijacking, But he was also starting to come out and talk about what some tangible solutions are.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
I mean, I like to say it this way, that one of the coins he's talking about now is Zeno. So they wanted to crucify Bitcoin Jesus so he didn't become Zeno Zeus because they know how effective he is at getting the message across about how to use these cryptocurrencies all over the world.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Yeah, I would say absolutely go to freerogernow.org and sign the petition immediately, but also send it to your friends. One of the things about social media is these social media sites don't want you going outside of their site. So they'll really suppress any external links. So contact your friends directly. Send people direct messages, go on Telegram, Signal.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Let's get the word out there because a lot of people say, well, this is worthless. This isn't really going to help. But Lynn Ulbrich to me is an absolute hero and inspiration. And she has been fighting for over a decade and worked to get over 600,000 signatures.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
And it made a difference, and it's one of the reasons that Trump was willing to talk to the Libertarian Party and were able to kind of negotiate this commitment to commute Ross's sentence on day one. The other thing is, why are they doing this? And in my opinion, part of why they're going after Roger is they want to have a chilling effect.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
They want to have a chilling effect on the information that's in hijacking Bitcoin. And on what Roger was starting to talk to the marketplace about, which is this cryptocurrency Zeno. And so what I think we should do is take the chilling effect they're intending to have and make it a galvanizing effect.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
I'm very pleased to see that after Roger's interview yesterday, hijacking Bitcoin is now the number one ranked book in the cryptocurrency category on Amazon. So go buy hijacking Bitcoin. Read Zeno. hijacking Bitcoin because it will absolutely open your eyes. And then let's turn this whole charade into an opportunity to increase adoption of privacy cryptocurrencies. So download a xeno.org.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
My bet is that's what Roger would be doing. If he hadn't been arrested, he probably would have been out talking about both of these things. So let's help amplify that. We don't individually have his voice. Z-A-N-O. Can you spell it?
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
That's where you download the wallet, yes.
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Roger Ver, Jan 6ers, Ross Ulbricht: Who Should Trump Pardon First? w/ Attorney Robert Barnes & Aaron Day – Ask Dr. Drew – Ep 435
Because I clearly typed in... It should be a blue site.