Jason Pfeiffer
Appearances
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
It's great progress. As we're eventually going to talk about how to think through what may be your next career change and what you want to do, do you have a number in your head of what you want to reach?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Because Sean, I will tell you, Nicole and I both experienced this and continue to experience it, which is that no matter what your accomplishment is and no matter how much money you make, it suddenly does not seem like enough because there's always more that you could get. So at some point you have to know what you're actually aiming for. Do you have that in your head?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
The point that Nicole is making is that you can't tell this negative story of yourself where the punchline of it is and now you're stuck or now you've wasted so much time. Rather, everything that you did served some kind of purpose. You were pursuing passions. You were interested in things. You learned a lot about what you want and what you don't want. And
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
it now informs the next decisions that you make. The question now is, starting from right now, what do we do? Stick around. Help Wanted will be right back.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Welcome back to Help Wanted. Let's get to it. Now I want to think through how you make more money. When you reached out, part of your wonder was, is it time to just make another career change? Just do something totally different again. And look, Maybe it is if you want to totally just optimize for money.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
But also, before you do that, I would want to step back and say, all right, what do I have here in the world of paralegal? Can I look around and see what other paralegals are making and where and what it takes to get there? Maybe some sacrifices do have to be made. You, for example, have said that you don't want to drive into Boston.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
But maybe if you start pushing yourself closer to Boston and taking a longer commute, you it translates into more dollars and ultimately the balance there is better.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Or maybe some of the skills that you've picked up in paralegal work actually translate really well to some adjacent field that doesn't require a full reboot of what you do, but that ultimately does pay better or gives you access to better paying employers or something like that. So have you looked into any of that? I have not.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Nicole makes an excellent point. You know how to do a lot of different things. The story of your career is actually one of accumulating a lot of skill sets. And you haven't actually stepped back and said, how do these things snap together in a way in which they're all useful?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Sean, here's something that I think you should do. You should look around and see what problems you can solve for people. Perhaps part of the reasons that you feel insecure is because if you don't know the problems that you can solve for people, then all you're doing is showing up and demanding their attention.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
And you don't know if they're busy or if they have a need or why they would care about you. But if you know the problems that you can solve... Then suddenly you see a role for yourself. So what would a problem be that you can solve? I don't know that much about the legal world, but I do know this because I've heard it from friends who are lawyers or who work in law firms that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Lawyers do not know how to write in a way that is not a complicated legal brief. They struggle with communication. And communicating in a way that is not a legal brief is an important thing that people need to know how to do, and that includes lawyers. And that's the reason why a lot of law firms actually hire outside consultants to teach their lawyers how to write like regular human beings.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Now, here is you, someone who has worked professionally as a communicator in a plain English kind of way, who also has developed the skills of a teacher to teach skills to other people, and you are sitting in a law firm, or you're at least sitting in an industry, I can't speak to your specific firm, these are people who are
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
probably very aware that a shortcoming of theirs is their ability to communicate in a non-legal way. Now we have identified a problem and you as a solution. And it might be worth even just volunteering or coming up with some kind of system or something that you can introduce to at your firm, see if people like it, maybe you become much more valuable there.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Maybe you take on a totally different role there. Maybe you create a whole department there. Or maybe you become really valuable in a way that they love but aren't going to pay you for. But now you have something that you can take somewhere else and say, ah, I am doubly valuable. I'm a really good paralegal. And also, I run this program teaching the lawyers how to write.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
And now somebody is going to pay you a lot more. That is how you take somebody's problem and connect it to the snapping together of the skills that you have accrued.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
This is Help Wanted, the show that tackles all the big work questions you cannot ask anyone else. I'm Jason Pfeiffer, editor-in-chief of Entrepreneur Magazine.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
You haven't quite figured out how to make the boundaries of what you think work are more flexible. I realized that getting ahead and making the kind of money that I wanted required doing multiple kinds of work at the same time. The Gardner News was the only job, that first job that we worked at, the only job I ever worked at where I just did that job.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
After that, I have always, including right now, freelanced on the side of whatever full-time job that I had, always. And that was where my extra income came from and that's where my advancement opportunities came from because that's what got me in front of the next set of people that were gonna create the next set of opportunities.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
The helpline is open. Nicole, do you stalk any of your former colleagues? Like stalk, stalk? Not in a illegal way, but you know, you pay attention to them on social. They don't know that you know what they've been up to for the last 20 years.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
And the reason we got to where we are here today is because in all of these cases, the answer doesn't start externally. It's not just about make this one other decision. It's internal. The work has to start internally, which is why what we did is we spent a lot of time trying to understand what your goals were and what your skills are and where your interests are and then what matters to you.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Because once you know that, you can start to construct an actual answer. I appreciate it.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
I was very proud of it. They're called 419 scams, those Nigerian 419 scams, where somebody emails you and they tell you that there's a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow and all you need to do is help them get there. Their whole thing is to scam you into trusting them so that you will send them money. But this means that this...
