Mickalene Thomas
Appearances
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Thank you so much for having me. Hopefully I'm not too congested.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
I think I would describe my art as radically shifting sort of notions of beauty by claiming space that has been often not have us on the platform as the leading character. We've been supportive characters for far too long and
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
historical images and that my art gives black women their flowers and let them know that they are the leading role and validating that and so there's intersections of using and juxtaposing historical tropes but also Disrupting and breaking sort of down those notions of beauty, of ideation that is hold to what is beauty, right?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
And so for me, I just look around my community within my world and started with my mother.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Yeah, I think the Barnes as an institution has always been committed to a particular community engagement. And it always has been about the art and the artists. But for this exhibition to be 15 minutes away from my family, I mean, it was, to be quite honest, like I was very anxious and nervous about it. Really? Yeah, because...
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Most of my family members were going to see my work for the first time in person, like my aunts and uncles, my cousins.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Yeah, even my father showed up. My brothers brought my father. And a lot of times, you know, people have their own understanding of art. And sometimes, you know, art can be a little elitist and we kind of go off and do things and it's conceptual and, you know, visually you might not understand. And some of them were going to see my mother and reposed in the nude.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
They would see me reposed and reclined in a nude. And they may go, why are you doing that? Yeah. It's so interesting. Why are you showing all that? Why are you exposing yourself?
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Well, one of my cousins was like, why are you going to go and show your mom that way? And I said, well, you know, my mother loves being shown that way. She actually gave me the permission to photograph her exposed. And so I think for them, they were so proud and excited to just be a part of it. Most of them came to the opening night, which was a gala event. So it was a
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
It's extravaganza, you know, it's like very just like colorful and just lots of different types of people and the music and energy. So I think for them to experience that part of my life made them feel special because I admit I haven't always been open to sharing that part of my life.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Freeing. It felt freeing and it felt supportive. And just to see the smiles. My brother stood in front of one of the paintings of my mother titled Dim All the Lights. She's wearing a red and black sweater and her hands are on the side. And it was quite beautiful to watch him engage with with the painting.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
But he stood there just, and I was behind him speaking with other family members, but I was watching him on the side. And he kept gesturing the same movement as her for a long time. And then he turned around and said, that's her. I know that, Stan. I know that's her. That's what she does. And that just made me feel so, and he had this glow and this light
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
And I think for him, you know, my mother's birthday was coming up, so it was like this energy. You know, my mother's birthday, October 27th. The opening was October 18th. So I think it was this energy. She was there, right? And there was this moment that you had to witness that you could see he was connecting to her.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Yeah, I think still today, I still believe, based on my experiences as an artist, that institutions are not comfortable with the nude black body. If it's not stereotypically presented in ways of – I think I present the nude black body in a way of just like celebrating and honoring and putting forth like all of the strong qualities. I think unless it's about trauma –
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Servitude, yeah, or entertainment, yeah. And I think the gesturing of like us being performative for an audience is still the notions that the boxes in our compartmentalize some visual artists.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
No, but it's not.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
It just is. And it's the state of resting, the state of being, the state of existing and rooted and grounded in that space, I think is somewhat threatening to people. of the ownership of it, taking accountability for their own space. I think when that is exuded, that sense of strength is oftentimes kind of felt with aggression or a threat.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
I've had people say, oh, your images or the women are very confronting. And I said their gaze is very confronting.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
They're looking straight out at you. They're demanding the space. They're not demanding to be validated. They're just letting you know that they're there. But with all that, too, there's still, you know, the other side is there. vulnerability and sensitivity. And I think it's just one-sided if you're going to look at it as that the women are confronting you.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
But I think that comes from their understanding. Like, if you approach an image, I can't control what you bring to it. Because you're bringing these ideas of what you think of black women when they're sort of seated in the position of all knowingness. There's, you know, but we have been, we sat on thrones before. And I think, you know, we've been queens and kings.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
And, you know, I think more of those images are now being put forth and celebrated, which is incredible. I love seeing that.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Yeah, so when I was in Pratt, I couldn't afford oil paint. I would rummage often through the recycled stretcher bins and gather my materials from that. All I could afford was craft materials because they were cheaper than oil paint, like felt and different fabrics and glitter. It was cheaper than tubes of oil paint.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
I gravitated towards those materials because they were accessible and affordable for me. But what they did was open up a way of expressing myself. But then when I also – to note that during that time, it was the sensation show. at Brooklyn Museum.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
So you had all of these Great Britain artists that were showing at the Sensation Show, and they were using all kinds of materials from, like, Chris Ofili, Elephant Dong, and, you know, you had Tracy Emin personally tell a story, you know, making a tent out of, like, felt and canvas and all kind of material. And so I think seeing exhibitions like that really... were paramount.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
But yeah, there was a struggle completing some assignments because some you had to use oil paint or some you had to use the traditional materials to make the art.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
I would borrow some of the My peers were – they were good. They were like, oh, yeah, he used some of this. People weren't too stingy or trying to keep you away from that. But I think we all were working and they saw that I was definitely in my studio all the time. And so sometimes people throw away tubes of paint because they think it's not good and you just cut it open. It's still painted there.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
It's kind of like, you know, like, you know, toothpaste, you know, you kind of, so I would, you know, take an exacto knife and cut it down the middle and just open it up. And it's kind of like with some of the turp medium, just use some of what I had.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Yes, I am. And I feel like she's, Definitely always around me. I know that for sure. Like the other day, it was like I sat down in a certain way, and I felt like I was sitting like my mother. I was like, oh, my mother sits like that. Like I felt her.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Oh, yes, and I love it now. Before, I grew up as a kid not looking like her and always covet the fact that I was like, why don't I look like my mother? And I had a cousin who looked like her and they used to always mistake my cousin for my mother's daughter, which really kind of like messed me up as a child. Yeah. But now when I look in the mirror, I was just like, ah, there you are.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
Oh, yeah. She's got to see it, experience it.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
celebrated she was celebrated for it she loved the fact that she was a part of my art she loved coming to the openings she loved coming to my friends openings she never when I decided I wanted to be an artist she never looked at it as like now why are you wanting to go and do that some of those things were in my head but she never she never vocalized that she was a supportive dance and music and
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
All things theater. I mean, that's one of the things we shared.
Fresh Air
Best Of: Jon Batiste's 'Beethoven Blues' / Visual Artist Mickalene Thomas
We've been supportive characters for far too long and My art gives Black women their flowers and let them know that they are the leading role.