#2211 - Michael Shellenberger

2438.913 - 2460.541 Unnamed Speaker

It's like journalism. Like you don't need a PhD to do science. Like science is something that you do. It's also not the same. I mean, sometimes you have experiments in labs, but science in the world of ecological biology is just going out there and counting the number of gorillas or whales. Right. So when they say science, they really mean like obey me. That's what they mean.