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
asshole wherever they are in the world is also, if you know that they're scamming you, is really now your plaything because you can just create increasingly ridiculous and complicated demands of them. And they'll play along because they think that they're leading you to the scam. And so that's what I did with this guy for who knows how long. He promised me his sister.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
But I'm not still in touch with the sister. Let's just be very clear. Yeah. And then I put it all on the Internet and it was a lot of fun. And you're probably the only person in the world who still remembers it. But I am touched that you do.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Yeah. But you know what? I didn't make a single dime off of that thing.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Oh, I didn't sign up for that. All right. Well, talk to you soon.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Yeah. And I think that what you just said there, the comparison is the thief of joy is perfect because that's exactly what can happen is that here you are, you were at the same moment in time as someone else and then paths diverged. And it's so easy to look at what they did and maybe think, oh, did I make the wrong step?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Career sliding doors. And that is exactly what we're going to hear today because I got an email recently from a guy that I worked with at my first job 20 years ago, who I have not talked to since. And we're about to talk to him because he feels like he wishes he made some of the decisions that I made.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
I don't think we're going to get into that, but let's hear from him. Sean, here's a thing I wouldn't have said 20 years ago because it didn't exist 20 years ago. I don't think podcasting existed 20 years ago. Welcome to Help Wanted.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
I really appreciate you reaching out and being that honest and vulnerable. And I think that what you're describing is something that a lot of people relate to. So you had originally reached out to me with a kind of summary of what had happened over the last 20 years.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
So why don't you share that with us so that we understand what you mean by you hadn't always made the best career decisions and where you are now so that we can start to talk through what matters to you and what to do next.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
You were at the paper. You were very committed to it. At some point, you must have made a decision to leave because of some reason. Tell us, why did you leave and what did you decide to do next?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Yeah. You know, it's funny, Sean, just for what it's worth is that if we're tracking the two careers, I remember making $20,000 in that first job that you and I worked at together. And then my next job paid $40,000. So if you were getting 50, then your next career move was more financially savvy in a way than mine.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
I'll just fill in because I know what happens next because you told me which is that you ended up leaving teaching and then you became a paralegal. And... You told me in your message to me that you were disappointed when after studying to be a paralegal and getting a job as a paralegal that it wasn't paying as much as you had hoped that it would, right?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
So that's the moment that you're in right now is that you've made a shift, got into the arena, and then discovered that there wasn't as much money as you wanted. Just to put a fine point on it, right now you said you're making $26 an hour, which I think translates to an annual salary of about $54,000 a year. Is that right?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
When you told me that you were a paralegal and that's what you were making, I went onto Google... And I just Googled average paralegal salary in Massachusetts. The first thing that came up told me that the average paralegal salary in Massachusetts where you live is $58,000, which is not that far off from what you're making.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Had you done any of that kind of research to know what you were getting into before you did it?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
I wonder if part of the reason that you're doing this in the way that you're doing it is because of the fear of not having a plan and therefore feeling lost. Because what you have told us throughout this story of being a journalist and then being a police dispatcher and then being a teacher and then being a paralegal is that
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
it sounds like what you did was you felt like you needed something else, something presented itself, and then you just ran towards it, which is totally understandable because the alternative is to say, oh no, I don't know what to do, and then spend a lot of time thinking about it and researching it and talking to people and marinating in this lostness of not knowing where to go.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
And that is a hard place to be. An easier place to be is to say, ah, I'll go over there. And then, of course, the problem is that you discover what you didn't know when you're already there instead of before you went there.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
Again, I don't want to... No, it's a good memory. Yeah. I think that this is an important thing that you bring up that I know Nicole can speak very intelligently to. So say what you're saying because you're right.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
You are absolutely correct in that I grew up with two very supportive parents. My dad was a dentist, made good money. They did not... roll out the red carpet for me on everything. But I knew that I could take risks in my career. And if something didn't work out, that I had a safety net. That without question enabled me to act bolder than I know some other people were able to.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"I Feel Behind in My Career. Help!"
So Nicole knows exactly where Sean is coming from.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I have thoughts on this too. Oh, I didn't know I have strong feelings on all these subjects.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yeah, that's a nice thing to do is to be clear about it. And if you're taking notes and people know you're taking notes because you care about what is being discussed, then it's like, whatever, there's a little clacking and that's fine. But a couple of things to say. Number one, you can always mute. I do that often.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
If someone's going to be talking for a few minutes and I'm typing, I will just mute myself and then type away. But also, shout out, we are not getting any money for this, though we probably should. I have been using Fathom. Fathom is an AI note taker. It joins my meetings. I think it's fathom.video is the website. And it is awesome. It's just there in the background.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
It transcribes all your calls, but it also does this great job of organizing all the main points using AI. It's really impressive. So now I have it in all my calls, and now I don't need to take as many notes.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I actually think that this is a really good move for anybody, which is to think about how other people perceive seeing you on the phone. So if you're in a meeting and you pick up your phone and you're taking notes, it's worth saying, sorry, I'm just taking notes. And that way people don't think that you're sexting or texting the dog walker.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Like when you do it when we're recording or whatever? Yeah. I always assume you're dealing with something and it's fine because you also... Again, this comes back to like what have you earned and what's the set expectations? I know that you're not going to pick up your phone and disappear into it in the middle of a conversation. And therefore, if you pick up the phone, it's not like a problem.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
But when my eight-year-old son, Fen...
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
picks up his ipad in the middle of a conversation i know we have fully lost him to roblox and therefore we got to pull him back but when i go and i give a talk uh like a keynote somewhere oftentimes i'll see people on their phones and then they will come up to me afterwards and they will show me the notes and they'll be like i i'm sorry if it looked rude that i was on the phone i was taking notes like they want they want to show that and i think that that's a good instinct
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yeah, exactly. Right. I hope not. We are really hoping that the other people that Fenn is interacting with on Roblox are also eight, but it's possible that they're 50 and at a convention listening to me give a keynote talk.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Just really awkwardly. Just glare at each other.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh man, I'm sorry about that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Because you had to do all the small talk, Morgan. What was your question?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Do anything good this weekend?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
All right, I'm going to give it to you. Here's the solution. This is the solution. The solution is this. Tell a story. So this is what I always do is if I'm on a call, I share whatever the latest amusing or random thing is. I just start telling that to people.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And the reason I do it is because I know that everyone on this call hates Zoom small talk, but also will feel obliged to do it unless somebody just fills the void. Somebody needs to fill the void. And I, you know, I know that I, for better or for worse, a thing I can do is fill a void. And so I'll just start talking. I'll just start, I'll just tell some random story until everyone's there.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And then I will exit the story and we'll get on. And it's like, look, as long as you know that you're not, you didn't just launch something.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
your own private version of the moth and like people aren't there for your stories so they don't want it any longer than necessary but like you know if you tell a story and then as soon as the last person shows up and the meeting is supposed to begin like wrap your story up and move into the thing everyone will love you for it
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yeah. You know, I mean, another way you could solve this for people is put interesting things in your background, and then people will ask about them.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Like a money roll, yes. Nicole's got a giant money roll behind her, like a physical statue of money. But then you need something amusing to say about it. And I found this to be the case often when I go and call somebody and I was like, oh, I like your wall of hats. And then they'll be like, oh, thank you. And then they'll start telling me about the hats and it fills whatever time is necessary.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I usually have, depending on the angle that I'm in my room, I either have a large old timey typewriter behind me, which was my grandma's. And so I have a whole couple of things to say about that. Or there are some guitars hanging on the wall that people ask me about. And then I say some things about that. So Have something that starts a conversation. People will ask about it.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
But now it is your duty to have some at least mildly engaging thing to say about it that can last 60 to 120 seconds.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
What percentage of time when you are on a Zoom call, for example, you listening at home, what you don't see is that we are recording. We're all in a Zoom together right now, me.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Nicole's looking at herself and has checked her phone a couple of times. But we're also recording locally, which is why the audio quality is better. Anyway, point is, on this call or on regular calls, what percentage of the time have you spent looking at yourself? Morgan, how much time have you spent looking at yourself instead of me and Nicole on this call?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I was going to go a little higher for myself, like maybe a third.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, yeah, that's this is at the end. Right. So there's a there is a just for context. There is a we're going to take another episode after this one. There is a guest for that episode. That person is in the waiting room waiting for us. But also Morgan had created a list of questions for this episode. And the shrimping was at the end. What the hell is shrimping?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
This is Help Wanted, the show that makes your work work for you. I'm Jason Pfeiffer, editor-in-chief of Entrepreneur Magazine.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Explain. Yeah, describe that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Right, so this is, it is 95% background. It's just like your head at a terrible angle, which is what it always is. And just like as a little nub in the bottom middle of the, everybody has seen that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
100%.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, really? I forgot about the white cord.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Right. Yes. Yeah. Nicole is policing what is happening in my... But yes, that is completely... You know, if you want to appear better to people in meetings and probably even be taken more seriously, two things... improve the video and improve the audio. And both are very, very easy. I will tell you what I have. Again, I'm not getting paid anything for this. I have a Logitech Brio.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
It is a 4K camera. It's just it just attaches to sort of sits on top of my laptop. You plug it in. Instant giant improvement in video quality. It also handles lighting better. So like even if I'm in a semi dark room, it looks better. And then I have for like important meetings that I take, I have a lav, which is just the kind of little microphone that clips to your clothing.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And it plugs directly into my MacBook. It's called a Clip 2, Clip 2 something. And it is great. It's so easy and it makes my audio much better and you get taken more seriously. So I think that's very important.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And on Thursdays, I give you one way to improve your work and build a career or company you love.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Help Wanted is a production of Money News Network. Help Wanted is hosted by me, Jason Pfeiffer.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, I didn't sign up for that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, I didn't even notice that. I will take it. What a big deal I am on this show. That's exciting. Morgan, welcome to my show where Nicole occasionally appears too.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
My wife is very obsessed with that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
All right. I like it. It's like the digital age Emily Post.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Here's a question back to you. Has your boss followed you on Instagram?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Ah. Ah.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I think that it depends upon the kind of relationship that you have with your boss. My boss's name is Bill at Entrepreneur. I thought I did not follow him, but I just checked Instagram and actually I do and he follows me. So maybe it's not so bad because Didn't even notice.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
But I think that the real issue here is how much should you be thinking about people that you know professionally when you are posting on social media? And I think the answer to that is all the time. Because even if your boss doesn't follow you, they could see something that you post. So you should probably act like your boss follows you regardless of what you do.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
You can follow. Right. There's like a whole ton of them.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Better not. That's fair. I think that the blocking is an aggressive move. So you'd want to be careful about that.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I would say default to no too. I would also say it shouldn't matter because the things that you're posting on social media are so work safe that anyone can see it. And this is why you should just create group chats with friends where you can really do all your shit talking.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
No, no. I actually make a very specific point of this. I do not follow colleagues unless we have hung out and that colleague relationship has turned friend-like. Otherwise, I leave it alone. I do not follow them. I don't want them thinking about me when they're posting stuff. That is an intentional decision that I make.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
So, yeah, here's a non digital scenario that I expand into all of this stuff. When I became the boss. I realized that my presence at a after work happy hour took on a different meaning. I think that people might want to talk about me. They might want to talk about some annoying thing that I did. And that's their right. They should.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And when I was there, now they all have to defer to me in some way because... His highness. But that's how I always feel. If anybody is above me in a hierarchy, I add this level of deferentialness to just general conversation just because I don't ever want them to be annoyed at me because that's the thing.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Even if it's a social setting, an annoyance in a social setting can now translate to the work setting where that person now has some... They can lord over me. Anyway, so I just thought... I now don't belong here after a certain amount of time. So maybe if everybody from the office goes to the bar, I don't belong here after the first drink. And then I should leave.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And I take that mentality and I apply it to everything with social media. If my presence... makes you think twice about anything because I am no longer just a neutral party in your- You're not a wallflower. Life. Yeah. Then I should remove myself. So that's why I don't follow people. That's why I don't go and like their stuff or whatever.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I remove myself because I understand that everything that I do or don't do is going to be perceived differently. And I just want to leave you alone and let you do your thing. Thank you, Your Highness. You are welcome.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Great.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
I've done that. I've brought out Indian food on work Zooms. Here's my rule. I have a very specific rule for this. The rule is... So first of all, it depends on the Zoom, right? If it's a client call or some important call, no, obviously not.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, all hands. Well, sorry, I'm exploring all the options. So...
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Eat on this call. That is fine. We give you permission. So if I need to be presenting totally professionally, obviously there's no food. If it is just internal and it's casual enough, then my rule is very specific. The rule is no food goes into my mouth on camera. I will lean off camera and take a bite and then come back on camera.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Why? Because it's, I find it unpleasant to see. And this is, you know, like whatever you go out to dinner, it doesn't matter. But like, I don't like watching cooking, like TV, like the food network or whatever. I don't like seeing people eat. Why do you want to see people take food and put it in their mouth? That's not a pleasant thing to see.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
But that's what people do. Like you watch Guy Fieri and it's just like him shoveling food into his mouth. I don't understand.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
The food is, and I just lean out of frame and I take a bite and then I come back in frame. This is, I've always, this is what I've been doing for years now.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yeah, see, I've probably done it with you guys.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
That is true.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Right. Nothing. Does it taste like anything? For context, for people who don't know, I literally genuinely do not have a sense of taste. I cannot taste food. So people who know this ask me a lot of questions.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Stick around. Help Wanted will be right back. Welcome back to Help Wanted. Let's get to it.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, I have strong feelings about this too.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yes. Or when somebody else is naked. I used to work from my bedroom and my wife would come in after the shower and she would always be like, is the Zoom off? And I'd have to turn it off. So I feel like companies, I feel like I'm going to deputize everyone listening to slowly, slowly try to drive your company culture towards camera off.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yes. Camera off. We don't need this. We don't need to be on camera all day to see each other.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Well, that's wonderful for, for filming, for making podcasts and stuff. But like, you know, if you were just talking to colleagues all day, I just don't think that you need to see their faces. And whenever I have a meeting and I tell people, you know, we don't need an, you don't need another zoom meeting in your life. I am sure we can do camera off. They always say, do you know what they say to me?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
They say the same thing every time. When I say, I'm sure you don't need another Zoom meeting in your life. We can keep the cameras off. What do they say?
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Thank you. They always say thank you. Thank you. Because they don't want it. Nobody wants it. I have found that entrepreneur, there were a couple colleagues who just started showing up with their camera off. Shout out Deepa. Deepa's camera's off and off. And it inspired others. It created permission for other people to keep their cameras off.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
And now most, in a lot of meeting settings at Entrepreneur, cameras are all off. I think that is wonderful. Cameras off.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Oh, I think it's entirely dependent upon the existing set of expectations. If this person works well and shows up and there's just never a question about whether they're working... Deepa is a great example of which. It's just a colleague of mine, Deepa. Deepa is the Swiss army knife of entrepreneurs. She does everything. And there is never a question of whether or not Deepa is on it.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Deepa is always on it. And as a result, nobody cares if Deepa's camera is off because... She's there. Everything will get done. There's just no worry. So in a way, you almost have to earn the camera off.
Money Rehab with Nicole Lapin
"Should I Follow My Boss On Instagram?" and Other New Workplace Etiquette Conundrums
Yeah. Safety first.